Is Turkey Lost To The West?

Tyler Durden's picture

Authored by Patrick Buchanan via,

Not long ago, a democratizing Turkey, with the second-largest army in NATO, appeared on track to join the European Union.

That’s not likely now, or perhaps ever.

Last week, President Recep Tayyip Erdogan compared Angela Merkel’s Germany to Hitler’s, said the Netherlands was full of “Nazi remnants” and “fascists,” and suggested the Dutch ambassador go home.

What precipitated Erdogan’s outbursts?

City officials in Germany refused to let him campaign in Turkish immigrant communities on behalf of an April 16 referendum proposal to augment his powers.

When the Netherlands denied Turkish Foreign Minister Mevlut Cavusoglu landing rights, he exploded, saying: “The Netherlands … are reminiscent of the Europe of World War II. The same racism, Islamophobia, xenophobia, anti-Semitism.”

When Turkey’s family and social policies minister, Betul Sayan Kaya, drove from Germany to Rotterdam to campaign, Dutch police blocked her from entering the Turkish consulate and escorted her back to Germany.

Liberal Europeans see Erdogan’s referendum as a power grab by an unpredictable and volatile ruler who has fired 100,000 civil servants and jailed 40,000 Turks after last summer’s attempted coup, and is converting his country into a dictatorship.

This crisis was tailor-made for Geert Wilders, the anti-EU, anti-Muslim Dutch nationalist who is on the ballot in Wednesday’s Dutch general election.

Claiming credit for the tough stance of conservative Prime Minister Mark Rutte, Wilders tweeted: “I am telling all Turks in the Netherlands that agree with Erdogan: GO to Turkey and NEVER come back!”

“Wilders is a racist, fascist Nazi,” replied Cavusoglu.

Wilders had been fading from his front-runner position, but this episode may have brought him back. While no major Dutch party would join a government led by Wilders, if he runs first in the election March 15, the shock to Europe would be tremendous.

Rutte, however, who dominated the media through the weekend confrontation with the Turks, could be the beneficiary, as a resurgent nationalism pulls all parties toward the right.

All Europe now seems to be piling on the Turks. Danes, Swedes and Swiss are taking Europe’s side against Erdogan.

Marine Le Pen, leader of the populist National Front in France, called on the socialist regime to deny Turkish leaders permission to campaign in Turkish communities. She was echoed by conservative party candidate Francois Fillon, whose once-bright hopes for the presidency all but collapsed after it was learned his wife and children had held do-nothing jobs on the government payroll.

On April 23 comes the first round of the French elections. And one outcome appears predictable. Neither of the major parties — the socialists of President Francois Hollande or the Republicans of ex-President Nicolas Sarkozy — may make it into the May 7 finals.

Le Pen, the anti-EU populist who would lift sanctions on Putin’s Russia, is running even with 39-year-old Emmanuel Macron, a socialist running as the independent leader of a new movement.

Should Le Pen run first in April, the shock to Europe would be far greater than when her father, Jean-Marie Le Pen, made the finals in 2002.

At the end of 2017, neither Wilders nor Le Pen is likely to be in power, but the forces driving their candidacies are growing stronger.

Foremost among these is the gnawing ethnonational fear across Europe that the migration from the South — Maghreb, the Middle East and the sub-Sahara — is unstoppable and will eventually swamp the countries, cultures and civilization of Europe and the West.

The ugly and brutal diplomatic confrontation with Turkey may make things worse, as the Turks, after generous payments from Germany, have kept Syrian civil war refugees from crossing its borders into Europe. Should Ankara open the gates, a new immigration crisis could engulf Europe this spring and summer.

Other ethnonational crises are brewing in a familiar place, the Balkans, among the successor states born of the 1990s breakup of Yugoslavia.

In Bosnia, secessionists seek to pull the Serb Republic away from Sarajevo toward Belgrade. The Albanian minority in Macedonia is denouncing political discrimination. The Serbs left behind after Kosovo broke loose in 1999, thanks to 78 days of U.S. bombing of Serbia, have never been reconciled to their fate.

Montenegro has charged Russia with backing an attempted coup late last year to prevent the tiny nation from joining NATO.

The Financial Times sees Vladimir Putin’s hand in what is going on in the Western Balkans, where World War I was ignited with the June 1914 assassination of the Austrian archduke in Sarajevo.

The upshot of all this:

Turkey, a powerful and reliable ally of the U.S. through the Cold War, appears to be coming unmoored from Europe and the West, and is becoming increasingly sectarian, autocratic and nationalistic.

While anti-immigrant and anti-EU parties across Europe may not take power anywhere in 2017, theirs is now a permanent and growing presence, leeching away support from centrist parties left and right.

With Russia’s deepening ties to populist and nationalist parties across Europe, from Paris to Istanbul, Vlad is back in the game.

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NMA's picture

"fired 100k civil servants"..... HOWS that a BAD thing??? THink we need some of that in the west..... 

Vilfredo Pareto's picture

Lol.  He fired the wrong ones most likely, then didn't zero out their positions but is replacing them with cronys  cronies?   Whatever

froze25's picture

I didn't know the migrant crisis had ended in Europe to allow for a new one to begin.  Have the rapes stopped?  Are the public pools safe again? Have the Rapeugees assimilated into the Western culture? 

VinceFostersGhost's picture



Have the Rapeugees assimilated into the Western culture? 


Yeah.....they don't mind raping western women.

Motasaurus's picture

Has the West lots Turkey?


Turkey will become the capitol of a new Islamic Caliphate. They will join with Iran to divide up the rest of the devastated Middle East (Iraq, Libya, Lebanon and Syria) and with all that power and resources (and the technology and economic interests of Russia and China on their side) they will bully Jordan into joining them. This new Ottoman Empire will declare war on Israel and take Jerusalem, which will itself cause the Gulf States to fall into line with them.

Eventually Iran will force the meteorite that Muslims fall own on their face to worship to be moved to Jerusalem as the new spiritual capitol of the Caliphate and eventually this Caliphate will launch an attack on the Arabian peninsular as they get fed up with Wahabbism and the Arab oil trade with the USA and Europe. This attack will destroy Mecca, which will cause Egypt to try and break away. The Caliphate will utterly crush Egypt's uprising and having brought all of the Islamic world into the fold will sign a peace agreement with Israel and in exchange for avoiding being utterly destroyed the Jews will agree to leave their lands and be dispersed throughout the Caliphate.

Nunyadambizness's picture

That's quite a story!  You're missing the part where Israel nukes the shit out of everyone, though.   

SWRichmond's picture

The west never really "had" Turkey

SmackDaddy's picture

Might want to check your history books their dipshit.  Byzantines?  Constantinople?

8774_44887's picture
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tr123's picture

That was over 1000 years ago and only really covered the western Mediterranean half.

Eastern half is and has always been in the Islamic fold, or whatever they were called before that religion spread there.

Then, once they took Constantinople it's been theirs for centuries.

Mufasa Dali's picture

In this scenario, is ISIS the 'daughter of the King of the South'?


TruthHunter's picture

new islamic Caliphate?

Only in Erdogan's psychotic imagination. Neither Arabs nor Persians

will unite under Turkish leadership. They wouldn't even unite against would be suicidal. They will continue to be susceptable to

incitement by Mossad and the CIA , who will always succumb to the temptation.


 I believe Westerners underestimate the damage our movies and music have

done to Islam. They are embarrassed by the excesses  of ISIS. They are

easily persuaded that the CIA is behind it. A generation has matured that only

give lip service to their traditional values. A minority react by becoming radicalized.

A far greater number have become secular agnostic/atheists. Significant

numbers are even turning to Christianity.

halcyon's picture

Let me guess, you are American, getting your news from the Internet alternative sources?

Some people actually live in Europe and see the situation daily.

I can tell you that there is no crisis anywhere in Europe, except for the borders where the influx pressure is.


tharsa57's picture

Why don't you tell us where in Europe you live ??????, because there is crisis in every Western European country. Are you blind and deaf?

Ital Scratch's picture

From my point of view, things are not so least in my country (Croatia).


BUT given the fact that my country is so fucked up that even the refugees dont want to stay here tells you how much fucked up my country is in first place. So we are not taking lot of refuguees.

Even minister of some shitty goverment part told some time ago that we got qouttas that we need to fulfill (like 2000 people) but only few people applied.

They were taking interviews during last big migration, and people just said that they where here just passing through, to reach Germany, Austria or Scandinavia; apparently Croatia is worse deal then war-torn Syria. So we "shipped" them through.

jus_lite_reading's picture

I'm married but I'd like to buy a hot Croatian chick? You think I have a chance?

flapdoodle's picture

Sounds like you haven't traveled around Europe much or know very many people who have. Its a real mess and the Europeans I've talked to are livid about what is happening to their cultures.

jus_lite_reading's picture



UnschooledAustrianEconomist's picture

I'm European. Actually from the hardest hit country, Austria.

You're talking bullshit.

sgt_doom's picture

Of course they are lost.

The Fake News people consistently ignored (as usual) important news over the past 5 years where Turkey's concerned, especially:

Erdogan's replacement of secularist commanding generals and their staffs with Islamic extremists loyal to him, in other words, he dismantled Ataturk's Deep State structure, which in the past had seized power every time religious extremists became too strong; and,

the Erdogan family's connections to oil and ISIS.

MasterControl's picture

Time to bring back constantinople.

Mustafa Kemal's picture

"fired 100k civil servants"..... HOWS that a BAD thing??? THink we need some of that in the west..... "

It is a bad thing only if you want some form of representative government. He is eliminating all resistance to his becoming Sultan. 

But you will get your wish I believe. More like this coming to the west.

Skeevers's picture

Ergoden is now the leader of the Muslim Brotherhood and took the lead when Al Sisi thru Morsi in a jail cell. The guy is hell bent on a Sectarian Muslim Society in Turkey. He kills Kurds at will and wants them extinguished I really feel we to reassess as well as the EU on NATO membership. The guy is bad JuJu



Vilfredo Pareto's picture

This crisis was tailor-made for Geert Wilders, the anti-EU, anti-Muslim Dutch nationalist who is on the ballot in Wednesday’s Dutch general election.


Of course.


The right wing says thank you Erdogan.


If Europe is going to be galvanized into avoiding being submerged by endless waves of illegal immigration from the overpopulating turd world then they need an event like this, a test run of two million retarded inbred illiterate middle easterners rushing their borders again.

Mustafa Kemal's picture

"The right wing says thank you Erdogan."

Indeed it does. But dont be fooled. Erdogan says thank you to the right wing. It also buttresses his support. He just looks like he disapproves.

Rock On Roger's picture

Turkey is losing the west. Oceania is about debt slavery, eastasia is about commerce.

im-a-nut-job's picture

Erdogan must be allowed to trade more isis oil to the zionists to keep him sweet.

Gnostech's picture

Retake Constantinople!

Mustafa Kemal's picture

Irredenta to 1453? Read the history of those years and you will be impressed with the Ottomans.

tharsa57's picture

What is the Ottoman contribution to the world, to civilizarion, science, art, etc. Who are you kidding?. The Turks are the peril of Asia. Even though they grabbed the lands of civilized peoples and in a way interacted with them, they are still and always will be barbarians.

flapdoodle's picture

To the Ottomans we can thank for the most significant contribution to mankind. They introduced coffee to Vienna.

Sandmann's picture

They also blocked the land route to China which is why Christopher Columbus had to sail west to find a new trade route once the Silk Road was blocked

tharsa57's picture

What is the Ottoman contribution to the world, to civilizarion, science, art, etc. Who are you kidding?. The Turks are the peril of Asia. Even though they grabbed the lands of civilized peoples and in a way interacted with them, they are still and always will be barbarians.

Sandmann's picture

Turkey was always lost to the West. Just because a few Europeanised Turks live on the Bosphorus is not indication that the other 75 million stretching into Central Asia are westernised.

It was always a US/UK stunt. Turkey was brought into NATO in 1952 simply because of geography. Turkey got to vote on Germany joining NATO in 1956. US wanted a German Army so it did not have to pay for the defence of Germany - France objected - so Turkey bought off by sending overspill male population to work in Germany.  German public told they were "Gastarbeiter" and would be going home once Germans started breeding again.

So 60 years later and Germany is stuck with >3 million Turks and Germany is Turkey's 4th largest electoral constituency.

NATO turned Germany into a Turkish colony

CRM114's picture

No. It's still German politicians' fault for saying yes and pushing the Integration myth ever since. And the German population's fault for not doing something about that.

UnschooledAustrianEconomist's picture

Sandmann is right. It was the US who told Germany (and others) to accept Turkish immigration. Back in those days (1960's and 1970's) Germany was even more a US-vassal than it is today.

forrestdweller's picture

Claiming the Dutch have insulted their ministers, while calling the Dutch nazis and fascists at the same time, shows only that this turkish government is constructing its own reality in order to manipulate their people into ignorant Erdogan supporting nationalism, which in turn will ultimately lead to violence against a party chosen by their leader. 

Very dangerous. We all know what happened to the armenians.

avenriv's picture

3 days ago on BBC, there is a serial documentary about WWII, there was an episode about the Netherlands during the war. surprisingly it showed the dutch were quite confortable with the germans and happily collaborated.

why BBC shows such images ?

as of Germany being content with the nazies, no discussion here.


DisorderlyConduct's picture

Lost to the west? It was never part of the west.

When will people learn that it really does matter if people, communities, states, nations value the same things to be unified? It's not like you can mix up religions, histories and national identities in a big pot and end up with something good.

Look at the US now. There is a serious question whether people here actually believe in our system of government anymore. And they vary wildly as to what they think proper governance is. In the EU they never had agreement - unelected officials rammed laws down the throats of people with no say.

It is going to be interesting to see how this all ends up.

JohnGaltUk's picture

War, most western governments are broke and will soon have to inform their citizens that there are no pensions, NHS and they will default on their government debts if they were going to be honest. They wont, they will manufacture are war with...... ooh I dont know, maybe Russia because Putin has been very busy lately.

Turkey is lashing out because he knows his time is up, bonds are up to about 11% yield. Many loans are in USD and the dollar keeps rising while the lira is falling...


DEFAULT. He will blame the Nazis.

Batman11's picture

A New World Order based on neo-liberalism, what a stupid idea.

When the Berlin wall fell there was great hope in the world but the globalists had come up with a very stupid plan.

Eastern Europe had hoped to become like the Western democracies they had envied but all they got was neo-liberalism. 

The problems with neo-liberalism were there at the start but were ignored, it was always going to go wrong in exactly the way it has.

Francis Fukuyama talked of the “end of history” and “liberal democracy”.

Liberal democracy was the bringing together of two mutually exclusive ideas.

Economic liberalism – that enriches the few and impoverishes the many.

Democracy – that requires the support of the majority.

Trying to bring two mutually exclusive ideas together just doesn’t work.

The ideas of “Economic Liberalism” came from Milton Freidman and the University of Chicago. It was so radical they first tried it in a military dictatorship in Chile, it wouldn’t be compatible with democracy. It took death squads, torture and terror to keep it in place, there was an ethnic cleansing of anyone who still showed signs of any left wing thinking.

It was tried in a few other places in South America using similar techniques. It then did succeed in a democracy but only by tricking the people into thinking they were voting for something else, severe oppression was needed when they found out what they were getting.

It brings extreme inequality and widespread poverty everywhere it’s tested, they decide it’s a system that should be rolled out globally. It’s just what they are looking for.

Margaret Thatcher bought these ideas to the West and the plan to eliminate the welfare state has only recently been revealed. Things had to be done slowly in the West due to that bothersome democracy. The West has now seen enough.

It was implemented far more brutally in the developing world where Milton Freidman’s “Chicago Boys” were the henchmen of “The Washington Consensus”. The IMF and World Bank acted as enforcers insisting on neoliberal conditionalities for loans.

Global markets punished those not towing the neoliberal line and kept nations in their place. As Nelson Mandela was released from prison the South African Rand fell 10%, someone like this was going to be pushing up wage costs and would be bad for the economy.

Looking back it was a grand folly of an international elite whose greed overcame even a modicum of common sense.

Naomi Klein's "The Shock Doctrine" will take you through all the gory details.

Underlying neo-liberalism is a different economics, neoclassical economics, which is heavily biased towards the wealthy. Inequality and a lack of demand in the global economy were also guaranteed from the start.

Batman11's picture

Francis Fukuyama talked of the “end of history” and “liberal democracy”.

Neo-liberalism was to be the basis for the New World Order of the Washington Consensus.

Unfortunately, the internal flaws in this ideology have led to its own demise.

Imagine a Chinese wage paying Western rent.

Why the West can't compete internationally, its labour has been priced out of the global market place.

We may want free trade but we had to understand its requirements.

A low cost of living.

The repeal of the Corn Laws ushered in the era of Laissez-Faire

The aristocratic landowners wanted high corn prices to get more land rent.

The businessmen wanted lower corn prices, to lower the cost of living for lower, internationally competitive wages.

I remember now, I did that in O-level History.

A schoolboy error underlying the New World Order.

Batman11's picture

Globalisation needed the cost of living in the West and East to converge, so the minimum wage would be almost the same everywhere.

The interests of national rentiers and international business are directly opposed in a free trade world.

The interests of the old money, landed, aristocracy and the business community, looking to open up international trade, were directly opposed in the fight to repeal the Corn Laws.

It’s the way it works.

The US has probably been the most successful in making its labour force internationally uncompetitive with soaring costs of housing, healthcare and student loan repayments.

A high cost of living needs high wages and protectionism.

A low cost of living is essential for free trade and requires subsidized housing, education and healthcare.

Trump has the protectionist solution.

Bernie had the re-distributive solution.


gcjohns1971's picture

Always thinking Half-thoughts are the purveyors of Socialism.

Fronts without backs.

Lefts without rights.

And To's without From's.

If Laissez faire did What you say then there is no "from" and your subsidies "To" don't really exist.

If it doesn't do what you say, then no subsidies are necessary.

See how that works?

The problem is that you look at State Interventionism - the opposite of Laissez Faire - and call it " Capitalism" and then prescribe even more state interventionism and look on in bewilderment when it doesn't work.

People like to steal.   It is an absolute.

All stealing, government authorized or not, is a disincentive to productivity.

Government people are still people.

The more power over money, trade, and production you give to the government, the more those things will "mysteriously" disappear into a multitude of pockets who are not the producers of that wealth.

Redistributive Socialist ideas are economically and factually sterile.

That is why you also have no birthrate.

People have themselves to take care of them.   No government is necessary or possible for that purpose...because PEOPLE LIKE TO STEAL. IT IS AN ABSOLUTE.  

Realizing this is called "growing up".  Understanding this means all "paternalism" or "welfare state" or "Communism" or "socialism" are lies.

They are lies because they violate one of the few absolutes of the human race:  PEOPLE LIKE TO STEAL.


avenriv's picture

turkey WAS NEVER supposed to join EU. Kohl, Sarkozy and other heavy-weights said long time ago: turkey will not join EU.

It is obvious why:

1. turkey will have an overwhelming voting weight

2. turkey will eat the majority of agricultural subsidies

3. turkey has another culture as the rest of Europe

this was said long before by heavy influence leaders in EU.


IranContra's picture

Turkey's Erdogan single-handedly saved humanity from World War III by betraying his own masters. He made a U-turn even after he helped NATO massively in creating ISIS and after shooting down a Russian airplane! World War III was so close. Obama almost made it to start World War III in Syria. Then, Erdogan said no to Satan and redeemed himself and saved humanity. He should be celebrated as a hero.

Putin was getting ready to defend Russia's interests in Syria, even with nukes. Then, Erdogan turned against NATO and ISIS and saved the world.

All the jerks attacking Erdogan are luciferian warmongers. What else?

flapdoodle's picture

Being a dyed in the wool conspiracy theorist, Its clear Putin and Erdogan have come to a agreement, perhaps with Xi for the new Silk Road and Turkey is no longer serious about joing the moribund EU.

My theory is this: Putin is *so* pissed off at the West, who have brazenly accused him of tampering with the Western elections (Trump, Brexit, future Merkel & French elections), something for which is likely completely innocent, that as revenge is has talked Erdogan into timing the latest Dutch row JUST SO WIlders can win. He will show the West how *REAL* tampering is done, elegant and no fingerprints.

IMHO Putin has correctly realized that the greatest blow against the NATO warmongers is in supporting Wilders/Brexit/LePen and the like. If Erdogan is the one "interfering" by causing a backlash, there is no way one can accuse Putin of tampering. If this wild eyed theory is true, well played by Putin.