Trump Admin Cracks Down On Visas For Coders

Tyler Durden's picture

As Nasdaq reaches ever record-er, record highs, it seems the ability to create a "Hello World" app is no longer enough to warrant an H1-B visa according to new guidelines from the Trump administration.

As The Hill reports, the new policy guidance that would make it harder for companies to use the H-1B visa program to bring foreign computer programmers into the U.S. A policy memo from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services changes the way the agency will process visa applications for computer programming positions, making companies jump through extra hoops to fill those jobs with foreign workers...

The memorandum also does not properly explain or distinguish an entry-level position from one that is, for example, more senior, complex, specialized, or unique.


Furthermore, the memorandum also did not accurately portray essential information from the Handbook that recognized that some computer programmers qualify for these jobs with only “2-year degrees.” While the memorandum did mention beneficiaries with “2-year” degrees, it incorrectly described them as “strictly involving the entering or review of code for an employer whose business is not computer related.”




Based on the current version of the Handbook, the fact that a person may be employed as a computer programmer and may use information technology skills and knowledge to help an enterprise achieve its goals in the course of his or her job is not sufficient to establish the position as a specialty occupation. Thus, a petitioner may not rely solely on the Handbook to meet its burden when seeking to sponsor a beneficiary for a computer programmer position. Instead, a petitioner must provide other evidence to establish that the particular position is one in a specialty occupation...

Companies use the H-1B program to import workers for highly skilled positions that are difficult to fill. The Trump administration, however, has alleged that tech companies and IT outsourcing firms have abused the program to the detriment of American workers.

The lottery for companies to apply for 2018 visas opened on Monday. Interestngly, as livemint reports, a feature film about the difficulties facing an Indian temporary work-visa holder waiting for permanent residency will be screened in 25 US cinemas on Friday, with backing from Silicon Valley investors, fuelling an already heated immigration debate.

Advocates of immigration often cite H1B success stories like Sundar Pichai of Google and Satya Nadella of Microsoft. But the work visas are controversial and critics say companies that use them the most — information technology services companies with the bulk of their operations in India — are hurting American workers by undercutting salaries and taking away jobs.

Workers who want to gain permanent residence are treated like indentured labor, said Vivek Wadhwa, Distinguished Fellow at Carnegie Mellon University’s College of Engineering. If they change jobs or take a promotion, they lose their turn in line, so they end up doing menial jobs during the most productive years of their lives, he said.

“I call this one of Silicon Valley’s darkest secrets,” said Wadhwa, who is also a director of research at Duke University’s Pratt School of Engineering.

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SMG's picture

THANK GOD!  One + for Trump today.

JRobby's picture

I would consider hiring the little kid in the pic just to get it away from the Swami

AllTimeWhys's picture

About damn time, make it happen Mr. President!

exi1ed0ne's picture

Cant find Americans to fill these positions my ass.  You can't find them at the current asking price/hr is more like.  I am interested to see if this is window dressing, or shit actually gets cleaned up with H1 and similar visas.

froze25's picture

There are plenty of qualified computer programmers to fill the positions. It's about time to end the artificial wage suppression being put on us by importing cheap labor.

knukles's picture


PLUS:  The President met with all the Silicon Valley folks and told them he wanted them to be as successful as they possibly could be.
In return they shit on him.
What the fuck do these people think would happen?
Next up!  Google and Tesla press releases that if we don't get the furriners in to code, the Teslas will crash and burn and that would be bad for Teslas.  Or some such shit.

You guys in Silicon Valley just trod all over your own dicks in your own cleats.
See, this is what being on the wrong end of political power feels like.
Always has always will
You guys had it good for all the past administrations. 
So go fuck yourselves, your Teslas, your basic black clothes affectations and liberal pamby mamby indoctrination hotshot shit.


Urban Roman's picture

Aren't the Teslas already crashing and burning?

Comtrend's picture
Comtrend (not verified) Urban Roman Apr 3, 2017 3:06 PM

Shit, no more cheap indian spammers to do marketing jobs. Time to do it yourself.

But who will pay for our pensions? What is that I hear from that direction?

The Ticking Time Bomb that Will Wipe Out Virtually Every Pension Fund in America


TwelveOhOne's picture

Note that this link goes to, so this is another of Xythras' accounts.  Reported to, I encourage others to do the same.

Art Van Delay's picture

It was Bill Gates brain child: TO DILUTE WHITE AMERICA

The H-1B visa program was created in 1990 to allow companies to bring skilled technical workers into the USA. It’s a non-immigrant visa and so has nothing at all to do with staying in the USA, becoming a citizen, or starting a business. Big tech employers are constantly lobbying for increases in H-1B quotas citing their inability to find qualified U.S. job applicants.

Bill Gates and other leaders from the IT industry have testified about this before Congress. Both major political parties embrace the H-1B program with varying levels of enthusiasm. But Bill Gates is wrong.What he said to Congress may have been right for Microsoft but was wrong for America and can only lead to lower wages, lower employment, and a lower standard of living. This is a bigger deal than people understand: it’s the rebirth of industrial labor relations circa 1920. Our ignorance about the H-1B visa program is being used to unfairly limit wages and steal — yes, steal — jobs from U.S. citizens.

There are a number of common misunderstandings about the H-1B program, the first of which is its size. H-1B quotas are set by Congress and vary from 65,000 to 190,000 per year. While that would seem to limit the impact of the program on a nation of 300+ million, H-1B is way bigger than you think because each visa lasts for three years and can be extended for another three years after that.

At any moment, then, there are about 700,000 H-1B visa holders working in the USA.

Most of these H-1B visa holders work in Information Technology (IT) and most of those come from India. There are about 500,000 IT workers in the USA holding H-1B visas. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, there are about 2.5 million IT workers in America. So approximately 20 percent of the domestic IT workforce isn’t domestic at all, but imported on H-1B visas. Keep this in mind as we move forward.

H-1B is a non-immigrant visa. H-1B holders can work here for 3-6 years but then have to return to their native countries. It’s possible for H-1B’s to convert to a different kind of visa but not commonly done. The most common way, in fact, for converting an H-1B visa into a green card is through marriage to a U.S. citizen.

H-1B isn’t the only way for foreigners to work in America. They can work to some extent on student visas and, in fact, many student visas are eventually converted to H-1B for those who have a job and want to stay but maybe not immigrate.

There is a misconception about the H-1B program that it was designed to allow companies to import workers with unique talents. There has long been a visa program for exactly that purpose. The O (for outstanding) visa program is for importing geniuses and nothing else. Interestingly enough, the O visa program has no quotas. So when Bill Gates complained about not being able to import enough top technical people for Microsoft, he wasn’t talking about geniuses, just normal coders.

H-1B visas are about journeyman techies and nothing else.

Companies can also transfer employees into the country who have worked for at least a year for the company overseas under an L-1 visa. These, too, are limited by quota and the quota is typically lower than for H-1Bs. Back in the late 1980s when the H-1B program was first being considered it was viewed as a preferable short term alternative to L-1. It has since turned into something else far darker.

So has the B visa, which is intended for companies to bring their foreign employees into the U.S. for business meetings and trade shows. You’d be amazed how many such business meetings and trade shows last 30 days as companies use B visas to enable foreign employees to work awhile in the U.S.  I’m told that IBM sometimes platoons workers on B visas, sending them to places like Mexico for a short time then bringing them back across the border for another stint.

Tourist visas are also commonly abused even though they specifically prohibit work.

The more interesting question here isn’t which multinational corporations consistently abuse B and tourist visas but which ones don’t, it is so common.

A key argument for H-1B has always been that there’s a shortage of technical talent in U.S. IT. This has been taken as a given by both major political parties. But it’s wrong. Here are six rigorous studies (123456) that show there is no shortage of STEM workers in the U.S. nor the likelihood of such a shortage in years to come.

You may recall a recent column here where the IT community in Memphis, TN proved there was no labor shortage in that technology hotbed.

The whole labor shortage argument is total hogwash. Yes, there is a labor shortage at substandard wages.

Can all of this be just about money? Yes.

The rules for H-1B visas state that they must be for technical positions for which there is no comparable U.S. citizen available and the position must pay the prevailing wage or higher.

It’s this definition of prevailing wage where we next see signs of H-1B abuse by employers. The intent of the original law was for companies not to use H-1B workers simply to save money. In the enabling legislation from 1990, however, there are two different definitions of the term “prevailing wage.” The first is quite strict while the second, which is used by self-certifying employers to set actual pay scales, has plenty of wiggle room.

Warning, dense reading ahead!

Here is the initial definition of “prevailing wage” in 8 USC 1182(n)(1)A)

  1. The employer­

(i) is offering and will offer during the period of authorized employment to aliens admitted or provided status as an H–1B nonimmigrant wages that are at least­

(ii) the actual wage level paid by the employer to all other individuals with similar experience and qualifications for the specific employment in question, or

(iii) the prevailing wage level for the occupational classification in the area of employment,

And here is the redefinition of “prevailing wage” in 8 USC 1182(p)(4):

(4) Where the Secretary of Labor uses, or makes available to employers, a governmental survey to determine the prevailing wage, such survey shall provide at least 4 levels of wages commensurate with experience, education, and the level of supervision. Where an existing government survey has only 2 levels, 2 intermediate levels may be created by dividing by 3, the difference between the 2 levels offered, adding the quotient thus obtained to the first level and subtracting that quotient from the second level.

pitz's picture

Very true.  H-1B can and should be shut down completely, its holders deported.  O-1 is the appropriate visa for truly best and brightest talent, but it requires evidence of such, which probably would be lacking in most (but not literally all) H-1B holders. 

Never One Roach's picture

Another WIN for the Home team.

Mr.Danglemeat's picture

I managed an apartment complex in the west. Two guys from India rented two 2 bedroom apartments from me and then moved 4 guys into each apartment. All of the guys were H1B, married and shortly after moving in they brought their wives over on tourist visas (3 months) then, as each woman got knocked-up they took 1 bedroom apartments and kept their wives outta sight for the remaining 6 months of the pregnancy...nine months later, off to the hospital where she poops out an American citizen and Voila' nobody ever has to go back to that shit-fest called India.

The guys were paid jack-shit because the real pay-off was the assignment to the land of Milk-n-Honey USA.

H1B, yeah it's a real fuckin' well run program.

mtanimal's picture

Excellent post - and I know from experience you are 100% correct.

Bigly's picture

Excellent post.

I agree it is all about $$$.  Funny how those numbers do not stack up with what i see everyday.

Coders: i would say over 50% are Indian. Depending on the area or project some are north of 75-80%.

QA:  they do not even hide this anymore...does anyone have a QA dept that is not over 90% Indian? They pull cognizant or ilk  in and sometimes it is 100% Indian.   100%.  I speak from first hand that i found that fucking appalling.   New england is screwed for jobs and it's BULLSHIT that Americans cannot do this.

BAs. Business BAs are majority american still, but BSAs are not.  Project managers used to be only american, now i would estimate 20%+ Indian. On highly techie projects, 50+%

I am sick of going into stores like bjs wholesale and 75% of the patrons are Indians. They are all h1bs. I know this. It exploded like an algae bloom. It was NOT that noticable even 5 years ago.

Outsourcing on steroids here. BIGLY.

This is now the insurance industry. People who code YOUR annuities, healthcare, etc.  They do not know the industry. It is a  joke.  I can peg it at Aoooa. It was 1998 and they brought in Infosys for just a little low end code. It rapidly expanded to other tasks. But the huge acceleration to Indian was in the last 5 years.

How do you like paying those inflated deductibles and premiums? You think insurance companies are paying their employees? Fuck no. We keep Chennai families fed, not Americans.

I am ready to spit on these companies.

legalize's picture

The biggest downside of H1-Bs is that as whitey you can't date these cute, smart indian girls because their family has already married them off to someone else in India as a promise.  I'm not even sure they (the girls) get to say no if the guy's a total douche.

Mr.Danglemeat's picture

slip her a roofie, bang that curry ass and when she wakes up, she'll realize that because she's now a "soiled Dove" her arranged marriage is off and she's free to fuk anybody she wants to..or not... just trying to help.

divingengineer's picture

If you can get past the odor and the body hair, you are welcome to them.
The sideburns, geesh, they look like Martin Van Buren for Christ's sake.

Refuse-Resist's picture

less than 5% pass the boner test for White men IMO.

There are a few though that are quite fetching.

DontGive's picture

Cosby the curry, brilliant!

bob_bichen's picture
bob_bichen (not verified) Comtrend Apr 3, 2017 9:56 PM

RE: chronic SPAMMER "COMTREND" (new log-on APril 3) AKA  "hotclips"  AKA  "blue fin"  AKA  "audio feeline"  AKA  "XYTHRAS"  (all the same person SPAMMING and then upvoting himself).

>>>>> DO NOT CLICK THE LINK "goo,gl" on Comtrend's comment!!! <<<<<<

This CHRONIC SPAMMER has strewn off-topic comments for his MALWARE- TROJAN  AND VIRUS-LADEN WEBSITE  "dailywesterner,com" for many, many months.  Many log-ons have been banned (adios "XYTHRAS") but, like crabs and parking tickets, he just keeps coming back.

** TODAY he is "hiding" his link to "dailywesterner" as a "goo,gl" link so that, perhaps, wise readers won't catch on.***

SEND an email to and ask that this SERIAL SPAMMER, and all his various log-on, be permanently BANNED>

Comtrend (new log-on April 3)

blue fin
audio feeline

etc. etc

johngaltfla's picture

Too late for one of my friends who committed suicide after training his 4 Indian replacements. This was years ago but is all too sad and common a story in the slave chambers known as I.T. and Silicon Valley.

yogibear's picture

He should have shot a few instead killing himself and claimed insanity. Sent his replacements back in body bags.

Titus's picture

"What do you do when your visa ends?"


Was that so hard?

NumNutt's picture

I worked for a large credit card procesor, about a dozen years ago. when I started at the company they had a full department of programers, did it all in house. Then one day they hire a "consulting firm" in india to "help with the work load". The american programmers trained the Indian counter parts. One year latter, management came in one day and laid all the American programmers off except one, he became the manager, all the indian programmers, in India, reported to him. Saved the company a shit load of money. Lower wages, no healthcare. Yep totally fucked all those guys (The Americans, and the Indians). Made everyones jobs fucking impossible, language barrier was a big problem, but they never turned back, was like that until I left years later...

AustrianJim's picture

The important thing is that the quality of the code dramatically increased.

rbianco3's picture

Not sure where you were seeing this, but from what I experience, the corporations assign one US citizen as the point-person for India labor, which is done fast but with inferior quality and with severe communcation deficits and mistakes.

The point person must start very early or work very late so as to interface with the Indians.

So they've outsourced the work, put responsibility on one developer, and forced that one citizen to work 60+ hours weekly to do their job.

And the citizen is working at the same rate (or lower) than they earned in the '90s

So a HUGE +1 for Trump 

asteroids's picture

Back in Ye Olde Days I worked in America with an H1B because I WAS one of the few people on the planet (at that time) that could write a "Hello World" app correctly. But the program has been abused. Pity. The downside is that all those folks won't be forced to sign up for Selective Service and fight Obozos last war. It's true in the event of war the DOD can force non-citizens to fight.

NurseRatched's picture

Artificial wage suppression?

Isn't that called the Free Market?

By restricting the foreigners, we are creating an artificial wage enhancer. Why are we coddling coders? What makes them immune form natural market forces?

Why are ZHers such flaming libs on this issue?

exi1ed0ne's picture

You can't compete with slavery fucker.  HB-1's have one purpose only - importing cheap, exploitable labor to drive the real cost of wages down with Government's interference in the market.

Hb-1's either do what they are told or get shiped back to whatever shithole they escaped from.  Hardly free market.

rbianco3's picture

And they (Indians) are SLAVES in every sense.

They are married to their firm until Green card is processed, meaning they are forced to work at rates far lower than even their green card Indians receive for four or five years.

H1B sucks balls and is the reason I went John Galt from a $150,000 job for almost two years under Obama. I returned to work under Trump - and if things don't improve I'm going Galt until I die - I will not serve the corporations as a slave, even for low six figures.

IntTheLight's picture

They bring girlfriends here. Marry and have a little anchor baby and get welfare for the little tyke. They are highly subsidized by the taxpayer. And get backdoor to citizenship through the little tyke.

Do the corps have to pay in for SS? If not, another win. Privatize profits and socialize the costs.

rbianco3's picture

WHY you ask?

Because we don't IMPORT Lawyers from India on H1B and hurt the lawyers when there are enough of the slimy folks here.

You can say that about most decent paying careers in the US except software.

IntTheLight's picture

There are about 3 billion people who wish to come here. Sorry! Let them fix their crummy little countries rather than destroy ours. How far down do you wish to see wages fall? And how much population growth from third world countries do you wish to embrace?

Humans are not interchangeable. Immigration is an outdated, disastrous 20th century experiment. Time to end it.

If diversity enriches a country, then let India and China swap out half their population. Toss in a half million Africans for each country. Then let's talk.

z80kid's picture

"Artificial wage suppression? Isn't that called the Free Market?"

No, it isn't. In a truly free global market, the American business owners *could* get cheap labor from the third world, but they would be out of business because their customers could buy everything they want the same way. These people are using the government to escape the American market for labor, while selling their services to Americans who cannot use the government to get what they want outside the American market.

IntTheLight's picture

American programmers don't have bedbugs! That's why they are disqualified. They also don't push women aside to get on elevators. And they don't make the office smell bad.

HelluvaEngineer's picture

It's all a crock of shit.  No one ever mentions how prejudiced these people are, either.  Once one of them gets into a management position they will ONLY hire asians to work under them.  Those positions become unavailable for white and black Americans.

TwelveOhOne's picture

Once worked for some caste-based motherfucker; agreed.

IntTheLight's picture

Um, yes. That has been my observation. They only hire their own. I heard bosses get kickbacks from their fellow Indians for hiring them. Lovely culture.

johnconnor's picture

This is 110% true, I work for a very big techlogy company, we were hiring to grow the team and I have been interviewing different people, most of them Americans, a few international top talents. We had selected a group of 4 elite people, 3 americans, 1 non american. Reorg two weeks ago, now I report to an Indian origin manager (US passport but born and raised in India), he okayed to one of these 4, rejected the other 3 with bogus excuses and now we are starting another round of interviews. Guess the country of origin of every single resume I am being asked to interview? All Indians. HR knows, nobody gives a shit. One of them flat out lied about having worked on a customer on a country where I worked and knew everyone on the project, he never worked there. Another one flat out lied about his education, some of them try to say they have a master degree with 2 year diploma mills. It is in the culture to lie, cheat and stablish a cabal where nobody but their tribe will ever be hired. Don't get me started with personal hygiene, in 2017 half of the Indian population still shit on the street 

IntTheLight's picture

DOJ says no company may discriminate against Americans. Report your company. Use fake address etc to protect yourself. Email CEO with fake name from outside website and tell him you are reporting him.

Refuse-Resist's picture

Every ethnic group in teh world plays 'tribal' but whites.

Period. Full stop.

We don't start playing by their rules, we lose and lose big.


Our (((rulers))) want us gone. It's working.

Fight back.

canisdirus's picture

That is one of the things I hate the most about them. I've never received a job where I came in and there were a bunch of Indians. They'll pepper you with "stump the american" questions in their unintelligible accents about some random esoteric topics using commonwealth terminology. Once a team gets an Indian majority (let alone one at the helm), say goodbye to any other race ever working there again.

dark fiber's picture

You do understand that most of those H1B holders are not competent even at basic level right?  The thing you have to realize about coding is that there are infarct very few people who can actually design a complete program and design the associated data structures and classes.  The rest of the "coders" involved are just typists.  They just type text without even knowing WTF they are doing.   There are several commercial codes that got open sourced and you can see exactly that effect.  There are  coding errors there that can only be made by somebody who is incompetent at a fundamental level. I have seen some very striking examples of this.

GTC's picture

Exactly. Most of them have no clue what the fuck they are doing. 

yogibear's picture

For the most part they are conformist. They are do what they are told even if it's wrong. They make good slaves. They can be yelled at, called names, sworn at and abused and they will smile. They will work 18 hour days with no complaints. They work for cheap.

Software slaves, it's why companies are replacing Americans with them. They can be abused.