Bill Gross Issues "Mea Culpa" Sees 0% Growth For Developed Economies Over The Coming Quarters

Tyler Durden's picture

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
achmachat's picture

this is pretty big. If I'm not wrong, a lot of folks out there listen to him and mainstream reaction is bound to follow.

MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

Bill Gross got what was comming to him when he had the sheer audacity to short safe-haven US treasuries. Let this be a lesson for anyone else who thinks about betting against America. You do NOT want to be short the world's number one safe-haven asset during a time of crisis. US- treasuries are the only asset that can protect you and your family during these uncertain times.

SheepDog-One's picture

If you think US Treasuries are a safe haven then youre a fucking idiot.

Biosci's picture

Is this the friday afternoon humor post?

topcallingtroll's picture

Yes. Ya gotta love hamy, i mean million dollar bonus.

But it has been true so far.
I used to like Bill Gross until he started dissing the united states merely to talk his book.

I have some respect for legitimate criticism not based on financial motives.

Bill showed himself to be a whining loser and his losses bring me joy, particularly since he made the same mistake shorting treasuries after qe 1. He claims he wasnt short, but Tyler proved him to be a liar in addirion to a conniving mercenary whiner.

Biosci's picture

It's a shame, really.  I used to think he was Mr. Trial Balloon for the Fed, since he was so spot on in predicting Fed policy.  You'd think that would be a license to print money, but if he knows policy changes in advance and still manages to lose money, then the PTB may have really lost control of this thing.

AldousHuxley's picture

Pimpco VS Fed and Fed won because it had the backing of ECB and Chinese central banks too.

 

But Mr. Gross has nothing on US Fed after socialism handout:

  1. he got bailout for $1.7B on fannie mae freddie mac deal
  2. hired Alan Greenspan to do inside the Fed trading
  3. hired Neel Kashkari of TARP fame

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aifsOWlwkqYM

http://www.pimco.com/EN/Experts/Pages/NeelKashkari.aspx

 

SO STFU Gross with your government subsidies and inside info and tell El-Erian to stop yapping on CNBC (parent GE got bailed out)

 

99% should go protest at his newport beach gambling parlor.

 

Cynical Sidney's picture

"My fabulous rock of a wife"

never heard of that expression before; my take is that his rock of a fund (total return or whatever it's called) is imploding and he needs to find a new rock of gibraltar to lean on. as for bill's '0% growth' forecast, debt driven growth will not offset negative growth and we are in a depression; after some sugarcoating and windowdressing bill says let's just call it '0% growth"

ps. milliondollabonus is a disingenuous fraud, he's probably selling all of his tnotes right now so he could buy more bullion, ignore his comments.

LongBallsShortBrains's picture

Did you forget who you were talking to?

How he keeps a straight face while typing that shit is beyond me.

Cynical Sidney's picture

that wouldn't be hard for folks who have an ulterior motive or some hidden agenda. for all i know milliondollarbonus could be some cuban agent trying to undermine democracy in the US by working up sentiments against the kleptocracy, or maybe his wife left him for a bankster and he wants bankster blood (in which case i'd be happy to oblige him)

topcallingtroll's picture

He has totally outclassed me as a troll. I am getting jealous.

Schmuck Raker's picture

"for all i know milliondollarbonus could be some cuban agent trying to undermine democracy in the US by working up sentiments against the kleptocracy..."

Huh? Shouldn't you be thanking him? Or...huh?

Cynical Sidney's picture

nope i'm not ready to go that far, at least not until he speaks his mind. but i enjoy milliondollarbonus' crazy antics, his parody of the FED, his mocking bernanke's ponzinomics, i find it amusing ;D

spiral_eyes's picture

If it helps, it's totally possible for stocks to crash up before hyperinflation hits. When the sovereigns really start moving out of US Treasuries and into gold and "productive" assets (read: S&P500) it could look like Benny was right all along for a few months. 

And then (for whatever reason, but quite possibly an oil shock) the failed bond auctions hit, treasuries crash, rates spike, and a massive flood of dollars ($trillions) is pushed onto the economy as investors try to get their hands on anything tangible.

KA-BOOM, bitchez.

When Benny is finished i predict DJIA $36,000. The problem is bread would be $36,000, too.

http://azizonomics.com/2011/10/14/the-great-treasury-dumping-game-begins/ 

SheepDog-One's picture

Somethings got to give soon. I dont know about protracted economic developments playing out anymore, I think theyll just take us into a world war like the other depressions.

spiral_eyes's picture

I've been writing about that today, too:

I’m coming to believe that the military-Keynesian establishment might try and kill every bird with one stone — a new regional war, probably involving Syria, Iran and Israel in Eurasia. Let’s look at what that might accomplish:

  1. Create a new post-9/11-style hard-to-question patriotism — “There’s a war on — we all need to rally together around the flag — the complainers and protestors must hate America”
  2. Put America back to work — in weapons factories, and on the front lines.
  3. Give the economy a large Keynesian injection — through war spending.
  4. Take out Iran, a powerful enemy of America — and send a threatening message to other uppity Eurasian autocracies like Russia and China.
  5. Curtail civil liberties & censor the internet — “There’s a war on — we all need to rally together around the flag — and those who don’t must be working to undermine America”

http://azizonomics.com/2011/10/14/war-the-quickest-way-to-kill-a-protest-movement/ 

 

derek_vineyard's picture

too much in-fighting with the Jones's to unify

survival of the fittest and luckiest and a total reset

AldousHuxley's picture

Nowadays computer science degree from MIT is not "fit" enough.

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405274870469960457534275192733443...

 

Extreme wealth is all about luck...many bullshitters sitting in corporate offices outsourcing and offshoring jobs to non-US citizens while collecting and complaining about lack to STEM workers.

 

Well I guess there's always the lottery or a gun.

 

Schmuck Raker's picture

"4. Take out Iran, a powerful enemy of America..."

"Powerful"? Your kidding right? They IMPORT oil, for cryin' out loud.

Pakistan would be a challenge, I bet. And get us on the Indians good side to boot. We'll need their help to pressure China's back door when we invade through the South China Sea, leveraging our assets in Brunei.

reflex_121's picture

SE,

I like!  That's some cold, hard logic friendo. 

I was just discussing this type of scenario with a co-worker today. 

progression:

new threat emerges through either attack on western soil or oil pipelines.

us convenes with western partners.

un resolution to establish war.

patriotic fervor is amplified by the media and/or brainless citizens.

those raging against the system via "ows" means will be deemed malcontents and unpatriotic/unproductive scum.

goals:

turn the tables on civil disobedience.

adrenaline boost to economy via manufacturing.

war bonds issued in us and eu to shore up auctions.

aids unemployment.

 

now, this type of pathological thinking is anathema to most (including myself), which makes it precisely right when viewed through the prism of our leaders and the unquenched thirst for power.

stay thirsty, friendo.

 

 

 

NoClueSneaker's picture

... I took a walk this evening. Something ist changing very fast, and the smell of the real change is in the air, despite all that brainwashing " Uns geht's  gut "...

The mightiest of all warlords rides again - General Fear .

K, maybe I'm just imagining it. I'd like to.

knukles's picture

MDB.
A week or so ago, you'd been on a crusade suggesting that everybody should be happy about paying taxes... implying more is good, America, patriotism, etc. 
I had challenged you to in fact do as you preach, to show all of us the quality of your character, that you are indeed a man of honor amd integrity by following up upon your own suggestions.  And to inform all of us publicily, veryify that you in fact had done so.
I offered you a once in a lifetime opportunity to show the quality of your convictions, to assure us that you are not simply a shill expousing nonsensical diatribes in which you truly hold no conviction. 
Thus I ask you outright sir, have you yet made additional volitinal contributions of personal monies above and beyond that required under the tax code to the Federal Government?
Thereby proudly supporting the country you so love?
Please let us know.
Indeed, you should be grateful for such an opportunity, both philosophically as it is in concert with your stated beliefs and as a proud American to establish a precedent to which we may all aspire. 
We look forward to your exercise of this amazing privilige to show your patriotic feality with America.
Please demonstrate such for us, verifying such.  We eagerly support your contibutions to our country in a time of need.
Remember, it takes a village of many giving altruistically for the benefit of Your Federal Family.

Biosci's picture

It is possible, knuckledragger, than he was being facetious then and is being facetious now.  Just a thought.

MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

It would be highly inappropriate to disclose my tax details to the public, but mark my word there are many Americans who simply do not pay their FAIR SHARE of money to the government. This is a time to make sacrifices for your country and allow the most talented politicians and economists to allocate capital for maximum effect.

knukles's picture

If one should make sacrifices, then we call upon you to show us how, to lead by example as any Great Patriotic American would do.  And if disclosure is good enough for Warren Buffet, it's good enough for you, too. 
Nothig whatsoever inappropriate about it.  Time as you said, for sacrifice.  Particulary when the Our Counrty is facing such dark hours ahead.
So quit with the dissembling, diversions and pablum.
Stand up and be counted as a True Americn Patriot.

Do you love America or Not?

Display your honor, credibility and feality, your love of America.

Else we might take you as a Troll.
Or just not take you seriously.
Which nobody wants to do, for we all love America and Her True Patriots.
Time to Man Up for America, Sir.

The Weight of Leadership is Heavy.

SpeakerFTD's picture

I love your stuff, MDB.   And I am surprised some of the frequent commenters still fall for your clever trolls.

Yamaha's picture

Million DollAR Bonus - you have the best POKER face of anyone on this sight!  Bless you....

From
Rick Perry

Schmuck Raker's picture

MillionDollarBonus_,

How can you be so heartless, and cruel? Have you no shame, sir?

Mr. Gross' letter is the most beautiful, and touching I've read in quite some time. (And this, among many other moving missives from Fund Managers, and like-minded Patriots we, here at Zero Hedge, have had the undeserved good fortune to be blessed with.)How can you denigrate such a fine man, and yourself, by presenting such callous commentary.

Was he mistaken in his analysis? Yes, yes...to be sure. But, he had no idea that what was clearly a most concrete recovery would be torpedoed by events in Europe. Nobody, nobody could have seen what was coming. Your advantage of hindsight should not be assumed by yourself to be carte blanch to criticize Mr. Gross.

I haven't the time to engage with you in a discussion explaining the merits, nay...the blessed wisdom of occasional "short selling". So I'll leave you with a thought for you to ponder.

"Is not the healthiest tree made stronger, indeed more whole, by artist pruning now and then?"

Respectfully,

A Humble Schmuck

He_Who Carried The Sun's picture

"Let this be a lesson for anyone else who thinks about betting against America. You do NOT want to be short the world's number one safe-haven asset during a time of crisis. US- treasuries are the only asset that can protect you and your family during these uncertain times."

Sure. Put in your ante already? Good! I hold and raise by 100%.

You can call or raise, its your choice but do not base your calculations on ideology or it will be game over sooner than I'd hoped for, silly.

Buck Johnson's picture

What you should have said was don't let the govt. know that you are shorting Treasuries big time.  Because they will do everything in their power to make sure you don't collect on that bet.  He bet against the US and him thinking that he was an insider (I still like to know why he did it in the first place, he's an insider he had to know that US treasuries and the dollar is important for the US and they will protect it no matter what).  And for him to make this mia culpa, he must have lost alot more than what he is letting on. I'm not saying that US treasuries are sound, they aren't.  But the US will do an manipulation it can to make sure US treasuries are bedrock or appear bedrock.

Divided States of America's picture

Nah, this guy is grossly overrated as an asset manager.

Yamaha's picture

No - he's just gay.............a switch hitter!

Deadpool's picture

one of the great comeuppances on Wall Street. next to Bill Miller and Warren Buffett this has been a classic too big to succeed story. Gross is a book talkin' asshole. You cannot invest along side him and make money...now you cannot invest with him and his Titanic of debt shit fund Total Return. What a scumbag earning fees for himself and Allianz while returning less then zero. burn, Bill, burn!

Caviar Emptor's picture

did Gross just jinx the recession out of existence?

No. The term "Recession" has simply gotten more complex.

And that's for the same reason that Bill Gross (and many other experts) got it wrong on inflation/deflation in 2011. 

Biflation is a tough concept to accept in a world that was once more simple. Yes, there can be inflation and deflation co-existing side by side. Net-net, that means decreasing buying power of money. Which means a constrained consumer and margin squeezes for most business. Necessities are inflating. Personal assets like real estate and incomes are deflating. 

So Bill Gross projects 0% growth. But that doesn't mean that there won't be inflation. What will that mean for interest rates? Volatility. For the same reason Gross did a 180 on his investment thesis for Treasuries. Some will perceive 0% growth, others will see monetary inflation. The two are currently canceling each other out and that's why we have biflation. And CPI will never reveal inflation with housing dragging down 40% of the calculated figure. 

AngryGerman's picture

"biflation"? if i understand that correctly, it just like a girl being digging dicks and cunts

topcallingtroll's picture

Stagflation bitchez.

We have seen this before. No need to make up words that show your lack of ejumacation.

jimmyjames's picture

Biflation is a tough concept to accept in a world that was once more simple. Yes, there can be inflation and deflation co-existing side by side. Net-net, that means decreasing buying power of money. Which means a constrained consumer and margin squeezes for most business. Necessities are inflating. Personal assets like real estate and incomes are deflating.

So Bill Gross projects 0% growth. But that doesn't mean that there won't be inflation. What will that mean for interest rates? Volatility. For the same reason Gross did a 180 on his investment thesis for Treasuries. Some will perceive 0% growth, others will see monetary inflation. The two are currently canceling each other out and that's why we have biflation. And CPI will never reveal inflation with housing dragging down 40% of the calculated figure.

*************

You cannot have both Inflation and Deflation at the same time-

Both are monetary phenomena -money supply and credit supply-

If cash and credit are going in opposite directions-it's as simple as which one is contracting or expanding by the largest amount-

Asset values decreasing is deflation-(a decrease in personal balance sheet worth ie: decrease in personal money supply)

Housing prices are not included in CPI and haven't been for years-

They used "owners equivalent rent" to hide the Inflation of the last 30 years and now they will use it to hide the Deflation in housing values-


Caviar Emptor's picture

The old concept was one of  "a strictly monetary phenomenon".  However those concepts were designed to describe a much simpler world. Today, you could contract the money supply to zero and still have inflation. The dollar is global reserve currency and there are oceans of dollars outside the porous border of the US economy. Same way that for 3-4 decades there was near limitless monetary inflation with concomitant price deflation due to the special arrangement between the US and China where money was sterilized into  a form of seller-financing. There are even more complexities to this theory that I have been discussing on ZH for 2 years. Many are becoming hip to the Biflation theory (see today's Casey Report cited on ZH) and it's gaining acceptance. But the Fed's Chicago monetarists get pale at the mere suggestion of it because it defies all that they have theorized regarding the cause and effect of their money printing and interest rate tweeking

SpeakerFTD's picture

I have been arguing for a "Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs"-flation for the last few years.  The notional values of any product will move depending on the vagaries of the central banks, but the key is to understand the relative value between products.   The spread between products at the bottom of the hierarchy and the products at the top is going to be closed over the next few years.   In the worst case, you will find that a product at the top of the hierarchy that used to be valued at >100x of a bottom product will be valued at <1x that bottom product.

AldousHuxley's picture

here is a little secret...you can meet ALL of maslow's hierarchy of needs with..... a gun. That's what OWS really needs...guns. Just rob the banksters and sleep with their wives. fuck them as they fucked you. eye for an eye bitches!

jimmyjames's picture

The old concept was one of  "a strictly monetary phenomenon".  However those concepts were designed to describe a much simpler world.

Same way that for 3-4 decades there was near limitless monetary inflation

Today, you could contract the money supply to zero and still have inflation.

***********

I don't believe the concept of inflation and deflation as strictly monetary phenomena has changed at all-no different today then the clipping of gold by the Romans-

I agree that prices can run opposite to the money supply-but prices cannot hang above the market clearing level for long-affordability enters the picture and prices must clear-or your commodity is essentially worthless-

Yes we've had horrendous inflation for the past 30 years and to see where the inflation occurred-you need to look at both credit and money/cash-

Cash supply

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/BASE

Credit supply

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/TCMDO

The Credit supply makes the cash supply look pathetic-

Caviar Emptor's picture

I agree that prices can run opposite to the money supply-but prices cannot hang above the market clearing level for long-affordability enters the picture and prices must clear-or your commodity is essentially worthless-

Affordability to whom? As the US consumer withers, the Chinese step in. All the holders of oceans of dollars around the world can support price and make it go even higher even if it's unaffordable to Americans . 

jimmyjames's picture

Affordability to whom? As the US consumer withers, the Chinese step in. All the holders of oceans of dollars around the world can support price and make it go even higher even if it's unaffordable to Americans .

**************

There is no oceans of dollars-(BASE) above-

There is debt that needs to be paid but obviously it hasn't been-

How in hell can China compete with 35 cents an hour wages?

China is like we were ATM'n the friggen house-living on credit-

China will crash and go into deflation-just like us-

Prices will meet affordability-they "must"

The growing protests around the world guarantee it-

Don't think for a second they're not looking down from their ivory towers with a chill running up their spine-