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Black Friday Gun Sales Break Records

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Even as Joe Sixpack was maxing out that last credit card on useless gadgets (but not flat screen TVs as Corning was so nice to warn), he was making sure to have enough in store for that one final Plan Z purchase. Guns. As KNDU reports, "Gun dealers flooded the FBI with background check requests from shoppers,  smashing the single day record with a 32% increase from last year." USA Today has more: "Deputy Assistant FBI Director Jerry Pender said the checks, required by federal law, surged to 129,166 during the day, far surpassing the previous high of 97,848 on Black Friday of 2008." And in reality, the number is likely far greater: "The actual number of firearms sold last Friday is likely higher because multiple firearms can be included in a transaction by a single buyer. And the FBI does not track actual gun sales." And while Saudi Arabia is warning that women driving leads to the end of the world, in America women are now the marginal guy buyer: "Some gun industry analysts attributed the unusual surge to a convergence of factors, including an increasing number of first-time buyers seeking firearms for protection and women who are being drawn to sport shooting and hunting. Larry Keane, a spokesman for the National Shooting Sports Foundation, said 25% of the purchases typically involve first-time buyers, many of them women. "I think there also is a burgeoning awakening of the American public that they do have a constitutional right to own guns," Keane said. Yet Keane said last Friday's number appeared to defy complete explanation. "It's really pretty amazing," he said." Indeed it is, and unlike Europe, where with the exception of Switzerland the best the local rioters can do is some imported (from the US) tear gas, when the Arab Spring finally makes landfall, it will be time to use up those one way international frequent flier miles (assuming of course that American and soon others don't cancel them).

More from KNDU:

In the Tri-Cities, sporting goods stores say they've seen an increase in sales in the last four years. Griggs in Pasco saw a 25 % increase in sales from Black Friday last year.

 

Wholesale Sports in Kennewick has an increase of 35 percent%.

 

"Normally it's electronics and people are out there looking for that screaming hot deal, and we were discussing that maybe women were out doing that shopping and their husbands were out buying their own Christmas gifts," says Charlie Grigg, whose family owns the ACE Hardware Griggs store.

 

Grigg says more than half of the calls that come into the store are for the gun department. They even had to put in extra phone lines to do background checks. Managers from both Griggs and Wholesale Sport say the presidential elections have a big effect on sales.  Sales went up four years ago when Obama was elected into office and they say with the new elections around the corner, many fear the President will work on changing gun control laws during his second term in office.

And for the attention and reading challenged:

 

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Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:00 | 1943279 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

Na, I think I will stay right here. I also firmly believe in our constitution. 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:24 | 1942947 philipat
philipat's picture

It's fun winding folks up!! I was actually attempting a "Vote down" record and am doing quite well.

There is a serious point though. In the most famous case of DC versus Heller, SCOTUS made a narrow decision with the following dissenting opinion:

In a dissenting opinion, joined by Justices David Souter, Ruth Bader Ginsburg, and Stephen Breyer, Justice John Paul Stevens said:

The (Second) Amendment’s text does justify a different limitation: the “right to keep and bear arms” protects only a right to possess and use firearms in connection with service in a state-organized militia. Had the Framers wished to expand the meaning of the phrase “bear arms” to encompass civilian possession and use, they could have done so by the addition of phrases such as “for the defense of themselves”.
Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:39 | 1942989 reescher
reescher's picture

You probably do real well in a pub on a saturday night.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:56 | 1943192 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

Must be a Chica-metrosexualville-go lawyer.  They don't do too well in bars up here during snowmobile season....

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:40 | 1942993 CompassionateFascist
CompassionateFascist's picture

2 Jews, 2 Cosmic WASPs. Figures.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:47 | 1943006 dwdollar
dwdollar's picture

"state-organized militia"

Whose ass did they pull that from? It reads:

"well regulated militia"

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:52 | 1943020 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

They pulled it from their hats, of course.  That bunch doesn't like citizens with firearms.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:15 | 1943295 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

"well regulated militia"

And in this case "regulated" means well trained in the use of arms.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 15:10 | 1944462 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Actually well regulated meant well functioning back then.

A brand new corvette is a well regulated sports car.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:04 | 1943070 KK Tipton
KK Tipton's picture

"Had the Framers wished to expand the meaning of the phrase “bear arms” to encompass civilian possession and use, they could have done so by the addition of phrases such as “for the defense of themselves”.

Like these "dissenting" pukes could have done a better job of writing the Constititution?
They lack the education.

Supreme arrogance on display.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:11 | 1943089 VelvetHog
VelvetHog's picture

The right to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Pushing Your Red Arrow.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:54 | 1943187 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

and if it wasn't a dissenting opinion, you might have some authority there

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 08:49 | 1943561 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I call complete bullshit.

"It's fun winding folks up!! I was actually attempting a "Vote down" record and am doing quite well. There is a serious point though."

You know how I know this new statement of yours is bullshit?...from your first statement...

"In most countries this is known as the military."

Any Supreme Court judge or commenter (like you) who offers an opinion citing another countrys laws or norms as an avenue to interpret our law and rights should be dismissed out of hand as a dangerous globalist sock puppet.

Ruth Bader Ginsberg does this shit almost constantly...drives me up the wall. No other country or organization has or should have influence over our domestic laws & rights.

Now lets all sing kum-fucking-bayah.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 12:01 | 1943891 g speed
g speed's picture

Lying pile of back peddling shit--You ment exactly what you said-- Typical lib/commie-- love of state over all.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:25 | 1942954 reescher
reescher's picture

philpat is stuck at -80. it won't let me vote him down anymore. anyone else?

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:33 | 1942974 Rome is burining
Rome is burining's picture

Yes "armed militias" ..... to fight the government..... if they ever become tyrannical or oppressive, which we know is a rediculous notion!  It's not like OUR government would ever do something rediculous like suspend our constitutional rights and give the President unilateral authority to declare one of our citizens a terrorist and then deny him a trial or anything silly like that!!!!

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:38 | 1942986 Simple.Machine
Simple.Machine's picture

Saying the 2nd amendment is not an individual right is like saying the first amendment only applies to professional reporters and the media. How many of the other rights listed in the Bill of Rights are not individual rights?

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:17 | 1943296 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

Rights denoted in the tenth amendment accrue unto either the people or the individual states.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:49 | 1943011 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

Get the fuck out you troll. "...the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed"

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:02 | 1943066 VelvetHog
VelvetHog's picture

The Supreme Court in all its corporations-are-people-too corruptitude doesn't agree with you, dawg.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:14 | 1943094 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Well philipat, as far as I know you now have the record!

+ 1 and -120

 

Signed,

An Armed Bearing

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:33 | 1943141 fuu
fuu's picture

MDB has had well over -250.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:21 | 1943105 Bananamerican
Bananamerican's picture

did Philipat set a ZH record?

i bought a "muthafuckin glock" 19...

if it's good enough for the fuzz it's good enough for me

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:35 | 1943148 San Diego Gold Bug
San Diego Gold Bug's picture

philipat Fool,

  Do you know how many retired military people there are in this country, The Great USA, that own guns?  Can you say Springfield M1A .308 with special Night Force night vision scope (500 yards in the dead of night is nothing)!  It is our right, one of the things that has made us great and help provide not only our freedom but the freedom of others (many of us died saving Europes ass from hitler).  hitler took away the guns and look what happened!  Maybe you should just stay inside and let us continue to do the heavy lifting for you!

A Patriot

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:35 | 1943150 xtop23
xtop23's picture

Your words have the ring of a lawyer for the Obama administration sir.

You didn't perchance attend Columbia did you? 

Saul Alinsky is your God.

FIN~

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:29 | 1943193 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

This is easy to clear up.  The Bill of Rights (the 1st 10 Amendments to the Constitution) protects INDIVIDUAL rights AGAINST the government...all 10 of the Amendments in the Bill of Rights do this, not just one or two of them.  The 2nd Amendment is one of those rights of INDIVIDUALS against government infringement.  Got it?

"Firearms stand next in importance to the constitution itself."  George Washington

"Americans have the advantage of being armed -unlike the citizens of other countries countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms." (James Madison -author of the US Constitution- The Federalist Papers #46 at 243-244)

Looks Madison is right, and you are wrong. 


Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:06 | 1943211 trav7777
trav7777's picture

that's contrary to the interpretation of like every legal or historical scholar around...thanks for setting them all straight, moron

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:35 | 1943253 joshua10
joshua10's picture

>>"Here we go again. Actually, the US Constitution does NOT give the right to individuals to bear arms. What it actually describes is the right of the people to establish "Armed militias". In most countries this is known as the military."<<

Amendment II

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Here we go again is exactly correct. I get so tired of correcting this half-ass backward argument. In the US, militias and the military are two completely different groups. Militias are under civilian control, military is under state or federal government control. Take notice of the exact wording of our 2nd Amendment above. No where does it say the militia must be regulated by the federal government or even the state. It says the militia is necessary for a FREE STATE. What ever powers are not specifically delegated to the federal government or the state are reserved exclusively for THE PEOPLE and shall not be infringed.

It is our right and duty to keep and bear arms and the ultimate security of the State is dependent upon the People being armed in order to defend the nation, the Constitution, and each other from all threat within and without.

In most parts of the socialist dominated cradle-to-grave welfare world that is sucking on the tit of the government, this concept is completely alien.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 14:02 | 1944317 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

You are actually stupid enough to think that the Second Amendment was put there to give the this country the right to have a military? All the rights in the Constitution are individual rights you fucking retarded statist Nazi pigs. 

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 17:32 | 1944726 DosZap
DosZap's picture

philipat

You must be a Liberal, FAR  left.

The Const, nor the BOR guarantees it.

It just puts it in writing.

Natural Law guarantees it.

Man has a God given inherent right to self preservation, and that of his family.

The BOR's just makes it CLEAR,the government cannot infringe on the right (already inherent thru Natural Law) a citizens/sovereigns right to own them.

 

Militias are the PEOPLE. Anyone can form a citizens Militia,(train,drill, and practice, have a chain of command, and be ready for whatever comes.)

The standing Army has ZERO to do with a Militia. Militias were formed as groups to be able to  OVERPOWER the Military,if it became onerous.

Originally the standing army, could not exceed 100,000 men.

What grade are you in, and are you American?.

PS: Before you bring it up, the National Guard is NOT the Militia either.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:20 | 1942820 brew
brew's picture

guns, gold and a getaway plan...

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:55 | 1943036 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

What about girls?  It can get pretty cold and lonely in that cave.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:59 | 1943196 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

In that kind of scenario if one has weapons, food, and security the notoriously short sighted American females will be a dime a dozen.

Or perhaps more accurately a bowl of beans a dozen...

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:19 | 1943298 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

Make that a pre-1965 dime a dozen.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 12:11 | 1943926 San Diego Gold Bug
San Diego Gold Bug's picture

Check comparesilverprices website...just found it for best silver prices in the US.  No 90%  but a good site for prices.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 17:02 | 1944772 DosZap
DosZap's picture

San Diego Gold Bug

Nice listing for the NOOB, but sure not the best prices.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 07:24 | 1943512 prole
prole's picture

And your assets well positioned in a diversified MFGlobal account.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 10:11 | 1943643 peekcrackers
peekcrackers's picture

Gold , Guns , GASMASK, getaway plan

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:41 | 1942862 navy62802
navy62802's picture

We got fun and games. We got everything you want.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 11:23 | 1943758 covert
covert's picture

this is a wonder sign of hope for the future, beware of sudden jihad syndrome.

http://expose2.wordpress.com

 

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 15:06 | 1944454 DosZap
DosZap's picture

"Deputy Assistant FBI Director Jerry Pender said the checks, required by federal law, surged to 129,166 during the day, far surpassing the previous high of 97,848 on Black Friday of 2008." And in reality, the number is likely far greater: "The actual number of firearms sold last Friday is likely higher because multiple firearms can be included in a transaction by a single buyer.

These numbers ars so far off it's a joke.They cannot even factor in Dealer purchases for stock, OR Permit holders, as they do not have to be NICS Checked.

The number is like 10-20x's that, if not more.

And the FBI does not track actual gun sales."

No, the ATF does illegally.

I have seen it with my own eyes,more than once.(actually saw two ATF agents doing an audit, get removed from the store they were auditing.

WHY?,they were skipping pages and writing down only buyers of all AR 15 clones.The owner confronted them, they told him to do his job, and they would do theirs, and leave them alone.

He promptly called the Dallas Office, and told the head nagga what they were doing,and he wanted them OUT of his store IMMEDIATELY(as they were breaking the law,two to be exact), within 30 mins 2 new agents replaced them.

Since when did the Feds do anything LEGAL.

Maybe, if they get caught red handed.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:53 | 1942761 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

America likes gunz more than ever, bitchez

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:55 | 1942888 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

America like gunz more than Bitchez,ever.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:53 | 1942762 SilverIsKing
SilverIsKing's picture

Guns make the perfect stocking stuffers.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:55 | 1942766 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

The guy in the pic looks like he is aiming at his wife.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:48 | 1942871 navy62802
navy62802's picture

Yeah, he looks homicidal ... about to pop that melon.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:34 | 1942845 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

You joke, but I was seriously considering giving all the male in-laws ar 15 stripped lower receivers for christmas...  Instead, I picked up 2 for myself...  couldn't pass up the $49.95/pop deal at palmetto state armory.  Nothing says christmas like assembling your own ar 15... 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:51 | 1942879 WaterWings
WaterWings's picture

Get 'em the pistol lowers. Concealable 5.56!!!

100 yards ain't as easy, but you're not likely to need it that far in a pinch...

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:01 | 1942906 JohnG
JohnG's picture

Those are NATO 5.56mm.  Don't make the common mistake of firing .223...can destoy the weapon, and half your face.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:21 | 1942922 Broken_Trades
Broken_Trades's picture

You're an armorer?

You can shoot .223 remington in a NATO chambered 5.56mm rifle all day long and not worry about a thing.

Supposedly you can't use 556mm in a .223 chambered rifle due to the higher pressures and longer chamber in 556.

If you're really worried , you can always buy a rifle chambered in .223 Wylde

 

Good Day!

 

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:48 | 1943008 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

Just buy a Mini-14. It'll eat both, and all makes from Wolf to match.

And you don't have to worry too much about little pins when you field-strip after a 1000 rounds or so.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:25 | 1942955 StormShadow
StormShadow's picture

It's the other way around. Can fire .223 in a 5.56 chamber all day long. 5.56 round in a .223 chamber, not a good idea.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:34 | 1942976 JohnG
JohnG's picture

Neither is a good idea.  Use the correct ammo of have your weapon re-chambered.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:39 | 1942988 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

The military brass is thicker and can cause excessive pressure in a gun chambered for 223.You need the bigger throat dimensions to use both.In 223 the accuracy will be lessened with the bigger throat.My rifle provides good accuracy with either, but it is not sub MOA.I have 30-06's for that duty.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:44 | 1943332 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Didin't Plaxico Buress (football player) stuff his gun in his pants?  That did not work out to well.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 03:09 | 1943368 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

You'll shoot your eye out kid!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppOXpyhM2wA

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:53 | 1942763 spankfish
spankfish's picture

I love the sound of my reloading press in the morning... it sounds like victory.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:49 | 1942877 navy62802
navy62802's picture

I love the smell of gun oil in the morning ... smells like ... victree.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:34 | 1943142 cbxer55
cbxer55's picture

I love the smell of Hoppe's #9 in the morning!

Don't have to post this link, but will anywho. ;-)

http://www.hoppes.com/products/solvents.html

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:01 | 1942905 navy62802
Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:21 | 1942940 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

You are wrong...it does not sound like victory....it IS victory!!!

 Casting and loading since 1975....bitches!!!!

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:54 | 1942765 duncangraper
duncangraper's picture

Got me 2 myself! Pb to go parabolic?

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:24 | 1942943 navy62802
navy62802's picture

OT - Did you know that the Nazis used wooden bullets towards the end of WWII, as their supplies of lead ran short? I once knew a guy (a coworker of my father's back in the 80s) who was shot in the eye with one of the wood bullets. Of course he lost his eye, but the only reason he lived is that the bullet splintered when it hit the eye socket.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:26 | 1943238 goat
goat's picture

Actually, those wooden bullets were "blank" rounds used to cycle MG34s and MG42s in training exercises.  They are soft wooden bullets seated in the cartridge. They allow the weapons to create enough pressure to cycle the bolt, and at the muzzle they are still dense enough to cause damage, but after a couple of feet they are sawdust, and do no damage.  I have fired many of them.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:55 | 1942767 domains-are-har...
domains-are-hard-assets's picture

Somehow one would expect gun sales to be inversely correlated to the (unadjusted) consumer confidence index.  Unfortunately there will never be a clean way to measure "gun sales". Why?  As confidence detioriates, a growing proportion of gun sales will not be measurable in retail trade and a growing number of firearms will be "missing".  Probably a more telling indicator is the number of spent rounds swept up at the local range.  Me thinks it might be on the increase.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:52 | 1943025 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

That reminds me of the funniest part of the article:

And the FBI does not track actual gun sales.

 

Nor do they track cell-phones, ISPs and e-mails, Facebook posts, OnStar, political activists, bank accounts and precious metal purchases....

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:02 | 1943063 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

That's because it's the NSA's job.  They get the big bucks.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:55 | 1942769 Carlyle Groupie
Carlyle Groupie's picture

Forget giving Johnny the jigsaw puzzle this year. Improve his lot in life give him the jigsaw AR this year. Gunsmiths will be in high demand!

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ARR552-1.html

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:08 | 1942795 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

For whatever reason people assume that being a Machinist means you are also a Gunsmith. I quit being shocked at the number of people that want to know how much it would cost to turn their legal semi-auto into an illegal full-auto machine gun. I've also learned how to spot federal ATF agents attempting to get me to do that. They offer more than a Franklin. I just stay away from Gunsmith work as I don't have an FFL. Even if all they want is the barrel slotted for a scope or even sling mounts. 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:20 | 1942800 Carlyle Groupie
Carlyle Groupie's picture

If you are a sovereign man you are legally allowed full-auto and no requirements for FFL's for manufacture of lowers.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:20 | 1942817 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

Those people are crazy. The (overrated) benefit of full-auto over semi-auto is completely outweighed by the potential looong stint in a Federal PMITA Prison. Except of course, if this country goes full-banana republic, the equation would change.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:36 | 1942851 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

While in the military I had the opportunity to use the firing ranges and experience firing a great number of firearms. If I had to chose a single rifle to go into combat with it would be the M1 Garand. I obtained one through the Civilian Marksmanship Program after I retired from the military. I was very lucky. I got one that was a virgin still in factory cosmoline. I used a gallon of gasoline cleaning it. I enjoyed every minute of that nasty job. I've shot Full Auto machine guns before. Your lucky if 99 out of 100 rounds go into what your actually shooting at. I can drive nails at 300 meters with my Garand.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:55 | 1942889 Seize Mars
Seize Mars's picture

George S. Patton said, "the M1 Garand is the greatest implement of battle ever devised."

When the US Army wants you to actually win a war, they will give you an M1 Garand to fight with. When they want you to fuck around on patrol for 8 years, racking up a bunch of expenses, they will give you a 223.

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:19 | 1942937 Broken_Trades
Broken_Trades's picture

Nothing like running around in the bush with a 10lb peice of lumber that goes "PING" when you empty the clip.

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:57 | 1943048 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

When you shoot something with an M1, it goes DOWN.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:10 | 1943221 trav7777
trav7777's picture

uh...there are better 762N rifles now than the M1.  The FAL is one example.  The Minimi is another.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:57 | 1943360 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

So, did they upgrade the SAW to 7.62 and platoon/heavy weapons status?  Last I knew it still fired 5.56.

Did the folks that need it to count everytime change over to FALs recently?  Last I knew they were using M-14s for 7.62 from the Arctic to the deserts.

I must be behind the times.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:47 | 1943341 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Hopefully McNamara is burning in hell with LBJ for the Mattel M-16.  F LBJ too.  Almost as bad as the 2008 muslim.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 17:19 | 1944818 DosZap
DosZap's picture

Long-John-Silver

Garands, great weapons.BUT, parts are all but junk now, and impossible to find,VERY expensive.Limited firepower(8rd enbloc clips),and WAY too many moving parts.At best(Best Match Grade) with a great shooter, ok for humans to around 800+yds.

Much newer  far more accurate, and less moving parts avail now.Decent Garands are $6-800.00, and parts are the issue if you have one go down.

Give me a 7.62x51 bolt,w 5-6x25x50 LRT's optics, and a an AR 10 style w/ 22-24" tube semi,w/Optics, and I am good to go to 1000.(and a good reloading set up, and your ready to rock.)

Wanna go to a mile,other rather inexpensive rigs can be had.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:38 | 1942854 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Not really...  maybe good for kicking in doors and cqb, but select fire is there for a reason (can't hit shit with that barrel climbing)...  I hate gun laws, but I really don't see what we're giving up with that one... 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:41 | 1942864 JohnG
JohnG's picture

Full auto is a waste of ammo unless you have an ass of enemy charging you.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:08 | 1943216 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

I had a chance to briefly test out the new bump fire stock for AR's once, they work pretty well with a little practice.  No need to buy a full auto weapon.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:43 | 1942859 JohnG
JohnG's picture

How to beat entrapment question:

Are you now, or have you ever been affiliated, employed by or attached to ANY law enforcement or military organization, either foreign or domestic, whether national, state, or local, in ANY capacity whatsoever.

NO?  Then may I copy your identifications, and please sign this statement in which you affirm and attest this the above fact.  (Include statement of affirmation on form.)

 

 

--Easy peasy.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:12 | 1943223 trav7777
trav7777's picture

ROTFL.

You know the cops can legally LIE to you, right?  Nothing you have written carries any legal weight whatsoever.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:35 | 1942848 JohnG
JohnG's picture

DO NOT buy anything from DPMS.  Very poor quality.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:57 | 1942895 Seize Mars
Seize Mars's picture

DO NOT buy anything from DPMS.  Very poor quality.

Why do you say that?

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:10 | 1942916 JohnG
JohnG's picture

Ever since Remington bought them, and Bushmaster (many DPMS manufactured parts), quality has gone steadily downhil.

I have an older Bushmaster, and I get many new ones that just will not group well.

 

It may just be the fact that Bushmaster lost a lot of master techs (if not all) when the factory was moved from Maine.  I've seen DPMS helicals broken before the first mag was emptied.  Out of spec mag catches from brand new Bushmasters (lower parts built by DPMS.)

 

I don't have anything against generic AR's, just some are built better than others.  Also there's no need to spend 2500 on a Colt.  Rebuild and spec a generic, and it will likely shoot better.  Just DPMS parts tend to be the most problematic in my experience.

 

Yes, I am (was) an armorer. 

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:36 | 1942981 StormShadow
StormShadow's picture

Can't say much about DPMS latest product, but over the years they've made great guns.

As for Bushy, never have liked em. This was reinforced by one of my employees who had a Bushy 9mm SBR blow up in his face at the range recently. No handmaids either, factory rounds. Bushy is doing nothing for him after multiple calls and 5 months have passed. Bad move on their part, as he's a NM Ranger...doubt any of his fellow Rangers will be buying any Bushmaster products any time soon

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:42 | 1943165 JohnG
JohnG's picture

No shit.  I think it's Remington/Cerberus cost cutting, because it is different now.  It's just different, feels different.  Work on the things for a long time, and I can tell it just FEELS different.....

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:44 | 1942998 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

Since you were an armorer, you know better than I that there's probably more BS in the the world of firearms than there is in politics. What are a few suggestions for a good bang-for-the-buck 223/556? SIG 556, LWRC, ...? Or would a DSArms FAL .308 be a better choice?

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:58 | 1943050 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

Mini-14, with Ruger mags.  If/when you run out of ammo, makes a good club, and the new one's really cut down on stringing shots with a hot barrel.

Go with an M-1 or M-1A for 7.62/.308.  Same-same action, more oomph.  Makes a better club.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:27 | 1943126 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

Thanks. I've heard that the Mini-14's are uber-reliable. Springfield M-1A?

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:02 | 1943200 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

Good description here:

http://www.cabelas.com/semiautomatic-springfield-m1a-8482-rifles-1.shtml

Kinda spendy, but they won't leave you up the creek without a paddle....

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 10:45 | 1943680 VelvetHog
VelvetHog's picture

That's "crick".

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:30 | 1943133 JohnG
JohnG's picture

Any gun is better than none.  And it depends on what you are using it for...

The sig 556 is a fine weapon, although I prefer an M16/MK4 (or AR15...) for a rifle probably because that is the weapon I have the most experience with and can fix for sure WHEN it breaks.  Anything with moving parts will break eventually,

I like the rail system on the MK series better than the M6 system, but that's probably just a matter of convenience.  It's alto less expensive to standardize your weapons than to have multiple platforms to buy parts and accessories and ammo for. 

DSARMS always to me seemed more expentive than they are worth.  You can chamber a MK4 to .300 Fireball for just the price of the parts, and a basic AR can be built for as little as $600.  Not so much with DS.

Also, as far as I know, there's no way to get around an FFL with DS, they only sell fully assembled weapons to the public.

Also, I believe that there are likely more parts that are/will be available when needed for the MK's, so that's where I'm at.

All are fine weapons, it's just a matter of choice.  My thing is parts to fix them, and there's sure to be LOT'S of AR parts available.  I don't want to get stuck with something I can't fix or use for parts.

 

Best bang for the buck is an assembled upper, lower kit, read and learn (TM 05538-23&P2 ... Marine Corps M16 Tech Manual) gives you more info that you will ever need.  Then you can take it apart to clean it properly, and fix it when it breaks.  imho.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:05 | 1943207 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

Thank you much for the response and advice!

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 10:57 | 1943694 chunga
chunga's picture

For $299 it's hard to beat a Saiga (genuine Izhmash AK variant). Field stripping involves a total of four parts. It always goes bang.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:57 | 1942771 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

Obama has done a fine job of increasing the firearms industrial segment of the economy.

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:00 | 1942776 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

I wonder if he receives any lobby money.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:54 | 1942882 Jack Burton
Jack Burton's picture

I have to admit, for a president who is going to take American's guns away from them, Mr. Obama is doing a piss poor job of it! Guns are selling like hot cakes and ammunition too, yet we have a man as president who is vowed to strip Americans of their right to bear arms.

Personally I armed myself to the teeth when Mr. Bush won re-election on the back of his Patriot Act which gave government the powers of your run of the mill communist dictator to arrest and dissappear Americans with only the word of the president as all the justification needed for hauling any American off to a secret torture prison for life without legal recourse.

Now Obama has reaffirmed the Bush dictator doctrine and expanded it to killing any American anywhere at anytime the president dictates the hit.

We have come a long way from our founding father's consitution. I recommend every America arm themselves to the teeth. Better to die during your attempted abduction by the USA secret torture police than be hauled off for life in a secret Polish CIA run torture prison.

 

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:08 | 1942913 Real Estate Geek
Real Estate Geek's picture

Gun control is not on the agenda of a president who wants to be re-elected.  It's a second-term issue.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:50 | 1943016 reescher
reescher's picture

It's not going to be on his agenda ever. Regardless of term.

 

House: Run by the GOP, thus not going to see anything antileg come down. Perhaps a feel good law with no teeth, but nothing that will have much of an impact.

Senate: Reid likes guns. Nevada likes guns. He likes be Sen Majority Leader. Thus, he likes guns. Won't let an anti-bill come out of committee.

 

End of story. End of anyhting ever surfacing.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:08 | 1943082 Blano
Blano's picture

It's been on his agenda all along and will continue to be.  He even told James Brady that he's looking at back door methods of gun control.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:55 | 1943354 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Fast & Furious was set up to create lots of drug gang crime that would have made the public angry and the public would demand more gun control.  Unbeliveably evil but he is a muslim.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 07:34 | 1943517 prole
prole's picture

I'm trying to believe you but if he's a Moslem like you say how come he only bombs Moslem countries? I'm really having a tough time figuring that out.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 11:16 | 1943746 False_Profit
False_Profit's picture

1-not all muslim countries are created and run the same...research the countries and you will find your answer as to why he only bombs certain ones, and doesn't bomb other ones...like iran.  egypt was lead by a moderate, his overthrow has put a militant muslim brotherhood in charge...libya was contained and running smoothly with massive infrastructure expendetures and truly progressive sovereign gold backed monetary plans being executed, now-not so much...

2-look at dear leader's history...he was born to a muslim father, went to a muslim elementary school in a muslim country, and it is apostacy punishable by death for a muslim to switch religions.

3-remember his interview with geo stepho? if you were Christian, would you /ever/ make a mix up and say "my muslim faith"??? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMUgNg7aD8M

4-benefit of the doubt you say? process of elimination: he has not and does not attend any true Christian church, sans "black liberation theology"...

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 13:14 | 1944156 prole
prole's picture

Process of elimidation. Check

You say he's not Christian and I certainly agree with you on that. Check

(Side point Shrub and O'man converting Iraq/Eqypt (Egypt might have been done without us?)  from free secular countries into Sharia law Islamic states. We agree on that? Check) (Syria to follow? Check)

You say he's not Christian, I say he's not Moslem, process of elimination.....

You mentioned his father's religion (which one?) But you didna' say much about Dear Mom's faith?

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 15:27 | 1944495 DosZap
DosZap's picture

prole

HE isn't bombing dicks squat as far as Mulsims go.

Everything he's doing  is just follow up on what he inherited.

He has no choice.

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:57 | 1942772 diesheepledie
diesheepledie's picture

Long Guns!

 

And Hand Guns too!

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 21:59 | 1942775 Van Halen
Van Halen's picture

The government laughs at our gun purchases. They will never take on an armed populace like this one. They'll do what they've done for decades: wipe us out with incremental totalitarianism.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:03 | 1942784 max2205
max2205's picture

The good ole days:

"

Radio Address to the Nation on the American Family
December 3, 1983

Ronald Reagan
1983: Book II

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United States
Maryland

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My fellow Americans:

This is a very special time of year for us, a time for family reunions and for celebrating together the blessings of God and the promises He has given us. From Thanksgiving to Hanukkah, which our Jewish community is now celebrating, to Christmas in 3 weeks' time, this is a season of hope and of love.

Certainly one of the greatest blessings for people everywhere is the family itself. The American Family Institute recently dedicated its book of essays, "The Family in the Modern World," to Maria Victoria Walesa, daughter of Danuta and Lech Walesa, to whose christening came 7,000 Poles expressing their belief that the family remains the foundation of freedom. And, of course, they're right. It's in the family where we learn to think for ourselves, care for others, and acquire the values of self-reliance, integrity, responsibility, and compassion.

Families stand at the center of society, so building our future must begin by preserving family values. Tragically, too many in Washington has been asking us to swallow a whopper: namely, that bigger government is the greatest force for fairness and progress. But this so-called solution has given most of us a bad case of financial indigestion. How can families survive when big government's powers to tax, inflate, and regulate absorb their wealth, usurp their rights, and crush their spirit? Was there compassion for a working family in 21 1/2- percent interest rates, 12 1/2-percent inflation, and taxes soaring out of sight? Consider the cost of childrearing. It now takes $85,000 to raise a child to age 18, and family incomes haven't kept up. During the 1970's real wages actually declined over 2 percent. Consider taxes. In 1948 the tax on the average two-child family was just $9. Today it is $2,900.

As economic and social pressures have increased, the bonds that bind families together have come under strain. For example, three times as many families are headed by single parents today as in 1960. Many single parents make heroic sacrifices and deserve all our support. But there is no question that many well-intentioned Great Society-type programs contributed to family breakups, welfare dependency, and a large increase in births out of wedlock. In the 1970's the number of single mothers rose from 8 to 13 percent among whites and from 31 to a tragic 47 percent among blacks. Too often their children grow up poor, malnourished, and lacking in motivation. It's a path to social and health problems, low school performance, unemployment, and delinquency.

If we strengthen families, we'll help reduce poverty and the whole range of other social problems.

We can begin by reducing the economic burdens of inflation and taxes, and we're doing this. Since 1980 inflation has been chopped by three-fourths. Taxes have been cut for every family that earns a living, and we've increased the tax credit for child care. Yesterday we learned that our growing economy reduced unemployment to 8.2 percent last month. The payroll employment figure went up by 370,000 jobs.

At the same time, new policies are helping our neediest families move from dependence to independence. Our new job training law will train over a million needy and unemployed Americans each year for productive jobs. I should add that our enterprise zones proposal would stimulate new businesses, bringing jobs and hope to some of the most destitute areas of the country. The Senate has adopted this proposal. But after 2 years of delay, the House Democratic leadership only recently agreed to hold its first hearing on the legislation. This is a jobs bill America needs. And come January, we expect action.

We're moving forward on many other fronts. We've made prevention of drug abuse among youth a top priority. We'll soon announce a national missing children's center to help find and rescue children who've been abducted and exploited. We're working with States and local communities to increase the adoption of special-needs children. More children with permanent homes mean fewer children with permanent problems.

We're also stiffening the enforcement of child support from absent parents. And we're trying hard to improve education through more discipline, a return to the basics, and through reforms like tuition tax credits to help hard-working parents.

In coming months, we'll propose new ways to help families stay together, remain independent, and cope with the pressures of modern life. A cornerstone of our efforts must be assisting families to support themselves. As Franklin Roosevelt said almost 50 years ago, "Self-help and self-control are the essence of the American tradition."

In Washington everyone looks out for special interest groups. Well, I think families are pretty special. And with your help, we'll continue looking out for their interests.

Till next week, thanks for listening, and God bless you.

Note: The President spoke at 12:06 p.m. from Camp David, Md.
Citation: Ronald Reagan: "Radio Address to the Nation on the American Family ," December 3, 1983. Online by Gerhard Peters and John T. Woolley, The American Presidency Project. http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/?pid=40829.

Read more at the American Presidency Project: www.presidency.ucsb.edu http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=40829#ixzz1fWkeHdGS

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:32 | 1942949 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

American mythology

Ronald Reagan, forefather of the dismantling of the Glass Steagall Act.

“This bill is the most important legislation for financial institutions in the last 50 years. It provides a long-term solution for troubled thrift institutions. ... All in all, I think we hit the jackpot.” Ronald Reagan in 1982, as he signed the Garn-St. Germain Depository Institutions Act.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:04 | 1942786 Free Markets
Free Markets's picture

That would be me! Bought my first gun because I do not trust that any of these people in power...whoever they are...have my best interest in mind.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:40 | 1942857 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

The only mistake you can make is to quit buying guns...  just make sure whenever you get a new one, you disassemble it, reassemble it, and shoot the hell out of it...  be able to take it apart and clean it without a manual handy... 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:06 | 1942789 aztrader
aztrader's picture

We are working the PHoenix gun show this weekend and were absolutely slammed.   We sell non-lethal products like Pepper Guns, stun guns, and various self defense products.   Today was the biggest selling day I have had in 2 years.   The gun dealers were pumping out product like crazy.  Ammo was flying out the door and the crowds were huge.

Our top products were the Piexon JPX Pepper Gun and the Kimber Pepperblasters.   People are definitely considering this kind of product for the holidays rather then wasting it on frivilous luxuries.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:28 | 1942964 Bolweevil
Bolweevil's picture

Methinksthat more than unruly shoppers may soon be on the receiving end of all that new pepper spray. I wonder what policy is for el ee oh if they get sprayed. Although the comedic nature of this potentiality is not lost on me I in no way condone anything more aggressive than chanting and sit-ins.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:07 | 1942791 diesheepledie
diesheepledie's picture

My favorite are the "Law Abiding Gun Owners". If the govt. outlaws or confiscates guns through martial "law" - which they did in N.O. during Katrina; all law abiding gun owners cease to be gun owners. During Kartrina, every single gun owner confronted by Nat. Guard or police turned in their weapons when directly requested. That's why the govt. does not fear them. The draft animals are so well trained you can give them firearms and then take them away whenever you feel like it. Really pathetic. 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:13 | 1942801 Eagle1
Eagle1's picture

Don't think this will be a repeat this time

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:17 | 1942812 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

I guess I need to get me a National Guard uniform and beat them to the punch. Trick or Treat, Bitchez.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:25 | 1942827 Carlyle Groupie
Carlyle Groupie's picture

A quick change of uniform and return 15 minutes later and demand their gold.

Dumb enough to give up arms = free PM's.

"I'm part of the Turbo Timmah strike force and all your gold is belong to us".

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:31 | 1942840 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Wanna go halves on a used UPS truck? LOL

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:53 | 1942878 Carlyle Groupie
Carlyle Groupie's picture

You drive the UPS truck I'll bring my Brinks truck. We'll need the 5-ton rear.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:22 | 1942821 Corn1945
Corn1945's picture

The government is going to have it's hands full with 46 million people whose foodstamp debit cards no longer work. Throw in the urban areas that will riot in a heartbeat and I'm betting law abiding gun owners are pretty far down on the list. The cops will also take off to protect their own homes. 

Also, it only takes a small percentage of resistance to completely overwhelm the inept US military. It took these guys 10 years to find one bearded guy in a cave. 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:24 | 1942950 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

It's gonna get HAIRY in areas like South Atlanta when the Gubbermint turns the 'Freebie' firehose off. The people there already shoot each other for the fun of it. For many years, the Military's been sending their doctors to Grady Hospital in downtown ATL, to learn how to treat stab wounds, gunshot wounds, and burns (it's because these wounds are seen there with such frequency).

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:31 | 1942968 JohnG
JohnG's picture

 

 

Grady has the "distinction" of being the only Level 5 trauma center in the southeast.

I used to live near Atlanta, only go there on business now, and only in the daytime.

I live a good two hours from there now, in the middle of nowhere, and that's how I like it.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:52 | 1943022 fightthepower
fightthepower's picture

Grady is a level 1 trauma center and that isn't a dubious distinction, dumbass. Being a inner city hospital they treat their fair share of gun wounds, but you should also know that if you ever get in a bad car wreck you will be enjoying a life flight to Grady because there is no level 1 trauma center in your shitty small town.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:37 | 1943158 JohnG
JohnG's picture

Don't junk hum for being right, there's level 1-5 trauma centers, 1 being the highest level of care/most likely to live.....excuse me for getting my numbers backwards on that (I'm not a doctor...., or trauma expert).  Unlike him apparently.

Junk him for being a dickhead and calling my town shitty.  It isn't, and you are a dick.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 18:22 | 1944946 Jena
Jena's picture

Any Level 1 trauma center is probably giving military docs training these days.  There aren't that many of them and the opportunity to see and treat the volume of those kinds of cases in that setting is valuable experience.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 19:43 | 1945133 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Suggestions: #1 When you essentially agree with a point; try not to be an asshole.

Other suggestions:

Fight the courtesy

Fight the education

Fight a good attitude

Fight to get a clue...

 

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:54 | 1943033 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

Same here. I live in the NE GA mountains near a lake. It's far more civilized up here than it is in Atlanta. I much prefer four-legged animals to the two-legged variety.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:21 | 1943234 trav7777
trav7777's picture

they have them in Baltimore too, and all the heavily black areas.

It's like a war and shit.  Incidentally, the violent death rate was higher in South Africa than in Iraq during the war.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 18:12 | 1944919 iLoveMisesToPieces
iLoveMisesToPieces's picture

I live in south east Atlanta and it's definitely picking up here.  In one week I had a friend that was shot at trying to defend his date from being mugged and a co-worker that was car jacked.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:18 | 1943107 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

Not to worry.  The food stamp debit cards will work as long as dollars are accepted and Bennie or his successor can still create more of them.  The alternative is too horrible to even think about.  Even the farmers would be pissed.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 16:45 | 1944730 pcrs
pcrs's picture

don't forget the drones, they will outsource the whole riot control to India. A whole bunch of drone pilots will control you, resist and they send a hell fire up your ass.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:36 | 1942849 Savyindallas
Savyindallas's picture

That's because they were the looter animal types from the Fischer and Desire projects out looting. Those that did not turn them in are dead  -haven't you heard about the massacres of civilians in New orleans during katrina. The problem is that a lot who were killed were not looters, and many were not armed. The rest of us will not willingly turn in our guns. The government will have to starve us out, like Stalin did to the Ukranians. 

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:23 | 1943117 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

No problem -- Blackwater will take care of us.  And after they take care of us, they'll feed us to their pigs.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 02:35 | 1943328 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

Xe.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:10 | 1942792 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

The good news is that the pansy Libs will be the ones without guns when TSHTF, inevitably.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:11 | 1942798 diesheepledie
diesheepledie's picture

And the Law Abiding gun owners as well.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:46 | 1942868 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

I dunno. I think people learned from the Katrina fiasco. Courts have also reaffirmed the rights of those law abiding gun owners. However, as we've already seen, when TSHTF Gov't generally does whatever it wants and worries about the legal ramifications later. It certainly forces a difficult decision on the gun owner.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:28 | 1943132 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

I presume you've read Zeitoun.   It's recommended reading for anyone that wants to know what the govt. is really going to do when TSHTF.  (It ain't pretty.)

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:01 | 1942907 WaterWings
WaterWings's picture

Lex mala, LEX NULLA.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:15 | 1942806 El Gordo
El Gordo's picture

Do you really bleieve that?  When have you ever known the libs to follow the same laws they establish for the common people?  You can bet the farm that they will turn up with plenty of guns, ammo, and human shields.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:31 | 1942841 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

I'm not talking about very wealthy libs - they'll of course have plenty of armed security, just as they do now. Like everything else with those people, it's 'Do as I say, not as I do.'

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 23:04 | 1942909 Seize Mars
Seize Mars's picture

Normalcy Bias: I gave you +1 for your avatar. That is the best fucking avatar from the Quad Cities I have ever seen. Just look out for the...rather elaborate network of trusses.

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:10 | 1943086 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

Thanks. You're the first person to comment on it. I don't think it would even register with anyone under 40 or so. It's my favorite Aykroyd other than Elwood Blues. Now, I'd better go so I can give 'Slick' his money, or he's gonna beat my ass!

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 00:20 | 1943112 KK Tipton
KK Tipton's picture

Fred Garvin....he's back!

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:24 | 1942824 economics1996
economics1996's picture

When the SHTF the liberal side will have 10 idiots for every lawyer.  I like my Ruger but my S&W is jealous now.  The Remmington is cool about the new addition.

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 22:31 | 1942839 Schmuck Raker
Schmuck Raker's picture

The bad news is the self-repressing Cons will only be able to find ditch weed.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!