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With Both Presidential Candidates Full Of Hot Air, El-Erian Warns Of Populist Anger Returning

Tyler Durden's picture


As the 'new' normal limps on, PIMCO's Mohamed El-Erian focuses his attention on the political dysfunction that roils the 'new new' normal in an excellent op-ed in Foreign Policy today. The economic and financial system risks breakages that the political system will be increasingly incapable of mending rapidly enough," he opines as he fears sluggishness in economic growth, unacceptably high youth unemployment and long-term joblessness, redoubled debt and deficit concerns, and worsening inequalities between rich and poor leading the US down a path towards Europe's disruption.

Via Foreign Policy:

"Sadly, neither Obama nor Romney has yet offered a meaningful, forward-looking economic reform program to address problems such as a malfunctioning labor market, unsustainable public finances, a broken credit system, inadequate infrastructure, and a lagging education system.


The risk for the United States, as well as the global economy, is that a lack of vision and political courage ends up leading to even greater economic disappointment and financial instability, bringing with it the social unrest we've seen in so many other countries over the past 18 months. Occupy Wall Street and the Tea Party may have somewhat fizzled, but populist anger could return with a vengeance.


The longer America's interlocking economic and political challenges persist, the greater the number of companies and long-term investors that begin to worry -- and, more importantly, act on those fears. They hire fewer people and invest less in factories and equipment. As they increasingly sit on the sidelines, the country's fate will be left in the hands of tactical position players and short-term traders, further ramping up volatility and reducing future growth and job opportunities. And when day traders and company flippers start running a country's economy, watch out.


The warning bells are ringing, and they are ringing loudly. We've already allowed bad economics to lead to bad politics. Now, it's high time to put a stop to the cycle where bad politics undermines an already fragile economy."


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Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:38 | 2701158 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

Hows this for alarm bells: DHS have put an order in for another 750 million rounds of assorted ammunition on top of the previous order of 450 million.

You can view a pdf of the order here.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:38 | 2701161 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Shit you beat me to it. I was just getting ready to post the same thing. I just got done reading about it.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:40 | 2701163 fuu
fuu's picture

Fun with Anagrams:


Barack + Joe = A Bare Jock

Mitt + Paul = A Tit Lump

Election 2012: The Dick or the Cancer, either way we're fucked.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:58 | 2701230 economics9698
economics9698's picture

Gary Johnson 2012.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:04 | 2701251 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Birth, Growth, Maturation, Decline & Death - Where is America?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:12 | 2701269 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

lol collectively that's more than a billion rounds of ammo.

Two or three bullets for one and all
However large or however small
In your head or heart, even in your bum
Lest you go to camp and duly succumb

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:25 | 2701332 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

More fun with anagrams...

"I am" (which is supposedly the name God gave himself to Moses) = M.I.A.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:36 | 2701386 fuu
fuu's picture

President: I Pretends

United States: Unstated Ties

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:58 | 2701449 Hugh_Jorgan
Hugh_Jorgan's picture

"Sadly, neither Obama nor Romney has yet offered a meaningful, forward-looking economic reform program to address problems..."

Uh, excuse me? It looks like Romney just nominated the man with the most cohesive, well-vetted economic plan to date as the candidate for VP.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:58 | 2701486 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

The most cohesive, well-vetted economic recovery plan to date = Austerity for the masses while more money is shoveled into the military-industrial complex.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:01 | 2701508 The Big Ching-aso
The Big Ching-aso's picture



Maybe rename it Department of Hollowpoint Security?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:08 | 2701546 ParkAveFlasher
ParkAveFlasher's picture

USDs = suds

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:14 | 2701576 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

Hahahaha +1

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:38 | 2701672 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

I've always wondered whose homeland they were securing.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 18:36 | 2702242 NewAmericaNow
NewAmericaNow's picture

I almost spit up my drink at the cluelessness of your comment. Obama wants socialism for healthcare and NATO and the UN to run our "humanitarian" assasinations but Ryan's idea is let Blue Cross and GSK run healthcare and Lockheed martin and Goldman Sachs run the pentagon. Not what I'd call Free Market principals either. The time is right for the end of Elephant and Donkey political theory.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 21:25 | 2702691 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

Neither the Elephant ior Donkey are going to give up their reserved seating at the public feed trough.  

They will BOTH do whatever is needed to hold onto power and keep the masses from actually demanding that thir 'representatives' actually serve THEM instead of pandering to thecorporate/uber wealthy oligarchy.

Better hope that our military and police uphold their oaths of office and defend the Constitution form all enemies - foreign or DOMESTIC.......nah.... they can always hire  Blackwater/XE/whatever eh latest incarnation of corporate mercenaries is called to put down any revolt.  Look at the reaction to OWS...... MASSIVE OVERKILL.   I wonder how bad they'll be towards protestors at the political conventions.....  Want to bet that the 'Free Speech Zones' will be conveniently located at the enarest FEMA camp. 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:32 | 2701365 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

Hah!  Al Qaeda in America will not have a chance!!!!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:52 | 2701460 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

like a 90 yr old with Alzheimer.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:06 | 2701258 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

Not all is lost. There is one way to beat the system.


you have to join the system and play the game.


just like banksters have lobbysts, middle class need to organize and pay for their lobbysts. The amounts aren't that much....<$1M. If everyone who works for a living donated $1 to the "middle class lobby", the funding will be staggering $150,000,000. pretty much buy any politician you want.



Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:30 | 2701319 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

With infinite printing capabilities, and numerous secret groups and initiatives it took the banks 100 years to capture the USA. You think that rallying the mindless drooling masses into giving up their piggy banks for lobbying is going to work?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:40 | 2701401 knowless
Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:41 | 2701405 fuu
fuu's picture

Kickstart that idea!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:11 | 2701561 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

it's time has come!

tell the AARP!  and don't forget the public employees and teachers, too!

hey!  maybe thePeople could form a political party? 

or work to get gold and silver coinage back into circulation, thru political speech!

and pretend they are A.Hux and not an asswipe fuking trolololio... too!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:30 | 2701638 fuu
fuu's picture

My apologies for annoying you sir.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:27 | 2701624 bank guy in Brussels
bank guy in Brussels's picture

Ha! Would never work in America ... they would squash it before it got too far ... the media would slander and bury the lobbying organisation while US judges shut it down and seized all the assets ...

Money only 'buys' politicians in the US when that is permitted ... if you aren't on the approved list of bribers, they will use other methods to seize the money and destroy the organisation ... Especially via various lawsuits or criminal accusations ...

It is one of the things that business people slowly learn in America ... Even unlimited money can't bribe against the US political insiders ... Unlimited money cannot get people justice in the US courts against them ...

There are cases of people offering US lawyers hundreds of thousands of dollars ... and no American lawyer would take the case, because representing that client would mean the lawyer losing his US law licence, or being jailed or dead ...

Our political refugee from the US in Brussels was one of those examples ... He was in a 200K American job when he had to leave America with the friends of George Bush threatening to kill him ... lawyers talked to him privately, telling him to get out before he was dead, but no US lawyer was ever brave enough to speak for him in a US courtroom ...

US politicians and judges and can only be bribed against political nobodies or weaker parties, not against Powers That Be insiders ... Otherwise people risk ending up suddenly dead, like US Federal Judge John Roll shot dead after ruling against Obama ... by a lone gunman of course who 'confessed' ... nothing to see here ...

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:40 | 2701675 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

....pretty much buy any politician you want.

I'd rather have a good dog.  A damn sight cheaper... and more useful.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:04 | 2701791 Ying-Yang
Ying-Yang's picture

Middle Class could open their own Central Bank!!! Yea, that's the ticket!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:43 | 2701173 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Um.. What kind of training do you use jacketed hollow point ammunition for?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:48 | 2701193 OTC_Options
OTC_Options's picture

It's generally only double the price of FMJs so, for a government expenditure, it's a fantastic savings. All kidding aside, I shoot a fair bit of it at the range 'cause it does shoot differently than FMJ.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:12 | 2701254 Manthong
Manthong's picture

So an inch or so at 100 yards (rifle) makes a difference to how many feds?

(25 feet for pistol)

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:34 | 2701893 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Ah, but at 1000 yds., it's the diff between a hit or a miss.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:48 | 2701198 1100-TACTICAL-12
1100-TACTICAL-12's picture

I sense a disturbance in the force... We will be lucky to make to the next puppet show in Nov...

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:01 | 2701229 Michael
Michael's picture

Anger like this?

Revenge votes for Obama is the solution. Black balling Dr Ron Paul was not a smart move this time.

No self respecting Ron Paul supporter will vote for Mitt Romney since he is a wholly owned subsidiary of the Rothschild's and Rockefeller banksters just as Obama is.

The Presidency is a wholly owned subsidiary of the international banking cartel, multi national corporations, and Goldman Sachs/JP Morgan.

Many millions of Ron Paul supporters like me will be voting directly for Obama in November in a political strategy so we can get a real Liberty candidate on the ballot in 2016.

If you don't like Obama next year, then impeach him for illegally attacking Libya, gun running fast and furious, and being disqualified for his forged birth certificate.

Fox news is an infomercial for the republicans and the GOP. MSNBC is an infomercial for the democrats, ABC, NBC, CBS, and CNN are left leaning, brainwashing, social engineering scum. Try not to get your news from them.

What's Romney gonna give me? Will he cancel the TSA/government 1.2 billion hollow point bullet order, abolish NDAA, and the Patriot act? Then fuck him.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:06 | 2701244 Michael
Michael's picture

This is the deepest thought of the last decade nobody gets;

The war against a Military Tactic(Terrorism) used by The Base(in Arabic Al-Qaeda) is idiotic. The Base doesn't even have any tanks or boats.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 21:37 | 2702741 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

The US needed a new bogeyman to justify spending 40% of the world's total military budget after the Commies folded......    Sort of pathetic that the best they could come up with was a bunch of jihadists formerly in US employ against the Ruskies in Afghanistan but the masses fell for it....

Great excuse to revoke the Bill of RIghts - somethign we didn't even attempt on a wholesale basis during WWII or the Cold War when the threat to our nation was far more real.  'Terrorism' is a tactic employed by the WEAK who cannot muster anything remotely comparable to the power their enemy possesses.  There is now way in hell that even the combined nations of Islam cxould overgthrow the government of the US and impose an Islamic state here (not that the nations of Islam have any such desire - they just want the US out of THEIR countries).

Madison naied it 200 years ago - when tyranny comes to these shores it will be in the guise of protecting us against a foreign thereat.  Our Founding Fathers feared our own government ebing undermined and subverted by a few for their own purposes more than any outside threat. 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:13 | 2701277 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

"Many millions of Ron Paul supporters like me will be voting directly for Obama in November in a political strategy so we can get a real Liberty candidate on the ballot in 2016."

The bipartisan system is an illusion of choice between two groups that serve the same masters. The republic is broken and all branches of the government have been completely hijacked by private banks. Your voting strategy will achieve nothing and only serves to give approval to your current owners. Being a frequenter of ZH for almost 3 years you should know this by now, what is the purpose of your post?


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:13 | 2701573 Michael
Michael's picture

You answered your own question. It doesn't matter which presidential candidate you vote for. I'd rather have 4 more years of Obama than 8 years of Romney.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:45 | 2701690 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

I'm sympathetic to your position.   However, it seems that the devil we know is not going to be sufficient for many.  I find it odd that so many here who are willing to bring down the system won't vote for the person who would be best for the task.   Seems to me that the best choice would be the one who could do the most damage.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:08 | 2701802 Ying-Yang
Ying-Yang's picture

Rocky.. are you working that raccoon reverse psychology on us?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:19 | 2701300 CH1
CH1's picture

Like I say, it's time to dump the entire game, and build new systems ouselves.

The Overseers (all of them) are Evil.

Don't get angry, get away!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:22 | 2701606 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture


You can live next to a commie or fascist and not have to worry about their government.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:33 | 2701368 El
El's picture

Oh, that makes a lot of sense. Really??? Why not write Ron Paul in if you support him, genius? I suspect many more RP supporters will be doing that than will be voting for either Romney or Obama.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:35 | 2701897 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Luke, you're adopted...

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:59 | 2701233 Manthong
Manthong's picture

I suppose we shouldn't be too concerned..

a billion rounds or so for federal domestic use sounds reasonable.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:25 | 2701328 Plymster
Plymster's picture

According to wikipedia (, hollow points would be used in situations where you'd want less penetration (ie: on a plane).  Of course they have the not so pleasant (for the people hit with them) side effect of generating more tissue damage.  It seems like this is exactly what you wouldn't want in a crowd situation, but what you might want on a plane.

In fact, if you were a conscientious agent of public safety, you would want to train with this type of ammo thoroughly, to learn how to minimize collateral damage in public situations (crowds, tight spaces, etc).

Of course, the tinfoil hat in me says it would help cut down on witnesses, too.



Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:18 | 2701588 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

You do not use "hollow points" on a use frangible bullets


BTW hollow points are banned in war by the Geneva Convention which is why our military uses full metal jackets...the hollow points are for us...

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:54 | 2701717 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

They were called dum-dums.  The GIs would whittle out the point, knowing what damage would occur.  They were then mass produced in India where the name was derived.  The proposition that the purchase of JHPs would be purposefully used against the populace has precedence in history:

"During the Hague Convention of 1899, the British delegation attempted to justify the use of the dumdum bullet by pointing to its utility when putting down colonial unrest. Barbara Tuchman writes that, "Developed by the British to stop the rush of fanatical tribesman, the bullets were vigorously defended by Sir John Ardagh against the heated attack of all except the American military delegate, Captain Crozier, whose country was about to make use of them in the Philippines. In warfare against savages, Ardagh explained to an absorbed audience, "men penetrated through and through several times by our latest pattern of small calibre projectiles, which make a small clean holes," were nevertheless able to rush on and come to close quarters. Some means had to be found to stop them. "The civilized soldier when shot recognizes that he is wounded and knows that the sooner he is attended to the sooner he will recover. He lies down on his stretcher and is taken off the field to his ambulance, where he is dressed or bandaged. Your fanatical barbarian, similarly wounded, continues to rush on, spear or sword in hand; and before you have the time to represent to him that his conduct is in flagrant violation of the understanding relative to the proper course for the wounded man to follow - he may have cut off your head." However, the rest of the delegates at the Hague Convention 1899 did not accept this justification and voted 22-2 to prohibit the future use of the dumdum bullet."

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:46 | 2701934 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Theoretically speaking, potential civilian defenders might want take that into consideration.

Smells like a "police action" but I'll bet a case of Lake City .223 55 grain FMJ that it'll be a domestic military operation.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:55 | 2701477 Hugh_Jorgan
Hugh_Jorgan's picture

ZOMMMMMMMMBIE Training Sir!!!!!!!!!!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:01 | 2701773 takinthehighway
takinthehighway's picture

Bill Murray: "ARMY TRAINING, SIR!"

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:47 | 2701189 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

That's what's wrong with you doomers; you like to "read" about things like "facts" and such. 

Can't you all just "fake it till you make it" like the rest of the zombies?  Can't you just use magical FRN's on plastic credit (read debt for those that don't understand the difference) to show your friends and neighbors that all is well and how prosperous you are and how there are green shoots protruding from your ass?  Can't you buy more things that you don't need to make tax revenues higher to insure the govt. can spend more on "programs" to help, people, corporations and countries that "need" it?

It is your patriotic duty!  If you aren't with know the rest.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:50 | 2701201 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

So you are saying that I do not need to see a doctor about those green tentacles hanging from my arse?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:53 | 2701211 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

Green shoots are "transitory" in nature like inflation apparently. 

G20 plans response as food prices climb

"The Group of 20 countries are planning a meeting to coordinate a response to surging food prices, the Financial Times reported on Monday, as the worst U.S. drought in more than half a century devastates crops, lifting grain prices to record highs."

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:01 | 2701239 dirtbagger
dirtbagger's picture

They will be black testicles hanging when Obama gets finished with his financial policies.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:50 | 2701456 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

Please be careful! You are about to give birth to a candidate!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 21:40 | 2702748 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

"Can't you all just "fake it till you make it" like the rest of the zombies? "     problem is there aren't enough red pills to go around.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:48 | 2701194 jayman21
jayman21's picture

91 page PDf to order ammo.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:58 | 2701765 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Only takes me a few clicks at Cheaper-Than-Dirt!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:56 | 2701212 HD
HD's picture

Great news. I've always worried that we were unprepared when Canada finally invades America to get to our strategic beaver supply. Those Canadians are so polite, I just know they're up to something...

DHS is just thinking ahead. DHS needs.moar.funding.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:05 | 2701257 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

Supposedly the US Army is entertaining the idea of fighting in a civil war here in the fatherland, er, homeland. Maybe DHS is fearful that the US Army, if we ever get them home, will be on the side of the people, not the gummint. DHS will need rounds to send at the army troops?

Just dreaming...Army/Navy?Marines/USAF vs. DHS and TSA.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:49 | 2701767 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

I doubt DHS or TSH is trained to take on the military.  TSH is a cowardly bunch who are up for molesting screaming children and old women in diapers who can't fight back.  I'm not quite sure what the DHS does, though I am sure they are doing a fine job, since no one has flown a plane into the World Trace Center since 2001.   I am sure the fine employees of these agenccies would enjoy blowing up the general population, if we get out of hand, and maybe even if we don't and they simply decide we are superfluous, but I doubt they signed up to shoot at someone who could shoot back.  

I am a bit concerned about the government abandoning the military in the middle east and inviting them to swim back, which would leave the generals swinging in the wind.  Rome knew the danger of generals very well and thus required Their generals to leave their armies on the barbarian side of the Rubicon before coming to Rome.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:54 | 2701957 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

I am a bit concerned about the government abandoning the military in the middle east and inviting them to swim back

That'd pretty much blow this whole enchilada wide open.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 17:53 | 2702136 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Consider how long and complex that supply line is.  

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 22:25 | 2702858 Uncle Remus
Uncle Remus's picture

Ok, I'll bite. What does that have to do with "the government abandoning the military in the middle east and inviting them to swim back"?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:55 | 2701219 vast-dom
vast-dom's picture

so long as SP is over 800 we are in hopium bull zone of lifted propped markets. any time i hear someone say markets are lower and bears are back i snigger bc anything over 800 is beyond bullish. 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:59 | 2701227 Michael
Michael's picture


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:04 | 2701248 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:03 | 2701247 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

Final Warning:  Why both Obama AND Romney are unacceptable in 2012

Trapwire*, the national-to-global surveillance system is now fully operational.  Those security cams you see everywhere, and many you don't observe, are watching and collecting data --- and can correlate that factory code IMEI) on your cell phone, or smart phone, or laptop, or tablet, or automobile, etc.

At this very moment that network is being interfaced with UAV (surveillance drone) networks to be fully operational within the next several years.

Skynet, the ultimate control and enforcement element.  Sound farfetched?  You already saw that movie?  The Terminator series?

Well, read Nick Turse's stuff (The Complex), and long before that, Alex Carey.

That's how they do their Influence Operations --- first fictionalize it for mass consumption --- next they make fun of the reality as being really harmless!

And that Terminator actor, Arnold Schwarzenegger, went on to do a deal with those Enron bandits and became governor.

And the members of Schwarzenegger's Republican administration went on to be appointed to Obama's administration.

Live and learn, suckers! 

And those consultants on Cheney's and Poindexter's Total Information Awareness Project went on to be appointed to Obama's administration!

Live and learn, suckers! 


Once Skynet --- or whatever they choose to name it --- is fully implemented, that's all folks; that's all she wrote!

One final chance, vote Jill Stein into the presidency in 2012, or bid goodbye to any fantasy of a possible democracy in America's future!

Trust Wall Street?  Trust the government owned by Wall Street?

Romney and Ryan are so extreme rightwing --- the far rightwing Obama/Biden appear tame by comparison, but the finest presidential candidate in my lifetime is certainly Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party.

Final warning . . .

*Trapwire:  Abraxas Corporation, the company that originally created TrapWire under its subsidiary Abraxas Applications, also has significant ties to the CIA.  The company was founded by Richard “Hollis” Helms in 2001, two years after he left the CIA where he had worked for nearly 30 years.  Many of the company’s past employees and management have worked at the CIA or other intelligence agencies. In fact, Tim Shorrock notes in his 2008 book Spies for Hire that so many employees of the CIA were thought to be going to work for private companies like Abraxas that in 2005 CIA Director Porter Goss had to ask the company to stop recruiting in the CIA Cafeteria at Langley. The Los Angeles Times reported in 2006 that Abraxas had a contract from the CIA for developing front companies and false identities for the Agency’s nonofficial cover (NOC) program.  The company and its work are so secretive that Shorrock reportedly called the company for comment and was told, “Sir, we don’t talk to the media.”

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:12 | 2701272 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

Excuse me, but we must be living on different planets, perhaps in different universes. Would you please present your definitions for extreme and far rightwing policies? I put both Romney and Obama on the side of big government, so on your scale where do you put someone in favor of minimalist government? Left? Right? Different plane of existence? We can't have a meaningful discussion if we can't use mutually understood terms.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:23 | 2701850 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

".. I put both Romney and Obama on the side of big government.."

You're right, douchetard, a completely propagandized moron like yourself is simply not fit to attempt communication with the adults!

Negative, rodger dodger, they are both Wall Street lackeys, and anyone who is incapable of figuring that out for themselves isn't capable of adult thought.

Keep worshipping your TV set, stooge!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 17:04 | 2701990 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

Quite a stellar case of projection there.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:08 | 2701250 knukles
knukles's picture

The New Official Preppers

There ain't enuf citizens for all that shit


See three or four years ago talking about any of this shit; DoofHuseS purchases a Bazillion round of ammo, Mohammed talking about the end of the world, no party mattering, etc., etc., etc....

....gotacha branded as a Tin Foil Hat Conspiracy Theorist.
Welcome to the group of fucknuts, EVERYBODY

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:16 | 2701285 LeisureSmith
LeisureSmith's picture

How about 700 pounds of ANFO and 700 pounds of flake RDX.  A pretty rich order for Canine training aids.

solicitation  doc. link 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 18:38 | 2702246 smiler03
smiler03's picture

These are miniscule amounts, your average farmer could probably make a considerably larger fertilizer bomb in a jiffy.

"The CES requires the 700 pounds of High Density Ammonium Nitrate and 700 pounds of A-5 Flake RDX to  provide Canine Explosive Training Aids"  

Probably for sniffer dog training. But that's probably not conspiratorial enough.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:47 | 2701434 1911A1
1911A1's picture

Bzzt.  Wrong.  This is not an order.

From the 2nd page of your linked file:

When the Government requires CLTA covered by this contract, delivery order(s) will be issued: delivery instructions will be listed therein. ... The minimum guarantee that the Government will order is 1,000 rounds per contract per year.


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:59 | 2701494 FRBNYrCROOKS
FRBNYrCROOKS's picture

I hate to be the Devil's Advocate but, the order you refer to is training ammunition for 90+ different agencies under the DHS umbrella. The contract said "up to 750 miliion rounds"

Check out page 49. Part 3.0 CLTA Requirements.


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:59 | 2701496 GAAPpreNixon
GAAPpreNixon's picture

And there's more. The military is beefing up their renewable energy capacity in order to function for "weeks or months" in the event of a "grid collapse".

Details and this controversial article about why the 1% are the most capable of saving humanity here: Hot off the presses!   


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:05 | 2701790 Ray Bones
Ray Bones's picture

Wait. Are you suggesting that the DHS plans to shoot each American 2.4 times? Actually, why else would they want all those bullets?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:39 | 2701160 malikai
malikai's picture

I think PIMCO really wants QE3, bad.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:50 | 2701202 bigdumbnugly
bigdumbnugly's picture

probably not even as bad as it wants qe4, 5, and 6.

and speaking of hot air, wouldn't el-erian intimating anyone of that easily fall into the pot, kettle category? 


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:18 | 2701293 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

jackass-produced hot air, too

everything seems ok today, so better make some craaaazy noise


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:55 | 2701218 You Didn't Buil...
You Didn&#039;t Build That's picture

"Winter of Discontent."

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:13 | 2701278 baby_BLYTHE
baby_BLYTHE's picture

Pimco wants austerity and the American people to pay the coupon on PIMCOs 1 trillion+ holdings of Government debt.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:27 | 2701343 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

the checks are in the mail

oh wait!  pimpco's outa checks again!  L0L!!!

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:41 | 2701165 Lost Wages
Lost Wages's picture

So the United States is going to die. Poopity doopity. Pull up a lawn chair.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:45 | 2701184 Dr. Richard Head
Dr. Richard Head's picture

'Grabs 80's style web lawn chair.  Pulls up next to Lost Wages.  Cracks too Steel Reserve piss beers.  Hands it to Lost Wages. Sits down in chair with a sigh'

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:11 | 2701267 Bob
Bob's picture

+2  Where's my remote?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:31 | 2701647 ZeroAvatar
ZeroAvatar's picture

Mine's a 'rocket lawn-chair'.  Har Har.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:15 | 2701581 Lost Wages
Lost Wages's picture

I have to object to spending the apocalypse with the worst malt liquor imaginable. But I will politely accept and pour it in the dirt when you're not looking.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:41 | 2701166 surf0766
surf0766's picture

Who is he voting for?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:35 | 2701366 LMAOLORI
LMAOLORI's picture



surf0766 Who is he voting for?

"Already, the upcoming fight over the $607 billion "fiscal cliff" of automatic spending cuts and tax increases set to go into effect next year -- a potentially devastating hit to an already sluggish economy -- is starting to roil markets, and rightly so."

His Wallet but he is a democrat and he worked for the IMF his father took part in the Israeli/Arab peace negotiations 



The Rising Stock Market Could Get Obama Reelected


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:41 | 2701167 HD
HD's picture

So, I guess we just should hope it will change...

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:44 | 2701177 1C3-N1N3
1C3-N1N3's picture

Anyone who requires a leader deserves whatever leader they get.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:49 | 2701200 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

I require a liter.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:44 | 2701178 CptAwesome
CptAwesome's picture

Makes no difference. You have to vote for one or the other. I mean what are you going to do throw your vote away! /sarc

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:10 | 2701264 CrimsonAvenger
CrimsonAvenger's picture

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:46 | 2701185 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

El-Erian is full of hot air too.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:00 | 2701237 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

Why should anyone care about his opinion over that of any one on this forum?

Often, an economics degree is a sign of being brainwashed with scientistic nonsense.


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:07 | 2701259 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

When the anger comes people will draw no distinction between El-Erian and his ivy league scumbag banker buddies.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:46 | 2701186 Meatballs
Meatballs's picture

I wasn't aware that the anger had left.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:47 | 2701190 LongSoupLine
LongSoupLine's picture

Ron Paul...there, that wasn't so hard now was it?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:16 | 2701287 irie1029
irie1029's picture

Paul gave up.  Gary Johnson.... not as good as Paul but has the right ideas.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:47 | 2701191 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

We've already allowed bad economics to lead to bad politics.



I think you put the cart before the horse there..............

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:48 | 2701195 TraderTimm
TraderTimm's picture

The biggest lie in america is that a non-funded vote matters. By "non-funded" I mean not backed by massive lobbying organizations and corporate contributions.

Money controls our political system, not votes. It doesn't matter who is in the presidential hotseat, what matters is which cause has been given the most money to influence the legislature and the eventual desired outcome.

Even if you took everyone out of their incumbent seat - it wouldn't matter - the real policy guidance comes from those who have the most to spend.

Please, prove me wrong - but that is where we are right now. The fact people even think the election matters is a testament to how intellectually lazy everyone is.

Frankly, the system needs a reboot and reformulation.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:52 | 2701207 1100-TACTICAL-12
1100-TACTICAL-12's picture

Voting does not mean shit , when a company in Spain owned partially by Soros does the tally.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:12 | 2701274 knukles
knukles's picture


The Dystopia of Orwell Come True

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:52 | 2701206 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

There is little difference between the two candidates on spending, war, lying, fraud, corruption, etc... 

The more I hear that they "are polar opposites" in the MSM (and here too) the less I believe it.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:58 | 2701208 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture

What populist anger?  Millions of crimes committed during the subprime crisis and not one person went to jail.  

Americans are controlled by TV, addiction to sports, antidepressants (usage up 400% in 20 years), fluoride in water, fear of al Qaeda attacks, and excessive levels of obesity and disease. There will be no riots in the streets - unless the government bans bacon.

Besides, drones are ready to be deployed if needed.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:08 | 2701263 Winston Smith 2009
Winston Smith 2009's picture

Ha, you beat me to it.  Joe and Jane Sixpack will only get off of their butts and into the streets when their games and circuses disappear.  In the mean time, they find that ignorance is bliss.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:14 | 2701281 Bob
Bob's picture

Thoughtcrime is a dangerous business.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:29 | 2701347 Winston Smith 2009
Winston Smith 2009's picture

Yes, it has become a crime to actually think critically about the status quo.  The lack of critical reasoning ability in the US is obvious.  The scientific process should be one that is drilled into young minds as much as possible, but it isn't.  Several of best bloggers I read who daily expose the scams of our political and financial system are former hi-tech industry types, like me.  When you have the learned ability of critical thought and analysis gained through constant exposure to the scientific process, it becomes second nature to easily determine how you are being told lies, half-truths, exaggerations, etc., etc., as part of a subtle marketing/propaganda machine, far more subtle than the one used in former Eastern Bloc countries and, as a result, probably far more effective.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:39 | 2701398 Bob
Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:07 | 2701541 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

If everyone thought objectively, we would already be in utopia.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:11 | 2701812 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

I can't recommend this book enough for anyone and everyone - especially those raising children and hoping to best prepare them.

Uncommon Sense: the Heretical Nature of Science  by Alan Cromer

Book Description

Most people believe that science arose as a natural end-product of our innate intelligence and curiosity, as an inevitable stage in human intellectual development. But physicist and educator Alan Cromer disputes this belief. Cromer argues that science is not the natural unfolding of human potential, but the invention of a particular culture, Greece, in a particular historical period. Indeed, far from being natural, scientific thinking goes so far against the grain of conventional human thought that if it hadn't been discovered in Greece, it might not have been discovered at all.
In Uncommon Sense, Alan Cromer develops the argument that science represents a radically new and different way of thinking. Using Piaget's stages of intellectual development, he shows that conventional thinking remains mired in subjective, "egocentric" ways of looking at the world--most people even today still believe in astrology, ESP, UFOs, ghosts and other paranormal phenomena--a mode of thought that science has outgrown. He provides a fascinating explanation of why science began in Greece, contrasting the Greek practice of debate to the Judaic reliance on prophets for acquiring knowledge. Other factors, such as a maritime economy and wandering scholars (both of which prevented parochialism) and an essentially literary religion not dominated by priests, also promoted in Greece an objective, analytical way of thinking not found elsewhere in the ancient world. He examines India and China and explains why science could not develop in either country. In China, for instance, astronomy served only the state, and the private study of astronomy was forbidden. Cromer also provides a perceptive account of science in Renaissance Europe and of figures such as Copernicus, Galileo, and Newton.


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 23:08 | 2702930 Bob
Bob's picture

Thanks, I ordered it.  It fits right into my reading list. 

Wed, 08/15/2012 - 14:58 | 2707642 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

I could have sent you a copy.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:33 | 2701373 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

They are very angry. They're not doing anything about it, but they're still angry. They have other ways of dealing with it, like bitching about it every chance they get, then going off to spend more credit-money on a quick fix of consumer hopium.

Don't underestimate populism. Most every tyrannical takeover in modern history has successfully leveraged populist anger, it is the lever of all socialisms. And when it is let loose, who suffers the most? Not the elites, bankers, politicians, aristocrats, criminals of any kind, but the evil bourgeois middle-class, the entrepreneurs, the pacifists, the classical conservatives and classical liberals - anyone who opposes or appears to oppose the mob - being sensible, calling for moderation, encouraging critical thought - these are punishable by death.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:07 | 2701539 yabyum
yabyum's picture


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:44 | 2701700 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

Right, when OWS tried to change the national conversation from "jobs, economy, macro" to "fraud, cronyism, micro".....that is when they unleashed their paid NYPD (union) thugs to beat the living shit out of unarmed protesters.  Or, when the Tea Party came about, how the Kochs and other corporate interests bought and paid off leader heads to talk about trivial shit like gay marriage and taxes on individuals instead of corporate taxes, regulations with teeth, and government fiscal responsibility.

It's pretty obvious the message from TPTB is: "You'll like what welfare we give you, what wage we give you, and what bread and circuses we give you - so SHUT the FUCK up!"


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:54 | 2701214 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

>Sadly, neither Obama nor Romney has yet offered a meaningful, forward-looking economic reform program to address problems

Why would they want to do that?

They are crooks through and through; the worst among liars and thieves. And they have no reason to be "forward-looking". They are akin to renters who trash their homes.

Americans don't want anything solved. They find lies to be sweeter and more comforting than truths, and they vote accordingly.


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:49 | 2701446 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

"Americans don't want anything solved." Because real solutions would be the end of all the neoliberal and neoconservative uberstatists' false promises. No more credit cards, no more mortgages, no more iToys, no more service economy, no more entitlements, no more military adventurism and world-policing, no more petrodollar or inflation exporting, but most of all, no more passing of the blame for the endless, boundless failure.

Why bother with any of that when you can just pull a lever and feel smug and proud of political sophistication while blaming someone else for the failure for four more years.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:05 | 2701523 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

spoken like a true elitist scumbag doc!

"ain't it just awful tho?!"

the republicans just don't like dodd/frank and pretend it isn't on the books;   like you, here;  however, it has been the LAW for 2 years now and even seems to be stabilizing the system which was, of course, it's purpose! 

bit of a palace coup in 08; solved a few things?  took care of mcCain/palin e.g.

that was tough, too!  now:  mittens

seen any polls? 

the "problem" for the whiney egyptian asswipe is that he can't pay the pensioners their pensions b/c he didn't invest THEIR money well enuf to do so, while living like a fuking KING btw

so he figures they will come after him [which they should] for being so full of shit for so fuking long that he may have a terminal condition @ pimpco called "underfunded liabilities" which is no one's fault but his own and his partners and employees who are ALL living quite well right now, i'll betcha...  all "legally" of course, too

the idea that either candidate is gonna kiss his worthless ass at this point is absurd, but he certainly has a right to throw a tantrum if he's not happy and people are coming after him w/ a rope

lies?  or do you mean legislation?  the failure of the R-majority House to hold prez0's feet to the fire last august ceiling time was amazingly noted by all here, as the pols (both parties)  took the 'staus quo'  do-re-mi and rPaul funnelled a shitload of TeaParty-type donations to the mitten-man as a good party guy who didn't rock the boat

so now, the TParty is pretending mittens is "one of us"

suuuure he is, BiCheZ! 

that woulld be the POLS doc, not thePeople, who took the corpo-fascist money for delivering the votes for the lobbyists

what got "solved" in 08 was the neoCons emptying the Treasury for themselves and their cronies

no, the neoCons are NOT happy campers here&now, either, are they?

and that would be their personal problem, at this point now wouldn't it?  sow;  reap;  duh.

"americans don't want..." ???   neoCons republicans...maybe...?

wake up
smell coffee
zip lip too? 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:15 | 2701819 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Nice to see you cut loose there, Slewie.  Good stuff.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:56 | 2701222 You Didn't Buil...
You Didn&#039;t Build That's picture

Does this mean we expect another round of record high Banker Bonuses, 4 years in a row?

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 13:56 | 2701223 Bastiat009
Bastiat009's picture

El-Erian never opposed bail outs, government interventions or having his ass kissed on CNBC.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:28 | 2701351 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

But will the grunts obey their officers? Viet Nam proved that an officer issuing unpopular orders was at risk.


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:50 | 2701458 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

Well then Afghanistan and Iraq disproved Vietnam.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:18 | 2701831 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

You are SO wrong.   Inform yourself of the difference between a volunteer and a conscripted army. 

Fragging has its place.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 16:19 | 2701834 roadhazard
roadhazard's picture

uh, but no. Put draftees in Iraq and Afghanistan and see what happens.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:05 | 2701252 toomanyfakecons...
toomanyfakeconservatives's picture

More fuel for the looming MASS ARRESTS...

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:05 | 2701255 earnulf
earnulf's picture

As so many have pointed out, the two party system offers the American Voter three choices, vote for the system candidate which will accomplish nothing, or don't vote at all.

Votes for independent or small party candidates are ladyfingers in the elections firework display.

It is literally a climb of freakish proportions to operate a presidential campaign under 50 different deadlines (state filings) and almost like shouting in the Grand Canyon to be heard.

We have already crossed the point of no return and the only way to turn the ship around is a hard reverse.    If Demos win, stalemate will ensue, if Repubs win, we could have a open class warfare within the next ten years as the have nots start dining on the haves.

Where is the MOR candidate who advocates raising taxes, eliminating deductions for corporations, cutting federal spending across the board (DOD, Entitlements, everything) and offers to do so while cutting his own paycheck by 10%?    Where is the MOR candidate that decrys the lavish perks of Congress and offers up the sacrificial Congressional lamb for slaughter so that the people can see their represenatatives do indeed "feel their pain"?

Mitt is not the "white knight on a firey steed".   Obama is not the "hero".    We need someone who doesn't give them hell, but tells the truth, which they think is hell!     I know the president is no saint, but before we can right the ship of state, we have to clean the decks first.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:12 | 2701271 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Debt slaves cannot make the hard choices necessary to provide even one more generation of freedom here in the U.S.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:19 | 2701292 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture


"If Demos win, stalemate will ensue, if Repubs win, we could have a open class warfare within the next ten years as the have nots start dining on the haves".

Do you really think we aren't having open class warfare now? Are you suggesting the dems are going protect you from that? Because rest assured both parties have declared war on the American public.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:22 | 2701314 Bob
Bob's picture

Having a purportedly embattled brutha heroically manning the Presidency against the barbarians effectively removes the dims from the equation.  Clever move, electing a slick black man to front for the plutocrats. 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 17:17 | 2702043 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

Ding ding ding! We have a winner!

The entire point of his presidency was to transform a volatile urban black population into hard core defenders of the current power structure overnight. As long as he has the job, they will go along with things that they would scream bloody murder over if a repub was the great and powerful Oz head without so much as a whimper.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 18:50 | 2702264 Bob
Bob's picture

Bingo.  And nobody likes black people more than I do, without sleeping with them. 

It's unforgivably cynical what's goin' on. 

Of course, Cornell West and Tavis Smiley haven't been quiet about it. 

Spike Lee apparently likes sucking dick . . . as long as it's black. 

Why ain't we hearing from Big and Black Chris Rock?

This shit hurts me.  But it is what it is. 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:20 | 2701305 Winston Smith 2009
Winston Smith 2009's picture

I agree 100%.  Unfortunately, the problem is systemic and, thus, the system will not allow let alone promote a "deck cleaning."  That, apparently, will only occur after a crash even worse than 2008 since the 2008 crash obviously wasn't enough, thanks to trillions in borrowed money spent, to get people off their butts and paying attention to how insanely bad they and their children were being robbed by the system as it is.  Next time, the tools used to soften the impact of the 2008 crash will not be available or, at least, will not be able to accomplish that as transparently.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:27 | 2701344 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

You might be surprised, a lot can be accomplished with 30,000 drones...........

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:37 | 2701340 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

Theft is immoral, criminal, and deleterious to civilization.

>Where is the MOR candidate who advocates raising taxes, eliminating deductions for corporations

And yet here you go calling for increased theft, and thwarting ways for people to avoid theft.

Does that mean you are you part of the problem?

Also, by "MOR" I assume you mean "middle-of-the-road". If so, it sounds like you are falling for the argumentum ad temperantiam fallacy too.


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:33 | 2701354 poor fella
poor fella's picture

In this day-and-age a candidate shouldn't have any friends or family to threaten.


Obama said Ryan is a family man (is that code?) - rest assured, the status quo is status quo - As far as November, we've already been 'mated'. 

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:12 | 2701270 monopoly
monopoly's picture

So maybe in 2013 we will have our "Spring" where 2 million march on Washington. That will be the shot that starts the change. Until then it is just Olympics, American Idol, the Bachelor, Amazing absurd race, and reality shows. Carry on.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:15 | 2701282 knukles
knukles's picture

Don't forget the Subliminal Messaging in those shows.
Stop watching TV

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:24 | 2701325 monopoly
monopoly's picture

Oh i did. Over 2 years ago. But we cannot disconnect Direct TV because my wife still watches MSM and crap. But I have given up on it. What a wasteland. And they charge us for watching inane programs.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:28 | 2701352 PatientZero
PatientZero's picture

I don't know, Tyler. Being full of shit is one thing -- being fucking criminal is another.

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 14:30 | 2701357 Ima anal sphincter
Ima anal sphincter's picture

Your Government--------------NOT!!!!!

Why bother with any of this shit. Two joke party's "representing" the people.

Evil bankers running the show.

A totally "controlled' media feeding us lies.

A military that no longer represents The Constitution. A military that excels at murdering totally innocent people over a lie called "The War on Terrorism".

Figure it out people.....there is only ONE answer to this. That answer is us.

Will enough of "us" figure it out before it's to late???????

Mon, 08/13/2012 - 15:00 | 2701500 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

"Until they become conscious they will never rebel, and until after they they have rebelled they cannot become conscious."


Mon, 08/13/2012 - 17:32 | 2702093 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

You're never a member of a group that points guns at you.

That fact escapes most people

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