This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

The Cherry On Top: CME Lowers Equity Index Margins By Over 20%

Tyler Durden's picture


In a week which has seen the Fed telegraphing further QEasing by its favorite mouthpiece, and the ECB promising, but never delivering, both that the ESM would get a banking license, which prevented the EURUSD from tumbling below 1.20 yesterday yet which has been totally forgotten today, and that we should "beeleeve" Mario Draghi that unlike before he will not let the EUR fail, the cherry on top and the one event which removes any doubt that the coordinated events of this whole have had the sole purposes of masking that US corporate success has finally plateaued and it is 'only downhill from here', comes courtesy of the CME which moments ago cut the margin requirements on the bulk of its equity indices by 20-25%.


- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:29 | 2654871 agent default
agent default's picture

Oh wow.  The bucketshop is trying to stay relevant. 

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:35 | 2654899 SHEEPFUKKER

Really CME? Really?

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:37 | 2654904 Ray1968
Ray1968's picture

Ready for the gold margin hike?

Just saying..... 

You know its coming.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:39 | 2654916 101 years and c...
101 years and counting's picture

didnt that mark the top last july/aug?  seriously.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:18 | 2655015 FieldingMellish
FieldingMellish's picture

Three times. 10 Aug, 24 Aug and 23 Sep. The more they hike the margin, the less effective it is at its intended purpose... kind of like QE.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:31 | 2655042 The Monkey
The Monkey's picture


Hall of horrors! You're fucked!!!

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:48 | 2655222 Doña K
Doña K's picture

And if there is a sudden downward trend.... We will see if everyone's margin is gone and while running for the exits someone has to take the hit. it will be you the little guy.

Or you are in and while you are down a bit, they increase margin in which case you need to unwind your positions or throw more money in the pit. 


The motto is: Preserve your capital. Forget any profits until the game is at least fair and the rules do not change on a daily basis.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:14 | 2655396 flacon
flacon's picture

June 1st, 2011:



CME lowers margins on S&P Futures-all in?



Friday, June 17, 2011

CME Group lowers margin requirements for Gold futures


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:59 | 2654935 SHEEPFUKKER

Yup Ray Ray, they will hike margins on AU/AG right after global QE is announced and stocks will soar and the metals will tank, and the spin doctors will be out in force saying how the world economy is saved and there is no need to be in the safety of gold and silver anymore.  Of course, that trend will last about 20 minutes. 

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:09 | 2654999 Renewable Life
Renewable Life's picture

yep, anything that even smells like it could compete with the fiat currency fantasy, (gold, silver, copper, etc) will get crushed, the the moon!!!

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:11 | 2655002 FieldingMellish
FieldingMellish's picture

Let them eliminate margin for PMs all together. Drive the specs out of the derivative market and into physical where everyone belongs. Honest markets for honest money.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 07:21 | 2655810 Northeaster
Northeaster's picture

Hopefully people are still reading this thread. You present a great question, and a question I've been asking for weeks that no one on ZH can answer, or even offer insight to:

A delay of TRIPLE margin hikes? The question of course, as I've been thinking, will this result in a massive sell off in paper? Monday, August 6th we'll have our answer or another delay.

Not sure about anyone else, but I'm hoping in sell off, with cash on the sidelines, it's a no-brainer buy (and I am not a metals bug).

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:30 | 2654873 veyron
veyron's picture

CME has no choice ... they are almost completely irrelevant

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:19 | 2655161 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

Still, they're a business and the leadership has fiduciary responsibilities. Does this seem at all responsible. When the market sits on what many are calling the edge of a decades long support that if it turns south there's huge downside risk and there's lots of resisitance above so limited chance of a big rally, that's when you decide to cut margins so your stock holders are left holding the bag if/when those overleveraged bozos get taken out? Margins are meant to protect the exchange from people who lose more than they have in their accounts. It's a desperation move on the part of the manipulators. They're going all-in on a pair of twos and praying for a streak of luck. If the drought is any indication they shouldn't expect any divine intervention to help them along. The Ponzi is going down.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:30 | 2654875 marz929
marz929's picture


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:31 | 2655044 LeisureSmith
LeisureSmith's picture

It's a bird! It's a plane! It's Jon Corzine! Free as a bird, laughing as he swoops down taking dumps on people below. The original Shithawk. This might not come as a surprise, but it was news to me. apparently the douche is pretty tight with placeHolder & co.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:32 | 2654880 Meesohaawnee
Meesohaawnee's picture


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:33 | 2654885 HelluvaEngineer
HelluvaEngineer's picture

"Screw you guys.  I'm going home."

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:33 | 2654888 ReallySparky
ReallySparky's picture

Ladies and Gentleman, the casino is open.   All muppets are welcome to place your bets.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:00 | 2654896 ATG
ATG's picture

Sold the SPY Aug 133 calls for +50% that got 6 ZH Red Votes last two days,

and still have GM calls in an account up 6.8 times since 2 July 2012, no guarantee for future results, maybe better:

Good luck anonymous Red ZH cluckers who don't add value, but enjoy tearing others down.

(Lots of idle frustration in those Red Clicks.)

Skeptics who know the price of everything and the value of nothing (OW)

We donate to ZH for every ZH subscriber.

Trading well truly is the best revenge.

5 thoughtless red clicks so far:

Guess this market's going higher...;


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:13 | 2655004 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

how are you making money selling SPY 133 calls when SPY is at 136 today and has not closed below 133 in all of July?

I don't think you're being junked because you're "bullish". I think you are being junked because you seem to be bullshitting.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:53 | 2655237 ATG
ATG's picture

AIQ, OO subscribers and people on ZH who followed the trades in real time know there is no bullshitting.

Thinking there is was more a reflection on the junkers than the junkee.

Red junk people were all too willing to render a verdict without material evidence.

Sold the SPY calls to close today after opening them long Wed and Thursday, as posted on ZH in real time, red junked at the time for being contrary to predictable emotional ZH crowd opinion reacting to bad news events.

(One of these days I would like to see a positive post on ZH. I keep looking. Yes, I understand ZH was an antidote to Wall Street bs, but too much antidote can poison too.)

Successful trading requires stoicism, not the antagonistic witticism that masquerades as intelligence too often in the comments.

Still have the GM calls bought and posted on ZH yesterday and today, thank you. They were red junked, so may also be a profitable trade.

Thanks for at least being halfway human AIQ.

If you arte reasonable enough to want the whole truth, read this instead of going to critical mass first like some others herewith:

OO weekly subscriptions have a money back subscription  guarantee and no one has needed their money back yet since OO started on 2 July 2012.

OO donates to ZH for ZH subscribers who join 00, profit and repeat subscribe. ZH does good work getting the news out quickly and intelligently, despite the bearish bias. 

(Past performance is no guarantee of future 00 results, maybe better.)

Pity red junkers cannot conceive of option trading success.


35 years of derivative tax loss carryforwards before wised up with OO...



Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:04 | 2655271 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

I don't mean to harp on this, but...I have to point out that there seems to be a glaring flaw in your response.

If you sold SPY 133 calls on Wed and covered today, you should have taken a pounding NOT a profit since SPY has gone from 133.25 low yesterday to about 136.50 high today.

Also, perhaps it's just semantics but, if you SOLD calls, you would BUY to close your position NOT sell (as you just stated).

I don't begrudge anyone making money in this market. It's no small task. But, there is such a thing as being graceful about it and your original post did not display much grace. I understand that you may have been pissed off at whomever for whatever...but your post threw gas on the fire...not water.

I hope you do well trading man. This shit ain't easy.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:20 | 2655406 ATG
ATG's picture

AIQ, harp away, there is no glaring flaw in my response.

Apparently you did not read my posts with adequate comprehension, likely due to all the mindless attack flamers assuming and insinuating claims not in evidence.

Did not post OO sold calls short to open trades.

You or another harranguer hypothecated that and it was picked up and spread by chattering monkey nabobs. Check the posts again and please correct if wrong.

Overnight Options trades only in-the-money opening and closing scaled-in long options, with adequate cash reserves to accumulate and hold for less than week, with enough time to expiration to avoid destructive Theta time decay.

There are no margin or naked collateralized OO trades, only cash trades. The $100 weekly suibscription is guaranteed if the open marlket trrades do not cover the cost. So far they have, and subscriberds have been repeat, with no guarantees for the future.

You and other ZH careful readers just got the charitable benefit of 35 years trading derivatives and options many ways with huge carry-forward losses, teaching a Stanford Course called Options and Other Beasts, over three decades at Merrill Lynch/Stanford Capital, recently publishing subscription guaranteed portfolios three years with over 1000% returns each year and making a presentation to TSAASF to perfect OO: 

If done with the right parameters, without fear or greed, options can have a good limited risk to higher reward ratio.

You are quite right about trading not being a small (or easy) task. Frankie Joe et al had fatal heart attacks trading agaoinst the crowd. 

OO was attacked on other blogs and even booted off for posting real trades in real time that worked well without selectively editing them.

Most people are either envious or skeptical it can be done, perhaps ZH posters who complain about the market as a rigged game because they lost money.

My point in posting was to inspire people that they can profit in these markets, rigged, CME, Madeoff, OMFG, PFG, Snodfart or not. 

If there was a lack of grace, it was attempting to respond rationally to repeated crude misbased neanderthal attacks.

As one of the TD fight club who correctly called out criminal Mad Hedge Fund Trader John Thomas fantasy trades as bogus, he eventually left ZH with his nonsense after somehow getting my email from ZH to subscribe to his overpriced mistakes.

Last time checked, his delusional meglomaniacal market calls and pocket trades, eg long TBT for years are still here to see, a credit to TD and ZH.

Likewise the Chilean Movie Maker Dartmouth Philosopher who pretended to be a Fed expert and repeatedly predicted Latin American hyperinflation around the corner in the USA, instead of defacto debt default asset deflation, despiet AG, BB, CR, HP, LS, 0 and TG calls for green shoots for subprimes since 2008.

We are in the greatest depression that began in the Jubilee Year of 2000, and is still poresenting short-term trading ops.  

If you want to send a mailing address to, can mail you all the OO account trades since 2 July 2012 when OO began publishing.

If you want to provide your email, maybe some OO subscribers would like to comment on their experience with OO, since the detractors here on ZH did not believe me.

At least one of them does read ZH, which triggered donations to ZH for the referral:

As I used to say when I had more time to put out Jubilee Prosperity with the help of Mark J of DNS, who keeps ZH working, this was a Longfellow...



Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:41 | 2655436 Freebird
Freebird's picture

Sounds like you're over & out, burnt out. Hang up your boots, get back to nature, screw the missus, hug your kids, check your preps & thanks for your contribution. Cioa ATG

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 23:12 | 2655475 ATG
ATG's picture

Thanks Freebird, good ideas after a 15 hour day on OO.

Through communicating with unarmed dangerous people who repeatedly do not care to understand the difference between buying long and selling short options.



Thu, 07/26/2012 - 23:36 | 2655507 Freebird
Freebird's picture

Easy, don't play their game no more. Did, nicely, but not now - its over.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 08:49 | 2655997 ATG
ATG's picture

Ain't over til it's over and trading well is the best revenge.


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:13 | 2655009 Global Hunter
Global Hunter's picture

People who get hung up on red arrows are whingers and no debates about that, its a FACT.

I'm not concerned about your trades, glad they worked out for you but there's no need to be a sore winner about it.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:40 | 2655068 The Monkey
The Monkey's picture

Some of the "advertised" trades worked out for them. Those that were significant losers were just flipped post results (i.e., puts turned into calls, etc.)

Definitely a scam artist. Watch out.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:27 | 2655173 ATG
ATG's picture

If I did not think you were just someone who dispenses prejudiced opinions without just evidence, I would show you all the trades in the account since 2 July 2012 or ask current repeat OO subscribers who have not needed refunds to straighten you out. Click on ATG to see the posts and then apologize for your rabid comments. 

Who exactly is the scam artist to watch out for TM?..


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:53 | 2655242 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

Methinks thou dost protest too much.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:24 | 2655307 ATG
ATG's picture

Not worth a comment Dead File Dept.

(In the three years on ZH there have a lot of gang rape comments by no-nothings, usually on the wrong side of the market...) 

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:39 | 2655337 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

wait a minute: You're the one claiming to be making money SELLING IN THE MONEY CALLS as the stock price is RISING and you are calling me a "no-nothing" (which you didn't even have the common sense to spell properly)? really need to learn when to shut the fuck up because with every word you type you are digging yourself deeper and deeper into the hole of zero credibility.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 23:02 | 2655464 ATG
ATG's picture

Did not claim to be SELLING IN THE MONEY CALLS, Holmes Joker.

Your specious claims devalue you.

Reread everything posted and apologize for your twisted comments or will no longer respond to your continued baseless attacks trying to demean honest accomplishments you apparently do not understand.

Then get a life beside ZH Cerberus.

A thousand to one misquotes and red marks to one or two greens do not make you or anyone else stooping right, only in league with the devil...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 08:41 | 2655979 ATG
ATG's picture

No AIQ, I meant no-nothing in your case.

Your language says it all...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:56 | 2655103 ATG
ATG's picture

Oy, way to smear GH.

Do you feel better now?

The comments on red arrows were re posting profitable real-time option trades here since 2 July 2012, that were junked by until-now anonymous ZH readers, who seem so blindly pessimistic they cannot apparently conceive of trading success being long equity options.

No one is a sore winner.

17 red arrows say a lot about the states of mind of those who did it anonymously. What exactly did they hope to accomplish byu spreading their animosity?

The trades and links were posted on ZH after years here to benefit more than current repeat subscribers, with donations for ZH subscribers going to ZH...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:58 | 2655110 Global Hunter
Global Hunter's picture

No smears, I am actually trying to give you some productive advice, take it or leave it.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:19 | 2655157 ATG
ATG's picture

And what exactly is the productive advice GH, that you can call someone a whinger and a sore winner and feel proud of it?... 

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:00 | 2655112 The Monkey
The Monkey's picture

Hey asshole. Quit changing your story on your positions. You're a fraud.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:12 | 2655142 ATG
ATG's picture

Watch your lying mouth Monkey Butt Troll.

Why don't you take the time to look up the real time posts before rendering an unqualified opinion?

What goes around comes around...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:02 | 2655115 fuu
fuu's picture

You've been around long enough to know that you get one for link pimping and 2 for flinching.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:16 | 2655148 ATG
ATG's picture

No pimp flinch here, FUU.

Just a lot of hostility from some frustrated ZH posters who have little constructive to say...


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 23:13 | 2655478 El Oregonian
El Oregonian's picture

Go to sleep.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 08:34 | 2655960 ATG
ATG's picture

Wake up...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:19 | 2655160 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

seems like you and robo are the only two dickheads fickle enough to count red arrows.

stop being such a pussy.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:19 | 2655298 ATG
ATG's picture

Who's counting now?

More smears lower your IQ alien.

Keep on name calling: that's what people do when they have nothing useful to say...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:37 | 2655198 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

Not complaining about your trades. If had wanted to wager in the casino I would have gone with a similar trade yesterday. The trend line support was still unbroken and yet another short-covering slime rally was pretty likely. I am saying that you're coming across as a whiny snot-nosed kid which sucks as a business model and super-sucks for fight club. Next time grow a set and go for the SPY 135s and make more money.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:16 | 2655291 ATG
ATG's picture

DF, thanks for the comment and falsetto condescension. 

You did not trade and OO subscribers did:

Calling out someone with half a century experience in markets from when silver dollars were a buck is priceless projection and entertaining indignation...




Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:45 | 2655443 Freebird
Freebird's picture

^^^^^^^ .

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 09:06 | 2656060 ATG
ATG's picture


Fri, 07/27/2012 - 08:33 | 2655958 ATG
ATG's picture

DF, you are living proof we can only get so far with the fight club metaphor.

Talk is cheap.

Good luck trading...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 11:53 | 2656795 ATG
ATG's picture

Setting the record straight Dept

(Green in the money long GM and new SPY long calls today speak for themselves):

From an Options Overnight subscriber:

"I don't have a ZH account (yet), so unfortunately can't set the record straight there for you.

Had a quick look at the dialog that occurred...a bit over the top there. Clearly they didn't read what you said...

I can certainly vouch for your statements because I was following your trades. And yes we DID make around 50% on the SPY Aug 133 calls as you describe. 

Flying wingman to your trades is both an exciting ride and a real learning experience.

After the market fall on Tuesday (into which we profited on your DIA AUG 125 put trade) I was CERTAIN that the market would finally go lower. But you BOUGHT CALLS instead! WTF?! 

But I'm here following your lead so I'll follow what you say since you have decades more experience than I do. So while shaking my head, I went in and bought the calls too. And here we are with more profit. You were right (again)!

Your short-term market timing continues to be impeccable. 

Your subscription model is brilliant too. No forking over big $'s up front. 

$100 for a week of trade alerts. Don't like it? Don't buy any more. Total cost? $100.

(and you'll even give a refund or a week for free if the trades don't make that $100 back). 

Can't be simpler than that.

But if like me you do like it, then you'll pony up again next week and become a repeat subscriber.

Watch and learn....and enjoy the ride.

Thanks again RC! " 

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:37 | 2654900 Racer
Racer's picture

How do you spell ponzi, pyramid, scam, fraud, corruption:

"The Stock Market"

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:39 | 2654918 centerline
centerline's picture

"The entire fucking civilized global economy"

Fixed it for ya!

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:50 | 2654950 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

To the best of my knowledge, there has never been a "civilization" on this planet. Tecnologically advanced heathens yes.........civilization, no.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:53 | 2654962 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

You'll have to beat the definition of civilization into anyone before they understand it, but that wouldn't be civilized, so the circle continues. Or should I say spiral? 

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:57 | 2654972 centerline
centerline's picture

"ponzi" = " general nature of the human species".

Yikes.  Is more correct than not.  Time for a beer, shot of something, etc.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:59 | 2654977 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture

Reporter: What do you think of western civilization?

Mahatma Gandhi: I think it would be a good idea.


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:37 | 2654905 Cdad
Cdad's picture

The CME...helping to float the SPY and ES bissfully all of the index underlying issues are obliterated after their qtrly earnings reports.  Great!  Apparently, there is zero margin on market manipulation.


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:39 | 2654915 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

If the goal is to slaughter the shorts then indeed "coordinated it must be." The proof of the pudding is in the eating. "Yummy ain't good enuf" in this economy.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:43 | 2654930 centerline
centerline's picture

A good portion of the fuel for the last few years has been exactly that... those evil shorts being sacrificed before the alter of central banking control.  Is no coincidence at all.  

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:51 | 2654929 chump666
chump666's picture

Big rally coming and I am the bear from hell. 

Could blow the April/May top.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:53 | 2654957 Reese Bobby
Reese Bobby's picture

"Could blow the Aug top."  What does that mean if you are in a sharing mood.  Thanks.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:55 | 2654965 Reese Bobby
Reese Bobby's picture

Ah, typo.  "Could" makes all statements possible.  One thing is for sure, stocks "can" do anything.  Good luck.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:48 | 2655064 chump666
chump666's picture

yeah typo.  ok this is what I know cause I like ZH posters.

May top, we have mad Mario rip -1% off the USD in a matter of minutes, the most brutal short squeeze too date, sans the EU jawboning in June, Bernanke's madness a week or so back.  We all await the FOMC on 31st/1st Aug.  If you check your charts, shorts could not get below central bank supports eg Dow 12000, S&P 1250 put/s, so you might as well ride this to May highs 13000 etc.

But, no new highs, all this Dow 15000 rubbish, with the market fully tapped into heroin from sick look central bank pushers, a bond bubble, inflation spreading rapidly throughout Asia, war tensions as ZH pointed out, oil inflation slamming into Obama's a-hole...I could go on, point is, market will slam down hard in Aug at some-point.  Eyes on Asia for selling cues.


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:02 | 2655262 SnobGobbler
SnobGobbler's picture

rally my ass, I bet they mail you a bag to hold... snail mail...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:45 | 2654936 Rainman
Rainman's picture

The liquidity bait commences or needs to continue or something like that.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:46 | 2654940 Reese Bobby
Reese Bobby's picture

CME?  Crisis Management Exercise?

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:04 | 2654990 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

Clobbering Muppets Electronically

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 02:10 | 2655624 HungrySeagull
HungrySeagull's picture

Chaning Madhouse Exits.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:49 | 2654949 FieldingMellish
FieldingMellish's picture

The mugger gives you back your empty wallet. How kind.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:57 | 2654954 JenkinsLane
JenkinsLane's picture

What's that smell? Can't... quite... put... my... finger... on... it. Oh yes, desperation.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:54 | 2654964 citizen2084
citizen2084's picture

The CME margin action?

Surely this is just a concerned corporate citizen trying to help the good people in tough time. 

...or not! Freaking criminals.




Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:57 | 2654971 Lost Wages
Lost Wages's picture

Don't buy nothin'.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:58 | 2654974 centerline
centerline's picture

Except real stuff... as opposed to that paper/electronic stuff.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 18:59 | 2654978 vote_libertaria...
vote_libertarian_party's picture

Maybe the gvt gave them a heads up that the GDP number tomorrow is a stinker and to open the liquidity floodgates fully.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:00 | 2654979 casaananda
casaananda's picture

Newmont earnings for 2Q look like a disaster. damnit. losing bigtime on that.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:04 | 2654988 fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

How about Barrick..

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:49 | 2655226 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

String of disasters out of the gold miners - amazing, gold up, oil down (generally speaking), and they still can't turn over a decent quarter.  No wonder they're perpetually getting their asses kicked in the market.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:06 | 2655275 ATG
ATG's picture

Unlike the 20s and 30s when we were on a fixed $20 and $36 government gold standard guaranteeing profits to gold miners while costs fell, miners today are being hit by increased costs and declining bullion prices, a double whammy. Only deep pockets and cash takeovers survive to eventually profit when gold goes up faster than PMI...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:56 | 2655104 The Monkey
The Monkey's picture

The miners have so many variables. Plus, gold is generally a byproduct of copper mining, and copper rolls with the economy.

Might be a good time to go with puts on GDX/GDXJ, given the bounce, to hedge a big gold position.

Essentially long gold, short gold mines (copper).

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:15 | 2655012 q99x2
q99x2's picture

If they lower it by 100% deal me a hand.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:18 | 2655016 spekulatn
spekulatn's picture

Free bath salts per-round, bitchez. 

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:20 | 2655022 macduggie
macduggie's picture

Stocks, bonds, shiny things and real estate(to an extent) are held wealth.

The real estate part is the bit that the arse has fallen out of.

The mortgages in the housing market serve as both a living cost and an equity investment- as it stands it's unbelievably sticky as mortgage payments are in essence non-discretionary.

If there were to be a move in the held wealth to house ownership allowing the tenants to choose make repayment or not (rationally you'd expect those on the breadline to choose not to increase their held wealth), there is room is the economy for consumption growth alongside reduction of loan-shark rate debt (reducing credit cards to close to zero).

Or the held wealth could flee into shiny things in the hope of social acceptability among our new magpie overlords as the real economy heads down the toilet.

Decisions, decisions.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:27 | 2655034 RobotTrader
RobotTrader's picture

Bottom line is that many here are frustrated to no end with underperforming gold and everything else is outperforming, like bonds and blue chip stocks.

No wonder so many are exacting revenge with the red arrows.

Go ahead, click away.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:30 | 2655039 Squid Vicious
Squid Vicious's picture

props to me, i got you first... how are your retail darlings holding up? me thinks not so well... but of course you have moved on to other topics...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:32 | 2655424 Freebird
Freebird's picture

Gold Robo, has never suffered fools gladly. Savvy?

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:31 | 2655041 Richard Head
Richard Head's picture

Dickhead: we'll give you a green arrow when you start owning up to your fuckups, like TZOO, NFLX, CMG.  

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:32 | 2655046 kito
kito's picture

robo, youre stuck in a dying paradigm........

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:40 | 2655067 Pancho Villa
Pancho Villa's picture

I imagine that you are frustrated with underperforming European financials, which you predicted would be the top performing sector of 2012.

EUFN is down 4.24% YTD, while S&P 500 is up 8.14% YTD.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:43 | 2655073 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Red arrows are almost automatic with you you can't see beyond your Mom's basement window.

Check GOLD priced in Euros, Real, CHF, Rand and Rupee (Up 17, 29, 22, 25, 26% YOY) respectively, you clown. You can find answers if you actually look for them.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:09 | 2655132 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

Nobody is junking you because they are angry or losing money. They are junking you because you are a sycophantic dickhead. Even you should be able to understand that.


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:18 | 2655156 lotsoffun
lotsoffun's picture

robo is right until he is wrong.  and at this point, i promise you.  the fix is in.  unless you have inside information, i.e. what draghi was going to promise today, and at what time, and you don't, then you will be CRUSHED. draghi works for the tbtf and they knew exactly what he was going to say, when, because..... come on - win the grammy..... come on.  they told him.  what and when and how and he did it.

that's called rigged.  and it's rigged.  and if the brits feel better the silly little yob punters, because barclays punted the diamond american jw boy (oh come on, whine now??) - does he really get claw backed?  you can claw back a lot on 10 years of 20 MM bonus and still leave the poor guy not hurting.

seen jon corzine lately??

ok, so they have limited upside in the future.... but in return for what?


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:44 | 2655037 SqueekyFromm
SqueekyFromm's picture

Damn, this is my third poem today. 


Welcome To My Parlor

by Squeeky Fromm


Welcome to my parlor

Said the Broker to the Fly.

The margins just got lowered

It is time to BUY! BUY! BUY!


But, replied the Muppet Fly,  

Consumers are tapped out.

Are you really sure that I should BUY!

Because I have some doubt???


Oh no, the Broker answered

In a voice becoming cranky.

I have it from a secret source,

A guy named Ben Bernanke!


Mr. Ben done told us, 

Through a dude named Hilsenrath.

That all the shorts are losers

And about to take a bath.


But still the little Fly had doubts

She'd heard this tale before.

And could you trust the Markets,

With the scandals like LIE-BOR???


And so the Little Fly buzzed off.

And really, who could blame her???

The Broker, needing validation,

Telephoned Jim Cramer. . .


Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:14 | 2655400 chump666
chump666's picture

that was f*cking excellent!

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:29 | 2655417 Freebird
Freebird's picture

+10 for classic Stones kinda& your adaption no

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:29 | 2655038 butchee
butchee's picture

“That old saying, how you always hurt the one you love, well, it works both ways”

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:30 | 2655040 Unbezahlbar
Unbezahlbar's picture

FB plunged more then 8% today...then another 11% AH.


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:39 | 2655063 ATG
ATG's picture

Facebook cellphone...;

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:44 | 2655076 FranSix
FranSix's picture

Its because they are trying to distance themselves from the LIBOR scandal, right?

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:45 | 2655077 Bull_Colapse
Bull_Colapse's picture

can some explain what cutting the margin does?

in terms of how the market 'should' respone and why.

Thnaks in advance.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:04 | 2655123 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Cutting the margins means that your $1, instead of buying 10 casino chips, can now buy 100 casino chips. Except that you lose all 100 chips now, instead of 10. So your chapter 11 is that much more spectacular. Hope this helps.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:42 | 2655437 HD
HD's picture

"So your chapter 11 is that much more spectacular"


 Great line mate.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:16 | 2655134 adr
adr's picture

Pretty much means that big bulk traders don't have to put as much of their own money on the line to buy stocks.

People think that when a big institutional trader buys $1 million in shares, that he actually has the $1 million in cash to back it up. Couldn't be further from the truth. With a margin requirement of 10% you would only need $100k to be able to buy $1 million worth of stock.

The issues arise if there is a major drop in the stock. If the stock drops by more than the margin percentage, you now lost more than the cash you actually hold. But, no need to worry because that is what bailouts are for.

So lower margins facilitate more risk taking and gambling, which usually causes stock valuations to go up as there are more buyers coming in the market.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:21 | 2655411 chump666
chump666's picture

Like ZH says, you got a three way orgy of money printing, ECB, BoE and the Fed. SO CME and others cut the margin requirements, which is bullish for the momo trade.  No one cares about value investing even stock valuations, what you are going to see for a week or so is pure momo trading on the greed trip.  Short, sharp rally.

Oil just went bid and the Asian's buying USD's are just about to be killed via a massive carry trade on risk trades FX,  Asia is risk on with Hang Seng (proxy risk on/off trade).

In saying that, a ZH poster put up the Rollover clip, try and find it, IMO, that is 100% what is coming next.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:00 | 2655259 ATG
ATG's picture

Increases market volatility, more bang for the buck, which can work for you or agin'ya...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:57 | 2655106 JackT
JackT's picture

Adding more bait to the fish barrel

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:33 | 2655191 Offthebeach
Offthebeach's picture

They're down to a 45 day supply of muppet pelts. Usual is 60-90 day. So there is a call from the Federal Open Muppet Committee to increase Muppet liquidity.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:00 | 2655113 Global Hunter
Global Hunter's picture

Given what has happened with the 2 brokers who went "poof" and all the capital vaporized, one could be forgiven for thinking that the CME might be looking to raise margin where they could to keep capital in the system but I don't have a phd or a masters in financial engineering.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:03 | 2655119 adr
adr's picture

So is this why Amazon (we sell everything at a loss but we'll make it up in revenue) traded up after the disaster?

The analysts claim Amazon's video on demand and Kindle tablets will bring the much needed profit growth.

So the video on demand model that is killing Netflix by destroying profit margin and the tablet Amazon sells for a loss will bring more profit. That is why Amazon trades at its lofty P/E.

That isn't just smoking hopium, that's vapor distilling it into pure concentrate and injecting it directly into the jugular.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:03 | 2655120 dcb
dcb's picture

No comment!!

lets make the world safe for leverage and long term destroy it.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:04 | 2655128 dcb
dcb's picture

I would really like to see an investigation about how this stuff happens!!

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:12 | 2655141 adr
adr's picture

Just think of a poker table, but instead of chips the gamblers plop down cocaine, hookers, and 7 year old boys. Every once an a while a nice indonesian 13 year old virgin.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:15 | 2655147 AgK9
AgK9's picture

Interesting inverse correlation between the number of times you post in a two-day period and the proceeding two-day performance in the SP500.  Haven't lost money yet.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:58 | 2655251 ATG
ATG's picture

Maybe this time is different, K9...;

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:03 | 2655197 doc_in_the_house
doc_in_the_house's picture

agree 100% with zerohedge

its COORDINATED MANIPULATION.  i have a stupid question:  who in their right mind will take on MORE LEVERAGE (RISK) in this manipulated environment?

although i covered my spx SHORTS (avg price 1370) days ago @ 1332... (posted in real time) = been in cash ever since.....waiting for 1315 to go long on a pop...OR 1360 to go short...wait a minute, 1360 was reached today!! ok i've upped my target to 1380 to short....ALTHOUGH 1360 could be the top...what to do? miss shorting the TOP @ 1360 or wait a LITTLE LONGER for better SHORTING PRICES (1380??)

furthermore i POSTED in real time that I covered ALL my EUR shorts @ 1.2058....the next day EUR was @ 1.216, and today @ 1.23 !! wow do i feel good !! i did keep my 1.315 shorts in place...feel like shorting more @ 1.23 and ride down to 1.10 = cover ALL shorts b4 QE3.  Can I get 1.24?? pretty please QEoranizer, STUPID-O-nomics??? gimme EUR to 1.24 and spx to 1380 for ME TO SHORT and ride to 1.10 and 1100 !!! you can do it...YES U CAN RAPE the US citizens with MORE DEBT and inflation? there did that upset you? good then "upset me" by pumping the casino!! LOL !!!! ROFLMAO !!!

come on the flopbookers need the pump!! LOL !!! @ $24 AH...yesterday @ $27 AH after zynga missed !! LOL !!!! bought my  FB @ $26 dumped @ $30..watched go to $33 = me NO CARE = NOT A STUPID PERFORMANCE CHASER !!

please ask PPT to pump spx to 1380 and EUR to 1.24 = feel more CONfident shorting HIGHER!! i'm a patient guy...don't care if minor correction tomorrow..can wait til next week b4 the "fed" = rapist announcement , the DISAPPOINTING announcement..= ME SHORT @ THE TOP BABY !!!!

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 22:55 | 2655456 Freebird
Freebird's picture

Go Ragamuffin go...

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:58 | 2655250 yogibear
yogibear's picture

It's time to print and print and print and print.

Drahhi and  Bernanke adding more digital money so investment bankers can use it to buy stocks.

Commodities should start breaking to the upside.



Thu, 07/26/2012 - 21:56 | 2655362 Fecklesslackey
Fecklesslackey's picture


The Market was breathlessly waiting for AAPL, AMZ, FB earnings to jump higher. And with an amazing series of misses ... the Market breathlessly moves higher.  I guess we live in RoboWorld. Is it because with everyone missing QE is guaranteed?


Thu, 07/26/2012 - 23:18 | 2655486 China
China's picture

China is very concerned about ZeroHedge and it's message. It is getting harder and harder to uphold confidence so China have time to buy gold. If the police state was fully active, Zerohedge would have to be shut down. China also concerned about people moving out of religious entertainment complexes. It is very important for people to stay entertained. Remember, God has a new Car for you. Please do not turn to honor and morality. It is a waste of time. Bag pants, dishonor old people. You deserve a house. Remember to vote in this upcoming election. We support Mitt Romney and President Obama. Also buy China. Thank you. September will be very interesting for you. Remember buy all gold now and sell when the Euro collapses as gold plummets.

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 23:29 | 2655496 Freebird
Freebird's picture

Thanks for your contribution Anthony Bolton - that is you yes

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 00:29 | 2655562 imbtween
imbtween's picture

wait... this is santelli's exchange. It'll all work out just fine. Why are you people getting all wordy?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 01:32 | 2655600 hedgehog9999
hedgehog9999's picture

Obama is desperate, Draghi's action was instigated by Obama, that way, Bernanke does not appear too involved.... perhaps some Trillion Dollar swaps.......

Then CME margin relaxation, which really only means that people will be forced to sell a heck of a lot sooner when the SHTF, it is still debt....after all

Spain's short selling ban did not work to prevent the recent drop, neither did Italy's, 2nd best way in the absence of short seliing is long selling....

And as soon as Merkel comes back from vacation, perhaps sooner SHTF, maybe even as early as Tomorrow AM, just watch that lagging NASDAQ index.....

They 've been at it for almost 2 years now since FAT FINGER did its thing..... and nothing has changed, actually everything has changed for the worst....



Fri, 07/27/2012 - 01:39 | 2655606 Coldfire
Coldfire's picture

I beeleeve StuporMario's emotional non-statement and the Criminal Market Enterprise's irrational margin cut both reek of desperation. Everyone seems to be jumpy. Does something wicked this way come? In that case the sheeple will be needing a distraction, sharpish. Why is it taking so long to invade Syria and Iran? Perhaps London will provide the catalyst...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 04:34 | 2655678 Venerability
Venerability's picture

From Seeking Alpha:

Once again: This time it is almost certainly a fund in the Citi Nexus, not the JPM Nexus, which is perched precariously on its (Short Euro? Short Gold?) leverage.

That the Usual Suspect Ranters and Ravers both here and at other DOG sites are not Ranting and Raving as much as they normally do - when the Alpha Bank (JPM) is at risk - pretty much proves the above.

Nonetheless, a THIRD disaster on top of MF Global and Peregrine is simply NOT acceptable right now. Especially not with the Olympics and the escalating situation in the Middle East - very bad today, by the way.  Not to mention a little election we have coming up in the United States soon.

Ergo, Da Boyz are being sternly raked over the coals by their respective PPTs and instructed to give both Gold and Brent a much wider berth for the next 4, 5, 6 weeks to come.

Alas, they have not been raked over the coals about their shameless targeting of us "little people" traders and investors yet. But that is coming, too.

If it doesn't, I am now committed to helping it along. The events of the past week or so have been well-nigh disgusting! Faux obituaries. Paid-for analyst ratings and hatchet job stories even Carson Block would blanch at. Outright threats to unleash a "mini-Stuxnet" on any human being who dares to interfere with the Kiddies' Fantasy Finance Short plays on the good ole Yahoo boards.

But maybe I won't have to. There are still SOME sane ones among market participants worldwide. And hopefully, some sane ones in world leadership positions.

(Although sometimes, one wonders.)

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 05:28 | 2655697 silverdragon
silverdragon's picture

No idea what you traders are talking about, f*ck that for a living.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 06:36 | 2655732 dcb
dcb's picture

hmm, you think things li,e this are why teh us market remians th worlds most overvalued on a regular basis. looks like someone is pumping the s and P

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 08:43 | 2655985 nathan1234
nathan1234's picture

Come into my parlour

Said the CME to the spiders

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!