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Citi On Whether Europe Can Ruin The World; Or How To Use An Insolvent Continent As An Excuse For Global Printing

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Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:08 | 1809460 jdelano
jdelano's picture

I've figured out when the Lehman moment will occur.  Some day soon, someone fed up or jilted on the inside is going to blow the lid off the fact that the 3:30 pumps are actually Bernanke via HFT shops.  It will become widely known by the mainstream and in a rage, investors will pull every red cent from the market.  This will happen.  In their arrogance they are taking the manipulation far too obvious. 

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:13 | 1809472 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

9:30-10 & 3:30-4 moves are from leverage ETF rebalancing, not the Feds.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:31 | 1809490 jdelano
jdelano's picture

Where'd you read that--school paper?  Try again dormie.


Feel bad about leaving it like that--ought to at least shine a light on your ignorance.  Marinate on this for a second---if a triple levered long SPY and a triple levered short SPY are both "rebalancing" at the end of the day, what would the net effect be?  Depends on the color of the index ticker, you'd have to say--but, the action on your 3:30 move only goes one way, up up up.  Now, get off the computer and go get laid kid.  I'm old.  At least I have excuse for being a ZH cretin.  

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:38 | 1809600 Manthong
Manthong's picture

You just need to look at the little DIA/S&P/NASDAQ  chart on Google Finance.

If they had a thicker crayon, it would be one brown line. The markets are being manipulated in unison.

Interesting to note that the colors blue, amber and red blended together produce a brown color.. how apropos.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:47 | 1809643 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

"manipulation" and "correlation" are two different words...both with negative meanings however. We like our markets highly "un-correlated." for example "oil falls to 20 bucks" and "equities power higher."

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:52 | 1809666 El Viejo
El Viejo's picture

I think an American received a Nobel prize in Economics for showing that when markets(assets) start moving together that a recession soon follows. Hasn't ECRI's Lachsman Achuthan stated we are entering into another recession? (he's been batting 1000 by the way)

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 22:48 | 1811004 dclaz
dclaz's picture

That's just negative correlation. :-p

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 17:47 | 1854793 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

lol wut..

I suggest you get yourself an internship on a trading desk to understand market dynamics. ETF rebalancing is done overnight and merely dictates what the first print will be during the very early premarket where only institutions trade. Into the close its corr and stat arb desks making sure their deltas are flat on the day, among other voodoo.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:24 | 1809508 Belarus
Belarus's picture

If they squel, they'll likely end up dead first. But yeah, they do this machine stuff so brazenly that it's unbelievable to me know one questions it.

As I was drinking coffee this morning, I just had to turn on CNBC to see what the monkey's were saying. "A reader chimed in and asked me (Cramer) if I thought this rally was all a big fake." To which Cramer replied to this question: "Who cares! The market went up!."

And that pretty much sums it all up. 

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:32 | 1809562 common_sense
common_sense's picture

really fed up of fed

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:34 | 1809575 xcehn
xcehn's picture

"Savers Protect Your Deposits From Bankrupting Banks and Quantitative Inflation"


Tue, 10/25/2011 - 14:57 | 1809416 KingdomKum
KingdomKum's picture

we few, we happy few, we band of silver holders  !



Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:16 | 1809487 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

And of course we gold holders are happy too.

It should be clear to all that everyone should have 5% - 10% (minimum, even mainstream financial advisors are OK with 5% in gold) of their (liquid or total, you pick) assets in gold and silver.  I am there and I sleep better as a result.

Last I checked, gold was up $50 + and silver even higher on a percentage basis.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:27 | 1809534 El Viejo
El Viejo's picture

And somewhere between gold and silver being the currency of choice and food and fuel becoming the currency of choice the Feds will take your currency of choice and everyone will laugh at you like you are laughing now.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:47 | 1809650 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Viejito: Since no one can predict the future you are correct to not be at the All Inn.  Food, fuel, water, guns & ammo and medical supplies are all good.

Depending on each person's situation.  Condo dwelling Bearing chooses not to store gasoline...

Re Feds coming to take what belongs to me (and millions more), that will STOP once somewhere between 20 - 50 Cops / Feds / Fascist Thugs are shot DEAD by thoise who say "No".  Come and get it, bitchez.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:09 | 1809420 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

hedgefunds and daytraders are picking up pennies in front of a steamroller.  Modern finance is too interconnected  to prevent the logical conclusion of systemic collapse. When agents try to rebalance one part, it creates shocks to other parts.  There hasn't been  proper international supervision. There is no structure, but spaghetti code, as financial agents arbitrage regulation with exotic financial products.


If you run the linear programming model to solve all the variables, and find equilibrium, the output is this  :(


capital is fucked.  welcome to labor's world. project mayhem.



Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:30 | 1809552 CharlieSDT
CharlieSDT's picture

Dormroom, can you PM me your email address please?



Tue, 10/25/2011 - 16:01 | 1809705 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

 I prefer to remain anonymous. =S

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 16:05 | 1809718 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

If you run the linear programming model to solve all the variables


Fool, trying to use a linear model on a non-linear quantum stochastic system.  Let me guess, you are using Excel to model the market.


Tue, 10/25/2011 - 19:48 | 1810452 defencev
defencev's picture

Linear programming model, nonlinear quantum stochastic system: you are a bunch of ignorant monkeys here, using various smart words without glimse of any understanding. That is the reason why the world collapses: it is overrun by growing group of idiots just pretending that they are in the know.

 The price of gold will depend on Bernanke (and others) printing machines. Other than that it is just seasonal variations.

Remove Bernanke. Defeat Marxist Obama!

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 22:50 | 1811012 dclaz
dclaz's picture

What the hell is Quantum about it?

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 14:58 | 1809422 LongSoupLine
LongSoupLine's picture

Off topic, but watching Herb Greenberg call Cramer out on the table over his Netflix calls is F'ing hilarious!!!  Cramer is getting louder and backpeddling like a MF'er.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:11 | 1809470 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

Cramer was also touting none other then Agnico Eagle mines when he was on his little gold trip. AEM dropped by 18% recently because one of their mines is caving in.

AEM is a solid company but their misfortunes look good on Cramer.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:42 | 1809619 Randall Cabot
Randall Cabot's picture

PAL cratered about 70% after Cramer pumped it. 

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 14:58 | 1809423 Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

The hypocrisy is getting a little too thick even for me. Time to pull on my full body head to toe shit waders.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:11 | 1809469 idea_hamster
idea_hamster's picture

Just as long as it's not a SCOPAS Suit.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:00 | 1809429 danger close here
danger close here's picture

picked up some Amazon oct 205 and 215 puts; wish me luck

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:33 | 1809568 jdelano
jdelano's picture

was tempted but didn't have the balls.  Good luck, sincerely.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 16:31 | 1809830 Smithovsky
Smithovsky's picture

i wish i had read your comment half an hour ago, d.c.h.

but on the bright side, the beers are on you

well played

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:00 | 1809431 PaperBear
PaperBear's picture

Good ahead and print you slave paper, Mr non-Federal non-Reserve, it will transfer some of the stolen wealth to those with physical gold/silver.

To the ZH audience, keep educating your fellow humans about the real story of gold/silver.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:57 | 1809677 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

I've pretty much given up on "educating fellow humans" about MONEY.

They've been conditioned far too long....it's like trying to teach Quantum Field Theory to an audience of kakkerlakken.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:00 | 1809432 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Anybody else read Insolvent Continent as Incontinence?

Not that there's much difference.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 16:07 | 1809735 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

I had thought Incontinent is more when you print and print and print...

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:01 | 1809434 PulauHantu29
PulauHantu29's picture

$1.2 Trillion....(plus a Gyro and a case of Ouzo) for starters.

Another $1 trillion the next 6 months...this is just for the Eurostan.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:01 | 1809435 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture
How To Use An Insolvent Continent As An Excuse For Global Printing

Euro land does not want to print. They want to liquidate and consolidate.

Been saying this for a while now....



Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:17 | 1809486 FinHits
FinHits's picture

Agreed, Eurozone does not want to print. I wonder if the adjustement mechanism can really be internal devaluation (hard cuts in salaries and benefits) and hard write-offs of debt.

Greece certainly would point that Europeans prefers the above hard torture over the seductive inflationary sedative pain.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:35 | 1809580 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

EuroZone does not want to print and is trying to find any excuse for delays, yes

According to the Austrian School this would cause a sharper, stronger, shorter pain...

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:57 | 1809694 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

Very painful.

Nature abhors a vacuum.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 16:37 | 1809882 FinHits
FinHits's picture

Would be great to know when that shorter uber-schock arrives: supposedly Euro tanks then and Eurozone share prices shoot trough the roof.

Until then Euro strengthens and share prices drop.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:01 | 1809436 bernorange
bernorange's picture

QE to infinity!  Or at least until they run out of digital ones and zeros.


Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:53 | 1809670 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Nice forum.  pmbug.com is a is little less hectic that Turd Ferguson's.  Best of luck with your site!

QE will obviously not go to infinity, but QE10 is certainly possible.  Inflation is almost always more politically palatable than .gov cutting spending, debt haircuts, etc.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:03 | 1809441 Odin
Odin's picture

Here comes your daily 3pm algo rally! Brought to you by your friends at PPT!

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:04 | 1809443 falak pema
falak pema's picture



I hope the sons of Jefferson will find a way out of this mess like the sons of Voltaire and Beethoven.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:04 | 1809446 Belarus
Belarus's picture

What is supremely paradoxical is that with the ECB stuck, any incremental QEasing by the world will merely result in an ever stronger euro, until exports by Germany become almost as impossible as those of Switzerland pr peg.

I'm skeptical that the EUR will be able to be held together without "new" money coming from somewhere. It's clear why there are zero grand plans to date: Germany isn't going to go all-in Willy-Nilly WITHOUT serious control over budgets in Greece, Italy, Spain, and possibly even France.

So, expect some very loud thuds coming soon.  

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:04 | 1809448 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

until exports by Germany become almost as impossible as those of Switzerland pr peg.

The US dollar has been falling for 10 years yet the trade deficit got larger and not smaller. Sure puts that theroy to rest...

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:07 | 1809457 qussl3
qussl3's picture

How much of that is with China, Japan and the oil producers?


Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:14 | 1809478 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

Quite allot.

Funny how Japan has higher wages then the US and they have trade surpluses with China.

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 15:37 | 1809518 qussl3
qussl3's picture

Kinda helps those trade barriers and cultural resistance to imported goods.

EZ and China both depend on the US as a final export market, the quid pro quo is that they buy its debt.

China is now trying to do the same to the EZ, but isnt near as enthused about repeating the same mistake with EZ debt as it did with USTs.

There is no final export market with any residual savings left to export to big enough to allow the EZ or China to export its way out.

The Japanese arent interested in the crap everyone else makes, the Chinese have a monstrously skewed income pyramid, the ME is too busy shooting each other and well the Germans, French and Italians are going to have to pay for the banks at some point.

Perhaps the martians will buy?

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