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Come The Revolution? The Lisbon Treaty Versus The U.S. Constitution
An interesting and succinct compare-and-contrast (by MEP Daniel Hannan) of the U.S. Constitution and its European equivalent (Lisbon Treaty) presented with little comment except to note in the last week we have discussed how the Irish view their German masters, how the French/Italians/Spanish will do pretty much anything in order that the Bundesbank will enable ECB monetization, and perhaps more critically the exodus of capital not merely from peripheral European debt markets but from the core also. We suspect the status quo cannot exist much longer (Keynesian Endgame?) and regimes (fiscal/monetary/political) will change as tail risk becomes the only risk.
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The technocrats can compare and contrast all they like. Capital flight is here and it is growing exponentially, not just in Greece, but Italy and Spain as well. This is the end game, and it can only deteriorate from here. They can institute all the austerity they like, and force as much new debt on these countries as they like, but it won't change the end result. Bankruptcy and quite possibly Euro peripheral revolution.
Time to put on those big-boy mants.
And the tighter they make the austerity belt, the more civil unrest, demand destruction, and thus tax revenue decline will result and down the spiral they go.
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/284656/Germans-try-to-kill-off-pound
CLGC’s memo proposes that the ABA pay CLGC $850,000 to conduct “opposition research” on Occupy Wall Street in order to construct “negative narratives” about the protests and allied politicians. The memo also asserts that Democratic victories in 2012 would be detrimental for Wall Street and targets specific races in which it says Wall Street would benefit by electing Republicans instead.
According to the memo, if Democrats embrace OWS, “This would mean more than just short-term political discomfort for Wall Street. … It has the potential to have very long-lasting political, policy and financial impacts on the companies in the center of the bullseye.”
The memo also suggests that Democratic victories in 2012 should not be the ABA’s biggest concern. “… (T)he bigger concern,” the memo says, “should be that Republicans will no longer defend Wall Street companies.”
Two of the memo’s authors, partners Sam Geduldig and Jay Cranford, previously worked for House Speaker John Boehner, R-Ohio. Geduldig joined CLGC before Boehner became speaker; Cranford joined CLGC this year after serving as the speaker’s assistant for policy. A third partner, Steve Clark, is reportedly “tight” with Boehner, according to a story by Roll Call that CLGC features on its website.
Jeff Sigmund, an ABA spokesperson, confirmed that the association got the memo. “Our Government Relations staff did receive the proposal – it was unsolicited and we chose not to act on it in any way,” he said in a statement to "Up."
CLGC did not return calls seeking comment.
Boehner spokesman Michael Steel declined to comment on the memo. But he responded to its characterization of Republicans as defenders of Wall Street by saying, “My understanding is that President Obama is the single largest recipient of donations from Wall Street.”
http://openchannel.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/11/19/8884405-lobbying-firms-memo-spells-out-plan-to-undermine-occupy-wall-street
A bit dramatic with this "Transformers, The Movie" soundtrack, but I would continue to stay short EUR against anything of real value
Yawn
Another anti-Tobin-Tax bad-Nazis good-Brits propaganda piece
Quick question - being north of the Equator, does water flushing down the commode go clickwise or counter clockwise. I need to know in case of flush futures.
As a proud, stumped toothed, bearded Appalachian mountain man, I applaud him as one of the very few respectable British dignitaries, as well as his fellow respected notable, Nigel Farage.
He was on BBC TV last night saying - not wxact words "the elites of eurore are openly seeking unelected rule for financial gain, they do not care for the interests of the poulation at large" lets hope we see a bit more of him - we NEVER get Farage on UK TV
So, how's that any different from here? We tossed the constitution quite awhile back, even before the oxymoronically named Patriot act - some of which is secret, in case you wanted to obey the law, you're not even allowed to know it. Obama care? Too disgusted to go on - filling in the rest of the blanks left as an exercise for the student.
Lisbon Treaty to make EU sound like they care so young Europeans don't go to communist China looking for jobs and stay within EU working rest of their lives to pay off the debts......just like the US constitution.
These paper documents are just bs to legitimize the power structure of the regime. Even dictator Kim Jong Il in North Korea has "constitutions" and democratic voting...except only his family members are on the ballot.
Patriot Act was there to
The Acts are always opposite of their name......
Aldous,'
You left out "Mall Ninja's"
Constitution of North Korea
It guarantees civil and political rights, such as freedom of expression, the right to elect officials, the right to a fair trial, and freedom of religion. It asserts the right of every citizen to work, education, food, and health care.
source: http://www.novexcn.com/dprk_constitution_98.html
What they don't tell you is that everythign will be shit. work will be shit, education will be shit, food will be shit, health care will be shit, election official choices are shit. Basically you are worthless shit.....and so is lisbon treaty or US constitution.
The signers of the constitution owned slaves.
The execututors, interpreters, and writers of constitution and US laws today also owns slaves who get wages not enough to own anything productive to buy out their freedom.
Constitution of Iran
http://www.iranonline.com/iran/iran-info/government/constitution-3.html
Constitution of Russia's KGB run oligarchy
http://www.constitution.ru/en/10003000-03.htm
Even fucking commie Russia has the same theoretical "freedoms" as USA pertaining to speech, religion, property and the "equal rights" pertaining to sex, race, nationality, language, origin, etc. censorship is banned? yeah right. same for USA elites' bootlicking OWS haters.
Just like money, your rights are worth nothing on paper.
"So, how's that any different from here?"
Its not...friggin thieves everywhere in government, at the highest levels.
The latest "beltway trader" who trades as good as any Goldmanite...John Kerry;
"The documents further support allegations of suspicious trading leveled during Sunday’s 60 Minutes report about the explosive new book by investigative reporter and Breitbart News editor Peter Schweizer, Throw Them All Out.
Sen. John Kerry’s position on the powerful Senate Finance Committee’s Health Subcommittee gives him direct access to critical information regarding health care policy. In July 2009, pharmaceutical industry representatives met with key members of Congress to flesh out the Obamacare bill. Then, in November 2009, with the bill’s passage was looking more likely, the Kerrys’ portfolios reflect a drug stock buying spree."
http://biggovernment.com/whall/2011/11/18/exclusive-documents-the-kerrys-curious-stock-trades/
Status quo should've ended long time ago, but TPTB will do everything to extend and pretend.
I wonder at what point will law enforcement take real action against the powerful, higher level corrupt, as there are way too many running around loose and in the open lately.
I may not agree with all of OWS, but the way many peaceful protesters and journalists are being treated is setting off alarm bells.
This cuts a little too close for my liking. Way too close.
The Freedom of Association
The Freedom of the Press (some people seem to think the press need NYPD passes?? WTF. Which BTW NYPD weren't even issuing, according the the NYPD, after Bloomberg said to go get them).
Remembrance Day just passed, people. For crying out loud.
John Kerry's wealth is from his wife who probably owns bunch of democratic stocks...stocks that serve the poor like WALMART. Kerry wants more welfare dollars to unproductive rednecks in small towns propped up only by federal government posts (ie. military bases) so that they have government handouts to spend at walmart which really is a government subsidy to walmart via proxy of the bottom class. Your tax money eventually trickled back up to walmart shareholders and Kerry's networth goes higher.
Republican candidates work the same way. All politicians work the same way. They only care about how much money they can make from their position of power by redistributing your tax dollars to businesses owned by their friends and family. And the way to get in that position of power is to be the best liar because voters are stupid and will vote based on looks and rhetoric not based on any scientific proof of your governing ability. That's why dumbasses with no education can even run for an office while he can't even be qualified to fix anything of value.
Breaking news, yes, as in things are breaking up all over. Someone would not sign zee papers!
Market Pulse Archives
Nov. 19, 2011, 3:07 p.m. EST
Greek creditors hit unexpected obstacle: reportBy Ronald D. Orol
WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) - One of three leaders in a new Greek coalition refused to sign an oath that he will approve austerity measures, creating a new obstacle for Greece's creditors, according to reports Saturday. Antonis Samaras, leader of Greece's top conservative party, New Democracy, said there is no need for him to offer a written declaration because he can be trusted, according to reports. His comments come after international leaders have called for written commitments to offset their fears that Greek politicians may backpedal on commitments during the period before the country's February elections, the reports said.
Nigel is a fraud. On RT he explained that the bail-out bankers deserved their big pay out.
What is his point? Italian and Greece can spend money like crazy because German and the ECB has to Bail them out?
He also called for martial law in Britain, something I pointed out a few days ago here on ZH & nobody cared except to junk me.
Farage says all the 'right' things, so fools will vote for him & then dumbly watch the tanks roll down the streets of London.
Of course he also completely ignores the fact government & its central banking arm, including the mother of them all, the Bank of England, are the cause of the current shitstorm.
Soooo.... You're saying Farage is a politician, that wants to be Adam Sutler?
Interesting to know.. will listen with more critical ear now.
I didn't hear anything disconcerting on his KWN spot a month or so back.
You missed this one from several months ago.
Vote for him & find out.
Nigel Farage is a cheap populist politician.
He basks in that kind of popularity you can get from the UK Tabloids readers by making cheap shots of half-truths.
ONE EXAMPLE:
"This guy is unelected" - an EuroGroup guy that has to be the PM of a country? He does have a majority of a Sovereign Parliament behind him, doesn't he? Hardly unelected, more like not directly elected by the people, which is something completely different.
This is the same as asking that US Ambassadors, US Supreme Court Judges, UK Ministers, Italian & German Presidents and a whole bunch of charges worldwide which by constitutional design are appointed by elected Parliaments have to be directly elected by the people.
So if Country A has a superior constitution, why should it matter to A if Country B+C+D have something inferior? It's the same as if I would call for Senators to be sent by the State's congresses (as it once was) or for US Presidents to be appointed by Congress. Really that relevant?
In short, his message is not far from: "not us. not like us. whoa! really not like us! hugh! bad! not like us at all!" Only thing I miss is "By Jingo!". Ah, and he does not want a Tobin Tax, of course...
Police pepper spraying sitting protestors
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BjnR7xET7Uo
Welcome to the terrordome BITCHEZZZZZZZ!
Are these police Syrian or Cali?
Syrian born police in California.
the constitution always loses.
http://expose2.wordpress.com
It would be interesting to compare the current EU and US constitutions, and then that of Assad's Syria. And then the Patriot Act and Syria's various emergency laws.
Barter is good .......Taxes are Bad
Actually, barter is NOT good, and its limitations was one of the primary forces which led to the creation of transferable receipts of debt, otherwise known as "money."
Max Fischer, Civis Mundi
You, sir, are wrong on several counts. One, receipts for debt are not "money", see the definition in the Black's law dictionary, which excludes bills and notes. It might be currency, but it is not money. Second, there were other forces which led to the creation of currency, including the enslavement of the indebted class. Lastly, not all currency is a receipt for debt - see the United States Note.
exactly - how a society defines money determines who controls it
No actually, YOU are wrong. I'll return to this thread later tonight and explain why. As for now, my girlfriend is standing in the doorway yelling at me, LET'S GO!, so I can spend all my goddamn money all goddamn day on her.
Max Fischer, Civis Mundi
A slave to the state, ignorance, AND pussy. Shame.
Conrad, you a funny mo'fo'.
Poor max, that ones gonna hang all day defenseless.
Come on guys... give Max a break... he's intoxicated with quim.
I am pussy whipped and proud.
"Why don't you...reverse it?"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-4QFYZzLPg
She actually said "COME ON! LET'S GO......SHOPPING".....which technically can lead to what you guys are talking about later.
I am pussy dripped and secretly proud, as I am modest about my poetry. For many its pottery.
Hope you save some "finger action" for your response ....
Don't you mean "so I can spend all my goddamn receipts for debt on her?"
First of all, sorry for the long delay.
Second, your reference to Black's dictionary is far too simplistic and incomplete. It just seems to be the definition that best suits your libertarian ideology. There is no absolute definition of money, nor is there a definitive answer to its origin. While everyone can list the three classic functions of money, there is no standard, universal definition for it. Money can be anything... metal, oil, paper, clay tablets, wooden sticks, cigarettes (prisons) sea shells, or, in the modern word of virtual money, it can be nothing at all. Whatever token a society decides to use as money, there is only one prerequisite: trust!... trust that others will accept the same token as payment for goods and services. Trust is the cornerstone of all tokens of money, including your silver and gold. Your silver coin has no special, magical, god-given guarantee that it will be accepted in exchange for goods and services by others in your society. You're just trusting that it will. And that's a huge leap in faith because society currently does NOT regard silver bullion as money or bankable collateral. It's an extremely volatile commodity which is very difficult to value.
Personally, I tend to agree with the credit theory of money, which suggests that money is just an abstraction. To quote David Graeber,*
Going back to the original point, bartering is horribly impractical, and anyone who suggests otherwise is really just a narrow-minded nutcase - probably one of those hard-core libertarians who fantasize about the collapse of society and turning the dial of time back by 300 years. Bartering requires a "double coincidence of wants" wherein both parties (hopefully) have assets the other party wants. This is a massive hurdle, an entirely unrealistic model of commerce which is why most modern anthropologists and economists are beginning to realize that a true bartering economy has never existed independently of credit and debts, i.e. money, in some form. Famous British anthropologist Caroline Humphrey came to the same conclusion: "no example of a barter economy, pure and simple, has ever been described....all available ethnography suggests that there has never been such a thing." In short, bartering does not work without some form of money to grease the wheels.
To demonstrate how money originated concurrently with bartering, consider this example: Mr. Corn Farmer wants to buy some milk from Mr Dairy Farmer, however, Mr Dairy Farmer already sold some milk to another corn farmer and doesn't need any more corn. How then can Mr Corn Farmer barter with the dairy farmer? Easy - the dairy farmer gives the corn farmer the milk, while the corn farmer "pays" him with an IOU. Now, rather than waiting to redeem this IOU at a later date, the diary farmer can forward the same IOU to a shirt maker in exchange for some new summer shirts. Now the shirt maker has the IOU, and you've just witnessed the creation of money. So long as everyone has trust in the original corn farmer, this IOU can continue to pass around the village among the merchants and farmers. The IOU greases the wheels of commerce, rather than the "economy" being needlessly stalled by the "double coincidence of wants" problem. That receipt/note of debt is money, and in all likelihood, this is exactly how bartering and money originated.
Now, if that IOU can be passed around in this small sphere of trust and grease the wheels of commerce, it stands to reason that multiple IOU's could pass around in a larger society if a trustworthy king, monarch or government was the original debtor. That is exactly what we have today: multiple IOU's passing around, backed by trust in the US government. The trust in our government is backed by our military and its ability to enforce the petrodollar monopoly. As much as we can find fault with our government and its idiotic leaders, what is the likelihood that our government will fail anytime soon? None. Just look at all the problems in Europe, and the euro is still strong.
I don't care what the IOU is made from: silver, gold, paper, clay, dead fish.... I don't care. As a medium of exchange and a unit of account, the paper dollar works perfectly fine, and I trust tomorrow will be fine, too. The only caveat is that elastic paper money doesn't retain its value over time. But that doesn't matter because I have other assets that serve my wealth preserving needs. My paper IOU's are just a small portion of my wealth that I keep for the ease of everyday commerce.
Yes, money can lead to enslavement, but that's not why money was created. That's like saying guns were invented to empower gangs.
*David Graeber, Debt: The First 5,000 Years.
Max Fischer, Civis Mundi
"Yes, money can lead to enslavement, but that's not why money was created. That's like saying guns were invented to empower gangs"
+1 and good counterpoint. The prob is this kind of long explanations, while endearing to people like me and you, are not what the crowd of "my head hurts gimme a simple solution to the money problem - perhaps eliminate money?" would like to hear.
Keep it short for them: "Ludwig von Mises and his teacher Carl Menger said (simplified): "Money is a natural human invention"
And for kinks throw in: "You have to first understand the difference between Money (Asset/Receipt for Asset) and Currency (Debt/Receipt for Debt)" and then you start to understand the problem and it's (uneasy) solutions.
"while endearing to people like me and you"
Superior, much?
Hmmm....not necessarily, Just like longer explanations...
Barter? Even in prisons some money of sort evolves.
I waited all that time for that? What a letdown.
1. Of course money is a creation of man - that's a truism.
2. Of course barter is impractical on large scales - that's a truism.
3. Of course money is based upon trust - that's a truism.
Besides wasting a lot of air on those points, your post falls down on three parts:
A. I used a dictionary to define a term - which is a reasoned and reasonable means to specify the meaning of a word. It is you that has 'gone off reservation' to add/change/modify/disagree with this definition, and even the existence thereof. "There is no absolute definition of money." Well, if you start a post with that, you've negated the value of the remainder of your argument. You've prefaced everything with a nothing. Nothing you say after that will help define anything, because you've argued that the thing cannot be defined.
B. Your entire example is created to try to make your point - that IOU's are money. And in the end, you seem to somehow make the connection that silver, gold, dead fish, etc. are IOU's. How are dead fish IOU's? If I give a dead fish (money in your example) to a farmer for grain - where is the IOU? Silver and gold are not IOU's. They are assets. You also completely ignore the difference between how any currency is created - as debt or as an asset. Coins created by the US Mint are sold to the public, with the US Mint earning the seigniorage. There is no IOU involved. Also, there is a difference between paying a debt and discharging a debt. Just as there is a difference between currency and money. You want to confuse the two to suit your purposes, but my dictionaries say there is a difference. And in a society, standardizing a term in order to use it properly is a part of the gig.
C. After all of your broad definitions of money, and even that one might not exist, you then proceed to tell me that silver is not money. Have you ever bought and sold silver at a coin shop? Taken a silver coin to a farmer's market? Purchased anything with silver? I have done all three. I can take a silver coin and exchange it for FRN's at thousands of coin shops around the country. Are you telling me that is not money? I have purchased items with silver from local vendors. Are you telling me that - in that not so limited case - that silver is not money?
Money measures debt? But what if I don't have any debt, but have some money? What is my money measuring?
Fail.
A few last comments...
Barter is impractical on ANY scale, unless both parties hit the jackpot and happen to have exactly what the other wishes.
Given several points you make in your post, when you say, "of course money is based on trust," you're not seeing past the comment itself. You're only commenting on the obvious. But what exactly does that trust mean? It means, if a society trusts the credibility of the original debtor, any token which represents an IOU from that debtor - whether a rectangular piece of paper with George Washington on it, a silver coin, gold coin, sea shells or fish heads - can be deemed money. Trust in the transferability and redeemability of goods/services of that IOU is all that matters; it has nothing to do with the content of that token, but rather the trust of what that token represents.
This leads me to your next claim... that your silver coin is, in fact, money. Why? Because it has trust inscribed on it. It's backed by the US government. That's why your silver coin is money, NOT because it's silver in and of itself. The silver means nothing; the trust inscribed on that coin means everything. If that silver coin was inscribed with the insignia of the government of Zimbabwe, the "moneyness" of the coin would be zero. You'd take it, melt it and sell it as a commodity, not as a token of money. Perhaps you could eBay it and it might have come collector's value. The TRUST in the credibility behind that coin is all that matters.
Just because you can take your silver coin to a coin shop and exchange it for FRN's means nothing in terms of it being money. I can take used books to a book reseller and get FRN's, too. Again, the only reason you can exchange a silver coin for goods and services is because of the implicit trust of the US government backing that coin. Silver, in and of itself, is NOT money. Just like books.
In 2008/09, when LIBOR imploded and interbank liquidity evaporated, forward lease rates on silver and gold began to diverge quite significantly. Gold was being treated differently than silver. Why? Because gold was being hoarded as real bankable collateral, whereas silver took its rightful place as just another commodity like cotton or platinum. Silver is NOT money, unless it's some coin with the trust of the US government backing it. Gold, on the other hand, in times of deep financial stress and chaos, does appear to have "money" qualities. But even that is limited and scarce.
I have no illusions that I'll convince a libertarian to change his views on money and metals. But if you think it through to its logical conclusion, you'll see that your worship of metals is a leap of faith into the unknown. It's not the metal that matters. It's the trust in who or what is backing that metal. If TPTB decide that platinum is money, not silver, you will be no better than a farmer with a barn full of corn.
History has shown that whatever the government will accept for tax payment is the true money of that society. You're guessing silver. It's a shot in the dark.
Max Fischer, Civis Mundi
You're just making shit up, including my responses. "Moneyness"?
Ever heard of barter networks?
I've used silver to buy things - not just US silver coins. The trust was placed in the fungibility of the silver, its content, etc. It had nothing to do the government.
All squares are rectangles. Not all rectangles are squares. All monies are currencies. But not all currencies are money.
The dictionary excludes evidences of debt as money. That's a fact.
This is not the end game. The end game will be hyperinflation, 30% unemployment, war, homelessness and famine. Could be next year or 10 years from now. The pain for the bottom 50% of population will be beyond belief, beyond imagination.
Top 10% will do well.
Actually apex predators are often susceptible to the collapse of their ecosystem and the lower order predators prove more adaptable. The bankers better maintain a viable monetary system to pay their private militias, or else.
If times are bad enough, militia can be paid with food, pussy, and loot. Who needs money"
The "loot" has already started.... that's why they keep a good part of what they confiscate.
There's Angela for the pussy and food.
Done deal.
New Wanker's Order
Only if "excess reserves" get into the greater economy. For now they are the rubber patch on the leaky rubber tube of shit bank assets.
God, I wish a few others appreciated that fact.
Too bad the the US Constitution has become a dead letter.
One politicians promise is not another politicians obligation.
There is no honor among thieves.
CatoTheElder
Too bad the the US Constitution has become a dead letter.
It hasn't, the people are dead.
When the pain get's bad enough, they will return to life and the letter.
Don't know why anyone would bother comparing the US constitution to anything. It is an archaic document, totally ignored by the powers that be. Which is a capital offense, in my estimation. With no statute of limitations.....
Some day it will come back to haunt them.
If I may, WE WILL COME BACK AND HUNT THEM.
*teehee* You need a piece of parchment to know that you're free and have unalienable natural rights? *teehee*
That Constitution sure did a bang-up job of stopping government from doing what governments do... oh, wait...
Between the rattlesnak's tail and its fangs. The crisis of legitimacy, the dearth of citizenship, the spectre of civil war and moral responsibility
"...collectivist systems go to great lengths to spy out those who are "not of the body," to convert, control, or failing that, to eliminate them. They build secret political police agencies like the NKVD, KGB, Gestapo, Stasi, and yes, FBI and DHS. They also build walls to keep people in, to prevent them from voting with their feet. These used to be made of concrete and steel like the Berlin Wall, but these days we are beginning to look at virtual walls created of surveillance cameras, computer databases, voice prints and facial recognition software, all marketed to us on the false premise of "counter terrorism." Thus rises the "soft tyranny."
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2011/11/between-rattlesnakes-...
You left off RFID tags. RFID tags will be in everything. Clothing labels, your shoes, your credit cards, your drivers license. There will be so many RFID numbers created that they could catalog everything in the world (including grains of sand on the beach) 100 times over. RFID tags will be able to learn what other tags know and pass it on to scanners in storefronts, airports, banks and anywhere else they are placed. Looking for someone? RFID will find them. With a large enough data warehouse, everything about everyone can be known. If RFID can not get a direct hit on finding where someone passed by a scanner, then there is always a person who passed by the person. If you think the world is scary now, it has been getting quietly scarier every day for a while now.
That being said, it is important to have wealth that is untraceable. If you do not know what I am talking about, you need to make that a homework problem.
Stay alert.. look for this to come back to the fore.
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2003/10/60771
Fight technology with technology.
Examples
God I love this place...
"RFID >> Just microwave shoes, whatever else and your passport for a few seconds..."
as they say...anything invented by man can be defeated by man.
Or in your case, a lovely woman ;-)
Sir, my advice is not to excessively worry. If you are interested, it is easily to familiarise yourself with the specifications, and hence, the limitations of RFID. First, anything in a Faraday cage isn't going to sing EM signals. Period. Second, ever wonder why RFID chips aren't on liquid soap or shampoo bottles? Because they attenuate the signals. Third, all receivers can be jammed even at low power levels (especially when high gain antennas are used). Finally, at least off the top of my head, embedded semiconductors in RFID are easily fried with several watts of millimeter wave EM signals - the poor little bastards can't isolate themselves from the overload. So, my friend, don't worry too much about the excessive risks posed by RFID.
Speaking of seeds of revolution, US Census data classifies 100 million Americans as "either in poverty or in the fretful zone just above it."
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/19/us/census-measures-those-not-quite-in-...
US economic policies have decimated the middle class. How long before civil discontent really gets going...
thats really the question, problem here in america people don't want to believe our government is the enemy "cognitive dissonance" but when the food becomes in short supply that is when i think
I agree that our financial system is out of control but I think the middle class has to step forth and take some of the blame for their own misery. How many shop at Walmart all the time because "they save money"? How money have HELOC'ed the hell out of their houses to "liberate equity"? How many wanted to live like their neighbors, not realizing that their neighbors were as financially irresponsible as them?
The middle class is dying. But part of it was self-inflicted?
WestVillageIdiot
Free will presumes truthful information. Joe and Sally 6pack were bombarded by the propaganda myth of the American Dream- Home ownership.
Day in and day out Home and Garden TV (Meredith Corp. NYSE) bombarded the public with "Flip that House". General Motors played Dietech.com mercilessly on CNN. And Greenspan babbled on about Irrational Exuberance, which in fact was Rational Exuberance. Everyone was going to be a millionaire from their home.
Yes, blame the individual for not comprehending that the 1% were lying to them then, as they are lying now.
Save the Criminals and Fuck everyone else.
The middle class wants to be paid well but then rushes to Walmart to buy cheap crap, solely because it is cheap. They don't give a shit where it was made, how it was made, or what the people that made it got paid.
I have an idea for the middle class. "Turn off the fucking television" if you can't understand it's all propaganda. I think CNBC is a bunch of lying mother fuckers. I don't turn on CNBC. I think CNN is a wasteland for "progressive" fuckheads that don't know their head from the ass. "Hello, Paul Begala." So I don't turn it on. I believe Fox News is filled with phony fucking evangelizing d-bags. I'm looking at you Sean Hannity. So I never watch Fox News.
Your argument is silly to me. All I can say, if what you wrote is true is, "grow the fuck up middle class and think for yourself". Blaming Flip That House or Property Ladder for Americans that were making $30,000 a year but had to drive a Lexus SUV because their ego demanded it is just complete bullshit to me.
Even today I am surrounded by members of the middle class that walk around in a somnambulent trance. It is their fault, not mine. How come I didn't buy into all the bullshit? How do you explain that? How do you explain other ZHers than didn't buy into it? Stupidity is no fucking defense.
Being stupid does not give someone a claim to OPM either
(other people's money)
No
electing someone just as stupid to represent you in Congress sets that in motion
Ja ever watch a good bird dog -- it gets close to a bird and then it lifts that leg and points that tail and just stands there and quivers-- People are a lot like that with TV -- I think it may be breeding-- you know- its in the DNA-- just thinking
WestVillage - good points and i don't disagree with them. But it is the nture of people not to rock the boat when they're doing alright.
For example you might think the company you're working for is in danger, maybe too complacent to a new competitor. Do you try to shake-up the management chain and risk pissing the off? Same with people. They will be content while things are going well. And who can blame them when they're in a job and have a home paid on low rate mortgages promised it'll beat inflation
People react to events they are not proactive. So while enough are in work they will not revolt nor do they feel radicalised enough like you or I to throw our slippers at CNBC because Steve Liesman is talking his usual BS happy data when we know it ain't true
I'd blame the worthless academic (liberal) junk State schools shove down our throats. History doesn't teach us how many countries the politician-banking gangster double-act have destroyed throughout history. How many false wars. That all Govts are corrupt etc etc etc
All this important history with hugely important lessons (and warnings) to learn is a blank. Our gerneration has unlearned the lessons of history so we do not now what to look out for or the wartning signals.
State education really has un-educated this generation into zombie sheep happy to chew the cud so long as the grass is growing. I feel for them and hope we can get the message out though i fear it's already too late
History teaches us brainwashed people are the most educated and literate. Centralized and standardized education as we know it today is a product of Marxism. Just read the Communist Manifesto and you'll understand why education is so important. I remember looking at CIA statistics on North Korea awhile back that listed North Korea as the most literate country in the world. This one compiled by UNESCO (cultural marxist NGO) has ex soviet bloc countries, communist countries, and ex communist countries that make up the entirety of the top 20. Australia the most literate "first world" nation ranks as #22 but its ran by the fabians.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_rate
Those dumb illiterate people are not so stupid afterall. They know not to trust the parasitic bureaucrats that come and take their crop every year on a utopia.
"And in this instance, you who are the father of letters, from a paternal love of your own children have been led to attribute to them a quality which they cannot have; for this discovery of yours will create forgetfulness in the learners' souls, because they will not use their memories; they will trust to the external written characters and not remember of themselves. The specific which you have discovered is an aid not to memory, but to reminiscence, and you give your disciples not truth, but only the semblance of truth; they will be hearers of many things and will have learned nothing; they will appear to be omniscient and will generally know nothing; they will be tiresome company, having the show of wisdom without the reality." - Plato on the origin of books
Is it really so hard to believe that any number of opposed groups can share blame for one's predicament?
"It's all the government's fault!" or "it's all the Wall Street's fault!" or "it's all the people's fault!" are all false claims which distract from the reality of the problem: each group is to blame in some degree, but without the complicity of all groups the present situation could not have arisen.
Much of the populist clique would have you believe that Joe American was on the straight 'n narrow until Evil Wall Street came along, tricked Good 'Ol Uncle Sam, and swindled poor Joe. Sort of, but that's not the whole story.
Much of the libertarian clique would have you believe that Joe American was on the straight 'n narrow until Evil Wall Street and Mean 'Ol Uncle Sam formed a gang and put the squeeze on poor Joe. Sort of, but that's not the whole story.
Much of the corporate-and-financial clique would have you believe that it was the victim of Evil Big Government and that Joe American was hurt in the process. Sort of, but that's not the whole story.
The people are not innocent, though we are the victim. That the world is not fundamentally just does not mean that the victim is always innocent.
There is nothing wrong with assigning blame where blame is due, that's the price paid for agreeing that actions have consequences.
i think we start with one slightly dodgy idea, like having a bit of credit (debt) is good then build another dodgy idea on top of it (being in debt for 30 years t pay off your mortgage)...sometimes it takes decades to expose the fault lines in the thinking
we also have banking, whoch was a conservative (safety first) operation turning into a Kamakazi suicide mission when Bwankers went from collaterised lending to pissing away near free interest money (mortgages) to people who would never be credit worthy (trash)
There's plenty of blame to go around with sub-prime mortgages
But here's the problem i have blaming the people. This credit (debt) mountain and inevitable mushroom cloud explosion is a regular repeating error throughout history.. it's been happening in banking and Govt for Centuries ..it cannot be 'demand' driven by society, it must be supply driven (the supply side being banking)
To suggest bankers and Govts are ignorant of these continual busts is to take us for fools ...something else is at work with bankers constantly pumping debt into society
Not that what you say isn't true but it seriously omits human nature and some of the worst attributes like Greed, Jealousy, Ego, Insecurity.
People most likely, even though some will claim they are victims, would have done some of that stuff anyway. You can't honestly believe that even though people may have known better they wouldn't still have acted in the same manner. One example, credit cards. Now of course many people had access to endless mailings for credit but each time they went to purchase some usless bauble it was their own action. And they may have even maxed out other CCs and been called by collectors but they still would activate another card until they were completely shut off. Credit card companies may have enabled them but their own actions cannot be discounted.
Humans are the only animals that will intentionally harm themselves with foreknowledge that they will be harmed by an action (not talking about defense). Are they stupid simiians that are so easily caught in monkey traps? Well what about the ones that are smart enough to avoid the trap?
Those people were not lied to and their own free will led them to their indebtedness. Now those people will be called "sick" it's a "disease" to want things and spend endlessly; to me that's a copout akin to calling being human a disease.
People were convinced those things were a good idea (HGTV, dietech, home equity) because they wanted to be convinced. "Easy money. Oh no I don't want that." Banksters are guilty of the same problem only they use other people's money and get bonuses for it. I wonder if they'll ever change their ways...nah I know that answer.
And what the fuck does "Free will presumes truthful information" mean anyway? What about Caveat Emptor? Who the fuck was raised, anywhere in this world, to blindly trust everyone? Maybe someone raised on a deserted island somewhere raised by scientists like in Twins?
Excellent points.
"...human nature and some of the worst attributes like Greed, Jealousy, Ego, Insecurity."
"You can't honestly believe that even though people may have known better they wouldn't still have acted in the same manner."
We all have at least a drop of larceny...everyone of us.
But I don't think its over the top to expect "our leaders" to have less larceny in their souls than the majority of us.
nmewn - you're far from naive.. so why would you expect a person running for public office and its status and power over Joe Public and requiring $millions in corporate donations to sponsor your campaign not to be corrupt and put public good over private sponsors?
who would think private sponsors would ever select a candidate to sponsor who would put the public interest first or over their own interests or such a loose canon would ever get selected or past their vetting process!
democracy is rigged from start to finish by the parasite class
"so why would you expect a person running for public office and its status and power over Joe Public and requiring $millions in corporate donations to sponsor your campaign not to be corrupt and put public good over private sponsors?"
I always look for the one who smiles in their face, knowing in their heart they are about to stab them in the back once in office. Same game, different level.
So far, not many...but I know they're there and they're multiplying ;-)
"Who the fuck was raised, anywhere in this world, to blindly trust everyone?"
All of us? As long as it was a "responsible corporation"? You don't seem to get just how much of this is forced on us in ways we don't even grasp. Advertising is aimed at pathos, not logos; emotions, not logic. There is a reason companies spend billions on surveys to make advertising more effective, and that does not even include the subliminals.
Quality is irrelevant in a consumer culture. If it breaks, get another one (which, being newer, will allegedly be better). Quality 100 years ago was a sin qua non - no quality, no sales. People did not have the time, disposable income, or desire to buy crap. In fact, crappy goods could kill you. They still can, but normally it's a matter of inconvenience, not life or death.
"Cheap is good" has been the mantra arguably since WW 2, and certainly since the 60's. Why not buy from Walmart or Harbor Freight? If you can buy 1/2 the quality for 1/3 the price, aren't you money ahead? This is exactly the thinking that started the Big 3 car companies (among others) on their way to their current situation, but remember, this is something they spend a lot of time teaching in college - cost accounting, cost effectiveness, cost reduction.
So what the fuck does the above have to do with trust? Simple - we are not being asked to trust people. In fact, at this point ("If you see something, say something") we are very specifically being taught to NOT trust people. What we are told to trust, day in, day out, from cradle to grave, is "the system," "The Man," the "expert" (e.g. The Bernank), the government and its agents. We are taught the government will make everything better, from Jim Crow to offensive T-shirts, and that it will punish bad people and companies. There has been a HUGE amount of "government protects us from bad" for a very long time. Breaking that meme on a mass scale is incredibly difficult. Information is often not enough, because information involves logic (in most cases). There generally is not enough emotional impact to get past the normalcy bias.
Put it another way - if Walmart says cheap is good, and the government (which is supposed to protect us from and/or punish bad) does not say anything, then doesn't that mean cheap really is good? If the government says there is no financial mess, doesn't that mean there is no financial mess (which, BTW, is a brilliant ploy - if there is no mess, then your joblessness is your fault, which depresses the unemployed, injures their self-esteem, and promotes feelings of worthlessness, which has kept the many at bay for so long.)
One thing this country faces is, the manipulation has it about 90 to 95% right. It's that odd 5 to 10% that will mess everything up. Especially the people, I'm afraid.
John Law Lives
The DEFINITION of Poverty for 100 million Americans is a joke.
We have no clue what poverty is.
Their definition is when a family of four makes less than +/-20k a year.
How about wondering where your next meal is coming from,no where to sleep, and few if any clothes..........that's poverty.
More government bullshit. You are right. By the silly definitions now used I probably grew up in poverty. I just wonder how many social programs we would now be eligible for. We had one car (old), never made a long distance call, old TV set, 130 square feet of living space per family member, no vacations, no pedicures, manicures, hair dyeing, no large vacations, limited meat at meal times, hand-me-down clothing as toddlers, etc. etc.
Poverty now is a flat screen TV, cell phone with data plan, headset that can rock a subway car, bubble jacket and Nikes but you have to suffer without the premium channels on your cable package. Fuck everything attached to our government. It is evil, through and through.
DosZap,
I will not attempt to defend the US Census Bureau data re. their definition of "poverty". I realize the "middle class" in America enjoy a better lifestyle than they would in many other nations. However, I believe the alarming content in the article is that many millions of Americans are on a declining path. If tens of millions of Americans can not at least maintain their "middle class" status, that could be the catalyst for broader civil unrest. Sooner or later, I believe the public will react. OWS could be just the start of broader civil unrest.
Saw an interesting article Re: OWS that "the American poor" were still the top 1% of the wealthiest people planet-wide. But, FTW and burn down the 1%. Carry on.
Remind me how, what's the average cost of living in America vs average income? If the first approaches the second too closely, you're poor.
I agree that the experience for many of poverty in this country may be hard to jibe with the common denotation of favelas, malnutrition, preventable diseases, etc., which is a consequence of what our society has (rightly or wrongly) deemed the minimal acceptable standard of living for this country's citizens (obviously, relative to many or most other places, our povery threshold is indeed high). But just how does this mean that poverty is not a problem, a growing problem, in America?
I don't foresee lower living costs, higher wages, or greater employment anytime in the foreseeable future, so while we may not be drinking collected rain, sharing 1 room shacks with the whole family, eating scraps picked from the garbage, thing aren't peachy keen. Ask yourself this: just what level of poverty do you think your fellow Americans would (will) accept before they decide it's time for some regime-change a la this same country circa 1776?
PS: Please excuse the snide tone, this is not intended as an attack against anyone.
+1
Agreed 100%. The significance of the article is that tens of millions of Americans are falling behind. Food Stamp participation has exploded in the past 5 years. The gulf between rich and poor is broad. These are seeds of civil unrest.
Did you even read this article, how about that lady that is moving into the 1/4 million dollar house with her spouse and daughter, they will only have $40,000 disposable income left over, Oh the humanity, I,m crying a river.
Of course I read it. I also clearly stated above that the significance of the article is that millions of Americans are sliding backward. I didn't say that all those same people were on the brink of starvation.
I see what you are saying - that the American animal can only slide back so far before they lash out violently. The others are saying that the human animal can be subjected to much deeper depravations before lashing out. The elites pray that you are wrong.
Hate to say it, but the world put up with the Panic of 1837, Revolution of 1848, the Long Depression of the 1870s, and the Panic of 1893-1897 prior to communism finding its first home in Russia in 1917.
This can go on for a long, long time.
Which constitution are they talking about? The CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES, c. 1861, or the Constitution for the united States of America, c. 1787?
I believe they mean the Federal Reserve Act c. 1913
Probably the Constitution that existed before "Honest Abe" took a giant shit on it.
Yes, your country would have been SO much better off if the South had won, wouldn't it? As it was, Lincoln was killed before he could implement any of his policies for reconstruction (which would have been FAR different from those of his successor) and the Carpetbaggers took over. How did that work out again?
Yes, your country would have been SO much better off if the South had won, wouldn't it?
The country would have been much better off if the war never happened, and the South was allowed to peacefully secede... instead of having all that power concentrated into a centralized, federal tyranny that quickly morphed into a military-banker empire bent on regional and then global hegemony.
Slavery was on its way out regardless of the outcome of that war. As a huge fan of "colonization" as a solution to the issue of slavery, if white supremacist Lincoln had his way he would have shipped all the slaves back to Africa. He certainly wasn't fighting the war on their behalf.
lesterbegood
# 2 for sure.................
Once again, Germans would like to be European masters. Once again, Germans will fail and pay a terrible price for it.
Actually, it is Germany that can save the Western Civilization from annihilating itself through money printing.
I know Germany have strenghts, but DB is a big fucking hedge fund and everything is so conected. when the domino starts falling they will end up with revolutions and disruptions of everything and Germany could end up as a police in eyes of many EU countries. BEst thing is to go for DM.
You remind me of those who lived down the street from "Lot" in Sodom.
It's not that the Germans "want" to be Europe's masters. They can't help themselves. This is just the nature of things. This is why PM Thatcher didn't want the two Germany's united.
But the greater point in this sorry episode playing out on the Continant, is that there are no mechanisms put in place for limiting the power of the Government. And this so called EU government is growing into a force of oppression by its own design.
And as the US is concerned, the greatest feature that the US founding fathers instilled in our Consitution is that od limited government. The only thing that needs to be limited in an social contract between a people and their government is the power that government can exert on the individual. Nothing else. And this is because power corrupts, and absote power corrupts absolutely. No matter how good the intentions are at the onset.
the U.S. CONSTITUTION is NOT a dead letter ....... unless we allow it . STAND UP, AMERICANS, STAND UP, arm-in-arm & demand that the corrupt government fall . the U.S. CONSTITUTION is sacred, it is our history, it is AMERICA. the past 100 years has been a deliberate act to drain all wealth out of this country into the coffers of the shareholders of the FEDERAL RESERVE BANK. we are going into the Second American Revolution, god bless the patriots.
Well it's just a shame there isn't a Constitutionalist running for President. Oh wait...
Yeah, and look at the treatment he is getting. The desperation is obvious.
"I can't hear you. La la la la la la la. I can't hear you. La la la la."
I am impersonating the Presstitutes in the ShameStream media.
I like damn near everything you write, what the hell are you doing in New York?
God must be punishing him
Thank you. I am preparing my exit. That is what I'm doing.
You will not be wrong in your departure. (voice of experience)
Yeah, well, we DID allow it. Too bad for America.
This time they will call the Patriots Terrorists
what do you mean "this time"?
The Independent have a good brief on the Squid's takeover of Europe
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/analysis-and-features/what-pr...
Thanks for the link. Good article, and one of the comments, by "Justamug", is even better--one of the clearest brief outlines of the situation I have read--and he nails it on the way forward: Distinguish between debts needed to maintain actual productivity and debt that merely shores up speculation. The first is worthy of maintenance, the latter not.
no one could have imagined the global fetishism that the information age has brought - there are still ways the republic could endure, but the path is growing narrow.
that guy will speak at our libertarian soc next monday. what a hero.
alas, more worthless discussion material from the "nattering nabobs of negativism" tip of the hat to william saffire, via spiro agnew.......
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiro_Agnew
OUr constitution has been hijacked by the Fabian socialists.
libertarian86.blogspot.com
Anyone ever actually read the Lisbon Treaty? It starts off with something like "Queen of Denmark, King of Spain, Queen of Netherlands, etc., etc. The whole time I was thinking how fucking "progressive" can you be when you're still honoring people for no other reason than the fact they were born.
Too bad American politicians have an infatuation with turning this country into another European state. It's almost like we didn't fight a war over not wanting to be like them.
I think you have some of it backwards. With the creation of the Fed and the ending of the gold standard in 1971 the rest of the world is trying to emulate the U.S. That is why the Euro was created and why China is spending endlessly. They all saw how easy the power scheme was and all they needed to do was create lots and lots of debt. They all wanted to listen to the smartest people in the room who had a proven track record of stealing and getting away with it and it so happened that they were all American.
slow motion train wreck v. n+1
Collapse seems certain but it will happen slowly due to the strenous efforts by many to keep the gave alive. The glorious era of investing we pray for where fake and impossible to value assets melt away could be a promised land we never see in our lifetimes (dammit). I am eager to see a new world where shares and obligations are evaluated on openly disclosed fundamentals because sitting on a pile of cash and gold is getting quite boring.
>>will change as tail risk becomes the only risk.<<
The Schwantz has known about this endgame since he first started using his login on the internet in 2004. That is why he has this name. Schwantz = tail (or slang for cock) in German. The entire world is well on its way to getting seriously fucked.
The world has been fucked. All that is going on now, is trying to convince her that she asked for it.
Treaties and Constitutions mean little to those who by force and deceit and cunning pervert morality and bend it to their selfish ends and it seems they are the ones that because of those attributes and ruthlessness take control. In so doing they pervert everything that was intended to foster the common good and force those true and good to take up the good fight to return to the original intent.
This usually does not happen without bloodshed and massive sacrifice. I doubt it will be different this time.
I do hope those clamoring for revolution have thought this through and understand the price that will be asked of them once they get their wish,because the hounds of war once loosened, and especially in this age will be hard to leash again. Also, those in power with a few exceptions are rarely those who suffer most.
But maybe, hopefully, the cowards in charge ( and they know who they are) will come to their senses soon, and steer this ship through more placid waters and to shores where sanity and stuardship of earth and resources is practiced, where intelligence is turned to compassionate and constructive ends and where we see each other as brothers and not as terrorists or satan spawn.
"I do hope those clamoring for revolution have thought this through and understand the price that will be asked of them once they get their wish"
Don't see much of this on ZH, but we need to. War is not a fucking walk in the park. Especially for the non-combatants, who seem to make up the majority of the dead and maimed.
Well said.
Maybe it's more like the good constitutional "DNA" helped the US to withstand the (unavoidable?) decay a little longer...
Kings, Queens and other DescendedFromGod types find it impossible to define insanity.
where I'm at along the coast of north FLA it looks like the French Revolution already took place. The neuvo-rich mansions at least 50% or so are now abandoned. And these are the pricks who were saying people who paid a hundred thousand for a house were idiots and deserve to be homeless. Well these fuckwads paid millions. And their credit bubbles have been blasted big time. Chad and Suzy better get used to fighting their golden retriever for garbage can scraps.
Prepare to die yuppie fucking scum!
The US constitution is simple, speaks to core concepts understood by all. It does not try to confuse but is in an ancient form of English to most.
However, it is easily translated into modern languages, and easy to use as a governing document. Becuase it was made to be that way by the founders that insisted John Adams didn't get his way.
When reading the US Constitution, one must understand there are three distinctly different english languages (informal english, business english, formal english), & the meaning of words can be completely different. Keep this in mind for a correct interpretation.
www.1215.org
h/t Chumbawumba
The introduction to the Lisbon Treaty (aka "EU Constitution") begins with these words:
The introduction to the US Constitution begins with these words:
'nuff said...
Q: "Who are the Belgians?"
A: "We are all Belgians, and I am your king."
A Federal Reserve Note is not money, it is used as money.
It is a Debt instrument.(an Obligation of the US Gvt).
The United Sates government is responsible for that debt, which means it is Debt to all Americans.
In bizarro world, money IS debt. At least the Bernank says so.
http://www.freedocumentaries.org/int.php?filmID=214
I read (Reuters I think) an interview with a Zrurich banker who said people were buting gold "by the ton."
Wonder if they are the PIIGS people moving to hard asset from paper?
Do they know you cannot eat gold? Even if you microwave it....too much indigestion I've read.
Major drama going on via UC Davis - police officer calmly pepper sprays sitting protestors, manages to motivate an entire campus into radicalism.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmJmmnMkuEM&feature=share
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuWEx6Cfn-I
Good over-view, complete with links: http://studentactivism.net/2011/11/19/police-brutality-and-lies-at-uc-da...
Fall out is large, and spreading - 4k+ comments on Reddit, trending on Twitter, Police PR department in tatters after stating it was done because the police 'feared for their safety' (when the video shows the officer giving a calm warning to each of them that they'd get pepper sprayed, then... did it, while rthe remaining officers lounged around) and staff are calling for the head of the Uni who ordered the police action.
Officer has been dox'd -
And the interesting thing - he's on a salary of over $100k / annum, 1/3rd of which is paid by the University. Nice gig if you can get it.
Comment:
While we're all aware of the ramifications of the 'monopoly of violence', and the young (as ever) are learning the hard way, this isn't the '60s. Or even 90's. And yes, we're all aware that this level of violence comes no-where near the state crackdowns in Syria et al, and does look a bit silly / kabuki, but... if you wanted to play this the wrong way, you're doing it right. The entire history of revolution is defined by the moment that the middle / upper-middle classes cease to believe that the 'forces of law & order' are there to protect them, but to oppress them. The French Revolution wasn't (originally) a working class revolution, and nor was the English Civil war: both were bourgeois driven.
UC Davies is the top end economically speaking of Universities, & the children of upper middle classes go there. Expect fireworks.
So are you extolling the virtues of the French revolution where millions died? What does your "post revolution" world look like? You sir will be no better off and quite possible dead.
Oh, please.
I use strawmen to light my cigars after winning - don't bring a peashooter to a gun fight.
And... one benefit of my particular genetics is: we survive, like cockroaches. Heck, I'm the nice fluffy one at the moment, and desperately misunderstood. Real option: if you try and discern "learnt" behaviour, without understanding that you're being judged mirror-like (and worse yet, have already failed three times on reciprocal tests, and are still demanding compassion, not to mention failing to do that central thing, which is: "Earn it, don't expect it" - and, LOL then bitch and moan when it gets thrown back at you? Me DeGusta), and throw wild accusations of 'non-authenticity' at a subject.... and they don't bite back, you're dealing with a pleasant version. Never think that the negative hasn't been thought, and rejected, and you've already been judged when coming to those conclusions.
I fucking hate it when those judging fail to understand their subjects. This is the primary reason why Philosophers on the subject of animal / cognition are so fucking wrong / boring, and why I dislike the 1,0's. 2.0's are barely tolerable, depending on their humour /and.or/ sincerity: but the prior models are insulting and it is a measure of compassion that they are not torn apart. And yes, I say that with an immense amount of irony towards the fucktards gaslighting out there - ask an honest question, get an education; try and game a player, and... just no. What's pathetic is you didn't even get what was really going on: "demons & angels" lol... only in the 3rd substrate, not the important ones. Use of Weapons + Inception = 5 tiered memetic levels, some of which you don't have access to. Deliberate like, because... I'm polite and so therefore, you need to knock on the door to get access. Grrrr.
And yes - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kpp22pHMcgk&feature=related
Throwing it back at you: if the lady makes it a conditional to break the laws of science to respond, and we're doing that - I want proof, not fucking 'expectation'. Nothing like my actual persona was attached to that piece of sharing, because - mainly - I was tired of being gamed, and I'm not going to risk myself on such an 'open' channel. Here's to imagining a child with no education coming into your world: not a guard dog or horse, which was the point of that level. (sigh). Nor do I want your collective desires dumped on me without some direct 1/1/1 discussion. Nature pictures, Christ and children photos, coupled with Warhol Christ canvases? Give me a break.
How's that van anyhow? Puerile, but an interesting experiment. Stop the upswing / orgasm, engine dies. Twice. I was amused. And serves the wankers driving it right, what are they.. chimps? Irritating as fuck, and lucky it was only the engine that stopped.
;.;
tldr;
Oh, back you your point. Yawn. Your brain is stuck in the 20C - we pity you. And yes, you can view this as batshit crazy or drunken ramblings or a coded message to someone who isn't you. Take your pick.
1st post reaction: "Hmmm!"
2nd post reaction: "Hmmm..."
I guess it's better to be thought of as a fool...
The audience reading it is not the droids you're looking for... As stated, its either batshit crazy, drunk, or a coded message not aimed at you reading it.
Hint: Try spending 4 weeks with a memetic baseline tapping into your primordial fear responses and still playing the game. I'm not talking about that fear you get when a deal is on the line, nor the fear you get when a relationship is a bit iffy, nor the fear you get when you strap yourself into a bungy cord. I'm talking real predator - prey, fear/flight response levels - ultimate lizard base line fear. Constantly.
Run with that, and still respond like a human, and you're dealing with one of the substrate / memetic levels. I think of it as the 'Cthulhu / David Icke Lizard' level - where it really is "eat or be eaten", or even worse, that whole extra-dimension eaten alive trope. Slap a whole Religious Judaism / Christian layer onto the level below that, and I can tell you - shit can get weird.
The other three are a little more complicated. And no, kids, don't try this at home. But yeah, I +1 you, because I'm well aware of what it reads like. Think of it like Bernanke reading his press, and filtering it through his own perceptions of reality. Shit can get that weird to make sense...
[edit] The point of doing this, is, of course, to experience and understand the human experience, and so be able to both comprehend and more importantly anticipate human behaviours. If you can't fully understand the sheep in the market, or the way in which Religious believers understand the world, then you can't model their behaviour correctly. It isn't nice or pleasant living like a majority of the human species, but you get a distinct advantage living it rather than 'modeling' it on guesswork. "Doing God's Work" - requires memetic insight to understand the moves.
Having done it, I know how segments of humanity think, and feel. I'm lucky, in that I can throw off those shackles - but trust me when I say; a lot of humans exist in a pretty nasty mental space.
Please return to your assilum. Do not pass go. You loose a turn.
If you're attempting to reference Bedlam, at least spell it correctly.
Modern technology - right click entry field, select "check spelling", look out for anything red and then alter accordingly (but beware of altar).
20C thinking, as I said.