Copper Jumps More Than 3 Standard Deviations On Largest 2-Day Rally Since March 09

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Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:48 | 1804261 DormRoom
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leverage capitalism is back!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:12 | 1804371 French Frog
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Yeah, look at crude too: on a free roll to 90 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:50 | 1804265 junkyardjack
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Strap in, the bull market is back

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:58 | 1804301 SheepDog-One
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Until Wednesday. 

Remember the last big market tank was on our own 'debt resolution' at DOW 12,700 when everyone was certain markets would shoot straight up. 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:29 | 1804459 French Frog
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Last time was a trick to make everyone believe that the market had already priced in the next QE (or even only an expectation of new QE) or Euro debt resolution.

This current move has already killed many shorts on the way up and will probably decimate all those still hanging and hoping for a repeat performance (ie. a sharp drop on any substantial bad news).

Alas, I fear that they will play the card that that most bad news are now priced in and any improvement on that will likely lead to an even bigger meltup

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:50 | 1804267 Cognitive Dissonance
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Three standard deviations, seven deviations, whatever.

This entire clusterfuck is a massive deviation.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:53 | 1804284 fuu
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Hi CD.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:44 | 1804541 Cognitive Dissonance
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Hey fuu, nice turn of phrase there with the "Clusterflock".

Haven't been around ZH much lately. Working other projects. Thanks for saying high.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:51 | 1804275 GeneMarchbanks
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Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:53 | 1804285 ruffian
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it's QE to infinity and beyond.......that's what the mkts are pricing.........bernank is going to do Europes dirty work, bail out greece, global banking, our federal govt and all muni's as well...........cant you hear the thunder in the distance............

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:59 | 1804313 SheepDog-One
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QE is a used tool, not effective for anything now.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:03 | 1804338 ruffian
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wrong, it's good for one thing...lifting asset prices.........1255 S&P then watch it all puke.......then the cavelry arrives

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:10 | 1804360 SheepDog-One
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The cavalry arrives with what....more free money to stuff into TBTF bank vaults? Then what?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:53 | 1804286 lizzy36
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Stairway to heaven, one standard deviation at a time.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:46 | 1804550 Cognitive Dissonance
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Very nice. May I steal that? :>)

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:54 | 1804295 baby_BLYTHE
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Looks like the bottom is in for Gold and Silver.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:58 | 1804307 ruffian
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No, risk topping here.........europe fails to agree........mkts tank..........bernank comes to rescue..........just about to sell off hard so Bernank has excuse to ride to the rescue

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:59 | 1804317 SheepDog-One
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And then what?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:00 | 1804322 ruffian
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Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:01 | 1804326 SheepDog-One
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I still dont think one has the money to pay for hyperinflation.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:05 | 1804343 ruffian
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what do you mean? fiat creation is infinite

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:08 | 1804349 SheepDog-One
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People dont have the money. Create as much imaginary currency as you want to hand to the banks, what difference does that make when its not in the peoples hands?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:12 | 1804372 ruffian
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the banks use the newly created digital fiat to buy all scarcity...things that cant be created out of thin air.....what does it matter WHO has the newly printed fiat.....thats why the public suffer........the first hands to touch new fiat (banks) have the advantage as they buy up all matter

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:13 | 1804375 SheepDog-One
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OK so banks 'buy everything up'....then what do they do with it?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:16 | 1804391 ruffian
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seriously?.....I've got things to do.......think about it.........why hold something that has infinite loses value..........own scarcity......holds it';s value.............sheesh

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:16 | 1804681 Seer
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As you can see, people turn off when they hit the wall after a few levels of questions.

I'd been asking this question for a long time.  When everyone is destitute except the few, then what is that value of the things that those few have?  People will be conditioned to living outside the McMansion, HDTV, iCrap and Hummer world.  All that CRAP will be exactly what we're seeing it's worth- nothing (nearing nothing currently).

In exchange for playing the game of extend and pretend, the banks take on worthless shit and are given worthless fiat (which is really only binary bits to pad their failing books).

The people that are giving you a hard time are likely those who are sitting on some pile of (soon to be) worthless crap.  They HAVE to believe that things would somehow turn around.  Or, if they are NOT in this situation, they probably believe that there's some massive NWO campaign.  Well, this results of this would be the same as I stated above- people won't find value in it, so that System (much as is happening with the existing system) won't get off the ground.

Yeah, it's the simple questions that everyone dodges: like "can you have infinite growth on a finite planet?"  In this case it's a simple question of: "why would the leaders of the status quo risk destabilizing the status quo if doing so presents a great risk to their retention of power?"

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 18:56 | 1806311 deebee
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mind the margin hikes

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 10:56 | 1804305 campag
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Brent crude very slow to  joining in with the ramp in prices . could this be the Libya effect ?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:01 | 1804321 SheepDog-One
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Oil is too real to be allowed to follow along in the price ramping. Of course as usual, there is NO inflation...

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:15 | 1804387 campag
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nope WTI is strong is this the correction of Brent/WTI prices

too early to confirm

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:05 | 1804345 NetDamage
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CME bought some cheap gold spraypaint? 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:15 | 1804389 SAME AS IT EVER WAS

"but then again applying sense to these markets is now nonsense anyway"

Have they never made any sense, execpt the blizting of end of the world headlines right before a bullish market turn?


Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:28 | 1804452 bill1102inf
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And yet there are still those who think the grand cure all is for  countries to tie their currencies to some form of metal. LMAO...

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:31 | 1804470 common_sense
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and falling again to hell... hug hug hug...

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:42 | 1804538 Dollar Bill Hiccup
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You can re-QE and it will only bring the market back to where it was before it sold off so violently.

I'm waiting for David Tepper to come on CNBC again.

Life is a day trade.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 11:54 | 1804587 mantrid
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ah, volatility in commodities. standard excuse for margin hikes. JP Morgan has to close their silver shorts and they're not happy to do it at these prices. encouraging CME to hike only silver would be a bit lame. so, volatility here, volatility there and the setting will be done.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:03 | 1804618 bill1102inf
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Look at that lovely chart. Now, imagine if the USD was somehow pegged to the value of copper (or gold) or any other single 'thing'.  One day gasoline is $5.00, the next $3.00, one day eggs are $1.50, the next $.80, ohhhh what a joy that would be.  


Then there are those that think they will be rich if we actually 'reset'. lmao.  IF that were to happen, and for every dollar we wanted to have in the system we removed 10, well, everything goes down by at least 10. But, since we use 'debt dollars' and since debt will be purged on a massive scale the value of things will be even less. So, gold at 1600, suddenly becomes worth 160 directly, but indirectly due to debt purging and credit contraction on a massively leveraged scale (at least to start) itll probably wind up closer to 16 but absolutely less than 160.



Mon, 10/24/2011 - 15:43 | 1805575 mantrid
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lol, this volatility is possible because USD is 'pegged' to nothing? this is incredible how the uninformed get things flipped. if you have tons of paper money wondering there and back then you have volatility. I don't see tons of gold or copper wondering like that. does it have something to do with the fact that you have to actually put some effort to increase their supply? :D

prices would be volatile if there were no speculation, no hedgeing, no exchanges and futures. but if some banksters create money out of nothing, how can one hedge against paper tsunami?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:19 | 1804690 Wheatman
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Why does Tyler always complain when risk assets, the Ero, Oil etc rally and ES ramps all the time? Just becuase you lose money Tyler, no need to whinge. Trade the volatility UP. Remember, no-one ios allowed to sell this market. It is not nice to sell, and it is bad manners. What a clusterfuck, but dont complain about it.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:19 | 1804693 Elmer Fudd
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The dollar is a turd?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:25 | 1804712 LudwigVon
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Another great post TD. TY, as usual.

Lastly I want to remark that continuing to follow Agriculture and fertilizer source minerals closely for ZH readers would be very valuable !! Please do not relent focus in this area.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:27 | 1804719 TheArmageddonTrader
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This is all about the unexpectedly strong data on Chinese copper imports in September. Which I suspect was largely just stocks being moved around as a result of the liquidation by financial investors last month. The data counts how much comes out of the bonded warehouses. Which in normal times is a good proxy for consumption, but September was anything but normal times in the copper market.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:01 | 1804870 Amish Hacker
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Oh, that Doctor Copper. First he told us to turn our head and cough, and now he says, "You're going to feel a little pressure..." Bullshit. This is going to hurt.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 14:12 | 1805184 mr1963
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Save pre 1982 pennies and any nickels...

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