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Did Today's Stock Plunge Give The QEeen Light?
From mid-November last year, S&P 500 futures fell from a high of 1259 to a low of 1136 in around 9 days - 123 points (or 9.7%). This was enough, it seemed, for the Central Banks of the world to get on the phone and press the big green 'print' button in a coordinated response to markets waking up to the dismal reality hidden under the covers. From May 1st highs at 1412 to today's 1300.5 lows is a 112point drop in around 13 days (or a drop of around 7.8%). While the most recent move is slower and smaller so far - today's action in stocks (and even more so in Gold) perhaps reflects the reality that QE3 is inevitable (gold) but not until stocks have fallen enough to warrant 'extraordinary actions' by the Fed. Do we have another 2-3% drop before the Fed picks up the phone?
and as we noted earlier, perhaps it is worth considering how the 'USD-fiat-based unit of account that the S&P 500 is priced in' is now dramatically different from the 'non-fiat-currency unit of 'risk' that credit is priced in'. Critically, credit markets remain a far more effective indication of the business cycle or credit demand/supply to put it another way, than the USD-devalued unreality of US equities...
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Most likely.
All Uncle Sugar needs to do is issue debt at these low rates and buy FB to get us out of this mess.
I was just noticing on the Treasury article how the charts are looking all QEasy.
At 1266 Benny hits ctrl-P.
At 1166 Benny calls Obama.
At 1066 England is invaded by Normandy.
At 966 Obama gets down on his knees in prayer.
At 666 God says to Obama "It's lights out time for you, buddy"
They have already said they're not doing anymore QE....
.... right?
yeah and I'm a dictionary salesman.
Hey Tyler, saw this over at TFMetalsReport.com ...
any comment?
If stocks keep dropping like this they're gonna have to hand out free money to people who can't afford to gamble.
Long silver futures here...'nough said.
Cdad
time to load up on gold silver
are gold futures taxed as collectibles?
qe after a 7.6% pullback? That's hard to sell. I think it needs to be close to 12-16% before the call is made
Spoke to my local coin dealer and he said it has to issue a 1099 for any sale of FOREIGN coins totally $25,000 or more. American coins do not require the 1099. I have read elsewhere that they are taxed as collectibles but you can carry a capital loss over.
I heard the same thing from someone who sounds like that wrote that article... they are working every way to Sunday to circumvent the "laws" preventing "monetizing" more debt... this will end well!! LMAO
What would have happened if the Fed told them no to buying the bank? China made them an offer they couldnt refuse, perhaps: Either A) we dump your treasuries, or B) all your banks are belong to us.
Just my opinion.
QE has never stopped. The low volume rally has all been QE or Twist or something that begins with printing money.
The problem they are having now is too many rats biting the same hot dog.
JP Morgan's failed hedge bet comes to mind.
Figure this one out. JP Morgan knows before anyone exactly where money is going and when. Yet they tried to hedge to make even more money. I can't tell you how absurd this is. If you break down how much money they get from the U S government by the number of employees they have it's well over a million per employee. Yet, even in a fat guilded ship someone always wants to be top dog. In order to become top dog they all try to make a little extra on the side. They do this by keeping information from each other. No one is the wiser until something blows up.
Basically Dimon could have cared less as long as his profits were coming in. The problem with one greedy rat is it ignites the greedy gene in all of them. Now many are selling out of their own positions just in case things go south. You don't want to be the last rat holding inequality when Greece goes totally bust. Once the selling starts you can't correct human mob behavior in the moment.
All QE will be a signal to sell out of gifted positions to the U S taxpayer or sucker du jour.
They can QE all they want from here out - saturation has been reached and it can't save Greece or Spain or Italy. It can only inflate the cost of current goods.
Crisismode said:
At 555 crazy shit happens at regular intervals, as if controlled by a timer.
Only two people got the joke so far? I thought there were plenty of EE's here.
All the new EE's are 'model jocks' (alternatively: schematic entry clerks) who program FPGAs and make sure all the vendor's timing models are available or they simply utlize SOC ('System On Chip' or alternately various 'chip sets') from the major silicon vendors (implementation or 'problem solving' is done with the help of the vendor's various app engs which is where the 'expertise' is for RF signal modulation and demodulation chips e.g. used for WiMAX/LTE, WiFi etc), and/or don't read/write native English and have never seen an 8-pin DIP through-hole package ...
Im no EE but I get the 555 Timer lol
I believe you are referring to a NE555 timer chip?
Signetics termed it the NE555 whereas National Semiconductor termed it LM555 (for Linear Monolithic (process fabrication on the usual wafer in layered form) as opposed to "LH" e.g. LH0002 (a high-current linear buffer chip) for Linear Hybrid technology (actual construction of a multi-component 'chip' via very small components interconnected with bond wires) back in the day ...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/555_timer_IC
I "teethed" on the National Semiconductor for linear stuff (still have my 1st NS linear databook I think!), and TI for the digital (7400 series) stuff. At one time I had an original issue (simple brown cover version) of Don Lancaster's "TTL Cookbook" too, but that has been lost (or thieved) somewhere back in time ...
The 555 is THE classic timer
Oh.....to be back in high school electronics again. A simpler time with simpler toys. The shit you could do with a 555.....If we could just breadboard a circuit to blink when it's time to buy silver at the bottom.
I am LM555 liking it ...
Somehow, you just raised my opinion of everyone on this board.
At 444 everyone is dead -- it's a Japanese thing.
That was damn funny, Crisismode. Good stuff!
I don't think so. The Bernank and the administration would love to bring oil back to the $70's range and gold into the $1250-$1350 range. Plus a summer time announcement in coordination with the usually seasonally strong August time period should provide an election boost to the markets and put the S&P 500 over $1400 easily. The other consideration is to keep their powder dry until Israel hits Iran with U.S. help.
Thus I think they'll let the traders twist, the LIESman whine, and goldbugs groaning until the very last possible moment. Look for the S&P 500 to level off around $1100, with $1016 as a probable floor.
None of that matters.
QE is done to lower rates. Each occasion he did it he said that was the purpose.
At 1.7% 10 year and 2.8% 30 year, there's no need for measures to lower rates.
And he dares not have politicians declare he is acting to influence the election or he will lose Fed independence, which has always been every Chairman's number 1 priority.
I suspect no QE til November, and with the fiscal cliff, maybe not then. Why QE? It's not helping.
Open QE to provide liquidity to a very illiquid EU.
Huh? They don't need QE to do that. 7.7T went out the back door to banks worldwide in 2008/9.
None of that was disclosed (aside from the 700B TARP).
That can't possibly fly. All Chairmen have been terrified of losing independence to Congressionally imposed regulation, and sending US money to Europe would trigger that.
Nope, it's an election year. Fed Independence is priorty 1. He won't move at all until after the election, and with the fiscal cliff looming, maybe not then.
It wouldn't matter if he did. It has no effect.
Plus the member banks are holding $1.5T in excess reserves. Kinda hard to claim you're "providing liquidity to unclog the credit markets" with a situation like that.
QE would be pushing on a string and everyone knows it (except perhaps Krugman and Cramer). Bernanke's in a bind. His "unorthadox tools" have caused severe market dislocations and he knows it.
He doesn't need to QE quite yet as there is a deflationary conflagration happeneing across both ponds. Flight to (relative) "safety"....bitchez. But he will eventually do QE3. Neg real yields can only go on for so long.
How do you come up with your numbers?
I think before Sunday night/Monday morning at the open of the markets, they will do QE3 or some type of money injection along with other countries.
nah it will fall lower. bernank wants everyone begging for more qe before he hits ctrl+p
crash is in the works
No ones even the least bit disturbed right now, 9 out of 10 people around me when asked had no idea what stock markets are even doing they dont even give a shit anymore.
most people don't pay any attention utill they get their quarterly 401k statement in the mail
Except the smart ones who took out all they can, to buy shit they actually need, and are no longer contributing to the fund.
The really smart ones took out the max in loans and bought PMs.
That's because if you just contribute to your 401k on a regular basis, and don't pay any attention to it, you'll be rich.
You'll be rich...in nominal terms.
Youll be rich until you suddenly have nothing....FED plan to bankrupt all pensioners on schedule.
"That's because if you just contribute to your 401k on a regular basis, and don't pay any attention to it, you'll be rich."
I'm going to hope that was sarcasm.
If not, well, I hope you like the taste of dogfood. Happy retirement!
Something happened in the stock market? I was too busy feeding my sheep in Farmville, its hard work but someone's got to do it...
The fed has spent billions on QE programs and it has done nothing overall.
...and your point is?
Billions? More like $30 trillion.
...so far.
I respectfully disagree. He wanted to launch the stock market into orbit and it worked. The S&P was over 1400! Hard to believe.
Anyway, Benny found out he can't control housing or create jobs but he could jolt stocks. So all the folks with big money in stocks have seen their wealth explode, which has led to them spending and giving us positive GDP for 3 years. Without QE the Dow is lucky to see 10K.
And who by a disproportionate margin own equities?
QE is nothing but a stealth bailout of the upper class.
actually a twofer.....add public pension funds
Good point, and one I don't hear many people talking about. The public pension funds are in a world of shit, and there are many trillions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of people expecting their dough. I wonder if this isn't one of the Fed's strongest motivations for ramping the stock markets.
Threefer, insurance companies (not equity holdings directly, but corporate credit).
The upper 10% are the only ones they care about bailing out anyway.
The owners know most of the sheople are either too stupid, too apathetic, or consider themselves temporarily embarrassed millionaires and future big time players who will get their mother lode one day even though that day never comes. That's how they get them to consistently vote against their own self interest election after election. The owners know most sheople will focus 100% on the carrot while never seeing the stick, the present reality. or the harness strapped around them. The sheople are like horses flat out running back to the burning barn.
QE will readily return if the upper 10% starts to feel pinched. That's the only group they will respond to. The bottom 50-60% could be homeless and starving and they wouldn't do a single thing unless those people threaten the upper 10%.
George,
You seem to misunderstand the 'upper class' when you put it at 10% of the population. You seem to misunderstand the 'upper class' if you think that noblesse oblige is dead just because money grubbing statists in Washington and the Fed failed in their duty of care toward the majority.
You seem to misunderstand the bond between the American born and bred 'upper class' and every other 'class' who share values, hopes, dreams and fears. One step at a time. This is our land, for better or worse. The Constitution and Declaration of Independence tells us so.
We shall overcome every oppressive government, every money master, every aggressor. Together we stand. Divided, we fall.
Ben only goosed stocks to create cover for monetizing the debt....people will soon learn what a real crash is.
As always, you're absolutely correct SheepDog.
Animals inevitably sense an impending storm and take cover before humans (just watch the birds 4 hours before the next thunderstorm).
Interestingly, as I look out my window, I see animals gathering 2 by 2, heading to Home Depot for 2 x 4s . . .
When did the QE's ever stop? Ben prefers the stealth QE approach. That way he can convince the sheeple that gold is a bubble.
QE to infinity while short selling commodities and precious metals all the way. This is Ben's version of "Sterilized QE"
Yep. Naked short selling of gold and silver allows the Fed and its agents like JP Morgue to lower the price, and stock up on the physical gold and silver. They are truly evil, the usurious money masters of old who hated the Republic in its infancy, and they hate us now even more.
I say NO to their aggression. A peaceful and wise person buys physical gold and silver, all the better to defend our country when the corporatists trigger the collapse which they plot in order to oppress the majority, be you ordinary Joe or ordinary millionaire in devalued paper money.
the bernank has the (upward sloping) siegfried line drawn on his chart of the s&p, that much is an absolute certainty.
Here it comes! BOHICA, bitchez!
Europe w/o Germany is in RECESSION
US in recession by June.
China technically in recession.
Printing more of the same won't change those facts and they know it. More easing is a pipe dream at this point because demand for just about anything is down despite cheap money.
Put me in the "no further easing" camp.
UNLESS the unthinkable happened and easing meant to slash debt burdens via jubilee and reset.
I hate to burst your BUBBLE (the one you live in)! .05% GDP print for Germany is recession! The U.S. has been in recession for several months now. At least go with the none tinted limo windows. When you roll down the windows you see whats really happening in the world.
but...but....Joe Biden just said that things are improving......he damn near screamed it......his face all all contorted and everything.....and he clenched his teefus and all.....the crowd started clapping.....he went on and on....mesmerizing......he meant it.....it must be true....it must.
(heavy, dripping like molasses sarcasm, off the tips of my fangs........)
Bocephus' teefus.
On the other hand, Biden is a tool.
Biden his time...that money grubbing career politico from a state of tax relief, whilst foisting more tax and unemployment among other states?
THAT Joe Biden his time?
Joe Biden means well, but I think I can do a better job as VP.....
Obummer needs a positive GDP number for November, and the surest way to get that is to ask Ben to "print" one for him.
"QE to infinity" camp here, as much as it pains me to say that ...
I don't trust a single "official" number out of China.
...nor from any other entity that is captialized.
GLAD TO SEE SOMEONE HERE GOT IR RIGHT ABOUT US DOUBLE DIP RECESSION IN JUNE - TO BE PRECISE THE 15TH
You cannot be sure of the 15th.
If you are, I like to flap over your way and take a look at your stuff...
From where I am sitting, Israel is about ready to attack... and they will do it.
The result may very well be a hot shooting war with Loyds of London counting up the losses world wide.
I am already positioning in metals for keeps now. The recent year and half or so was just a sandbox and baby talk while I learned.
There is no QE3 on the water, and there will not be one on land.
They're done with Operation Reflation. Get ready for Operation Depression.
That's just election rhetoric. The day they stop easing, is the day they fall from power.
IDNJY (I did not junk you)
Exactly realtick. I know all the equity junkies are Jonezin' bad for more free crack, but theyll soon find out theyre all on their own.
Thank you, SheepDog.
Wake up people - the Fed is not going to destroy the dollar's reserve currency status in order to keep propping up the stock market.
They will but if they did it right now there would be way too much backlash, they have to wait until the people are begging for it in true junky fashion.
Sell in may and go away...again.
may,2th, dow 13300, now almost 1000 points lower.
QE3 means hyperinflation, so I don't think they're going to do it unless people are begging for it.
I have a pretty bad track record for predictions though.
Shenanigans. We're nowhere near hyperinflation levels and the euro getting crushed only helps to keep the dollar 'strong' (for now). QE3 will have an inflationary effect and is A step towards hyperinflation, but it is not hyperinflation outright.
hyperinflation is the loss of currency demand and that means there has to be an alternative medium of exchange to run to.
every other hyperinflation has had this, and that is why the global phd paper standard was so coveted by the money changers.
only way we hyperinflate to metal is someone actually using it as medium.
moral of this story is we peasant bitches will tolerate a LOT of inflation.
you dig.
"Hyperinflations are caused by government deficits" (Peter Bernholz, Monetary Regimes and Inflation).
Once new debt issuance to fund the continuance of government crosses 40%, you're in rough seas.
I hear helicopter rotors...
That could also be the mother of all fans awaiting something to hit it.
I really hope this time the intervention falls flat on its face. Commodities spiking, US dollar tanking, financial assets not responding as previously as crisis of confidence grows ...
Yet there appears to be plenty of irrational exuberance tinder to light and more QE may very well cause another melt-up explosion. Facebook pricing at high end (25x revenues, and really how much bigger can it get without pissing off its users) and look at Saleforce.com after hours today. This company generates no cash, has good growth but for how long, and trades at nearly 100x massaged earnings. Do we really need QE on top of this?
I'm sure you meant 'rational ignorance' of the bulltard type. A fool and his 'money' will soon be parted....Fascist thinking begets Darwinian reality...
There is no need for QE. All that cash on the sidelines is about to come back in. Yup.
Have the shorts piled on yet? Surely he will wait until the time is right for a short-covering rip-fest.
Too bad teh Bernanke painted himself into a corner with shitty ( for QE ) employment and inflation numbers .
Run rates lower drop stocks (but not create a lower low). Run rates higher and run stocks to a higher high. Rinse / repeat. Ben you are a fucking dick!
People go to jail doing this shit. But not you. Yet
You know, this might sound a little crazy, but does anyone else think the unusual takedowns in AU (just prior to the banking stuff, where it's normal to sell down to cover margin, get USD, etc) where there were guaranteed money-losing trades selling in to the nanosecond down momentum might have been to make some headroom for QE?
I'm just remember Volker saying during the late 70s/early 80s the high gold price "looked bad." And if they didn't do a pre-QE takedown, AU would have certainly had a shot of blipping over the $2K mark -- which would look bad and feed more momentum into the rise. This way they make it look like AU is just bouncing between channels and not breaking out to new (nominal) highs.
The movement just seems odd, but would make a lot of sense if you were planning on another QE and didn't want AU to look like the safety net it is.
Of course gold and silver had to be crushed before letting QE out of the bag again.
STOP thinking CRUSHED as a bad thing.
Paper is fantasy, having physical possession is the win.
Crushed simply means to get ready to BUY more.
That's roight... get stacking.
Sheesh I dont get any respect around here...
All the commodities got trashed.
Do you think they also had to cut the knees off cocoa, pork bellies, and cotton?
No, they didn't have to trash those too, but then again, why not?
Trying to reinforce that Au and Ag are just (like other) commodities.
Very interesting idea!
In my opinion? not this time. Were all going down equally as planned.
Will not happen till after the Euro meltdown starts dragging down
the US banking system.
The Bernanke has only one shot left.
Inked himself into a corner.
Forget Bernank QEefing until you see a few face melting -5% days strung together. Hell the S&P is still up 3% for the year....WHAT crisis? This aint it, not yet anyway, not even close.
Exactly the high before the crash was around 1370 something for the S&P and that went down to 1000 with no word from the Fed. The fed can't step in when markets are still near all time highs...
It will have to be much deeper plunge to crank it up again. Gas is still 3.65 here. at 3.90 life stops.
Another qe will simply put the rest who are on the edge over the cliff financially with increased gas, food etc.
Election year - lower oil price most welcome. But it seems wise to have covered some shorts and tightened stops for now. A plan to make a plan will be announced shortly. In 2008 the bankers and politicians were pretty much shoulder to shoulder, but I sense an unease between them now, but it may be for show, but who doubts that in the end THEY WILL PRINT, its just a matter of time and timing is everything!
Friends, Romans, countrymen, lend me your EURS:
Money creation has not, will not, stop. We are only discussing the rate of change, acceleration, and Jerk. No, not the Jerks in political office - rather the engineering type.
Soon, engineering texts will add the "Bernank" to the list. This quantity is the imaginary part of the Jerk, involves no work, yet is able to move markets.
Third derivative of a different kind, bitchez.
Ta for the show :-)
Why do some people think the Fed is reluctant to print?
They have already said all options are on the table in the event of
slowdown in the economy. There will be QE3 in some form and it will
come soon. Not printing and letting the economy crash before the election,
would be considered a political move by Bernanke in the eyes of the Democrats.
Bernanke's hands are tied. If the economy stalls, he has to print or be accused of
playing politics.
Wouldn't printing be playing politics as well, by your reasoning?
When my sisters and I were little my dad took our elderly cat to the vet. The vet said he was dying and wanted to put him to sleep, but my dad said he had promised his 3 girls he would be returning with the cat. So, the vet shot him up with steroids and that cat ran around the house like a kitten for two solid weeks before he dropped dead.
Obummer will shoot this economy up with steroids to win this election. He doesn't care what happens after November.
Right now the Fed is getting everything it wants. Commodities are falling, T-bills are supported and S&P still only off 8%...
The fed won't (and I suggest can't) print until it has a clear "no choice" crisis. It's coming but not until the EU unravels.
agree. but with rumors of bank runs, that EU unraveling prediction could be happening a lot sooner than you might think.
I'm shocked it hasn't happened yet. Market has a bad case of normalcy bias. Any massive QE post an EU implosion isn't going to just give the markets a bullish bounce and we all go on - I think it will be the only thing holding the markets together at all.
But it's anybody's guess.
Will QE3 gas will be at 8 bucks a fuckin' gallon.
All is proceeding as per script. We will likely see a confluence of further market retreats and deterioration in the EZ which will lead to a coordinated policy response from the Fed, ECB, BoE, BoJ, PBoC et al which will simulataneously reramp all asset markets. In other words, don't look for the Fed to lead or act in isolation. The next move will have to be an "all hands on deck" drill. Only problem is that it won't be a live fire action. They will all be shooting blanks, and the end game will have been put in motion.
Let's not forget the parabolic rise in the "DXY". We needed that, so the commodity sector inflation looks contained, when helicoptor Ben starts dropping pallets of " Green Manure"!
look at the money supply versus velocity
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/BASE
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/M2V
http://nowandfutures.com/fed_watch.html
QE = anti-Viagra
Wow, I just looked. I had no idea that velocity is the lowest it's ever been since the Fed started tracking it. That's crazy.
Theoretically he doesn't have to do a thing. If the euro implodes thanks to lack of EU leadership and Greece, Spain, Italy starting runs on the bank that Germany balks at civering, then all the paper he printed in the last few years starts getting more valuable. If the euro unravels entirely the dollar becomes even more valuable still as sole reserve currency and calm store of value in a turbulent time.
We may need to ask whether the destruction of the Euro "fixes" everything.
You're joking, right? With the banks all incestuously connected you would see cascading cross defaults everywhere= QE to the moon. I give the USD 3 weeks to start it's ugly freefall after the EU implodes.
No I'm not. I think everyone is looking at the problem of a EU bank run through American Dollar colored glasses.
I've had a lot of conversation with family in Greece and it centers around the topic of "What happens if it ALL goes tits up"; not just Greece but all of Europe. Do they take all their money out or keep it in the banks. We're talking working class people here not the rich.
Welcome to game theory. If they empty their accounts and stuff a bunch of euros in their mattresses, and then Greece exits and the Euro survives, well they pat themselves on the back at their cleverness. They got one over on those German bastards.
If they empty their accounts and stuff a bunch of euros in their mattresses, Greece then exits and the Euro ceases to be a few weeks later, well, they're in deep shit cause they potentialy have a mattress full of worthless paper, that Drachma Greece doesnt really have to honor, nor Germany need accept for DM. I see planes loads of Greeks heading to Germany with Greek branded Euros then told to piss off.
What they all really want are US dollars or PM's which are immune from this catch-22. Or property in the UK. Something to save their cash and hedge against the Euro.
I understand that the banks are incestuously connected, but if the Euro gets fried, wont that leave OUR banks in the global drivers seat? Stuffed with Ctr+P dollars that suddenly soar in value and able to feast long term on everybody else. I'm not making a claim, or even stating a hunch, just positing a what if conversation starter.
NO IT DOES NOT ONLY DESTROYING THE US DOLLAR WITH MORE QE AND HENCE MORE VALUABLE GOLD WILL FIX EVERYTHING
...lou,
That's the calculated game. We'll see soon if it works.
Anyone know why the futures are always green no matter how the market closes?
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/has-simple-retail-investor-become-smarter-...
Euro-USD just broke 1.27
Must be all of the positive economic developments from today.
dam eur/usd... looks like we have a comet tail on the 5 minute. Looks like some intervention going on.
We're getting there, but not quite yet. We have ~ 400 points to go before official "correction" territory.
In that case ...
... he still has a couple of hundred points for the S&P to fall before he needs to do anything.
For any of you waiting on QE3, here is a suggestion. STOP WAITING !!!!
The markets don't mean dingleberries anymore.
The issue is what happens when the EU/euro capsizes ...
When that happens, the global economy is going to see a contraction unlike anything that has ever happened before.
Ben is going to need more powder than even he can dream of shooting his wad on WHEN that happens. It is NOT an IF anymore.
barliman
Nah, don't wait. Get some cash out of the bank, just in case they decide to announce "holidays".
I've usually got £1-2k in cash, though my fiancee tends to reduce the stack faster than I can withdraw & add to it.
No offense ...
... you need a new fiancee.
If you live in the UK and are familiar with Guy Ritchie's film "Snatch" you'll understand my reference - "With a finacee like that you are going to end up properly fucked."
barliman
Get over this bullshit already!
There is no way in hell you are going to get anymore QE anytime soon!
QE now would just destroy the value of the standard of living of every working slob in this country!
To all you greedy bastards who would profit from QE, F*** You!
We need to stand up, stand proud and admit this country is on the wrong path!
Cant have a lemonade stand, cant hug your friend, no bake sales?
Are you fracking serious?
Hey Cass Sunstein, you and your new O.I.A.R. can go F*** yourself, and take Bubble Blowin Ben and Tax Cheat Timmy with you!
F***ing progressives!
Leave our divinely inspired republic once and forever, I hear the "Fabian Socialist's" across the pond are looking for some more scumbag losers to help rape and pillage their citizens!
Lord have mercy!
I don't think most people here WANT further (or indeed, any) QE, it's just that the realization is that it will come so we might as well just get it over with.
The monetary policy we have witnessed has not generally been condoned on ZH...
Bullsh*t. EVERYONE on this site is praying for new QE. Then, their precious gold will go up in value. Readers here want QE more than the Margin Stanly.
Crimedog,
We must agree to disagree on your point. I as many dislike QE intensely, for it marks a hateful new phase in the rise of statists: insolvent governments and insolvent banks bailing out each other, all for their personal power and profit, with no regard for the genuine rights and dignity of wo/man outside their corporatist clique. Their fans apologise for them; applaud them. Their fans hate anyone who finds a way to evade that debt slavery statist trap, whether it be by living simply off the land among a gentle community or making millions from betting against the latest fiat money dystopoia experiment.
I wish I could give you more than one green arrow for that. Well said.
I resent it when people think that because I prepare for a crisis, that I somehow relish the idea of the people around me suffering. I don't welcome QE, because I don't like to see good people lose their wealth. But I will prepare for it, as it is inevitable, IMO. And I will not apologize later for having been prepared, any more than I would apologize for surviving a tsunami or a fire.
AustriAnnie,
The strong will survive, and that is how they will protect the weaker. We have no say over the machinations of statists and the globalist central bank cartel. We can only outwit them in our own quiet way, and live to defend our values; our values which are better than the statists and corporatists.
Twas ever thus, my friend.
QE now would just destroy the value of the standard of living of every working slob in this country!
And the Fed cares about this how?
FED does not give 1 shit about any useless eater peasant....and unless youre in their billionaire banksters club, youre one of the peasants. 'Standard of living for the Proles'....lol yea sure.
OT but another Twilight Zone moment
http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=206119
In 1991 Obama was born in Kenya. Today, not so much
QEeen Light. nailed it right.
Sex Pistols - God Save The Queen
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VTQBAl4mtyA
.
there be the program. debt, endless debt
all the way to the grave.
Ben! Ben!
Fire up the choppers...it's an emergency!
You call this a plunge, bichez?? What are we down, 7-8%? Show me a crash we can be proud of.
Absolutely correct. The market is up 3% in the past 4.5 months.
We have about 30% to lose to get down below August lows, where we belong. Hell, August was less than 12 months ago. Not a big move at all.
When people ask me why I didn't come up with an idea like Facebook I say:
Sorry I don't know how to come up with stupid ideas that don't make any money, yet are somehow valued more than all the other great ideas in history.
I come up with brilliant ideas that actually make money, yet somehow are not valued like Facebook because you actually have to sell them to a consumer. The stock market doesn't like ideas like that. Selling a real product actually takes work.
In retrospect I should have patented every stupid idea I threw out in college during classes in 1995 just to make a point how easy it is to come up with simple ideas. A device that knows where you and your friends are, a radio frequency tag you can put on your kids backpack, a portable music player using the infant .mp3 format.
How many guys in college used Geocities to make an online hotlist using freshman facebook photos. I know me and my friends did.
YES FUCKERBERGS IDEA WAS NOT NEW. If he made Facebook in 1997, it wouldn't have been worth jack shit. MySpace, Friendster, and all the rest are just extensions of the social internet circa 1997-2000. Why it is worth hundreds of billions now is beyond me.
Oh yeah that's right. ZIRP allows underwriters to borrow excessive sums of money to make bets on IPOs knowing they will return billions in profit, justifying massive fraud and waste. A SCAM.
Primary wave 3 down appears well under way under the Elliott Wave principle.
http://bullandbearmash.com/index/djia/daily/
Isn't technical analysis only somewhat valid when there isn't overt manipulation by the ptb? Seems like I haven't seen a truly predictive elliot wave call since this crisis began.
Can anyone here legitimately explain the scenario where it pays off to have invested 20%-30% of one's savings into gold? Everyone on this site professes a hate for fiat currency but cheers when gold goes up in value priced in dollars. Why would you care if it goes up in price? Are you going to sell it for the hated dollar once it gets high enough? And if it gets ridiculously priced, such as $4-5K per ounce, that probably means the economy as a whole is ruined and the dollar is crap. In this scenario, do you think you will be able to trade in your gold for some sort of new currency and will trade at a comparable rate to where gold was priced in dollars? How will I profit from the fact that I own gold besides an increase in pdollar price?
I ask this because I still only believe gold would help in an ALL-OUT collapse - like Mad Max. But even then, guns are more important.
VERY SIMPLE FACTS:-
1) USD IS NOT THE ONLY FIAT CURRENCY AROUND WHERE YOU CAN SWAP YOUR DOLLARS INTO AFTER SELLING YOUR PHYSICAL GOLD, PAPER NEEDS NOT TO APPLY.
2) IF ALL CURRENCIES ARE FIAT THEN PHYSICAL GOLD BECOMES THE NEW NORM OR THE NEW CURRENCY BEFORE YOU SWAP IT INTO ANOTHER FIAT CURRENCY OF COURSE.
3) THOSE HOLDING PHYSICAL GOLD WILL BE ABLE TO TRADE GOLD FOR REAL IN EXCHANGE FOR GOODS AND SERVICES.
4) THOSE NOT HOLDING PHYSICAL GOLD WILL BE GIVING WHATEVER LEFT FIAT CURRENCY IS IN THE SYSTEM OR A NEW FIAT CURRENCY BUT OF COURSE PRICED AT DISCOUNT COMPARED TO THE NOMINAL VALUE OF GOLD..
HOPE IT HELPS
This sounds like hopium to me.
2) Why do you assume physical gold becomes the new norm? Where is this guaranteed?
4) What would the nominal value of gold be? How do you know it would not be artificially suppressed to screw average gold-holders?