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The Dutch Central Bank Answers 10 Questions About Its Gold
Three weeks ago, the Dutch asked their central bank where their gold is. The central bank has responded. Courtesy of Vrijspreker, here are both the replies, as well as the key follow up questions. And while the bulk of the answers are expectedly trite, and generic form, "DNB’s physical gold holdings function as the ultimate reserve and anchor of trust in times of financial crisis. Further, gold is being held for diversification reasons." This appears just slightly different from our own Chairman's definition of gold as mere barbarous tradition.
We repeat the questions of the Dutch Socialistic Party with the answers of the Secretary, and follow up with first comments of the Vrijspreker. We think further questions are justified!
Question —Answer—Comment
1. Did the Dutch Central Bank (DNB) loan part of their gold?
If yes, how much and to whom?
No. DNB has informed me that they have stopped loaning out gold as of 2008.
Comments Vrijspreker: if so, why doesn’t DNB make that clear in the annual report? Why hide such crucial information.
2. Why are gold and gold loans stated as one line item in the annual report 2010 instead of mentioned as 2 separate items?
DNB follows the rules for valuation, determination of result and balance sheet presentation of the European system of Central Banks. The asset ‘Gold and Gold Receivables’ reflects the physical gold inventory.
Comments Vrijspreker: good international accounting standards oblige companies to separate cash from receivables, as they’re clearly different. Why wouldn’t these standards apply to central banks? In times of increasing civil unrest because of opaque financial schemes being set up by governments, central and commercial banks and the demand for more transparency, how would you justify these special rules for central banks? Are they above the law?
3. Can you give an overview of the yearly yields of the gold loans during the past years?
No gold has been loaned out over the past years.
4. Where IS the physical gold of DNB? At which locations and how much is where?
What is the reason that the gold is still at these locations?
DNB has a location policy, which means that the gold has been spread over the following locations: New York, Ottawa, London and Amsterdam.
Comments Vrijspreker: why doesn’t the Secretary answer all the questions? What is the amount per location? And what exactly is the location policy? Why New York instead of any random other city? Also it’s important to know how often and by whom the vaults are audited.
5. What was the most important reason for DNB to sell the gold in the past? Are the storage costs a reason? What are the actual costs to store the gold?
By selling gold in the past, DNB has tried to align its gold holdings with other gold holding countries. The storage costs were not a factor in the decision to sell the gold, because they are relatively low. Currently, DNB’s total annual storage costs paid to other central banks amount to a few hundreds of thousands of euros. The costs vary per location.
Comments Vrijspreker: why would DNB want to align its gold holdings with other central banks’ holdings? Is there a coordinated central policy amongst all central banks? Has this been prescribed by the Bank of International Settlements? Are the recent gold purchases by developing countries’ central banks not conflicting with this international policy. Could you outline the details of this policy?
6. Can you confirm that since 1991 of the 1700 tons of gold about 1100 tons have been sold?
Is the remark of journalist Peter de Waard correct that because of these historic sales there is a loss of about 30 billion euro?
If not correct, what is the right amount?
Since 1991, 1,100 tons of gold have been sold. Back then it was concluded that DNB held relatively much gold compared to other central banks. Decided was to align the amount of gold with other important gold owning countries. Sales proceeds have been added to DNB’s general reserves and have been invested in interest generating investments. Comparing the actual, as a result of the financial crisis, higher gold price with the historical gold price does indeed lead to more or less the amount as mentioned by Mr. De Waard. However, one has to take into account the investment income generated since selling the gold and the fact that the result of said calculations heavily depend of the strongly fluctuating price of gold.
Comments Vrijspreker: again, why align the gold holdings with that of other central banks? What exactly is the purpose of that policy?
7. How much of the National Debt has during the past 20 years been paid off with the proceeds of the gold sales? Are you of opinion that the sustainability of the national debt will be improved by paying off the debt and at the same time selling the gold?
Gold is an asset of DNB. The sales proceeds have been invested in other assets and have hence not been used to reduce the national debt. The return on investments will flow back to the Dutch government as a result of DNB’s dividend payments.
8. What is in your opinion the present function of the gold stock?
DNB’s physical gold holdings function as the ultimate reserve and anchor of trust in times of financial crisis. Further, gold is being held for diversification reasons.
Comments Vrijspreker: clearly DNB sees value in gold. For that reason, it needs to be more transparent, and so should all central banks.
9. What is the relation between the size of the market of the gold stock and the size of the market of gold derivates? What are the possible consequences of this?
The size of the physical gold market and derivatives market cannot easily be compared because of diverging measures for the size. For the trade in physical gold the turnover is measured: in the most important market (London) this amounted to USD 136 billion in the second half of 2010 according to the London Bullion Market Association. For the derivatives market the underlying value of outstanding derivatives (swaps, future contracts and options) is of importance. For the second half of 2010 these amounted to USD 396 billion according to the Bank of International Settlements. In general one can say that the availability of derivatives markets promote efficient price discovery.
10. Can you confirm that recently a number of countries have even enlarged their physical gold stock? Do you have an explanation for this development?
Buyers are developing economies that show strongly growing official reserves or where gold traditionally only constituted a small portion of the reserves. There is also a wide group of countries that have sold gold the past decade (including France, Spain, UK and Switzerland)
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"1. Did the Dutch Central Bank (DNB) loan part of their gold?
If yes, how much and to whom?
No. DNB has informed me that they have stopped loaning out gold as of 2008."
That could be read a couple of different ways. One way: we loaned all of our gold as of 2008. We have not loaned any more gold [because it is already 100% on loan] since 2008.
"We have not loaned any more gold [because it is already 100% on loan] since 2008."
how cute!
here in america we would never let such a small detail stop us.
i wonder how much of thier gold ended up at the B,I,S.
Beer is better than Obama because beer isn't a lawyer.
"So while a country might have contributed 8% of the ECB's gold, that country now owned 8% of the interest in the system. And being part of a system, that country also agreed to all operations in foreign reserve assets, not just those transferred to the ECB, being centrally coordinated by the system aggregator, the ECB"
these central banks are cultivating contagions one country after another. they just gave away all thur gold for a 8% stake in eu debt. gold for debt herpes, indeed a great trade. somebody made a lot of money on that trade, cui bono?
They did not give it away. That 8% stake implies a 8% in all assets of that entity(and also all liabilities)
If the ECB does fall, do you think those countries will simply hand over their gold to outsiders, or will they simply reclaim their stake; taking into account that they have more foreign reserves ( read US dollar assets) than foreign claims ( read US dollar liabilities) and if the SHTF they 'could' settle all other claims by printing, seeing as all other claims are in euro.
Think before you type.
"8% stake implies a 8% in all assets of that entity(and also all liabilities)"
"they 'could' settle all other claims by printing, seeing as all other claims are in euro."
in line with your 'thinking', we've just solved the greatest debt problem in the history of mankind! thank you printing press! only if bernanke have such profound knowledge and insights....oh wait!
The operative word there was 'could'. I did not imply it was the solution.
We both know that printing money solves nothing. I just pointed out that most of what you said was bullshit.
what I said was bs? did you read dcb secretary's responses? i'm mocking the banksters, out-bullshitting them at their own game. dcb sold most of their gold reserves, they don't tell you how much it held they dont' tell you who's got the gold. they contribute gold to ecb for fiat debt. foreign reserve is fiat debt, foreign claims are more fiat debt. dcb gave away their real wealth and run their country awash in fiat debt they must be very proud. if eu goes down, there will not be a single bullion left for anyone to reclaim. you say i'm all bs how would you rank the banksters who are peddling up shits creek to claim their shit's gold?
I did. They did, which is unfortunate. I rank them individually based on their actions and stated goals. The ECB of which the DNB is part of far outranks the FED in terms of honesty.
I do not think the euro will fail. We shall have to see.
Like now?? Or do we still have to wait for the other shoe to drop!!
Not yet.
If I stored my gold reserves at BIS or the FED, I would be nervous....
Never watched this show before but stopped while flipping through channels on Brad Meltzer's Decoded because he was doing a story on Fort Knox. I expected the show to be a happy ending with the feel good of the gold being there...instead they found so many people that worked at Fort Knox acknowledging the gold was gone they actually had to admit "the gold is probably gone.."
Watch if you want...
http://www.history.com/shows/brad-meltzers-decoded/videos/brad-meltzers-...
(maniacial laughter)
thought baloon: (where the fucks these people been?)
Thanks for the link.
it's all in the MORGUE,,, JPs
takeaway from chris powell of gata: occupying a country militarily is nothing. if you can control its currency market (vs. the dollar) you can make everyone in the country work for you as your slave.
eh...life would go on bc ppl would just shrug like they do every other time the gov't is proven to be a complete fraud.
My first reaction was you are reading a bit much into the statement. OTOH, politicians universally are weasels, so all possibilities should be considered.
Nope, it simply means that none of the Dutch gold is currently leased out.
DNB has always been quite open about our national gold stash. In particular their 2005 publication "Goudbeheer van DNB" is a nice introduction, also to the international gold market and about other central bank's policies. They've got many more publications about gold, see http://www.google.nl/search?q=goud+site%3Adnb.nl (ironically their site seems to be offline as I write this, along with several other government sites).
One thing that I found interesting is that the Dutch gold stored in New York does not conform to the Good Delivery standard. Specifically, the bars are not registered individually but in bundles of 20. When they sold many tons of this NY gold in the nineties, the bars had to be weighed and registered one by one so they could be sold on the London gold market.
Anyway, I don't think these replies to questions posed in parliament are in any way evading. One thing that I would have liked to know but that wasn't asked, is if the gold that the Netherlands have pledged to the ECB, the IMF and possibly the BIS is part of our current 600 tonnes stock of gold, and so, no longer fully under our own control..
FOFOA just answered your question.
It should be noted that this initial transfer was not a surrender of assets to a third party central bank, but instead it was a buy-in, a purchase of equity in the system itself. So while a country might have contributed 8% of the ECB's gold, that country now owned 8% of the interest in the system. And being part of a system, that country also agreed to all operations in foreign reserve assets, not just those transferred to the ECB, being centrally coordinated by the system aggregator, the ECB.
http://freegoldobserver.blogspot.com/
Thanks, but no, it doesn't answer the question whether the gold that we contributed to the ECB's reserves is included in the figure of 610 tonnes that our central bank holds. From DNB's own publications, I would guess that it is not, because they also (i.e. 'additionally') manage part of the ECB's reserves, which I would guess includes the gold and foreign currencies that we contributed. This is not just relevant because our actual holdings would be less if the 610 tonnes include the gold contributed to the ECB, but also because if we should ever leave the euro, we shuold get that ECB gold back.
who ever "possesses" the gold is the practical owner, so they are broke.
http://expose2.wordpress.com
and it's gone
dutch peoples
best round up their gold [ physical ]
and bring it home ..
ZH should consider a "Got Gold?" T-shirt. Then WB7 should give a fark of Fisher, Kocherlakota and Plosser wearing it while talking to Bernanke.
good idea,
i'd buy one that said,
GOT SILVER?
"Question 7. How much of the National Debt has during the past 20 years been paid off with the proceeds of the gold sales? Are you of opinion that the sustainability of the national debt will be improved by paying off the debt and at the same time selling the gold?
Answer by Central Bank: Gold is an asset of DNB. The sales proceeds have been invested in other assets and have hence not been used to reduce the national debt."
Translation: the Gold that the central bank purchased by issuing currency that became a debt to the Dutch people to be paid back in taxes owed to the state, belongs to the central bank now. See, we get to buy real things like gold by conjuring up currency that becomes a debt to the Dutch people. We will never give it back. You fucked up. You trusted us.
I believe you have hit the nail on the head L.T.E.R. It's also clear they have no intention of divulging the current size of that "debt".
.
Beer is better than Obama because you're sad if there's no more beer.
more accurate (hence funnier) than the lawyer one.
Possession is 9\10 of the law.
The C/Bs have the gold that the people paid for through inflation of the money supply.
The C/Bs are not going to give it back because they have sold it leased it or are keeping it for the 1%.
It clearly belongs to the people who have a right to actually posses their own share of it.
So in short. 'we have a problem"
This will not end well.....
I put my money on the king on this one, not the bankers. If it comes to that.
the gov't has these things called tanks. they trump the jew confetti
splitz . . . schizophrenic. yet not dialectic . . . because anyone hallucinatory enough to still be stuck in kultural delusions of l/r d/r communism/capitalism, et cetera, are long-since fooled, fleeced and totally f-fucked, by just such false flags as of even this latest date are anyway thought flown over their eventually triumphant capitol/capital . . . false fronts, and known knowns, where military jokes such as your own just as yet don't get who the real owners are of your tanks, and thinktanks alike, however again and again near-everwhere shown to be filled by whatever spam-in-a-can or propagandists otherwise called either soldiers or idealogues, owned
owned
owned, lock-stock&barrel of every little cog-screw&flywheel of their machine which runs where/when/and why they send it right on down to each and every screwloose grunt-troop&boot on the ground
talking tanks . . .
tanks!
bankers
Bankers! you dumb f-fucking drone --which they also own-- so you can't stay or ever say surprised when it's all over and you're found left looking around with your smartmouth wide open in then suddenly findingout just who finally owns the gold
All The Gold
for a time maybe leasedout on loan, but --in their usual death-for-debt ratio --coming in with the moors and long since left behind with the euros, again exhibiting their old debt-for-gold m.o. which they know is why they're so secretly envied, and/or not so secretly hated, as they've time and again nevertheless spread their accomplished contagion instead among their very own
pieces-of-eight. split with nobody
8
just eight families. Eight, now as then the apotheosis of Power.Envy.Hate, this long ensconced as Lords over kings nevermind the lordosis of mere premiers, prime ministers and presidents under the weight of their golden throne. Banking
yeh. send in the tanks
The DNB was clearly perforing some kind of Kabuki dance. We all know it.
The Dutch don't have a history of being stupid with money. They settled New York FFs
If anyone has their gold, its the Dutch IMO
http://freegoldobserver.blogspot.com/
Spitzer you are one of the smarter mother effers around here.
What? No beer and Obama jokes? You are not being consistent CCC! Here's one I just made up:
Beer is better than Obama, because beer is just as good whether or not there is a teleprompter in front of it.
Beer is better than Obama because you don't have to be a banker to get some head.
Actually, they traded it for Suriname. Apparently, spices were big back then. Internationally, the Dutch have a reputation for being 'tight' with money, not 'smart.'
...still a big player in tulips though! http://www.investopedia.com/features/crashes/crashes2.asp#axzz1aFQJ8WZ9
Dumping New York on the British in exchange for Suriname, a plantation colony that was profitable for 200 years, was not a bad move.
How long was it before the British had to fight the American independence war..and lost ?
Will you take IOU?
This question will be asked until answered.
Occupy
The Money Honey should ask
Do you know what your money is?
Answer: Piss off. It's not your gold.
Germany just got done paying the last of its reperations due from the Second War World, as of last year.
Once again, Germany is in the heat of having to prop up the EURO or be blammed for its fall. The Question is, especially with the United States and the rest of the West in Bankrupt territory, who is going to pay for the sins of the world this time around? This is why many (rightfully so) fear that World War III is the inevitable outcome.
If you look at history war is the only constant broken up by brief periods of peace. The world will always be at war until everyone lives in the same size home, has the same looking wife/husband whatever, with the same amount of money, and believing in the same god. I don't think I'll be around when that day comes.
Ever hear a politician say that democracy isn't about violence? The US was birthed from a violent war, and has engaged in violent wars throughout it's history.
"What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must from time to time be refreshed with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
-Thomas Jefferson
Only since Rome is this true. Before that, when we were tribal, wars only happened every few generations. When living with 100 people, a war could wipe out one's whole family and bloodline, and people knew this was unwise. Disputes were often handled between individuals "Mano a mano" when they were violent.
I would go on but I know we have been over this before.
Bitch Pleazzzzz
Before the dawn of civilization, war likely consisted of small-scale raiding. One half of the people found in a Nubian cemetery dating to as early as 12,000 years ago had died of violence.[15] Since the rise of the state some 5,000 years ago,[16] military activity has occurred over much of the globe. The advent of gunpowder and the acceleration of technological advances led to modern warfare. According to Conway W. Henderson, "One source claims 14,500 wars have taken place between 3500 BC and the late 20th century, costing 3.5 billion lives, leaving only 300 years of peace (Beer 1981: 20)."[17]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War#History_of_warfare
Trippin' homey. Run n' tell that.
what is your point?
that war is good? that war is our nature and therefore ok?
I have an analogy for you:
99.99% of all the homo sapiens that ever lived on this planet (probably about 50 billion so far) have died because of a horrible illness, like bad teeth, viruses or failing organs etc...
Does this mean that "illness" is good?
is "illness" the natural way for a person to go?
shouldnt war be considered an illness that MUST be treated... and be it only for as long as possible...
But surely we have to look at war/illness as a problem... not a solution?
Or how SICK would you have to be to long for a sickness?
I think you missed the point. "The tree of Liberty must from time to time be refreshed with the blood of patriots and tyrants." A Patriot will from time to time give his life for the priveldge of having Liberty and Freeedom for himself and kinship. It is only against the tyrants wishing to remove this privilege that the patriot will defend himself. And this he must.
No. I think you missed the point.
I've studied Jefferson for the better part of my life.
do you have a screen shot to back that up?
I thought it was the First World War reparations that were paid off in 2010.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1315869/Germany-end-World-War-On...
Although they may have paid off Second World War reparations, too.
as of what I have been able to find, the net sum total due from the War (most consider WWI and WWII as one event) was paid off as of 2010 by the German populace.
That is of minor concern in the context of a certain select that don't want the propanda and deceit of the past forgotten (Glenn Beck plug ur ears):
Truth: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ao-IHBHiPw
most consider ww1 and ww2 one event? "as is well known" korea and vietnam? ussr vs. afghanistan and u.s. vs. afghanistan? radio and television? sex and birth?
What i can say, is that at least the german population culturally and mentally *CURRENTLY* incompatible with war. It has been so since WW2 (massive indoctrination). The current mentality isn't one of physical aggression TOWARDS other countries, but rather an increasingly isolationist stance.... basically, they got the EMU forcefed, had to take a full 360degree living standard haircut in a matter of YEARS (let me say: if what during 2000-2005 happened in germany, would have happened in the USA, you'd have civil war there. Imagine wages as well as entitlements dropping like a stone - 50% in just a few years!)..... where was i going? Ah, see, germans took all that, even with gnawing teeth and massdemonstrations.... because they were told that ultimately it would be for the "greater good" - so, ultimately things would get better for whole europe including germany.....
......now they their skin is a thin as it can get.... and they get THIS! The reaction is primarily REJECTION, rather than aggression. So, they're pissed about the whole EU thing and increasingly just want to get back to pre-EMU. So, less "Let's kill those lazy greeks!" but more like "WTF? After all we had to endure, why do we now also have to put up with all this crap? Enough! Let's get out of this bullshit!"
As for the future.... can't make any predictions about that. Even though war from the side of the germans right now isn't popularily possible, the global financial instability, and all the racist propaganda spread on MSM and ZH psyops and biggots.... well, you know what that may lead to, given enough time and repetition.
Most of this was due to the costs of reunification, about a trillion $$$. East Germany was a basket case.
""We repeat the questions of the Dutch Socialistic Party with the answers of the Secretary, and follow up with first comments of the Vrijspreker. We think further questions are justified!""
maybe an audit
Subterfuge and flattery is all I see here, no specifics at all.
Gold, it'shat's [going to be able to buy] for dinner.
He who holds the most gold wins - China.
I just assumed all of the Dutch's gold was being held by Johan van der Smut, better known as Goldmember....?
Bernanke screamed into the phone on the answering machine of the Dutch CB office.
yet another instance of , 'if you don't hold it , you don't own it'
Beer is better than Obama because cold beer disproves the myth of man made global warming.
DNB’s physical gold holdings function as the ultimate reserve and anchor of trust in times of financial crisis. Further, gold is being held for diversification reasons.
Tell me again, who was it that said gold is not money? Was it buffon bernanke?
They hold it in conjuction with all central banks so they can collude with all central banks in f-cking with the market
in a sea of sharks we shoulnt be surprised that all "top dogs" are sharks, exactly.
It sounds like the DNB has retained Carl Rove to work as their spokesman. Were I Dutch, I would be getting a little curious as to exactly what the balance sheet is with regard to gold, loaned gold, gold derivatives, and the current location and earned interest accruing from any gold that has been sold. In short, it would seem the DNB has no interest in providing the Dutch citizenry with any real assessment of the value of its gold holdings.
This would be fine if DNB were a private bank beholden only to its private owners. However; as a central bank, the citizens, who are paying taxes to the Dutch government, have every right to know what their central bank is doing with the citizens money.
This should be a fun story to follow. DNB's answers really just lead anyone to wonder if the bank actually knows how much gold they have and/or where it is. Do they have this same problem accounting for Dutch government bonds?
DNB's answers really just lead anyone to wonder if the bank actually knows how much gold they have and/or where it is.
And here it is. If thats the case for one country and their gold, isn't it the same for all countries holding gold elsewhere? If they truly are unaware, things could get very ugly if the truth turns out to be what most here think it is.
Do you know where your gold is? Don't think for a minute they don't know where their gold is.
None of us will be around to enjoy our "preparations" for armaggedon so why this mas hysteria to "survive" something we cannot control ???
War is the ultimate outcome and it will be the last fought modernly, the next will be with stones and bats...again!
I say live hard and die harder when the time comes, fuck the gov shills and bancheros and their creepy helpers, we all have one life, let's LIVE IT instead of constantly "prepare"!!!
Let's make money/paper/dough etc and SPEND IT, LIVE XTRA LARGE AND DIE FREE!!!!
I'd keep my gold in Holland, wooden shoe?
Beer is better than Obama because imported beer doesn’t pretend to be domestic.
Its a f@ckin' clog, Amish! Don't make me lay a crapper on yo a$$, aight.
Wooden shoe up yo@r$. #lol
Possession is 10/10ths of the law. Gold bitchezz!
Possession is hard without the other PMs, brass, copper and lead....
Add in a little fulminate of mercury and cordite, a bunch of friends and neighbors, and you have a party!
"Comments Vrijspreker: good international accounting standards oblige companies to separate cash from receivables, as they’re clearly different. Why wouldn’t these standards apply to central banks? In times of increasing civil unrest because of opaque financial schemes being set up by governments, central and commercial banks and the demand for more transparency, how would you justify these special rules for central banks?"
We cannot.
"Are they above the law?
Yes.
Let The Bernank answer those gold questions for you...
The Bernank:
You forgot # 11
Vot! You don't trust me?
#12...
Is a massage of the lump on my prostate covered under ObamaCare?
No, I'm not kidding. Look, you can feel it right here. Up a little...
Y'all forgot that he doesn't accept the premise of the questions.
Yes, its called the euro, ever heard of it?
http://www.ecb.int/press/pressconf/1998/html/is980708.en.html
================================
Of course, that's the whole point of the Euro - a gold reserved currency to replace the dollar's international transactional role when the dollar fails.
Why do you pander to this utterly ignorant and ianne commentary???????????
LOL?
The euro cannot even sustain itself WITH moneyprinting, let alone be a stable goldbacked currency that doesn't need "green shots" that doesn't suffer from like 10-30% real inflation per year. Any FIAT that doesn't artificially devalue itself, is better than the "goldbacked" EUR for the purposes of a reserve currency. I mean, who the fuck cares about goldbacking, when the ratio can be changed at the whim? This is about as useless, as GLD.
So you think gold is useless. GLD can be redeemed for physical gold. Interesting.
Damnit, the downvote button isn't working.
You don't know how the Euro is built or the dollar. Commercial banks in Europe are the dollars problem.
The Euro is expalined here
http://freegoldobserver.blogspot.com/
"How the euro is built or the dollar" is completely irrelevant.
If the euro breaks up because the EMU breaks up, then that makes it kinda hard to use as a reserve currency, right? I mean, how can something be the reserve currency, when it no longer exists?
Next, hypothetically assuming that the EMU can be kept together in the longterm, by a massive money printing spree, then... uh, i dunno, would that perhaps result in massive devaluation DESPITE the gold backing? If yes, how is that any better than what the dollar is in the current century?
See, now shutup.
"The euro cannot even sustain itself WITH moneyprinting,"
How much have they printed versus the US? Please cite your sources.
And the down button works just fine on your posts.
Cheers
"The euro cannot even sustain itself WITH moneyprinting,"
Learn to read, retard. The euro cannot do that. That conclusion does not requier that they attempt to do so (even though, they HAVE recently ramped up the printing presses).
Learn to write, shit stain.
shocking pictures show one demonstrator defecating on a POLICE CAR
Look some guy is taking a Rynak on that police car.
He's not pooping, he's polishing, helping out. Great American patriot.
yea I saw the picture. Could have been staged. But scrolling down there was a picture of Keith Oberman at the protest giving his support. I thought he was a govt schill proclaiming TBTF lies on tv. a propogantist if you will. Or was I mistaken?
How do you suggest the Euro currency will no longer exist ? Even hyperiflated currencies still carry the same name. Do you think Europe will just do away with money or what ?
Ben, is that you ?
Well great, that is sophism defined. "Hey, it may not even be backed anymore by what now is called the EMU or warped in some weird way.... but it may still have the same name, so i'm right!"
head @ wall
Buttons don't work on posts whose first lines are italicized.
Thank you for the info.
This is just not true. This is the second time I've seen this and gone back to up the post. No problem.
Of course you can redeem GLD for physical gold.
If you are an Authorized Participant with a Basket of 100,000 shares (currently ~ $15M or so), or as an individual investor, you have to make arrangements with your broker.
Helps to look at FAQs at www.spdrgoldshares.com/sites/us/faqs/ to get the answer, but that takes time, eh?
It's been said before: gold isn't useless, GLD is. Asshat.
At least "Freespeaker" got some semi-responsive answers. The most significant one was:
"DNB’s physical gold holdings function as the ultimate reserve and anchor of trust in times of financial crisis."
One wonders if the US has any anchor of trust at all? Doubtful in the extreme. The question seems to be, now that it is clear to everyone that the US cannot be trusted, what's next?
Beer is better than Obama because beer isn't promoted on National Public Radio.
I bet all the gold is gone, or it has been 100% leased out, proceeds of which is invested in AA-rated U.S. Treasuries yielding under 2%.
People would rather have paper vs. things now that we are in a deflation environment, even though they "jawbone" about still having adequate gold for "diversification".
Until some central bank sacks up and demands 100% physical gold as their primary store of value, the gold market will continue to be controlled by paper pushers at the COMEX.
I'm amazed that a central bank of a small country hasn't dumped everything and used the money to buy 100% gold for its liquid reserves.
Until that happens, paper shorting will continue to drive the gold price, not physical supply/demand.
Who cracked robottraders account? You're supposed to send the message with sophistic means and bullshit, not with "80% truths".
robo,
i think your starting to sound like, like a....
GOLD BUG!
p.s. robo, are you going green again?
You have reached the office of the President of the United States. President Obama is either away from his desk or not in the Oval Office at this time. At the tone, please leave your name, your telephone number, the size of the bailout or earmark that you are seeking and the aggregate dollar amount of your campaign donations to date. Beep.
There's gonna be a knock, knock, knocking at your 3 a.m. front door.
Yoo hoo, Mr. Cheerie! We'd like to talk to you! Wakie wakie, time for your water-boarding!
Just remember... you're not ACTUALLY drowning, it just feels like it.
Don't forget the golden rule: He who has the gold, rules.
Try asking the same questions about US gold reserves........................... crickets.
i would ask how much of the gold at ft. knox ( which was leased out under president clinton), is now in the hands of the Bank of International Settlements?
Does it really matter? Tungsten prices over the last year have gone from $260 to $460.
Too bad it's per mtu, not 1/4 oz....
now that would be justice....
LOL
+1 to UP!
Sometimes I catch a good one. After all, I was a 12B20, and I still have all my fingers....
glad to see ya made it back in one piece,sgt.
we really liked and thought very highly of our engineers
hell, they were in front of our 19D's
thank you for your service to our country...
I was able to ETS before inhaling any DU in the sandbox. They recalled me a year and a half later, and the Doc said I wasn't able to "play Cowboys and Indians in the Sandbox." His words. Running and rucking KoleKole Pass killed my lower body.
But shaking the CG's windows with sympathetic detonations and lighting elephant grass on fire was pretty fun, as was flippin' the bird to Bosnian Po-Po's while speeding in a HMMWV....
sorry dbl post
Clearly, the most interesting part is twice admitting to being in competition with other CBs regarding gold ownership. That ancient relic Bernanke so famously said was held by central banks for "tradition". Sure, I've got a few hundred billion to blow on a little tradition as well.
Ironically, it doesn't matter how much of the US's 8,133 tons still exist IF 1) All federal reserve notes are redeemable for gold at a price fixed at today's market, and 2) The US doesn't debase the currency so that it is advantageous to take them up on their offer to redeem.
As long as 1 & 2 are not in place, then you're damn right. We need a very detailed accounting.
1. Did the Dutch Central Bank (DNB) loan part of their gold?
If yes, how much and to whom?
No. DNB has informed me that they have stopped loaning out gold as of 2008.
this is what lawyers call "hearsay": the respondent has no direct knowledge of wtf happened, but he has "heard" that "they stopped loaning out gold as of 2008."
basically, everything seems pretty much a big fuking secret, here
imagine that, BiCheZ!
Check this: http://www.gold.org/government_affairs/reserve_asset_management/central_bank_gold_agreements/
Thanks.
It reminds me of a case where the Dutch SEC objected to an overweight accumulation of gold in a pensionfund.....and another one too.
Full Disclosure:
Long and short of it is that by answering/not answering the questions (take your pick, half empty/half full) they ain't got any more fucking gold than Brad Meltzer's Fort Knox.
Dutch central bankster Nout Wellink (CFR member and Bilderberger) always said to his colleagues:
“There are two thing you can lie about as central banker, gold and interest rates.”
Greenspan in 1998, before Congress:
"central banks stand ready to LEASE GOLD in increasing quantities, should its price rise."
http://www.federalreserve.gov/boarddocs/testimony/1998/19980724.htm
William S. White June stipulated in 2005 ( head of the Monetary and Economic Department of the Bank of International Settlements in Basel ):
"One of the five main purposes of central bank cooperation is the provision of international credits and joint efforts to influence asset prices – especially gold and foreign exchange – in circumstances where this might be thoughtful."
Australian Central Bank 2003:
"Foreign currency reserves and gold are held primarily to support intervention in the foreign exchange markets!"
Jim Rickards about Gold Manipulation:
“We call it market manipulation the central banks simply call it policy.”
The Netherlands: Big Banks Do Not Implement Saving Rate Increasments , They Keep it Low (google trans from Dutch) http://tinyurl.com/62k2ocl
ORG: Grootbanken verhogen spaarrente niet http://mijngeld.blog.nl/nieuws/2011/10/07/grootbanken-verhogen-spaarrente-niet
The Netherlands: Houses Cheaper Again (google trans from Dutch) http://tinyurl.com/6hv6o8r
During the past quarter, the average price of property sold declined by 1.1%, compared to the previous quarter .
ORG: NVM: woningen opnieuw goedkoper http://nieuws.nvm.nl/actual/oktober_2011/nvm_woningen_opnieuw_goedkoper.aspx
Alan Blinder, former Vice Chairman of the Federal Reserve
Why do most people assume that gold loans are physical? The fact that the put gold and gold loans on the same line is a giveaway: they aren't loaning phyiscal gold, they are loaning paper and the borrower is selling the paper into the market.
Sense on ZH. Must be the endtimes. :P
Always excellent Pater Tenebrarum (Acting man) puts the boots to Mark Williams and 'Gold Bugs Beware, the Bubble will Burst'
Also throws Nadler under the bus in the same swipe
There it is again, the unsubstantiated assertion that the bull market is a 'bubble'. Apart from that, it is incorrect that it has 'lasted three times as long as the last one'. The man has apparently not even looked at a chart. The 1970's bull market lasted ten years and gained nearly 2,500%. The current one has lasted ten years to date as well, but has so far only gained 540%.
Furthermore, there have been substantial corrections in the course of the present bull market, although it is true that gold has ultimately gained every single year since the year 2000 (that obviously doesn't make it a bad investment). It is of course possible, even likely, that there will be a down year at some point. So what? As to the reasoning of the few investors holding gold (only 0.8% of the world's financial assets are invested in gold, and only an estimated 0.2% of all institutional investment assets are invested in gold or gold stocks, which is basically a rounding error), their reasoning has been and continues to be 100% correct – Williams makes it sound as though that were not so, but obviously it actually is so.
http://www.acting-man.com/?p=10750#more-10750
I wish this site had a "delete comment" feature.
Update:
The website of 'De Nederlandsche Bank' (Dutch central bank) is offline!!
www.dnb.nl
No, it`s not.
i emailed similar questions to the bank of england a few months ago. it took them a week to answer and their answers were similarly evasive compared to these, but i think it's a good idea to do this, even at an individual level. the more they see that people are aware of the gold price manipulation scheme, the greater the pressure on them to stop. given that in the UK there is no political party that even talks about closing the central bank (even nigel farrage/UKIP are happy with the existing central bank system), i can't see any better option than expressing an opinion direct to the central bank.
Tulips, anyone?
"promote efficient price discovery" - priceless.
bernanke didn't call it barbarous. he called it 'tradition'. tradition, tradition, tradition....to quote fiddler on the roof. it was another who called it barbaric. i think it was roubini.
http://quotationsbook.com/quote/44513/
According to this, it was Keynes.
This image is found on the PBS.org website companion for the television documentary America Rebuilds under the sectionUncovering Property. The page, entitled A Treasure in Silver and Gold, describes the vault as two levels of 3,000 square feet each. See the source for the full-sized image. The page credits images to Leslie E. Robertson and Associates."Missing Gold Precious Metals in WTC 4 Vault: Only a Fraction Recovered?
The basement of 4 World Trade Center housed vaults used to store gold and silver bullion. Published articles about precious metals recovered from the World Trade Center ruins in the aftermath of the attack mention less than $300 million worth of gold. All such reports appear to refer to a removal operation conducted in late October of 2001. On Nov. 1, Mayor Rudolph Giuliani announced that "more than $230 million" worth of gold and silver bars that had been stored in a bomb-proof vault had been recovered. A New York Times article contained:
Two Brinks trucks were at ground zero on Wednesday to start hauling away the $200 million in gold and silver that the Bank of Nova Scotia had stored in a vault under the trade center ... A team of 30 firefighters and police officers are helping to move the metals, a task that can be measured practically down to the flake but that has been rounded off at 379,036 ounces of gold and 29,942,619 ounces of silver .. 1Reports describing the contents of the vaults before the attack suggest that nearly $1 billion in precious metals was stored in the vaults. A figure of $650 million in a National Real Estate Investor article published after the attack is apparently based on pre-attack reports.
Unknown to most people at the time, $650 million in gold and silver was being kept in a special vault four floors beneath Four World Trade Center. 2An article in the TimesOnline gives the following rundown of precious metals that were being stored in the WTC vault belonging to Comex. 3
The TimesOnline article is not clear as to whether the $200 million in gold reported by the Bank of Nova Scotia was part of the $220 million in gold held by Comex for clients. If so, the total is $750 million; otherwise $950 million.
There appear to be no reports of precious metals discovered between November of 2001 and the completion of excavation several months later. Assuming that the above reports described the value of precious metals in the vaulst before the attack, and that the $230 million mentioned by Giuliani represented the approxmiate value of metals recovered, it would seem that at least the better part of a billion dollars worth of precious metals went missing. (It is not plausible, of course, that whatever destroyed the towers vaporized gold and silver, which are dense, inert metals that are extremely unlikely to participate in chemical reactions with other materials.)
"An article in The Sierra Times suggests that gold was recovered from two trucks in a tunnel under 5 World Trade Center, giving rise to suspicions that the trucks were being used to remove the gold from the vaults before the South Tower fell. 4 However, this report may have been based on an erroneous reading of other reports that describe the removal of crushed vehicles from a tunnel under 5 WTC in order to gain access to the vaults under 4 WTC to remove their contents. 5
Why is there this huge discrepancy between the value of gold and silver reported recovered, and the value reported to have been stored in the vaults? There are a number of possible explanations, from outright theft using the attack as cover, to insurance fraud. Until there is a genuine investigation that probes all the relevant facts and circumstances surrounding the attack, we can only speculate."
http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/gold.html
Excellent!
"...why would DNB want to align its gold holdings with other central banks’ holdings?..."
Doesn't even make sense, does it? I mean are they THAT submissive and controlled?
Maybe the Faithful Order of Teutonic Tribes in Upper Silesia should pay the DNB submissives a visit and relieve them of their barbaric relics?
Hey brother can you spare an ounce?
Sizing up the gold market ( Financial Times 9 September 2011 )
http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/eb342ad4-daba-11e0-a58b-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1aJW83yt2
The London Bullion Market has carried out a study quantifying the size of the over the counter gold market in London
10.9 Billion ounces of Gold worth 15.200 Billion USD changed hands in the first quarter of 2011 , 10 times what is implied by clearing statistics. The vast majority approx 90 % of this was in the Spot market .
The daily turnover in the London Bullion Market was on average 240 Billion USD higher than the global daily turnover of any currency pair except USD/EUR , USD / Yen , USD / GBP and USD / AUD . The daily currency turnover of USD / CHF for ex is 168 Billion USD
The statements by the Dutch Central bank are therefore a serious understatement of the actual trading volume ( and therefore importance ) of GOLD which is traded more than 200 times more than the paltry figures mentioned by The Dutch Bank
According to the Financial Times ( Sept 2011 ) the daily turnover of GOLD in London ( LBM ) is approx and on average 240 Billion USD which is more than the daily turnover of the currency pair USD / CHF . The quarterly over the counter turn-over is approx 10.9 Billion Ounces of Gold worth approx 15,200 Billion USD , 90 % of this in the Spot market. This 200 times bigger market than stated by the Gouvernor of the Dutch Central Bank and underlines the argument that physical Gold is a major factor on the Global Financial Scene !
Question —Answer—Comment ?
Comment=dumb questions already answered!
Comments Vrijspreker: Why would DNB want to align its gold holdings with other central banks’ holdings? Is there a coordinated central policy amongst all central banks? Are the recent gold purchases by developing countries’ central banks not conflicting with this international policy. Could you outline the details of this policy?
Bonker: Since 1991, 1,100 tons of gold have been sold. Back then we were instructed that DNB held relatively too much gold compared to other central banks. We decided to align our reserve amount with the "Don't hold gold" golden policy, along with the other large, important gold owning countries.
Comments Vrijspreker: Again, why align the gold holdings with that of other central banks? What exactly is the purpose of that policy?
Bonker: Buyers in developing economies show strongly growing official gold reserves. There is also a wide group of countries that have been told "Sold gold" is the best. The past decade, many have followed policy, including France, Spain, UK and Switzerland! Do I have to spell it out for you: P-O-L-I-C, ah, never mind.
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