European Finance Ministers Driven To Despair As Reality Returns

Tyler Durden's picture

The release of the Troika report (stating the what-we-all-know that is much larger haircuts will be needed for any type of debt sustainability) seemed to bring events this weekend in Europe to an early halt, according to SudDeutsche. As the sheer mathematical certainty of the event horizon that is Europe these days is slammed at light speed into the foreheads of the European cognoscenti, we finally see some actual frustration, foot-stomping, and 'throw-your-teddy-bear-out-of-the-pram'-ness. The Telegraph reports on some choice turns-of-phrase among the leading players, our favorite being:

"It was grim. The worst mood I have ever seen, a complete mess," said one eurozone finance minister.

But it only got better from there, with several of the major movers feeling the need to express their frustration (and what is German for Schadenfreude?) at the lunacy of what SudDeutsche reports was in the Troika debt sustainability report (via Google Translate).

The numbers that the Troika on Friday evening on the debt situation in Greece is presented, have altered the agenda of the Euro-Finance completely. Really wanted the department heads to advise [if] they need to convince the country's private creditors to agree on a bigger discount on the bonds held by them, than the previously planned 21 percent.

 

But the "if" was suddenly a "how high?". Because the inspectors of the Greek lender describe in their "debt sustainability report," a scenario that far surpasses any fears. The country needs even under "normal" conditions, so if everything goes as planned with the reforming and saving, at least 252 billion euros , by 2020 to get back on its feet.

 

If the economy collapses further, state enterprises can not be privatized as hoped, nor do the reforms [produce the] € 444 billion needed to [please] the inspectors. So it is suddenly clear: the euro rescue fund EFSF is hardly sufficient for more countries to save, and his successor, the latest from 2013 operational ESM also not good.

 

...

 

 

"It is clear that a substantial debt cut is necessary," however, said Swedish Finance Minister Anders Borg....

 

The Exchequer George Osborne sharply criticized the actions of the euro partners: "The crisis in the euro-zone causes major damage in many European economies, including Britain," he shouted in Brussels, adding: "We have had enough of short-term measures, it enough, paving draufzukleben that bring us through the next few weeks. " Europe must tackle the causes of the crisis. Used to be a comprehensive and lasting solution to the crisis, so that growth in Europe could begin rising again.

 

... The Luxembourg Foreign Minister Jean Asselborn announced immediately to resist. "What we need now is rest and no whip," he said.

 

A stronger economic cooperation is also possible on the basis of existing treaties. "It is important that we do not open another front," said Asselborn. "It can not be that domestic political considerations of even the greatest country outweigh everything."

It was clear that the reality of the size of loan required to 'solve' Greece alone will likely leave the cupboard bare:

Jan Kees de Jager, the Dutch finance minister, told colleagues: "We've got to get real. People are talking about new defences but with one gulp the whole €440 billion could be gone, leaving the eurozone with no protection at all."

Schaeuble-to-Everyone:

According to insiders, Wolfgang Schaeuble, Germany's finance minister, could not resist taking an "I told you so" approach - he had been, after all, the first to call for an "orderly" default for Greece 18 months ago, at a time when the cost of such a move was less than one third of the price today.

"Schaeuble is a man who does not mince his words, whose reputation for harshness and arrogance is well earned. He was, frankly, unbearable," said one diplomat.

And Baroin (France) to IMF swiftly followed by Lagarde (France/IMF)'s slapdown:

Francois Baroin, the young and inexperienced French finance minister,
attempted to hit back, complaining that the IMF's default medicine would hit
France the hardest
; the country's banks are highly exposed and could
threaten its "untouchable" AAA rating.

 

But Mrs Lagarde, who had held his post until taking up the IMF job this
summer, "shut him up" by brandishing the report and pointing to it
its detailed figures. "She really slapped him down
- and in perfect
English too, a language he cannot speak," said a diplomat.

We suspect many of the attendees (finance ministers) have not actually spoken to one another, read any serious research, or even attempted to comprehend the whole-versus-the-single sub-optimal decisions they face (until very recently) as their voluminous outbursts were incredible:

 

"Their shouting could be heard down the corridor in the concert hall where an orchestra was about to play the EU's anthem, Ode to Joy," said an incredulous EU official.

 

It did not stop there as the pointlessness of the meeting was highlighted as it became increasingly clear that the good old Franco-German comradeship may be fraying at the core and at the edges and without them.

Finance ministers - including George Osborne, the Chancellor - expressed frustration on Saturday that their emergency meeting could take no decisions of substance until Mrs Merkel and Mr Sarkozy had buried the hatchet.

 

"This Ecofin meeting has been reduced to an academic seminar, an exercise with absolutely no purpose," complained one finance minister.  complained one finance minister.

For those expecting any solution that is more than a simple kick-the-can hold-your-breath for the final solution, we suggest hedges asap on Sunday night as it is crystal clear that nothing of substance will be created soon and furthermore, we wonder whether this is some elaborate global game to force the Fed to rescue everyone by flooding it with greenbacks.

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Cabreado's picture

Few things are more pathetic, nor more dangerous, than a gaggle of Narcissists in a state of depression.

sqz's picture

"Their shouting could be heard down the corridor in the concert hall where an orchestra was about to play the EU's anthem, Ode to Joy," said an incredulous EU official.

lol

Sounds like the political pressure is being turned on now because they've run out of excuses straight from the horses mouth.

France is going to start demanding ECB printing as they realise there's no way anyone, even the German taxpayer can bailout the world.

Germany is going to hopefully hold the line at "insolvent default first or you get nothing because we can leave the Euro any time, but even for us these experiments are starting to get expensive, so decide now!".

UK wants them to do anything, just sort it out, even if it means a loss on official creditors (including their contribution), quite likely.

Rest of EU probably siding with Germany as long as they are not one of the BIGPIS (Belgium, Ireland, Greece, Portgugal, Italy, Spain) or France.

 

jm's picture

France: desperation clear now that the thin veneer of charm wears thin.

Germany:  stubborn idealists that can't see the train coming even as they lay on the track for a quick nap.

And the practical Brits know its hopeless for these freaks across the channel so they willl down some Port and hope for the best.

 

Motley Fool's picture

Good point.

The hourglass seems to be running empty.

strannick's picture

One European Parliament needing dramatic swift action is an improbability. A bunch of them together being required to act decisively? A tradi-comedic farce to be watched from the sideline. I'll just play my lottery numbers instead, and take my cash out of the bank. 

i-dog's picture

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lW4J1e2WW68

I highly recommend this particular video by David Icke to everyone here -- irrespective of what you think of him -- and not to learn anything you don't know already but to get your thinking straight and focused on the central issues [pun intended]!

His message:

  1. The answer to too much debt is not ... more debt!
     
  2. The answer to failed centralised government is not ... more centralised government!

He just doesn't go far enough into explaining that taking individual control back from the central planners should, by definition, mean strengthening local community control over local community issues and lifestyles. SECEDE NOW!!

Dismantling the Brussels dictatorship and taking the EU back to individual sovereign states does not have to mean that some of the good things of mutual cooperation need also to be thrown away! For example, free movement between states doesn't need to be taken away. Treaties between all the states can still be signed for those specific purposes (but not for the whole fucking shooting match!). SECEDE NOW!!

Similarly, dismantling the Washington dictatorship and taking the USA back to individual sovereign states does not have to mean that free trade and movement between the states will be lost, or that the common identity of "The United States of America" need be lost. Treaties can still be signed between all the states for those specific purposes ... without needing a central planning bureaucracy snuffling truffles on the banks of the Potomac to manage it!! The original Articles of Confederation provided a good framework, but got subverted almost immediately into a Constitution that led back to centralised control from Europe! SECEDE NOW!!

David Icke is not stupid ... and he knows exactly who is behind the curtain (and it's not lizards!). But he is afraid to name them and always redirects to the bogeymen of the bankers and corporations on the right and the whipping boys on the left (Rothschild, Soros, etc). But, at the end of the day, it doesn't matter who created the problem: What matters is that we take back control from the central planners, whoever they may be, and fix the problem! SECEDE NOW!!

Motley Fool's picture

I don't. His economic understanding is quite superficial, and he mixes truth with lies, though it seems to be out of ignorance rather than malice.

i-dog's picture

He's not an economist, and he's never (to my knowledge) shown himself to be a free-marketeer.

All media pundits have an agenda, and he's no exception ... they need funding, backing and the protection of a group to be able to continue to spread their own messages. But in this particular video, he just states the obvious in a cogent and succinct presentation - with very little banging of his own drum.

Motley Fool's picture

Sure, he states the 'obvious'. That is part of my issue, since some of the obvious is obviously wrong.

But. For the sheep at OWS, this is a decent introduction to the topic I suppose.

Mauibrad's picture

Would really like to see these guys fail.

jm's picture

If you thought about what their failure will mean, you wouldn't say that.

i-dog's picture

OWS and the Tea Party are just fighting over who should hold the gun!

(Ooops ... That should get me junks from both sides! I could strike out for MDB's record!)

infinity8's picture

so who do you support?

i-dog's picture

I support my family, my local community and anyone who voluntarily wishes to join either. Beyond that, I'll volunteer my support to any larger group that benefits my family and my local community so long as I can voluntarily withdraw if they fail to meet any of the conditions we originally agreed on.

Since, by definition, political parties and organised protest movements pander to many groups with conflicting interests, I don't support any of them. They are guaranteed to break any promises (ie. social contracts) they make.

Hdawg's picture

A supporter of family and local commmunity = enemy of the state...as we all should be.

AldousHuxley's picture

For Greece to return to a sustainable debt load of 60% of GDP, the nominal value of its bonds needs to be cut by 64%, in line with the current market price at 36% of face value

UP Forester's picture

You're shit doesn't stink less the more you post it....

Just sayin'.

UP Forester's picture

OK, OK, you win.  You have the exclusive rights to post both in bold and blue.

And here's a twist on your rants:  What if the divide-and-conquer owners of the media are deliberately focusing on the "originators" of OWS, and selecting the views of blogs and "useful idiot" protesters to further their goal, but are starting to lose control?

In other words, if they built the foundation, does that mean we can't change the building plans before their "planks" are laid down?

Quixotic_Not's picture

Go ask Matt Taibbi, isn't he your brilliant progressive/socialist prophet du jour?

I mean, you don't need anything that we stupid Americans have done, what we would think or say...you're just gonna rip out the foundation and burn the house down anyways, right?

Don't piss on my back and tell me it's raining Mr. OWS/Adbuster Op...get on with the next stage in the permanent revolution already!

C'mon, I double dog dare you!!!

UP Forester's picture

I took my oath 12 years ago.

And this is getting skinny....

JW n FL's picture

 

 

Quixotic_Not

C'mon, I double dog dare you!!!

Do you enjoy bashing those truly kind little progressives? does it make your ego swell with pride knowing that you jumped up and down on some lil christian who really deep down believes that thier Love can conquer your hate?

I will tell you this mrs. double dick your fat hariy wife in the ass twice before I do the same to you daughters.. they are not the problem, they are not the ones that will be paying for your scalp(s).

Now, EVERYONE here knows exactly who I am.. so you could even try to sneak up on me.. like the coward you are (i know from the foes YOU! choose).

I would happily be your huckleberry BITCH!

so, mrs. mouthy.. balls in your court.

Lord Welligton's picture

They both get to hold guns.

The Elite get to hold all of the property.

monkeys.pick.bottoms's picture

I generally like what you say. Not here, though. I think it does not matter who is protesting (though it's to me an unfair generalisation to call them all socialists, at least one guy is not) - as long as someone is generating heat. I hate communism but I would march with communists against fascism any day.

the one guy (I'm sure there are more of such people out there):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKqP6v_BoV4

Temporalist's picture

Listen to the comments in the video.  Many people realize capitalism is not the problem at OWS and I think at this point the "socialists" are the minority.  People of all stripes are there don't be sold on one person's opinion.

Peter Schiff at OWS:

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/17999453

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/18000013

duo's picture

as a 99% er that has to work during the day, is it unethical to give someone $100 and a sign to go protest on my behalf?

Oh regional Indian's picture

hah! Nice question for the ethicists out there.

Or that should peobably read like Ethicysts, given where we are as a world today.

And the EU (the political class at least), for what they did to Libya....... I pray this entire "Union" implodes into it's natural formation.

Ode to Grief...

Peace, in Pieces

ORI

 

Temporalist's picture

What if I told you I was there every day since the beginning on your behalf?  Where can I send my bill to you?

duo's picture

you have to make your own sign, then.  Something witty, like "If I go to the bank to get beaten up by the police, should I go to the police station to cash this check?"

AldousHuxley's picture

time to pull the trigger boys and girls

 

behind all the pomp and circumstance, the elite aren't worth shit.

derek_vineyard's picture

Enuf of this crappola...when is DWTS on?

Bendromeda Strain's picture

Maybe they will dance to "Owed to Joy"

Quixotic_Not's picture

Behind OWS? Meet the Marxist spawn of Frances Fox Piven who wants a militant revolution

The current meme among the media elites is that the Occupy Wall Street protests are an organic and spontaneous movement created by college-aged students who are frustrated with the cost of student loans, housing, health care and overall corporate greed.

If that were true I’d like to state the obvious, that behind every student is a teacher.

Meet Professor John Asimakopoulos (for purposes of this article we’ll call him Dr. John). He is an associate professor of sociology at the City University of New York-Bronx where he works beside Marxist revolutionary Frances Fox Piven, the quickly aging and fragile grandmother who is best known for being one-half of the Cloward and Piven strategy. Dr. John has also been published alongside other famous Marxists intellectuals such as Howard Zinn, Ward Churchill, and Bill Ayers, advisor to/lifelong friend of/acquaintance of/not associated with President Obama. Among Dr John’s 2,000+ Facebook friends are Wade Radthke from ACORN, Cindy Sheehan, an anti-war activist, and Lisa Fithian, one of the leading organizers of the Occupy Wall Street movement.

OWS: The Perestroika Deception Develops a Face

In recent weeks, every American has watched with morbid curiosity as swarms of hate-filled, sputtering communist loons and Hippie-wannabees have taken to the streets, shutting down cities and leaving a path of destruction wherever they go.  Although many Americans disagree with the stated agenda of these radicals, most think them harmless, dismissing their acts as pathetic attempts to resurrect the failed social movements of the sixties.

But this group of determined radicals is not to be laughed at.  Lisa Fithian, the primary OWS organizer, is an unrepentant communist and proponent of government and economic destabilization as a means of achieving totalitarian centralization along communist lines.  Writing for a socialist rag, Fithian once stated, “I have no issue with property destruction…We’re in a society where property is idolized, so a lot of people don’t get it yet that it doesn’t really matter.”

While this should shock Americans (and would, if the facts were being reported) this is nothing new.  This is just the latest tactic in a long-term strategy that has been quietly moving forward for decade...

Dissecting the OWS List of Demands

Nassim Taleb: "OWS Second Generation Marxist Class Struggle"

OWS Is Almost Entirely Socialist/Marxist

terryfuckwit's picture

quixotic certainly not...just a plain vanilla nailed to your narrow minded left/right dogma agenda..ows are fighting the socialist/fascist(take your pick) 1% of lying bastard thieves who have destroyed our economy. the 1% and lying bastard thieves terninology understood by all... carry on rantin quixotic but no one is interested in your historically irrelevent labeling structures . a lying bastard thief is exactly that..right / left, socialist or fascist this is your ancient tribalism you are using,, as you quite singularly fail to muddy the waters and help us crystalise the reality...

Bendromeda Strain's picture

Back to your drum circle, Terry. You may wish to ascribe such universal goodwill to OWS, but anyone who looks beyond the MSM's cautious fawning can see that the "99%" is fractious and partitioned, yet overwhelmingly Marxist the longer it goes on. Oh, and the Assembly has decreed that you drummers are not getting paid.

Segestan's picture

A large number of those persons who took their business to China , and have a controlling interest in the Fed are Socialist/Communist. Freedom means free labor to some.

AnAnonymous's picture

A large number of those persons who took their business to China , and have a controlling interest in the Fed are Socialist/Communist. Freedom means free labor to some.
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Ummmmmmmm. It is funny how US citizens like to segment themselves into smaller groups to try to deflect from the point they are US citizens.

Why point at them as Socialist/Communist when a better generality exists and encompasses all people who share that idea.

Freedom means free labour to some works for US citizens, no matter they are socialist, now defunct communist or capitalist.

US citizens think freedom means free labour for some. That is why they maintained slavery when they started their 'free' nation.

US citizens are, useless to pick on various subsets of US citizens. US citizens can come in all kinds, capitalist, socialist, christian, muslim, atheist, white people, negroes, etc...
It does not matter.

What matters is US citizenism.

gillimus's picture

Your groovy babble is hypnotic, but at least you return to a central point -- US citizenism.

 

By being mad that we think we're better than you, you only prove our point.  If you were better than us, you wouldn't care what we thought, which means you're not better than us, which makes us better than you.

 

Sorry to break it down like that, but keep up with the posting.  You're obviously intelligent, well-read, and opinionated.

AnAnonymous's picture

By being mad that we think we're better than you, you only prove our point. If you were better than us, you wouldn't care what we thought, which means you're not better than us, which makes us better than you.

/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

This is stupid. I admit, it is what you expect from US cheap propaganda...

US citizens think everything in terms of inequality.

But one trying to know what a cat thought or even if cats think mean nothing in terms of better than the cat or anything.

Even better, who knows if cats care about what most human beings think (including US citizens)

Following the same line of reasoning, who is better? Cats or human beings?

US citizenism has totally ruined any attempt to think. The obsession of US citizens to turn tables so they are always shown in the good lights makes it impossible for them to admit facts and leads to disastrous thought processes.

gillimus's picture

Look, I avoid most beefs, and I respect your right to have an opinion.  My point is this: Your posts all blame America and American citizens, but you never offer a solution.  

 

Here's one: government transparency.  If I could go online and access my senator's schedule, who contributed to his campaign, and his voting record I would be able to make a more informed decision about whether I want him to represent me.  If I were an elected official, I would want my constituents to have an accounting of my efforts on their behalf.  As a member of the "US citizenism" I live in the freest, wealthiest, best-fed country in the solar system.  Which makes me better than you.

andrewp111's picture

Failure would create great buying opportinities. Can you say "pennies on the Euro"? Of course you need to keep your own money safe first in US Government obligations, and find a way to buy Euro denominated assets at a time when all EU counterparties are suspect and could vanish at any moment. The last one is not trrivial.

Chappaquiddick's picture

Why beat about the bush? - He's a cunt.  His input is about boosting his profile and making some coin.  Lets hope the TSA does its job and the next report we get from Dave is from inside a cell at Guantanamo.    

Chappaquiddick's picture

David Icke - are you fucking kidding me????!!!!

He is an absolute empty vessel with nothing new to add.  He's come late to this issue and has simply jumped on the band waggon.  This contains nothing new - NOTHING.

He is entitled to an opinion as are we all BUT FOR FUCKS SAKE dont take what this muppet has to say as an educated or an informed position - at best he's a twat at worst he is pied-piper.

Now stop lowering the tone. 

Transformer's picture

So is this it?  Are we staring into the void? Is that a huge drop off right ahead of us there?

 

aahhhh, not possible.  They'll figure out a way to make it last at least another week.  For sure.