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"The European Financial System Is Finished" In Quotes
When it comes to European bureaucrats, the easiest way to determine if they are lying is whether or not their mouths are open. Yet there are those rare occasions in which even the most hardened of liars let one slip. The Economic Collapse, always the master of compiling impactful bulletins, has prepared a list of just such "slip" quotes that "are absolutely shocking. In Europe they openly admit that the financial system is dying, that the euro is in danger of not surviving and that the EU does not work in its present form." In other words, ignore the ceaseless headlines of promises that all shall be well. Because it won't. Here is all you need to know about the imminent end of the Eurozone, straight from the horses' mouths.
From the Economic Collapse:
The following are 20 quotes from European leaders that prove that they know that the financial system in Europe is doomed....
#1 Polish finance minister Jacek Rostowski: "European elites, including German elites, must decide if they want the euro to survive - even at a high price - or not. If not, we should prepare for a controlled dismantling of the currency zone."
#2 Stephane Deo, Paul Donovan, and Larry Hatheway of Swiss banking giant UBS: "Under the current structure and with the current membership, the euro does not work. Either the current structure will have to change, or the current membership will have to change."
#3 EU President Herman Van Rompuy: "The euro has never had the infrastructure that it requires."
#4 German President Christian Wulff: "I regard the huge buy-up of bonds of individual states by the ECB as legally and politically questionable. Article 123 of the Treaty on the EU’s workings prohibits the ECB from directly purchasing debt instruments, in order to safeguard the central bank’s independence"
#5 Deutsche Bank CEO Josef Ackerman: "It is an open secret that numerous European banks would not survive having to revalue sovereign debt held on the banking book at market levels."
#6 ECB President Jean-Claude Trichet: "We are experiencing very demanding times"
#7 International Monetary Fund Managing Director Christine Lagarde: "Developments this summer have indicated we are in a dangerous new phase"
#8 Prince Hermann Otto zu Solms-Hohensolms-Lich, the Bundestag's Deputy President: "We must consider whether it would not be better for the currency union and for Greece itself to go for debt restructuring and an exit from the euro"
#9 Alastair Newton, a strategist for Nomura Securities in London: "We believe that we are just about to enter a critical period for the eurozone and that the threat of some sort of break-up between now and year-end is greater than it has been at any time since the start of the crisis"
#10 Former German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder: "The current crisis makes it relentlessly clear that we cannot have a common currency zone without a common fiscal, economic and social policy"
#11 Bank of England Governor Mervyn King: "Dealing with a banking crisis was difficult enough, but at least there were public-sector balance sheets on to which the problems could be moved. Once you move into sovereign debt, there is no answer; there's no backstop."
#12 George Soros: "We are on the verge of an economic collapse which starts, let's say, in Greece. The financial system remains extremely vulnerable."
#13 German Chancellor Angela Merkel: "The current crisis facing the euro is the biggest test Europe has faced for decades, even since the Treaty of Rome was signed in 1957."
#14 Stephane Deo, Paul Donovan, and Larry Hatheway of Swiss banking giant UBS: "Member states would be economically better off if they had never joined. European monetary union was generally mis-sold to the population of the Europe."
#15 Professor Giacomo Vaciago of Milan's Catholic University: "It's clear that the euro has virtually failed over the last ten years, even if you are not supposed to say that."
#16 EU President Herman Van Rompuy: "We’re in a survival crisis. We all have to work together in order to survive with the euro zone, because if we don’t survive with the euro zone we will not survive with the European Union."
#17 German Chancellor Angela Merkel: "If the euro fails, then Europe fails."
#18 Deutsche Bank CEO Josef Ackerman: "All this reminds one of the autumn of 2008"
#19 International Monetary Fund Managing Director Christine Lagarde: "There has been a clear crisis of confidence that has seriously aggravated the situation. Measures need to be taken to ensure that this vicious circle is broken"
#20 German Chancellor Angela Merkel: "The euro is in danger ... If we don't deal with this danger, then the consequences for us in Europe are incalculable."
Most of the individuals quoted above desperately want to save the euro. They are not going to go down without a fight. The overwhelming consensus among the political and financial elite in Europe is that increased European integration in Europe is the answer.
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I have never seen the Swiss deciding on anything that was not in their interest.
Either it is peg-unpeg-peg, or they know that something is in the works that will make the Euro survive as a more-or-less credible reserve currency. European CB's hold a lot of gold.
This is about making the CHF more affordable to their debtors in order to save Swiss exports which are largely financial loans outside of the country. These loans have payment terms in CHF which has made it increasingly more expensive for their Euro debtors pushing them closer to nonpayment.
Can't the Euroland just get along?
(!)
End that shit!
I like this one.... "European monetary union was generally mis-sold to the population of the Europe." Isn't that the argument that the FHFA just used? So...who does everybody sue here? Who was it that sold them that "shitty deal"? LMAO
Our politicians. We (dutch) got a bad deal, since our previous currency (guilder) was at least 10% undervalued. At that moment in time politcal murder took care of the opposition. And yes, the Netherlands was very close to revolt. We got a bunch of neo-cons, who copied the USA scare tactics, and let some crazed idiots run around killing some more (was secret service informant).
The population remembered and remembers this, and voted "no" for the farce they offered us as "european constitution". After that they called it "Treaty of Lisbon", and rammed it through anyway (it took some effort in the case of Ireland). If ordinairy people would understand what is in that "Treaty" they'd revolt. But no matter, they're not being asked anyway.
Count on this though: If there's another "bad deal" when exiting the euro or when they'll try to "leap forward" and try solve this huge black hole with some political "jedi hand gestures" like they've "hinted upon", then you'll see some fireworks, because they will be held accountable. Dutch are generally bored with political games as long as the strong export economy runs smoothly, but if the shop they've worked hard for turns out to be a broke casino they will revolt. It's in their nature.
When the Dutch revolt, it's just more noise, albeit sometimes a lot more noise. They spend all their effort trying to find out whose fault it is. They never get to the bullet stage. The best defense against a Dutch revolt is earplugs.
A tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
So you think it was bad to enter Euro with an undervalued currency?
I can sell Germans or Dutch a very nice bridge, here in San Francisco.
Made by the chinese.
ah, that nice one that has a Chinese mortgage on it?
No -- the nice U.S. made one. Seasoned, a daily driver. As is, where is. Buyer must remove.
When the Germans are presented with the document that says they are jointly and severally liable for all Eurozone debts, who in their right mind thought they would sign it?
Lets make a bet. They will sign it.
I'll be stunned if they do, and will praise your call if you are right.
They will sign it with some stupid conditions, such as: "Next time the PIIGS shall make a greater effort to consolidate." That will be it
They won't sign it and db is so short the market they will come out unscathed and help the government fix the crap banks - starting with the landesbanks
i was at 60 wallstreet today talking to some traders and they did not sound like they were short the market a bit..
Goldman Sachs recommended the short covering on the EUR two hrs before the SNB intervention.
The Chinese jawboned today with the 'we might ease' BS. That means more volatility trades. No meltup just yet. You'll need the FED to offer the 1trillion + and wave it around.
Also traders usually trade opposite to what they say, it's a dirty business
i was at 60 wallstreet today talking to some traders and they did not sound like they were short the market a bit..
I hope they aren't so stupid as to do that.
I'm with you, if they can't hide behind the court decision
Nobody, but then again, who is in their right mind?
German high court decision on the legality of the Greek bailout due tomorrow. This will be interesting. Any bets on what the interest rate will be on 2-year Greek paper?
Probably 75-80% on the 2, close to 100 on the 1yr. My guess.
Are they even servicing their debt anymore?
There's some servicing going on to be sure...
I doubt they're answering their phones when they ring late at night .
The malignantly undemocratic, heavy-handedly centralized, and elitist European Union, and its bastard Euro currency offspring, both deserve their long overdue deaths.
I hope that millions of formerly bamboozled Europeans line up to piss on their graves.
I come in from a long day in the shop, hop on ZeroHedge, and discover the world is closer to implosion than the day before.
Why am I no longer surprised? I wish they would just shoot that EURO Horse and put it out of our misery.
Just one month ago it was the dollar near dead when they struggled with the debt ceiling.
Reports of the dollar's death have been only slightly exaggerated.
it's the lipstick on a pig trade
Pig In a Dress
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=se5KqgXqiZ0
I feel for those trying to keep the Euro together. Europe has a history of nasty wars triggered by economic problems and I'm sure they hope a unified currency will prevent bloodshed. The core problem is that most countries are living beyond their means. This will have to be addressed with or without the Euro. Better to address sustainability within the Euro framework I think.
The unified currency is called "1 oz"
Alas, our "1 oz" stash is in Fort Knox (presumably). The Keynesians are still in control here. They HATE gold, judging from their whole stance.
When this euro ship's going to make serious water and there's the need for some alternative, there'll be questions. We're not there yet.
any feelings on buying copper? I'm thinking about it. It seems it's supposed to dip over the next year by 50%, but as people buy up Gold I'm wondering if perhaps more copper will be bought for scientific purposes?
you can pay the Tinsman in copper.
or if you think war is immenant then copper is.....wait a second, with science/war in full swing copper projectiles are expected to increase in velocity, yes, copper is indeed in the need. reload during the dips.
@peak--the bigger the fiat currency, the bigger the monster. dont feel bad for them. they didnt put this currency together for altruistic purposes. they put it together for greater power and standing in the world. they should choke on their euros till theyre gold in the face........
Exactly, the colonialist/imperialist pipedreams of the ruling european elite and their sheeple fully supported this abomination.
Let them eat toilet paper.
"Patrice Émery Lumumba (2 July 1925 – 17 January 1961) was a Congolese independence leader and the first legally elected Prime Minister of the Republic of the Congo after he helped win its independence from Belgium in June 1960. Only ten weeks later, Lumumba's government was deposed in a coup during the Congo Crisis.[1] He was subsequently imprisoned and murdered, an act committed with the direct assistance of the government of the United States and in circumstances suggesting the support and complicity of the government of Belgium."
CIA fixed that troublemaker, eh?
True, and you made me laugh..... I get a tickle out of the Europeans who bash the USA for being warmongers when they had to form a union to keep from killiing themselves after 400 years of constant Euro wars.
I think you mean 4000.
Consider how Americans would feel, and what sort of policies you would pursue, if YOU had been subjected to the equivalent of the American Civil War say five times over the last 200 years. One Civil War every 40 or so years? In comparison to the Europeans, you guys are a bunch of soft, whining pussies.
#21 Austrian School Economist. Ludwig Von Mises, 1940 ; " There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved."
You can tell it's contagious if it hurts as "you're a peein'".
lol
Why Does It Hurt When I Pee?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vmPwZT-9zY
Conveniently subtitled auf Deutsch.
+ 2 moracas
Zappa discussed this very topic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oL_DxT2UOyo
Reminds me of a quote from Zsa-Zsa Gabor: "When men are single they are incomplete. Once they are married, they're finished."
Two thumbs up! Two thumbs up!
Don't get married, get a Harem!
Haha!
Do like me.
Marry a bisexual AND get a harem.
I thought it was so cool when my wife finally allowed me to have a small harem as long as she was in charge. I could have never imagined evenrually I would get bored with it and at times it would feel like a chore. I guess I am getting too old to keep up.
Moral lesson. Get your harem in your twenties.
Go to the three top cougar dating sites, adult friend finder, and ashley madison. If you are young and HWP you will have a gaggle of women in no time. Pay for premium subscriptions and put up fully clothed pics. Beware! It is a lot of work to keep three or four women sexually and emotionally satisfied.
emotionally maybe...
That's why it's easier and cheaper to pay for a high end whore. When it's all over no need to gnaw your arm off to get away.
Is Geithner's ass as tight as it looks?
sieg heil euro-bitchez
I'm off to the Blitzkrieg races mein fuhrer.
the western financial system is finished. Why limit it to EU?
There's a reason I've been playing "Eve Of Destruction" today.
The European PTB will never surrender, more likely they will pursue some sort of United States of Europe but....with them still "up there"! Politically it's tough pitching this to sovereign nations within the EU, too much of a difference in mentality, culture and pride. Not to mention the dire state of (fiscal and political) affairs in most member countries!
I do see a major crash as some sort of leverage to push whatever sort of agenda forward I just can't see a US of Europe anytime soon! The euro will eventually survive, maybe as a souvenir?
I love these guys... the Euro collapses and the consequences will be "incalculable"?
Does no one remember that Europe was doing just fine without the Euro only a decade ago?
How DARE you look back into history and notice that the power elites' propaganda themes are nothing but a tissue of lies! Don't you know that, like Sardinian maggot cheese, ANY mention of history will soon be considered
"against the public good", as well as "subversive" and "intellectual terrorism"?
Yeah, people act like Germany never sold a car when it was deutschemarks Currency will not kill their exports - hurt yes, but they aren't going to zero or anything close. Merc or chevy volt?
Ah but you forget the suicidal nature of the financial system "If you try to fix this or stop my pillaging I will blow up and kill us all!!!" Granted it will eventually blow up anyway, but have to grind through at least a few more bonus seasons right? Those pillagers all have to get their islands in the sun first...
At least give Max Keiser credit for the "Suicide Bankers" thing.
I'm pretty sure most ZH readers know who Max is. Now do you attribute every thing you learned to the specific person? If so you missed giving a shout out to the people who taught you the words you used. So where did you pick up the word "credit"? :)
Now, now. You are both on the same side here.
banzai bankerstm
And so is the Bitcon system, even tho i do believe there were allot of trolls messing around about Bitcoin's
Take a look at the Trend-Micro weblog about "BotNets" and mining of bitcoins http://blog.trendmicro.com/malicious-links-on-twitter-lead-to-bitcoin-mi...
Time to put up Wagner, Ride of die Walküre.
Ta-ta M.
"The overwhelming consensus among the political and financial elite in Europe is that increased European integration in Europe is the answer."
That is exactly what i am expecting here as these guys will "never let a crisis go to waste."
The real danger and most likely end result is that they completely de-value the Euro and make it practically worthless as they continue to prop-up every sovereign and zombie bank in sight.
Ah yes, but now we're seeing, just like in the USA that the elite in each country turn on each other. Europe is not Belgium, and maybe the politicians thought it was.
you know, i just get this nagging feeling that tptb will hold this together for a really long time.....a realllly long time.....
My nightmare too. 10th debt ceiling raise, gold merely at $2400, trigger finger crippled with rhumatoid arthritis and the 'internet kill switch' turns out to be a return to dial-up modems....[*shivers*]
Won't last the decade in the current state. Even some military documents talking about eh food riots of the future, in Western countries. Food riots and stability in fiscal and monetary policy rarely go together, so you know got that to look forward to... To me the real wild card is how long will most of the world take US paper in exchange for real goods and services. If their patience is infinite then maybe they can kick this can a while longer.
People think that only two states exist:
1) Fine and dandy
2) Total detonation
It doesn't work like that. The Eurozone is clearly coming apart at the seems. Even if the Germans start bailing people out, the PIIGS have absolutely no incentive to get their acts together. They will keep running the same game of bullshit forever and will eventually drag Germany and Italy down with them.
What the Swiss did today I find very unusual. This is one of the strongest countries on the planet. And from my trips there a very intelligent, rational people. I guess when it comes to monetary survival, all bets are off. I would imagine the Swiss people are becoming very uncomfortable with this scheme.
Unusual yes, but its not the people governing or deciding (democracy), just the central bank. I was never fond of the Swiss and found them to be quite cold and indifferent whether to tourists or on a business exchange.
Swiss exporters on the other hand (well, the few. Novartis, Nestle. Think thats about it..) must be quite happy with this.
I, on the other hand, have had numerous dealings with the Swiss (as tourists, anyway), and have almost uniformly found them to be a pleasant if not delightful people ---- FAR nicer to deal with than the grim, humorless and rude Germans, Bavarians in particular, who seem to me like the New Yorkers of Europe.
Yes intelligent and rational. And I would add moral. They have a law that prevents them from counting their Nazi gold on a Sunday.
Most gold counting is done by fascists. Who do you think the banksters are anyway?
I agree with the pessimism but for short-term tactics I am standing out of the way of a likely relief rally in Europe tomorrow, as both the Italian and Greek governments have come out with austerity plans that show their willingness to compromise. The Italian plan seems likely to satisfy the ECB for now. The Greek plan hasn’t been described in enough detail to judge, and it’s not clear whether the plan needs approval in parliament, or could get that approval, but anyway it’s a very big step from where they were yesterday. There’s also the probability that the German court will formally allow the bailout. Of course this round of Greek chicken is still far from over, but I wouldn’t want to be in the way of tomorrow’s likely bounce.
http://how-to-trade-armageddon.com/2011/09/04/playing-greek-chicken/
This is getting more interesting by the day, one of the banks has to implode soon and I wonder what happens to all that CDS that floating around the US. We could see bailouts and consolidations bigger than 08, whcih means everybody prints and prints and prints.
I'm watching for the same trigger. It's going to make the Great Depression seem more like a Sunday picnic in contrast.
Denninger has a note up from Doug Kass claiming that Europe is actively considering a suspension of bank MTM.
Having a single fiat currency with the Germans having a major say in monetary policy seems a bit better than having a dozen+ fiat currencies with the Germans only controlliing one. The Europeans shouldn't give up on the Euro, but instead they should lower their expectations for it. Of course, no fiat currency is going to be very good. But the keeping the Euro seems a bit less bad than letting it fragment into a bunch of separate currencies.
In particular, Europeans should abandon the idea that any country that runs up a huge pile of Euro debt will automatically be bailed out by the EU. Countries that cannot pay their debts should be allowed (forced) to default. But they should still be allowed to use the Euro if they wish. (One currency to rule them all...)
Ah, yes, wait until they apply that logic to America and Canada, already wedded to the narco state called Mexico through the shotgun marriage called NAFTA, producing the ugly, smelly, gurgling baby called the North American Union.
Or, is it more like the blob that consumes everything in its path as it grows and grows. Anything that tries to escape its clutches is bombed into submission under the auspices of humanitarian concerns.
NATO must bomb, so that no Libyans feel the need to immolate themselves on the alter of Bernank hyperinflation.
"Most of the individuals quoted above desperately want to save the euro. They are not going to go down without a fight. The overwhelming consensus among the political and financial elite in Europe is that increased European integration in Europe is the answer."........
yeah, this is the NWO....the creation of the "Super States"......of which the Eurozone would be the first. I'm tellin' ya, these fuckers will stop at nothing. How does it feel to be one of the serfs in the NWO? To keep your wealth in their fiat system supports them! Get it out! Unless you like being a serf.........
Read the first line and thought ithey were talking about the dope in the White House.
I had the same thought!
I'm just awaiting the executive order that we are to call the Dictator in Chief by the name Caesar now. His official title is to be "Emperor Obama".
Shirley.
all of this frank talk about defects is nothing but paulsonian threats of financial armageddon unless tighter integration is accomplished....of course such gentle language is nothing but a synonym for a german anchluss 2.0...the eurocrats will not be satisified until all of europe is under the control of european elites who realize that borders are but artificial seams separating a common lust....
#22 Knukles: Nice. Real fucking nice. 'Bout time they fessed up. Done went and wasted one hell of a lot of the World's treasure on a criminal experiment.
These people need be tried as financial terrorists for crimes against humanity.
And this is why calamity is certainty!
Eric Von Cartman: "The global banking system can remain insolvent alot longer than its douchebag leaders can remain irrational"
"kaput." the system is "kaput." move along...move along...
Swiss move was on of the most bizarre things ever, pegging the CHF like they did just sliced some more confidence out of the European markets. Europe Zone is finished.
Side note, the peg will last less than mth after oil inflation takes out the Swiss Economy. Tight.
Hahaha Japan can't do what the insane SNB just did, cause they have inflation overkill. This f*cking global economy is at breaking point.
Fiat things for all the Kings under the darkening sky,
Fiat for the Illuminati Lords in their halls of splinters,
Fiat for Mortal Men doomed to die,
Fiat for the Dark Lord and his printers,
In the Land of the Eccles where the Shadows lie.
One Thing to rule them all, One Thing to find them,
One Thing to bring them all and in the darkness bind them
In the Land of the Eccles where the Shadows lie.
But what is the Master-thing, the One thing to rule them all?
What is this the one thing lost many years ago,
that weakens the great power of the printer?
Now, we greatly desire to have it again,
- but the Dark Lord and his Dark Govenors scream, "They must NOT get it!"
What is it fair readers of Zero Hedge? What is it?
Gold, bitchez! (And silver, too).
The precious?
Is it finito or is it tot? How about terminado?
This is bullish, right? I get so cornfused.
'EU sucks, S&P recovers 2/3rds of loss'
'Someone sucks more' cited.
My favorite:
#11 Bank of England Governor Mervyn King: "Dealing with a banking crisis was difficult enough, but at least there were public-sector balance sheets on to which the problems could be moved. Once you move into sovereign debt, there is no answer; there's no backstop."
Oh yes! How nice for Mervyn King that all the grubby little debt serfs were there for the banks when they needed them, to soak up their losses and bad bets.
SOLUTION: MOVE THE PROBLEMS BACK ONTO THE BANKING BALANCE SHEETS WHERE THEY BELONG, SOVEREIGNS ARE CALLED SOVEREIGN FOR A REASON.
The Euro pricks don't realize that their own central planning is what killed the Euro and the EU. Central planning can't fix the problem either because it is the problem. The centrally planned misallocations are to massive and contorted to be unwound by another invested committee.
The market rules, and will have it's way, one way or another.
Market? Was ist 'market'?
Good point, Mynhair. Market in this case is the one seeking sound money and safe havens despite the financial repression into bonds. The market will find one either in Pms or other hard assets, as always happens when banana republics collapse. All those sovereign bonds underpinning the entire monetary system are increasingly worthless and on their way to the big Central Bank in the sky.
Good point, Mynhair. Market in this case is the one seeking sound money and safe havens despite the financial repression into bonds. The market will find one either in Pms or other hard assets, as always happens when banana republics collapse. All those sovereign bonds underpinning the entire monetary system are increasingly worthless and on their way to the big Central Bank in the sky.
A controlled demolition of the Euro would be appreciated.
Just like WTC7.
It's more like a controlled demolition of the Eurozone (you may notice from the above quotes that it was doomed from the start, but that was the compromise it took to get it all started). Question is, what will arise from its ashes?
I'm of the opinion that the creation (and subsequent destruction) of the Eurozone was just a Hegelian exercise to create a "New & Improved" set of shackles. That some think that the destruction will lead to decentralization is why the trap works so well.
test
Failed.
Aren't all these quotes 10 years old?
As I mentioned above, the Eurozone's demise was present from the very beginning (much like Social Security or any other incoherent plan). It really wasn't hard to see that it wouldn't work, given that it required every participant to rely on the honesty of the other not to cheat. In other words, its a classic prisoner's dilemma.
Agreed. Any monetary union without a fiscal union is destined to fail. How many times is Europe going to go through this exercise? How many times have exchange rate fixing mechanisms been tried and failed? Will Germany, Italy, France, or Greece ever really change? C'mon, even the "secret global banking cartel" should have figured this out by now.
Try something different.
Throw some Goldman Sachs and CDS into the mix and voila!
Fear, pessimism, and negativity is pretty high right now, and players are piling on puts paying outlandish premiums. I wonder how fast the market could run if all these shorts have to cover.
'cause we need to break Aug lows for any bounce, the financial system is breaking down. So rule out mega rallies, even those will be capped. Plus our dear friends the Chinese and their economic implosion is probably on. If copper corrects hard, next few weeks, the VIX will blow out big time.
Rumor on wires that China is going to print more. Endgame just got closer
Actually, if everybody prints, it moves the endgame further away. If everybody prints, every currency is equal. It really is a race to see who can print faster, to try to stimulate their economy at the expense of other nations. If everyone prints, the fiat game perpetuates. Only if one or more did not print, would the difference between real money and fiat become clear, and the unsustainability of fiat be realized.
Sure, they'd be equal.... equally worth less and less.
Really. I'm looking forward to Christmas. By then, I will recall all the doomers and laugh out loud. The euro will survive, the Finns will still be in, Greece and other Piggies too, the German Court will long be forgotten, Merkel is still Bundeskanzler (no one of her cabinet wants elections NOW), even "kikkerlandje" The Netherlands will remain silent. No banking crisis. Everything will be fine by then, maybe some economic growth, as you look at the US "better than expected" statistics. Crises and disasters are a thing of the past. Believe me. Merry Christmas. Boring world we live in.
Aren't you forgetting to mention the pink fluffy unicorns dancing on rainbows?
Yes, and The Wizard of OZ, Charlie and the Chocolate factory and what not. Really, I'm in the mood. Don't understand all the eurodoom, just enjoy the thought of warm chocolate milk and the tree. Forget the fall, just relax.
I bet the Germans thought the same thing as the Nazis rose to power in the 1930's.
Start here: e.g.
http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?sts=t&tn=when+money+dies&x...
The Wizard of Oz was L Frank Baum's allegorical argument for sound money. in the book, Dorothy wore SILVER slippers.
#nowyouknow
Got anymore of that weed?
grudingly agree. bloomberg for the last couple of days has had the actual smart people on (they do this when the hopium wears off) Euroes, Asians, south and north american (non) pundits.
The consensus? ECB raised rates. ECB will lower rates. soveriegns and individuals will borrow. With the crisis averted, the PIGS will try to fix thier tax codes and the population will go along with it. Then the ECB will have the basis to issue bonds/print money.
I am more worred about the USA. Rates are already at zero and Ben has said he will not raise them till 2013. 70% of the american people want the tax code to stay just exactly the way it is now. (the top teirs of the corporatate ranks, and the min maxers of all shapes, sizes, races or creeds who have a lifestyle that allows them to avoid nearly all taxation except the taxes that they get back 200% in perks benes, etc.
It is not uncommon in the USA to see 80 year olds using change purses at the grocer to buy staple goods, followed in line by 20 somethings dressed to the nines and driving $50k autos, who use food stamps without even a scintilla of guilt. And why should people have any shame, "if the tax code says it is okay, it must be the right thing to do! I mean Obama says tax code/credits/deduction is what gives us all jobs! might as well give us food too!"
The world is pretty boring when you can see the macro problems with a simple trip to the grocer.
Garbage. You can't tell whether that 20 something is using a debit card or an EBT (food stamp) card. The keystrokes are the same.
And yes, my 86 year old mother uses cash. I use a debit card funded by direct deposit of my pay.
I am not trying to be ad hominem. I am one of those christian types that belives we are all Gods children. So when something is messed up it usually not the greed of any one set of indidivuals from top to bottom.
But you can tell when people are using food stamps for the exact reason you mentioned. The keystrokes are the same for the food they purchase with EBT, and the same for the luxuries such as magazines and non food items like light bulbs, etc they put the remander of the bill on.
Again, I am not trying to divide and conquer. thats what TPTB do. I am just like alot of the less sophisticated folks here on ZH who try to add perspective to some of the more complex themes. 40 Million people on foodstamps in a country where people in most areas could grow a back yard garden.
Sounds like more hopium. ECB bonds are a unicorn. The world isn't boring, merely populated by (some) boring people.
You don't make a lick of sense. But what I think you're trying to say is this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSjK2Oqrgic
nah...the end is extremely nigh. In fact, we are all so doomed that you won't even get coal in your stocking this Christmas. your only hope at this point is to collect plenty of fiat paper so at least you will have something to burn and stay warm...
I wish I could agree. But as long as the Europeans keep bailing out countries that spend too much, countries will keep doing it. Even if they do manage to delay or avert disaster wrt. Greece and the other PIIGS, it won't be long until some other country is in trouble. And eventually the Germans will run out of patience.
That said, I think that it is certainly possible that they could hold things together until Christmas. The next $109B euro round of funding could postpone the end for a year or more. Or not. We shall see...
Ok, if you answer this question, I believe you. Pray tell: WHO THE FUCK IS GOING TO PAY FOR THIS MESS?
We all are gonna pay. In fact, the erosion of all fiatmoney is a payment which allready lasts for decades.
Of course that was the plan, and it worked in the USA in 2008, but the banks underestimated that it's now becoming glaringly obvious it's not a liquidity crisis but a solvency one, and their modus operandi to throw increasing amounts of paper at the smouldering fire, is not accepted anymore. Italy is an XXL while Ireland was an S. And Finland broke the silence and demanded collateral instead of greek hot air (thank God someone had balls). Dutch and German ministers can't sell to their constituency that Finland will get a deal, and they won't. So that was the watershed moment.
The next logical course of action is to go full retard and glue the whole of europe into one bucket of good and bad, and then gloss everything over with strong leadership and interesting new promises of financial restructuring (your x-mas?). I don't see a political structure that would equal a federal government like in the USA that could force people into accepting them as the supreme government. The European Commission simply have no support whatsoever of any population at the moment, which in a divided Belgium is inconsequential but not in other countries. They also are nothing but burocrats that should've minded the store. More power? To do what? Transfer even more money to corrupt Italians? The euro could've worked but they were far to busy pulling new countries in, and buying allegiance with other people's money, than to make the union work and have countries grow towards each other politically and fiscally. Italians electing arseholes like Berlusconi also didn't help. Ridiculing enemies while you're begging for money doesn't really work anymore, so he's done. I wonder if he gets to keep his millions. I think not, looking at historic precedents.
The other solution is serious (finally!?) work in the financial system to get the bad apples out. Problem there is that (guesstimate) half of the apples are now rotten, the financial system is dragging the economies down, and it's too late to restructure and recapitalise banks without some serious defaults. Anything else (printing of euros) will result in hyperinflation and gold to 10000 euros (or 20000 who cares?!) What goes up, must come down. They've run out of time.
The problem with this line of thinking is that you can't find a single piece of data that supports it. The data is coming in pretty shitty in the US and Europe. Bond yields are blowing out on Greece. Yields are rising in Italy. CDS spreads are blowing out. In short the data sucks. The market is clearly ignoring the worst of it, but it was doing that in 2008 also. We all remember how that ended.
I remember people saying that Greece was saved after the first bailout and not to worry about it. Pretty obvious how that call turned out.
The situation isn't getting better. It's getting worse. The market doesn't reflect that but I've given up on the global markets as any kind of price discovery mechanism.
2008 ended with big bailouts. Now, we're still alive. The biggest panic makers (the markets) have run into bonds, stocks and-what-not since 2008. What now end of the world? These panickees are the first to calm down and run into any opportunity after a new round of money pumping. Ben "deflation, not in my lifetime" Bernanke gives them all they want. So does Trichet or whoever. And the big boys will bite. I simply cannot imagine myself running/fighting for food, money and so on. So, merry Christmas.
Just because you can't imagine it, doesn't mean you won't start running like everyone else.
I wonder what people were thinking as they strode about the deck of the Titanic, so proudly. "I can't imagine how cold that water is."
Here's the thing: they didn't have to use imagination once they were in the drink.
Happy New Year!
All tptb need do to keep their Ponzi going
is to find new public balance sheets.
Or, create new jobs,
Or, eliminate number of job seekers.
ahhh...even in the worst of times, just seeing the name "herman van rompuy" puts a smile on my face. maybe it's just me but I find that to be hilarious every time I see it.
Of course that integration is all about shifting power over to the bankster's guys to screw over the people so the banks survive. To them everything will be candy canes and gum drops if they just can oversee all of europe's national and local gov'ts...and basically make all decisions regarding money, rendering all elected officials useless.
That's what they want. Save their banks, their careers, their place in history...and damn the people.
Because to them, dictatorship by banks, is better than letting Europe's frauds unravel. It's fraud, yet they want to save it. In a continent of monetarist dumbasses, the sane blind man is king.
They've basically decided to jettison the lifeboats on the Titanic, and order everybody to start bailing out water.
They're fucking insane. They want to avoid incalculable problems by implementing policies that will in fact cause them.
Glass-Steagall worldwide (implemented individually of course).
I don't regard the Eurocrat elitists hardened liars, since that implies conditioning. They are natural born liars.
The "market" is totally disconnected from reality. I feel like it doesn't matter how much research you do, whether you are right or wrong, or what the fundamentals say. The central planners will jam some bullshit up your ass. I've followed the real situation for two years now and the market simply doesn't give a fuck what the truth is.
It's maddening. The entire thing is one big fucking casino. That's why it's hard to get excited over this stuff anymore.
Drudge headline currently (no link yet)
NYT: Bank Fail Fear in EU
This was going to be my point, EXACTLY !
Plus, one has to be willing to act. I know many very bright people who knew/know they should get PM's, but didn't. Why? Outside their confort zone? Outside traditional investing "knowledge"? Storage issues? Probably a combo of all the above. What's interesting is that when people do finally take the plunge, they invariably wish they did it sooner and in greater quanitity.
Far out in the uncharted backwaters of the unfashionable end of the western
spiral arm of the Galaxy lies a small unregarded yellow sun. Orbiting
this at a distance of roughly ninety-two million miles is an utterly insigni -
cant little blue green planet whose ape-descended life forms are so amazingly
primitive that they still think digital watches are a pretty neat idea.
This planet has { or rather had { a problem, which was this: most of the
people on it were unhappy for pretty much of the time. Many solutions were
suggested for this problem, but most of these were largely concerned with the
movements of small green pieces of paper, which is odd because on the whole
it wasn't the small green pieces of paper that were unhappy.
And so the problem remained; lots of the people were mean, and most of
them were miserable, even the ones with digital watches...
all ben bernanke and his fellow cult of print members had to do was read the opening paragraph of "the hitchhikers guide to the galaxy" to realize that making more fiat paper was just going to make more people more miserable. it's sad when there is more economic wisdom in one paragraph of a five dollar book, then in most of these peoples six figure educations...
You can stack if you want to, you can leave your friends behind, cuz your friends don't stack, and if they don't stack, well they're not gonna have a dime.
Say, you can stack where you want to. A place Uncle will never find. You can spend like they did, in the old world. and legal tenderly. wipe your behind.
You can stack!
You can stack when you want to. Crisis young but time will fly. You can dress real neat, and maybe even eat, and maybe you won't die.
Say, you can stack if you want to. If you don't, JP Morgan will. Then you can act real rude, and totally remove, all the fucks on capitol hill.
You can stack, You can stack. Not a damn thing's under control. You can stack. You can stack, Or you can dig a you-shaped hole.
You can stack. You can stack. Everybody look at their stacks. You can stack, You can stack, Everybody's watchin' their backs.
Safety stacks, Well-a, safety stacks. Yes, safety stacks.
Men Without Asshats