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Europe's Tallest-To-Be Building Is Burning - Live Feed

Tyler Durden's picture


First the Costa Concordia was a sinking example of the failing European experiment, now we may have an even better case study of the continent's burning ambitions, as the Moscow Federation Tower, designed to be the tallest building in Europe, is engulfed in flames. As RT says, "As firefighters try to put out the flames on the top floors, the danger the incomplete building might collapse is growing every minute." Watch live here until the feed is shut off.

h/t Mario


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Mon, 04/02/2012 - 15:43 | 2310429 Banksters
Banksters's picture



I'd like to take this opportunity to say, trav is phuckstick.


End of message.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 15:47 | 2310449 Badabing
Badabing's picture

No problem we know that tall burning buildings fall into there own footprint.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 15:47 | 2310450 AN0NYM0US
AN0NYM0US's picture

thermite,  no termite

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 15:53 | 2310479 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture


1. Was insurance coverage doubled?

2. Has short interest on the applicable postions been placed?

3. Have all the video tapes been confiscated?

4. How do you say patriot act in Russian?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:08 | 2310484 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Hindenburg event. How fitting for a burning continent.
So when does the second Antonov AN-225 strike the tower?

Seems like the power elite need such events before rolling out the newly creaded "police forces".
Enter the Russian muttawa:

A Russian newspaper reports that the country’s authorities are pondering the creation of a new power agency, the national guard, to fight external and internal threats.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:16 | 2310591 Ghordius
Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:25 | 2310617 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Exactly Ghordius.
Just as Hanussen predicted:
As to another of his predictions:!

It is also coming....AGAIN.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:31 | 2310644 The Big Ching-aso
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Shit.    Was it hit by an airline full of flaming bolsheviks?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 19:15 | 2311223 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

Ash to cash.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 22:44 | 2311754 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Ahh yes, an unfocused fire takes a core like this:

And turns it into a smoldering liquified heap with not a trace left, that stays liquified for the next 6 months, like this:

It's the new physics I learned in 2001.



Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:36 | 2310664 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Tyler, relax! You are overworked.

"the Costa Concordia was a sinking example of the failing European experiment"

Relation to Captain making stupid mistakes because of the EU? How?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:40 | 2310677 DogSlime
DogSlime's picture

Last I saw, the captains of Europe were making plenty of mistakes.  The ship is sinking.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:57 | 2310733 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Ah, a metaphore. Worse than World Wars?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:36 | 2310668 DosZap
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A Russian newspaper reports that the country’s authorities are pondering the creation of a newpower agency, the national guard, to fight external and internal threats.


Now, I wonder where they got that idea??

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:55 | 2310995 Ropingdown
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The really tough bit is chosing the shirt color for the agents. Brown? Black?  Ah, choices.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:08 | 2311046 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

"Hunger Games" has them wearing white.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:41 | 2311564 palmereldritch
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It's the least Barry can do to help out a fellow statesman like Putin in need:

[snip] (Emphasis mine):

"Most important, Mr. Putin’s decade-old autocratic regime is looking shaky. Hundreds of thousands of Russians have turned out to demonstrate against fraud in the presidential and parliamentary elections, and to demand political reform. Many Russian experts are saying that the Kremlin’s economic and political policies are unsustainable, and that Mr. Putin will not finish his six-year term unless he makes major concessions to the opposition — which he shows little sign of doing.

Remarkably, however, President Obama has responded to Mr. Putin’s return to the presidency by strongly affirming his commitment to partnering with the strongman. His meant-to-be-confidential assurance to outgoing President Dmitry Medvedev on Monday, that “after my election I have more flexibility” to solve “all these issues, but particularly missile defense,” was only the latest sign that Mr. Obama has decided to bet on deal-making with Mr. Putin rather than on democratic change in Russia."

Flexibility huh....He should probably start with a little light body scanning and work his way up from there.

In Russia, the letters TSA translate into 'KGB'.


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 22:01 | 2311613 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

Interesting idea.

The National Guard is us. Would we "obey" and kill our neighbors.


Would we be well trained and informed (and armed) revolutionaries?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 15:56 | 2310492 johnu1978
johnu1978's picture

Doesn't Larry Silverstein own this building?


Primitive Skills Classes:

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:17 | 2310596 Id fight Gandhi
Id fight Gandhi's picture

Jewish lightning?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:56 | 2311001 Ropingdown
Ropingdown's picture

I thought it was called the Israeli Fire Department, "So good we know you need us before the fire's even started."

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:37 | 2310920 JohnKozac
JohnKozac's picture

Oi vey!

Wait until my mother finds out about this....

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:20 | 2310604 Jack Sheet
Jack Sheet's picture

post deleted - cyrillic script failed

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:36 | 2310910 Cpl Hicks
Cpl Hicks's picture

It's not as funny in English?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 04:12 | 2312224 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

Sometimes banana is just a banana and fire is just a fire.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:35 | 2310662 roadlust
roadlust's picture

"Patriot Act in Russian?" is pronounced, P.U.T.I.N.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:17 | 2310824 Angus195
Angus195's picture

Have the found the passports of the 'terrorists' at the base of the building .... in pristine condition?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:19 | 2310834 He_Who Carried ...
He_Who Carried The Sun's picture

Termites are bullish!

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:23 | 2311088 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

But there weren't even any windows to be broken!

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:11 | 2310562 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

We all know that Bush did it with thousands of co-conspirators who not only pulled it off, but all kept quiet about it.


May as well believe in elves and goblins for as smart as you nutballs sound.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:15 | 2310584 W10321303
W10321303's picture

Ignorance is bliss....or how much of the $10 billion inusrance payout did you get?.....or ......are you a real person or one of those NSA cyborgs?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:23 | 2310618 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

Zero, and i've been here a long time fighting the ignorance that gives ZH a bad name.

I am just in awe of the kind of rationalization required to simultaneously believe that the federal government is incompetant (which it is) yet in the case of 9/11, pulled off the greatest piece of open-air theater ever accomplished without anyone spilling the beans. Idiots say things like, "well they fell straight down! how do you explain that?" to which I can say, "A basic understanding of engineering and gravity would tell you that the curtain wall construction of the WTCs made it much more likely for the burning jet fuel to compromise the integrity of the long steel beams holding up the floors, causing one to pancake down on the others."

But at that point the 9/11 truther has gone back to knawing on the doggie toy because materials engineering is a communist conspiracy cooked up by Cheney in the bunker outside Moscow.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:34 | 2310657 W10321303
W10321303's picture

The Borg wipe out all of your brain cells needed for rational thinking, at least that's what I have heard, don't they?

Sorry Sister, large buildings weren't built that way back in the mid-20th century. Who is feeding you this utter nonsense? NSA? Koch Brothers? Dick Cheney? Have you ever heard of the RichStag Fire? Do you know the legal definition of a conspiracy? Have you ever looked at the buildings falling in slow motion? Have you ever heard of Newton's laws of physics? Are you a machine? (ref: if the Borg left you any cognitive capcity...

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:40 | 2310676 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

The WTC wasn't built back in the mid 20th century. Construction was started in 1971 using a revolutionary and unique design that relied upon the strong outer curtain wall which allowed for wide open internal office space without many support pillars. The planes ripped that curtain open and sprayed the floors with burning jet fuel. That fuel caused the steel to warm up, and since you know that warming metal causes it to expand and lose its structural integrity, the floors began to sag and finally fall. Without internal support columns, things fall down very quickly.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:59 | 2310741 Belarusian Bull
Belarusian Bull's picture

Jet fuel can't melt construction steel. Furthermore, when only side of building's support is crippled, it collapses in a different manner.


P.S. BTW, what a happened to that WTC building 7 ?

You should really learn you history, i'd suggest you to start with how US entered WW2... you know, that story where Roosevelt forced Japan to attack Pearl Harbor. Oh, and their fleet was tracked all the way from Japan to Pearl Harbor to make sure nothing will go wrong. It's all the same.




Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:06 | 2310769 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

Isn't it obvious? Once the rules were changed to where jet fuel can crumble a steel building in upon itself by shearing the steel without it bending, then it became instantly possible for an office fire to do the same thing.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:50 | 2310976 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

Perhaps you could benefit from looking at some pictures of the bent steel in the rubble.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:23 | 2311092 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Can you explain why the inner column supports were not left standing at least part of the way?  I understand the design completely and as a mechanical engineer that has done solid modeling and strength analysis, I can say the the inner core that was made up of MANY columns and supports would at lest be standing at 30%.. MINIMUM!!  We won't even debate the thermodinamics of the situation as to how hot for how long it would take to weaken the steel supports.. Have you actually seen footage of the buildings coming down?  If you have, and do not think something is wrong with the official explanation, well, i'm sorry to say, you are a moron.. And probably have ZERO engineering or design experience with structural steel.. I do..

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 19:18 | 2311231 Doña K
Doña K's picture

All the corner columns have "moment connections" which prevent vertical failure. For all these to fail is almost impossible. Whether this was a US government's job other government's job, or insurance fraud, I can't say.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:31 | 2311380 clymer
clymer's picture

Ignore Xeno the same way she-he-it has ignored the overwhelming evidence surrounding that fateful day that had led to so much global misery. Anyone who doesn't recognize that 9-11 was a staged event by now is a fucking idiot

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:45 | 2311404 tmosley
tmosley's picture

That doesn't follow.  Just because something lead to misery and increased government power doesn't mean that it was the government that did it.  They clearly TOOK ADVANTAGE of the situation, but that does NOT imply that they caused it to happen in a direct manner.

The government is evil, but that doesn't mean that all evil comes from the government.  Evil comes about when men commit aggression against one another.  The government might have CAUSED 9/11 through their relentless oppression of muslims, but that doesn't mean that they planned and executed it.

Learn to think like a rationalist, please.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:16 | 2311483 clymer
clymer's picture


where in my post did you read the word "government"? The Government is us, "we the people". You know, we wanted to form a more perfect union.. Just because a small handful of globalist maniacs and their brainwashed puppets managed to make you actually believe that the thermite was sprinkled around the debris? That Hijacker passports survived the blast and surfaced in perfect condition at the base of towers? 6 out of 9 commissioners that were assembled to create the report have come public and said the invesitgation was compromised. I guess you chose to ignore that memo. Building 7 alone is the smoking gun.

Until we come to grips and truth about this day as a nation, and as human beings world wide we will not move ahead.

And a sincere "fuck you" to all who will not support a new and impartial PUBLIC investigation into September 11, 2001. Especially Americans. You are cowards and traitors




Mon, 04/02/2012 - 23:06 | 2311560 Bob
Bob's picture

"Truthers" could be a cargo cult, then?

Could be.  I'm sorry we spend so much energy on details that, in the larger picture, are completely superfluous by now, regardless of what really happened in 2001 NYC.  

To give them what it seems to me should be considered a reasonable amount of credit, it's not like the various players they believe pulled off the job wouldn't do it if they could. 

More importantly, I can't help but think, what's followed has certainly made for a seamlessly fascist sequence of events. 

I wish "truthers" would just stick to those indisputable facts.

Everything that has followed 9-11 has been more than enough to confirm their basic instincts, it seems to me.  Do we really have to argue about individual punches in this fight?

Do we have such perverse luxury?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 03:49 | 2312205 zhandax
zhandax's picture

OK Brainiac, correlation doesn't imply causation; Tyler has pressed that point home well enough.  Explain how the BBC reported that tower 7 fell with the damn thing standing in the background of the video and 20 minutes later it really did?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 06:24 | 2312286 Max Hunter
Max Hunter's picture

Tmosley, I'm not saying the governement did it. I'm saying the "official" story is full of holes and outright lies.. Any person with and even marginal ability to reason would have to conclude something isn't right..

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 15:42 | 2314297 RallyRoundTheFamily
RallyRoundTheFamily's picture

All the corner columns have "moment connections" which prevent vertical failure. For all these to fail at the exact same time is impossible. (fixed)

3 times in one day?

I did not want to believe it either.                                                     

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 10:17 | 2312789 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture

Watch the video of WTC1's collapse. Try to block out the voices in your head while watching. CLEARLY, many the central columns remain standing for a few seconds. Please explain to me why everyone bent on conspiracy can't see what is plainly in front of their own eyes?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:13 | 2310794 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

"Jet fuel can't melt construction steel."

Melting isn't required; all that is necessary is losing about half the carryign capacity of the beams, and the structure comes down. As it happened.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:43 | 2310947 Ratscam
Ratscam's picture

Finally someone has found the cheapest and most efficient way to pull a building.

You'll become seriously rich if your method works.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:50 | 2311412 tmosley
tmosley's picture

I guess you didn't notice the fact that this method of "demolition" was quite catastrophic and took a decade to clean up.  

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 15:45 | 2314313 RallyRoundTheFamily
RallyRoundTheFamily's picture

all that is necessary is losing about half the carrying capacity of the beams, and the structure comes down.

Again all four sides at exactly the same time, otherwise it would lean\bend\fallover to one side.

3 times in one day.


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:47 | 2310965 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

You don't need to melt it, only make it weaker, which heating it does.


Funny how they always run to building 7 once their bullshit has been called on buildings 1 and 2? uncanny. It's like they all get their information from a small collection of sites that cannibalizes from each other spreading lies as if they were truth.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:08 | 2311044 Goldilocks
Goldilocks's picture

"World Trade Center 7 (Building 7) wasn't hit by airliners. Fell anyway. Now we know why - its architectural sympathy."

Jim Willie
Building 7 (9/11) (0:20)

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:12 | 2311055 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

Makes about as much sense as the controlled demolitions theory.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:57 | 2311422 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Ahhh yes, all the pretty little gold bars at the bottom of the wtc 1 and 2, all GONE without a trace, and replaced with.... smoldering "Steel" that smolders for 6 months while they pour water on it 24/7 fukushima style. Because steel smolders for 6 months from jet fuel. Sometimes your zio genes shine brightly my pretty frog.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:34 | 2311545 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Did you ever try to put out a tire fire?

Or a coal mine fire, for that matter?

Takes a LONG time and a LOT of water.  Most of the time they don't bother.

For the last time, the jet fuel only STARTED the fire.  It was the lighter fluid to the briquettes of the contents of the WTC buildings.

The truthers have a cognative disease.  Rationalism is the cure:

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 22:59 | 2311784 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Steel melting on itself is not a self sustaining reaction, i'm sorry, there is no internal heat being generated by it, unless an outside force/heat is applied, it will not remain a liquid in -open air- (the other examples you give are not open air, the coal is flammable and in an enclosed space to build up pressure and heat, the tires burn because petroleum is flammable, not to mention god knows what other ethylenes in there, steel is -not- flammable), unless there is some other chain reaction/decay involved to supply the heat. Sorry Tmos, i'm afraid those examples are wrong, usually you and I agree but not today :)

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:13 | 2311058 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Hutchinson effect.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 19:11 | 2311220 Goldilocks
Goldilocks's picture

Watch [pay homage to] the following Ted Gunderson [an Ex-FBI guy] videos...
(close to the end of #5 & in #6, Ted talks of a new type of bomb)

Ted Gunderson - The Great Conspiracy Exposed 1/7 PL (9:04)

Ted Gunderson - The Great Conspiracy Exposed 2/7 PL (9:11)

Ted Gunderson - The Great Conspiracy Exposed 3/7 PL (9:09)

Ted Gunderson - The Great Conspiracy Exposed 4/7 PL (9:05)

Ted Gunderson - The Great Conspiracy Exposed 5/7 PL (9:07)

Ted Gunderson - The Great Conspiracy Exposed 6/7 PL (9:10)

Ted Gunderson - The Great Conspiracy Exposed 7/7 PL (9:08)

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 23:10 | 2311820 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

I wasn't aware of this persons work expounding on Tesla's unexplored genius. Thanks for that.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:58 | 2311427 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Funny how you can't tell me why steel smolders for 6 months after being hit with jet fuel. And you can't tell me where a single piece of gold is from the bottom of wtc 1 and 2.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:41 | 2315001 RallyRoundTheFamily
RallyRoundTheFamily's picture

They did recover some gold bars, in a van in a basement parking garage.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 04:35 | 2312239 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

To be fair, temperature should not necessarily be that high to melt the steel, because steel quickly may lose structural stability long before it actually melts.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:02 | 2310752 TaxSlave
TaxSlave's picture

Thanks for helping out with that explanation.  Now I'm gonna go quit my job as an engineer making induction heating equipment that heats steel for forming, because you know more than I do about heating methods, metallurgy, and properties of steel at elevated temperature.  And some guy is gonna come by and put us out of business with the much less expensive method of using oxygen-starved kerosene fires to heat the material.  Oh yeah, I almost forgot.  I'm gonna put my barbeque out by the curb, too, before it collapses.  You can't be too safe, you know.


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:13 | 2310803 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

"Thanks for helping out with that explanation. Now I'm gonna go quit my job as an engineer making induction heating equipment that heats steel for forming, because you know more than I do about heating methods, metallurgy, and properties of steel at elevated temperature."

Thanks for helping public safety, dude. I wouldn't feel safe in a building you had your name on considering what you've expressed.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:25 | 2310864 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Death and Gravity said:

Thanks for helping public safety, dude. I wouldn't feel safe in a building you had your name on considering what you've expressed.

He wouldn't make a good blacksmith either. He'd look pretty silly pounding on a melted horseshoe, even if he somehow managed to pull it from the fire and place it on an anvil.


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:00 | 2311431 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

What did he express exactly? That froggy is full of shit? And because he expressed that froggy is full of shit, you doubt his engineering degree? Maybe you can give me advance warning when you drive your car so I'll know to stay off the roads.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:50 | 2310977 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

Perhaps you should if someone with my qualifications knows more about the properties of steel than you do.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:37 | 2312096 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

What type of steel?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:35 | 2312449 BigDuke6
BigDuke6's picture

Maybe I'm getting old but I hate it when fights go on too long and someone like xenousefulidiot gets totally crushed

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:39 | 2312457 BigDuke6
BigDuke6's picture

In fact ... Fuck the freaky slut

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:40 | 2312458 BigDuke6
BigDuke6's picture

Up the arse

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:59 | 2311180 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture

"I'm gonna put my barbeque out by the curb, too, before it collapses. You can't be too safe, you know."

Proof Tax Slave is a liar and is in no way knowledegable of metalurgy.

The Japanese engineers, well that's another story. They figured out that there's a problem with US building codes, which account for weakening of steel from fire but not for the further weakening due to vertical expansion of columns. In the case of WTC 1 and 2, the heat was enough to weaken the steel at the hottest points down to  10% of design strength (which is still well below melting, btw). However, it also caused the hottest columns to expand 1" in height per floor, acting as jacks trying in vain to lift the upper floors. So ultimate failure came as increased height from thermal expansion factored in with reduction in bearing capacity due to heat stress. Failure came well below melting temp, even well below that required for failure from heat alone.


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:42 | 2312102 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

What are referring to is known as shearing stress. It's w ell known and accounted for effect that is absolutely inapplicable in this situation. The steel and the floors of the WTC's were designed specifically to have 4' of flex in all directions to provent the stresses of that neture to build up in the first place. When people say the WTC were the first of their kind, they were not lying. The amount of technological innovation of those towers was far beyond what most of you would even be aware of. Yes, even the Japanese, because apparently they were not aware of that little 4" of give.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 10:32 | 2312847 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture

Sorry, Parrot, but you are what is known as a useful idiot. Steel has a certain design yield strength, say 22,000 psi. If a column expands it takes the load off of surrounding columns, acting like a jack. That increases its share of the load. ADDITIONALLY, the heated steel is loosing strength. When it fails it makes a huge bang and its load is redistributed to surrounding columns that are then overloaded, and are expanding and weakening fron heat, and so on. One simply can't analyze design in context of load shifting from progressive structural failure with the tools they had back in the '60s.

Why are so many people married to the conspiracy theory that the feel the need to lie about being structural engineers? This whole thread is full of liars. Azzoles - ever heard of projection? That's when you are  a liar, for example, and being a liar you assume everyone else is a liar, and hatch conspiracies based on their "lies."

Google "Fire Resistance of Steel Frames" by Sakumoto, Nishigaki, Ikeda and Kohno. Look at Photo 6 for deformed column from loaded heat test. Then, if you give a damn, read the 11-page report.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:07 | 2310776 aerojet
aerojet's picture

I saw it all, and yet, I still have my doubts.  My dad was a welder, so I grew up around shop where all kinds of steel was being cut and joined together all the time.  It takes a lot of focused heat to melt steel--a really hot fire in an area would not do it.  You're saying that the steel wasn't melted but simply "weakened" but again, I just don't see how massive I-beams would melt enough in a typical fire.  You need really focused heat--like an oxygen/acetylene torch or an oxidizing reaction like thermite to get the temperature you need.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:16 | 2310813 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

That's why the lie had to change over time to the wishy-washy "weakened."

Otherwise, within two weeks, everyone would've stepped back and went "hey, this shit isn't even possible, let alone likely."

And if that would've happened, the next question might've been asking Rumsfeld where the missing $3T went. But no, we were too busy watching the anthrax distraction "attack."

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:53 | 2310990 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

It was never, "changed over time". It's the official and scientifically accepted fact. That you don't like it because it conflicts with your conspiracy theory doesn't make it wishy washy.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:03 | 2311444 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Name one other steel skyscraper that collapsed from fire. Cmon, it can't be that hard to find one.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 22:35 | 2311726 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

There are not any.



Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:50 | 2311588 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

And then tell us about Conservation of Momentum and why on that day, The day everything changed!TM, the law of physics did not apply to the collapse of WTC7...please, we're waiting.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:24 | 2312086 mvsjcl
mvsjcl's picture

Froggy, I've stopped even trying to talk to people that spew the garbage you do.


Fuck you.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 07:48 | 2312363 fnordfnordfnord
fnordfnordfnord's picture

What is a scientifically accepted fact? Is it better than a regular one? I happen to know a few scientists, and I've never heard them make the distinction from regular facts. And while we're talking about scientists, did they all convene a secret meeting and endorse the NIST findings? Because I reckon I would have heard of that too (I'm on the email listserv). The fact* that other scientists have not objected to NIST's findings does not imply an endorsement.

* The regular kind of fact, not one of the more fancier types like you use.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:10 | 2310782 gabeh73
gabeh73's picture

If the support was all in the sides and one side got destroyed you would have seen asymetric collapse...otherwise demolition companies are a scam. In any case there were lots of inner columns in all 3 WTC buildings...even the one not hit by a plane. The symettric fall due to fire is very very wierd...demolition experts will say it was impossible. The offical explantion is not logical because it is not even possible.


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:15 | 2310810 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Only that the unadultered WTC7 collapse video DOES show an assymatric collapse.

Thats of course not the video that the 'truthers' will show you.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:20 | 2310839 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

I think you need help with your definintions. When an entire building collapses straight down, directly into its own footprint, that is symmetric. An assymetric collapse is when it falls in pieces at different times in different directions, with parts toppling over, etc...

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:28 | 2310876 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

For your edification:


"Conspiracy sites like to bring up the 'Symmetric Collapse' of building 7 and claim that the building should have fallen over to the south. They show grainy, dark photos of debris piles which were taken well after 9/11 and a debris pile with a grayish, smoky image of building 7 in the background. They deceptively show the north side which was relatively free of damage. As if the Tower should have reached over to the other side of the building and damaged that side too. "

Pictures and discussion halfway down the page should put this one to rest. Thanks for your attention.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:30 | 2312088 mvsjcl
mvsjcl's picture

Where do they even find these fucking people! For my edification? You're pulling my leg, right? Right? I mean, you aren't really serious, are you? Are you? Come on, now! Are you?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 07:58 | 2312373 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Another thing I've noticed about the troofers is whenever you present solidly backed facts that flies in the face of their expressed beliefs, the one stops posting and acknowledging your assertions, while another steps right in, only this time attempts at argument are replaced with inane spew and plain adhoms.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:12 | 2310790 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Thanks for outing yourself finally.

So, did you cut and paste that Popular Science article all by yourself?

Better go get you a new sock-puppet id now, as you've reached the end of the line with your FroggyGirl one.

BTW, your arguments might make sense had not the buildings all collapsed at near free-fall speed. Something which anyone with the least bit of engineering understanding would realize can only happen if there is NO RESISTANCE below it, like say 70+ stories of skyscraper.

As for Bldg. 7... well, you'd have to be an even bigger idiot to believe that 'collapse' story, as the building was about as asymmetrical as you can get, being built AROUND an existing ConEd power plant. Yet it fell perfectly into its own footprint, even though its skeleton had loads projecting in all sorts of directions as a result of its contstruction.

You might as well go find a new site to troll now, as your work here is done.


(oh, and on the rare chance you're legitimately this ignorant, STFU and go learn something real)

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:55 | 2310999 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

I've been here a lot longer than you have. Nice try buddy.


"Oh no, someone is challenging my thinking with facts and observable properties of matter! Time to shut my brain off and accuse her of being a government spy/robot/plant/gerbil"

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 22:32 | 2311714 FeralSerf
FeralSerf's picture

Do you work for a Zionist group -- they seem to be universal in their defense of the official conspiracy theory -- or do you suck on one of the government tits?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 23:38 | 2311900 Who is John Galt
Who is John Galt's picture

STFU you little ZIONIST bitch and go suck a Jew cock!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:37 | 2312095 mvsjcl
mvsjcl's picture

Keep pumping that line! The Fed's got your back!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:01 | 2312376 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Xenofrog wrote: "Oh no, someone is challenging my thinking with facts and observable properties of matter! Time to shut my brain off and accuse her of being a government spy/robot/plant/gerbil"


Responses to your post collected for display:


Do you work for a Zionist group -- they seem to be universal in their defense of the official conspiracy theory -- or do you suck on one of the government tits?

Who is John Galt:

STFU you little ZIONIST bitch and go suck a Jew cock!


Keep pumping that line! The Fed's got your back!

The irony can cut glass.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:00 | 2311222 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture

Near free fall = Bullshit. 15 seconds give or take is not freefall. 9 and a fraction seconds is. Gravitational acceleration is exponential, so a lead sphere falling from a distance of 2.5 times the height of either twin tower would have hit the ground at the same time as the tower roof. "Near free fall" sounds good but visually it's no match.

When you watch the video of a tower collapsing you see two parts, separated by the damage caused by the airplanes, collapsing simultaneously. The top is collapsing onto the bottom, and the bottom part is collapsing from the top down. The total collapse speed is the sum of those two parts' individual rates. Once the top part is completely collapsed, you can clearly see the towers collapse slow down, as only the bottom remains collapsing. Conspiratorial idiots like to take the collapse time when both sections are collapsing onto each other and extrapolate. But there are available video for each of the twin towers' collapses where the time of the sound of the actual collapses can be measured.

No, building 7 did not fall in it's footprint. Look long enough on line and you will find pictures of one side facing upward, taken from a nearby building, and another where #7's debris, several stories tall, have been cleared off an adjoining roadway over which it fell.


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:40 | 2312100 mvsjcl
mvsjcl's picture

Even NIST admitted free fall.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:48 | 2312109 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Where the fuck did you learn physics? Gravitational freefall is static based on the gravitation of the area. There's nothing exponential about it. For most of the planet it's around 9.81 m/s^2. No faster, no slower.Once it hit's it's terminal velocity it doesn't go any faster.


There's nothing worth commenting on in the rest of that rambling of ignorance.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 07:56 | 2312369 fnordfnordfnord
fnordfnordfnord's picture

Claims "There's nothing exponential about it."

Proceeds to cite Gravitational constant, inculding exponent.

Exponent, I do not think it means what you think it means.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:03 | 2312379 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

"There's nothing worth commenting on in the rest of that rambling of ignorance."

Irt. ignorance, why do you include terms that are irellevant or out of place in the context? 'gravitational freefall is static'?

Take a look in the mirror, dude.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 10:39 | 2312870 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture

32 feet per second, per second, shitforbrains. Tha's gravitational acceleration. Acceleration, Parrot, is exponential. Every second velocity increases 32 feet per second. So if one object drops from 64 feet and a second from 32 feet, it doesnt take twice the time to hit the ground (linear) it takes 1.4 times longer (square root of 2).

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 10:41 | 2312879 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:19 | 2310830 citizen2084
citizen2084's picture

The fact is there were 47 internal columns holding up the WTCs. You are correct in that the steel mesh outer screen was contemporary design in order to strengthen the building, but not for the reason you state, “to allow for open office space”.

The two buildings hit by planes were built to withstand just that type of event. Like a pencil through the screen over window doesn’t impair the rest of the screens structure a plane penetrating the WTCs outer screen would not impair the integrity of the entire outer structure.  The fact that a wayward bomber flew into the Empire state building just after WW2 was the reason that the architects designed the buildings to have to withstand a 767 flying right into them. I think it was 767 that was the largest commercial passenger plane when the building still in design.

Also “warming” steel may expand but it does not lose its integrity until well past 2,500 Fahrenheit, a temp level which is literally impossible in an open air fire. Anyway let’s put these points aside.

Do you assert that the 1,500+ architects and engineers for 911 (AE911truth dot org), do not understand engineering or physics?

The government isn’t inept.  Bureaucrats are inept. The folks that own our rethuglican and democrap politicians are far from inept.  You maybe inept, but not them.


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:30 | 2310881 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Since when was a jet fuel fire in a enclosed space, aided by open elevator shafts (which from the airflow start to act like blast furnaces) an 'open air fire'?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:50 | 2312113 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Blast furnaces use pure O2.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:05 | 2312384 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Right, and using a bellows to pump up a fire won't work, because atmosphering air only contains 21% O2.

Only, bellows work quite fine, and an ample updraft for a raging fire will likewise act quite well as a blast furnace.

Stop being disingenous.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:42 | 2310944 Belarusian Bull
Belarusian Bull's picture

I remember watching the collapse from another part of the planet live on TV... i was only 16 years old, and my thoughts were exactly "What a bullshit this show is"  


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:45 | 2310952 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Arnie in "Red Heat", watching cheap porn on a telly in a dingy Chicago hotel room:


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:45 | 2310956 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

Thankfully you ran with that first instinct instead of seeking out the facts and information that would show that it wasn't, in fact, a bullshit show.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 19:04 | 2311195 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

"Do you assert that the 1,500+ architects and engineers for 911 (AE911truth dot org), do not understand engineering or physics? "

Not as much as they are caught up with a poorly expressed sense of distrust of government.

Of course, if there are 1500+ at all; if the headcount is along the same lines as the global warming-denying OISM petition, then it's a far cray from that.

Oh, and consensus isn't science, right?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:00 | 2312375 fnordfnordfnord
fnordfnordfnord's picture

Now truthers are deniers too? Straw man

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:07 | 2312387 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

No, rather a show that "truthers" will grab onto whatever debris of their mythology that floats past, in order to throw something (anything!!) at us "paid government trolls" or "zionist robots" or whathaveyou...

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:07 | 2311322 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture

Completely wrong on all counts. The WTC 1 and 2 designs were to maximize floor space, which makes money but also created a design issue. The structure was designed to withstand aircraft hititng them but not fires against raw steel. Landing aircraft low on fuel, not those having just taken off, were considered. Code requires time for occupants to get out, not infinite structural capacity. Fires kept people trapped. And Steel looses 90% of strength between 750 and 900 degrees celsius. It melts at temperatures you mention.


Yes, those architects and engineersa are idiots - OR - they agree on further hearings but not that the airplanes didn't bring down the towers. ask the AIA their position.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:30 | 2310880 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

I do believe we have a new troll. 

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:47 | 2310696 Robot Traders Mom
Robot Traders Mom's picture



Paul Krugman is now posting as XenoFrog

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:52 | 2310706 easypoints
easypoints's picture

Read "Crossing the Rubicon" by Michale C. Ruppert before you come to conclusions on 9/11. On second thought, all of our conclusions are irrelevent. What's done is done and we have bigger problems now, but assuming something is impossible because it sounds impossible is the thought process of a sheep. 

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 16:57 | 2310734 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

A well educated person understands that the most logical explanation for an event is usually the correct one. Explanations that involve vast conspiracies with thousands of participants and billions of dollars of equipment and training are by their very nature impossible to keep from being discovered. I know you and your cabal of nutballs thinks you've figured it all out but most of what you rely upon as truth is actually rumor and conjecture that has been recycled over and over again until no one knows where it came from. Example: The "hundreds/thousands" (depending on who you ask) of israelis/jews/zionists who didn't show up to work at the WTC that day due to some early warning. It was a rumor started by a pro-palestinain tv station without any source or proof. Yet over thousands of times copied over and over on various 9/11 truther sites, it has mysteriously lost that biased sourcing and just become accepted truther fact of a zionist conspiracy.


It's mental.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:06 | 2310771 john39
john39's picture

logic eh?  a small group of muslims living in caves in Afghanistan destroy three skyscrapers (despite only allegedly hitting two) with nothing but box cutters?  is that the logic to which you refer?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:20 | 2310840 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Government makes it happen.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:59 | 2311009 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

no, a small group of very well funded islamic radicals perpetrated a very novel attack using boxcutters against people who had no expectation that the highjackings would result in being slammed into buildings at 500mph.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:32 | 2311381 easypoints
easypoints's picture

Xeno, buy Rubicon, write 600 pages with a thousand footnotes debunking it, and publish it. Someone has yet to do so, and we've all been waiting a decade.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:09 | 2312389 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

"Xeno, buy Rubicon, write 600 pages with a thousand footnotes debunking it, and publish it. Someone has yet to do so, and we've all been waiting a decade."

Sigh, the usual "argument", along the lines "go on this treasure hunt and find my arguments for me, and disprove them, because i cant and wont try to make a coherent argument myself."

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 10:49 | 2312906 easypoints
easypoints's picture

My argument is to simply suggest a well-researched piece on the subject. I'm not interested in regurgitating points from said book ad nasuium, or arguing the validity of those points.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:52 | 2312116 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Yes, because Islamic Fundamentalists had never hi-jacked planes before, and the FBI/CIA alphabet soup people hadn't said anything about it in the previous 10 years.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:20 | 2310837 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

XenoFrog, most people are pretty much set in their beliefs about this issue.

Believe it or not, the best explanation I've seen was the South Park episode The Mystery of the Urinal Deuce. This short clip offers a nice summary:


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:32 | 2310895 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Sad thing is that youre right; 10 years on, everything is deeply muddled up in popular mythology and (justified) distrust of government, and your average 'truther' has no reason to question their own beliefs.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:43 | 2310945 XenoFrog
XenoFrog's picture

I know it's largely a waste of time, but I don't want people to legitimately leave ZH thinking that we're all idiots who think Alex Jones has any interest other than to make money.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 19:07 | 2311203 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

I'll echo that. I have, what I feel is a healthy sense of distrust for authority, especially in these troubled and corrput times, but I'm also quite aware that jumping on any bandwagon to be able to rant at those i'm disgusted with (mostly government and corpocrats), including by means of conspiracyst mythology and outright lies, will do nothing other than to harm my own case.

Plus, i'm happy having feet with no gunshot wounds.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:10 | 2311465 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Hey froggy, can you hook me up with the dancing Israelis? Can you call some cousins or something and maybe they can check around? I'd love to get an interview.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:28 | 2311527 The Heart
The Heart's picture

Check out what is coming next:



Mon, 04/02/2012 - 20:16 | 2311332 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:08 | 2311458 phyuckyiu
phyuckyiu's picture

Hey froggy, tell us about the dancing Israelis that were in jail for a month and mysteriously released? That's all BULLSHIT, RIGHT?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:25 | 2311518 The Heart
The Heart's picture

"It's Mental."

OK, so you may be right about that little issue.

Sure glad someone around here knows what happened on that horrible day.

Perhaps you can answer these simple questions also since you seem to know all about what happened on 9/11.

Anxiously awaiting your valued answers.:


1. Why didn't jets intercept the airliners since they had numerous warnings of terrorist attacks?
2. Why did Ashcroft stop flying commercial, citing an unidentified "threat" in July 2001?
3. Why were there no photos or videos of the Pentagon plane?
4. Why didn't the Secret Service hustle Dubya out of the classroom?
5. Where was George H. W. Bush at the time of the attacks?
6. Why did passengers or crew members on three of the flights all use the term box cutters?
7. Where are the flight recorders?
8. Why were the FISA warrants discontinued?
9. How did Bush see the first plane crash on live camera?
10. Why was a security meeting scheduled for 9/11cancelled by WTC management on 9/10?
11. How did they come up with the "culprits" so quickly?
12. How did they find the terrorist's cars at the airports so quickly?
13. Why did Shrub dissolve the Bin Laden Task Force?
14. Why the strange pattern of debris from Flight 93?
15. Why was no plane seen at the Pentagon?
16. How extensive was the relationship between the Taliban, the ISI and the CIA?
17. What exactly was the role of Henry Kissinger at UNOCAL?
18. When was it decided to cancel building a pipeline from Turkmenistan through Afghanistan to Pakistan?
19. When was the decision made to send the FEMA to New York?
20. Why did FEMA spokesman Tom Kenney tell Dan Rather he was in New York on Sept. 10?
21. Why did the FBI in 1996 close the files to investigate Osama bin Laden's relatives in Washington?
22. Why did .Bush stop inquiries into terrorist connections of the Bin Laden family in early 2001?
23. Who made the decision to have John O'Neill stop investigating Al-ceada accounts?
24. Who gave the decision to give him a security job at the World Trade Center?
25. Did John O'Neill meet anyone of the FEMA in the night of September 10th?
26. What about media reports that hijackers bought tickets for flights scheduled after Sept. 11?
27. Why did none of the 19 hijackers appeared on the passenger lists?
28. Why would devout Muslims frequent bars, drink alcoholic beverages and leave their bibles?
29. Why would the hijackers use credit cards and allow drivers licenses with photos to be zeroxed?
30. Why did the hijackers force passengers to call relatives?
31. How did the hijackers change the flight plan without law enforcement or the military try to stop them?
32. Which hijacker's passport was found in the WTC rubble? Who found it and what time?
33. How could the FBI distinguish between "regular" Muslims and hijacker Muslims on those flights?
34. Why was there not one "innocent" Muslim on board any of these flights?
35. Did someone go through the passenger lists looking for Muslim names and label them as hijackers?

36. Did the Florida police provide information that Atta was searched because of 1) an expired Visa, 2) driving a car without a license, 3) because of an incident at Miami Airport?
37. Why did Atta leave his bag at the airport and the employees didn't put it on board?
38. Who found his bag? How can we be sure it was his bag?
39. Why did Atta place a video "how to fly planes", a uniform and his last will into his bag, knowing that he would commit suicide?
40. Why did Atta leave his drivers license in a rental car?
41. When did Atta train on a flight simulator?
42. Did Atta leave the US while in training and then return?
43. Why did Atta decide to study at Opa Locka, a famous hub of 6 Navy training bases and includes government partners like U.S. Coast Guard Air Station, Police (Miami-Dade) Aviation Unit?
44. Why was Atta allowed to study since he was stopped by the police for driving without a license and also for violating his visa?

45. Why were the Black Boxes never recovered?
46. Why didn't the FBI release the air traffic controller's protocols?
47. Why did the FBI not release the Flight Data Recorder info?
48. Who video-recorded the first plane hitting the tower? Why did he disappear from the media?

49. How did the FBI receive a tip from a passenger who boarded a different plane and reached his destination safely that he had a confrontation with two ME men at the Logan airport in Boston?
50. Who tipped the FBI to storm the Westin Hotel in Boston on September 12th?
51. Where did the photos of all 19 hijackers come from?
52. How were all hijackers identified just 2 days after the attack?
53. Why did all 19 names not appear on the passenger list 2 days after the hijacker list was released?
54. Why do none of the names appear on the passenger lists UA and AA gave to CNN?
55. How could the hijackers disable the defense systems?
56. Why did the FBI ignore Bin Laden's family, who left the United States without further investigation?
57. What about the supposed hijackers who are still alive?
58. Was there a reason to change the list of the original 19 hijackers?
59. What happened to Ayub Ali Khan and Mohammed Jaweed Azmath, who have been in jail since September 2001, because of possession of box cutters on a train? Who gave the tip to arrest them?
60. Why did it take 4 months before Ramsi Binalschibhs name was mentioned, since he was a good friend of Mohammad Atta and lived in his apartment in Hamburg?
61. Why did it take 4 months until December 11 to charge Zacarias Moussaoui for the 9/11 attacks when his case was known worldwide for months, but not mentioned in the American media?
62. Whatever happened with Lotfi Raissi, who was arrested in UK for teaching the terrorist pilots?
63. What is the current status of the investigation of Mamoun Darkazanli Import-Export-Company in Hamburg and Al Taqwa Management Organization in Lugano?
64. Why was Richard Reid able to enter the Paris airport twice and who paid for his hotel?
65. Who hired Zacarias Mouassoui to learn how to fly passenger jets in the United States?
66. Why did the FBI or CIA fail to interrogate him between August and December 2001?

67. Did the CIA monitor Bin Laden in 1998 with the help of 15 Afghan agents, paid $1,000/ month?
68. Where are these agents? Was Johnny "Mike" Spann one? Was John Walker Lindh one?
69. Is an Afghan agent a member of the ISI? Is an Afghan agent working for Bin Laden?
70. When was the first time Tenet mentioned the Al-Qaeda group to any member of the Senate?
71. Why did the Pentagon release a new video version or translation of the Bin Laden Home video?
72. Why it was released only 8 hours after translation by the German magazine MONITOR on December?
73. Why were the four translators prior US-Government workers?
74. When was the Bin Laden Home Video found and who found it?
75. Who found the video if Northern Alliance and US troops had not yet arrived in Kandahar or Jahalabad?
76. Does the timestamp on the Bin Laden video indicate that it was found two weeks after it was produced?
77. Why was the public not informed who found the video and when?
78. Why according to MONITOR magazine, were the most controversial statements translated incorrectly?
79. Why was the video released?
80. Who gave the final decision to release it?
81. Why is the Bin Laden video of June 2001 in which he praised the attack, available on the Internet?
82. What about Bin Laden's statements on Al-Jazeera in June 2001 about the bombing of USS Cole, which are similar to the statements on the November 2001 home   video?
83. Why did Bin Laden state in Umman Magazine in Sept. 2001, that he was not involved in the WTC?
84. Is Bin Laden still on the payroll of the CIA or ISI?
85. Did the Bin Laden Group Inc. help build Tora Bora with the CIA?
86. What was the purpose of the meeting with General Pervez Musharraf in May 2001?
87. Why was a statement released that Al-Khalifa bin Laden, who is not the mother of Bin Laden, had a telephone call with Bin Laden on September 9, rather than Alia Ghanem, his mother? Why did Alia Ghanem say she did not believe he planned the attack?

88. What happened on September 18th, when an employee of Batelle Memorial Institute was involved in a so-called anthrax hoax on that day? Was he arrested?
90. Why did the investigation of that case begin in December 2001?
91. What was in the memo of Dr. Leonard Horowitz, a public health consumer advocate and author of "Death in the Air" on October 1, 2001, almost two weeks before the first anthrax letter was sent from Trenton to the American media building in Boca Raton?
92. What about his letter of Nov. 13 in which he claimed that BAYER is behind the anthrax infections?
93. Did US BioDefense laboratories send the anthrax-laced letters to get a new budget for   research?
94. What about the statement of former UN-weapons inspector of Iraq, Richard Spertzel, who told ABC, "...he knows only five scientists in the USA who would be in the situation to produce such a fine, highly developed spore material"?
95. Why did it take 48 hours to inform Bob Stevens that he had anthrax?
96. Why were envelopes never found near Bob Stevens, Amelie Lundgren and Mia Nguyen?
97. How come Microsoft got a hoax anthrax letter from Malaysia on the same day that President Bush said Malaysia might be one of the next targets of the United States?
98. Why did the FBI never investigate the case Don Wiley, a Bioscientist who disappeared 11/13/01?
99. Why did the FBI begin to investigate after his body was found on December 22, 300 miles away?
100. Was there an investigation at the military hydro plant where workers found him?
101. Why did the media write different versions about how, when and where he was found?
102. Why did the police report change 2 months later from suicide to an accident?
103. What was the goal of Bioport in 1997?
104. Did development of anti-anthrax vaccines begin in 1998?
105. When did Bioport decide to produce anthrax vaccines?
106. Was it before or after Sept. 1998 that Admiral Crowe was put in charge of investigations of the August 7, 1998 bombings of Embassy Nairobi and Embassy Dar Es Salaam?
107. Did the schedule for developing anti-anthrax vaccines begin starting in 1998?
108. When did the US Government ask Bayer for help in developing a vaccine?
109. When did Bayer start sending the vaccines to the U.S.?
110. When did Bayer double production of the vaccines?
111. Was the death of Vladimir Pasechnik investigated? He was former director of the Institute of Ultra Pure Biochemical Preparations of the Soviet bio-warfare establishment Biopreparat in November 2001?
112. How are the deaths of scientists Robert M. Schwartz, Dr. Benito Que and Set Van Nguyen explained since all occurred in the same month? Is Set van Nguyen related to the anthrax victim Mia Nguyen?
113. What about the death of Nancy Sonnenfeld (FEMA-Wife)?
114. Why was the NJ Division of Fish and Wildlife examining Anthrax in August 2000?
115. Do any employees in Trenton have the same handwriting as printed on the Anthrax envelopes?
116. Is it just a coincidence that the laboratory is also based in Trenton?
117. Did the FBI ever ask Fort Detrick to examine anthrax spores?
118. What about the list of 15-20 labs (maintained by Barbara Rosenzweig) who used Fort Detrick spores?
119. Does the CIA have spores different from those at Fort Detrick?
120. Why did Tommy Thompson, The Secretary of the Department of Health and Human Services, and other Bush cabinet members meet secretly (i.e. illegally) in Oct. 2001 with officials of the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America (PhRMA) to develop plans for their Emergency Preparedness Task Force?
121. Why did he decide on October 25, 2001 to ask Congress for another $500 million to produce Acambis's smallpox vaccine?
122. Why did it take 4.5 hours until Jean Marie Malecki, Director Palm Beach County Health Department, picked up the phone for employees of the AMI-Building, Boca Raton. This is where editor Bob Stevens got anthrax. Why did she wait two days before she visited that building again?
123. Did Walter Gilbert, Director Myriad Genetics ever get official permission from relatives of those killed at WTC to examine their DNA?

124. Why did General Mahmud Ahmad, former head of the ISI quit his position?
125. Why did retaliation against the Taliban begin the day he stepped down?
126. Who in the ISI paid $100.000 to Mohammad Atta?
127. Why does Ahmad think that another secret service was involved in the WTC attack?
128. Which Secret Service was he referring to?
129. Did other ISI official's believe that?
130. Did officials of the CIA believe that?
131. Did some officials of the Mossad believe that?
132. What was the purpose of Ahmad's visit to Washington on 9/11?
133. Who told Russian Foreign Minister Ivanov to abort an air strike against Afghanistan in May 2000?
134. Did Russian intelligence notify the CIA in 2001 that 25 terrorist pilots had been training for suicide missions, as reported in the Russian press?

1. What did Kissinger mean that an "outside threat from beyond", a "world government" and "individual rights" who are "willingly relinquished for the guarantee of their well-being granted", what you mentioned in 1991 on a Bilderberg Conference?
2. What was his role at UNOCAL?
3. Is he in contact with representatives of these companies or institutions:
4. What did he discuss at the Bilderberg meeting last year in May 2001?
5. What was the purpose of his meeting with Moscow Mayor Yuri Luzhkov in July 2001?
6. Why does he write in "Toward a New Diplomacy for the 21st Century" that America doesn't need a Foreign Policy?
7. When was the last time Henry Kissinger met US-Ambassador in Pakistan, Robert Oakley?

1. Is it true that the CIA is in possession of PROMIS software?
2. What is the purpose of PROMIS?
3. Did A.B. "Buzzy" Krongard, CIA, own any stocks of United Airlines, American Airlines, Merrill Lynch,
4. Morgan Stanley, AXA Re (insurance) which owns 25% of American Airlines, and Munich Re.?
5. What is his connection to Alex Brown, Deutsche Bank?
6. Did he give any insider information about to George Tenet, CIA?
7. Who was the investor who purchased 2,000 UAL put options between August and September 11, 2001?
8. Did Deutsche Bank-Alex Brown own any stocks of UA, AA, Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, AXA Re (insurance) which owns 25% of American Airlines, and Munich Re?
9. What about the 2,500 UA-contracts which were "split into 500 chunks each, directing each order to different U.S. exchanges around the country simultaneously." on August 10, 2001?
10. Did Deutsche purchase UAL options in August 2001?
11. Why did DB-AB purchase 4,744 put options on United Air Lines stock as opposed to only 396 call s on September 6-7? What was the purpose of doing that?
12. What is the connection to Wally Kromgaard?
13. Did Deutsche Bank or Wally Kromgaard purchase 4,516 put options on American Airlines as compared to 748 call options on September 10?
14. What was the reason of Mayo Shattuck III re-assignment on September 15th?

1. When was the last time they met any representatives of the US-Government?
2. What was the purpose of these meetings?
3. Do the Taliban know Karl E. Inderfurth and State Department counterterrorism Chief Michael Sheehan?
4. Do they know which US-Representative said in February 2001: "Either you accept our offer of a carpet of gold, or we bury you under a carpet of bombs"?
5. When was the last time the Taliban was in touch with this representative?
6. Did Abdul Haq, the former Mujahedin leader executed Sept 2001 by the Taliban, decide in winter 2000 to attack the Taliban?
7. Did production of opium in Afghanistan fall from 3276 tonnes in 2000 to 185 tonnes in 2001?

1. Was Global Hawk technology able to remotely control unmanned planes in 1999 for 27 hours?
2. Did Northrop-Grumman use Global Hawk technology in the war in Afghanistan since October 2001?
3. What is the purpose of unmanned technology?
4. Is Northrop in contact with any engineers of Boeing?
5. Did Northrop install Global Hawk technology in a commercial airplane?

1. Did two U.S. carrier battle groups arrive in the Gulf of Arabia just off the Pakistani coast before 9/11?
2. Did 17,000 U.S. troops join more than 23,000 NATO troops in Egypt for Operation 'Bright Star' on 9/11? What was the purpose of both of these operations?

1. When did Tommy Franks learn that he would use Thermobarics in Tora Bora?
2. Does he know if it had been tested on December 12 in Nevada?
3. Who told Franks that Bin Laden might hide in Tora Bora?
4. Is the main purpose of Thermobarics to destroy buried bio and chemical stocks?
5. Was Thermobarics developed for the purpose to use one day in Iraq?
6. When was the first time Franks used Thermobarics?
7. Was it before or after the announcement of the end of ABM Treaty on December 11?
8. When did the US decide to use B61-11, the "nuclear version" of its "conventional" BLU-113 counterpart?
9. Why has the NSA destroyed data collected on Americans or US companies since the Sept. 11 attacks?

1. Why did Clinton abort an attack on Bin Laden in October 1999?
2. Who was responsible for that operation?
3. Why was the operation put on hold?
4. Why did Musharraf halt a covert operation to attack Bin Laden in October 1999?
5. Why did the GOP in Congress stop almost every move Clinton made against terrorism? They refused to believe reports and pass necessary legislation. In 1996 Clinton proposed a very extensive anti-terrorism regulation.

1. Who hired Richard Reid to threaten a passenger plane in Paris?
2. Who did he send an email to in Pakistan?
3. Has he ever been in touch with the ISI or CIA?
4. Did he know the difference between an explosive and a detonator?
5. How many ounces did he have in his shoes?
6. What size are his shoes?
7. Who build or prepared his shoes?

1. Has John Walker Lindh ever been in touch with the CIA?
2. Did he ever work for the CIA?
3. Who arrested him in 2001?
4. Why didn't he escape in the tumult to nearby Masar-e-Sharif?
5. Who hired his lawyer, Richard Brohanan? Who paid his lawyer?
6. Why didn't he go to Guantanamo Bay?

1. When did Cheney stop working for Halliburton?
2. Is he still in possession of any Halliburton stock?
3. Is he still in contact with Halliburton?
4. Was Halliburton invited to an oil conference in May 2002?
5. Does Cheney know when that meeting was planned?
6. Did Cheney have influence concerning Halliburton contracts with the Pentagon?
7. What exactly did Cheney decide to do on September 11th?
8. Did he speak with an Air Force Commander or Lt. Gen. Charles F. Wald on that day?
9. When did he inform the president about the hijacked airplanes on September 11?
10. Who called the White House on September 11 at 9:30 PM about a possible threat?
11. Why was no air security at the White House or the Pentagon at 9:30 PM?
12. When and who gave the approval to evacuate the White House at 9:45 PM?
13. What was the purpose of a meeting with Indian opposition leader Sonia Gandhi in June 2001 about a multimillion-dollar debt owed to Enron from a major energy project in Indian Power Plants?
14. When was the last time Cheney spoke with anyone from ENRON?

1. What was the role of Colin Powell?
2. Who decided to give $43 million in aid to the Taliban regime in May 2001?
3. Did he know that production of opium in Afghanistan fell from 3276 tonnes in 2000 to 185 in 2001?
4. What was the purpose of his decision to treat the Taliban prisoners as War Prisoners? Is this decision in any way related to media reports 2 days earlier that Powell may have been involved in negotiations with Indian Power Plants?
5. What was the purpose of his short trip to Latin America on September 11?
6. Who decided that he fly to Latin America on that day?
7. Why would someone threaten him in Afghanistan on January 17, 2002 as Newsweek reported?
8. What was the purpose of Powell meeting with India's foreign minister on April 6, 2001?
9. Did Enron or Cheney ask Powell to help collect a $64 million debt on an Indian plant project?

1. When was the last time George H.W. Bush traveled to South Arabia on behalf of the Carlyle Group?
2. What was the purpose of that meeting?
3. Why was Bush Sr. in Dealy plaza the day Kennedy was assassinated?
4. What connection did Bush Sr. have with the Gulf of Tonkin?       

1. Is Thomas White still in contact with ENRON?
2. Did his contact at anytime influence his decisions?
3. Does he still own ENRON stocks?

1. Did Vreeland warn Canadian Intelligence in May 2001 about possible terrorist
attacks on New York and the Pentagon?
2. Did he place the warning in an envelope while in prison in Toronto, Canada?
3. Where did he get his information?
4. Whom did he give the envelope to?
5. Why was he placed in jail?

1. Was the domain created on September 11th, 2000?
2. Who paid for that domain?
3. Are they also owners of Iridium Satellites?
4. When did they end contact with relatives of the Bush family?

1. When was the last time George H.W. Bush traveled to Saudi Arabia on behalf of the privately owned Carlyle Group, the 11th largest defense contractor in the U.S.?
2. What was the purpose of that meeting?
3. When did he resign from Carlyle Group?
4. Is he still in touch with any of their representatives?

1. Did Lander monitor a phone conversation between Zacarias Moussaoui and Richard Reid in Dec. 2000?
2. What did Lander tell representatives of the CIA about Zacarias Moussaoui?
3. Why did he stop monitoring Djamel Beghal, member of Takfir-wal-Hijra (financed by Osama bin Laden) in August 2001?

1. Did Bin Laden in July 2001 enter an American hospital in Dubai?
2. Did he arrive on July 4, 2001 on a flight from Qetta, Pakistan to American Hospital? 3. Was he at the hospital July 4-11, 2001?
4. Did Bernard Koval, CEO of American Hospital, ever speak with Doctor Terry Callaway about that visit?
5. Why did he change his statements about this story not being true and that he "asked around"?
6. What is the difference between Continuous Ambulatory Peritoneal Dialysis and Continuous Cycling Peritoneal Dialysis?
7. Did Koval know Larry Stevens?
8. Can Koval explain why Richard Labeviere, author of "Terror Dollars" (about illegal Al-Qaeda accounts), wrote the story about Osama Bin Laden's kidney operation?

1. What exactly happened on September 11 and at what time was President Bush informed?
2. Why was President Bush scheduled to visit a school in Florida?
3. Who scheduled the time of the visit?
4. When exactly did Bush learn about the first crash into the WTC?
5. How could he have seen that on TV?
6. Why didn't he interrupt his school meeting as soon as he learned of the first plane crash?
7. Did Bush ever wonder how Bin Laden was able to hear the first plane crash live on the radio?
8. Which radio station he was listening to?
9. Can Bush explain how Bin Laden's Home Video was found only two weeks after it was produced?
10. Why did Bush decide to release Bin Laden's Home Video?
11. What is the purpose of the Western Hemisphere Institute for Security Cooperation (WHISC) in Fort Benning, Georgia, where terrorists have been trained for undercover agents in South America? Bush stated "if any government sponsors the outlaws and killers of innocents, they have become outlaws and murderers themselves". So what does he think about Fort Benning?
12. What is the role of Zalmay Khalilzad (former UNOCAL) in the National Security Council?
13. What is the current role of Zalmay Khalilzad (former UNOCAL) in Afghanistan?
14. When was Bush's last contact with anyone from ENRON?
15. Why was China admitted to the WTO on September 13 after 15 years of unsuccessful attempts?
16. Why did Bush postpone the release of Ronald Reagan's records?
17. How does Bush feel about the need to investigate the CIA's mistakes?
18. Does Bush agree with senators John McCain, Joseph I. Lieberman, Porter J. Goss, former C.I.A. clandestine case officer and a Florida Republican, Richard C. Shelby and Ron Paul, US Congressman, who want an investigation and have said "Secret government is winning out over open government"?
19. Did he know before he left his hotel that morning on the way to the school that the 1st tower had been hit? ABC news reported that morning that he was asked by reporters if he was aware of events in NYC and he answered yes. If so, why did he later say he first heard of it was when he was at the school?
20. Why did Bush continue to sit in that classroom reading to children when he should have been conferring with his advisors?
21. Why did Bush say that he and Card initially thought it was an accident involving a small plane?
22. Given all the information sources available to the POTUS and his staff how could his people not have known the kind of plane involved?
23. Why didn't they know at this point, as did the FAA and NORAD, that aircraft were hijacked? The Battalion Chief in the 9/11 video was seen and heard asking for military backup immediately after the building was hit.
24. How come the NYFD knew it was terrorism right away but the POTUS and his aides just calmly went about their business?

1. Were 25,000 British troops and the largest British Armada since the Falkland Islands War, part of Operation 'Essential Harvest' pre-positioned in Oman, the closest point on the Arabian Peninsula to Pakistan before September 11, 2001?
2. When did he begin to place SIS-Special Forces in Afghanistan? Why?
3. Is Tony Blair a bi-sexual?

1. Did Gloria Irish own unit 1504 at the Delray Racquet Club, 755 Dotterel?
2. Did she rent that property to Hamza Alghamdi in August 2001?
3. Why did the media not report about a connection of the Sun-Sentinel and the hijackers?
4. Why did it first appear that the hijackers had something to do with the anthrax attacks?
5. Why has this connection or coincidence never appeared in the media again?
6. What was the connection between husband Michael Irish (Sun Sentinel) and Bob Stevens (who died from Anthrax)?

1. When did Vladimir Putin warn the CIA about a possible terrorist attack and what was their reaction?
2. What was the purpose of the meeting between Christina Rocca, director of Asian affairs at the State Department and the Taliban ambassador Mollah Abdul Salam Zaeef in Islamabad in August 2001?
3. Why did she oversee the delivery of Stinger missiles in the 80s to Afghan mujaheddin?
4. Did Walid Arkeh in Seminole County jail inform the FBI in August 2001 about an attack on America? What was the reaction of the FBI?
5. Why did Dr. Jeffrey Starr, U.S. department of defense, visit Tajikistan in Jan 2001?
6. When did Jean-Claude Cousseran, Director DGSE, and French Secret Service inform the CIA about terrorist attacks on America? What was their reaction?
7. What does he know about the monitoring of Djamel Beghal, member of Takfir-wal-Hijra (financed by Osama bin Laden) and Kamel Daoudi? Did he ever inform the CIA about that? And when?
8. When did Italian Deputy Prime Minister Gianfranco Fini inform the CIA about a possible attack on the American president "with the use of an airplane"? What was their reaction?
9. When did President Mubarak, Egypt, inform the CIA about a possible attack on America with an "airplane stuffed with explosives"? What was their reaction?
10. When did Efraim Halevy, Director of Mossad since 1998 (unconfirmed) inform the CIA about a possible attack with "200 terrorists" on America? What was their reaction?
11. Is it true he warned Ariel Sharon not to travel to New York on September 11 to speak at a festival?
12. Did a caller to Loxley Banks, Director Radio Cayman Islands talk show, give several warnings of an imminent attack on the U.S on Sept. 3 -10?
13. The London Times reported that someone from the FAA warned Salman Rushdie not to travel to the United States on September 3rd? If this is true, who was it?
14. Did the FBI investigate the two men who met Mohamed Atta and Marwan Al-Shehhi in Harry's Bar at the Helmsley Hotel in Manhattan on September 8, 2001?
15. Who does Abdullah Abdullah (Northern Alliance) believe killed Commander Ahmad Shah Massoud on September 9, 2001?
16. When and why did he decide to attack Kabul on September 11 at 5:30 PM?
17. When did he decide to invade Masar-i-Scharif?
18. Did the CIA help him provoke a tumult?
19. Did he ever meet John Walker Lindh?
20. Why was Major John Kenny, Commander Wright Patterson Air Base, Dayton placedon high alert on September 10? Did he inform companies in Dayton to shutdown their offices?
21. Why was Colonel William M. Dietrich, Commander Defense Language Institute in Garrison, Monterey on high alert on September 10?
22. Why did one of Kenneth (Ken) Weinbrecht (President SAMS) executives say on September 10, that he was a Wildcard? Ruthless and cunning. Has capability to target US forces and make it look like a Palestinian/Arab act.'"
23. Did Jean-Louis Bruguiere, French anti-terrorism, inform the CIA on September 10 about a possible terrorist attack? If so, what was their reaction?
24. Why did Atta and hijacker Abdulaziz Alomari checke into a Portland, Maine motel (unidentified) on September 10?
25. Why was the Portland, Airport, according to eye-witnesses, in full charge of more military officials and soldiers than usual, weeks before September 11, 2001?
26. Why, as the San Francisco Chronicle reported, was Mayor Brown warned to be "cautious in your travel" the night of September 10? Who warned him?
27. Why did Alex Diamandis, Odigo Vice President of Sales and Marketing, receive a warning on his messenger service about a possible attack on America on September 11, 2001? At which time?
28. When did Dr. August Hanning, President BND (Bundesnachrichtendienst Germany) inform the CIA that "Middle Eastern terrorists are 'planning to hijack commercial aircraft?” What was their reaction? Did he allow an Iranian prisoner in Hamburg call to the CIA in summer 2001 about an attack on America? What was their reaction?

1. Why did Kenneth Waldie, Stanley Hall, Herbert Homer and Peter Gay of Raytheon travel on Sept. 11?
2. Can Global Hawk technology be used for at least 27 hours?
3. Is Global Hawk technology used in commercial airplanes?
4. Did Danielle O'Brien, air traffic controller, inform another air traffic control center about a plane traveling fast southwest of Dulles after spotting it 8:18 AM on September 11?
5. Who was informed and what happened?

1. Why didn't Dr. James G. Roche, Secretary of the Air Force try to reach the airplanes in NYC (7 minutes time for McGuire AFB in New Jersey ) and at the Pentagon (10 minutes time)?
2. Did Roche ever try to shutdown the plane in Pennsylvania?
3. Can Roche explain why magazines of that plane were found 20 miles away from the crash? Andrews AFB is 13 miles away. He had one hour and fifteen minutes to respond to the plane that hit the Pentagon. What happened during that time?
4. Can he explain why many ear- and eye witnesses, including workers of the road construction company New Enterprise saw or heard F-16 jets?
5. Why did President Bush say only one week later that he tried to shutdown that plane?
6. Who gave that decision?

1. Why did George Bush leave Barksdale Air Force Base aboard Air Force One and flew to an Air Force base in Nebraska on 1:48 PM on September 11 and returned to Washington at 4:30 PM?
2. What exactly did Donald Rumsfeld do that day before he arrived at the Pentagon around 3:55 PM?
3. How did Rumsfeld know at 5:30 PM on September 11 that the plane in Pennsylvania could have been headed for one of three possible targets: Camp David, the White House or the U.S. Capitol building?
4. Can he explain why early media reports told us that no squadrons of combat-ready fighter jets have been at Andrews and later changed their reports that they haven't been on high alert only?
5. Why was Air Force Lt. Col. Vic Warzinski, another Pentagon spokesman, so sure on September 11 that aircraft was coming your way?
6. What did the D.C. Air National Guard in Washington do on September 11?
7. Can he explain what those 3 fighters did from 9:40AM until 9:55AM when they finally turned towards Flight 93 and were 60 miles out at 10:06am?
8. Can he explain why Air Traffic Controllers in a Nashua Telegraph article did report an F-16 was circling Flight 93 and was in visual range at the time of crash?
9. Can he confirm a witness report that National Guard F-16's have been at Hancock field in Syracuse NY in the air early that morning before 9AM?
10. How could the hijackers know how to disable defense systems?
11. What was the official reason that fighters of the 305th Air Wing, McGuire Air Force Base, NJ did not intercept the 2nd hijacked plane in NYC? This would have been possible within 7 minutes after 8:48 AM
12. Why did none of the 459th Aircraft Squadron (Andrews AFB) fighters intercept the plane which crashed into the Pentagon? Andrews AFB is 10 miles from Washington DC.
13. Col. Ken McClellan, Air Force spokesman said on September 11, that Mohammad Atta attended the International Officer's School at Maxwell/Gunter Air Force Base in Montgomery, and was seen by eye-witnesses? What was McClellan doing there? Why did he later deny the report?
14. Why did he decide not to shutdown ECHELON base Bad Aibling in Germany as planned for 2002?
15. What is the reason that none of any Air Force fighters reached the hijacked plane in time?
16. Many eye- and witnesses think that the plane in Pennsylvania was shot down. What is the scientific explanation why the magazine of the airplane was found many miles away?
17. Why did Jack Kelly,, inform USA Today only 12 minutes after the first crash (8:48AM) that terror groups using Web encryption may have been responsible? And why was he so sure before the second crash at 9:03 PM?
18. Did Kelly serve with the U.S. government where he managed several significant programs for the information warfare and intelligence communities?
19. Did Joseph J. Esposito, Chief of NYPD try to contact the Pentagon at 9:06 AM on September 11? What was their reaction?
10. Why didn't General Elwood "Pete" Quesada of the FAA inform President Bush between 8:15 and 9:05 about four simultaneously hijacked planes? Who did he inform and what was their reaction?

1. What does Nicholas Scoppetta of FDNY know about the latest reports of the WTC destruction?
2. Can he explain why many witnesses saw and heard more than two explosions in the WTC?
3. Can he explain why both Twin Towers and Building 7 collapsed in that way?
4. Can he explain why a gas tank was in Building 7?
5. Can he explain why there were no passengers in the subway under the WTC?
6. Can he explain why there was no guard at the gold reservoir under the WTC?
7. Why did Dr. Jeffrey P. Koplan, Director CDC prepare, as CNN reported, emergency-response teams on September 11 at 11:16 PM?

1. When did Dr. August Hanning, President BND (Bundesnachrichtendienst Germany) inform the CIA that "Middle Eastern terrorists are 'planning to hijack commercial aircraft?"  What was their reaction? Did he allow an Iranian prisoner in Hamburg call to the CIA in summer 2001 about an attack on America? What was their reaction?
2. When did Tayseer Allouni, Kabul correspondent Al-Jazeera, receive his first video from Bin Laden? Can he explain why the first video on October 7 2001, the day of the retaliation, looked like it was recorded in the morning?
3. Did Tom Simmons (former U.S. Ambassador to Pakistan), Karl Inderfurth (former Assistant Secretary of State for South Asian affairs) and Lee Coldren (former State Department expert on South Asia) decide or announce in a July 2001 meeting that an attack was planned on the Taliban in October 2001?
4. Why did Ms. Barbara Bodine, US ambassador to Yemen stop John O'Neill from investigating Al-Qaeda accounts in July 2001?
5. Did Niaz Niak, former Pakistani Foreign Secretary say in mid July 2001 that the USA planned military action against Osama Bin Laden and the Taliban?
6. Did Hameed Gul, retired Pakistani general of Pakistan's Inter Services Intelligence, say that a secret service was involved in the attack on America?
7. Why did Tommy Thompson, The Secretary of the Department of Health and Human Services, and other Bush cabinet members meet secretly (i.e. illegally) in Oct. 2001 with officials of the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America (PhRMA) to develop plans for their Emergency Preparedness Task Force? Why did he decide on October 25, 2001 to ask Congress for another $500 million to produce Acambis's smallpox vaccine?
8. Why did it take 4.5 hours until Jean Marie Malecki, Director Palm Beach County Health Department, picked up the phone for employees of the AMI-Building, Boca Raton? This is where editor Bob Stevens got anthrax. Why did she wait two days before she visited that building again?
9. Why did Mayor Guilani sell WTC rubble to India for recycling and also China? Who made that decision?
10. What was the purpose of U.S. Ambassador Wendy Chamberlain's phone call on October 10, 2001 to the Pakistani oil minister? Why was she sure that a previously abandoned Unocal pipeline from Turkmenistan across Afghanistan to the Pakistani coast for the purpose of selling oil and gas to China, was back on the table in view of recent geopolitical developments?
11. What exactly was found on Z. Moussaoui's computer after 9/11, when local agents were given a Federal Intelligence Security Act (FISA) warrant, which they had requested six weeks previously? This ties directly into the question of the administration's dealings with the Taliban, its reluctance to investigate Saudi nationals, etc.
12. Why the attack on Cynthia McKinney for asking: 1) why has there been no investigation of the 9-11 attack? and 2) did Bush/CIA/NSA know of it beforehand, and allow it to happen?
13. Why is the Bush administration so strongly against a real investigation into the events of 9-11?
14. Why did the US give 43 million dollars to Afghanistan back in May or June of 2001? 15. Why did Bush toss the Hart-Rudman terror security study (developed over a 2 year period) and instead assign responsibility to Cheney and FEMA?
16. Why did Ashcroft stops flying commercial, citing an unidentified "threat" in July 2001? Why did the FBI and Justice not identify the form, origin and time of the threat?
17. Why did Bush stay in Texas for the month of August and Cheney in Wyoming?
18. Why no photos or videos of the Pentagon plane? And there's not a single credible frame of film or second of video of this? Also, why hasn't a similar flight path graphic ever been published?
19. Why didn't the Secret Service hustle Dubya out of the classroom a half-second after Andy Card told him, "Mr. President, the nation is under attack"?
20. Why did they leave him exposed to danger for two and a half minutes in the classroom and another half-hour in the school before he returned to the relative safety of Air Force One?
21. Where was George H. W. Bush at the time of the attacks?
22. Why did passengers or crewmembers on three of the flights tell people on the ground that the hijackers had "box cutters"?
23. Where are the flight recorders?
24. How did they find a passport that just "happens" to belong to one of the hijackers in the WTC rubble and they can't locate even ONE flight recorder?
25. Why no investigative reporting of the Pentagon scene? The photos do not show much, but then photographers were not allowed, initially, to photograph the scene, if I remember correctly.
26. Why was the series of recommendations Al Gore also put together in 1996 on airport security called by Republican congress "paranoid" and too harsh. Why did the airline industry, lobbying against it, consider it too expensive and impractical?
27. Why was the Hart-Rudman report on the potential dangers of terrorism in the homeland? The results of the research ignored by Bush?
28. Why were FISA warrants disallowed by Bush?
29. Why did the US pull the plug on Muslim websites Monday September 10, 2001?
30. Why did the Saudi bin-Laden-group have a website with a PRE-SET expiration date of Sept. 11, 2001?
31. Why were the bin Ladens flown out of the U.S. on private jets the day after the 9/11?
32. Why did Cheney say that everyone in the White House started taking Cipro on September 12 when the first anthrax letter wasn't postmarked until September 18?
33. Why did Bush dissolve the Bin Laden Task Force? What would have happened had this focused and knowledgeable group been in place 9 months before 911?
34. Why was metallic debris found 8 miles from the crash site of the plane that went down in Penn? They said it went straight down and left a small hole in the ground. If they found metallic debris from the plane 8 miles away it was either shot down or a bomb exploded in the plane.
35. Why did they not let the media or any reporters take video or photos of the crash site?


Mon, 04/02/2012 - 22:40 | 2311741 forexskin
forexskin's picture

big ragin' up-on for gross work impression - thatsa lotta words

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 23:44 | 2311915 Who is John Galt
Who is John Galt's picture

good LORD! talk about a mountain of evidence. but, thats ok. OJ was innocent remember?

can the bitch refute all of this? or does OJ need to try on the glove?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:13 | 2312396 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Who is John Galt posted: "can the bitch refute all of this? or does OJ need to try on the glove?"

It's remarkable how much emotion these 'truthers' put into their debates, esp. irt. personal attacks.

As to the debate M.O. of posting a wall of text, entirely cut-n-pated from somewhere else, and requiring that the opponent debunk all of it....

Of course, should "the bitch" choose to spend her time doing so, you quite aware that the outcome would be (assuming the 'truthers' were still around to listen, which they of course wouldn't be - they'd have moved on to the next hapless thread or target to hose down with bile and emotional outbursts) more insults, talk-arounds and further appeals to conspiracy, as it always is with conspiracists.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:00 | 2310745 aerojet
aerojet's picture

I'm not sure I follow.  It can be both that the government perpetrated 9/11 and is also incompetent. It's not like the whole massive organization was involved, just a small, compartmented group of people in one of the intelligence services who moved the project along and removed any roadblocks put in place by remaining pockets of competence within agencies such as the FBI. Why is that so hard to understand?  Either a bunch of know-nothings from Saudi led by a blind sheik perpretrated the world's greatest financial crime, or they were materially aided so that there would be terrorism drills taking place on just the right day and locations in order to add to the cognitive dissonance as well as a coordinated release of anthrax to further scare the populace while eliminating any roadblocks to the pasage of key legislation to enable all the the various schemes the PNAC had devised ahead of time. 

I don't know why the buildings fell straight down.  I do know that Building 7 received no direct hit from a plane and was demolished for reasons not completely related to its structural integrity, as though some kind of crime had to be concealed or perhaps other evidence of corruption conveniently eliminated permanently.  

9/11 is the mother of all false-flag operations to date.  There's just too many coincidences and events such as members of the Bin Laden family being spirited out of the US while no other commercial planes were allowed to fly.  How does that get arranged like that?  It was a tremendous coup and it helped stave off the collapse until 2008 while lining the pockets of the power elite in the process.  Think of it like a giant bank robbery amongst loosely associated insiders, the majority of whom did not directly know what was going to happen, only that something big would happen and that they should position themselves accordingly, so that's why you have the WTC property changing hands shortly before the event and the big insurance policy taken out on it, the anonymous people who bought put options on the airlines, and so on.  Some people definitely knew something and acted on it.



Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:36 | 2310912 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

thats right folks!  the government is way to stupid to pull off somthing that requires so much planning and organization.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 02:03 | 2312131 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Yet they can perform surgical strikes with Tomahawk missiles and SEAL teams.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:09 | 2312388 fnordfnordfnord
fnordfnordfnord's picture

I get your imagery. A group of trained seals* who are very good bowlers, simultaneously performing surgery. But what do the missiles have to do with anything?

* The Sea World kind? It's been a while, I really must go and see that show again! They've apparently made tremendous progress training them.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:12 | 2310970 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Well... would it actually take 'thousands' of people to be in on it?

And does jet fuel burn hot enough (in an oxygen-poor environment, yet!) to melt/sufficiently weaken structural steel? Plenty of engineers think not:

And that WT7 business.. that's a bit fishy, no? No tonnes of jet fuel to bring that baby down.

Now... where's that doggie toy? I love the smell of doggie toy in the morning.. it's... it's the smell of victory!

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 21:02 | 2311439 tmosley
tmosley's picture

How many thousands of charges need to be set to bring down a building like the WTC?  How could you possibly keep that many people quiet after they saw that they had really, really participated in that act of mass murder of their own people?  

Truthers believe in evil mutants.  But there aren't a lot of people like that, and they certainly don't organize and play nice with each other.

Ask your engineers whether or not anything ELSE in those towers could burn hot enough to melt or weaken steel that had had its insulation blasted off.  Here's a hint--charcoal burns hot enough to SMELT the stuff.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 18:32 | 2311112 Angus195
Angus195's picture


If you are truly this ignorant, you have my deepest sympathies. 

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 19:17 | 2311227 maximin thrax
maximin thrax's picture

Xeno displays knowledeg and courage. You? Not so much of either.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:37 | 2311432 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture



I am just in awe of the kind of rationalization required to simultaneously believe that the federal government is incompetant (which it is) yet in the case of 9/11, pulled off the greatest piece of open-air theater ever accomplished without anyone spilling the beans.

Who said anything about the federal government being incompetent?  Not me. 

They're smart enough to fool all the sheeple into believing they're trying to help the economy recover.

They appear incompetent at it because they're not trying to help the economy recover.  They couldn't care less about the economy.

And yes, this government is quite capable of pulling off a huge false flag event like WTC.

The only incompetent people are the ones believing it was done by a few arabs.  Anyone believing that ridiculous story is just plain stupid.

And no, fire has never brought down a steel skeleton skyscraper.  Never.  Ever.

You have to be deliberately blind to the facts to believe it could and would.  There's more than enough evidence to show what really happened. You just ignore it.

People believe what they wana believe.  Facts don't matter.  Evidence doesn't matter.  That's why discussing 9/11 with a cofirmed koolaid drinking believer is a waste of time.  Their mind is made up.  It's not gonna change regardless of how many facts and how much evidence you show them.

Trying to change their mind is lunacy also.  A waste of time.

By the way folks, this thread illustrates why there won't be a revolution in America.   Too many koolaid drinking morons believing any bullshit the government tells them.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 01:32 | 2312090 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

Who said they were incompetent?

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 17:11 | 2310787 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

Blah blah.

Stay on topic. How many thousands of peopel do you think was involved in the conspiracy to bring down the WTC, and bust the pantagon, and remove an entire planeload of people and la la la...

And why hasn't anyone spoken out?

They're a mighty tightlipped bunch, I'd say.

Mon, 04/02/2012 - 23:12 | 2311828 FeralSerf
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Less than a thousand.  Some of them are Israeli government employees sworn to secrecy.  The rest know what the penalty is (death) for exposing the operation, besides the obvious possibility of prosecution for accessory to murder.  Some of them are already dead.  They were well compensated.

The military has been involved in many operations/conspiracies  that had thousands involved that were kept secret.  How about the conspiracy to bomb Japan with an atomic bomb, for example?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 08:25 | 2312417 Death and Gravity
Death and Gravity's picture

"The military has been involved in many operations/conspiracies that had thousands involved that were kept secret. How about the conspiracy to bomb Japan with an atomic bomb, for example?"

The scientists and personell working on the Manhattan project in question were locked down tightly in a camp. Besides, the peopel in the top slots later came very public with their disdain and ethical outrage over the methods and use of their developments. Later, what set off the cold war was the nabbing of the nuclear bomb designs by the russians.

All government employees in places of confidentiality are sworn to secrecy, are they not? Yet both can be considered leaks.

"The rest know what the penalty is (death) for exposing the operation,"

That hasn't dissuaded many humans of different nations from exposing and protesting what they saw as outrageous and inhumane.

" besides the obvious possibility of prosecution for accessory to murder."

I think that ranks very low on the list of reasons not to disclose a massive government false flag operation.

And, not even considering how looselipped people tend to be when either alcohol or monetary rewards are involved.... still no whistleblowers, considering the ease of which government dirty laundry can be aired these days?

By the way, I'd guess that WikiLeaks would have some dirt on the WTC coverup by now (assuming it was there), but I've heard nothing to suggest that.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:58 | 2314895 FeralSerf
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There is some evidence that Wikileaks is another Zionist operation.

Like that famous Ashkenazi "Jew" Lenin said: "The best way to control the opposition is to lead it ourselves."

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