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"Every Former MF Global Account Faces A Margin Call" - Non-CME MF Global Transfers Get The Monday Blues

Tyler Durden's picture


If you are a former MF Global account and you have your account transferred over to RJ O'Brien, or many others, you will have no choice but to fork out a bunch of cash to keep positions on, according to a statement awaiting all such accounts on the RJO website, or else be next in line for broad liquidations. To wit: "Former MF Global customers transferred to R.J. O’Brien were delivered with approximately 75% of the maintenance margin requirement related to their accounts. As a result, every former MF Global account faces a margin call. No excess equity was transferred." Naturally the next question is "Why are we not getting 100% of our MMR (Maintenance Margin) from the exchange?" And the answer: "This is an agreement between the trustee and CME Group. Please visit for further information or questions." So, in addition to lowering initial margin for everyone, not just MF Global clients, did the CME iron out preferential terms over other exchanges and get larger equity of the account transfer than most? Because somehow we doubt that RJ O'Brien is the only exchange that is greeting their clients with this particular notice.

Full FAQ for All R.J. O'Brien customers:

R.J. O’Brien Margin Policy Update for Former MF Global Customers

Former MF Global customers transferred to R.J. O’Brien were
delivered with approximately 75% of the maintenance margin requirement
related to their accounts. As a result, every former MF Global account faces a margin call. No excess equity was transferred.

All former MF Global customers must wire R.J. O’Brien additional
monies to bring their account above its initial margin requirement or
liquidate their current trading positions.

If the account did not contain a trading position, former MF
Global customers must wire or mail R.J. O’Brien funds to initiate
trading as no excess equity was transferred.

All Margin Calls Must Be Met By Wire

Former MF Global customers will need to begin initiating payment
to meet margin calls immediately. Customers will need to wire monies
to the following account:

Harris Bank, Chicago IL
ABA #071-000-288
R.J. O’Brien Cust Seg Funds
FFC: Customer Account Name
FFC: Customer Account Number

If funds are not received by the close of
business (4:00 PM CST) Monday, November 7, 2011, your account will be
subject to liquidation.

After your account has been properly margined, the regular R.J. O’Brien margin policy will be in effect.

Who is now clearing my account?

  • Individual trading and some other accounts formerly cleared by MF Global are now cleared by R.J. O’Brien.

When will I be able to trade my account?

  • We anticipate you will be able to trade at the regular Sunday
    evening market opening(s) for the trade date of Monday, November 7,

How do I log in? Will I see my positions?

  • Log in to the MF page as you did before, using your
    current account number and preferred platform. Your positions that were
    transferred will be accessible via your platform.

What if there are discrepancies with my account balance or transferred positions?

  • Contact your trade desk or broker for assistance.

Has my account number changed?

  • Yes. See the list below to determine your new number. For example, if you account number started with 550, it’s now U50.

    Z = will preface any offices that start with a blank
    Y = 1
    X = 2
    W = 3
    V = 4
    U = 5
    T = 6
    S =7
    H = 8
    Q =9

What numbers do I call or night or day order entry?

  • Any phone numbers and personnel you currently use are still active.

What exactly moved over from my position at MF Global?

  • Open positions on U.S. futures exchanges were transferred to RJO.
    These include positions on CME Group (including CME, CBOT and NYMEX),
    ICE Futures U.S., Kansas City Board of Trade, Minneapolis Grain
    Exchange, NYSE Liffe U.S. and CBOE Futures Exchange (CFE).
  • All account types, including individual, IRA, trust, joint, corporate, etc. were transferred.

Will positions on international exchanges move to RJO?

What If I did not have positions on, only cash?

  • If you only had cash in your account, this equity did not transfer and resides with the trustee. Please visit
    for information on how to obtain these funds. However, you do have an
    account on record with R.J. O’Brien and can trade after funding it. See
    funding instructions below or at

Can I trade open outcry markets?

  • Call your trade desk or broker for assistance.

Where do I get my quotes and charts?

Who should I contact about receiving the cash in my account that did not transfer?

If I go on margin call because my entire account balance did not transfer, what do I do?

  • You will be required to properly fund your account to meet margin
    requirements, or you will need to liquidate your positions to increase
    the equity in your account. R.J. O’Brien’s margin policy is available at

Why are we not getting 100% of our MMR (Maintenance Margin) from the exchange?

  • This is an agreement between the trustee and CME Group. Please visit for further information or questions.

What happens if I had an account at R.J. O’Brien and MF Global?

  • You will have two separate accounts.

Will my commission structure change?

  • We are committed to maintaining the current structure. Your
    statement may contain a different rate, but it will be subsequently

How do I access my statement?

  • If you traditionally receive your statement via email or mail, you
    will continue to receive it. If you receive it via your platform, call
    your trade desk for assistance.

I want to close my account and/or transfer to another broker.

  • To close your account, see wire instructions below. To transfer to
    another broker, contact that broker, who will facilitate the process.

I have a broker-assisted account. Can I still trade with my current market strategist?

  • Yes.

What if I have a deliverable position?

  • At this time, the clearing houses have not yet made a decision on the delivery process. Please contact your broker or for further details.

How long do I have to meet my margin requirement?

  • As soon as possible; call your trade desk or broker for assistance.

How do I send money to my RJO account?

  • Please send checks by express mail to:
  • RJO Treasury Department
    222 South Riverside Plaza
    Suite 900
    Chicago, IL, 60606

  • We will also accept wire transfers. Please use the following wire instructions:
  • United States Dollar-Customer Segregated, Fed wire instructions:
    Harris Bank, Chicago IL
    ABA #071-000-288
    R.J. O’Brien Cust Seg Funds
    FFC: Customer Account Name
    FFC: Customer Account Number

What are the wire cut-off times?

  • Inbound or outbound is 11:00 a.m. CT.

Can you accept checks made out to MF Global?

  • No. Please make checks payable to R.J. O’Brien.

Do you accept ACH deposits from clients?

  • We will be able to accept ACH’s after the first of the year.
  • ACH set-up forms will be made available in the coming days.

I’m a Schwab at MF Global client. Can I still do an internal transfer between my futures and equity Schwab account?

  • No, this service is not available at this time.

Who do I contact with questions about my Schwab at MF Global account?

  • Contact your usual Schwab at MF Global representative and/or trade desk.


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Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:21 | 1852114 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Jumping jmminy! Great post!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:56 | 1852160 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Margin call, bitchez.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:20 | 1852240 aus_punter
aus_punter's picture

Hey Lennon Hendrix, you are clearly a fucking moron


As a non US based customer of MF I have been unable to close out any positions since the week before last, so, I now have not only the potentially high liability of my positions going against me, but I could lose money as the firm margin calls me or "may" get closed out at a later date, but who knows ? It looks like US based customers (by virtue of having their accounts transferred to other brokers) will at least get the opportunity to close out positions .... something I do not have. 


Fuck you Corzine you fucking cunt. And fuck you CME for not only destroying the integrity of one of the oldest markets in existence but by preserving some clients ahead of others by preferential deal swith the trustee.


And to all the arseholes like Lennon Hendrix who have the "intellect" to post things such as "Margin call , bitchez" ..... an especially big fuck you too.  You are either on the same side as the kleptocrats and hence you are applauding their efforts with your posts or you are just an immature fuckstick.



Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:10 | 1852258 foofoojin
foofoojin's picture

I assure you the rapping is universal. only the most well connected are getting covered. do not be divided by the differing levels of injustice. you choose to play the game and the rules got change. what the hell did you expect to happen? you expected a fair playing field. you expected contracts to be honored? the hunt brother never tried to corner the market. CME raised margins multiple time in several days and implemented a no-rollover a the end of the month. you see there is an inner circle . and anytime a member has a problem and the pain can be pushed to the non inner members. the rules are changed. THE ONLY WINNING MOVE IS NOT TO PLAY.


How many players? enter ZERO     (yes it is that reference to Wargames. GD word used if that constitutes NSFW)

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:52 | 1852382 j0nx
j0nx's picture

I agree 110%. A fool and his money are soon parted. Anyone still in this market will either win big or lose bigger. Aus, you rolled the dice and you lost so don't expect any sympathies around here. We've been talking about MF going tits up for weeks at the TF before they did anyway so if you missed the opportunity to cash out then that's on you. I feel your pain but you fucked up plain and simple. Rules do not apply to these people because we allow them to get away with it. As I have said numerous times before, that will continue happening until it doesn't and the people get sick of being fleeced. GL with closing your positions mate.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:07 | 1852264 Ponziconomy
Ponziconomy's picture

Truth aus_punter. What these knuckleheads don't realize, and what those of us with an international account exposure have suffered (including Lehman bk), is bankruptcy laws vary insanely from country to country. Once a BK arrives, just because you dealt with a US-based company does not mean that you will be treated under US bankruptcy protections. And, what looks like goo-less ass stabbing, is simply a function of the Trustee fucking everyone they can to keep the US complaints to a minimum. Without knowing your situation, I'm sure it's brutal. Asswipes that have a $100k in some account and buy gold etfs have no lot in life commenting on people that make their livlihood as traders. If I were you, I would call either ADM or RJO and see if they can work something out with you. Both firms are capable of understanding your lock out dillema and hopefully can work with you on some cross-margin deal until liquidation becomes a possibility. This whole thing is a fucking train wreck. Don't let the little douchebags that haven't lost real money get under your skin. When shit like this happens, even veteran traders can and do (well, at least it's happened to me) lose their cool. Find a real FCM to help you get neutral so frustration won't compound the nightmare. Best-

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:07 | 1852265 jomama
jomama's picture

i'll just leave this here.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:24 | 1852277 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Quit whining like a little bitch. YOU were the one that put your fortune and faith in paper. YOU were the one that trusted the banks even after everything you read here.

With any luck you still have some wealth left but take responsibility for YOUR bad decision/call.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:05 | 1852297 aus_punter
aus_punter's picture

do you know my positions ? no

do you know my situation ? no

do I take advice from a blog populated by people I don't know nor will ever meet ? no

do  judgemental peole like you annoy the fuck out of me ? yes 

now go fuck yourself

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:58 | 1852318 tickhound
tickhound's picture

"do I take advice from a blog populated by people I don't know nor will ever meet ? no"

Hence why your anger would be better directed at the "fucking moron" you DID take advice from...

You've been on zh for over 2 years.  MF's been in near free-fall since early August. 

And while we're on the subject of "immature fucksticks"....


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:57 | 1852526 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:14 | 1852326 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Do we know your positons?  Yes.  Paper bullshit.  You were warned, but you ignored those warnings.

What happened to you is terrible, but you were warned.  You chose to play in paper, knowing full well the extent of the corruption, and now you will pay the price.

Let ALL others learn from this mistake.  I have been totally out of paper for almost two years because I hated the manipulation I was seeing, and wanted no part of it.  It was clear to me back shortly after the start of QEI that this would all end very, very badly.

Sorry to be "judgemental" or to say "I told you so", but people need to know that there is a real, viable alternative out there.  No-one gets margin calls on physical metal.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:20 | 1852333 writingsonthewall
writingsonthewall's picture

"Sorry to be "judgemental" or to say "I told you so"


Say it - SAY IT!!!


There's nothing like the smell of Schadenfruend in the morning...

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:26 | 1852363 Schmoo
Schmoo's picture

I feel kinda bad for aus_punt and others, but that's a funny post on several levels. One for the intended use of schadenfreude, and another for inventing a new German word meaning 'harm to your friend'

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:42 | 1852486 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Whether this trader had notice or not, you can't expect to have notice of impending doom in this market.  We have here a perfect example of why you should not trade this market, especially with money you cannot afford to lose.  You can't protect yourself from corruption.  They can change the rules on you at any time, and will do so when it benefits their cronies and hurts you. 

Those of you who are left with paper positons, heed the wise advice of Tmosley and get out.  There aren't any markets anymore, just train wrecks with gamblers standing on the tracks rummaging through the strewn luggage and hoping another train isn't coming.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 02:59 | 1855696 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

First they stick it in, then they break it off!

Glad I bailed out in March, 2010!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:17 | 1852329 writingsonthewall
writingsonthewall's picture

Let me have a stab at answering your questions.


do you know my positions ?- They're all based on bullshit


do you know my situation ? - Dire


do I take advice from a blog populated by people I don't know nor will ever meet ? - No, you take advice from people you trust.

I think it's time to re-evaluate your 'friends'


do  judgemental peole like you annoy the fuck out of me ? - because indifference is a good quality???


now go fuck yourself - Physically impossible, I tried it once, ended up in casualty with a very embarassing case of 'over-stretched dick'.


I hope that answers your questions fully. I would advise you read Zero Hedge for the advance notice of the next 'victim' of the crisis.

I hear it begins with 'J' - those who are most adamant and insistent about their security - are the ones least secure.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 13:18 | 1853653 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture



  • do you know my positions ? no : It's pretty obvious you had money / positions @ MF Global. 
  • do you know my situation ? no : It's VERY obvious you lost your ass based on paper faith. 
  • do I take advice from a blog populated by people I don't know nor will ever meet ? no :
    • Considering you are whining about a bad loss maybe you should have.   If you want to play in a rigged casino get used to losing.  ZH has had more than enough information here to make rational and proper investment decisions based on paper confidence and in-your-face CORRUPTION which you decided to still play along with.    
  • do  judgemental peole like you annoy the fuck out of me ? yes : Deal with it shithead.  
  • now go fuck yourself :
    • Now I will have a moment of pity and contempt for you dumbass because apparently you refuse to take responsbility for your BAD DECISION.  
    • Nobody twisted your arm. 
Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:51 | 1852315 writingsonthewall
writingsonthewall's picture

You fucking gambled on the 'system' - it's all your own fault you dick.

Didn't you read the small print?


"Your investments are as much subject to corruption as anyone else's"


Go Lennon Hendrix - these 'winnners' can only sing when they're winning - and you just proved it. They can only win by hagning onto the coattails of the riggers - and doesn't it show.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:21 | 1852335 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

Hey guys. You will all feel the same way when you find out your 401k or pension plan was using MF Global.  Ease up.  We all have paper exposure somewhere.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:34 | 1852341 tmosley
tmosley's picture

I have neither, and if I had, I would have cashed it out long ago, just as I have encouraged everyone who will listen to.

My only paper exposure is my job, which I don't need to survive, due to my rather stunning amount of savings.  I keep doing it because I can still buy more silver and pay the bills with the salary.  As soon as that is no longer the case (ie I can't buy at least a certain pre-determinned amount of silver each month), I will quit and spend my time accumulating capital at home.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:57 | 1852351 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

Still, no point kicking the man while he is down.  We are not JPM or The Squid.  It is enough that people will begin to believe you now and move into the only physical medium of wealth that can be stored at home, out of the system, without rotting or renting a warehouse.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:24 | 1852362 tmosley
tmosley's picture

The point is NOT to kick him while he is down.  The point is to use this as a teachable moment, to get more people straight the fuck out of paper before the same thing happens to them.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:48 | 1852498 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Word, word, and word.  Absolutely friggin A.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:16 | 1852359 writingsonthewall
writingsonthewall's picture

I have no pension - the only paper 'gamble' I have is

a) Petty Cash (unavoidable as it's still used as tender by grocery stores)

b) $5k in a Commdity fund - which has already been labelled as 'throw away money' - as it would if I put it on a horse


Everything else is physical Gold, property or LEAD.


Of course I'm no genius - I just read ZH - and now I'm buying popcorn to sit back and watch the end of the movie.


It's a shame those who did not listen now cry and wail about how unfair it all is.


Did Lehmans teach them NOTHING?


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:16 | 1852360 writingsonthewall
writingsonthewall's picture


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 13:17 | 1853687 SilverRhino
SilverRhino's picture

Not here.  I don't play this market, keep minimal balances at the banks for electronic funds payments and put the rest of my admittedly limited wealth in things I have complete control over.  Metals, foods, appreciating items.

That poor bastard's loss above us in this thread is just another object lesson:

If you don't HOLD it, you don't OWN it.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:40 | 1852347 JuicedGamma
JuicedGamma's picture

So if the players in the systems are corrupt then we should just accept our fate and let them screw us over.
I think not the system needs to be cleansed ( as in it needs a good douching ), let's start by removing all of the current Congress. In fact we should have a special election of the entire Senate at once instead of the rolling bs they have now, just like the House.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:32 | 1852340 JuicedGamma
JuicedGamma's picture

The squids progeny gives you the gift that keeps on giving.
Maybe we should think about cleaning all these fuckers ( ex squidies ) from public life. We could start with Gensler, since he was in charge of regulating MF Global this he is to blame as much as anyone.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:35 | 1852342 JuicedGamma
Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:11 | 1852412 MFL8240
MFL8240's picture

Hey Aus_Punter, I am sorry for the treatment you received from the CME.  I would caution you and any other outsiders to stay clear of the CME, they are a corrupt organization which became evident months ago with their hiking of margin calls while Gold was selling off to help this entirely corrupt banking system manipulate Gold prices lower.  That was the first warning and you should have been wise enough to see the US under Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, Obama, Geithner and Bernanke cannot be trusted, get out while you can and do business in a country with some integrity, we have none anymore this is a country led by trash and the American people are finally waking up to what the rest of the world has known for a long time.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:18 | 1852417 Widowmaker
Widowmaker's picture

Cracked another.

Two words -- taxpayer TARP -- you internationals are fucking welcome.

Anything else the house of fraud, lies, record bonuses, and YOUR MONEY can get for you?

Kicks in the ass are 50% off, justice abortions always free, and your money is always good here.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:06 | 1852551 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

and ... it's gone.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:47 | 1852497 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Sorry to hear it Aus_p.  I think the lesson we've all learned these last few years is the markets are not, and never were, markets.  They were always rigged, and all the books on investing we have ever read were written with that key bit of information omitted.  "Markets" exist to shear sheep, and every one of us has been sheared at least once in their trading careers.  Good luck, I hope it works out.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:14 | 1852577 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture


In America we have a saying, "The fish rots from the head down," and I would have rather a bullet in my head than do business with Jon Corzine who bankrupted NJ.

You, however, did do business with him.

Again...Fuck you and have a nice day.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:08 | 1852182 c'mon man
c'mon man's picture

Is this a clarification of the clarification??

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:09 | 1852231 WVO Biker
WVO Biker's picture

Customer positions were transfered with Thursday's closing prices. Earlier open profits are GONE as are balances that were in excess of 75% of maintenance margin for positions. Three hours into Sunday night session they could still not trade NY.

Customers that were flat at MF received an account at O'Brian with a $ balance of 0.


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:12 | 1852236 knukles
knukles's picture

Well, there's that $650,000,000. 
Or if not, then maybe Jon's still got it?
"Then were the fuck is my money that was held safely in my segregated account?" says the satisfied customer in today's modern financial service economy? 

This is just plain fucking evil.

Your money is safe with us, which we're not gonna let you get to and if you don't send us more money because we won't let you have your money that's safe with us, you've got to send us more money or we'll take the rest of your safe with us money that's safe with us, too.
So bloody well bugger off, mate.

Paper PM's and commodities, anybody?
First it's the central banks fucking you as a counterparty what with the SNB's Euro peg.
Then the dealers continue raping and pillaging but bring it to a whole new and improved dimension with the ISDA ain't no default of ours, asshole.
Then the commodity exchanges just off and fuck up segregated accounts.
The whole fucking system is corrupt.

Oh, and did I forget to mention the hyperdrive prinitng presses?

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:23 | 1852276 JOYFUL
JOYFUL's picture

This is just plain fucking evil."

While I share your sentiments in full, this has got beyond just plain ******* evil. 

This is something like, I dunno, Mind ******* evil, we got it all covered now, break out the Chateau Rothschilds 91 ********evil....

ever since they finally got to GDaff, and set that whole Gold Dinars, we the people don't need your stinkin CB thing straight, these M F******s have been on overtime victory laps. 

It's right full in your face now Amerika.  Either buy your kneepads from the usual authorized outlets, or find a M****** F******* pitchfork and rise.  It's your money they're stealing!

Er, sorry: It was your money.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:22 | 1852117 Blorf
Blorf's picture

Nothing inspires confidence in an exchange like having "customers" robbed of cash in their accounts, and then having their positions liquidated because they don't have enough cash in their accounts.  "Please send a check ASAP, we need more money to steal."

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:01 | 1852171 navy62802
navy62802's picture

If the press doesn't cover it, then it isn't actually happening, right??

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:12 | 1852572 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

the internet seems to have come at an inconvenient time for the global elite, relatively speaking.  the republican party leadership may yet come to rue their institutional support of very wide gun ownership.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:16 | 1852188 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

Jesus christ, a private deal between the Trustee and the CME for not funding those accounts 100% margin.  If people truly knew what was going on in Wallstreet, our country would be in flames by the end of the day.  They are running a ponzi scheme on top of a scam with the fox guarding the hen house.  It's designed to work for the ones with contact and money, the ones that don't have it they are there to be fleeced at anytime.  When this game is over, it will  destroy the US.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:50 | 1852213 SHEEPFUKKER


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:24 | 1852118 jonjon831983
jonjon831983's picture

So, this is for RJO.  I am assuming this 75% thing would be similar situation for any other company accounts were transferred to?



Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:31 | 1852202 paarsons
paarsons's picture

Why worry?

We can always print more money?

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:00 | 1852229 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

No offense but just shut up. Real people are being raped and robbed and rendered powerless to do anything about it before our eyes. I don't have words. Think I'll shut the fuck up too.

Folks stuck in this, I am so sorry.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:20 | 1852273 Conrad Murray
Conrad Murray's picture

Everyone in the markets should know they are rigged. If someone doesn't know that, that individual is stupid beyond words. There are no innocents. Gamble at your own risk.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:26 | 1852122 chump666
chump666's picture

sending in cheques to cover a margin call...hahahahahaha.

Liquidation trade on.


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:26 | 1852123 navy62802
navy62802's picture

Wow, glad I wasn't with MF Global. That sounds like a royal goat fuck.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:17 | 1852330 tmosley
tmosley's picture

*Implying you have money with another broker.

*Implying you'd best GTFO while you can.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:17 | 1852593 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture

i worry who's next and suspect it's me (if you don't know who the ....).

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 10:14 | 1852800 goat
goat's picture

Stay the hell away from my escutcheon.


Know your goat

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:28 | 1852125 Troy Ounce
Troy Ounce's picture




Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:29 | 1852126 jonjon831983
jonjon831983's picture

Mondays... ugh.

Office Space:

Peter Gibbons: Let me ask you something. When you come in on Monday and you're not feeling real well, does anyone ever say to you, "Sounds like someone has a case of the Mondays?" 
Lawrence: No. No, man. Shit, no, man. I believe you'd get your ass kicked sayin' something like that, man.


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:30 | 1852128 Mactheknife
Mactheknife's picture

Talk about adding "insult to injury".  Going to be a lot of attorneys getting calls first thing in the am.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:39 | 1852143 chump666
chump666's picture

Especially the poor souls that ended up sending a cheque "express mail".

The FED is 100% responsible, plus dumb ass Obama for allowing speculation back into the market.  MF Global should never had existed, 2008 was supposed to clean out the crap firms.  But our academic madmen dropped interest rates to nothing and forced people to gamble.  Then this sh*t happens with a junk firm that gamed them selves, the market and their customers.  Disgusting.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:58 | 1852165 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture



Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:03 | 1852173 navy62802
navy62802's picture

Par for course in our modern economic times. It'll be interesting to look back at this period 15 or 20 years from now.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:01 | 1852230 JesusUp
JesusUp's picture


15-20 years from now

quite the optimist

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:19 | 1852606 jeff montanye
jeff montanye's picture


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:39 | 1852206 francis_the_won...
francis_the_wonder_hamster's picture

Oh, come on, Chump.....we got know, "the strongest financial reform since the Great Depression (part 1)".

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:11 | 1852408 j0nx
j0nx's picture

HAHA GL getting the MSM to report on this whole Obama/FED blame thing you talk about, assuming you can even get them to talk about MF at all...

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:51 | 1852130 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

counterparty cumstains in corrupt casinos

we know they got fuked.  but did they get kissed, too?

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:37 | 1852137 Hansel
Hansel's picture

Oh my god.  What a mess.  Your cash, it's gone.  Please step aside; this line is for customers who actually have money.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:51 | 1852154 Out9922
Out9922's picture

Lol.  Glad Im not gambling

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:59 | 1852167 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Aaand!!!!  It's gone.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:12 | 1852414 j0nx
j0nx's picture

HAHA I'm trying not to laugh but you're making it difficult.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:39 | 1852141 riley martini
riley martini's picture

  From the WSJ " Regulators to skip MF Global investigation" .  Shareholders are on their own in a corrupt system .

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:06 | 1852178 navy62802
navy62802's picture

Yeah I saw that one. Apparently CFTC Chairman Gary Gensler is too cozy with Jon Corzine. He says he's essentially recusing himself from the investigation because there would be an "appearance" of a conflict of interest if he stayed on. I call bullshit and say that there has existed a conflict of interest before now, which is the reason these firms operate with impunity.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:21 | 1852431 Widowmaker
Widowmaker's picture

Impunity is USA Inc.

Wake me when someone feeds the fish.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:46 | 1852147 Ecoman11
Ecoman11's picture
CME Group Finds Mix-Up In Transfer Of Some MF Global Accounts In Canada
Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:47 | 1852150 bill1102inf
bill1102inf's picture

Just call up or go online and sell your positions right now.  Everything is fine and pretty much trading right where it was when the accounts were locked down.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:47 | 1852151 Yamaha
Yamaha's picture

This makes Europe look stable.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:47 | 1852211 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

of course, Ya_ha!

europa has la staabeeeelliteee'!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:48 | 1852152 dwayne elizando
dwayne elizando's picture

Does anyone know the # to MF Global? I wanna drunk dial them!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:51 | 1852153 navy62802
navy62802's picture

They don't need a phone number because they're Mother Fuckin Global.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:01 | 1852172 dwayne elizando
dwayne elizando's picture

Well then I guess I'll just apply for a janitor position with them!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:04 | 1852232 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Deliver their pizza, serve their soup...

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:20 | 1852332 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Fart pizza and piss soup.

And you don't even want to know about the clam chowder...


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:55 | 1852158 azusgm
azusgm's picture

This kind of stuff has got to push gold higher even in an environment with forced liquidations all around. Who on earth wants to play in a blatantly rigged game that has gone beyond pilfering?

Gold is looking very pretty and shiny.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:59 | 1852168 navy62802
navy62802's picture

Don't forget what good ole Ben said ... Gold is definitely not money.

I think Benny boy will be saying that all the way to the grave.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:13 | 1852186 azusgm
azusgm's picture

Well then the tradition of stacking the barbarous relic looks like even more of a good idea.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:01 | 1852533 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

LOL yeah.  Gold is just traditional.  That's why all the bailout entities keep trying to get the bankrupt nation to pledge their gold as collateral.  They tried that rap with the Germans and were told to go screw themselves. 

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:06 | 1852296 JOYFUL
JOYFUL's picture

I'm sorry, I'd like to agree with you.

But "they" will let Au rise a bit, take in a few more suckers with cash, then crash it a hundred or so down(with appropriate pre-knowledge to the fortunate few), then buy the dip with the fiat they've gained from this MF scam and the rest of the 24/7 house never loses ponzi deals that fill in for a "free market" in our bold new "post reality" reality paradigm.

That said, at the end of the day, those who hold, and refuse to fold will at least be 'at large;'  even if DHS/TSA has our pix on airport/bus station walls, I'd prefer to be looked at rather than lookin!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:22 | 1852336 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Imagine what it would look like if the Western paper decoupled from Eastern exchanges and physical.

The liquidations push down Western paper, but in the East, and in the physical markets you see no effect, just rapidly rising price as the people see that they are no longer safe ANYWHERE in the ponzi complex, and head for the exits.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:07 | 1852552 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

right.  Not that the Chinese will use the Pan Asian Gold Exchange to decouple their markets from the Western ponzi, or more exactly, not just yet.  Currently, they are the chief beneficiaries of the kick the can and buy gold scheme as their acknowledged reserves are terribly inadequate.  So for now, they kick the can and coordinate margin hikes. 

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:56 | 1852162 geneb
geneb's picture

Aaannnnd it's gone....

Here's your margaritta machine.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 01:59 | 1852169 Milton Waddams
Milton Waddams's picture

So sick... the DOJ made online poker (ex-colusion, a game of skill) effectively illegal, yet any chump can transfer his life savings onto an online brokerage account and click his mouse and lose his house.  

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:57 | 1852227 SHEEPFUKKER

Whatever, the online poker was taking time away from my online porn.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:00 | 1852170 JLee2027
JLee2027's picture

Back to Square one on this margin call business.  Almost as confusing as the Greek bailout.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:11 | 1852179 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Did I just get fucked in the ass?

Yes, you did.  Here at the Fiat Ponzi, we try and make sure to ass rape every person not running insider inormation.  In fact, we even fuck them sometimes, too.

Will I get a reach around?

Absolutely not.  You would need to pay for a reach around, and Mother Fuckin' Global just stole your last dime.

Will you please use lube?

Sorry, we only use lube if you pay for it, and you have no funds for lube.

I didn't want to lose my anal virginity this way!

Please state that in the form of a question.  The Fiat Ponzi has an authority complex and control issues, and we only respond when you are self deprecating.

Isn't implying I am going to lose my anal virginity self deprecating enough?

No it isn', it isn't.  Here at the Fiat Ponzi, we want to see you squirm until you are either broke or dead.  Preferably, both.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:23 | 1852197 barliman
barliman's picture




Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:53 | 1852218 SHEEPFUKKER

too epic

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:17 | 1852239 knukles
knukles's picture

Beg motherfuckers.

Seriously, this is the epitome of a Skullfucking

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:22 | 1852275 The Big Ching-aso
The Big Ching-aso's picture

Repeat customers who like getting fucked in the ass are bound to return in droves.

This is just great.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:29 | 1852199 Ponziconomy
Ponziconomy's picture

Well, this whole thing sucks. Dirt and dirtier. Gensler and Corzine-- no prisonmate Bubba-stuff yet-- but what the F*CK? For what it's worth, I'll say this-- I've traded through RJO for 13ish years. Never a problem. They, at least, don't do anything other than exchange-traded futures. NO PROP TRADING. NO BULLSHIT. Anybody think there's a reason the CME didn't give positions to "The Squid", "J.Pierpont's (m)Organ", "Mostly Stupid", "Unreasonable Bonus Structure", "Bone America" or the other Street houses of horror? It's because the CME is the DSRO for firms receiving positions. They are the (mostly) monoline futures guys. Hard to f*ck up the audit when you handle a company that CAN'T COMINGLE CUSTOMER FUNDS 'CAUSE THEY DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER PLACE TO STASH 'EM.  IF YOU TRADE FUTURES AND YOU KEEP YOUR CASH AND ACCOUNT WITH ONE OF THE "WE DO EVERYTHING (STREET and quasi-Street) FIRMS", YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY NUTS. CRAZY. Now it's time for the CME, with its vast fortunes reaped from us traders on their INSANE FEEs, TO F*CKING NUT UP. Cover the money lost, as you "guarantee it", for these people who, mistaken as they may have been, believed YOU- THE CHICAGO MERCANTILE EXCHANGE- made sure their cash was safe and their positions appropriately margined. NO BULLSHIT ABOUT "TRUSTEE DEALS". WHAT, CME, ARE YOU COVERING AND WHAT ARE YOU NOT COVERING!??! Anything less than "EVERYBODY IS WHOLE" is not okay. Are you there or are you just another Street Puppet?  NUT UP AND CARVE THE CHECKS-- or at least promise to do it once all the accounting shit is settled.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:30 | 1852200 jomama
jomama's picture

but i thought those account holders were insured against this type of thing?!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:44 | 1852208 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

Yes, the accounts are insured until they aren't. 

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:46 | 1852210 jekyll island
jekyll island's picture

Well, they are kinda insured, you see MF Global bought CDS from AIG instead of paying for SIPC coverage. You will just need to contact the counterparty for payment on the claim. 

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:51 | 1852215 PrintingPress
PrintingPress's picture

Just some technicalities all other accounts are properly insured and there is absolutely nothing to be concerned about.   Everything is under control. 

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:52 | 1852216 seek
seek's picture

They are, it's just there's a 25% shakedown insurance fee taken off the top, because you're a small, defenseless speculator and not a bank.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:45 | 1852209 Joe Ploppy
Joe Ploppy's picture

MF clients face 3 choices:

1. Keep your account with MF, get margin called and maybe never see your cash after the liquidation.  But at least there is no logner a threat of making or taking delivery.

2. Have the account transferred to RJ O'Brien, liquidate the position to meet the margin requirement, but at least get 75% of you cash value back, vs. getting zero by staying with MF.

3.  Hope the SIPC (the counterpart to the FDIC, except in securities vs. bank accounts) gets them the rest of the money back some day by sapping the US Taxpayers a little more.

Option 2, though bad, is less bad than option 1.  We don't know the extent that option 3 is in play...

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:52 | 1852217 The Swedish Chef
The Swedish Chef's picture

I wish the markets could open already so we can find out what the transfer of MF accounts will do to the various commodities. We can read pressreleases until our eyes bleed, we will not make sense out of it...

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:16 | 1852238 ViewfromUnderth...
ViewfromUndertheBridge's picture

You want the markets to open? How quaint.

You obviously dont work for CME, MF Global or any of the ten firms taking over MFG accounts, or IB who walked when they did their DD on the MFG accounts, or any one related to all those previous firms or drinking buddies of ALL the forementioned or their mother-in-laws... because Asia has been open all night and gold for one is trading unusually, as if someone knows the MF Global customer positions (which they have been looking at since October 31) contain a lot of shorts.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:32 | 1852249 qussl3
qussl3's picture

Unless the large commercials use MF, im pretty sure the funds and retail are typcially net long.

Balls to the wall long.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:54 | 1852219 saulysw
saulysw's picture

If I read the FAQ correctly, people have around 2 hours (to 9am to 11am) to settle the call, otherwise they start liquidating the position.

This strikes me as being very short term bearish for commodities. Let's see if gold/silver take a huge dump around, say, 11am?

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:36 | 1852470 PulauHantu29
PulauHantu29's picture

I already have myu orders in to scoop up some cheap USO, GLD and SLV if this happens::))

Same for a couple of the oil drillers...HAL and SLB...they should drop also if this happens

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 01:46 | 1855647 saulysw
saulysw's picture

Well, I was wrong. The commodities went up, up, up. Perhaps the positions being liquidated were short positions then? I kind of assumed they were long. Hmmmm....

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:55 | 1852220 SHEEPFUKKER

Good times.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 02:58 | 1852228 mrjon007
mrjon007's picture

What if the banksters in charge divvied up the transferred accounts as follows:

- All accounts with net long positions in gold/silver go to RJO.

- All accounts with net short positions in gold/silver go to firms honoring reduced margins.

I suppose it's the CFTC overseeing that, but everything's so rigged these days, I just gotta ask!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:56 | 1852345 foofoojin
foofoojin's picture

if the longs are strong hands. then that could back fire. you be giving RJO more cash and stronge position with out counter party risk at the same time.

you be giving the shorters even more shorts.  exposing them even more to risk of a run up.  both parties would be pissed(if they both actaully had real risk). both parties would be unable to have counter party risk properly allocated. if this happened.

RJO would do the math. see a descrepency in the influx of what is expected and what occured. and woud act accordingly. only there not a full "we do everything" sort a place. there transaction would be more apparent on the market. as they seek counter party.  crimex good ol boy network would already be shorted to hell anyways. so whats wronge with a little more shorting. they might not even seek longs. as they know RJO will seek shorts equalize level the counter party risk.

if we see longs get crushed mid day hard. your going to have to look at the cot report for gold and silver tuesday afternoon . what i would do is grab last week cot report. it is from the first. the day after the MFglobal shit storm and look at tomarrow cot report and compare.


edit: and before you all rip me to shreads. why don't you take a stab at it.



Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:11 | 1852235 oldman
oldman's picture

Anyone who is still against Occupy Wall Street is----------------------------------------------------------------


FUCKING SELF-DESTRUCTIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Sympathy for each victim                            om

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:16 | 1852422 Carlyle Groupie
Carlyle Groupie's picture

Many of the talking heads are anti-OWS because they are paid to be by their masters.

Their masters FEAR this kind of awakening:

Restore The US Draft, Israel Is Demanding It

Gordon Duff is a Marine Vietnam 100% disabled veteran.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 12:18 | 1853362 JOYFUL
JOYFUL's picture

Gordon Duff is a bought&paid for zionist shill hiding behind the disabled vet shield (*not a physical disability, in his case/ unlike the several hundred thousand US servicemen who were poisoned by their own government and can't even buy a doctors' appointment now!) who works counterintel now for the same folks he was dissing just one year ago.  It's sad, but it's also TRUE...just read the pages of over the last, say, 14 months, and you will see that the change in viewpoint is detectable. 

No, I mean READ the pages, before you answer that accusation - then mouth off to your hearts content. From righteous rebel to pathetic shill in a few short months....(focus on february 2011 forward...Gordo and VT were amongst the first to advocate the intervention into Libya, and to recommend that the Keynan take out the only real African resistance to NWO-PNAC.

Yup, kill the guys who are behind the African gold standard, oil for gold, no Rothschilds central banks needed idea....kind of counterintuitive if you are into freedom and liberty n that kind of stuff huh?!?Merika, you've been betrayed by those closest to you. Wise up, or lose all you've got left.

p.s. many people are not enthused with OWS, cause they've seen what happens when the CFR, CIA, Brookings Institute and what'll script "change": 3 years into the latest Manchurian candidate,  you really still want CHANGE? Carlyle Groupie? You're not with the Carlyle Group are you? That would be too obvious, even for, wouldn't it?


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:14 | 1852237 Ponziconomy
Ponziconomy's picture

IN THE CASE OF LEHMAN-- A TOTAL DISASTER AND EX-EMPLOYER OF MINE:  While they did pretty much everything wrong, they did NOT comingle futures account money with house cash. So, as the world blew up, the only thing that kept working for Lehman was their futures operation. As accounts transferred out, 50% of the cash was moved with the positions. A few days later, another 25% came through. A couple weeks later, the final 25% came through. ALL THE CASH SHOWED UP, JUST NOT INSTANTLY.  MF Global appears to be a different story. They stole futures margin cash from their clients. Let's say the (moving target) number is $650 million. If MF had customer "segregated" funds of $6bb, HERE'S THE MATH-- ($6bb-$650mm)/$6bb = 89%ish. So, my expectation would be that, over the next month or so, MF clients will get 89% of their cash back. THAT ISN'T BAD BUT IT ALSO ISN'T ACCEPTABLE. THE CME OWES THEM, AT LEAST, THE OTHER 11%. Now for the "big ugly"... If you are a dentist in Des Moines that had $50k in your account because every now and then you'd get a wild hair up your ass and decide to trade 3 contracts of Gold (or whatever commodity) AND YOU, AT THE BANKRUPTCY DATE OF LAST MONDAY, HAD NO OPEN POSITIONS, your money-- the $50k-- is EXCESS MARGIN; not MMR. What's the difference? THE DIFFERENCE IS EXCESS IS NOT, REPEAT NOT, GUARANTEED BY THE CME. It may or may not be covered by SIPC-- we'll see. SO, IN MY MIND, THE CME WILL OWE YOU 11CENTS ON EVERY DOLLAR PLACED AS MARGIN AGAINST OPEN POSITIONS. BUT, EVERY OTHER PENNY IN YOU MF'D ACCOUNT MAY BE VAPORIZED. Nobody with $50k likes spending $15 wire charges to move money in and out of their futures account when positions are put on or liquidated or have a daily margin variation. What we're all about to find out is, "1) WILL THE CME COVER THE PORTION OF MY MARGIN THAT MF COMMITED FRAUD ON, AND 2) WILL SIPC COVER EXCESS MARGIN MONIES"  Major corollary: "IF MY BANK BLOWS, WILL THE FDIC BE THERE OR WILL THERE BE A DEAL BETWEEN THE TRUSTEE AND THE FDIC THAT MAKES IT, UH, OTHER THAN ME GETTING MY JACK BACK?"  Hmmm....


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:09 | 1852266 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

This turned into a rant. Sorry, sort of.

One of the reasons I thought they were propping it up at the begining (when I first learned about derrivatives) was because of the impossible logistics of unwinding it. It seemed to me that the lawyers, judges, juries, and court rooms needed to process this whole thing would be swamped. After reading these blogs for a number of years, I have come to believe other things as well (cleptocrats propping it up because they are still profiting, clinging to an old way of being, in denial that anything is wrong, and more). 

But fundamentally, the logistics (they averted it in real estate and the MERS debacle, or so it would seem) may be the undoing of the whole damn thing. Is it not the case that the real problem in Europe is that they simply do not know how to proceed? There is no precedent for it, nothing of this scale has ever been possible before. It is global and computerized, you are fucked big and fast and furiously when it happens. We will grind to a Mother Fucking Global halt processing this thing.

MF Global folks, the company gambled their own money and lost, so they gambled yours and now they are trying to hide it and hope that someone will bail them out by paying you insurance or taxpayer bucks, or by not holding them accountable via criminal or civil law. Ask folks holding GM paper, I bet they have a story to tell. Hell is in the unwind, they may even be counting on this.

We are all vulnerable if we have anything in the system at all. ALL OF US. Those of you who have mocked these people who have been victimized by this, you better look over your holdings and your situation. Something like this can happen to any of us, any where. Me, I am vulnerable in the following ways:

1. I have insurance money in the bank I can't get out because it is being held as collateral while I rebuild my house that was destroyed in a storm.

2. I have an annuity I was forced into by my employer.  I can't get at it unless I lose my job.

3. I have regular money in the bank because I have to have it fucking seasoned or I can't spend it to pay off the goddamn loan I had to apply for to finish building my house. Long damn story, I keep cash, they won't take it if it hasn't been in the bank for a while.

4. I have been paying into social security for years, like most of you.

I bet there is more I am not thinking of. Any of it can fail. That is where things have come to. Anyone who is holding your stuff other than you is a potential source of ripping you off and logistics failure. Those holding it could not be ripping you off, but they get ripped off and can't cover. It's that easy.

Was it Hugh Hendry who said, "I suggest you panic?"

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:34 | 1852464 Widowmaker
Widowmaker's picture

Good rant until "criminal and civil law."

Is this church because there sure is a whole lot of believing going on?

This ain't church, this is business. There ain't no laws in business, pretty.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:49 | 1852379 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

The money market buck was broken in 2008. All since then has been illusion and fraud to keep from revealing that the buck was broken. 89 percent is just the broken buck rearing it's ugly head. By the time it rears from tbtf banks the buck will suffer a horrendous bustification factor.

They keep giving fresh ponzi money to microsoft and apple and the "Wonderful men of character and philanthropy"

But all they do is shovel it back through the buck bustification engine.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:51 | 1852241 Bollixed
Bollixed's picture

Damn, we should have voted for "Change" in 2008 when we had the chance...

Time to go long Vaseline.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:27 | 1852245 knukles
knukles's picture

Santelli Yo! 
Your morning tirade.

Skullfucking in Commodity Land.

Maybe even start on about those rumors of maybe not enough shit in the vaults to make deliveries. 
Hah hah ha ha hah.
(Be killed on screen, but would be a great a.m. completely loose it bat-shit rant blast-o-matic job.  I mean waving your arms about, spitting, screaming, throwing shit, jumping up and dowm, crawling on top of stations, drooling, turning bright red, eyes popping out.)

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 03:58 | 1852260 dumpster
dumpster's picture

counter part on MF risk is a taco stand in bangladesh .

we cover risks one taco at a time

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:19 | 1852272 Ralph Spoilsport
Ralph Spoilsport's picture

Keep reading that insect shirt.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 04:30 | 1852280 JB
JB's picture

Has anyone here studied common law? According to Article 61 of the Magna Carta, 24 duly elected members of the barony can form a grand jury and issue a presentment. There is NO Lawful Grand Jury in this country- they are all either 21 or 23 members. So we elect ourselves. Are there 23 other people willing? I am.

AT ANY RATE, it's time WE take the LAW into our own hands. A lawful presentment that is not adequately dealt with within 40 days subjects the persons the presentment was filed against to the seizure of ALL THEIR ASSETS.

The Executive Branch has failed us.
The Legislative Branch has failed us.
The Judicial Branch has failed us.

I think some really famous guy wrote something about 235 years ago that government exists at the consent of the governed and that when government fails it is the right of the people to throw off that government and form a new one. I'm pretty sure his name was Thomas Jefferson, and I'm pretty sure the document he was writing was The Declaration of Independence.

It's Time to do it again.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:46 | 1852349 JesusUp
JesusUp's picture

the Magna Carta? David Rubenstein, co-founder of Carlyle Group, bought that bitch.

you are owned, how do it feel

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:40 | 1852483 Widowmaker
Widowmaker's picture

Copied and psted.

"Is this church because there sure is a whole lot of believing going on?

This ain't church, this is business. There ain't no laws in business, pretty."

...and bonuses are up!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:21 | 1852299 ManicMechanic
ManicMechanic's picture

News Flash … just in time for Christmas Shopping! Controversial Obama Chia Pet Grows “Afro” “Just Add Water And Watch It Grow Faster Than The National Deficit”.


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:46 | 1852307 Zodiac
Zodiac's picture

I would assume that the account holders as a group were somewhat evenly distributed between short and long positions so that there would not be a huge swing one way or another as positions were liquidated today.

Still, this is a sad event for those traders that have cash locked up in MF until the Trustee agrees that it should be released.  The bad things in the financial system have not been purged as a result of the events of 2008.  The fact that the regulators couldn't or wouldn't do one goddamn thing to prevent this rampant risk taking is disgusting.


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:43 | 1852313 nathan1234
nathan1234's picture

What Americans do not realise

Today- it is the MF Global Account

Tomorrow it is your Bank account

They will tell you what part of your money is lost, what you can take out.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:21 | 1852608 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture

Exactly.  There are innumerable ways for the douche bags to confiscate our funds, this is just one of them... they will use as many as necessary.  That is why Gold and Silver is such a good play... it is an attempt to rob the douche bags before they rob us.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 13:34 | 1853761 JOYFUL
JOYFUL's picture

Too true:

and take it to the next level - 

after they've wiped out the suckers still in fiat... they will come for all those geniuses here today who dumped upon AusPunter cause they were so secure in their physical positions...till holding Au is the new domestic terrorist designation.

wow, Solidarity too big a word anymore for y'all?

even the 1 percent ahead of the curve are snarly lemmings  who would rather run over anybody whose been broadsided by the bastards in charge rather than ride back and help a brother survive to fight another day.

Karma's still a bitch.  Even for ZHer's.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 05:57 | 1852319 writingsonthewall
writingsonthewall's picture

Now more importantly  - Tyler, is this the margin call that wasn't a margin call, that now is?


Kid Dynamite will be gutted - he was spunking all over himself for getting one up on ZH (with some help from his friends)

What will be ironic is if we get a meltdown anyway!

Then this piece will have to change - again.


I can understand how the confusion came about (the wording from the CME) - but has Tyler considered getting a few things deliberately wrong in the future - as this one story got more publicity than the 1000's of correct ones!


This is also how the MSM is so popular - they tell the people what they want to hear.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:18 | 1852599 KidDynamite
KidDynamite's picture

I don't know why this is so hard for you to understand - it's EXACTLY what I wrote in my post. 

The CME is changing the rules to lessen (I was going to use the word "ameliorate" but I didn't want your brain to hurt) the effects of these margin calls - so that call-ees only have to bring their margin up to the maintenance level, not the (formerly higher) initial level.   It's really not hard to understand.


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:01 | 1852322 Leraconteur
Leraconteur's picture

This is brilliant.

The Trustee and CME transfer only 75% of MM to O'Brien, who then give the account holders until 4pm to wire the difference or suffer immediate liquidation. This is a boon to O'Brien who, no doubt, will reap millions in liquidated assets as some scramble or don't make the deadline.

The CME get to bailout their buddies with power, contacts and the right Rolodex, the Trustee gets to keep his hands off of the missing money, and no one has to go out and actually find the $650m as it was spread out, tax-like, to the transferred account holders who now must pay a 133.3% premium on their own money just to get back 100%!

God Bless America!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:13 | 1852324 sumo
sumo's picture

Efficient markets at work, efficiently rat-fucking retail investors. Geithner will phone all and any regulators telling them to take it east and not to rush into things.

CFTC will investigate, of course, right after it finishes its investigation into the Silver market. That will happen Real Soon Now *cough* ... staff shortages ... you know how it is *wink*.

Corzine will found a new financial startup: Rat Fuckers Global. Motto: "We're Rat Fuckers. We're everywhere."

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 06:26 | 1852337 azusgm
azusgm's picture

Should have banned new CDS in 2008 and allowed the existing ones to run off. The world is not a better or safer place with notional many multiples > global GDP. Of course the market's rigged. It is a high-stakes casino without rules or regulation. The Nevada Gaming Commission would be the appropriate (and more honest and effective) regulator for wagering vehicles.

Quit playing. Go to cash and figure out something real and productive to do with your life. The beast cannot live without your energy.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:46 | 1852376 Withdrawn Sanction
Withdrawn Sanction's picture

At least in a casino, you know the odds going in; and that the pit boss wont change them after the cards are dealt or the wheel is spun.  To call what we have "gambling" is a disservice to gamblers everywhere.  This is just fraud mixed with naked robbery, pure and simple.

Your assessment to not play is spot on.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:35 | 1852672 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Exactly.  This is not a game.  Games have rules.  The markets are a bigger scam than Three Card Monte.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 07:30 | 1852365 swani
swani's picture

Occupy Wall Street bitchez!

Seriously, this is an outrage, and aus_punter, it's not only happening to international brokers, it's happening to everyone except a chosen few of course.

Well everyone knows what to do, get off your sofa and demand some justice; RICO prosecutions, class acton lawsuits against everyone. create a lobbying group of brokers and jilted traders and DO SOMETHING.  


Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:30 | 1852448 sumo
sumo's picture

Buy physical gold and silver. Make yourself an enemy of every western central bank and every rat fucker on wall street.

Abandon the fiat fiasco to the fullest extent possible, and crash this corrupt system.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:25 | 1852639 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture

Or like me, do both.  Transfer all assets to Gold / Silver, and Occupy Wall Street.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:46 | 1852495 monximus
monximus's picture

"If you only had cash in your account, this equity did not transfer and resides with the trustee."


I called it, right on the money, with my last post. Inviting customers to previously close out their positions, transfer to cash, was pure rape.

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:09 | 1852556 monximus
monximus's picture
Tue, 11/01/2011 - 15:16 "If you liquidate contracts or equities into cash aren't you more likely to lose that cash (having it divied up equally among all who have cash claims) than any positions?" What you should have done was be 0% cash, 100% ETF/Equity, etc. When that transferred to RJ O'Brien, just move those positions over to a third new broker = you lost 0%.
Mon, 11/07/2011 - 09:37 | 1852683 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Very impressive.  You sir, are da man!

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 08:59 | 1852499 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture

I don't quite understand the interpretations most seem to be making with this report.  RJO decided that it was not going to lower their margin requirements for MF clients.  CME decided it would lower margin requirements for all clients, to aid the impoverished MF clients who were transferring to them.  This seems a simple private business decision.  CME decided they want to attract business by lowering their margin requirements.  RJO may not be able to afford to do such a thing, so they decided to retain their margin structure. What is the big fucking conspiracy here, apart from that there was a collapse of a dealer, people were robbed, and now their accounts are vulnerable in ways that they were not a few weeks ago.  



Mon, 11/07/2011 - 11:41 | 1853155 gina distrusts gov
gina distrusts gov's picture

getting close to time for vigilanti justice

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 22:46 | 1855360 Jack Kreuz
Jack Kreuz's picture

There are three ways to make a living in this business: be first, be smarter, or cheat. Guess which one is Wall Street's favorite?

Mon, 11/07/2011 - 23:05 | 1855395 Jack Kreuz
Jack Kreuz's picture

The court's order granting motion for the customer accounts transfers by the Trustee to other futures commissions merchants, punishes customers who had the most amount of excess cash in their commodities accounts by preventing them to have access to their excess cash, and rewards customers who had the bare minimum to transfer all of it. Customers whose cash was wholly used as performance bond for their futures positions will get to see an amount of cash equivalent to the minimum margin once their accounts have been transferred to another firm. In other words, customers who had the bare minimum margin will be able to transfer all the cash, as none of their cash will remain frozen. However, customers who didn't have any positions opened, or have excess cash, will have to keep waiting for their funds. It is even possible that such conservative customers might never see their money back if the creditors persuade judge Martin Glenn that MF Global didn't have customers' funds segregated, in which case the customer will become an unsecured creditor. Thus, customers who leveraged the most will be the most better off, and customers who were the most conservative stand to lose the most.

Amongst 125 futures commissions merchants, MF Global was the eighth largest by customers' funds, right between Barclays and Merrill Lynch. If customers of such a large institution were not protected, customers of smaller firms should not expect any protection at all. If customers are not going to be protected, there is no need to have that many acronyms (CFTC, SIPC, SEC, FINRA) causing a strain on the pockets of those who pay taxes. After all, it seems that any futures commissions merchant can easily embezzle customers’ funds, call it an error, and no longer be liable to its customers. Furthermore, market participants should really be doubtful about the CME and the ICE's financial “safeguards,” which are promoted under the banner of “ensuring the safety and soundness of their markets,” such as their “guarantee funds” supposedly created for “the benefit and protection of both clearing members and their customers.” In a market with no integrity, losses belong to you, but profits belong to bureaucrats and embezzlers.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 00:04 | 1855465 Jack Kreuz
Jack Kreuz's picture

Since MF Global was a clearing member of the commodities exchanges, owners of metals and grains kept their warehouse receipts and certificates at MF Global. Now, those receipts and certificates belong to the bankrupt estate of MF Global. Therefore, holders of metals and agricultural commodities stand to lose a significant portion of their assets. Since ETFs' metals holdings were not being cleared by MF Global, they were not lost. But next time they might not be that fortunate. In the future, ETFs based on gold and other metals will fail due to fraud by its management, its clearing house or its vault. It is just a matter of time before warehouses and vaults commit fraud. In order to get out of the corrupt system completely, you will have to own your own warehouse or vault in which to keep your physical assets.

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 13:36 | 1861395 Jack Kreuz
Jack Kreuz's picture

Besides, brokers insist that the regulatory structure ensures customers' funds are safe, although they are not. Read this letter sent last week by Gerry Corcoran, RJ O'Brien CEO:
"the industry has built a reliable regulatory structure that further ensures your funds are safe. RJO is regulated by each of the CFTC, the NFA and the CME. Paramount to this regulatory structure is RJO's requirement to maintain customers' funds and margin deposits in certain specified investments, including bank accounts that are entirely separate from RJO's own operating accounts."

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