Finns Prepare For Euro's End: "Deeply Suspicious" of EU's 'Gang of Four'

Tyler Durden's picture

While not advocating the break-up of the Euro-zone, Finland's foreign minister Erkki Tuomioja told the Daily Telegraph this evening that "it is only a matter of time". In a somewhat stunning show of truthiness, perhaps the first cracks in Europe's Nash Equilibrium are starting to show through following Monti's 'threats', Draghi's 'promises', and Merkel's 'well, nothings'. The Finn continues, via Reuters, "Either the south or the north will break away because this currency strait-jacket is causing misery for millions and destroying Europe's future."

Finland, which has a veto that could be used to block any new bailout measures, has already stirred the pot unilaterally by demanding collateral from Greece and Spain, is quite clear in its view that Europe "is a total catastrophe" but adds that no-one wants to be first to get out of the Euro and take all the blame.

Insisting that the break-up of the Euro does not mean the end of the European Union, Tuomioja believes "it could make the EU function better," but comments that he is deeply suspicious of the 'gang of four' - which includes Draghi - with regard his promises (especially ESM seniority) adding that he "does not trust these people."

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Neethgie's picture

 the euro is finnished

THX 1178's picture

Will the Euro continue much longer? Nor way!

JoeSexPack's picture

First one out is like South Carolina in 1860.



anonum's picture

As a rebound to the above-quoted Tuomioja; Finnish MSM spat out huge headlines this morning quoting Stubb (Finnish foreign trade minister, and government PM party representative) that "Finland's government is 100% committed to supporting the euro" and "Tuomioja's views do not represent the Finnish government views" ... ie. official denial of Tuomioja's views, which was to be expected.


fockewulf190's picture

Indeed, there must have been phones exploding in Helsinki because the Finns went into full damage control mode almost immediatley. The CNBS merry-go-round ticker, which is running 9 headlines currently, has dedicated three of them to pro EU stories: Merkel vows to save €, (bare)backs ECB efforts; Finnland's Stubbs tells CNBC "100% committed to Euro" (had to make sure the biz channels get the word); Euro zone trade surplus for June climbs to record high €14,9 billion. All fucking fluff, and I say all because I'm confident ZH is going to dig into that surplus story and find the manipulation.

GOSPLAN HERO's picture

It's time to raise the Bonnie Blue Flag!

Kayman's picture

Europe is 1860's South Carolina ? Not even close.  A Common Market without a Common Currency will let Europe out of the Euro strait jacket.

Haager's picture

Speaking of Norway: I wonder how much currency (AUD,SEK,NOK,NZD) THEY continue to sell before the effect reverses.


CCanuck's picture

Ya but, European on me and telling me its raining!

phalfa5's picture

Oh those crazy Finns, always on the edge.  2800 years ago, the Finns invented the toilet seat.  However, 300 years later it was none other than the Norwegians that put a hole in it...

euphoria's picture

I downvoted you for being so unbelievably lame.

THX 1178's picture

Did ya? Den Mark my words, you'll get yer comeuppance-- and that right soon. If I see you in the streets, I'll grab the nearest rock and estonia!!!

Joe A's picture

Be a bit more sweet tish

THX 1178's picture

I slander whoever deserves it.

Gavrikon's picture

Is this really Ger-man(e) to the discussion?

SmallerGovNow2's picture

Hey Gav, it's SmallerGovNow from the MW site which is now closed as you may know.  Good to see you...

DanDaley's picture

If they wanted to beat you up, they've got the Lats to do it.

Neethgie's picture

sounds like someone missed his breakfast, you must be hungary

THX 1178's picture

Hungary for some Turkey and Chile served on the finest China. That's all for me folks!

Sven Sikztu's picture

use a napkin to avoid greece stains

persu's picture

As a little nuance. Finland has a trade deficit with EZ and current account is barely positive. That is, trade benefit disappeared in 2007 and funding base to re-circulate surplus is nil.
Plus economynhas been hollowed out, first Nokia led electronicsncluster moved to Asia, Paper industry has been in a decade long perma-crisis and engineering is super cyclical. Rovia, biofuels etc just does not make it up. But everybody wants to have a mortgage, banks give a loan to any amount someone invents on application.

Some serious cost and benefit calculation is needed. Greece 2 barely got passed, for September we expect Greece 3. Will be interesting.

Soini's eurosceptics are again increasing their support in polls. Although they are not in government, he has moved the whole political spectrum. Major parties, mainly social democrates, are worried as their supporters moved behind Soini in previous elections. Now center party is profiling increasingly as eurosceptic. So maybe circa 50-60% of parties are sceptic or pretend to be tough by claimining collateral.

I still do not believe Finalnd would leave EZ unless we do not get understanding in other areas such as farming north of polar circle.

Frozen IcQb's picture

A euro collapse would also bring down European banks (including some in the US). This will not be allowed to happen. The Fed, the  ECB , BOE et al will step in to prevent its demise. They will print and swap to infinity or to the next manufactured war (whichever comes first) if they have to.

Shelby Moore III's picture

How do you define "euro collapse"? Is the Euro falling to parity with the dollar a collapse? I think that is likely to occur, since Europe is so much less competitive than the USA (38 hour work weeks, 4 weeks paid vacation, worse population demographics, etc).

There doesn't need to be printing to infinity in order to sustain the Eurozone, because a massive depression can be managed and encouraged by collectivist intervention as has been going on-- FDR's New Deal in the 1930s USA is an example of over a decade of it.

The countries will be subject to austerity to minimize debasement necessary, while sovereign defaults will be prevented with debasement.

What bothers me is this unspecific idea of infinity printing. That isn't what is happening nor going to happen. You can read some of my other comments for more details.

Ghordius's picture

competitive? have a look at the trade balances, first

Zeilschip's picture

The Euro is breaking up? Swede!

ammo42's picture

the euro is finnished

Only after having been suomized.

lolmao500's picture

no-one wants to be first to get out of the Euro and take all the blame

Only pussies say that. Man the fuck up and do it. And take all the blame.. from who? From the scum running the EU?? Big fucking deal! Finland defeated the Soviet Union and now they are afraid of a bunch of scumbag bureaucrats??? Is he fucking serious??? Fire his ass now and appoint someone with fucking balls for God's sake! This guy is an insult to Finish history and pride!

THX 1178's picture

"Finland defeated the Soviet Union"


This statement needs some context.

lolmao500's picture

Well they ``lost`` ultimately but still kicked some serious butts... Look it up... The Winter War...

It would be like if Iraq had killed 5-6 times more US soldiers than they lost...

Joe A's picture

When there were the referenda on the European constitution in 2004, the Dutch and French voters voted against. France then got the glory and the Netherlands got the blame. The latter was then ostrichized for a while in the EU. Finland being a small country would be the easy scapegoat if they would pull out. Never the big countries get the blame. Much at stake here.

Ghordius's picture

This is utter nonsense and you are mixing up an EU issue with an EZ issue where this Finn is very careful not to do so. btw the word is ostracized.

Nozza's picture

lol - Joe A really did mean ostrichized and not ostracized. I think. Either way the Euro is finnished ;)

Ghordius's picture

based on what reasoning? this currency war is young. they usually last a decade. and fiat currencies often last much longer, until they are spent.

lewy14's picture

Problem is that the Euro is designed to be unspendable. And I do mean problem.

The Euro architects knew that debasement and inflation was an irresistable force.

So they went forth and designed the Euro as an immovable object

So veddy, veddy clever of them.

Tension then becomes a singularity. Which we're witnessing.

Ghordius's picture

I think - and this is speculation - that eventually the EUR will be spent, for political and "mercantilistic" goals. but yes, from a design perspective it was meant to shelter it's zone from the very currency war we are experiencing. the banks would love to profit from the sheer churn that 17 currencies would create by competitive deleveraging, though meanwhile the industry here would have to shift to the East, generating even more churn and movements that would make many financial interests happy.

The political "tug of war" is only about the relative speed. And the true numéraire for the EUR is gold.

lewy14's picture

The industry shifts to the east or the east shifts to the industry. Meaning, take your pick of deleveragings, external or internal.

IMO you're wrong about financial interests but in any case, the political interests love the Euro because it creates for them the exegent circumstances to obliterate democratic democratic consent. 

FinalCollapse's picture

So what 'ostrichized' means? Bury the head in the sand and bend over?

Bohm Squad's picture

No.  It means bend over and then bury your head in the sand; it's a subtle, but important, distinction.

Ghordius's picture

Well, the statement starts with "While not advocating the break-up...", then correctly identifies the guy as the foreign minister talking with a British Newspaper (and they are all addicted to EUR break-up stories, not only the notorious AEP's Telegraph, they sell).

Fact is, if Finnland gets out, could they float their currency? Or would they have to find a peg or a floor? That's the logic of a currency war like we are in since two years.

The "afraid of a bunch of bureaucrats" is just nonsense, the Finns are not afraid, they are just frustrated.

And the "no-one wants to be the first ... and take all the blame" is of course nonsense, too. What are the options?

Marco's picture

Or they could just devalue enough to remain wage competetive and no more ... the northern countries are now being forced to be super-competetive and maintain a trade surplus ... for the benefit of the southern states and I'm sure purely coincidentally for the US as well.

d_taco's picture

Absolutely Right

The Dutch guilder was always pegged to the DMark. No free currency. And if the Spain or Italy devaluate the Dutch pension funds take a big hit. The whole bailout thing is to save the debt holders and has little to do with saving the Euro.

The big question is why does zerohedge continually ignoring the situation in the UK. In Scotland there are more people in favor of a break up the UK than there are in the Netherlands.

The anti Europe party PVV  is losing in the Dutch Polls and the pro Europe party D66 (the party with the biggest number youth members) is gaining. The big winners, the former communist SP are absolutely not against the Euro nor against Europe. But the ZeroHedge spin doctors will portray them as anti Europe like they did with the Greece far left parties. The socialist elite are absolutely not looking for a break up. The clear trend is that the socialist are winning in more countries. The socialist are the most trans-Europe organized group since 1847. If you like it or not, we will see in the end a turn to a more socialistic Europe rather than a break up. The clear turn to left will be explained by the UK Bankers (= Zerohedge) as a request for breakup.

Terminus C's picture

This says all that needs to be said about the Euro experiment.

The big winners, the former (hah!) communist SP are absolutely not against the Euro nor against Europe.



GCT's picture

+1 Ghordius.   The first out if it is a Northern country will be punished for being first by the EU politicians and markets.

Marco's picture

For what? To make some American libertarians living off Saudi wellfare happy? There is no upside ... the small decrease in trade surplus to the southern states is not worth getting kicked out of the common market for. Let the collapse come at it's own pace.

slackrabbit's picture

I'll take the blame.
Yes, it was me and I'd do it again!
Now f**k off!


Inthemix96's picture


I could not agree more, but lend me you're ear.  My business, and it is a small enterprise (I like it that way, less hassle), I have to work with a local government over here in the UK, namely a county council called North Tyneside.  Now bear in mind here folks Me and my staff are fully conversed in what we do, I have been opperating my firm for a very long time.

One of my contracts stipulates that:-

minimum, £20 million pounds public liabilty insurance, fully trained workforce in both health and safety, and working at hight regulations, fully equiped saftey wear equipment including steel toed boots, high visabilty jackets, and eye protection.

On top of this, every job I undertake needs a signed off risk assesment from whomever is in charge on any given day, and continal updates to the local or superior council official.

Does this sound like I may come into contact with something nefarious?  Heres the kicker.  We clean fucking windows, that is what we do, nothing more nothing less.

So to cut to the chase, if I had the time, or the gall left at the end of the day, I would personally wipe out all regulations, and then at least 90% of the fuckers who stop me doing my bastard job, and then maybe, we could get some fucking work done.  The EU is destroying us by just being in the fucking way.  Any new rule or regs, UK INC, is the first stupid country to buy into it.  I have had over twenty years watching this fucker get worse and worse, more rules, less freedom to do my job.

Sorry for the rant, but this is what its like if you have the temerity to own your own business here in gestapo land.

Sven Sikztu's picture

welcome to Obongo's America sir! not that Romney will reign in the hyper regulatory state either... f*ck the cancer of these bureaucrats!

Shelby Moore III's picture

As much as I share your angst, how do you beat collectivism by wishing for a collective solution? You feed the beast by waiting for national leader to help. The solution is when the individuals have the balls to walk away. Finns could migrate back to the countryside and refuse to work in the system. Or migrate to third world countries that aren't yet overloaded with regulations and government.

But westerners don't want to "just do it" on an individual basis. They want someone else to do it for them. The John Wayne types would just take an individual action and be done with it. Leave the collectivists swimming in their cesspool.