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Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:38 | 1816906 SGS
SGS's picture

Ponzi continuum 101.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:42 | 1816926 CClarity
CClarity's picture

Maybe Europe will grant Madoff asylum as a political refugee, on basis that he was only doing God's work and shouldn't be locked up for doing what is business as usual by the goverments and accounting practices overseers.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 11:04 | 1817247 gmrpeabody
gmrpeabody's picture

So, since my neighbor willingly only let half his house burn down, my insurance won't pay?

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 11:44 | 1817380 Hard1
Hard1's picture
Q: Would this call into question the utility of CDS as a hedging tool?  A: NO!!! LOL!!!!!   ROFL!!!! (You'll laugh at this unlesss you were hedging your Greece portfolio and you lost on the portfolio, gained nothing on the CDS and still have to pay 4 years of premiums)

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:52 | 1816964 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

This teaches traders for hedging in the completely discredited CDS market. The doomer CDS market has been incorrectly indicating BOA and Morgan Stanley defaults for some time now. So where are the defaults? I'm still waiting ...

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:26 | 1817106 snowball777
snowball777's picture

1) mark to market

2) fireworks (pun intended)

3) (another) bailout or get lehman'd

If derivatives are so cool by them, why the need to shift their liabilities in that space into FDIC land?

Bears are gonna "clawback" your $1M bonus!

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:01 | 1816986 jdelano
jdelano's picture

You've lost me here.  If there's no chance that this is a credit event, then sovereign CDS are toilet paper and CDS market is officially dead.  Why would anyone buy insurance that has proven to be completely worthless?  Would seem to me the yields on PIIS bonds are going to blow out... 

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 11:47 | 1817399 piceridu
piceridu's picture

I have found that this answer fits with any question or frustration: Note, plug in any question or scenario...CDS, Wallstreet Bankers, will work with any confusion or proposition regarding the Keynesian paradigm.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:01 | 1816998 Solid Gold Bubble
Solid Gold Bubble's picture

So the PTB get the S&P up to 1270 and save the banks without QE3 by strongarming the necessary officials. Can't they just carry this on forever? If they can do this, imagine what they could do to the price of silver? Oh, wait...

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:39 | 1816908 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

What part of 'if the big banks on The Committee got laid last night your CDS might be worth something' don't folks understand? 

Just discount everything on Earth 50% and maybe it will make more sense.  From a market as opposed to mafioso standpoint.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:39 | 1816910 bigwavedave
bigwavedave's picture


Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:46 | 1816939 CPL
CPL's picture

+1 for tits.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:39 | 1816911 george
george's picture

one small step for europe one giant step for zero hedge

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:40 | 1816913 island
island's picture

Caveat Emptor

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:40 | 1816915 pendragon
pendragon's picture

safe, efficient markets. really? got to be a joke

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:40 | 1816916 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

There are no markets, there are only interventions.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:41 | 1816918 SwingForce
SwingForce's picture

If you believe what the Euro PTB just did will work, I've got a bridge to sell you.

If the haircuts are voluntary, I would rescind my agreement if I was a Greek pension.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:42 | 1816924 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

" I would rescind my agreement if I was a Greek pension"

Exactly, you are one smart monkey.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:41 | 1816920 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

Next up  Japanese crisis?

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:42 | 1816923 PicassoInActions
PicassoInActions's picture

shorts are getting killed today

tomorrow may not be many of us left.


Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:43 | 1816929 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

That is the plan.  Now that CDS have become a place for money to die, look for some massive sovereign unwinds and contract lawyers to spring into action.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:05 | 1816976 Chump
Chump's picture

Yup, so goodbye short-covering rallies and hello no-bid flash crash.  I'm glad our distinguished leaders are so smurt.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:05 | 1817018 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

They sure as hell must be running out of Charlie Brown shorts to kornhole to raise world markets. At some point here, theyll all give up shorting and THEN what?

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:42 | 1816927 LongSoupLine
LongSoupLine's picture

Holy Shit...Bob Pisani just had a coming to Jesus and is spewing out common sense and truth as fast as he can.

Never thought I'd hear it.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 13:29 | 1817856 Spigot
Spigot's picture

Hope he doesn't have an aneurysm. But its funny that once his friends have their security blanket taken away from them (a Linus moment) they completely lose it.

As I wrote further down, this is the end of derivatives as we know them and the beginning of "The Great Interest Rate Reloading" where interest rates rise to compensate for default and other such risks, which risk premiums where shifted to these derivates contracts, but now MUST be reloaded onto the interest rate required as its got to be paid for by someone, and now (again) it will be the borrower directly.

Boy, this is going to be fun and aweful to watch.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:42 | 1816928 ZeroPower
ZeroPower's picture

A disgusting day for all professionals working in the credit and sov bond space. 

Hey look mr. Risk dept, no more need for any hedges, SINCE THEY WONT FUCKING PAY OUT.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:47 | 1816945 Hansel
Hansel's picture

So then just sell the underlying.  #NotThatHard

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:03 | 1817003 machineh
machineh's picture

Typical insurance company 'that don't count' weaseling:

Your house was destroyed by an Act of God? That don't count!

Your house was ruined by a flood? That don't count!

You had a building code violation when your house burned down? That don't count!

So why the f*ck did I buy insurance?

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:11 | 1817045 Hansel
Hansel's picture

But CDS has never been insurance.  If it was it would be highly regulated and issuers would have to hold reserves against it.  This was always a toxic security. 

I have no sympathy for people whining "I bought Greek debt even though I knew they were bankrupt because I also bought CDS so I could make a couple extra percent..."

Bring on the junks.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 19:49 | 1819173 unununium
unununium's picture

Why am I thinking that the hedgies probably bought Greek debt and SOLD the CDS...

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:44 | 1816932 EL INDIO
EL INDIO's picture

LMAO “… a 'voluntary' gun-to-my-head haircut of 50% is not a credit event.”

If it’s not a credit event it’s definitely a scalping event.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:46 | 1816940 RobotTrader
RobotTrader's picture

It was pretty much a dead lock that they would cobble together a solution.

What matters is not whether it is a credible plan or not.

The only thing that matters is how the market reacts to it.

You could see this coming a mile away, since we had 41 consecutive days of -1000 TICK readings, with many over -1250 and two over -1400.

Clean breakaway gap right over the 200-day on the NY Composite.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:50 | 1816960 kito
kito's picture

no robo, in your case, you saw that it came a mile away. 

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:07 | 1817028 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Robo saw it coming from his position of rearview mirror trading, well after the fact as usual.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:54 | 1816975 The Axe
The Axe's picture

At least the market stocks like exxon, boeing, intel  up    gmcr,nflx,open,   down over the last 3 weeks.... 

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:55 | 1816982 Chump
Chump's picture

How can you still afford electricity and internet access?

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:03 | 1817004 wang (not verified)
wang's picture

Hey Robo  whilst you were getting serviced last night many of your detractors also appear to have been getting serviced (though in the latter case straight up the ass with a wire brush) I wonder how many of them are able to sit at their computer long enough to junk you.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:06 | 1817022 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

I would like the City Shrimp, preeze.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:19 | 1817044 wang (not verified)
wang's picture

ding nei gaw fye

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:04 | 1817009 jcaz
jcaz's picture

Hey, you're almost whole on Netflix now, huh?

Seriously, I've been in the Securities industry for 24 years, and I've never seen anyone as clueless as you are.

Is this your 8th grade Civics assignment?   Who the fuck watches the TICK anymore?

Your conclusions are- without fail- meaningless and obtuse.   One can literally take your observations and apply them to any market event, and come to a conclusion that prices always will rise the next day.

Please stop citing technical trading- technical trading is, by definition, agnostic, and you're clearly a perma-bull, which renders the charts meaningless for you.

Charts don't make you sound intelligent, and don't reinforce your undying belief that all stocks must go straight up every day.

And Netflix will never see $100 again in our lifetimes- deal with it.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:11 | 1817056 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

How about if it's an "Incredible Plan"? Does that count?

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:46 | 1816941 SwingForce
SwingForce's picture

Pretty slick, if the 15 members if ISDA don't take haircuts, then its NOT a credit event. Screw Barclays.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:46 | 1816942 vegas
vegas's picture

ISDA has proven themselves to be nothing short of a bunch of modern day thieves; on a par with the scumbags who populate the CME in Chicago.

If I was a CDS trader, I'd be looking for a new market to trade. How many times do you need to be bent over the proverbial fencepost and fucked with no kisses, and be told wasn't that great?

Despite the bullshit of no credit event, everybody knows the truth. Remember, if their lips move they are lying.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:49 | 1816950 EL INDIO
EL INDIO's picture

"...If I was a CDS trader, I'd be looking for a new market to trade..."


You mean find another job.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:49 | 1816955 island
island's picture

I'd be getting a lawyer.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:52 | 1816969 kito
kito's picture

somebody please crush the International Socialist Derivatives Association with a massive class action lawsuit!!!!! please!!!!!  

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:25 | 1817101 Gief Gold Plox
Gief Gold Plox's picture

While I agree with your call to action, but did you see the names behind ISDA? You'd have to be God himself to stand a chance.

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 09:48 | 1816949 island
island's picture

"The Restructuring Credit Event is triggered if one of a defined list of events occurs, withrespect to a debt obligation such as a bond or a loan, as a result of a decline increditworthiness or financial condition of the reference entity. The listed events are: reductionin the rate of interest or amount of principal payable (which would
include a “haircut”);
deferral of payment of interest or principal (which would include an extension of maturity of
an outstanding obligation); subordination of the obligation; and change in the currency of payment to a currency that is not legal tender in a G7 country or a AAA-rated OECD country. The decline in creditworthiness or financial condition requirement is intended to filter out restructurings that occur as a result of improved financial condition."


SO what makes this a situation where a CREDIT EVENT is NOT TRIGGERED?

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:04 | 1817011 azusgm
azusgm's picture

It's a voluntary re-fi agreement. <sarc>

Thu, 10/27/2011 - 10:16 | 1817071 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture's just half your debt. I imagine if it was....50.01, THAT MISTER IS A CREDIT EVENT.

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