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Germany Spoils Party After FinMin Says Second Greek Bailout May Need To be Revised

Tyler Durden's picture


Just hitting Dow Jones, another set of cold hard factual bricks for the bailout rumor brigade. From Germany's FinMin Wolfgang Schaeuble:


It appears the euro is now soaring on expectations of a rumor to refute this latest fact.


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Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:43 | 1700812 Vergeltung
Vergeltung's picture

(re the mis-spelling in the headline, channeling Al Sharpton):


"protest, we much"


EDIT: fixed fast. damn!  :-)



Fri, 09/23/2011 - 12:25 | 1701716 covert
covert's picture

all of us are overdue time to take a stand in favor of individual financial responsibility.


Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:42 | 1700813 smlbizman
smlbizman's picture

is this why futures have turned upward?

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:44 | 1700820 HelluvaEngineer
HelluvaEngineer's picture

Right.  So let me get this straight - stawks are supposed to turn around this morning and silver can't catch a bid?  I'm sure copper will just bust a 180 at some point and gold/silver will just get taken to the woodshed again.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:25 | 1701023 Dr Hackenbush
Dr Hackenbush's picture

on the notion that Dow 10K hats create jobs

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:43 | 1700816 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Silver getting MOTHERFUCKING SLAUGHTERED. Now at 32$!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:45 | 1700824 pods
pods's picture

No, it just went on SALE!


Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:47 | 1700845 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Makes you wonder what else is gonna go on sale here.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:04 | 1700920 Comay Mierda
Comay Mierda's picture

two possible outcomes

1) central banks let all the banks fail and depositors lose everything - silver and gold will take a shit

2) central banks launch TARP2,3,4,5, etc.+ QE3,4,5,6,etc. - silver and gold take off to the moon

play both sides. buy puts on the banks and buy phyz gold + silver

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:13 | 1700952 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

central banks let all the banks fail and depositors lose everything 

And what do you think will be the value of their currencies when that happens?

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:18 | 1700977 Comay Mierda
Comay Mierda's picture

less money in circulation = deflation on everything bitchez

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:20 | 1700986 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

The smart money still runs to gold in economic uncertainty.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:23 | 1701001 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

That was true when currency was money because it was gold & silver.  Money is now nothing when the debt behind it collapses = end of fiat regime.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:14 | 1700960 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

Gold will take a shit on bank failures? There is a reason (not a logical one though) Roosevelt outlawed gold ownership in the 30's.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:24 | 1701011 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

2) central banks launch TARP2,3,4,5, etc.+ QE3,4,5,6,etc. - silver and gold take off to the moon

Under the rule of reverse logic, this would lead to lower PM prices because it would provoke an attack by central banks.  I know PMs should go up, but they should have risen upon the SNB peg too, and they didn't.  Surrender to the dog god of reverse logic all PM bitchez.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:32 | 1701057 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Central banks take all gold in nationalized institutions. Have a nice day!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:47 | 1701125 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

Likely outcome :-(

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:14 | 1700962 lynnybee
lynnybee's picture

a lady can never have tooo much gold & silver !    great, on sale, i'll buy more .      ( thank the ZEROHEDGE people for teaching me correctly. )

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:46 | 1700840 CClarity
CClarity's picture

Not in Aussie, Looney or Euro.  Watch oil too.  You're dollar focuses, not saying that's inappropriate cuz that's probably what you own it in, but it isn't in death throes everywhere today.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:50 | 1700864 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Wrong. Silver in loony : -8% at 33.88$ down... another 8%.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:54 | 1700882 achmachat
achmachat's picture

you mean not that "much" in Euro...

in 48 hours the equivalent of a Lotus Elise just went up in smoke for me. Lucky for me that my silver is for a very very long timeline and I wasn't expecting to liquify it any time soon... 

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:27 | 1701026 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Exactly, and that's why I held back cash for my son's college expenses.  Physical is very dangerous if you are forced to liquidate at the wrong time.

I closed my paper, and still love my physical.  By the time this is over, it will be worth a lot, and anyone without physical will be poor.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:36 | 1701076 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Start a solar panel mfg..."thingy" since "you have all that silvery stuff." That should net you a couple hundred mill. Make sure you an exit strategy tho!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:43 | 1700817 Robslob
Robslob's picture

"all your Euros belongs to us"

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:44 | 1700822 lolmao500
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Yeah well Switzerland is screwed then since the banks are worth 394% of GDP.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:45 | 1700829 walküre
walküre's picture

Gold and silver on sale for Americans!

Spread the word.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:47 | 1700842 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Markets shrug off terrible news, expect release of rumor to refute 'no bailout for Greece'....back to carrot and stick world economic driver!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:53 | 1700873 walküre
walküre's picture

The bailout of Greece is NOT a done deal. Never was. Germans disapprove with 80% majority to be hog tied to the sinking ship.

Greece will default officially before Christmas. One US bank will implode over that for sure holding the counterparty risk on the CDS to Greek debt.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:57 | 1700890 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Of course Greece is not going to be 'bailed out', did I say otherwise?

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:39 | 1701092 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Christmas? I thought the "formal" (never to be announced) it a bankruptcy?...would be finished by today.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:47 | 1700846 oogs66
oogs66's picture

its the end of the euro as we know it

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:41 | 1701101 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

You mean as we "no it" in "would you like a euro?" and you say "no."

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:48 | 1700848 Cassandra Syndrome
Cassandra Syndrome's picture

Must have been a telephone conference call. That would explain the rally.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:48 | 1700851 pacdm
pacdm's picture

when will this all end? soon i hope, its all one big joke


Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:51 | 1700867 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

This is the part Hal Lindsay warned about where the Central Banksters would chase gold and silver bugs out of their holdings, right before the big collapse.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:53 | 1700878 TradingJoe
TradingJoe's picture


Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:25 | 1701018 Treason Season
Treason Season's picture

Spelling Police! Freeze TJ!

And stop panicking!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:00 | 1700904 Vincent Vega
Vincent Vega's picture

Sheep, I'm guessing that a lot of the downward price action in Au/Ag is being done by models that the hedge funds use. markets change the models tell them to allocate more (or less) to a particular asset. I have a hard time believing that the price action is coming from people like you, me, et al that are going to local coin shops and selling. Or put another way: it's just the paper players.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:34 | 1701070 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Yea its such a tiny market by comparison, I think its impossible people going into coin stores are causing -20% drops.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:59 | 1700905 HelluvaEngineer
HelluvaEngineer's picture

I keep thinking we'll hear some coordinated central bank stupidity this weekend (or soon enough)

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:02 | 1700909 dclaz
dclaz's picture

Who is selling though? And in such large quanitites?

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:19 | 1700981 RealFinney
RealFinney's picture

All i can see from that article is that Soros has sold pieces of paper and bought companies that produce lumps of gold.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:29 | 1701039 walküre
walküre's picture

Just google "George Soros selling gold" or "George Soros sold gold" and you get hundreds of links

Jim Rogers take on that.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:54 | 1701163 RealFinney
RealFinney's picture

<== Soros actually believes Gold is no longer a good asset to hold and is making an ordinary moving into other areas.

<== Soros is concerned that Gold ETFs are ephemeral paper that isn't actually backed by anything real, and is quickly switching into physcial assets like Mines and Farms before the ETF Ponzi Collapses.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 12:10 | 1701629 RSloane
RSloane's picture

They almost have to. Its just another last desperate lurch to maintain their power.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:56 | 1700888 Dick Darlington
Dick Darlington's picture

Heard a rumor of yet another idiotic Medley report doing rounds saying ECB should buy bank debt. My take is that ECB can do what ever the idiots want to extend the ponzi for a few monts and wipe their asses again with the Lisbon treaty but they can do it without Germany. And without Germany, well, there's no euro.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 09:57 | 1700892 Ancona
Ancona's picture

Fuck 'em and feed 'em fish heads.

This is probably going to be the last buying opportunity in PM's for some time to come. Blythe and Da Boyz are having their fling, but in the long run the fundamentals really do still exist. The demand for physical silver is outstripped by available supply, and the number of people holding paper promises cannot change that.

Pass me the bong please, I'm going to smoke up the last of this hopium.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:00 | 1700911 ISEEIT
ISEEIT's picture

This is freaking silly. Risk on???? WTF! Gotta be expectations of a pending FT/National Enquirer piece due out soon?

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:07 | 1700930 walküre
walküre's picture

Not according to VIX. "Risk On" is not going to happen unless we hear that the Fed will print, print, print.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:01 | 1700912 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Euro Icarus!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:14 | 1700957 reload
reload's picture

Euro - like dax faile at 61.8% fib retracement level. I expect both to swoon again.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:02 | 1700914 r101958
r101958's picture

Some of that 'free' Fed money (our future tax money) being put to use again.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:25 | 1701019 The Fonz...befo...
The Fonz...before shark jump's picture

Wait, what!? There is a SECOND Greek bailout?

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:28 | 1701034 lizzy36
lizzy36's picture

It doesn't matter what Germany or any other member state of the EU does. Greece is done. First loss is always your best loss. If these policy dopes ever worked in capital markets EVER, they might understand that.

Here is the issue that matters. Greek citizens are not going to comply. Simple.

From Spiegal Online:

The group's slogan is as simple as it is stoic: "We Won't Pay."

These are not the people who weaseled their way into Greece's oversized civil service; these are people who put their money in the private sector, working 12-hour days, seven days a week. Or so Belitsakos says.

Standing in his small store, Belitsakos makes a sweeping gesture and says that the people in his movement no longer have a choice. "The state will kill us," he says. "We're acting in self-defense." Then he starts to do the math. Over the last two years, his sales have massively shrunk as 60 of the tavernas and restaurants he used to make deliveries to have terminated their contracts with him. At the same time, the government has raised the value-added tax (VAT) twice while imposing a never-ending series of new fees. He mentions the €300 ($406) one-time fee for the self-employed, a two-percentage-point boost in the VAT, a €180 solidarity levy for the unemployed and a property tax that is "easily a few hundred euros every year."

Belitsakos stresses that his plan is to refuse to pay any and all taxes and fees. If he has to, he says he will either go broke, to jail or both. He is convinced that there are thousands upon thousands who think just like he does and that, in the end, the Greeks will win this battle that they never chose.

The only question is what they really have to win.


Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:40 | 1701095 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

Belitsakos stresses that his plan is to refuse to pay any and all taxes and fees. If he has to, he says he will either go broke, to jail or both. He is convinced that there are thousands upon thousands who think just like he does

This is a very powerful statement and something I have thought about for some time.  The only thing that keeps you wedded to the system is the fear of them taking your house, or going to jail.  With so many without homes, or excess loan to value, is the spectre of going to jail going to continue to command compliance with the tax laws?  I say no.  People will realize there are just too many tax protesters for the government to do anything about it.  They won't pay.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:51 | 1701143 Debugas
Debugas's picture

when one loses everything he loses it

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 12:16 | 1701654 RSloane
RSloane's picture

I agree with you. They will continue to not pay because they can't afford to pay, as so many other thousands cannot pay. Greece does not have jails large enough to stuff their citizenry in.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 12:16 | 1701655 RSloane
RSloane's picture

 double post, sorry

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:47 | 1701124 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Awww. Kind of like your first boyfriend then! Also opposing slogan said with equal German stoicism (and heavy accent as well!) yveeeesss yvouu vill....

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:37 | 1701080 Toolshed
Toolshed's picture

Confiscation time approaches.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:37 | 1701085 SoNH80
SoNH80's picture

These clowns couldn't manage a flea circus.  Cheap politicking, while the swine gnaw at each other's tails.  GERMAN OFFICIALS:  (1)  Merkel: We stand by the Euro, and will offer 'help' for Southern Europe.  ---> (2)  We have come to an agreement with France about the terms of a 'rescue' package.  ---> (3)  Subordinate German Minister: No, no, Germany will not abide by the terms the agreed 'rescue' package, as it violates the German Constitution/Lisbon Treaty/whatever ---> (4) European credit market turmoil ----> (1prime)  Merkel: We stand by the Euro, and will offer 'help' for Southern Europe --> RINSE AND REPEAT.  If I were Merkel, I'd fire ol' Wolfie's ass!  This ain't no party, this ain't no disco, this ain't no fooling around!  What's the endgame here?  A Neue DM, pushing the swarthies off of the boat????

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:56 | 1701108 Smiddywesson
Smiddywesson's picture

It's all a show to stall for time while they buy up cheap gold.  Enjoy the show and don't get spooked out of your long range position.  People who just react to this craziness will lose their heads.

As to gold, all I'm seeing is a $100+ (200) drop in the making.  The last one didn't last too long before it retraced.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:46 | 1701117 Dick Darlington
Dick Darlington's picture

Again the same rumor mill in full force to give the equity bubble few minutes breather. Wonder how France and AAA (looool) go together if they would announce the hundreath banks rescue in the form of TARP. And we all know what happens to the monster cdo called EFSF when the insolvent France finally loses it's top rating.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:49 | 1701134 Debugas
Debugas's picture

Everyone for himself from now on in EU:


Fri, 09/23/2011 - 11:08 | 1701243 Dick Darlington
Dick Darlington's picture

Lights out France (and well almost everyone)!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 13:03 | 1701957 RSloane
RSloane's picture

This will not end well.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 10:53 | 1701147 falak pema
falak pema's picture

the Third and Fourth greek bail out scenarios are now being scheduled for the next G20 meetings on Oct 14 at PAris; where the July 21 provisional Greek package will be provisonally and MOMENTARILY approved,  and then finally, November 3, at Cannes; where,  Ultimately ALL will be revealed and the LAST revised greek package will be finalised along with the FINAL, FINAL and overlall plan to save Euroland. WHeeeeewwwww...

This was decided yesterday at the FAILED G20 meeting at Washington where EU and USA disagreed to Timy's call to HOT up the QE strategy in Europe. Germany said "Niet, We want to first solve debt problem."

So in the meantime as the Central banks CATS are away, the Market mice will play....

Now all is clear, may the roller coaster ride recommence...If perchance the markets push Greece to default in the meantime then we rinse and rebegin...

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 11:06 | 1701223 BarryG
BarryG's picture

Things are getting scary in Germany.

The state sponsored media is pushing a new book called "Dare Less Democracy", which explains that democracy and democratic process is a threat to Germany!

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 11:06 | 1701225 anyways
anyways's picture

I expect Greece to default over the Weekend.

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 11:53 | 1701523 Bullish Bear
Bullish Bear's picture

Any truth to the rumors Schaeuble said the only way the bailout works is if Merkel takes a second job?

Fri, 09/23/2011 - 11:53 | 1701524 Bullish Bear
Bullish Bear's picture

Any truth to the rumors Schaeuble said the only way the bailout works is if Merkel takes a second job?

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