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Greek Banana Republic Status Upgraded To AAA After Sit-Ins At Eight Ministries Prevent Troika Inspections

Tyler Durden's picture




 

A day after we learned that the Greece tragicomedy just gets better and better after it had run out of ink to print tax forms, and hence is unable to collect taxes, and were forced to got over a minute long bout of hysterical laughter having learned that Greece plans on refinancing its rolling debt (which trades at over 100%) with Century Bonds, no seriously and this under the sage advice of BNP Paribas, Deutsche Bank, HSBC and Lazard, we now get the latest update in this progression of relentless Banana Republic upgrades after learning that the Troika is unable to conduct its much needed inspections of Greek deficit cut progress due to sit ins by protesting government workers at 8 ministries. From Kathimerini: "The troika has been in Athens since Wednesday but its monitoring of Greek finances is running into a variety of problems, as besides the disagreement with the government on a number of issues, the representatives of the country’s international creditors had to deal with sit-ins at the building they were about to visit on Thursday. Public sector employees blocked the entrance to the Finance Ministry and the Hellenic Statistical Authority (ELSTAT) in protest at the planned measure of putting thousands of them on labor standby status." Seriously what else? News that government workers start shredding debt indentures for fun? In the meantime the Troika is having official meetings with what's left of the government at the local Starbucks...

From Kathimerini:

The inspectors met with Finance Minister Evangelos Venizelos at the deputy prime minister’s office on Zalocosta Street instead, a meeting that went relatively well according to reports, making amends for a rather disastrous meeting in late August that had led to the troika’s hasty departure.

 

The new snags concern the labor standby system, closed-shop professions and the privatizations.

 

By Monday, the troika will need to have completed its assessment, while the government must have approved the labor standby system, as well as the new public sector salary system, the 2012 budget draft and the new midterm fiscal plan. Venizelos therefore had an extraordinary meeting with Administrative Reform Minister Dimitris Reppas on Thursday evening, and there will be an extraordinary cabinet meeting on Sunday.

 

Public sector workers also staged sit-ins at seven other ministries on Thursday, but decided to leave during the day. Protesters intend to stay at the Finance Ministry until tonight while the sit-in at the ELSTAT building is not seen ending before Sunday.

Meanwhile the government has resorted to withholding the salaries of state employees who have outstanding tax debts, provided their monthly salary exceeds 1,000 euros. Already 20 civil aviation authority employees have had their salaries withheld.

Well at least the meeting went well...

 

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Fri, 09/30/2011 - 05:49 | 1725052 oogs66
oogs66's picture

they need to issue some bonds so they can pay the banks for their advice and no inspection must mean Germany can give even more money! 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 05:53 | 1725055 jm
jm's picture

Just keep breast-feeding those assholes off the German teat, guys.

WINNING!

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:23 | 1725089 malamasa
malamasa's picture

Those assholes JM pay 5% to the Germans while the Germans borrow money at less than 2%

Not bad deal eh!!

and Jm I really doubt that you know where Europe is ...

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:30 | 1725099 jm
jm's picture

Guess we now know that Greek government employees read ZH.

Speaking of Europe, ask the German taxpayer what he thinks of the little vig you describe.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:41 | 1725114 malamasa
malamasa's picture

Government employee ...of course not ...I belong to the private sector y ..I've been working my whole life in the private sector 

and if you want the truth .......

I PAY THE GERMANS PLUS I PAY THESE GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES ....

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:51 | 1725123 jm
jm's picture

Your country pays German banks because it borrowed from them at a contracted interest rate. 

Germany pays less in interest costs because they are not bums on a historical, collective basis.  Do I really need to spell out why your country has to pay a higher interest rate?

Great, you're in the private sector. *claps*

Now why aren't you bitching about the bums doing the sit-in? 

Why should you be pissed that people see through the ridiculous joke on the German taxpayer?

 

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:21 | 1725163 malamasa
malamasa's picture

You dont have a fucking clue what am I doing here ....and how I act as a citizen ....

so ..please stay there in your fantastic world in US ..and always check http://nationaldebtclocks.com/unitedstates.htm

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:30 | 1725176 snowball777
snowball777's picture

But he's complaining about it...doesn't that count for something? /sarc

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:23 | 1725164 richard in norway
richard in norway's picture

you are not a nice person

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:30 | 1725175 jm
jm's picture

The truth hurts, and nobody ever wants to hear it, much less handle it.

As long as there is a good faith effort on the part of a debtor, you forebear.  You work with them.

When they thumb their nose at you, you cut your losses and leave them to their own self-made fate.

US and European banks will never take this step as long as taxpayers shell out to keep the charade going.

That's cruel.

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:33 | 1725182 snowball777
snowball777's picture

You mean those awesomely prudent banks that wouldn't exist right now but for bailouts?

It takes two to tango; a bad loan is just as much the fault of the creditor with dollar/euro signs in their eyes.

Perhaps if those banks had been left to their own self-made fate, we wouldn't be playing charades anymore.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:38 | 1725185 jm
jm's picture

Uh, when a bank "cuts losses", it means there are losses. 

To some extent, there is a place for taxpayer assistance, but it should be done in the framework of democratic process.  Most of what has gone on in the last couple of years is under a cloak of secrecy that shoudl make everyone's skin crawl.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:42 | 1725191 snowball777
snowball777's picture

There should be no "taxpayer assistance" for banks. None. Whether that collusion is above-board or not or controlled by a democratic process (two wolves, one sheep) is completely irrelevant. To pretend that moral hazard is bad for citizens but okay for banks is to invite violent revolution.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:43 | 1725193 jm
jm's picture

One could argue that this should be for voters to decide, but clearly not some technocrats.  But I've pissed off enough people this morning already.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:29 | 1725324 macroeconomist
macroeconomist's picture

You piss people off because you don't know a thing about the crisis in Europe, neither the reasons nor the way to a solution. Instead, you utter the same crap with the "oh lazy Southerners" camp. Here's some stuff for you to read about optmal currency areas and eurozone. You probably won't be bothered, so in summary:

1. High German Wages are possible because of the structural problems in the South.

2. Since joining the Euro, the south has lost all its competitive advantage against Germany and France (to a much lesser degree though) due to common monetary policy and lack of taxes, quotas, or other forms of protection for domestic industries

3. In an optimal currency area (OCA), one of the most important requirements is common fiscal policy, especially when some members run into problems. This is not robbing German taxpayers, it is only getting some of their gains from the OCA back. Which makes all sorts of sense. It is exactly like U.S having federal debt, and the taxes of, let's say New Yorkers, paying for Californian debt.

4. A feasible solution is to issue EU bonds by transferring the excess of Southern Debt over 60% of GDP to a European Pool. That does not necessarily mean that the necessary strucural reforms would not be carried out in these countries. It will only enable the PIIGS to finance some of their debt at much lower rates (at the expense of Germany, France and some others who finance their debt at lower interest rates than the EU bonds will possibly have).

 

http://www2.vwl.wiso.uni-goettingen.de/departmentpaper/No_141.pdf

http://researchonmoneyandfinance.org/media/papers/RMF-29-Stockhammer.pdf

http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=229599

http://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2011/03/11/a-modest-proposal-for-overcoming-the-euro-crisis-version-2-0/


 

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:40 | 1725350 jm
jm's picture

Oh, Good Lord in heaven, now I've pissed off an economist.

Thanks for building the story around dumb political decisions that were unforecastable at time t = 0.  Anybody can go back at what happened ten years ago and say "see, we knew it all along!"  Read my papers.  Where the hell were you guys when the monetary union was in design mode?

No, but thanks.  I'd like to stick with cashflows to determine default contingencies and let the market determine the haircuts and austerity.  But there's no way in hell that's gonna stick when there's a slop trough to be had.  Yet.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 09:19 | 1725478 macroeconomist
macroeconomist's picture

Jm,

 

I have been against the monetary union since the first days, particularly the inclusion of the South. Many wrote that THIS would happen during early 2000s. What I get annoyed with is that a lot of people keep on arguing it is all Greece's fault, and the poor German taxpayers are paying for this. I am sorry but that is not the case. That was my whole point. 

I am totally against bailing out the banks, and i do not think the Greeks must sell all their assets to pay for that stupid debt. 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 09:28 | 1725517 jm
jm's picture

I never siad it was all Greece's fault,  But when you thumb your nose at your creditors, well the forebearance grows cold.  Debtors have to sacrifice and creditors have to eat some too.  Usually this process is accomplished through judicial process.  Traders think CDS will save them but they depend on a determination process that conains inherent political and finacial biases against them. 

Countries aren't amenable names to either CDS or judicial process.  This is why it has gone on so long and involves more and more skin in the game.

 

 

 

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 11:37 | 1725966 edotabin
edotabin's picture

Understood and agreed.  On the other hand, things are totally out of control in Greece. It is difficult for someone that hasn't lived it to understand just how wrong things are in the Greek public sector. Long term, the best thing that can happen for Greece is to scale back the public sector by 50% and slowly begin repairing the damage of dogma, indoctrination and entitlement that have far surpassed reality, effectiveness, efficiency and just plain working to help your fellow citizen.

It is kind of like in America where the police has gone from "to serve and protect" to "scare and intimidate"

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:43 | 1725192 richard in norway
richard in norway's picture

good faith effort, would that be the greeks selling their children. you keep taking pot shots at the ordenary greek people, the only ones who have actually lose anything so far. and the only ones who dont get their point of veiw represented on main stream media

 

bash the greeks is a very popular sport these days, doesnt that make you think that we are being misdirected

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:51 | 1725216 jm
jm's picture

Richard, I can tell you are a kinder man than me, but it doesn't make what you say right.

If the Greek government can't service their debt, then they need to default and face the consequences, not create complications and stalling just to receive another cashburn that forestalls the inevitable for another week or so.  There is no shame in admitting you overextended.  The shame is in all this pretence and graft.

Banks won't give because they have a taxpayer backstop.  Greek government employees won't give because their government keeps a life-line going by gaming the "negotiations".  Who is losing here?  The guys backstopping the whole stupid, stupid game.  

About a default, nobody knows what those consequences would be, other than both better and worse than what some people expect.

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:00 | 1725252 malamasa
malamasa's picture

JM you long CDS right?

 

Do you really think it is up to the (Stupid) Greek Government to decide when Greece is going to default?

I think they have no choice on the matter and its not their call.

Plus our PM Papandreou has US roots and has been accused in Greece as conspiring with certain HF owners (call me Soros his family friend) to create this situation .....

your thoughts on this???? 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:13 | 1725286 jm
jm's picture

My thoughts: Sorry I was an asshole to you.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 09:19 | 1725480 mjk0259
mjk0259's picture

Considering that the default risk is a lot higher than 3% and that the Greeks would have to pay 100% or more, that is a pretty bad deal for the Germans

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:53 | 1725125 Dental Floss Tycoon
Dental Floss Tycoon's picture

 

Dem Greek slaves got to be taught a lesson!

 

No fly zone, bitches.

 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:23 | 1725165 malamasa
malamasa's picture

sleves ... remind me your roots ???? .....Africa boy 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:46 | 1725205 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Awfully proud talk for someone who is about to be a German's houseboy.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 12:00 | 1726056 zorba THE GREEK
zorba THE GREEK's picture

Malamasma is posting more like Malakeesma with that statement. (inside Greek joke)

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:27 | 1725172 DavidAKZ
DavidAKZ's picture

Confessions of an Economic Hitman anyone with Boston big dick prices ?

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 05:56 | 1725058 BlackSea
BlackSea's picture

Uh, soo, I guess Greece will get it's money since the meeting was good and no new bad information was unearthed.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:02 | 1725064 richard in norway
richard in norway's picture

yeah

but they dont want the money. the greek people want to default. they dont see any end to this, all they can see is years of being squeesed. they wantt to get it over with. its the politicans and bankers that want to keep it going

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:23 | 1725090 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

Greece should hold a national referendum, and put the question of exiting the EZ to a vote, and be done with this.  Without popular support, Greece will continually have budget gaps, since no one is going to pay,  and Germany will be left holding the bag.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:35 | 1725107 richard in norway
richard in norway's picture

no one wants to ask what the greeks want to do cos the PTB wont like the answer

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:44 | 1725358 YHC-FTSE
YHC-FTSE's picture

Maybe. Referendum sounds like a good idea, but despite the riots by passionate protestors, the results of such a poll might be in the PTB's favour in Greece. The protests are against austerity, ie they want more benefits, more pensions, more stuff for free. They don't give a shit where it comes from, these ouzo swilling monkeys want more. 

 

The thing that caught my eye was Greek students throwing CDs at the police. The reason? The government could not afford to print them so they distributed text books on CDs instead, and they deemed that unacceptable. Actually paying for them like the rest of us in N.Europe doesn't seem to occur to these people. No wonder they are in the untenable position they are in - Any bailout of Greece will eventually hit my pocket and a default by Greece will also eventually hit my pocket! Where do you think the banks and the governments are going to recoup their losses? I'm really tired of people portraying these lazy, selfish, aggressive beggars as heroes against the banking oligarchy. If the Greeks had any decency and honour, they would have voluntarily left the EZ, and apologized to the rest for their fiscal impropriety. 

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 11:57 | 1726041 edotabin
edotabin's picture

30 years of indoctrination do not vanish in 2.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:00 | 1725062 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

These were grown adult males at their best. Notice how man-children are taking over?

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:00 | 1725063 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Not sure that certain other countries in the world will consider the Greek situation handling as tragicomedy.

When they compare what happened to them in this US world order at the hands of US hands through institutions like the IMF and the way the Greeks are allowed in, it is very doubtful that they will appreciate the double standards at work.

But as in this US driven world, wanton hate is encouraged and laudated over well sourced hate which is a disgrace for a human being to feel (dixeunt US citizens), they will have to put up once again with that obscene exhibition of injustice.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:04 | 1725066 ivars
ivars's picture

Here is comparison chart between my feb 6th chart of DJIA and actual prices. After 8 months with mistakes in the middle, its for last 2 months within 0-5% of actual DJIA:

 

http://saposjoint.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2860#p34298

 

In original chart, the trend continues to go down with increasing speed.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:04 | 1725068 agent default
agent default's picture

I think there is a revolution brewing there, be very weary of the Euro.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:15 | 1725083 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

i know i am

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:46 | 1725207 jez
jez's picture

He probably meant "wary", as I think you noticed. I'm both weary and wary of it.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:24 | 1725094 malamasa
malamasa's picture

yes maybe and world war3.....

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:34 | 1725333 QuietCorday
QuietCorday's picture

I suspect an internal revolution may be on its way as well. However, I sense something far more complex in global terms may emerge.

I am keeping my eye on how Turkey is playing this situation, and possibly taking advantage of EMU/EU weakness and Greece's predicament to make some expansionist power plays that could lead to a nasty upheaval that pulls the E.Med into hell again. 

I have just come back from the Eastern Med, and it was rather alarming to note how many Beirutis and Cypriots I know seem to be accepting the possibility of war over the issue of Cypriot exploration drilling. The impact of Turkey making such a play could be severely destablising for the region with a global impact, as it would pull in Britain, the US, Greece, Turkey, Lebanon, Israel, Syria, and probably Russia into the mix, with Egypt involved as well, with the usual renegade suspects, backed by Iran, Syria etc, taking advantage of the chaos.

This could end up as an almighty mess and the first big front for what could become a third world war. With Western and Central Europe in financial chaos, the US economically weak, Greece in internal political turmoil, UN and core NATO member troops stuck in the Afghanistan mire ... well, the situation doesn't bear thinking about. 

This sort of thing is the reason why I loathe the EU and its idiocies. They have been so stupid and so narrow-minded with their ideological soixante-huit attitudes that they forgot about the core obligation of government: ie. defence of the realm from external and internal threats. In attempting to prevent pan-European war with their blinkered eyes, they have created a situation where the EU will be unable to respond adequately to threats to EZ members while, at the same time, kneecapping sovereign states' abilities to protect themselves.  

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:09 | 1725072 Die Weiße Rose
Die Weiße Rose's picture

a multi-cultural Europe is the future

Germany is glad to help our Greek friends...

Estonia joined the Euro recently and Poland is waiting to join soon

China started it's space-program, so no hard landing...

Europe, Russia and China are nations that have lasted for thousands of years,

they have seen civilisations and Empires rise and fall...

wr;)

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:15 | 1725082 Golden Receiver
Golden Receiver's picture

Since when did Europe become a nation? Isn't the fact they are not considered by some to be part of their current problem? Did I miss the <snark> tag?

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:17 | 1725084 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

Did I miss the <snark> tag?

 

clearly

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:46 | 1725206 agent default
agent default's picture

Bullshit.  German surpluses are the Eurozone periphery deficits.  The Euro was just a wealth transfer mechanism and the transfer is now complete.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:11 | 1725074 papaswamp
papaswamp's picture

The hilarity! ...and the Germans approved this? The Greeks called China yesterday on ways to cook the books and in the mean time instructed govt. workers to 'protest' so would have time to alter figures.

Seriously, how many times is this going to happen?

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:27 | 1725095 sabra1
sabra1's picture

at least they haven't blown up any buildings! (WTC7)

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:32 | 1725328 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

"Seriously, how many times is this going to happen?"

How many times are the Euros going to show up and hassle the Greeks?

I think the Greeks are being very clear: either pay us or get lost.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:13 | 1725077 Comay Mierda
Comay Mierda's picture

Can't wait for the millenium bonds

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:22 | 1725087 Poetic injustice
Poetic injustice's picture

The same as some banks were seriously considering multi-generation mortgage offers.

But Germany will swallow more cooked numbers from Greece, they are not at breaking point yet.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:13 | 1725079 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Government workers have staged a sit in?...ROTFL!!!

I can hear the slogans now...More Taxes Now!...More Taxes Now!!! 

We Want Ink!...We Want Ink!!!

Bureaucracy Now!...Bureaucracy Now!!!

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:52 | 1725222 jez
jez's picture

Yeah, just imagine. Thousands of civil servants on strike, and so not spending all day writing pointless memos to each other. What a hammer blow to the Greek economy.

Nobody will notice any difference at all.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 11:47 | 1726005 edotabin
edotabin's picture

Yes, now just imagine you are the average Greek citizen that needs to deal with government in order to buy toilet paper (exaggerating a bit to make a point) and see how pleasant your life becomes.  It may take a week to accomplish something that elsewhere would take a couple hours.  Further draining peoples' spirits and the economy.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 18:39 | 1727727 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Are you high?

The non-welfare Greeks go out of their way to avoid government.

The toilet paper analogy gave me a good laugh though...Castro just went through potty paper chaos not long ago...not quite Sheryl Crow...but still...you may just get what you want and you won't like it. 

"I propose a limitation be put on how many squares of toilet paper can be used in any one sitting." Sheryl Crow

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

"The extent of Cuba's economic crisis has become so severe that officials say the country is in danger of running out of toilet paper and other supplies, Reuters reports.

Cuban officials said they were reducing the prices on a range of basic goods, but may not receive more toilet paper supplies until later in the year.

Cuba does not currently have the raw resources to produce its own supplies of toilet paper, says Reuters."

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Peoples spirit is drained sitting around waiting for government to do something?...lol...good luck with the rest of your life comrade.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:37 | 1725109 Die Weiße Rose
Die Weiße Rose's picture

the british colonial Empire is crumbling

the 200 year old colonial Experiment has failed miserably

and soon the UK will beg to join the Euro,

however, the Brits will need to first get their own house in order

otherwise they would not be allowed to apply...

wr;)

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 12:18 | 1726154 agent default
agent default's picture

Britain did not fight two world wars to become part of the fourth (financial) Reich.  Get used to it.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 06:58 | 1725126 PontifexMaximus
PontifexMaximus's picture

why is everybody looking at Greece? Watch DEXIA, makes much more fun. Interesting meeting will happen on Moday. Bllombergs T. Patel and A. Clapham are writing interesting "read between the lines stories".

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:19 | 1725295 Tyler Durden
Tyler Durden's picture

You mean this Dexia?

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:00 | 1725127 bullchit
bullchit's picture

The Greek default referendum ballot papers should be a simple affair. One box for "yes" default and one box for "no" default.  Underneath the "yes' default would be 3 extra boxes, marked 50%, 75%, 100%, indicating the haircut.
Paris would be a sea of "Merde".
Regards.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:37 | 1725341 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

There isn't going to be a referendum.  The Greeks would say "See Ya!".

The Greeks have the Euros over a barrel and they both know it.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:18 | 1725159 Byte Me
Byte Me's picture

PIIGD out.

D is for dysfunctional bureaucracy Greco-style.

You had the dosh you shiftless low-lifes, and you loved it while everyone had their hands in their wallets ponying up for your potlach, which went on 15 years past its sell-by.

..Now, arms out, 'cos we want payback -- in blood.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:38 | 1725344 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

The Greeks aren't paying back.  And nobody can make them.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 09:22 | 1725492 Rynak
Rynak's picture

Who is this "we"? The "german" here, prefers payback for the braindamage you caused by making others read your post - preferably in blood. Go fuck yourself, sockpuppet asshole.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:34 | 1725180 MFL8240
MFL8240's picture

Where is Obummer when the Greek people need him.  He needs to go there and preach his hope and change, its worked so well in the US.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:38 | 1725348 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

The Greeks are smarter and more united than the USA.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:39 | 1725188 fredquimby
fredquimby's picture

I just got sent this....

In 1887 Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinborough, had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years prior: 

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse over loose fiscal policy, (which is) always followed by a dictatorship." 

"The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence: 

From bondage to spiritual faith; 
From spiritual faith to great courage; 
From courage to liberty; 
From liberty to abundance; 
From abundance to complacency; 
From complacency to apathy; 
From apathy to dependence; 
From dependence back into bondage."p
The Obituary follows:

Born 1776, Died 2012  
It doesn't hurt to read this several times.
            
Professor Joseph Olson of Hamline University School of Law in  St. Paul , Minnesota , points out some interesting facts concerning the last Presidential election: 

Number of States won by:          Obama: 19          McCain: 29 
Square miles of land won by:      Obama: 580,000    McCain: 2,427,000 
Population of counties won by:    Obama: 127 million  McCain: 143 million 
Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by:  Obama: 13.2
McCain: 2.1  

Professor Olson adds: "In aggregate, the map of the territory McCain won was
Mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of the country.

Obama territory mostly encompassed those citizens living in low income
Tenements and living off various forms of government welfare..."

Olson believes the  United States    is now somewhere between the
"complacency and apathy" phase of Professor Tyler's definition of democracy,
With some forty percent of the nation's population already having reached
The "governmental dependency" phase."

 


Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:49 | 1725210 Hobbleknee
Hobbleknee's picture

The US is supposed to be a republic, which is superior to democracy. But nobody listens to the Constitution anymore and the republic died long ago.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:53 | 1725224 snowball777
snowball777's picture

You know it's superior because there are so many successful republics to be found.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:51 | 1725218 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Are you suggesting apportionment based on surface area?

Moving people from the cities out to Montana and Idaho?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzPUZwev7V8

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:45 | 1725364 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

"Professor Olson adds: "In aggregate, the map of the territory McCain won was mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of the country."

McCain and the Republicans win red states.  The red states are in deficit to FedGov.  The blue states are the net contributors.

Enough of Dem. vs. Rep.  It is a phony construct.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 07:45 | 1725199 Hobbleknee
Hobbleknee's picture

300 was on TV last night.  My how times have changed.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 08:25 | 1725308 snowball777
snowball777's picture

Did they include the part about the Spartans routinely assfucking little boys this time?

I'm always amused by the irony of militia wankers' lame machismo making them want to emulate some of the biggest 'mos of all time.

"Molon labe, bigboy."

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 09:28 | 1725514 4exNinja
4exNinja's picture

It won't matter how much money Germany chucks at Greece if the Greeks don't realize that austerity measures are a MUST! As long as they're acting like a bunch of spoiled brats by throwing away free (!!!) textbook CDs because they'd prefer real books, nothing will get fixed. Of course not all of them are guilty, but it should be evident that the reckless tax evasion and being used to free handouts strategy won't work anymore...deal with it!!

What pisses me off is when they complain about Germany or the other states now bailing them out, when it's the Greeks who messed up in the first place. And them leaving the EU won't automatically make things better or hand them money. All it achieves is that they can continue their reckless spending habits without having a big brother looking over the shoulder stopping them.

Having said that, I've been in Greece many times, and always thought "this isn't Europe"...and I have the same feeling for the part of Italy south of Rome.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 11:06 | 1725834 ambrosiac
ambrosiac's picture

 

 

As a matter of fact all those free textbooks are also available as freely downloadable PDFs at the EdMin website.  Throwing away the CDs is a symbolic gesture with no substance, and no effect other than perhaps scaring the beejesus out of the pigeons of Syntagma Square.

Fri, 09/30/2011 - 11:21 | 1725890 gina distrusts gov
gina distrusts gov's picture

What I find amusing reading all the comments about greece is no one mentions the U.S. banker that hid the underying debt in greece so they could get into the euro zone the great and holy Goldman saches

Tue, 04/17/2012 - 06:21 | 2350797 jaanp444
jaanp444's picture

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