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Greek Bank Deposits Plunge By €5.5 Billion In September: Biggest Monthly Drop Ever

Tyler Durden's picture




 

We had a feeling that the modest upward blip in Greek August deposits by corporations and households, to the tune of €1.4 billion, was a "transitory" event. It was. According to just released data by the Bank of Greece, the September collapse in gross deposits from €188.7 billion €183.2 billion was the largest ever, and took the total to an amount last seen in June 2007. Indicatively Greek deposits peaked at €237.8 billion in September 2009. Said otherwise, in addition to being massively undercapitalized, banks cash in the form of deposit liabilities has plunged 23% from its all time highs. Look for this number to continue dropping month after month as more and more Greeks move their cash offshore. Additionally, the ECB announced that financing to Greek banks in September was €77.8 billion while Greek reliance on the "temporary" Emergency Liquidity Assistance program hit €26.6 billion according to Bloomberg. With every additional deposit outflow, expect ever more money to be needed to keep the Greek sham of a banking system afloat, and more and more Germans to follow in Jens Weidmann's footsteps and start getting very, very angry.

 

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Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:02 | 1856607 PaperBear
PaperBear's picture

Who were the fools putting in €1.446 billion into Greek banks during August 2011 ?

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:04 | 1856621 fuu
fuu's picture

Ben and Timmah?

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:07 | 1856636 Lord Welligton
Lord Welligton's picture

The ECB via some SPIV?

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:18 | 1856683 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

why doesn't the EU go after Goldman SAchs for selling Greece swaps to hide its deficit, so it could get in the union?  Oh right, if they crush GS, the economy would collapse, and US Congresspeople would lose in the election.

 

GS owes EU taxpayers $$$

 

A pox upon the house of Goldman SAchs!

 

#occupywallstreet.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:20 | 1856698 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

They cant go after goldman sucks and greece, because every single southern european country did it too.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:27 | 1856717 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

But that's the @#ASF problem.  Goldman Sachs conducts these questionable dealings, and it has primary dealer status, and is recognized as a TBTF bank, implying that if it goes down, it'd lead to systemic collapse.

 

So GS is untouchable, as it continues its de-facto criminal dealings.  And taxpayers are on the hook, if deals go bust.

 

Why the @#$# do regulators give a near criminal enterprise global financial immunity?  Arggh.  makes me so mad.

 

#occupywallstreet.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:43 | 1856779 Biosci
Biosci's picture

Stage 2 in Kubler-Ross.  There, there.  It will pass.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:25 | 1868776 Richard Whitney
Richard Whitney's picture

Greece tried that gambit, about one year ago. The threat lasted only over a week-end, until it was revealed that 1) Greece invited GS to Greece to do 2) what Goldman had been asked to do previously by several other EU members. That was not the first weasel move by the zeropeans, and many have followed.

You are obviously underinformed about this issue. Continue to mindlessly rant, it is your birthright.

 

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:19 | 1856692 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Uhmm you are. Or should I say you and all the other American tax payers.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:22 | 1856706 Long-John-Silver
Long-John-Silver's picture

You must use an intermediary bank to convert fiat to Gold and Silver when buying on-line.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:11 | 1856882 Jean
Jean's picture

You, if you pay taxes

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:02 | 1856612 AngryGerman
AngryGerman's picture

rats are fleeing the ship. at least the smart rats.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:21 | 1856700 Breaker
Breaker's picture

"Look for this number to continue dropping month after month as more and more Greeks move their cash offshore."

Well then. All is well. They can leverage the deposits and buy Greek and Italian bonds. I think this is a big positive.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:25 | 1856713 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

I have a question.

Why doesnt the EMU plan an orderly transition of greece out of the Euro. Otherwise doesnt everyone know that the transition out will be disorderly? Everyone knows it is inevitable now. The greeks are taking all their money out, that which isnt needed to pay immediate bills.

Why are they all going to allow a.disorderly exit and say " we couldnt see this coming?" No way will greeks pledge national assets as collateral.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:30 | 1856745 Rainman
Rainman's picture

simple one word answer is contagion

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:52 | 1856823 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

It seems if they start early enough they could kick out portugal and greece, and they would have saved some money they could then put toward ringfencing italy and spain. All the money they have already wasted on greece would have been a substantial addition to the EFSF.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:35 | 1856751 DormRoom
DormRoom's picture

if Greece exits, the rest of the PIIGs will be a target.  And theremaining PIIGS--Italy in particular-- bond yields go up, they won't be able to rollover their debts, and they will go bust.  And if they go bust, then the EZ, and Euro are finished.  And if the Euro is a failed currency, then you have a global systemic collapse.  That's the contangion the ECB fears.  We are close to that point. weeks/months away.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:42 | 1856775 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

Because the money-changers want their odious debt paid back.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:02 | 1856614 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

Who you gonna call when the money's all gone?

"Another senior government official said Greece's eurozone partners are demanding that five top Greek officials co-sign a letter reaffirming their commitment to the country's bailout deals and economic reforms, in return for the release of a vital euro8 billion ($11 billion) loan installment later this month. He said those officials are Papandreou and Samaras, the Bank of Greece governor, the new prime minister and the new finance minister."

Pathetic.  A letter.

 

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:06 | 1856632 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

You were expecting maybe, the pledge of their left nut and first born child?

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:14 | 1856671 AngryGerman
AngryGerman's picture

all their daughters, delviers as virgins when they turn 16! then maybe we will release some gold! buahahahaha

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:03 | 1856619 YesWeKahn
YesWeKahn's picture

I am only looking at the month before, wasn't that a positive influx? It must be bullish.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:03 | 1856620 YesWeKahn
YesWeKahn's picture

I am only looking at the month before, wasn't that a positive influx? It must be bullish.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:04 | 1856622 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

transitory - as in, on it's way to zero.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:05 | 1856624 Odin
Odin's picture

I mean can this market really stay a float for another month? It's already over bought, and clinging on to dear life... Call me a bear, but this is insanity...

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:05 | 1856625 Abitdodgie
Abitdodgie's picture

I cannot see the graph the adds are over the top of it.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:38 | 1856759 Ralph Spoilsport
Ralph Spoilsport's picture

I have the same problem on the iPad.

Try the "Printer Friendly View" option at the end of the article.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:52 | 1856825 pods
pods's picture

Well, have you ever gone skiing?

Just imagine a ski slope with a little jump near the bottom.

pods

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:15 | 1856627 Lord Welligton
Lord Welligton's picture

 With every additional deposit outflow, expect ever more money to be needed to keep the Greek sham of a banking system afloat

And is this not the absolute truth.

Anybody in Greece holding money in a Greek bank now faces two risks.

The collapse of the banks.

And the, now not insignificant, risk that Greece might exit the Euro.

An exit from the Euro should be their greatest worry.

They would be better having all of their Euros under the mattress now.

Why take the risk of having them forcibly converted in a new Drachma?

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:18 | 1856913 RiverRoad
RiverRoad's picture

It's possible that a new Drachma might be just what the doctor ordered especially since the MO of most currencies now seems to be intent on winning the race to the bottom anyway.  Greece would be overrun with tourists (Santorini redux!) and the velocity of the currency re that aspect would do the country a world of financial good in regard to what other hiccups would occur.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:07 | 1856638 EZT
EZT's picture

This is Bullish, NOT

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:08 | 1856641 ssp2s
ssp2s's picture

I don't think this is going to make it to a "month after month" situation.  As Mish explained yesterday, the rational action for Greeks is to pull their money from banks, and the run that this amounts to will bring it down.  As they say, the collapse comes slowly, and then all at once:

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/11/history-suggests-greece-will-freeze.html

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:08 | 1856646 youngman
youngman's picture

Whoever has money in a greek bank right now isa an idiot...but then again.....

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:09 | 1856650 partimer1
partimer1's picture

Its not about Greece anymore, and its never really about Greeece.  Whatever they do, it simply does not matter anymore.  

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:10 | 1856655 yabyum
yabyum's picture

Today. We are all Greeks.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:11 | 1856657 Manipulism
Manipulism's picture
The Italian Job – How Passports Influence Monetary Policy Decisions

The nationality of the ECB’s managerial staff matters for the monetary policy of the central bank, two German and Austrian economists show in a new paper. The findings are so politically charged that the detailed results of the study are kept secret.

http://economicsintelligence.com/2011/11/01/the-italian-job-how-passport...

I would love to hear smoething about this from Tyler.


Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:49 | 1856811 RiverRoad
RiverRoad's picture

Yeah, and the "official line" is they're all supposed "to leave their passports at the door"........riiiight.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:11 | 1856658 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

B

  A

    N

      K

        R

          U

            N....

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:12 | 1856661 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

What I want to know is why anybody keeps money in the Greek banks in the first place.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:51 | 1856820 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

Normalcy Bias.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:20 | 1856921 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

No shit, who would have thought the banks contained 5.5 billion euro??  Hello morons!!!

 

Your country is swirling the drain, convert Greek marked euro to N. euro and hide under bed..  Or alternatively you could buy some metal, high strength steel and lead perhaps..

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:13 | 1856668 YesWeKahn
YesWeKahn's picture

How much money does Greece has in deposit? From the chart, it should be zero already. That's green shoots, it can only go up from here.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:15 | 1856674 TideFighter
TideFighter's picture

Anybody know why KITCO is down again. I've got some rumors, but no good source.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:25 | 1856712 Stax Edwards
Stax Edwards's picture

I heard they refuse to sell Gold right now, because it is trading too cheap vs Fiat

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:35 | 1856982 MissCellany
MissCellany's picture

That never worried them before.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:20 | 1856677 The Swedish Chef
The Swedish Chef's picture

Greeks are suddenly big, if not the biggest, foreign owners of Swedish stocks. They have vacuumed Stockholm OMX for a place to put their money. Capital flight bitchez!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:18 | 1856686 BarryG
BarryG's picture

Germany - The Biggest Debt Transgressor In History....

http://germanywatch.blogspot.com/2011/11/germany-biggest-debt-transgressor-in.html

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:19 | 1856690 americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

Greeks are cashing out their bank deposits for lots of reasons but my guess is that the primary reason is that so many have no income now and are now living on the last of their savings.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:26 | 1856716 Capitalist10
Capitalist10's picture

Well at least that's progress, compared to living on the Germans' savings.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:28 | 1856727 AngryGerman
AngryGerman's picture

i don't mind them living of my money when they fulfill the necessary conditions (see my comment above)

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:08 | 1856877 Capitalist10
Capitalist10's picture

LOL!  I'll take a piece of that action!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:27 | 1856724 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture

Greek population is about 11 million - so that works out to be 500 euro withdrawl for every man, woman and child in Greece.  That is way too much to be only for survival for a month.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:29 | 1856732 AngryGerman
AngryGerman's picture

depends what you do with the money. 500 cannot buy you a lot of high-end hookers...

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:21 | 1856703 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

The market is down 50 pts. Quick we need a rumor.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:25 | 1856714 Iriestx
Iriestx's picture

3pm announcement will be Berlusconi's resignation. 

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 15:07 | 1857598 Iriestx
Iriestx's picture

BOOM!  Fucking called it!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 15:07 | 1857603 Iriestx
Iriestx's picture

BOOM!  Fucking called it!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 15:10 | 1857613 Iriestx
Iriestx's picture

BOOM!  Fucking called it!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:26 | 1856719 AngryGerman
AngryGerman's picture

ahaha, uhuhu, wait i got it:

 

IRISH FIND POTS OF GOLD UNDER RAINBOWS! WILL USE FUNDS TO SUPPORT EFSF!!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:42 | 1856777 NumberNone
NumberNone's picture

Leprechauns form Occupy Dublin in protest.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:27 | 1856725 RaymondKHessel
RaymondKHessel's picture

I am so sick of stupid EUROPE just GO AWAY.

FAZ to the moon here $50+

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:28 | 1856728 monopoly
monopoly's picture

Pay attention all, this is a prelude to what will happen here. That is a promise.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:28 | 1856729 Dick Darlington
Dick Darlington's picture

Yet the Irish banks are sucking way more ECB financing + money from ELA program than Greek banks. Yet EVERY pundit tells how Ireland has "turned the corner". Lol!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:29 | 1856734 reggiehammond
reggiehammond's picture

From a moral perspective I would take any Greek over any large cap US bank. Greece might be slightly les solvent than US, but from an integirty perpspective Greece banks have their US counterparts by exponents. Hopefully eveything will crash and CEO's will have to hide in drainage ditches from homicidal masses with wobbly cellphone video cams chanting religious banter.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:40 | 1856765 The Swedish Chef
The Swedish Chef's picture

At least Greece has islands and retsina to pledge as collateral. Banks have paper and bonuses...

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:55 | 1856837 fuu
fuu's picture

Maybe the missing deposits are up in there.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:30 | 1856739 oogs66
oogs66's picture

this is why they did a bond deal yesterday...6.3 billion euros, guaranteed by the government, so they can fund it at the ecb...circular!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:30 | 1856740 Bam_Man
Bam_Man's picture

Time to start the countdown.

How many more Fridays are there 'til a "bank holiday" is declared?

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:31 | 1856747 Texas Ginslinger
Texas Ginslinger's picture

"If Greece had defaulted, there would have been a domino effect carrying everyone away,"

"Allowing Greece into the eurozone in 2001 was a mistake."

Nicolas Sarkozy

Interesting how he says 'if'.

If looks more and more like when, and then what..??

Italy next in line..??

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:39 | 1856761 AngryGerman
AngryGerman's picture

the beginning of a fantastic meal:

1. Greek salad

2. Some pasta

3. Paella

4. Coq au vin

5. To close up some Queijo da serra, together with a glas of whiskey.

 

And after all that I probably will go out and help myself to some German beers!!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:43 | 1857007 jomama
jomama's picture

that's like a 4000+ calorie day.  i don't eat that much and i work out daily.

about that sustainability thing...

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:34 | 1856755 Dick Darlington
Dick Darlington's picture

Here's an interesting article abt Greece:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/07/world/europe/in-greece-economic-crisis...

From the article:

That the Greek economy is in a downward spiral from a relentless program of austerity is well known. In October, Greek manufacturing had one of its sharpest declines ever, and this year overall production is expected to contract by more than 6 percent. What has not yet shown up in the official figures, though, is the extent to which the crisis atmosphere has brought the economy to a virtual standstill.

Auto sales have essentially stopped and are at their lowest level since 1993. People who do have cars have trouble with the expenses of operating them. In the last three months, the number of uninsured drivers increased by 500,000, bringing the total to 1.5 million.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:38 | 1856760 Dr. Gonzo
Dr. Gonzo's picture

I just got the minutes from today's meeting at the TPTF ministry of Ponzi. "Ok. Dow down 64 now. That's close enough. Churn it between -90 and -30 for a few more hours then have the computer ramp it up on another absurd rumor our MSM is putting in the headlines to a +90 close again and call it good. Then do it again tomorrow and the next day. Let's close at the day high everyday this week to really freak people out but no more moves up or down over 100 for another week. We don't want to get too cute. It will be hilarious. Huge Christmas bonuses for all your hard work." 

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:41 | 1856771 RiverRoad
RiverRoad's picture

It seems to me that if Merkozy et al were serious about preserving the Euro at all costs, they would have found a way to institute currency controls on the Euro in Greece and all of the Eurozone for that matter.  Without currency controls, hypothetically, all Eurobank depositors could move all their money out of the Eurozone.  Could this interminable dog and pony show denial and delay have anything to do with the fact that what each of them is primarily working on is their own ultimate plan to exit the Euro????

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:49 | 1856808 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

I'm playing with my State Senator.  I sent her an email about the ECB Fed Deposits rise and now I just sent her this chart.

I cant wait until I get a response.  The state of WI doesnt have a clue whats coming...of course none do but I have been warning her for about 2 months.  Here are my oringinal emails to her in September Youtube vids on it...

My Email to her: http://youtu.be/sSknThHgnHI

He call to discuss:http://youtu.be/wBWL4vW_kM8

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:49 | 1856812 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

GOOD!!!!

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:54 | 1856831 Eddyspain
Eddyspain's picture

What about getting a credit from a Greek bank? You put your euros abroad (or convert them into gold, dollars etc), wait some months and return the credit in neodrachmas. Of course, you must have "friends in high places".

I bet this thing is going on now ("compadres" obtaining loans in order to transfer the funds abroad, waiting for the devaluation) This is the likely consecuence of the ECB insistence in keeping the Greek financial system liquid.

 

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:57 | 1856848 Jean
Jean's picture

Why worry about NeoDrachmas?  The drama isn't about whatever liquidity lets the Greek economy putter along - it's going to about NeoDMs.

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:55 | 1856836 Jean
Jean's picture

Is Greek money staying in the EU or going to Russia/Israel?

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 12:57 | 1856847 ThirdCoastSurfer
ThirdCoastSurfer's picture

With every dollar you spend or borrow or save, you vote! 

You don't have to be registered. You can be a convict, who can't read or write. You can be an illegal, a tourist or a child. 

If you don't like something, don't spend money on it! 

But what of the government you ask? Should I not pay taxes?  Of course not. The great blind spot in humanity is that no matter how much evidence is presented showing who really controls the government (did you see the interview of Abramoff on 60 minutes?), the people will forever cutoff their nose to spite their face. 

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:00 | 1856860 dr.charlemagne
dr.charlemagne's picture

Hey ZHer's. Anyone know when the contagion kicks off? I Like FAZ here :-)

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:11 | 1856881 RaymondKHessel
RaymondKHessel's picture

FAZ is a strong buy now....

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:32 | 1856965 ivars
ivars's picture

The more I look at US debt crash correction and future gold/silver charts,

http://saposjoint.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2626&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&sta...

http://www.tfmetalsreport.com/comment/78024#comment-78024

http://www.tfmetalsreport.com/comment/78025#comment-78025

Something does not fit with end of 2013 or beginning of 2014 being the date of US debt crash correction. So the anwer could be:

that defaults of USA Treasury to FED will happen in discrete (DISCRETE as in DISCRETE scale, not as in discrete presence) way starting from November 2012,->and that is the reason of Gold price connection with this election cycle, then FED buys more, then Treasury defaults again etc. It will be kind of a new "permanent"  way of handling country debt and monetary issues combined.

I just wander what other consequences it will bring to USD value  ( vs. commodities, other currencies), will it become fashionable way to handle part of debt in every country (except Europe where partial debt corrections happens as  country by country defaults as there are no local central banks). Than of course every countries currency will devaluate in a similar manner to the USD except that USD will still be sitting on bank balance sheets even if they will receive a default in JPY ( e.g. Japan). So despite US correcting its debt to FED , USD still will have the longest (one of the longest ) lifetimes among currencies. The currencies that can outdo USD will be those where total government debt and other debt in the economy is small relative to GDP, and where USD etc is not too prominent on the balance sheet of central bank.

Also, does it MEAN Ron Paul can make it to president with coming recession etc and consequently exploding debt? Or his idea will be stolen by Obama?

"Congressmen and Presidential hopeful Ron Paul, who chairs the House sub-committee on monetary affairs says the Fed should not be holding this “ficitious” debt any longer against US tax payers."

http://saposjoint.net/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=2626&start=860#p35004

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 13:33 | 1856970 DCFusor
DCFusor's picture

Assuming Greeks are just moving money overseas without tracking where it goes is just as stupid as the sell side guys saying that with all the outflow from equities, there is a ton of money on the sidelines just waiting to return.  I call bullshit - I know all too many who simply used the money to get by, having no other options (as far as their thinking goes).All those corp profits are that money - -and the profits are there due to cost cutting, so no more is coming in for people to spend....

Tue, 11/08/2011 - 14:35 | 1857364 Balmyone
Balmyone's picture

I wonder if the people fleeing the European Banking Titanic are buying gold and silver.

I wonder.

I will say that Chinese and Indians know that its smart to buy gold.  Americans, maybe not so much.

http://www.gainesvillecoins.com/news/490/FT--Chinas-September-Gold-Impor...

http://www.gainesvillecoins.com/news/474/Mine-Web--Indias-Gold-and-Silve...

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