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Guest Post: America’s Iraq Experience: Invasi-Eradicavi-Turbavi
Submitted by Ben Tanosborn
America’s Iraq Experience: Invasi-Eradicavi-Turbavi
Julius Caesar undoubtedly was showing off with his Veni-Vidi-Vici (I came, I saw, I conquered) when referencing to his short war outside Zela (Zile) in Turkey over two millennia ago. Similarly, if we were to use a short catchy-comment for the almost nine years America has invested in its “Iraq Mission,” we would be on target by condensing the US experience in also three Latin words, although not as melodic this time: Invasi-Eradicavi-Turbavi which sadly stand for, I invaded, I destroyed and I threw-into-chaos.
No matter what the Pentagon and White House tell us, the fiasco in Iraq likely stands as the most costly mistake in America’s history, a true Keystone Kops type of political dark comedy. And it wasn’t a bad or flawed decision by a singular moron or group of morons – Bush the Younger, Sadist Cheney and Loquacious Rumsfeld composing the original warpath triumvirate, together with two dozen equally deranged staff of their inner circles. Unfortunately, this time Congress, together with a brainwashed public, closed rank with an evil and criminal White House. So, whether the American citizenry likes it or not… the Iraq conflict wasn’t just Bush’s war, but “the peoples’ war,” a war with a dangerous aftermath yet to come, one we’ll likely be paying for in the future with additional blood and treasure.
American mainstream media, true to their corporate ownership, are bringing us the images of the GIs returning home together with some white-washed commentary. The corporate media is careful not to turn this December event into a celebration, but grotesquely over-simplifies this empire’s adventure by summarily giving its cost as “an expensive war with 4,500 American casualties and 100,000 Iraqis killed.” There you have it: the sum total of our criminal intervention under the cry of “Democracy and Freedom”! In 1099 AD, it was the cry of Deus vult (God wills it) that led Christianity to its First Crusade and the capture of Jerusalem. Now it’s the pseudo-patriotic cry of defending our freedoms which takes to war thousands of miles away. Totally inane!
Yes, it has been (and continues to be) an expensive war, the true figures not properly made public. And, yes, the number of US casualties is probably around 4,500. But those 100,000 Iraqi deaths are only a fraction of the 500,000 to 1,000,000 range given by most credible accounts. However, even these figures don’t begin to tell the true holocaustic implications of decisions made in the White House during the months leading to the March 2003 invasion of Iraq.
What about the tens of thousands of US soldiers wounded or maimed? Or the hundreds of thousands of American military personnel mentally wounded? What about the millions, yes, millions, of Iraqis displaced from their homes? What about the suffering and depravation of the Iraqi population for many years after the invasion – water, electricity, safety concerns? What about the indignities suffered by an occupied people, where crimes committed by the occupying military were not properly punished… does anyone remember the incidents in Fallujah and Haditha among others?
It’s certainly not our intent to revisit the war, or to touch on Americans’ ignorance of what the war was all about. Our purpose is not to follow course in the treatment of the inefficacy of a war, whether in the battlefield or the Iraqis’ hearts, as the media seems to be portraying this great misadventure. We would like to take it a step further, truly show the idiocy of an empire whose civilian, military and academic leaderships were incapable to read history and, in the most basic fashion, extrapolate from it.
As the Ottoman Empire was dismantled in 1920, it was the League of Nations that really created the nation of Iraq, giving it its borders and putting Britain in charge. Ironically, it was a secular dictator, Saddam Hussein, who maintained rule and order in a country ethnically and religiously divided; and doing so with a Sunni minority, without true adherence from the Shiites and open defiance by the Kurds.
America’s introduction of democracy has consolidated the power of the majority Shia over the Sunnis, with Kurds exercising a great level of autonomy in their region. For the US, the political bottom line, outside of a shaky hand on the oil, could not have been any worse: Shiites don’t feel any sense of gratitude to America for being handed the power, and the ability to exact discriminatory-revenge against the Sunnis. In fact, inadvertently, the US has been matchmaker to the romance taking place between Iran and Iraq.
Is the rebirth of the Persian Empire something imminent as Iran achieves the status of being the next nuclear power?
The last 18,000 American troops are coming home from Iraq this month. We ask ourselves if the White House and the Pentagon are planning to send 500,000 more in the near future as Israel prepares to defend its nuclear hegemony in the region.
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yes we can!
There is only one person that can stop this suicidal, mass-death madness. His name is Ron Paul. Please send him $10 today so he can continue to be the lone national political figure who actually stands for peace.
Done. Family and friends finally relented and sent money in last night. Small amounts, but all of us were gutted in 2008. Motivation level is high.
I sent in also--but I'm holding below my legel limit for the campaign because I feel that if RP wins the nomination he will have zero backing from the Republican neocons party and will be on his own for financing and I want to have room to give again.
I agree totally.
Iraq was necessary. The duration was the problem. That one should have been: invade, kill Sadam and get da fck outa there.
Someone else would have taken power and fixed the oil pipes.
We don't like the someone else?
Repeat the process.
Same has to be done with Iran: Bomb them by surprise and do it heavily, cripple them until some other movement from within takes power.
We don't like the someone else?
Repeat the process.
This is the only foreign policy that can work in the middle east.
We need their fckn oil and we don't want them to get nuclear, especially not nuclear AND ballistic.
Remember what your were sold at the start. Weapns of mass destruction. Never not one shred of evidence to support such a claim was found. Now they are using the same excuse to go to Iran. again without any evidence. See a pattern?
If there are or aren't there WMD is not an issue. Don't care if it was a lie.
Iraq had to be stopped because it was not in the interests of the US for that regime to continue.
The same applies to Iran but the need is even stronger. Even if Iran were not doing R&D for nukes. Even in that case, Iran regime change is a necessity: Oil, terror and regional power-grab.
It is much more --- no, VASTLY more --- the aggressively militaristic, openly imperialistic USA that is spreading terror in the region, and making a "regional power grab", than is Iran.
It is the American government who is in the wrong here, not that of Iran, which however religiously misguided and repressive domestically is merely responding to US regional (not to mention worldwide) aggression, not fomenting its own.
Get back to me when you find the website for the "Project for a New Iranian Century".
MDB stop the BS with this other alias please....
By that logic, every other nation in the world has the same right to view the US in the same manner. You're not in my best interest, so I'll blast you to the stars.
You want to "stop" Iran from encroaching on "your interests?" Put your money where your mouth is. Pick up an M4 and get to work.
Otherwise, crawl back into your warm hole of internet anonymity.
Yes, and be prepared to have your tax rate double so we actually pay for it instesd of borrowing the money from China, to be paid back by our children.
That is your fckn retarded logic. Same right? what the fuck are u talking about?
The US is right, Iran is wrong. Full stop.
The West has the kind of stuff that is absolutely true: equality in front of the law, gender equality, democracy and most importantly: No fckn god putting someone in government.
Same right?
Dumb ass!
Spoken like someone with room-temperatue IQ.
It was a huge strategic blunder by the neo-cons to upset the balance of power by destroying Iraq. The Iraq threat served to keep Iran occupied and both countries wasted their resources fighting eachother. Bush the elder understood this which is why he didn't go all the way in the first gulf war. Saddam was no real threat to anyone but Iran.
Thats exactly my point: Bomb until regime is changed. DO NOT invade. Then provide Iraq cheap big guns from the US in exchange of oil.
What pattern? What are you talking about? They almost have the bomb. They hate us because of our freedoms and our democratic way of life. Since 1953 we've been trying to set them straight and they won't listen. Don't they understand that we need all that oil? And because of who we are and the incredible job we do of keeping the world free of conflict, we should have access to all that oil. The American way of life is at stake here. And I for one, am not going to sacrifice it.
Yeah baby!!
Iraq was indeed necessary. Bush screwed up by disbanding the Ba'ath Party and not installing another strongman to take over. Bush is naive to think that the Iraqis are ready to establish a civil republic.
Who gives a fuck ! They are so occupied in their self absorbed stupidity they are rendered harmless to their neighbors ! Is Tanborn a German expert of "Victory" ? LMAO Monedas 2011 Comedy Jihad Germans Pontificating On How Victory Feels ?
Similar to how the CIA screwed up by helping install Saddam Hussein as a strongman? The same goes for the Shah of Iran--that certainly worked out well for The West.
The timing was exquisite ! We left as soon as the Arab Spring dominoes began their predictable fall ! Monedas 2011 Comedy Jihad I'm Not Losing My Timing In Mid Air !
I think you need do some more work on your grand scheme strategy. You take out Saddam and get outta there...and then what...?
As for Iran - you sure you gonna like the "other" significant movement ?
You haven´t yet reached the Kissinger level of sophistication and understanding of the use of power...and the world. You know - the world is a big place - even bigger than the US
what oil did we get from iraq that we weren't getting before? iran sells oil mostly to europe....what's wrong with...uh...buying oil? why do we have to steal it? if that is what you are saying we did.
Hrm. Perhaps the USA (CIA) shouldn't have helped Saddam Hussein into power to begin with. Furthermore, The West has already done quite enough about Iran. Usurping their secular democracy was atrocious, but supplying Saddam Hussein with chemical weapons and the means to create them was insult-to-injury. I'm sure the hills blanketed with the bodies of hundreds of thousands of Iranians twitching from their synapses literally melting was worth it though.
Then again, Iran (formerly Persia) did go on a world conquest as recently as 479 BC--almost 2,500 years ago. I suppose they cannot be trusted.
How did that Iraq oil for US taxpayer war bill work out?
Here is a Co2 carrot dangling from my stick. We have a new strawman that will make you lose your freedoms. You must rally support for his dealth or you'll be placed on the DHS list as a terrorist combatant.
LOL!!
Yeah how did our oil get under their sand, anyway?
Oh really, that's the reason?
I guess you don't realise that you can buy oil then?
What happened to that idea? ... no trading ... just steal shit at gun point? ...
You sound rather israeli ...
--
Lastly, Iran has every right to exert influence within its OWN immediate bordering regions ... the US has ZERO right to do it in someone else's region of influence, let alone invade countries and slaughter their people under false pretenses.
That's exactly what Hitler did in Poland ... and ... and ... and ..
Does anyone know if the campaign-limit counter resets on 1/1/2012?
you were having feelings of being "gutted" because sarah pallin didn't win???????????????????????????
it's palin. i too felt gutted. i contributed to, canvassed and voted for obama. i have since registered republican. i have contributed to ron paul and intend to vote for him in the florida primary.
how could ANY of you dudes vote for Owebama when Geethner and Summers et al were on board DURING his campaign??
what the hell did you expect to happen?
"how could ANY of you dudes vote for Owebama "
Because he could walk and chew gum at the same time. I didn't vote for Obama, but most of my well meaning friends did. Don't forget how much Obama lied to the people during his campaign. Starting with shutting down Gitmo. And look who was put up in opposition. A angry, corrupt, and senile old man and a stupid cunt. (I use the word to reflect a very particular type of woman, a counterpart to, say, a dickhead). Anyway, most people weren't clever enough to see that it was all lies and no choice. The positive part about the Obama election victory is that it reflects that the majority of Americans wanted the country to get back on track. They just didn't realise that it was all a pack of lies. It was in fact a CIA color revolution strategy brought back to the fatherland.
I am posing this question totally hypothetically and do not believe it to be the actual case. But what if Ron Paul were elected and he proceded to continue the policies of Bush and Obama to the letter? Would you say that all of the Paul supporters are idiots and should have seen through the lies? In politics anything is possible so you have to go with the probable.
"But what if Ron Paul were elected and he proceded to continue the policies of Bush and Obama to the letter?"
AFAIK, RP hasn't proposed keeping Bernanke on in his admin (heavy sarc)
Well, then you would vote for Hillary 2016.
Certainly we would have egg on our faces. In fact, we would turn on him and his administration viciously. That's the difference: Obama supporters were tricked, but they haven't demanded his resignation. Indeed, no one's bothered to primary him. That's not to say that there won't be scandals in a Paul administration (bureaucrats being what they are), but we would hope that they would be dealt with quickly.
Liberals have a surprising tolerance for neo-cons when they are democrats.
You don't understand. If Ron Paul were elected he'd be dead within 6 weeks. A "lone madman" would appear as if by magic.
I meant gutted financially in 2008. That's why the small money bomb contributions.
But, I campaigned for Ron Paul for the 2008 primary. Stuck about 700 signs in the ground, and manned the polling place in my town on Primary Day. The GOP comitteeman was not pleased at my presence but we shook hands afterwards.
I would vote for Ron Paul, or his son for that matter. But do we actually think Ron Paul would stand a chance against the Global Elite? These are the people who control the whole world by controlling the worlds financial system. They can control anything they want, buy anything they want and buy whomever they want. They control whole nations! They control the United States! Ron Paul is just a David facing the Luciferian Goliath. But it would be nice if he was able to accomplish the same victory that David accomplished. But still, he's got my vote.
It does not matter who you vote for , it is the people counting the votes that matter .
naive cynicism, imo
And intentional ignorance on your part if you do not see the truth of that statement. Ask Al Gore.
From what I understood of your supreme court hearrings, the state (in this case Florida) is the sole decider of who is 'eligible to vote', and thus, what votes will be counted. http://www.davesweb.cnchost.com/Supreme.htm
http://www.davesweb.cnchost.com/Supreme2.htm
http://www.davesweb.cnchost.com/Supreme3.htm
Voting machines made by Diebold were easily rigged. People who complained about it were smacked down with ... copyright suits by Diebold.
https://www.eff.org/cases/online-policy-group-v-diebold
It was Joseph Stalin who first mouthed those words. You can call Stalin a lot of things, but naive is not one of them.
people or machines.
Even Homer Simpson figured that out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aBaX9GPSaQ
You wll never know unless/until you try.
Fine, make RP president, have your moment of victory.
That's all it will be. Because he would be completely shut down, unable to accomplish any of his objectives in congress, and if he tries to do it by executive order he would be run out of office / offed / whached / whatever.
Don't think so? Just ask JFK.
Don't misuderstand, I would vote for RP. But I wouldn't expect to see any accomplishments. He'd be lucky to stay alive 4 years.
There's a difference now. More people are awake to the elites and what they do than at any time in history. If Ron Paul actually gets to the whitehouse, he can use the bully pulpit, and could accomplish most anything. There are over 300 million of us, and just a few thousands of them, and they know it. Of course, They could off RP, and who knows what would happen then, civil war?
I do agree that the chances of RP making a real and lasting change are slim, even if he gets elected. I think the chances of them offing him one way or another, or doing something like thermonuclear war, are high. But it's our only chance. We've got to try.
It's not "our only chance". It may be the only chance "we" have that doesn't require any real commitment or action on "our" parts, other than donating a Ben Franklin and driving down the the polls to play the part of concerned citizen. There is no 300 million of "us" btw. If there were we wouldn't even be having this discussion.
Identify individually the "global elite", having done that they can be neutralised
He wouldn't stand a chance against congress...
+ $200
While it is possible RP may be better, bear in mind that Obama was ushered in with an exuberance that things were going to be different.
It does not matter what political system being a mayor/senator/etc none of it will be the same as being The President. The magnitude of responsibility and history will rest upon the President. Special interest groups... Party politics and individual alliances, filtered information. Balancing one budget off another. etc etc. Best laid plans laid to waste.
Then again who knows, maybe RP will strong arm it with enough supporters in the right place. Just hope the system doesn't strong arm him back.
Maybe I'm just pessimistic about politics in general.
http://www.juancole.com/2011/12/iraqs-al-maliki-seeks-arrest-of-sunni-vp...
Iraq’s al-Maliki Seeks Arrest of Sunni VP as Terrorist, Parliament in UproarOnly a couple days after US Secretary of Defense Leon Panetta declared the Iraq War over and turned the last US base in Iraq over to the Iraqi military, Shiite Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki has struck against a Sunni Arab vice President, Tariq al-Hashimi. Iraqi police have issued an arrest warrant for Hashimi, a member of the now Sunni-dominated Iraqiya Party. The Ministry of the Interior, which al-Maliki controls, confirmed the warrant.
Three members of the VP’s security detail had been under investigation in recent days, charged with engineering a car bombing inside Iraq’s Green Zone on November 28, allegedly in hopes of assassinating al-Maliki. The car bomb had been constructed inside the Green Zone (a protected area in downtown Baghdad encircling government offices and embassies) which admittedly does point to a member of the political elite. It is alleged to have gone off prematurely. Apparently Hashimi is now being fingered as the mastermind of the car bombing.
If the country’s vice president really is a terrorist, it is a sad commentary on the state of Iraqi politics. If he isn’t, then al-Maliki is deploying ‘war on terror’ accusations to grab complete power for his coalition of Shiite parties.
The announcement of the warrant came just after the Iraqiya Party walked out of parliament (according to al-Hayat writing in Arabic), announcing a legislators’ boycott. Iraqiya holds 91 of 320 seats and is the single largest party in that body.
...
If the countrys vice-president really is a terrorist......
You mean he has 7 days food, guns, ammo and a Ron Paul sticker on his Benz? Shocking. Quick!! Call Janet!!
Yes we Cain! Not Herman, but the original Cain, murderer of his brother.
"...an evil and criminal White House..."
Really. So the fact that this so-called criminal White House FOLLOWED the law and GOT PERMISSION from Congress to embark on this (admittedly lame) war makes them criminal. Jeez, that must make the current White House positively Hitler-esque. Oh shoot, I guess I can't play my new song on Monday Night Football now.
Criminal -- as in war criminals -- they violated international law and the Geneva convention.
Leading the country into war based on lies may not be against American law but it wasn't very good idea, was it? At least Obama is ending them instead of starting them. If Cheney was still in there we'd have bombed Iran already.
Agreed. It was astonishing to watch this process; leadership like a headless chicken.
As it says above: « ... holocaustic implications ... »
The US oligarchic rulers are a new-look continuation of Hitler's Nazis.
And it is a shame of Europe when closely associated with them.
A useless rant from someone with an idealized view of history.
Exactly...people have some sort of delusion that it's over, there are still over a half million personelle on the ground in that mini-city built by USO.
In a 100 years people will fully know what happened, but I don't think anyone will give a shit other than a handful of historians if literacy is as abundant as today.
I remember reading that there were 4 - 5 huge permanent bases constructed all over Iraq because we never intended to leave. We don't hear much about them now and you have to wonder what became of them. McDonalds and Pizza Hut have a stake in those bases and are losing money. Yay.
I read somewhere that some are being turned into hotels. I couldn't find the article. But here is another article.
http://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/RestOfAsia/Iraqis-turn-abandoned-US-prison-camps-into-hotels/Article1-777904.aspx
Oops! This may have been the article.
http://www.salon.com/2011/12/17/no_the_u_s_is_not_leaving_iraq/singleton/
No, the U.S. is not leaving IraqIn a speech at Fort Bragg, N.C., Wednesday, President Obama declared that the war in Iraq is over.
“I’ve come to speak to you about the end of the war in Iraq,” he told gathered troops. “Over the last few months, the final work of leaving Iraq has been done. Dozens of bases with American names that housed thousands of American troops have been closed down or turned over to the Iraqis. Thousands of tons of equipment have been packed up and shipped out. Tomorrow, the colors of United States Forces-Iraq — the colors you fought under — will be formally cased in a ceremony in Baghdad.”
All the specifics were true. But what about Obama’s claim that the war has come to a end?
The truth is more complicated. It turns out the Obama administration is leaving behind a huge contingent from the State Department along with thousands of armed private contractors. The possibility for violence between Americans and Iraqis is very real.
To dig into the details, I spoke to Spencer Ackerman, who has been covering the issue closely for Wired’s Danger Room.
The administration is saying the war is over. Is the Defense Department leaving anyone behind?
There’s going to be something called the Office of Security Cooperation in Iraq that exists after the troop pullout on Dec. 31. That’s going to be under the auspices of the U.S. embassy, so there’s not going to be a military command in Iraq. It’s going to be a pretty small, 150-person office that will do training — things like helping the Iraqi air force understand how to operate the F-16s we’re selling them. That’s a pretty typical relationship for countries who have bought American military hardware.
What about the State Department?
State is going to leave behind the largest embassy that it has on the planet. All told, there are going to be 18,000 people who work for this embassy. Very few of those will be diplomats. Others will be American civil service workers. A great number will be non-Iraqi contractors who do things like the laundry, mail services, cleaning, etc. Then there’s going to be a substantial component of armed private security contractors. Depending on whose numbers you believe, there will be 3,500 to 5,500 of them.
What is the mission of the State Department there?
It will be different than a typical embassy in the sense that Iraq is still a more dangerous place than most places the U.S. operates. There are more fortresslike consulates around the country than is typical. The mission is in theory like any other State Department mission: You manage commercial ties; you deal with bilateral political issues as they arise; you try to get favorable security cooperation. In reality, it’s going to be way different than usual. Iraq is going to be a battleground — using that term colloquially — between the U.S. and Iran. A hugely important mission of the U.S. ambassador in Iraq will be to try to get Iraq’s foreign policy not to back Iran. Look at the recent Arab League vote to condemn the regime in Syria, for example. Iraq abstained from that vote because Iran was upset about the condemnation of one of its proxies. So the U.S. will try to weaken Iran’s diplomatic ties to Iraq.
On the mercenary — or armed private contractor — front, do we know who these people are going to be and what they’re going to be up to?
One is a big security company that’s been in Iraq since 2005 called Triple Canopy. Another is called Global. Another is SOC Inc. Interestingly, the CEO of Blackwater — now renamed Academi — told me on Monday they’re going to get their license back; they lost it after the Nisour Square massacre. They don’t have a contract to do work in Iraq now, but they want to do it again. Beyond that, we know nearly nothing. The State Department has stonewalled even the Special Inspector General for Iraq Reconstruction from finding out basic information like what the rules of engagement for the contractors will be. How close can Iraqis get to U.S. diplomats before these guys can open fire? I don’t know the answer to that. Most members of Congress don’t know the answer to that. Pretty much no one who doesn’t work in the State Department knows the answer to that.
The contract is for diplomatic protection. You’re not supposed to see Triple Canopy employees, say, go out on raids. Fifty-six days before the U.S. withdrawal, the State Department also put out a contract for aviation support. That’s an indicator of how this is being put together on the fly. It’s also an indication that the State Department is contracting for missions as sensitive as Medevac or close air support.
...
private corporate ownership of people, land & resources, held together with paid sociopath mercenary ranks - a wet dream for the war boys, defending the machine against humanity. . .
"thousands of CONtractors"
this is one of the single most DISGUSTING, dishonorable, aspects of amerika's corporatist war venture in Iraq (& Afghanistan)...
what a total blatant fleecing...The SOLE reason for the invasion was/remains corpoRAT profits...
Amerikan soldiers bodies were USED initially to take the beta down, simply in order to increase CorpoRAT amerika's profit margins
Yeah, and Fuku is in cold shutdown ... see ... easy ... totally new situation ...
great article Ben. More than anything else, for me it was the sheer stupidity. The US spent all that money - for what?
''spent all that money for what"...spent? We aren't even close to spent...we are still and will be be SPENDING.
The mess is just starting. Iraq has the largest US Embassy in the world right NOW, and is about to be even bigger with 16,000 to 18,000 personnel and 3,400 to 4,000 seciruty contractors. We haven't downsized this 'enguagement' we have simplky mover the jello around the plate.
Americans have yet to understand that Americans don't give a rats ass about their own people or their welfare, why else do you find US service men standing in fornt of the grocery asking for contributions. Shameful, disgraceful
War increases nominal GDP, plain and simple. We can talk about the pros and cons of each mission until we are blue in the face. There will never be a war where any decent human can cheerlead death and destruction under any circumstances, period.
what about the costs of less productive mentally deranged workers? surely that must come into play in your simplistic equation....
Yeah, "we" have again allowed the idiots to outsource the war to global .corp with our taxpayer dollars.
Just WHO are the idiots in this equation?
Uh, yeah.
Clearly the entire event was a smashing success.
All of you people that actually believed that Iraq had WMD should hang your head in shame.
Iraq had WMD, you moron. Just ask the Kurds.
you do know that the biological weapons used on the Kurds were given to Sadam by the USA, right?
Sadam was a huge USA ally in the region, because he checked Iranian power. It wasn't until he invaded Kuwait, spiked up oil prices, thereby risking the reelection of George Bush Sr, was he seen as an enemy of the state.
Same thing with the Taliban. They were backed & funded by the CIA to terrorize the Russian. Now they are terrorizing the US. But the theories and practice of terror was formulated by the CIA, and given to them.
US also funds Pakistani Intelligence, which funds Lashkar-e-Taiba, which cooperate with the Pakistani Taliban, to kill US troops in Afghanistan.
What's even more fucked up is how the US pays the Haqqani Network in Afghanistan to protect convoys, and the Haqqani Network uses that money to buy guns, and men, to attack US forces. The US is paying protection money to the group responsbiel for most of the attacks on it.
What's your point?
my point is the US war on terror is a circle jerk. We're waging a war on an emotion (terror). Huge capital is being misallocated to the war on terror, and away from schools, infrastructure, social services., and less taxes.
US spends $1T on the war on terror, even though Al-Qaeda is a shadow of its former self, and Bid Laden is dead. There is no exit condition, because we're waging war on an emotion. Also framing terrorosm in terms of war, instead of a global-criminal-enterprise, is misleading.
Terror is not an existential threat to the USA. Terror cannot organize state resources, weapponry, and armed personnel to defeat America. It is a phantom menace, used the the military-industrial complex to continue funding post Cold War.
Remember the War on Drugs? 30 years later, we're still fighting it. But street drugs are cheaper, more accessible, and purer today, than @ any time in history. It was another war on an abstract idea.
War on drugs = price support for drugs same thing with the war on terror = support for anti war on terror efforts growing world wide.
Agree with much of what you said, but disagree that terrorism is not an existenial threat. 19 guys with boxcutters have already made us forfeit our Constitution and helped push us to the verge of economic collapse 10 years after we had a budget surplus. American citizens can now be rounded up and put in FEMA camps on a false accusation.
The DC sniper was a former bodyguard of Nation of Islam's Louis Farrakhan and caused much mayhem in a small geographical area. God forbid, imagine 50 of same simultaneously around the country, and IEDs also going off randomly around the country, or worse. Such acts would be devastating for normal economic activity to proceed. What little is left would be gone and would economically push us over the edge. A police state would be as unsustainable as the Welfare srate.
19 guys with box cutters? Really?
Yessir, they picked planes full of fuel and went through security which was at the time nothing more than a person using pads to touch the carry on on the outside (Remember, there was no opening unless something provided just cause to) looking for explosive residue etc.
You tube should still have the video of the attackers clearing security with the little black boxes in which they carried the blades on board.
In our Rig, the television was active for two weeks 24/7 without losing a single channel. It would have taken a mountain of VCR tapes to record all the stuff that came out in addition to what we were seeing as we crossed the GWB the second evening.
They say let sleeping dogs lie and a new generation will grow up and not remember or read about the stuff I and my wife have seen on that day after we die.
All that will be left is conspiracy and 70 to 100 years later some details will be released or declassified.
Even now, I have learned over the years small tidbits in the previous wars which involved family (Who never talked about it) and other interesting things that no one ever heard of except the ones directly involved it.
For example, prior to the Walker case, we would tap into the USSR's actual cable that carried military traffic and retrieve it from time to time. Took a big pair of balls to do that. Not brass, but platinum.
War is never over. I expect more... however, the future is not too clear at the moment. On 9-11 when the second plane hit the tower on TV, Wife and I looked at each other and said "It's war!" we are at war. Bush vanished on the plane (Cold War plans had him going to Omaha and thence to a better place) and a brief shot on tv from Airforce one through the window at one of the escorting F16's with a very large.. and grotesque device on a wing and oviously very very very high, much higher than normal airliners.
How high can the AF1 go. That's classified.
Today?
The VA is full. Mental health is full. Prescription medicines flood both the vet and civilian market. Our Children grow up in a dumbed down school unable to understand precisely what went on.
Yea the cry of God wills it thousands of years ago has somehow changed into "National Security!"
A thought occured to me. I have sufficient on hand to go be a merc and help the "System" maintain the peace and security. However I rather do it here at home on main street against terrorists who wish to come here and kill us.
And boy, there are a lot of soft targets all around us.... we have been very lucky these last 10 years.
On my reading of what you say here, it's not terrorism that's an "existential threat" (whatever the fuck that is) to the US, it's america. Which is sorta funny. We have seen the enemy, and it is us. Or something.
...Agree with much of what you said, but disagree that terrorism is not an existenial threat. 19 guys with boxcutters have already made us forfeit our Constitution and helped push us to the verge of economic collapse 10 years after we had a budget surplus. American citizens can now be rounded up and put in FEMA camps on a false accusation.
He said terrorism is not an existential threat. That's not the same thing as saying our beloved overlords' response to it hasn't been an existential threat.
box cutters are the new star wars...
my point is the US war on terror is a [Penn State football camp]
Fixed it for you.
i agree with you 100% was being sarcastic!
Palin/Perry 2012!
obummer for sec of state!
YES WE CAN!
@vxpatel....His point is much more clear than yours. So, what's YOUR point?
my point is go short...the end is here! bring it on bitchez!
The point is that he had WMD, regardless of where they came from. Nasty weapons move all over the place between countries. Also, if you knew that you were going to get invaded, you would move or hide your stuff...just like half the people here bury their gold and silver in the back yard or some forest. Remember the nuclear triggers that they found in the Iraqi physicist's flower garden? No WMD, indeed.
Are you another one of these 'humorous' trolls popping up here? Huh? Yeah, you gotta be. Okay, I get it now. Good one!
Probably a conscript in someone's "water army..."
Any nation on earth can make WMD's in a high school lab. We can do absolutely nothing about it. Same is true for a rogue scientist. Did you work for Dick Cheney?
you forgot your meds today...it's obivious.
Lets not forget that we were the ones who supplied Sadaam with these weapons during the Iraq/Iran war. But after the first Iraq war they were either destroyed or shipped off to Syria. This is my understanding.
Yep, he was your "Made Man"..........
My mistake. Saddam only killed 182,000 kurds, including 5,000 in Halabja by chemical attack. Can't count as WMD unless it's nuclear or something else with a higher death count. Just forgot.
wasn't it rumsfelf that arranged for saddam to get the chemcials? and didn't we provide sat photos of their exact locations....?
Have to reply to my own post because I can't edit.
I just wanted to add this:
As a Canadian I am deeply ashamed that we sent troops to Afghanistan. How on earth could anyone think that sending 2000 (all ranks) men and women to patrol an area the size of Alberta could have any chance of success? Our troops never had a hope in hell. All we could do is patrol a few dirt roads--and watch the bodies return because with all our 'force and might' we couldn't figure out how to defeat a $20 roadside IED.
Keep in mind that the 2000 was basically the total number of troops and support. I think the actual number of combat specialists was around 500.
I love this country, it's the citizens I can't stand.
"All we could do is patrol a few dirt roads--and watch the bodies return because with all our 'force and might' we couldn't figure out how to defeat a $20 roadside IED."
This, my Canadian friend, is the key to all our hubristic folly. We did not learn from Viet Nam, with the pungi stakes, trip wires, mines, and the silent population where we were the only easily recognizable enemy/target.
When 10's of thousands of silent, floating mines are let lose around the straits of Hormuz, we will be given a new lesson. Probably won't learn anything then, either, but every person on earth will feel the effect of a sharply reduced oil supply.
Well look at that America LOST another war , the best equipped army in the world has not won a single war in the last 60 years . I know Americans are dumb, but yu have to de seeing a patern here. Congrats are in order to the most haostile nation this planet has ever seen, but hay its Sunday lets all go to church and pretend that we love God .
better yet-lets pretend God is on our side--
you guys whipped panama and grenada, so it aint all bad
Yep, the 300 pound bully on steroids kicked the ass of two defenseless, innocent 50 lb schoolgirls.
Boy, don't that just make the American heart swell with pride.
USA! USA! USA! USA!
All of you people that actually believed that Iraq had WMD should hang your head in shame.
STILL believing that lie?
Not the WMD part. Everybody on the planet has them.
WMD being the reason we invaded & occupied Iraq. That's the lie.
It was about keeping Iraqi oil priced in US dollars.
...the same reason the US government wants to invade & occupy Iran now. And they're using the same cover story, WMD.
...and most American sheeple will believe it again.
Yes, Iraq wars were about maintaining the fiat ponzi, but you're leaving out the needs of the colonial entity. Google PNAC.
I'm tired of war and preparing for war.
I vividly recall the air raid drills in grammar school. The fear of Cuba and the Soviets.
The fear of being drafted. The tradgedy of Viet Nam.
Now that the cold war is over, and we've spent ourselves silly, we need new villians, so that the rich can get even richer.
The more I listen to Ron Paul, the more I like it.
War is America's number one GDP component...where would we be as a society without it?
for one thing you wouldn't have to bid against the war machine for that gallon of gasoline you use to get to work every day.
Living in extra-terrestial colonies? Expand yer thinking, folks.
A lot better off economically. War is a destruction of resources (Sun Tzu), and the false belief that it is an economic boon is the Austrian school broken window fallacy illustrated in full.
The resources that were squandered on weapons and lives could have been put to better use. The Iraq debacle would have paid off every single home mortgage in the US, for instance (CHS and Karl Denninger have both pointed this one out before).
All military expenditures are an investment in the broken window fallacy, as well as broken windows.
The illusion that has to be maintained is that America has a threat outside of its own borders. As long as you have the fear factor on your side you can lead to war(s).
Just because you believe that people don't want to kill you, doesn't mean that they don't.
That about sums up the DoD motto, Dannyboy.
or vice versa
I'm beginng to see why you might feel that way, Dan.
...Just because you believe that people don't want to kill you, doesn't mean that they don't.
Maybe if we stop invading their countries, and giving their so-called leaders' 'security' personnel munitions and training, they wouldn't want to kill us in the first place.
Save a packet of $$$, too.
Study history, folks. There is always going to be some leader, nation, religion, or political faction that is not going to try to take what you have, either individually or as a nation. Not to recognize this expresses a profound naivete. I'll say no more.
It is you who needs to study history. There are ALWAYS going to be Machiavellian, sociopathic politicians willing to whip up hysteria and overblown fears of nonexistent or wildly exaggerated "existential enemies" to consolidate power and control the masses.
You are clearly just another victim of government fearmongering and warmongering --- "They're coming for us!" Yet somehow, NO other nation on earth feels the need to spend such a vastly disproportionate amount of its national resources on so-called "defense" and military adventurism. The fact that the USA spends MORE on misnamed "defense" (read: military aggression) than EVERY other nation in the world, combined, probably doesn't faze you in the least.
Okay, let's say RP gets elected and by some miracle is able to get everything that he wants. Defense spending is reduced 95% or whatever, banking is overhauled, and only sweetness and light exist in Washington and across the land. There will still be leaders/nations out there who will want to destroy the US. I agree that governments shoud never be trusted, but to think that all governments are eternally populated by endlessly Machiavellian psycopaths is severely overstating the case.
Why is it overstating the case, when YOU believe exactly that in regards to foreign governments?
Rarely in history has a well-armed nation ever suffered the wrath of an aggressor whom it did not first provoke. And contemporary interventionistic US foreign policy is nothing if not an endless series of provocations, all of course in the name of "security" and "defense". History conclusively demonstrates that people have FAR more to fear from their own governments than they do from foreign enemies, and this time is not different.
And they'll tell you black is really white, the moon is just a sun at night...
you don't have to listen to the voices in your head....
Since the American Solder took an oath to defend our constitution, shouldn't they be going to war with Congress?
I, (NAME), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.
What the heck? Which is it? Follow the Constitution or the President? Cuz ya can't do both.
There you go trying to make logic one of Americas values. Shame
December Dual trades in progress
http://capital3x.com/think-tank/december-dual-trading-in-progress-views-from-inter-market/
Was it worth it? Hell Fucking No!!
The only good thing Bush ever did was sign a treaty with Iraq promising that the US would withdraw by year end 2011. And Obama finally earns his Nobel Peace Prize -- thanks to Bush. Oh the irony.
Full disclosure: IMO both parties suck MIC cock.
I read an article today (from a conspiracy website) that the troops are just being pointed in a different direction: Iran. Somehow I have a tendancy to believe this. Lindsay Williams said that we are trying to lure Iran into firing the first shot. He also said that the Iran war will be started around next September or so. This is to help Obama get re-elected, since no incumbent ever lost an election during time of war. I kind of have a tendancy to believe this also. But we will have to wait and see how their evil plans unfold. By the way, Iran is no threat to the US, only Israel. Just as Iraq was no threat to the US, only Israel.
bull shit--Iraq was not a threat to Israel-- it was a threat to big oil-- everthing else is a lie.
Iraq was certainly not a serious threat to Israel.... but Saddam's paying off the families of suicide bombers was definitely not something our zionist 'leadership' liked to see.
Gotta' do Syria first....then Iran. Already grouping around the Jordan border. We really can't have all those soldiers come home and join OWS when they realize there are no jobs. Stay tuned.
Many in the US thought the WMD hard sell for invasion was bogus. Yellowcake? However, we were warned by Ari Fleischer, Bush' press secretary, to "watch what we said" when it came to questioning the government and its policies. This put a chill on what little free press we had left. It has only gotten worse from there. Anyone who doubts that Obama's administration is a continuation of the Bush family dictatorship needs to examine the timeline.
I don't have an opinion about family dictatorships, but examining the timeline sounds like a very good idea. Take a good look at the role played by the Project for a New American Century, which provided the ideological framework for the continuing catastrophe in the Middle East
Remember the optimism universally promoted by the corporate media as the war began? No one was allowed to doubt Donald Rumsfeld's rosy scenarios of a cakewalk (good-bye, General Shinseki), where we would be greeted as liberators, Iraqi oil would pay for the war (and the rebuilding after), and best of all, America would emerge in the driver's seat of a new Middle East. Shock and Awe, bitchezz!
But Rumsfeld and Cheney and the other luminaries on the PNAC roster (which includes such worthies as Elliot Abrams, Dan Quayle, Norman Podhoretz and Paul Wolfowitz) were spectacularly wrong, as history has proven to the satisfaction of fair-minded observers everywhere. "Full spectrum dominance" was a paranoid fantasy, and all the talk of a "Reaganite policy of military strength" and "promoting freedom abroad" (http://www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm) was thin cover for their real purpose: "to challenge regimes hostile to our interests." I submit that this is not a sound basis for national foreign policy, especially when conducted by people who think peace is what you get when you have annihilated your last enemy. (Hint: that day never arrives.)
So there's my rant for this Sunday. We can disagree about whether the Bush-Cheney-PNAC policies were driven by deliberate intent (in which case, these people are evil) or by blundering, wrong-headed ideology (in which case they're idiots), but I hope we can we agree that these policies have accelerated the dismantling of American constitutional principles, and we need to change them.
+1 Agreed. Sorry I let my contempt for the Bush family creep in there.
Bingo & +1000, AmishHacker!
In fact, the one thing I object to in the article this thread follows was the author's saying this was the American people's war. This was the Bush administrations war, the MIC's war, the oil industry war, and it was sold & supported by the corporate media. Many Americans were saying WTF. I was one of them. Many of us called this rah-rah "embedded" bullshit for what it was.....pure hype and propaganda. The Bush administration did everything possible to fan the flames after 9/11, and the press went right along with the lies and the undermining of the constitution, cheerleading all the way.
I remember the cheerleading you mention clearly. Your point is well taken that the press folded up like a cheap suitcase. It was very disheartening to behold. Some new websites popped up like "Get Your War On" during that dark time.
http://www.mnftiu.cc/category/gywo/war81/
Yes, and all those interests were able to enrich themselves so handsomely because the war created an operating environment where the media, the mercenaries and the moguls could work together without interference from "we the people."
But take another step back and look at the even bigger picture. The war in Iraq was simply one element in a larger process designed to take wealth from a large number of productive people and deliver it to a very small number of non-productive people. Yes, governments perform the same function via taxation, and central banks do an excellent job of it via inflation, but war is by far the most efficient way yet found to move huge amounts of money into the right hands, and that's why The War In (Fill in the blank) will never be allowed to end.
Amish Hacker
Agreed. One tiny quibble. Evil and Idiot are not mutually exclusive.
They're very far from done with that paradigm. It grows like the red weed in Jeff Waynes War of the Worlds - covers all.
The only problem is it creates so much data ... most of it useless.
This Single Picture Sums Up Iraq Being Left Behind By The U.S.
http://www.businessinsider.com/iraq-end-of-war-bunker-assignments-2011-12
How Maliki and Iran Outsmarted the US on Troop Withdrawal
http://original.antiwar.com/porter/2011/12/16/how-maliki-and-iran-outsma...
And it will end up costing us a mere 4 trillion dollars and 4500 US lives. What a deal!
Dude... Just admit it.. You hate America.. And are probably a racist.. And you are with the terrorists.. And probably don't bath very often.. Didn't I see you throw a bag of puppies in a river the other day? Ohhh I almost forgot.. NAZI !!!
How could any of that be true? The American people would never let their government commit crimes against other peoples of the world.. How absurd..
max i admit it. i am a racist, homophobe, i hate amerika, and a terrorist........oh did i forget to mention that i have gold and food stored up.......
Max Hunter
Yeah, I saw it too. 5, count em, 5 yellow labs. Yer, wit us, or yer agin us. Want to go huntin' Dick ?
Tony Blair rot in Hell!