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Guest Post: America’s Wealth-Defined Society
Submitted by Ben Tanosborn
America’s Wealth-Defined Society
Many of us wonder whether the Occupy Wall Street movement will continue to grow and establish roots, to offer some hope for change… or whether it will be stopped and smothered… not by the Fat-Cats represented in that odious One Percent, but by the Squires, that Nineteen Percent of enforcers, or bystanders, of predatory capitalism that has taken over America; what is now Corporate America. The Squires are the only middle-class left in the United States today, even if there are many others who illusorily think of themselves as middle-class, not wanting to be included in a bottom 80 percent, the place where they belong if only they would wake up to reality, set aside their pride.
For almost three generations most anyone in America considered themselves to be part of that mythical middle-class. Lower class was a term seldom mentioned; only people down on their luck and one-third or more of blacks and browns living in virtual poverty, belonged to that class swept under the rug. Be that as it may, the majority of Americans by most any standard were affluent enough not to worry about the many wealth rungs in the socio-economic ladder, or where they stood in it.
However, political economics during the past three decades have helped create greater inequality, much greater wealth differences between lower and higher rungs. And, what may be even worse, it also helped erase the upward economic mobility it once existed in the lower rungs, where 80 percent of the nation’s population resides. Such mobility has completely disappeared. Ronald Reagan made greed a top virtue for Americans, and much of the population was ready to live by that creed. But as it turned out, only a small percentage was successful at it – and not entrepreneurially but predatorily – most others still smarting from a real estate bubble, as acquisition of a home mortgage was dabbed part of the American dream… what should have been called the American nightmare.
The Occupy Wall Street movement, whether by art or by design, has been careful not to make their common cause one of a struggle between classes, and that has been, at least initially, a wise thing. Having said that, however, it would be wise and survivalist for them to realize that although they portray the wealthy top One Percent as the enemy, it is the power of the Nineteen Percent behind them that they need to worry about; and that appears as not much of an issue with the protesters. If so, it could easily become their downfall, a complete debacle for the movement.
For once, let’s be realistic and try not to live in ignorance or make-believe.
We should be challenging not only the meaning behind those statistics which are getting all the headlines, but also dig deeper for what other statistics may mean for a more just society. Such statistics are available but unfortunately not properly analyzed or, at the very least, not properly presented. There are very powerful implications to the well-being and justice for the bottom 80 percent of us… not just a majority, but a resounding and truly overwhelming majority… the EIGHTY PERCENT of POOR and POWERLESS in a nation we deem free and democratic, but which unfortunately is neither. Here is what we tend to focus on… how unequal we are relative to The Wealthiest One Percent with three examples cited time and time again:
- That the Top 1% owns 40% of the Nation’s Wealth; and,
- That the Top 1% end up receiving 24% of the National Income (Take Home Pay); and,
- That the Top 1% owns 50% of the nation’s stocks, bonds and mutual funds.
There is another truth, however, which gives a much greater condemnation of our capitalist system, a system which has gone array and makes a mockery of a just society, one which brings out the worst in our citizens, the predatory nature of man, not his compassion.
Shouldn’t that overwhelming part of the population, the bottom 80 percent, be just as angry or upset if told they are joining forces with the only true middle-class, a class which in relative terms is ALMOST THIRTY-TWO TIMES (32X) as wealthy as they are? [The 19% group that follows the top 1% possesses 53% of the Nation’s Wealth; while the bottom 80% only possesses 7% of the Nation’s Wealth.]
Isn’t about time we look at the distribution of wealth in this nation, and realize the iniquity in our system of taxation, for the unworkable and unfair system that it is?
Should it surprise us that the standard of living for most Americans has been declining for years? That more and more Americans lack access to basic necessities such as food and health care? That 19 percent of Americans lack the money to put enough food on the table… while that’s only true with 6 percent of Chinese?
It is the system… a system which unfortunately is endorsed by far more than 1 percent of the population. For America to set on a right course, the movement cannot be solely Occupy Wall Street… it should grow and become Occupy Main Street.
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My inference that all of your talking points come from Fox News.
What are your talking points?
Ad hominem.
....I don't watch fox news
He came to this conclusion by hanging out over at AOL-Huff-Post.
"If you try, you can make it from the bottom 80% to the next 19%."
If you think about it, that's a truely wonderful thing, and nothing to complain about. Cracking the top 1% is really all about envy.
Who gives a fuck about making as much money as possible: I'd just want to earn enough to secure a place out in the wilderness that's far away from people.
People are a hassle.
People make too much noise.
Get enough of them together, and they start stinking up the place.
People are too needy.
You ever just stop and observe any group of people you happen to be tied to out of social obligation? YAP YAP YAP YAP YAP YAP.
IF I could realize that goal through "hard work" like in decades past, I would. But that America is long gone, so I guess I'm cursed to be amongst people for an indefinite amount of time. Fucking noise making hens for biped apes. fuck people
Well said, Incubus
I'm off to the forest for a week alone tomorrow. I've never seen the French Pyrennes in autumn.
We people are a mess, but we have to live together most of the time. This life is a 'process' and unfolds as naturtally as as a leaf opening in the springtime-----that's what I think when I am not trapping myself in these ubiquitous puzzles that our egos so love.
Nice comment, thanks om
You are complaining because you can't make it to the 1% level?
Wow, I believe it is an understatement to say that the sense of entitlement has gotten just a tad warped. Gee, let's all go to Lake Wobegon Estates, that gated community where not only is "everyone above average", but everyone is a 1%'er. And while we're at it, heck, I wanted to play point guard for the Celtics! I even could dunk it until I was about 35. It's just not fair! I never was given a chance!
What is "third base" (changing back to your metaphor)? Is it just wealth? What about brains? I suspect brains have more to do with hitting the top 20% as well as the top 1%, and that few of those without them (brains) have by the very nature of their birth much likelihood of reaching that exalted 1%. So should we lobotomize intelligent people in order to give the lesser minds a fighting chance? Should we require, as Kurt Vonnegut wrote, that gifted ballet dancers wear a hundred eighty-five pounds of buckshot on their backs so as not to make bad dancers feel left out? Nature isn't either fair nor equitable.
There are a lot of 1%'ers, even some everyone loves to hate, who were not born under the best of circumstances. Jobs, Soros, Wozniak, Dell...even Lloyd Blankfein and John Meriwether. Those people did not start on 3rd base. They weren't even in the dugout. Heck, Meriwether was on a roof top on the southside of Chicago just trying to sneak a peek at a White Sox game. Jobs was adopted.
The problem is not wealth, it is privilege. Rein in privilege and the system is as fair as can be, given the constraints nature has put on humans, who are hardly born anything close to equal. One irony is that it is within our grasp in an internet age to control privilege and control government by making everyone accountable, but instead we look longingly at other obviously failed ideologies for solutions. At the same time, the rest of humanity also has to be held accountable...buy what you can afford, expect nobody to cover for your mistakes, don't have kids if you can't raise them properly, etc.
If you're in the top 1% in this country chances are you inherited it.
MOST didn't
http://www.forbes.com/forbes-400/#p_1_s_arank_All%20industries_All%20states_All%20categories_
Oh please. One thing in common with ALL the wealthy is that they have the inside line to those who print the money. Simple as that. They have the access to leverage, and more importantly, know WHEN to lever up and when to lever down.
Where do you think Rockefeller got capital? From the ones who wanted to give it to him. Usual names, Schiff, Kuen and Loeb, Warburg, et all.
It is like monopoly. Who always wins in monopoly?
The bank. Cause when the game starts and when the game ends, all the money and wealth goes back to the bank!
pods
haha. You should read Titan (Rockefeller biography) it's longer than 10 pages so it's probably way over your head. It has 5 stars from Amazon
http://www.amazon.com/Titan-Life-John-Rockefeller-Sr/dp/1400077303
What's your point?
Well SOMETHING has to change. We are dying!
http://confoundedinterest.wordpress.com
It's "gone awry", not gone array, fwiw.
Capitalism works great when you have some mechanism to funnel money back to the bottom from the top. Trickle down is like trying to keep a fire going by dousing it with water.
As anyone with a brain can see, money always trickles up, it needs no help. What you need is to get the money back down to keep economic activity going.
My suggestion is a mandatory 50% profit-sharing law. Make any profits from companies be shared equally among employees for at least 50% of profits. The rest can go to shareholders or whomever. This includes employees in cheap labor markets as well if cheap labor is used.
No taxes. The money is redistributed. No gov't intervention. ANd it goes to people that DESERVE IT. No welfare.
I don't think this will kill investment. It will spur businesses as there will be more money in the hands that actually SPEND IT.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=tK0O30aFT7g#!
"You cannot be a protester and a customer at the same time."
You're just harassing some poor manager that is trying to keep annoying people out of her branch.
Why bring in signs? Why harass people? Just go in, close the account, then come out and show that you closed it.
That's the issue I have with this movement, too many KIDS that just want to be shocking and ground-breaking. I think it's doomed to fail when these kids lose interest because it's no longer exciting.
I saw a 15 year old girl with one of the anonymous masks on in the Philadelphia train station today. Big cop shouting at her and made her take it off.
The real question will be, "how will US elites respond."
a.) Like Saudi Arabia redistributing the wealth or as I would put "re-circulating the money/debt."
b.) Like Syria, call in the security forces followed by army tanks.
c:) gas up the yachts and the planes and run away.
Whaaaaaa! Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. Equal protection under the law should be your concern, not wealth redistribution.
Which, of course, begs the question "Who writes the laws" and the follow-up "Who pays the scum that write the laws"?
How long shall we obey unjust laws? This article attempts to link monetary equality to justice and assert that compassion relies upon financial stability..............it's all Socialist bullshit. Rule of law has broken down, which is the fundamental problem IMO.
Fact is, all the poor families have big TVs.
I ain't got any TVs so I am in poverty? I need my EBT cards right now.
Well, come on down to the welfare orifice. As long as you ain't white, you can get all the welfare benies available. And, if you is white, you better get back to work so you can make up for all the past sins against oppressed peoples everywhere.
A 32" flat screen costs $250. Health care costs $600 per month.
Really? Then why do I get 50 responses on craigslist when I give an old TV away?
Of course, when you get secion 8 you've got plenty of money to buy TV's and cell phones.
Well if poverty sounds so great, stop bitching about it and quit your job.
There's a huge line for jobs. And if being poor is so great, run with it. Put your money where your mouth is, go on the dole tough guy.
Get your free cell phones and giant screen TVs. Sounds like a great life to me. WHere do you work? I know people that need work.
Been on the dole plenty of times. Lost more jobs than you've lived years of life.
Lived on the bottom rung for more years than your IQ level.
Lived in my car and worked more crappy jobs than your girlfriend has pubic hairs.
One day I stopped felling sorry for myself and decided to climb out of the gutter and hating other people that actually tried to make something better out of life.
And, I learned to stop blaming others for my poverty.
Maybe you don't know this, but before the Hispanics came north and took over the crappy jobs in this country, people like me would hire ourselves out to do those jobs in our youth.
PE
Your poverty has nothing to do with economics----change your diet, dude. You'll notice the difference om
"Isn’t about time we look at the distribution of wealth in this nation, and realize the iniquity in our system of taxation, for the unworkable and unfair system that it is?"
Iniquity?
A higher iniquity is taking by force from one who has not earned it and giving it to another who has not.
Watch your words spud.
the law of the jungle cuts both ways. not advocating a position, just saying. You smart monkey, you climb tree and get banana, me smarter, I wait at bottom with big stick.
Exactly so buzz.
Using the police power of the state to piss off half the population that actually pays taxes.
Here's one.
Abolish income taxes altogether. Go with a flat tax. Everyone has skin in the game that way. Pay your fair share first, then bitch about "iniquity".
Oh, thats not regressive...er ahhh...progressive enough.
The article is complete emotional bullshit.
i find the premise for the whole piece to be flawed. i define wealth as doing what i want when i want. slavishly chasing paper gains until i'm older than the hills seems like a waste of precious time to me. thinking that money is the answer to everything is what will ultimately collapse the whole system. flat tax, regressive tax, meh. i leave that to others to fight over. people should strive to be free, to me that is wealth.
Agreed.
Being free and having the means to remain free is true wealth.
The means can be land to support yourself & family...it can be simply the shirt on your back and the wits between your ears.
And time, as you say, is the most precious "commodity" there is.
there are still places where people have no money, don't "own" anything, not even clothes. When contacted they always have big grins. Lucky bastidges.
Yeah, well...I prefer running water & lights ;-)
I watched a show one time where they took these guys off this island, gave them jobs, and they were miserable. Thanks for nothing.
Roots ?
Defining who has "earned" what is totally subjective.
It's funny how people talk about entitlements, when the wealthy feel entitled to the wealth they make at the expense of cheap labor, tax-free dividends and political connections.
Technically society makes the rules on what you keep. Just like a welfare recipient doesn't earn their money, neither do trust-fund babies.
This BS crap about "having earned it" is nonsense. Consider yourself lucky you don't live in a country where the people take by force WTF you think you EARNED.
I have earned every fucking dime I have ever made.
When "society" uses the police power of the state to take more of what I earn...I don't feel like working harder & earning more to feed it.
I can shut down anytime I want. Then what will "society" do with the welfare recipient? Print more Benny bucks?
Excellent.
We go back to square one then don't we?
Now give me the standard line of welfare queens showing up ay my doorstep demanding my savings...that doesn't end well for them in any country.
By all means, QUIT.
I love the empty threat of people like you. WE DONT NEED YOU!! WE DONT NEED JAMIE DIMON. WE DONT NEED BLANKFEIN.
GET OVER YOURSELVES...We have 20% unemployment, I'm sure there's at least 90% of them that can do whatever paper-pushing bullshit job it is you do.
You think you've earned your money? Then tell us how much you've made and how you earned it. Let us decide! LMAO. C'mon don't be embarassed!
For all the people like that threaten to quit. For all the wealthy LOSERS that say we need to kiss the ass of the wealthy....I say LET THEM FAIL. You'd be surprised how many over-priced, over-paid WASTE-of-SPACE there are that pump themselves up as being "necessary".
QUIT DAMMIT! WE NEED THE JOB.
"Consider yourself lucky you don't live in a country where the people take by force WTF you think you EARNED."
I've got Google Earth opened up. Can you give me the coordinates of some of those countries in which one should consider oneself lucky for not living? I'm thinking Somalia and Mugabe's Zimbabwe, but after that I'm stuck. I think I need the remedial course in MadMaxistan.
Its incredible ain't chin?
To some here, it is not a question of how someone became wealthy. It is that they are wealthy. If someone hasn't stolen (broken the law) in order to become wealthy I don't care that they are wealthy.
Confession, do I have a preconcieved notion when I look over at stop light and see a guy in a beemer at a traffic light? Yes I do. Not because of the wealth he obviously has...but because most guys who drive beemers are pricks.
I don't feel that way about the Benz driver for some reason ;-)
That's a clever distinction and one I agree with; what to do with criminals who think stealing from taxpayers equates to earning is the question.
Those who 'take by force' are the elected leaders of a republic who pass its laws. This "taking away", as you put it, is done by the elected people's representatives, in the context of laws passed by Congress. So its not "taking by force" as this implies it is UNLAWFUL. From your perspective, one who believes in a state of law but in minimal government, I can understand your rant IF you said 'taxes are immoral'. NOT UNLAWFUL.
Now considering this second point : Are taxes immoral?
I think this argument is unsustainable within limits. As Elizabeth Warren, currently in the media headlights, puts its so articulately, in her video..."Take a big chunk of your earnings, Mr Entrepreneur, God bless you! But leave some for those who built the roads on which your trucks run, built the schools where the workers who are productive in your factory were educated, and where the next generation will receive its education...(hopefully to produce cutting edge entrepreneurs lie you)."
I think that summarises it well...NOBODY MAKES MONEY ON HIS OWN IN SOCIETY, HOWEVER 'STEVE JOBS' HE BE.
But to come back to taxing iniquity, I would agree with you that small businesses and entrepreneurs should not be over taxed, drowned in paperwork, or bamboozled by IRS shills applying arcane laws an entrepreneur cannot derail without hiring expensive corporate lawyers, which he can't afford. Bureaucratic bamboozling is a state of art that is revolting and should be punished. But that is the whole purpose of 'regulatory capture' exercised by State shills on the unsophisticated and relatively ignorant.
Wow, all these new names. Bunch of sock puppets. A lot of phony posters born of boutique, social media PR propanda mills being employed by The Powers That Be is awesome to behold. Well, hear me now, you whores: I am a real citizen and I condemn you to the last and with my last drop of blood spit at you. Don't buy the lie. UP WITH THE AMERICAN PEOPLE! DOWN WITH THE CORPORATOCRACY!
Wow, you should get your own column.
That was better than even the clap-trap that spawned this thread.
Hey Tyler, I think we have another GW in the making.
Honestly, the only guy on this site speaking truth to power is Banzai7.
Don't you have something else to do? Seriously, your very presence lowers the quality of the discourse here by 37.2%
Just 37.2%?
I was trying for 99%.
Of course with the drivel you produce I can see why my discourse is only bringing the quality down to a measly 37.2%
You, my fucktard friend, are really flattening out the ole bell curve with your extremely low IQ.
At least I don't have to sound out my words as I type. Another 3.4% diminution of quality. Well done!
Dude, do you sit on elephant boners for a living, cause I fail to see why you're so anal retentive.
Trying giving your asshole a rest and using your pie hole instead.
That way you won't have to use your esophagus as a different pathway for the shit that comes out of your brain.
Dr. Evil,
There is a difference between "earning" money and "making" it...Ben makes it, and gives it to his buddies on Wall Street..It's called stealing where I'm from..I know, I used to be a thief.
It's obvious by the posts that many people haven't crawled completely out of their liberal or conservative shells and can't fully see the bigger picture. This is the the latest talking point TPTB are currently pushing (by co-opting OWS to some extent) because they know will it wil pit folks against each other.
Let me see if this can help better describe the real problem.
Ben Tanosborn was born yesterday (ie. is a socialist)
he bangs on about "inequality" of the system comparing rich to poor but fails to mention the working middle and lower classes have been paying for decades for the non-working to sit on their arses
is it not socialism that has bankrupted most countries on the planet many times over? It is not the 'capitalist system' that creates inequality but the socialist, and more specifically the Govt system, that creates poor by robbing (ie. taxation) the productive people in the private sector to feed the parasites (unproductive public sector and welfare spongers)
When Mr Tanosborn moans on (and on) about "inequality" and the "distribution of wealth" he only ever wants a power grab (robbery) on the productive people to feather his little empire building. That's what all Govt in history has been about. Socialised idealogical theft by parasites
Your bunch of lazy useless corrupt crooks have had your way in many countries many times over Mr Tanosborn ...look where your social robbery got you in USSR, North Korea, China, Germany, Argentina, Greece and across Europe and America. Re-distribution is little more than theft and it has always ended in bankrupt countries and everyone being impoverished (the distribution of poverty).
Your distribution (socialist) system is a failure because it ransacks the productive and replaces an enterprising elite with a parasitical unproductive elite.. socialism is the biggest failure in history as both an ideology and as an actual applied belief system..go rob your Granny Mr Tanosborn rather than trying to rob society
.look where it got Germany. !
.ok. why do the Oil & Gas companies receive subsidies?
and the brilliance of the co-opt of OWS is bearing fruit when ZH features the likes of Ben, though I shall hasten to add that to the credit of ZH a broad spectrum of opinion is evidence of ZHs' journalistic integrity.
Made me laugh.
You know, US citizens are those type of people who can claim that there is no land mines in a land mine field, hearing the loud explosion and the screams of people exploded by mines.
The failure of self perception among US citizens is astonishing. How are they allowed in such divorce with reality?
Simple. Just the very same way denial happen on a mine field: power. They get others absorb the bad consequences of their cheap propaganda, constant denial of most observations.
Just send somebody else on a land mine field and it is easy to deny there is any mine. You are not the one who is going to be blown up.
So what do politicians produce? Power structures that have pampered this US citizen poster so that he can deny his politicians produce the very same power structures that allow him to live in a permanent divorce with basic reality.
The failure of self perception among US citizens is impressive: they owe everything to their government as they are unable to cope with reality. They have been pampered by nanny state since the inception of the US which has afforded them to deny the benefits they have drawn from the government.
Meanwhile, the rest of the world eats the garbage so that US citizens can keep living in a fantasy land, totally disconnected from reality.
As the US citizen nature is eternal, the only end to be known is when US citizens run out of people to send on the land mine fields. At this point, well, all of a sudden, they will start to acknowledge that there are land mines.
This trait is already showing as for them globalization started four decades ago etc
Right, Anon
Most people probably still believe that the Marshall Plan was for'----- the poor and starving masses of a war-torn Europe' when in reality it was a corporate welfare program that guaranteed investment to the-----you guessed it----the same bankers and corporations who are in the bag today.
And the first shot of this revolution that became 'globaism'--------------well, you don't need anyone to tell you this---you seem to have it wired.
nice to read your post, though om
Agreed with your thoughts Anon.
OM, my problem is that the majority seem to dismiss the policy, simply because the actors who perpetrated it were corrupt. So in te example of the Marshall Plan, there was a way it could have been purely for the benefit of the poor, but it was the bad actors who did it for greed / profit. That doesn't mean that Marshall Plans are abject failures, it means that we have a society which engenders immoral behavior. Too many people choose erroneously to fault the plan, instead of separating the actors from the plan, and considering each independently.
Just using that as an example. It's a disease prevalent in most arguments.
Alex Jones and the dallas fed...........
http://www.infowars.com/alert-federal-reserve-tries-to-censor-infowars-video/
More than most, the administration of the US, and wherre possible, the UK too, push propoganda that 'Patriotism' and 'Nationalism' are relevant to the lives of a citizen...most adults through history would be surprised at the principle of willingly submitting to the Ruling Thug. I probably don't know as much as I would like about the formative years of the US, but didn't it take some considerable effort to convince everyone to 'start coming together under the banner of America', or whatever... and (the point) that's been played to - the 'Americanism' is your 'Happiness', your Freedom (so very kindly protected for you), your Wide roads and SUVs', comfortable smiles and long accents: It's (all) absolutely Centralized - Hollywood, New York, Washington DC. :: certainly, in terms of political economics, the ideas and way-of-life which are held to be so fragile, ought to be provided from locally-sourced resources. (like Paris Hilton, she's american, and a pin-up, I can't see how you could go wrong suggesting her as a model for your basic American - much like Quasimodo, why not nominate her Bimbo-in-chief for a day)
We have already had a taste of socialism (keynsian style) and that has brought us all to this mess. What do you call Medicare,Medicaid,Prescription Drug,Social Security,funding the IMF, and on and on. None of it paid for and all of that and more in future obligations. Do you think that will change with more proposed handouts?
Obama called for a transformation and this is exactly the kind of shit and more he wants to install. No thanks. Been there and done that. I'm for jailing the banksters(Mozilla, Lehman Brothers execs, whoever else), politicians (Hank Paulson, Ben Bernake, Tim Geithner, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, Meeks, etc.), but please don't give me that socialism(redistribution) is the answer garbage.
If we had a Department of Justice who acutually was led by someone other than Eric Holder we might just have had justice handed out to these criminals. Instead they have all been let off the hook. Vote these guys out and stop your friends from voting for them.
Demand that tariffs be placed on products made outside of the states. I get that. Why should we pay unemployment for a worker here who could be employed here if we just bought an American made product? I'm on board with that kind of change that by the way Obama said he was for while he ran for president. Did you forget? I didn't.
Many in the OWS crowd are against the bank bailout and I get that. Then on the other hand they want student loans forgiven. I don't understand that at all. If bailouts are wrongthen they are wrong for everyone and are indeed not capitalism. Capitalism works when failure is not rewarded with bailouts. Bankruptcy is there for a reason and needs to be utilized to clear out the wrongful pursuits. Demand that.
Clearly, I am no longer living in the same country I grew up in. I fear the people calling for these changes do not have our collective better interests in mind and are encouraging the desire for change in exchange for the power they are pursuing.
Gini coefficient measuring worsening wealth disparity is one thing, but the more pressing issue, which is the more difficult to communicate is the danger posed by the criminal syndicate, the banking cartel who will not rest until we are all trapped in debt slavery, debt peonage with satellte TV and iPhones.
As a Paramedic who deals mostly with the bottom whatever percent, I can tell you a few universal truths: first there's always money for beer and cigs. Second, no matter what there is tv and cell phones and usually a car. Poor choices in a rampant consumer society keep the poor poor. I am not rich but I save first then spend. I have created a buffer. You have to make your own oppurtunity. The OWS crowd has been brainwashed into thinking a degree entitles you to lifelong prosperity. I contend there is only one way to do this: Rely on yourself. Always save for the future. Work hard. Be a good steward of your capital. Vote with your wallet. Be cheap, trying to keep up with the peacocks will drive you into the ground.
DumFarmer, You ain't dumb.
I'm waving my flag as you speak, dumfarmer.
*tear falls down my face*
Yeah, right.
In April of this year, one million people applied for a job at McDonalds. 940,000 of them did not get a job.
This isn't 1950. It's not 1985. It's not 2000.
The implication that there are opportunities is misguided. A college education is $10,000s. The debt that comes with an education is unforgivable. It's life-long debt. And like you said, there are no guarantees of even getting a job.
It's easy for you to tell kids today how you succeeded. After all, you're not looking for a job NOW. You probably have a home and a car...and savings. You probably went to college when the cost wasn't equivalent to a MORTGAGE.
As for the poor smoking and drinking. WTF would you do if your life was hanging around a dumpy house all day? You'd probably drink and smoke as well.
You are totally clueless. You expect the poor to live without things that most people are afforded?? Let me guess, they probably had toilet paper too!! OMG, they really are RICH!
So you are saying we need more McDonalds?
Frankly, I don't think that is the solution. I don't think there is any attractive solution. There are simply not enough jobs in the world for everyone to have something meaningful to do. We postponed the day of reckoning by allowing the credit bubble to inflate and create artificial demand that could only be "afforded" with debt. Then we reached the limits of our ability to repay the debt, so we've transferred it all to governments. There is nowhere else to go, and there is still nothing for billions of people to do, even if they are skilled, which most are not. The debt is still there, the system cannot generate any more without collapsing currencies, and yet billions are still without gainful employment.
I'm also not sure why I should give precedence to people who just happened to have been born within the same geographical borders as me (which is why I used 'billions' in the last paragraph). Are these people---those born within the same borders as me---automatically better and more deserving? Are they brighter? Are they harder workers? Seems an artificial construct.
The only solutions I can see---apart from the obvious of stopping the "slippage" due to cronyism---is to become less efficient and shrink the population. The humane way to shrink is not to have kids. The less human ways are war and famine. Redistributing income, taking away incentive, or pretending everybody is equally intelligent and equally hard working are unfair and fantastical.
Any other solution is a fairy tale based on both a failed ideology and the failure to grasp the true nature of the problem. We have peak oil; we need peak population. Oh, and I did not make any kids (for exactly this reason), and when I'm finished I'll go quietly into that good night.
Waoooo, another dose of US 'realism'
Always funny to read a US citizen claiming that they deal in reality, push away unicorns.
Kind of reading a fairy tale within a fairy tale.
Wars curbing human population growth? Powerful effect that would lead to think the world has not known wars since its beginning.
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The only solutions I can see---apart from the obvious of stopping the "slippage" due to cronyism---is to become less efficient and shrink the population. The humane way to shrink is not to have kids. The less human ways are war and famine. Redistributing income, taking away incentive, or pretending everybody is equally intelligent and equally hard working are unfair and fantastical.
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The capacity of US citizens to start off with a postulate and go off the tracks is astounding. Done in one breath...
Where does this issue come from? Because US citizens are not the solution, they are the problem. They cant stand self indicting themselves and therefore have to find ways to shift the blame on an alien element.
So it starts with that becoming less efficient and shrinking the population to end with redistributing income, taking away incentitive or pretending everybody is equally intelligent and equally hard working.
Funny.
It has to be repeated over and over again that local populations are going to live a nightmare at the hands of US citizens. Second worlders, third worlders have to prepare themselves: US citizens are going to land on their shores and it is going to be ugly.
US citizens can not perceive themselves as the problem when they are the problem and no matter what, have to be the solution of the problems they create.
With US citizens, it is always more of the causes of a problem as the cure to the problem.
Becoming a nurse takes much less than a lifetime of debt if the educational institution is chosen well. Or maybe they are too stupid. Anyone can kick an illigal out and pick crops for cash. Or that's below them. And nobody goes without TP. They steal it from mcdonalds while they fill their morbidly obese bellies with quality cheap food. Come into the medical field. You opinion of individual choice will change. I promise.
Ho hum. Work hard says the gov't. leech.
Oh so funny. Not all medics work for the govt. Hospitals employ some of us. Ive been a farmer, welder, mechanic, pipefitter, load concrete, etc. I did due dilligence when choosing how to get educated in a way that fits the current employment oppurtunities. There are plenty of jobs for nurses and primary care doctors. But that takes hard work and commitment. or maybe they are too dumb to complete the course material. These fields pay any loans quickly. Or find a product or service that is needed. No one but the individual can figure out how to prosper. Sitting around drinking and smoking is shortsighted and counterproductive. No one lacks TP. The fact this is a universal truth shows things aren't that bad. Fuck the victim sob story. Pick yourself up. Be thankful for what you do have. Be sustainable in all your actions. If not suffer the consequences. We have illigals coming here finding plenty of work. But that's benieth an AMERICAN. Again I have never had a problem finding some work. Not the easiest, cleanest or well paying. But that lit my fire to move on and make more. So again I say fuck you sob story parasites. Do something before we're all broke and I have to shoot you for trying to steal the food I grow. I have. There are oppurtunities out there. Find them.
I'm having a hard time understanding the anti-wealth angle of the OWS movement. When I was in my 20s I wanted to be wealthy. I thought it was a good goal and I still do. I didn't go to college, delayed a lot of gratification, didn't ask for a dime from anybody, drove shitty cars and worked my ass off for 25 years. That's what it takes - 25 years of intelligent, dilligent, 10-hour-a-day hard work. Banging on drums, painting signs, dressing up, chanting, posting rants on boards like this one -- these things may make one feel good and may be fun but they ain't gonna generate any wealth for you (or anyone else, for that matter). Here's some advice: start a busines that you own, focus on an area where you have personal talent and are more skillful than most others (you know, the other 99%), seek the advice of successful entrepreneurs, figure out how to capture the value you create (this may take some time, but you have time), read a lot of books instead of watching TV, don't party, don't drink, don't waste money, ignore political bullshit such as OWS, write your goals down on paper, work hard for 25 years, and you will be the 1%. Since most of you reading this are probably in your 20s, now is your time to start. Get going - it's really worth it! Free enterprise is a great system - so please don't fuck it up with all them negative waves.
If you're having a hard time understanding that our government is not responsive to the needs of the people, then you are not going to get it now, or anytime in the future. There is no dispute that the top 1% controls the political, legal and military process in this country as well as most of the world. If you are happy the way things are going currently, then you are reading the wrong blog. So here is some advice for you as well: Go back to Fox News. It's better than thinking.
Wow, you really tried to turn a positive message about how to make it in the real world into someone being brainwashed by Fox News.
Old Ball, you're exactly right. That's how a lot of folks have made it successfully in this country.
Obviously the top 1% control weinerdog43's thinking because they have brainwashed him into thinking they control everything including the rising and setting of the sun.
Very well. You win. I did not realize I was communicating with Roger Ailes himself. Since I'm not interested in 'communicating' with obvious Republic party dolts, I'll leave this thread to you. Auf weidersehen.
Man, did anyone else notice how the old man stink just went away when that guy left?
Dude, you're the one going around throwing shit at other people, so I don't get why you start crying and leave the game when other people start throwing shit back in your direction.
Did someone get in a face shot on you, crybaby?
Just a heads up. It's not 1985.
Giving anecdotes about 25 years ago is about as useful a rubber crutch.
it would appear that #OCCUPYZH is underway based on many of the above comments
Is the nineteen percent he refers to average corporate America wage slaves?
If so, this guy is a moron.
Fact is, food stamps and welfare provide insurance for the top 1%. It's a small price to pay besides it's passed along to the bottom 20 to 50%. The top 20 oppose the a collective of the bottom 80, I'd say 60% sit it out.
If 50% of the bottom 80% got involved it's bad news for the top 1'ers.
Doesn't really matter what any of us think, it won't stop it. It should reach a peak next June, just part of the cycle, it's just time. Call it what you like it is the greatest depression the train is still on motion. We won't know the real damage for a few more years, then we can talk about a way out. One guy used to post here:
"There is no out, only in"
That sums up where we are now.
bottom 80%?
upwardly mobile, BiCheZ!
Move to China then, Bitch(ez)
Seems like an eye opener to remind the "we are other 99 percent" people that there is another group of people who view then as the one percent.
Under $6k/year
6 to 30
30 to 80
over 80
Geez - too many apologists for the current system to represent only the 1%. We must be having an outbreak of "Joe the Plumber" disease. Some of the commenters need to let go of the FauxNews/MicrobrainSNBC - Right vs. Left thing.
Big Government is the problem. Big deficits are the problem. Big money and influence in the Republic is the problem. Captured bureaucrats and lawmakers are the problem. The plague of nationwide ignorance is the problem. Shit, we have a lot of problems!
None of them will ever get better by maintaining the status quo.
Simple example - we have an airport in DuPage County, IL - we pay taxes to support it. The Fed pays staff (with our tax dollars) to man it. At sometime - we all paid taxes to build it. Only folks with private airplanes use it. Pretty much nothing but Republicans out here... Big government/big money - no public benefit...but it is nice if you have the $$$.
It would be nice if all Americans would stop looking for something for nothing.
This is getting dangerous. Dog eat dog. How long until we are eating the 80% who have anything left.
There is a revolution coming. We have one every time the wealth distribution goes skewed. But we can't all revolt against everybody else.
So now they want to go after the bourgeoisie, who are far more industrious and knowledgeable than these dregs will ever be? Good luck with that and I may as well hand them shovels right now to start digging their own graves.
This guy is nothing but a cloaked marxist. His description of the middle-class or Marx' "Bourgeoise" is the intended recipient of the "purge" by the masses.
My "middle class" family consisted of a stay-at-home mother and a dad with 2 jobs. My brother and I sent ourselves to college and worked and saved our way through school. Both of us have decent professional jobs.
But in the brave-new world of US marxism, working hard and saving is to be discouraged; and worse, to be pointed to as someone others should be against -?
WTF?
Ben: Fuck you and your class warfare fomenting tripe of an attempt at an article.
I am part of the 19% that you speak of.
Those in the lower 80% who are willing to work and contribute to society, but who are tired of being ass-raped, are allies in my book.
The elites and those not willing to better their situation can also fuck off.
HopeanChange you say? Didn't the US vote for that in '08. And now, how's that working for you? Oh, you say you want more? Hey let's start a revolution because the Bamster has been too successful at implementing his demented policies. Yea, that's the ticket.
PK, green for you, brother because you raise the pertinent point: there was a vote for change and after three years of lies from the changeman---we give up and we have a plan. We just run wild until there is the change that is needed----so, nothing to do but put one foot in front at a time and follow the suvival instinct because that is what this all about for nearly all of our species. And it will not be so important if we don't make it, but we will------------------
You are on the team whether you agree or not om
Monedas invents the "Mother of all Band Aids" and does not pledge profits to rebuild inner city neighbourhoods ! I got sick and tired and infected by cheap, Chinese, imitation Band Aids that don't stick in the sauna ! I cut a patch from a fresh panty liner, placed it absorbent side against the wound and taped it on with duct tape ! Monedas 2011 Comedy Jihad Wealth Creation Convention
This is a good, clear and truthful article - clearly from some of the responses on here there are still a hardcore of 'middle class' who think they will be protected by their masters.....what a shame for them.
If you're spending this depression worrying about your business folding or your job going - then you're working class....if you're spending this depression on your yacht hunting around the fallen asset prices looking for bargain companies to 'snap up' - then you're probably not.
This is not new however, Marx did say all of this - as you can see from Egypt it's the 'middle class' who fall furthest and fastest and are least prepared to accept it - those who thought they had the masters favour and lost it - are always going to be more angry than those who never wanted it to begin with.
It's a shame that the 'privately owned' media decided to confuse the heads of Americans by mixing ideologies up and making the people think that the ideals of the left are evil (even though the most haenous crimes of inhumanity were pepetrated by the right). Had they not fallen for this then maybe the outcome would not be a violent and bloody revolution (which is inevitable I'm afraid)
Had the 'middle class' not been so keen to accept their inflated property prices, increased wages and greater status - without question - then maybe we wouldn't be in the mess we are now.
Only 1% are perpetrators - but a lot more looked on and did nothing.