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Guest Post: Does America Face An Election Between Two Moderates?

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by James Miller of the Ludwig von Mises Institute of Canada

Does America Face An Election Between Two Moderates?

This weekend the runoff election will be held in Egypt to decide who will be the next president.  The country’s first democratic election in decades comes one year after former President Hosni Mubarak was ousted during a massive civilian protest.  Despite decades of financial support from supposedly democracy-friendly U.S. and Western governments, it’s was widely acknowledged that Mubarak’s constant reelection was the product of ballot rigging.  He aggressively held power for years by censoring and controlling the media along with suppressing political dissent.  Mubarak was shielded from most opposition by the fact that he used his office as a tool of political corruption and was the quintessential Western puppet of a dictator.

At the beginning, most journalists in the West were celebrating the Egyptian revolution as a victory for democratic governance.  They saw the possibility of untainted elections as the best way for Egyptians to adopt their values.  With the first presidential runoff ballot since Mubarak just around the corner, the good feelings have begun to wear off.  Many prominent media publications are dismayed that this weekend’s contest is looking like a battle between two radical candidates.  The Globe and Mail reports:

If this is what democracy is like, maybe we’re better off without it, many Egyptians voting in their first-ever truly free presidential election must be thinking.

With a choice between a leader of the Muslim Brotherhood on the one hand and a former air-force commander and prime minister for Hosni Mubarak on the other, not only do these virgin voters have to choose between two political extremes, but the majority of Egyptians don’t want either of them to win.

New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman equates the runoff election with “having to choose between two diseases.”

From the mainstream, corporate media perspective, this isn’t how elections are supposed to play out.  In America, the Democrat vs. Republican paradigm forces both parties to appease centrists and independent voters.  The nominees must campaign not as extremists, but pragmatic moderates who embody the level headedness of the people.  The victor in November is thus given an electoral mandate from the voters to carry out their collective will.

This is also the election process taught in public schools and universities.

But while the American public has been duped into believing such a process gives rise to pragmatic and temperate leaders, quite the opposite is true.

With former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney now the presumptive Republican nominee, campaign season is now fully underway.  Romney is being portrayed as the free market loving, social conservative choice to Barack Obama’s cool, calm, and collected liberalism.  Instead of falling victim to the stereotype of being a fragile leftist, Obama’s ramping up of the War on Terror has been applauded by the right as a step toward the center.  Weekly Standard editor and all around warmonger Bill Kristol declared the President a “born again neo-con.”  And in spite of initially supporting a public option within his key legislative achievement of health care reform, Obama opted for the less extreme alternative of the individual mandate that the conservative Heritage Foundation once endorsed.

As for Romney, he was portrayed by his opponents as Obama-lite due to his pioneering the President’s health care scheme during his tenure as governor of Massachusetts.  Romney has gone on record stating “I’m not going to cut $1 trillion in the first year” as it would “cause our economy to shrink [and] would put a lot of people out of work.”  Of course his logic only works if you believe the money stolen and spent by the government actually creates wealth despite the expenditures never having to compete in the open market.  Statements like these are what leads to Romney being called a “closet Keynesian” by Paul Krugman and the “Massachusetts moderate” by Newt Gingrich.

Though the November election will be hyped as two opposites squaring off against each other, both candidates are considered rather moderate compared to who could have been the nominees.

The question is, are Barack Obama and Mitt Romney really that moderate?

Let’s account for the similarity in policy of both.

–Both are large supporters of the military industrial complex.  Romney has vowed to increase defense spending and wants the Navy, which is larger than the navies of the next 13 nations combined, to ramp up production of warships.  Numerous times the former governor has vowed to prevent Iran from acquiring a nuclear weapon even if it means offensive military action.  For Obama, as the New York Times recently revealed, the President spends every Tuesday morning playing God by picking out drone targets on what could be mistaken for baseball cards.  His unlawfully ordered death strikes are based on flimsy evidence and incredibly vague criteria for determining who the enemy is.  And then there are the hundreds of civilian casualties that have been a result of the unaccountable killing spree.  The drone war won’t end in a second Obama administration and military aggression will likely escalate under a Romney presidency.  This policy does absolutely nothing to keep the U.S. safe and everything to put the public in harm’s way.

–Both show no opposition to the Federal Reserve System and the banking cronyism it has institutionalized.  Both supported the Wall Street bailouts and the unprecedented bout of money printing that took place during the financial crisis.  While Goldman Sachs was Obama’s biggest private donor in the last election, the investment firm is currently Romney’s largest donor.  This election is shaping up to be more of the same as Wall Street is bankrolling both candidates.  Seeing as how the whole banking system operates under the veil of solvency due to fractional reserve lending, it is in the elite money lender’s interest to use their easy access to the printing press to keep the house of cards from collapsing.

–Neither candidate has made a peep out of ending the needlessly expensive and socially degenerating drug war.  In fact, the Obama administration has increased spending on drug enforcement and has cracked down on medical marijuana distributors more than any other president before him.  Romney hasn’t taken a position on the drug war but considering his socially conservative talking points, it’s extremely unlikely he will allow others the freedom of putting what they want in their own bodies.  In short, both candidates are supporters of the prohibition on dry plants and the seedy and dangerous black market it has created.

–And then there is the drug of which all of Washington is addicted to: spending and borrowing.  Neither Obama nor Romney have presented budgets that have actually brought expenditures in line with revenues.  The national debt would balloon under both their proposals.  Being that, as Lew Rockwell identified, pork barrel spending is the “entirety” of the federal government’s budget, denying the welfare dependents of their food stamps, the elderly of their Social Security checks, farmers of their subsidies, green energy companies of their taxpayer loans, Wall Street of its implied bailouts, dictators of their foreign aid, and military contractors of their lucrative deals has become electoral suicide.

Those opposed to the above polices are typically referred to as radicals.  This is especially so for the independent minded who see politics as a game played by well dressed mobsters and the state as an institution of pure thievery.  In modern American discourse, peace is now the policy of ignorance.  The right to do what you want with your self and property must come second to the will of the ruling class.  Being in favor of free markets and not the crooked capitalism which politicians love means wishing to see workers starving in the streets.  True liberty is only of value to the dimwitted and unpatriotic.

Texas Congressman Ron Paul was a steadfast supporter of sound money, nonintervention, the unfettered market, and significantly axing government spending before a now guaranteed financial collapse.  His reward was being treated like a senile uncle and his presidential campaign being subjected to an incredible amount of voter fraud.  He was deemed too much of a threat to the establishment.

In the end, Paul and others who are disgusted at the utter cronyism that is the state aren’t the extremists.  What’s extreme is a blind adoration of government power.  Paul isn’t a radical; he is practically the only politician in Washington who isn’t a closet socialist or fascist on an egotistical power trip.

With such radicalism deeply entrenched in the U.S. government, the best hope the country has is for this fall’s election turnout to be the lowest on record.  Like Egypt, the choice is between two radicals seeking to use the state’s apparatus of violence to help their political buddies and mold society to their liking.  Voting for the lesser of two evils is still evil and immoral.  The freedom to not vote is still available to Americans.  They would be best to exercise it before it’s too late.


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Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:21 | 2531212 reader2010
reader2010's picture

Fuck it!

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:31 | 2531224 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Exactly. Why is the election even being discussed on ZH? It's an insult to our intelligence!

What's next? ... Baseball batting averages? Analysis of Dancing With The Stars entrants?

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:37 | 2531247 The They
The They's picture

They don't sound like moderates to me. They both sound like authoritarians... authoritarian left or right.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:59 | 2531279 sitenine
sitenine's picture

I never saw a close correlation between socialism and fascism until recently.  Let's face it, the US gets Fascism (yes, with a capital F) with either one, but they have differing opinions on religion - strangely, no one talks about religion anymore.  It does appear that it's all about the money after all.  Did you really expect it to be any different?

[edit] @The They - I checked out your blog.  +1

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:07 | 2531306 Deo vindice
Deo vindice's picture

They are not moderates.  They are two radicals who are too radical.

You know the country is listing badly when a radical is considered a moderate.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:27 | 2531411 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

You must not be watching enough television- a radical is one of those lunatics that want to limit the reach of central government and resuscitate that antiquated piece of paper dreamed up by evil white men known as the Constitution.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:00 | 2531438 FEDbuster
FEDbuster's picture

Does anyone really think it will matter who wins?  Hasten the Collapse, Obamney 2012

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:15 | 2531453 Michael
Michael's picture

The best way to fuck over the whole system is to hold your nose vote for Obama and press for impeachment.

I'm voting for Obama and against all incumbents in the primaries and in November.

Why do you think Nobody talks about ousting congress critter incumbents in the primaries and general elections? That's how we got rid of the R Dick Luger.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:38 | 2531477 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

Wow, I see you've been "empowered".  Unfortunately there's nothing you can do to "fuck over the whole system ".  It's already done, you're a consequence and example of those past mistakes, best you can hope for is to not end up a victim or statistic.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 20:09 | 2532864 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

They are both authoritarian statists and crony capitalists. Both serve the corporate and banking elite and both will push the Trans-Pacific Partnership because the corporate and banking elites want it. 

Sun, 06/17/2012 - 01:47 | 2533255 Andy Lewis
Andy Lewis's picture

Damn straight: a Wall street stooge vs. a Wall Street thug.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:57 | 2531493 redpill
redpill's picture

I'm voting Libertarian and am planning on burying time capsules in various places explaining how I tried to stop dumb fucks from voting for Obamney and the like but they did it anyway.  Then at least when aliens find the remains of the human race in the future they will know that some of us understood that voluntary slavery never leads to freedom.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 04:16 | 2531587 Michael
Michael's picture

I really like the Apple Corporation.

They came back after the Dot-Com bubble bust and did really good. And Forest Gump is one of my favorite movies.

I have one of the best inventions ever made, the Ipod Touch. It's an interface to the Internet, and other things and is so slimline in look, nothing will be more modern looking than it except for the BIC lighter, the second greatest invention.

Just sayin.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 04:32 | 2531592 Michael
Michael's picture

Candidates@Google: Ron Paul

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 08:47 | 2531798 El Viejo
El Viejo's picture

If you think the movie was good try reading the book. It has extra episodes not in the movie. Forrest finds he is a natural for doing a certain orbital calculation and they lauch him into space. He and a female Air Force Col land in Borneo amongst head hunters, one of which went to Harvard(a natural choice) and learned to play chess before dropping out and returning home. He teaches Forrest chess and when he starts to beat the teacher they are considered food for the pot...  LMAO - funniest book I ever read.

They are All moderates until the second term.  Impose term limits vote out all encumbents! 

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 10:44 | 2531987 derek_vineyard
derek_vineyard's picture

does america face an election between two idiots?

headline amended  (that shouldn't be in the form of a question though)

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 10:48 | 2531994 Pool Shark
Pool Shark's picture



"Don't blame me; I voted for Kodos."



Sat, 06/16/2012 - 08:45 | 2531719 Escapeclaws
Escapeclaws's picture

Check out Webster argues that libertarianism was actually an invention of the CIA to engender a false conciousness, to prevent people from really understanding what is in their own interest. Watch him debate Adam Kokesh, who is as fundamentalist libertarian as you can get. It's like arguing with a fundamentalist Christian or a fundamentalist evolutionist. Furthermore, Adam Kokesh tries so hard to show he just as intelligent as Tarpley that he won't let him get a word in edgewise. Tarpley is ever patient and gracious and never loses his cool this debate. He almost has to sneak in his own thoughts.

Also watch Tarpley try to get his points across about Ron Paul on the Alex Jones show. Jones keeps hounding him, taking away the microphone, etc.

Tarpley is not a socialist or a Marxist. He calls himself a Hamiltoninan and represents what used to be the American tradition before this extreme Reagan/Thatcher free-market ideology got the upper hand in the 1980's.

Tarpley is incredibly well-informed and attacks both the left and the right. Regardless of whether you agree with him or not, he has some of the most provocative and intelligent analysis out there. He detests Obama and Romney and basically feels that Paul is a stooge for Romney.

He makes the point that the Bilderbergers have already decided that Obama is out. No need to vote unless you want to write in someone--the election is already determined.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:01 | 2531827 Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture



Ayn Rand called Libertarians 'Hippies of the Right".


For the record, I shall repeat what I have said many times before: I do not join or endorse any political group or movement. More specifically, I disapprove of, disagree with, and have no connection with, the latest aberration of some conservatives, the so-called “hippies of the right,” who attempt to snare the younger or more careless ones of my readers by claiming simultanteously to be followers of my philosophy and advocates of anarchism. Anyone offering such a combination confesses his inability to understand either. Anarchism is the most irrational, anti-intellectual notion ever spun by the concrete-bound, context-dropping, whim-worshiping fringe of the collectivist movement, where it properly belongs.

“Brief Summary,”
The Objectivist, Sept. 1971, 1

Above all, do not join the wrong ideological groups or movements, in order to “do something.” By “ideological” (in this context), I mean groups or movements proclaiming some vaguely generalized, undefined (and, usually, contradictory) political goals. (E.g., the Conservative Party, which subordinates reason to faith, and substitutes theocracy for capitalism; or the “libertarian” hippies, who subordinate reason to whims, and substitute anarchism for capitalism.) To join such groups means to reverse the philosophical hierarchy and to sell out fundamental principles for the sake of some superficial political action which is bound to fail. It means that you help the defeat of your ideas and the victory of your enemies. (For a discussion of the reasons, see “The Anatomy of Compromise” in my book Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal.)

“What Can One Do?”
Philosophy: Who Needs It, 202

The “libertarians” . . . plagiarize Ayn Rand’s principle that no man may initiate the use of physical force, and treat it as a mystically revealed, out-of-context absolute . . . .

In the philosophical battle for a free society, the one crucial connection to be upheld is that between capitalism and reason. The religious conservatives are seeking to tie capitalism to mysticism; the “libertarians” are tying capitalism to the whim-worshipping subjectivism and chaos of anarchy. To cooperate with either group is to betray capitalism, reason, and one’s own future.

Harry Binswanger, “Q & A Department: Anarchism,”
The Objectivist Forum, Aug. 1981, 12


(Libertarians don't even understand what exactly their roots are)

Libertarianism refers to political philosophies which emphasize freedom, liberty, and voluntary association. There is no general consensus among scholars on the precise definition. Libertarians generally advocate a society with a government of small scope relative to most present day societies or no government whatsoever.

The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy defines libertarianism as the moral view that agents initially fully own themselves and have certain moral powers to acquire property rights in external things.[1] Libertarian historian George Woodcock defines libertarianism as the philosophy that fundamentally doubts authority and advocates transforming society by reform or revolution.[2] Libertarian philosopher Roderick Long defines libertarianism as "any political position that advocates a radical redistribution of power from the coercive state to voluntary associations of free individuals", whether "voluntary association" takes the form of the free market or of communal co-operatives.[3] According to the U.S. Libertarian Party, libertarianism is the advocacy of a government that is funded voluntarily and limited to protecting individuals from coercion and violence.[4]

Libertarian schools of thought differ over the degree to which the state should be reduced. Anarchistic schools advocate complete elimination of the state. Minarchist schools advocate a state which is limited to protecting its citizens from aggression, theft, breach of contract, and fraud. Some schools accept public assistance for the poor.[5] Additionally, some schools are supportive of private property rights in the ownership of unappropriated land and natural resources while others reject such private ownership and often support common ownership instead.[6][7][8] Another distinction can be made among libertarians who support private ownership and those that support common ownership of the means of production; the former generally supporting a capitalist economy, the latter a socialist economic system. Contractarian libertarianism holds that any legitimate authority of government derives not from the consent of the governed, but from contract or mutual agreement, though this can be seen as reducible to consequentialism or deontologism depending on what grounds contracts are justified.[9][10][11] Some Libertarian socialists reject deontological and consequential approaches and use historical materialism to justify their political beliefs.[12]

Political scholars such as Noam Chomsky assert that in most countries the terms "libertarian" and "libertarianism" are synonymous with left anarchism.[13] It is only in the United States that the term libertarian is commonly associated with those who have conservative positions on economic issues and liberal positions on social issues, going by the common meanings of "conservative" and "liberal" in the United States.[14


( Libertarians are the Goddes worshipers of the Right. They claim they want something different, but only slightly different. Ted Rall once saids somethging like US citizens vote for change but only very little change, they can't handle radical change.)

“Well I sometimes call myself a libertarian but that’s only because most people don’t know what anarchist means. Most people hear you’re an anarchist and they think you’re getting ready to throw a bomb at a building. They don’t understand the concept of voluntary association, the whole concept of replacing force with voluntary cooperation or contractual arrangements and so on. So libertarian is a clearer word that doesn’t arouse any immediate anxiety upon the listener. And then again, libertarians, if they were totally consistent with their principles would be anarchists.”

Robert Anton Wilson

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:56 | 2531917 Marco
Marco's picture

An awful lot of words to talk about what Objectivists think of libertarians ... with a conspicious absence of actually putting into words the practical difference between Libertarian Anarcho-Capitalism and Objectivist Laissez Faire Capitalism.

Forget about the ad hominems for a moment, what are the concrete differences in the political/economic systems they want to implement? I see none.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 10:36 | 2531980 Escapeclaws
Escapeclaws's picture

GF good post. I'm really struck by how you can't argue with a libertarian because they already have all the answers. No different than arguing with a milatant feminist, a militant Darwinist, etc. The point is, these people already know all the answers and the only thing they will study for is to get even more reinforcement for their ideology. I care less about what they advocate than about the fact they they have a closed system--they are "true believers".

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 12:25 | 2532043 i-dog
i-dog's picture

I believe what you did there is called "projection". :-/

Anyway, don't get sucked in by Tarpley ... his scholarship and geopolitical ananlysis is second to none (and I like him a lot as an individual), but his proffered solutions are pure elitist "big government". Some brand him as a Marxist (I know I have in the past!), while he now calls himself a "Hamiltonian". Either way, he wants either an all-powerful Politburo (Marxist) or an all-powerful central government with a King and an aristocratic hereditary upper house (Hamiltonian).

For the record, Hamilton was opposed to state governments and wanted a single central government with complete political authority as "the perfect union". His idea of "checks and balances" was to retain a monarchy and a house of lords to make sure the peasants in the house of representatives didn't get too cocky! Sheer elitism of the very highest order! ... and Tarpley hangs his hat on that peg!?!

Hamilton also championed absolute Central Planning (as Tarpley does), where the government would "foster commerce" (ie. pick winners and losers, and subsidise buddies), "foster revenue" (ie. keep ramping up taxes to fund aristocratic excesses, and to buy votes) and be "strong enough to earn the respect of other governments" (ie. to effectively foster an arms race)! What Hamilton wanted is exactly what Herman van Rompuy is pursuing in Europe (for his masters down the road beside the Viale Vaticano).

To cap it off, Tarpley's other great hero is Franklin Delano Roosevelt ... grandson of wealthy master drug trafficker, Warren Delano, and tool of the Vatican's WW2 machinations. No coincidence, since FDR embodied all of Hamilton's "ideals".

PS. I'm neither a libertarian nor objectivist, and I reject all their and RP's platforms. I'm a voluntarist and want both you and Tarpley to stop telling me what I want! I'll sort that out for myself, and in co-operation with my local community, thank you very much.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 14:26 | 2532433 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

be nice if people would stop tying themselves in (k)nots while looking for a label to "vote" for - be it in their lives, or for candidates who can never live up to every-body's miniscule variants.

this propensity for adding modifiers to political ideologies, making five-word-long labels that often conflict in definition the further down the sentence one goes, just goes to show that "things" are fracturing, the center cannot hold, etc.  which is inevitable when a take-over is under way, as we are living through now. . . "they" love it that people are arguing over which "freedom" or law is to be allowed in the new systems being invented, massive distractions and arguing amongst the populace, while "they" continue to roll back all liberty, at a pace not seen since?  forever?

but people love their labels, it's shorthand to use them as descriptives - we all do it - why anyone still believes a politician asking for money is going to adhere to any labels the individual uses to justify the donation - that's just amazing to me!

"voluntarist" as you've described - I like that one. . . until, of course, someone running for a position of power co-opts it and attracts a following. . . *smiles*

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 15:49 | 2532559 i-dog
i-dog's picture


"until, of course, someone running for a position of power co-opts it and attracts a following"

They can do what they want, CA! We (in a local community) won't nuke them if they don't come stomping in demanding money for their harebrained schemes.

The world of today is a far different environment than that of the past. In the past, any small community had to build a great army or ally with a great power to avoid being overrun by a neighboring imperialist despot and his adoring masses. Now, we (ie. a small local community) have the means of MAD to deter such activity and it is time to consider that when breaking down this headlong rush towards a global feudal government.

A new paradigm for the century ahead needs to contemplate that each community, or tribe, or sect, or nation, could exist in peace and trade in peace if each held the means of MAD as a deterrent to outsiders. We just need to get rid of the Imperial Zionist-Anglo-American Military first!

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 21:24 | 2532953 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

these times have their moments of sheer breathlessness, in that some of us are creating safe spaces in our minds first, through resistance and bravery, and others of a like mind are "finding" more similars as they speak of their desires, autonomy from authority. . .

going forward, speaking personal truths, gathering peoples - it's definitely happening, I see it daily!

so yes, "we in a local community" will most definitely defend our space(s), our friends and family (however these are defined, and it does vary), keeping a low profile, quiet dignity, in the face of tyranny. 

occasionally I "worry" about the "IZAAM" - and I know we'll never really be rid of them overall - but more and more I realise that what is happening is an evolution of sorts, a "new paradigm" as you say - we have to be strong and steadfast to maintain inner equilibrium, and trust that we become part of a greater whole going forward.

keep overturning those rocks i-dog, expose those bugs to the light of truth!  

always best wishes to you & yours.

Sun, 06/17/2012 - 07:30 | 2533465 smb12321
smb12321's picture

Militant Darwinist?  Oh brother.  What about those kooks who hold to the germ theory or the idiots that maintain we're made of virtually empty entities called atoms?  Clue - someone who accepts tested scientific data is not a true believer.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 16:37 | 2532628 The Heart
The Heart's picture

Here is today's show on GCN. Webster Tarpley was talking to someone in Greece about what is coming tomorrow.:

Part 1:

Part 2:



Sat, 06/16/2012 - 21:22 | 2532949 gall batter
gall batter's picture

I'll have a bilderburger with bacon, cheese, and let us prey on little children with dark skin in countries rich in resouces.  

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:55 | 2531916 Winston Smith 2009
Winston Smith 2009's picture

"I'm voting Libertarian"

I used to do so for many years.  I now realize it was a complete waste of time as I am surrounded by persistent morons.

"Then at least when aliens find the remains of the human race in the future they will know that some of us understood that voluntary slavery never leads to freedom."

"Look, Grokk, some of these apes with car keys weren't quite as stupid as the others.  Unfortunately for them, they still thought that voting mattered even when they were up against abject voter stupidity and ignorance promoted by the beneficiaries of a multi-trillion dollar taxpayer gravy train."


Sat, 06/16/2012 - 02:42 | 2531524 FlyoverCountryS...
FlyoverCountrySchmuck's picture

In the Church of Obama, the Kool-aid is always free.

The guy behind you in line has to pay for it.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 05:09 | 2531612 BennyBoy
BennyBoy's picture

One takes orders from the Financial Elite.

The other is the Financial Elite.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 14:28 | 2532435 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

Dubya drank yer milkshake.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:09 | 2531682 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

Neither candidate has the balls, brains, moral rectitude or intestinal fortitude to do the right things.  Pathetic really

I will also be voting against incumbents

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:48 | 2531904 Winston Smith 2009
Winston Smith 2009's picture

I'd vote against all incumbents, too, if I actually still bothered to waste my time and gasoline voting.  I'm unjustly stuck in a Moron Academy and my vote won't counter the majority morons. 

Hell, I even tear up mail ballots these days.  Eventually, they'll stop wasting my money sending them to me.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 22:27 | 2533029 gall batter
gall batter's picture

Wrong, e s, they're both doing what they are operated to do.  This is unrelated to what you think about having balls, brains, moral rectitude or intestinal fortitude. Voting against or for incumbents is pointless.  An illusion.  

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 02:41 | 2531520 FlyoverCountryS...
FlyoverCountrySchmuck's picture

Obama is NO MODERATE, he is an Academic Socialist Radical.

Meanwhile, Romney is about as center of the road as it gets.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:10 | 2531557 Benjamin Glutton
Benjamin Glutton's picture

They are both center right.


either will sign off on renewal of the Fed Res charter, war with Iran, Patriot Act etc.


neither will alter the general course set over the previous 12 years.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 08:23 | 2531721 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

Obama is the most liberal presidents we've ever had and his Congressional voting record backs this assessment. He is definitely not center right unless of course you consider Karl Marx to be a moderate.

Can they have the same Federal Reserve policy? Sure. But that does not make the two center right candidates. There are far more policies that come into play. Obama is our version of Hugo Chavez when it comes to redistribution and that is not center right.

My question is if Obama is center right then who is a leftist.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 20:53 | 2532917 malek
malek's picture

His voting record? Are you stupid??

Look what he has done or not done during the 3+ years as a president!

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 23:06 | 2533091 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

The DKos crowd has come out in numbers here thanks to GW, to them anyone who isnt flat out foaming loony California left is center right. An interventionist foreign policy isnt so much left or right as just an extroverted Wilsonian progressivism.

Romneys record is little if any better than Obamas, the only question in November is what color Obama we want.

Lets see, I want to vote for the effeminate Ivy League twerp who:

1)  Will give an incompetent financial sector everything it wants

2) Will appoint leftist judges

3) Is generally hostile to the 2nd Amendment

4) Will muck around in the Middle East with no clear goal or reason

5) Has a political record of excessive deficit spending and a massive debt that is somehow not their fault, though they held executive power when it was incurred.

6) Has no discernable spine or backbone, and will bend like a reed in the wind for political expediency

Its only whether we want the black twit or the white twit.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 03:52 | 2531571 Tsukato
Tsukato's picture

Here we go again. Why you gotta go insultin a brother this way? Aint you gots no sense?! This brother OBAMA is so unpopular just cuz you ignerent muthfuckas are just racists, and anti-semites! I've been seein the way you dis the joos and us powerful men of color. Well, I got news for you fuckin crackers... we been takin your fat bitches for the past 20 years, and your welfare for even longer. I been personally fuckin lotsa married white women down at Appleby's on ladies nights, and they was all married. Anyway, we're gonna have a race riot soon, and mop up the streets with your white asses, then us brothers gonna go fuck all your bitches and daughters, then we're gonna come take all your escalades. Its a brothers' world cummin, and Mr. President of the USA Obama, has made it all possible. Choke on that girls.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:37 | 2531702 BeetleBailey
BeetleBailey's picture

LOL. Nice post.

Obama isn't even black, so your post is an epic failure.

Oh, and even if your post was a "serious" one, you are outnumbered badly - 10 to 1. Try this "mopping up the streets" shite and you'll get beaten like a rented mule.

IF you are serious, you've gotten duped again. Obama played you. He's Arabic - dickhead - not black.

What a putz. Go screw all the white women; it's all you're "good" for.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:05 | 2531832 Tsukato
Tsukato's picture

Yeah baby, gonna start with yo momma, gf, and/or wife. You some sorta soldier, limp dick? I'm gonna be drinkin PBR oughta yur skull when this is all finished.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 14:35 | 2532444 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

trollin' 101, just the basics.

gotta love how some dudes love to talk of all the harm they'll do with their dicks, when it's so very obvious you rarely leave the house, and most likely type with one fist in yer lap.

here's hoping you're still in your teens, anything else would be too pathetic to consider. . .

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 21:27 | 2532957 BeetleBailey
BeetleBailey's picture


Big boots. Big Hat.

No Cattle.

My "momma" is dead. Go fuck a corpse, chump. My girlfriend hates black men.

Know why - chump? They are all cheap, and think with their dicks.

Go suck down a bucket of Popeye's chicken, douchebag.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 22:52 | 2533067 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

Dont waste time, that ones a pure troll and not even a good one.

Awhile back he was a successful American in China, next week he will be something else.

Nothing but a mentally ill idiot on the internet, just move on when you see that one. When it doesnt get attention, it will wither.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 13:47 | 2531985 Eireann go Brach
Eireann go Brach's picture

Tsukako, are you speaking fucking English or what type of language are you speaking?

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 12:41 | 2532258 Iwanttoknow
Iwanttoknow's picture

Great.let's start a race war.That should solve every problem.get a life,moron.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 15:52 | 2532566 Debt-Is-Not-Money
Debt-Is-Not-Money's picture

"Romney is about as center of the road as it gets"

As a former US Congressman once told me: all you find in the center of the road is yellow stripes and dead skunks!

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 20:55 | 2532920 malek
malek's picture

Fuckin' A.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 17:36 | 2532696 Blammo
Blammo's picture

The main differance between a fascist (National Socialist Party) And a modern socialist is the latters aversion to guns and ammo

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:17 | 2531455 dukeness
dukeness's picture

But we get to choose the color of the dildo we get fucked with. Red or Blue - Not lube but glue.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:15 | 2531691 Debt-Is-Not-Money
Debt-Is-Not-Money's picture

authoritarian = dictator

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:11 | 2531846 Cistercian
Cistercian's picture

Either candidate represents the same puppetmasters.

 Voting at this level has no effect other than to lend legitimacy to our slavery.

The Jefferson option is the only vote that will actually have a salutary effect.

 Don't enable enslavement by voting for it again.



Sat, 06/16/2012 - 13:57 | 2532394 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture


Indeed, "The They" speaks for the rest of us.

Nothing "moderate" about the two Wall Street Super-Stooges we've been presented with as the usual "choice" ---


Dr. Jill Stein in 2012 --- think intelligently, vote Green!

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:05 | 2531303 Global Hunter
Global Hunter's picture

Its the type of article that would have blown me away when I first came to ZH now that I've been here for over a year I feel all growd up now!  Everybody has to start somewhere!

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:21 | 2531459 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

"insult to "our" intelligence!" You're not 1/2 as smart as your momma told you boy.  You're gonna cry like she never let you.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 03:28 | 2531552 i-dog
i-dog's picture

LOL. I see you are spending a long childhood doing a lot of crying. My condolences to your mother!

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:33 | 2531242 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

oddly, i had the same thought myself a short time ago, as this author, whom i can't fuking stand to wit: 

The freedom to not vote is still available to Americans.

None of the Abovebrewster'sMillions

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:08 | 2531307 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

Slewie, I think this is the only possible sane response at this point.

Thanks for the link, it's one of my favorite movies.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:51 | 2531371 joe6px
joe6px's picture

Great link!  However, I respectfully disagree.  Go to the polls and vote.  Write in the candidate you back.  At least that way you can participate in the fraud and still have a clear conscience.  There was once a whisper of a dream....and perhaps those of us strong enough to pursue it can at least die in it's shadow.  No FEMA camp for me.  I wish I lived in New Hampshire just for the state motto...but where I am will have to do.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:40 | 2531418 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

Go to the polls and vote for what? So you can legitimize your own enslavement?

No thank you.

If you vote, YOU are responsible for what you get.

I'm with George Carlin, I don't vote.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:56 | 2531432 Lucius Corneliu...
Lucius Cornelius Sulla's picture

I vote so they don't raise my local property taxes.  I could care less about the National political farce.  Usually just vote Libertarian and then whoever I perceive will tax me less.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:46 | 2531902 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Property taxes are unconstitutional. Those who fight them [quickly] end up not paying them.

Don't waste your time voting ... educate yourself and starve the beast of illegal payola.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:58 | 2531433 Socialism4Ever
Socialism4Ever's picture

The best we can do is to keep them in the gridlock state. Vote for Democratic President and Republican Congress or Republican President and Democratic Congress.


Sat, 06/16/2012 - 12:57 | 2532286 Jumbotron
Jumbotron's picture

geekgrrl said....


"Go to the polls and vote for what? So you can legitimize your own enslavement?

No thank you.

If you vote, YOU are responsible for what you get.

I'm with George Carlin, I don't vote."

Amen geekgrrl....haven't voted since I cast a vote for the functional retard George W. Bush.  Mea Culpa no more.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:56 | 2531429 JohnKozac
JohnKozac's picture

"I knew Joe Moderate, and you, Sir, are no Joe Moderate!"


BTW, Austerity Bites Canada:


'Maple Spring' protests: Cuts, crackdown on student rallies roil Quebec


Updated at 5:00 p.m ET: Demonstrators are filling Quebec's streets daily to support a four-month-old student strike against a tuition hike that has morphed into a movement against efforts to curb the right to protest and to impose austerity measures in Canada's largest province.

The walkout over an 80 percent increase in university and college tuition fees began on Feb. 13 with about 11,000 students. By late March, more than 300,000 people -- or about three-quarters of Quebec's student population -- were participating, organizers say.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:40 | 2531249 El Oregonian
El Oregonian's picture

Lawyers for Ron Paul have taken over Paul's campaign and will have him nominated as the Presidential candidate and have Mitt Romney stripped of his delegates! Great interview and a MUST LISTEN.  Finally, some really great news on dismantling this Tyranny! Long Live Liberty!!

The incredible info starts around 5:00

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:09 | 2531312 Fake Jim Quinn
Fake Jim Quinn's picture

Don't think so. I bet Rand Paul backed Romney because Mitt is going to name Ron Paul Treasury Secretary. This would immediately get Romney a fair share of Ron Paul voters. Romney usually lets his managers manage, so Dr. Paul could have a great economic effect on this country

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:20 | 2531328 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Interesting comment, + 1

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:39 | 2531351 joe6px
joe6px's picture

Uncle Ron on the staff?  As much as I love the thought I think it would be too little too late.  It would be like putting the one honest cop left in America on patrol in Detroit.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:47 | 2531368 CommunityStandard
CommunityStandard's picture

Treasury Secretary is a bit different than cop on patrol.  It was enough to make me stop and think about it.  But the banks (via Mitt and Congress) would never allow Ron to see his economic ideas through.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:55 | 2531376 joe6px
joe6px's picture

Thus the analogy.  One honest person with responsibility in a sea of crime and corruption cannot do anything other than make a small stir before falling into the abyss.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:04 | 2531444 Theosebes Goodfellow
Theosebes Goodfellow's picture

He can if he has the power to hire and fire. Think Elliot Ness and the FBI. Yeah, I like the idea of Ron Paul as SecTres. a lot.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 11:30 | 2532092 Bob
Bob's picture

Window dressing at most, the ideological equivalent of a trophy wife, arm candy. 

What would it say about Dr. Paul's sincerity to allow himself to be used that way?

Realistically, it would have been a Hail Mary at best to get him into the Oval Office (as if he could end our "contract" with the Fed). but serving Rmoney could be little more than vanity for him and a tranquilizer for his supporters. 

Sun, 06/17/2012 - 03:55 | 2533343 monad
monad's picture

It would be like killing the last honest cop, then reanimating him with Delta Corp programming & putting him on the street in Detroit.

That was done already: RoboCop. 2 sequels even. Buckaroo Banzai is better.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:45 | 2531361 El Oregonian
El Oregonian's picture

Wrong bet. We'll see just how principled Dr. Paul turns out to be. That would be the bet.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 12:50 | 2532273 John_Coltrane
John_Coltrane's picture

Ron Paul as treasury secretary would actually get me to back Romney.  I suspect RP could end the FED just by refusing to issue any morre bonds/debt-that's the treasury's job isn't it?  So, no more debt means running the government on cash flow only.  I like it- I like it a lot!  But I'm skeptical that the banking cartel would ever allow anyone they control (like Romney) to put RP in charge of the debt.  Still just getting the recent house passed Ryan budget signed into law would be a step in the right direction regarding spending/entitlement reform-and that can't happen with Obama in charge.  Too bad Romney is such a war monger.

My overall feeling is that expecting any president or party to resolve the problems of the country is naive.  It has to happen from the bottom up-starting with a recognition of the importance of personal responsibility.  However, anything that could lead to more decentralization and smaller government is a step in the right direction.  Too many control freaks running around in Washington.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 21:04 | 2532929 malek
malek's picture

I call bullshit.

Just pathetic attempts to get RP supporters to vote for Romney.
And even if RP became Treasury Secretary und a pres Romney, that single position wouldn't allow him to implement any significant change.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 16:01 | 2532576 Milestones
Milestones's picture

I listened to that broadcast yesterday and look forward to where this thing will go. At least someone is trying.           Milestones 

Sorry for the bold type. My screw-up.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 02:12 | 2531503 HungrySeagull
HungrySeagull's picture

Agreed. Thumbs up for you.

Wife has already said she aint voting for either one. I will go along with that.

Now whom shall we send to the white house?

Beuller? Bueller?... Bueller?

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 08:35 | 2531773 midtowng
midtowng's picture

The best things for mainstream politicians is to get you to vote for them.

A close second would be for you to not vote.

The ONLY thing they don't want is for you to vote for someone else.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 09:36 | 2531884 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

A 1972 movie, for your consideration:

I shall not look for a clip, to avoid offending the delicate sinsibilities of the ZH commentariat. And because I'm too lazy to care.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 11:49 | 2532153 knowless
knowless's picture

spirit of the times..

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 14:17 | 2532420 batterycharged
batterycharged's picture

So is the author a fan of the Muslim Brotherhood or a Mubarik supporter?

Sun, 06/17/2012 - 00:55 | 2533208 Bloodstock
Bloodstock's picture

Two lying bastards is no choice at all.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:23 | 2531216 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

no agenda here!

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:39 | 2531251 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

You did some great posts last night Slewie!  Keep up the good work!

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:27 | 2531338 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

politics is tuff especially when tyler has this asshole 3X/week

but if poeple don't recognize that Voting for the lesser of two evils is still evilis a quote from a richardPryor film,  whacha gonna do?

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:14 | 2531394 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

that's right!  i called jamesMiller an asshole

and, i think he junked me!

and the vonMisis/canada is a den of vipers to put this shit out behind that man's name

i mean it, too!  this shit don't cut it for zH!  too much is enough! 

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:07 | 2531446 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 We all get some time in the "Barrel" Slewie.    I always , take that time to read 90% of your Ideas!

   I'm on the "shitter" the rest of the time! A  good dump is hard earned!   Slewie +1! Aways has been!

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 03:24 | 2531518 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

i'm worried about the site

i've tried to point out before that you can't have a decent poker game unless you agree to two simple rules:

  1. don't discuss religion
  2. don't discuss politics

rPaul ain't happenin, BiCheZ!  let's either give the religious brainiacs equal time with these moronic shitheads or just STFU and deal

i'm acting up;  i'll admit it, ok?  but i won't apologize

let me try this.  listen.   tyler and slewie are almost like brothers: we want to kill each other about half the time

when tyler went for rPaul he did it so tentatively that for 2-3 weeks i was the only one who noticed!  i kept pointing out the implications of him as a publisher going deep here and finally people wanted me to either prove it or STFU so i gave them the links & pastes, proved it, and tyler came out, too;  i outed tyler over rPaul

i was the only one paying close enuf attention to what tyler was saying for 2-3 sundays, there, to understand what tyler was actually doing

true story

so tyler did ok;  but many possibly most of the people he was co-featuring politically and paradigmatically are mittens-heads now, i think

my concern is we'll end up with partisan bitterness about things we have no control over because we have this either/or dichotomy and for zH, i think it is a false dichotomy b/c neither candidate's ideas fits the site;  rPauls did; pretty damned well, too, imo

so let's not self-destruct over MSM politics or even "think-tank" stuff like i quess it would be more polite if i called this dogshit here...

if others do not catch the agendae of the writers?  if rosie comes out for mittens and then starts selling analyses by others smarter than he which just happen to...  call for a political change...  that's what zH is gonna be featuring for the next 5 months?  see ya!

again, i agree that we don't need to be discussing these candidates here "none of the above" is ok for zH imo

but i don't like this guy b/c i think he is an ideologue;  i wouldn't like him if he were a princeton prof or on the CFR either, ok?  i like lewRockwell, too;  sometimes;  but tyler doesn't put lew up

on zH i have spent the last 3 weeks tagging the "reaganites against socialism" clones here;  these peole can't quote maggie thacher often enuf, either

mittens is gonna do zeroHedge like no pols have done zeroHeadge b4

so we have been getting media-messaged quite professionally;  now do you think that the vonMises/Canuck is for or against socialism?  against!  he sez so!  rPaul?  for! 

now he doesn't come out for mittens cause he's in canada, so he says: don't vote!

so i guess people can decide whether that is a mittens-favoring strategy and message or not;  i thought so two essays ago

if tyler isn't gonna come out for mittens or prez0, i don't want to participate in tyler getting played

and i think this is starting to look pretty clearly like a play

so i'm down with trying to give him a heads-up on what i see;  i'll take the shots;  i know how to fight, thank you

and tyler knows if he wants to kick rosie or this guy in the nads i'll back him

now, if we think either/or, where does dCasey fall?  x?  y?  z? 

be very careful with the subtleties of change, hope, and progress;  look what happened the last election!

...and if tyler wants to spend the next 5 months for mittens but in the closet so people won't dislike him i hope he doesn't mind me setting the door on fire a few times every day...

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 14:56 | 2532473 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

nice use of the "alter-ego" meme in Fight Club.

good luck trying to rid this space of "religion and politics" tho' - these are just as important to the constructed persona as porn and sports and gambling.  and this year we're heading to the stadia for playoffs, the trophy cup.

without these things, where would the arguing happen?  as we all know, arguments are where it's AT.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 20:03 | 2532854 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

Sometimes Slewie is a POS, but this last comment is good.

Its interesting that so far it 50-50 on the +'s and -'s

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 21:02 | 2532926 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

i was trying to advise against the partisan stuff here

right now, so much is directed at subliminal triggers such as "reagan"  'socialist'  rPaul   

again, these seem to = vote for mittens

i'm sorry you don't understand c_aura;  it isn't complicated or as psychodynamic as you think imo

but maybe that is just you being you

if you think that arguing endlessly about false dichotomies where no personal control is possible is healthy, knock yerself out

even this moronic shithead above me thinks he is funny calling me names and counting "votes".  talking like a man with a paper asshole with thomJ as an avatar? 

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 21:44 | 2532976 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture

alright slewie - for what it's worth, my "nice use" compliment was sincere, as was my lament that ZH will never be free of the religion & politics "side-taking" as you say.

my agreement with you simply included the most popular memes dropped into one-line posts here, and the subsequent derailing of any interesting discussions that might build. . . in the end, most threads are unreadable bores.

early in this year of 2012, the fur was flying on the voting topic. . . the events of the past week has thrown some water on that raging fire, yet still people are looking for a loophole/alternative reasoning to justify voting. . . old habits die hard.

for clarity, I enjoyed your post, k? 

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:24 | 2531220 Overfed
Overfed's picture

If by moderate you mean 'soft fascist', then yes, they are both moderates.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:28 | 2531228 jomama
jomama's picture

beat me to it.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 20:04 | 2532858 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

They are both authoritartian statists. Is this not so?

What is to be done?

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:39 | 2531252 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

Ha! At first, I only read the headline... thought, meh... fascist, maybe. "Moderate" is such a retarded term in today's political climate. And by retarded I mean retarded. It sets the conversation back by suggesting that there is some sort of position between existing positions that themselves are somehow opposed. This is not what exists currently. Not even close.

The last paragraph of the article is good. Actually the article is pretty good... But moderates they are not.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:01 | 2531293 CommunityStandard
CommunityStandard's picture

I'm writing in Dr. Paul.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 14:00 | 2532399 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

The fact of the matter is --- you are right!

I don't support or agree fundamentally with Dr. Paul, as I believe from his congressional record he has long been anti-worker.

But logically, this election should only and chiefly concern two doctors as candidates:

Dr. Ron Paul on the conservative side,

Dr. Jill Stein on the progressive side.

End of discussion among adults.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 21:06 | 2531401 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

the last para is plagiarized from a 1979 richardPryor film you nit-wit!

true;  900 junks ain't gonna change what this fuking doucebag is up to here!

None of the Abovebrewster'sMillions

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:41 | 2531257 RiverRoad
RiverRoad's picture

Both are falling all over themselves to be the next Fed stooge.  There is no choice.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:12 | 2531315 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

Soft fascist? That's an oxymoron.

I think you might be under-estimating what is coming...

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:45 | 2531423 Overfed
Overfed's picture

You could be right.....

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:44 | 2531484 geekgrrl
geekgrrl's picture

I really hope I'm wrong.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 10:00 | 2531926 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Unfortunately, you are dead right.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 12:21 | 2532227 Husk-Erzulie
Husk-Erzulie's picture

Yep. Paragraph 5, the barbarians are inside the gate.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 06:57 | 2531672 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

Don't you think you slightly over-estimated the last time. 

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:28 | 2531226 glenlloyd
glenlloyd's picture

I would have to say yes...

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 11:19 | 2532056 DosZap
DosZap's picture

To call O a Moderate, is totally insane.................BAD to the bone.

There is nothing moderate about him,or his agenda.

Give HIM four more years and your are dead.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:28 | 2531227 jomama
jomama's picture

moderates?  i consider them both fascists.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 16:14 | 2532600 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

And you are 100%, by-the-book, dictionary-definition CORRECT on that

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:31 | 2531230 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Many people say these two guys dance to the same songwriters.  I kind of disagree.  Here's my take:



"The Fractured Elite: The Only Reason Why We Are Not A Fascist State, Yet"


Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:04 | 2531381 joe6px
joe6px's picture

Simply put, it will be the TYPE of F*cking Fascist State we get.  Stalin or Hitler/Mussolini....pick your poison.

edit: caps TYPE

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:30 | 2531232 Marty Rothbard
Marty Rothbard's picture

Moderately evil?  Moderately evil is still evil.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:30 | 2531235 caimen garou
caimen garou's picture

In the right light they do look like twins!

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:40 | 2531254 AetosAeros
AetosAeros's picture

OH, I get it.


You mean if we close our eyes and judge them based on their actions, their policies, their stated policies, their twice-stated and reneged and restated for a better sound-byte policies, and for being complete ass-hats in the cloakroom of ignrance.

Yep, complete and utter twins. (and that's not being sarcastic, I agree with you)

Now if only there was a third option, one that upheld the Constituition, worked for responsible spending, a true 'defense only' military, less poking in others affairs, held criminal bankers accountable and dumped the Fed..... if only..... a third option.....that got MSM attention like these two Bozos who share the same clown college where would I look for that?

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:46 | 2531266 caimen garou
caimen garou's picture


Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:08 | 2531386 joe6px
joe6px's picture

I would vote for that person...wherever could we find such a candidate with such an agenda?! Hmmm.   Keep stacking.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 01:02 | 2531439 Lucius Corneliu...
Lucius Cornelius Sulla's picture

The MSM is owned by global corporations which are controlled by, well, not people looking out for the best interests of the American people (or just about any people for that matter).  Any moron with an IQ above 80 could figure that one out if they had any inclination to ever think for themselves.  Oh, wait, that would take effort.  Forget about it.  Sheep will be sheep...

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:02 | 2531574 Benjamin Glutton
Benjamin Glutton's picture

Is not the purpose of agreeing on what is "moderate" an excercise in defining what is radical?


"Now if only there was a third option, one that upheld the Constituition, worked for responsible spending, a true 'defense only' military, less poking in others affairs, held criminal bankers accountable and dumped the Fed..... if only..... a third option.....that got MSM attention like these two Bozos who share the same clown college" where would I look for that?

This perfectly sane observation would then be cast as radical.



Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:33 | 2531241 bigwavedave
bigwavedave's picture

There really is nothing to worry about. The (next) President of the USA will surely fix it. He belives that Jesus Christ your Lord physically visited America and will one day return there. Personally, I believe that Jesus Christ has already returned in the form of a Kenyan who speaks fluent Indonesian.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:45 | 2531265 RiverRoad
RiverRoad's picture

Some think he's the Antichrist.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:49 | 2531271 caimen garou
caimen garou's picture

some think he's the great pumkin

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:59 | 2531435 ILikeBoats
ILikeBoats's picture




Sat, 06/16/2012 - 16:15 | 2532602 Milestones
Milestones's picture

O'Blah blah is nothingf more or less than a two bit, third rate street punk. I lived on the south side of Chicago and met dozens of his ilk in all sizes, shapes and colors. Chicago, like many other large cites of the world are full of them.

He is full of himself. A complete turd blossom.                 Milestones

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:10 | 2531313 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture


Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:13 | 2531391 joe6px
joe6px's picture

LOL!  +1

Thanks for that.  I think you you hit it on the head....if, of course, you think Jesus was gay or a Smith.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 08:52 | 2531806 DOT
DOT's picture

Agent Smith.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:35 | 2531243 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

'Moderates'?!?!?!    modern rats maybe......serving their corporate overlords in preserving the ILLUSION that we still have a Republic instead of on oligarchy running a failing empire.


Obama turned out to be Bush III - more executive power, more war, less transparency, less rights, NO accountability for anything while Wall Street and the banks got mopre $$$$ and the ILLUSION of 'more' regulation....     Obama or Romney?  do you really think there would be any real difference in anything that matters?  The economy is shot, not much left to loot before the final collapse.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:04 | 2531677 Rick64
Rick64's picture

  Exactly, even if they didn't have similarities now they will be the same after the election. They will say some things that people want to hear which will be meaningless after the election. The politicians as a whole don't represent the common man and they never have although there have been some exceptions. History supports this if your willing to do the research. 


Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:38 | 2531248 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Why must we be constantly reminded, " Rome is Burning"?

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:46 | 2531269 RiverRoad
RiverRoad's picture

Because of all the fiddling going on.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:04 | 2531300 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

because there ain't a fire hose in sight...just a whole lot of fans and gas canisters.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 23:06 | 2531305 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Arm& Hammer?  baking Soda!

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:41 | 2531255 nah
nah's picture

obama is eloquent bitchez

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:10 | 2531685 Rick64
Rick64's picture

Reagan was handsome and gave the appearance of strength, and Clinton was charming, ect.. Its the ultimate acting gig, but the script is always the same.

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 07:46 | 2531705 The Gooch
The Gooch's picture

Until the tele-prompter malfunctions.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:42 | 2531258 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

Look, if you're gonna vote for evil, then cast your vote for me!

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:15 | 2531398 CaptainObvious
CaptainObvious's picture

Making a note to myself...on voting ballot, write in "Ron Paul, but if he is not available, Pure Evil."

Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:20 | 2531405 joe6px
joe6px's picture

Jamie Dimon already has a job...of sorts..


Sat, 06/16/2012 - 08:51 | 2531803 GMadScientist
GMadScientist's picture

Who's your running mate? "Total Carnage"?

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:42 | 2531259 ankehaton
ankehaton's picture

yeah, if "moderate" means "for sale."

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:42 | 2531260 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

Isn't it all now just a Minstrel Show orchestrated by the banks and mega corporations?

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:46 | 2531268 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

We only need Madonna and Lady Gaga to disrobe to get us reaching for the vomit bags.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:49 | 2531272 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture


Sat, 06/16/2012 - 00:24 | 2531408 CaptainObvious
CaptainObvious's picture

...Aaaaaand now I see where you get your screenname from.  How dare you put a mental image of those two hags disrobing in my head?  Now I hafta go fish some porn out from under the mattress to make it all better.

Fri, 06/15/2012 - 22:55 | 2531263 LongOfTooth
LongOfTooth's picture

Seems like it's one of them yin & yang deals to me.  

One's black and one's white, one's this and one's that, etc., etc., but they're both whores for the new world order puppet masters.


And we're screwed.


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