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Guest Post: How States Can Protect Themselves From Financial Collapse

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by Brandon Smith from Alt-Markets

How States Can Protect Themselves From Financial Collapse

The states of America are, truly, children of the Constitution.  The legal framework that is the foundation of state sovereignty and internal administration is unique for perhaps any country in history up to the moment the U.S. won its independence.  States were designed to decentralize and keep in check the power of a subservient Federal Government.  They were meant to be the guardians at the gate, the barrier to the formation of oligarchy or outright dictatorship.  This, of course, has changed drastically.

The battle over centralized verses decentralized authority and economy has been going on for quite some time, and is undeniably critical in our climate of crisis now, under a government which is bankrupt in every sense and a currency which is on the verge of calamity.

A vast shift in state independence was definitely caused by the reformations of the Civil War, but the progressive erasure of financial sovereignty in the states was really placed on the fast track after the Federal Reserve Act of 1913, when the enforcement of new taxes fueled the establishment machine, including social security (which the government constantly steals from) and the income tax (which does not pay for any state infrastructure), came to life.  Now, the Federal Government could borrow fiat money created at will by the private central bank from thin air, and, it could tax the populace to feed the Federal Reserve in a cannibalistic circle of doom.  This dynamic has grown our government to a size so massive that it is now forced to monetize its own debt just to survive.

Setting aside the inevitable collapse of the dollar and our economic system as we know it, a considerable goal has been achieved by centralists; with so much free money at the disposal of the Feds, they could wipe away the last vestiges of state sovereignty by simply BUYING state compliance.  Through agencies like the EPA, FDA, ATF, etc, 10th Amendment checks and balances are trampled constantly without any regard for local laws or the will of the people, but really, state governments and citizens would be in a far better position to deny such agency intrusions if they didn’t gobble every dollar that D.C. waves in their faces like doggie treats.  In our era of tenuous fiscal sop-gaps and imploding economies, the need for Americans, and especially states, to decouple from the Federal Government and the mainstream system is more important than ever.

The following is a step by step method that states could use to accomplish the task of insulation from financial crisis and federal control.  Much of it hinges on a willingness by state governments to actually pursue independence, which might seem like a naïve dream to most of us.  But, in the wake of a major breakdown, and the fall of the greenback, I believe many states will be seeking a way to weather the storm, if only out of a desire to survive, and this includes walking away from their ties to Washington:

Step 1:  Stop Accepting Federal Funding

For states already drowning in debt, this is probably an incomprehensible idea (there is no financial escape for California or Illinois that I can see), but for those states which have some responsibility, and lower debt levels, federal funding is not necessary.  Much of the money that the Federal Government collects comes through state cooperation.  This money is then handed back to the states through various avenues with strings attached.  The rest of the capital D.C. pumps into states is attained through printing; which carries the high price of dollar devaluation and the hidden tax of inflation.  The fact is, states are not required by law (yet) to accept federal funds.  As long as states do so anyway, they expose themselves to federal influence.  As the dollar goes, so shall all those tied to it.  States should take a lesson from the Asian bloc nations like China or Japan and begin distancing themselves as far away from U.S. currency and debt as possible.  In the long term, those that do will endure.  Those that don’t will be drug under the water along with the sinking ship.

Step 2:  Enforce 10th Amendment Nullification

Once states are no longer beholden to federal monies, they have more leeway to obstruct intrusions by alphabet agencies and to deny dangerous legislative programs (like Obamacare) which put them at financial risk.  Nullification takes many forms, and numerous issues have the potential to become vehicles for the assertion of 10th Amendment rights.  One very fascinating political method was devised by representative Phil Hart of Idaho, who used the power to declare emergencies by states themselves to devise a piece of legislation which would allow Idaho to trump Federal and EPA restriction of the local wolf problem.  As the bill flew through the legislature, interestingly, Congress delisted the wolf as an endangered species.  Obviously, the Federal Government did not want the issue to become a success for 10th Amendment rights, and so defused the situation pulling the EPA back.  Essentially, the Federal Government blinked.

This strategy could be used for multiple state conflicts with the Federal Government to effectively nullify their ability to lord over and interfere with specific needs of the people of a particular region.  The future economic prosperity of the various states will depend greatly on their ability to take decisive fiscal action without constantly having to ask permission from the feds.

Step 3:  Set Up A State Bank

There is certainly some controversy over the idea of a state bank.  In the end, any institution can be twisted for devious ends, and a state bank is no different.  However, this system has worked well in North Dakota, where a state bank has been in operation for over 90 years.   Some from the “left” (whatever that means anymore) often attempt to use the institution as an example of “socialist banking”, which is not exactly accurate, and gives the strategy a bad name.  Yes, the bank is state owned, but its purpose is to invest in and encourage free market enterprise within the state, not create a state owned and operated economy.

A state bank would be especially effective in resource rich areas, where a state government can invest in local projects run by local companies which employ local people.  This is the opposite of what we see so often today, where international corporate entities are given monopoly over resource development within a state.  They siphon away most of the profits and jobs from the region, while the Federal Government thwarts the growth of competing small businesses through concerted taxation and regulation.  This goes on because states often do not feel they have the funding capability to encourage local business efforts.  The problem diminishes drastically with a state bank, if done correctly, honestly, and with oversight from the citizenry.

Step 4:  Resource Development

As mentioned above, resource rich states will have a noticeable advantage in the event of a primary system collapse.  As the dollar continues to tumble and inflation rises, trade methods will eventually revert to raw goods and materials.  This has taken place in nearly every recorded modern economic crisis, and was especially prevalent during Weimar Germany, when debtor nations began refusing the hyperinflated Mark as payment, and demanded natural resources from the Germans instead.  States with heavy resources will be in a perfect position to decouple from the failing establishment and build their own systems (which is probably a main motivation behind Obama’s latest “National Defense Resources Preparedness Executive Order…).

Step 5:  Adopt Alternative Currencies

There is a lot of debate over the “legality” of a state coining its own money, so, I recommend cutting out the debate entirely and merely adopting certain metals, like silver, gold and copper, as recognized methods of payment within the state.  Many state governments are considering measures for alternative currencies, and some, like Utah, have passed bills on precious metals.  The problem is that most of these bills do not go far enough.  At bottom, states are going to have to complete the economic chain by paying OUT precious metals into the system and encouraging businesses to do likewise.  It’s not enough for residents to be allowed to pay IN.

States that rely on the dollar as their only trade mechanism will fail.  States that decentralize currencies by adding other options into the mix will survive.  It’s really that simple.

Step 6:  Encourage Localized Markets

States will only be as healthy economically as their individual communities allow.  Small communities can become independent trade networks on their own, but the right state help and encouragement would make the process move along much faster.  The more self reliant each town and county becomes, the more insulated they become from wide spectrum disaster.  During any national breakdown, redundancy is the key.  It will mean the difference between a total nightmare scenario and large scale tragedy, or a minimal system shock followed by rapid rebuilding.  Barter must be reintroduced to the American lifestyle, and states have the ability to help nurture network growth.  Trade skills and micro-industries can easily be promoted through state programs.

This is the kind of constructive government involvement that is needed; it seeks to open doors and then gets out of the way, rather than closing doors, and grasping for more control.  Unfortunately, policies like this are not possible under the current Federal construct, but they still could be possible within the states.

I would like to point out that in the event that your state government is not receptive to the idea of independent economy, all is not lost.  Each one of the steps above can be accomplished in reverse at the neighborhood, town, and county level.  Over a period of time, and with relentless drive, solid alternative networks will spread, link, and take over a state regardless of what the local government approves of.  The secret is this;

Provide for yourself and others what the mainstream system will not, and eventually, they will either have to conform to your logic, because it works, or, they will have to try and stop you with violence and expose their inherent tyranny, building greater resistance.  In either case, you win.


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Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:33 | 2358436 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture

Best way for the states to protect themselves would be to arrest the bankers and put them in jail, then start printing money backed by precoius metals and actually put it into the base of the pyramid for a change

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:41 | 2358467 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture


Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:59 | 2358536 jez
jez's picture

Didn't a number of states try that in about 1860?


But what the hell, maybe it's time to try it again. Best plan would be for all the states to secede first, and then all the individuals in the states to secede from their state gummints.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:18 | 2358607 economics9698
economics9698's picture

States need to be ready to go it alone because they will have to go it alone.  When the fiat dies so dies the federal government.  Piling up 30% short term federal debt at 0.08% interest is a death sentence for the federal government.  And when the fiat is worthless the bread trucks do not run to the cites.  If the state governments ignore the collapse then they should be violently overthrown and the legislatures hung from the nearest tree until the mother fucking politicians start fucking working for the people again.

When the SHTF the only thing these political thugs understand is violence.  Hang the mother fuckers whenever you get a chance.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:53 | 2358868 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture

States, Counties, Communities, neighborhoods, households - will all have to go it alone. And soon. The problem will be that our brainwashed military will try to exert control. They have billions of gallons of fuel stored in preparation for the event. However, eventually their fuel will run out. They will fail. What is not sustainable will eventually fail. Preppers and homesteaders will do fine. People in cities will be dependant on surrounding farmers for food. The military-banking-complex already owns most of americas farmland, so if you do not own a atleast a small farm, you might want to start looking. Otherwise you will be dependant on others. What would you do to feed yourself and your family? What will you do? Some will try to take advantage of others like in New Orleans. Except this time it's going to happen on a much larger scale. And there will be no one to come to the rescue of those that have not been listening. What are they going to do when the power is permanently shut off and there's no TV to tell them what to do?

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:30 | 2358855 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

Never let a good crisis go to waste works both ways, and I think there are any number of crises heading at us.  Best to wait until the height of a crisis, such as the coming currency crisis, a massive natural disaster, or another one of their useless foreign adventures, which I think will be in the works as soon as things are obviously going in the toilet, in other words, any time now. When their attention is diverted and they are stretched too thin, that is the time to strike out for independence. Kick 'em when they're down. 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:27 | 2359053 Michael
Michael's picture

The USA is getting dangerously close to complete and total economic collapse, as is the rest of the world.

May I suggest we organize local community groups to meet once a week or so to discuss how we, in our local communities, will prepare for the inevitable economic collapse, and come up with viable solutions to get us through the ruff times ahead. The federal government will not address the problem, they only make the outcome worse.  We prepare for civil disasters, it would also be prudent to prepare ourselves for an economic disaster as well.

What's wrong with organizing locally in your own community to prepare for the inevitable? Some Grecians have the right idea.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 18:03 | 2359686 dolly madison
dolly madison's picture

There's nothing wrong with organizing locally.  My husband does talk to several people making plans of how to get firewood to everyone, and to keep the water flowing if need be. 

I have also put up flyers in my community, and I have seen others put up flyers too warning that it could be coming, and to stock up on months of food in order to hopefully make it more doable here.

I don't think it needs to be a weekly meeting yet though. These things take so much time.  It could still be years before it gets bad, or it could be soon.  Where I live is a very small town surrounded by ranch land for at least 120 miles in every direction.  There is a bit less to prepare for here than in heavily populated areas.  More people are closer to self sufficiency here already, but not everyone. 

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 01:28 | 2360385 Michael
Michael's picture

Thanks for the input. I'm just glad a rational discussion is starting on this subject. We may be able to save hundreds of thousands of lives if we get started pretty soon.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 16:39 | 2359499 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

What is needed is for all fifty states to secede from Washington, DC. simultaneously.

The other seven states can be returned to Mexico or sold to China.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:51 | 2358483 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

This is one of the most ignorant articles I have read for quite some time. Here are some lessons for doomer libertarians on the real constitutional powers of the federal government:

1. The Interstate Commerce Clause allows the federal government "To regulate Commerce". Therefore it is the constitutional right of the federal government to regulate ANY business for the good of society. Case Closed.

2. The General Welfare Clause allows the federal government to tax the states and provide welfare to those who need it. This is an open and shut case I'm afraid, so libertarians better get used to it.

Also, "adopting alternative currencies" is an act of OPEN TERRORISM toward our government and Federal Reserve as it undermines our national currency. Bernard Von Nothaus was sentenced to prison for this, after being flagged by the Southern Poverty Law center as a potential counterfeiter.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:53 | 2358508 imbrbing
imbrbing's picture

uhhhh.......regulate Interstate Commerce 

is NOT  a right to "regulate ANY business"



Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:00 | 2358545 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

These businesses are involved in interstate commerce, so it is perfectly legitimate for the Federal Government to regulate them. Let me guess, you're another one of these purist libertarians. You think we can just let every business sell goods and services and hire people AT WILL? We need regulations to make sure consumers are not able to make uninformed choices. Because politicians are more trustworthy and responsible than average, they are more qualified to make choices for businesses and consumers than the people themselves. This is just common sense.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:04 | 2358565 imbrbing
imbrbing's picture

LOL, surely you jest. What are "these businesses". If I want to grow lemons in my back yard, squeeze that into glasses, sell it on the street, the FEDERAL GOVT

doent need to get involved. That is not interstate. If I bottle it up, ship it to florida, the federal govnt can step in to make sure the 2 states play nicelty together

in the transaction.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:07 | 2358573 imbrbing
imbrbing's picture

And if I dont like how the STATE regulates how I sell on my local street corner, I will find a state I do agree with.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 16:50 | 2359525 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

You overlook the fact that the FDA and EPA will intervene anywhere they want, for any or every reason, or for no reason at all beyond some administrator is suffering from PMS.

The ability of businesses to do as they wished ended when the Feds outlawed discrimination based on race and forced some small restaurants to serve blacks. Freedom to conduct business as one wishes may have ended earlier than that, but I remember - fuzzily - the debates over the Civil Rights laws on this issue.

Apparently the word 'regulate' now includes 'coerce' as a subsidiary meaning, and 'interstate' means 'any where, any time'.

For a better understanding of where the US is headed, listen to this song from around 1967:

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:19 | 2358585 Chump
Chump's picture

Stop replying to your replies.  You invariably fall off the script and it's clear that your primary weakness is when you ad lib.  Also, stop saying that politicians are more trustworthy and responsible than the average person.  Not even the people you're parodying believe that.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:18 | 2358609 tarpuranus
tarpuranus's picture

You are joking, right? Sometimes I almost believe that you believe what you are saying.

Must me me, misinterpreting your comment

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:27 | 2358632 Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

Because politicians are more trustworthy and responsible than average...


Good one!  I actually, literally LOL'd at that.  You're in fine form today MDB!

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:03 | 2358747 bank guy in Brussels
bank guy in Brussels's picture

It's quite something that even after so many posts with fake views pretending to support the US empire, MDB still manages to scoop up several more people who don't get the sarcasm, nearly every time he posts.

Though I think MDB made it harder when he recently changed his avatar photo. I preferred the earlier brighter one. But maybe MDB changed the image to help fool people a bit better.

Kudos to Tyler for keeping MDB on here, giving all the laughter, despite the majority of down arrows from those who haven't yet caught on to the game.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:19 | 2359021 XitSam
XitSam's picture

Who are you really? Someone from the Mises Institute? Tom Woods? Even dyed in the wool Keynsians like Krugman wouldn't make these arguments. Robert Murphy? It's not even nuanced anymore. C'mon, you can tell me, I can keep a secret.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:19 | 2359229 nicxios
nicxios's picture

Now this is some mighty fine trolling! 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:22 | 2359241 Golden Showers
Golden Showers's picture

Um, mdb, do you realize that every time you limp dick onto this board that:

Your weak sellout bait further consolidates and strengthens the resolve and solidarity of those with balls enough to post their thoughts on why you suck?

Also, when I do read your posts, it puts me into a position where I have to check reality. Thank you for that. For every post of yours I do a gut check. Then I check out the news of the day. After that I drill down into fundamentals. You provide me with ample questions to consider. For that I welcome your comments. However, I find, consistently, that you offer nothing to further the conversation to these threads on this board. Rather, it appears to me that you seek to derail the thread because your pussy hurts. I am sorry that your pussy hurts, sir. Perhaps you may find that you are simply doing it wrong and you would indeed find that your comments would be welcome somewhere else on another board, for example. Maybe on the IMDB Titanic Message Board. I don't know. But here, you seem to want (today) to offer a politicized view of libertarians. This is well and good and more power to you. However, you cannot make any and all of these postings into a debate on libertarian "ideals" as you so endeavor to do in your second post on this thread.

I concur that you are indeed putting your cart before the horse your mother rode in on. Look: it's not my fault. It's just that you continue to shake the fig tree.

Now, it's no skin off my nose, but I think that perhaps there are more than (n)one of you. And I wouldn't put it past the Tylers to create a little fun by posting as a troll, douche nozzle, just to check the pulse on their wonderful news outlet.

But you know what? I doubt it. "Hen" is too busy to stop kicking ass researching and typing to stop and jerk me off. I must then conclude that you, mdb, are simply either a sick loser with nothing better to do than entertain yourself with baiting this board, or that you are a species of skynet with an agenda to spider web suckers for your amusement.

But look: honestly, dude, you are actually not scaring anyone and you are proving yourself wrong by consolidating "our" research, gut-checks, and togetherness against your own. Ultimately, you are, on this board, nothing but a grab-ass fig-shaker. And I have to ask "Why"? What is it about you(s) that desires and wants derision? What kind of person are you who wants to get your ass handed to you daily?

Wouldn't you just feel better if you killed yourself? Listen: In your city there is sure to be a toll-free number that you can phone where people will understand your confusion and uncertainty. Hell, we all face it. Let me reach out to you here, you are a good person. You really are a benefit to each and every person who reads the comments. But, look, dude. You're taking the hard road. And you must be getting something out of this that is more important than being made the butt of every joke on here. Is it money? A job for you to check in? Why don't you tell us? It's ok. You are welcome here (if I am).

Otherwise, don't not exepect to NOT get your card pulled, you weak piece of shit. Think of it as a gift that I am writing to you now, you sack. Because I might be a lot of things including a "private person", but I ain't, at the end of the day, confused.

Keep writing, baby!



PS: Keep on Fight!

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:58 | 2358538 GCT
GCT's picture

But MDB the states can convene a constitutional convention consisting of 38 states and tell the fed to bite off and guess what!  Nothing the Fed can do, nor can the supreme court, or congress.  I know you will not take this well and that is ok. One must read the whole constitution to understand this. Counterfeiting is one thing notice how Arizona is now using gold and silver as well as FRN.

Dam terrorists. 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:05 | 2358566 gaoptimize
gaoptimize's picture

You really are the mouthpiece of the enemies of liberty here, aren't you MDB?  I really don't know how you can live with yourself knowing the scale of the corruption you are defending.    You only hasten and maginify the collapse by preventing even the smallest adaptations and defenses against it by individuals and groups.  The next couple of years will be very painful for you to observe and reconcile with your ideology.  I recommend you do some soul searching and reform yourself.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:33 | 2358654 smb12321
smb12321's picture

MillionDollar - my beef with your policies is that they've been tried (repeatedly) and the result is an increasingly authoritarian state and financial ruin in the guise of "helping people."   The idea that a central government is supreme in all things contradicts both the spirit and letter of the Constitution.   The Founders's greatest fear was not war, currency, succession or foreign powers.  It was stifling the power of the State vs the individuals AND the states.  

Federal and state governments are entirely different creatures and much of our troubles stem from the Feds trying to act like states.  

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:46 | 2358693 knightowl77
knightowl77's picture

MDB the only case that is closed is that you are flat out completely wrong....

Neither of those clauses say what you say they do...Nor is that what the framers intended as you can tell from the Federalist papers....The entire reason for the Constitution in the first place was to LIMIT the Feds and keep power in the states and with the people...It is exactly your liberal socialist interpretation that has allowed this country to get so far out of whack....You and Nancy Pelosi should be ashamed of yourselves...

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:04 | 2358748 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture

Yum, yum this poodle is deeeelish.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 17:57 | 2359680 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

Enjoying the high life I see!

Just cat food for us proles :D

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:20 | 2359026 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture



MDB's comment eliminates any dobut he's a full-fledged communist advocating total communism in America.

In the 1950s MDB would have been arrested and tried for treason, but today his views would be praised by the government.

And by the way, according to MDB the president and everyone in congess should have been arrested and tried for treason back in 1913 for adopting an alternative currency, federal reserve notes, in place of US dollars issued by the government.

As for his other points, any communist can take portions of the constitution out of context and twist them to fit their communist thinking.  

Interstate commerce is regulating commerce between states, not commerce within a state.  The constitution gives no authority to the federal government to interfere with commerce within a state.

The general welfare clause says promote, not control, and certainly not steal wealth from all the people and give it to specific people.  There is no authority in the constitution for tax-funded welfare programs.  Zero.  None. 

And while we're at it, there's no authority in the constitution for a national income tax, not even the 16th amemdment.  The 16the amendment gives the federal government authority to tax incomes of Washington DC residents and residents of other federal territories, not residents of the 50 states.

Of course MDB doesn't know any of this constitutional background.  He's just a clueless communist twisting the constitution out of context.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:37 | 2359080 Michael
Michael's picture

Southern Poverty Law center

Southern Poverty Scum center,

there, fixed it for ya.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 17:56 | 2359675 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

NOT seeking a better currency and printing US dollars as Bernanke has done is open terrorism against ALL people especially the jobless and the elderly.

Interstate commerce clause doesn't apply to any business if there's no interstate commerce for that business.


Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:33 | 2358437 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

Dont tell JPM/GS...............

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:34 | 2358441 Buzzworthy
Buzzworthy's picture

Very interesting and thought provoking, Mr. Smith.  One correction, however, the Constitution is the child of the States, not the other way around.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:44 | 2358482 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture


What's funny is the rest of the paragraph makes that perfectly clear.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:46 | 2358488 Rossalgondamer
Rossalgondamer's picture


Thanks for that!

A 1001 times they utter the Sun is small and close-by - yet still not true.



Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:35 | 2358444 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

Step 1 : stop looting the population like this lady :

The comptroller of Dixon was arrested and charged Tuesday for allegedly stealing more than $30 million in city funds since 2006 to furnish her lavish lifestyle, which included a horse farm, seven tractor-trailer trucks and a $2.1 motor home, according to a federal complaint.
Since last fall, it is believed that Crundwell embezzled more than $3.2 million, the complaint said. She used only $74,274 of the funds for city operations. The rest was used for her own expenses, including approximately $450,000 for her horse farm, $600,000 in online credit card payments, and $67,000 to by a 2012 Chevy Silverado pickup truck.

Step 2 : enforce the goddamn laws... like Louisiana has been starting doing :

Step 3 : tell the feds to stick any unconstitutional crap they try to make the states pay for where the sun don't shine.

Step 4 : promote alternative currencies like gold/silver back currencies.

Step 5 : enforce the goddamn mortgage laws! No note : mortgage forgiven!

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:54 | 2358520 dracos_ghost
dracos_ghost's picture

A $2.1 motor home? I was a photo right.

Where the f$%^ were the auditors.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:49 | 2359049 Swarmee
Swarmee's picture

Regarding your step 1 I have been mulling over a potential change to how charges are filed against those who embezzle tax funds. It goes something like this, given that the funds come from all taxpaying citizens of the State, and that those funds are intended to provide various services to the citizens of the state, then when one steals taxpayer funds they are not committing a single crime, but rather multiple crimes, in direct proportion to the number of citizens affected. Thus the woman in your example should be charged with the top level crime (grand larceny?) as well as a number of smaller theft charges equal to the number of citizens affected. There is an argument to be made as to whether you count the tax payers or the tax beneficiaries, but either way the number will be quite large. Further such a law should also stipulate that being found guilty of one count translates to gilty on all counts. So in your example if Crundwell were found guilty then she would face penalties for one count of grand larceny, and e.g. 200,000 counts of petty theft for stealing the equivalent of $16 from 200,000 people. That way the penalties stack and become effective life sentences every time you steal from taxpayers. If those who commit fraud and abuse against the legitimate tax payers of the nation were faced with the near guarantee of a life sentence if found guilty then perhaps it would actually dissuade the crime more effectively.

Just a thought experiment but I'd be interested in hearing other's thoughts on why this may or may not work, if it has been tried, or what the greater ramifications might be.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:34 | 2358449 overhere2000
overhere2000's picture

Need to add nullifying or greatly reducing onerous and burdensome federally mandated Intellectual Labor agreements (copyright/patent cartels). 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:35 | 2358453 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

All good stuff but none of this will happen until the dollar gets wiped out. As long as the dollar is around states and lobbyists will have their hand out.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:40 | 2358461 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture



I guess, 1 or is it 2 years after.. how many states.. push to be a lil more independent...

it is safe to sound off on the issue..

I love traders.. until there is a multiyear trend line there is NOTHING! LOL!!

It comes from having to pitch to people who want PROOF.. and if you don’t have PROOF you don’t have a deal.

You can always tell the good help from the bad help by the way they live their life away from trading because it all bleeds over!


How are those multi-year trend lines working out for you?

Let me guess..

Down?? 3% 2% and change is what I was really thinking but I rounded…

Wait! Now is when the trader(s) step in with a chart of a lone wolf account that they manage for someone else.. who provides explicit direction for the account.. that they (the traders have NO say what so ever in).. but they show the prize winner! Like it is their own.. and push the sales line that!! If you could trust them! To do what they want!! Verse what the market is saying.. that YOU TO COULD BE A WINNER! LOL!!

And no matter which chop shop you go too! It’s the same!

The reason the larger shops do better! Is because they can lose the sale with one scumbag and then sick another scumbag on you with some winning numbers… in things you like!

And the sale of potential client information!

Any way!

That’s my rant on the 2 and 20 crowd! LOL I can remember when it was 10 and 50%!! LOL!!



I can make any chart say anything I want..

the question is what do you want it to say?? onc eI know that.. I can make you happy! and thusly Gamble with YOUR MONEY! LOL!!

Disclosure.. I am nor have I ever been a sales man or trader in the since that the above are!

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:48 | 2358490 Pure Evil
Pure Evil's picture

The best thing for the states would be to succeed from D.C. now, why wait for Federal collapse.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:08 | 2358758 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture


Your car's black box has just reported this posting to #AttackWatch


Please continue on your way (for now)

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:47 | 2358491 Stuck on Zero
Stuck on Zero's picture

Parable of the Sewer Pipe


Our glorious little city needed to put in a new sewer line.  The cost was estimated at $1M.  The funds were available from sewer/water fees and so a request for bids was let out.  Suddenly someone spotted a notice for a Federal government grant that would cover the cost.  So far so good.  The city made inquiries and started the long process of securing the Federal grant.  There were lots and lots of forms to fill out, certifications, requirements to fulfill etc. etc. etc.  A preliminary acceptance was granted but there was more paperwork to do.  Several people were hired to work out the details.  It took several years to secure the funding.  Meanwhile clogs, backups and emergency repairs were adding to the costs.  Finally, the money came ... but with lengthy requirements.  Depth, diameter, size, materials, cover, trenching, safety, unions, minority hiring, inspections, ad nauseum.  Eventually a request for bids was let out.  The lowest bid exceeded $11M and there were only two bids.  All the local contractors did not want to deal with the issues.  The sewer was finally replaced with the Federal government picking up half the tab.  Total cost to the city was over $7M. 



Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:07 | 2358571 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

So... it's a win-win then, right?

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:44 | 2358681 putaipan
putaipan's picture

.... financial prolapse.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:00 | 2359177 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

That's one way to ruin a good sewer, put the gov't and politicians into it...

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:50 | 2358495 l1b3rty
l1b3rty's picture

There is no reason these states cannot just start issuing their own currencies...except the gravity of tyranny... 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:49 | 2358496 l1b3rty
l1b3rty's picture

There is no reason these states cannot just start issuing their own currencies...except the gravity of tyranny... 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:52 | 2358505 gaoptimize
gaoptimize's picture

A serious effort by a state to pursue the 6 steps described above would cause me to seriously consider moving my family and assetts to their jurisdiction.  Texas, Arizona, Utah, Idaho, Virginia...I'm watching.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:00 | 2358543 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Any state west of the plains (Utah, Idaho...) would be going from the frying pan into the fire. Uncle Sugar "owns" it all.

North Dakota seems to be the best, but with all of the fracking, who knows what you'll end up drinking with your water. Though maybe you can heat your home with it?

16M hits on the google!

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:52 | 2358513 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

The author acts like states other than Cali and Illinois actually have a choice, when the reality is, they're mostly all well indebted to Uncle Sugar for UE benefits that they have no money to pay, as they've all exhausted their funds over the past few years. Just the threat of making interest payments has been sufficient to keep them in line, let alone paying on the principal (which will never happen).

This is one of the primary reasons why the state attorneys general are in cahoots to cover-up the MERS fraud, even though it is costing their states revenue from filing fees (not to mention that it has clouded damn near every title in the last ten years).

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:54 | 2358514 BlueCollaredOne
BlueCollaredOne's picture

When states start doing this is when the FEMA camps will begin to get filled.  Bernard von NotHaus is a good example of what happens when you actually take initiative to fight the system. 

Playground time in these camps would be great.  Can you imagine some of the great ideas that would be presented?  It would be the equivalent of how the founders met to discuss their idea of a new utopian society in the back room of bars.  The only difference would be no booze, the daily torturings, the daily rationing of pink slime, and the endless slew of experimental pharmaceuticals that would be shoved down our throats. 

Yes, Im a pessimist.


Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:28 | 2359061 XitSam
XitSam's picture

I thought you were being optimistic. I'm a pessimist.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:53 | 2358518 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

Oh Bullshit, fucking all talk. Look what is taking place in Michigan to the family farmer. No one is doing shit, period!!!

This story has been posted on Zero Hedge many times in thread's, this should be a head liner, hasn't got any attention in the MSM either.

EPA tried banning lead in bullet's on Tuesday, good thing the house struck it down. Attack's are real with very little support for the people.

Read the story below with you tube video and there website on making them kill there hog's or there felon's. What a total outrage!! 


"Our friend Kyle made another video regarding what is happening here in Northern Michigan.  His first video had over 70,000 views.  Thank you Kyle for spreading the word and sharing with the world what the government in Michigan is doing.  Every farmer, gardener, 4H student, agriculturalist, biologist, naturalist, ecologist and red blooded American should be shocked at how the Michigan DNR and Republican Governor Rick Snyder are attempting to shut down every family farm in Michigan, one at a time. If you grow your own food or if you enjoy locally grown food, now is the time to get involved. Please help the Bakers help the rest of us here in Michigan. 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:00 | 2358733 hardcleareye
hardcleareye's picture

Interesting link,  I have shot many (at least 3 a month sometimes more)  wild pigs on my property in central Florida, they really trash the land.   I have shot what looks like Russian Boars to the "brown and pink" (good eaten') spotted "domestic" pigs. My poor husband has been awaken more than once by me leaning against the kitchen door taken a shot at a pig in the field..... great sport (both killing the pig and waking the husband)!

Who are they trying to kid, a domesticated pig will do as much damage as a "old world" pig if left to fend for themselves.  I carry a loaded 30-30 in my car (a 9mm pistol, which I carry in my purse) just doesn't cut it with these critters... they just squeal and keep on running unless you get a clean head shot).  I have to open my farm gate to get out and have encountered several long tusked male boars who didn't run away from me....  they didn't do that twice!   It is damn near impossible to keep a fence up that they will not find a way under (or over...).

I know Mich needs to call a state of emergency because the wild pigs pose a threat to humans due to the possibility of infecting the humans with tape worms... <sarc, see Idaho EPA wolf issue>  Hmmm now there's  a thought. I wonder if  a timber wolf will take a feral pig down!  <sarc>

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:42 | 2358883 10mm
10mm's picture

Get rid of that 9,get yourself a 10mm.problem solved.Uncle Teds favorite on hogs/boar etc.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:44 | 2358888 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

What a troll!!! If you Need a lesson on pig hunting just come to east Texas and Northern LA. I shoot the fuck out of them of my ranches to, we actually raise cattle, not gentleman farm lol. 

This is a total outrage that should piss off anyone, especially farmer's/rancher's!! There trying to numb everyone into thinking it is wild pig's. There not. 

If you would stop blabbing and go watch the video, there not wild pig's. There pig's that these farmer's raise in fenced barn yard's troll. Wake up, it is another power grab. Idiot.

Coming to a farm/ranch near you, shoot your livestock or you are a felon!!




Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:06 | 2358959 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture

Well, if you want REAL hog hunting, come to central CA along the coast....we had some clown in Monterey decades ago bring in wild boars from Europe and turn them loose....we now have a breed of them here that is big and fearless.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:17 | 2359018 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture



Wild boar are awesome animals to hunt. They’re dangerous, alert, smart, vicious and challenging.  They have an attitude and can run both fast and far when threatened.  Without warning, they may quickly and easily turn and charge an unsuspecting challenger and it’s a tragic mistake to underestimate their instinct to survive.  Awkward in appearance, they are deceiving. Brawny, with well built legs, massive chests and shielded shoulders that cover powerful muscles, they  bound effortlessly up and down the steep, rugged terrain of their chosen habitat.

Wild pigs are not native to California.  The animals we hunt are a result of imports brought to this country by and for farmers prior to the 1900’s. Released to feed upon the abundant forage available, much of the domestic population became undomesticated or “feral”.  Domestic stock that escaped or wandered from farms and ranches mingled freely with imported dark-haired European and Russian pigs of both feral and domestic stocks. This created the hearty strain of pigs we now hunt as wild boar in a wide variety of color combinations, from tan to solid black.

Most of California’s mature pig population is between 100-150 pounds, but they are available in excess of 300 pounds and are documented over 500 pounds. Trophyhunters search for the larger,darker European boar with fearsome tusks in the two to four inch range and longer,but meat hunters find that sows and smaller pigs make much better table fare.  Shooting an animal from 75 to 150 pounds is the goal of most hunters as they yield from 25-50 pounds of high quality great tasting hams, chops, bacon and sausage. 

Without question, the Golden State’s top opportunity for big game is pig hunting.
The hunting of wild boar has become extremely popular in California and is steadily on the rise, and it’s no wonder.  Open year-round and with no daily possession or seasonal bag limit, boar hunters see game more often and have an opportunity to shoot with greater frequency. 

When acorns begin to drop in the fall, wild pigs go on the “root”, ripping up the ground like a cheap rototiller, foraging acorns and building up fat reserves for the upcoming winter. By spring they feed on new growth grasses and roots. As summer arrives many natural water sources begin to dry up and pigs are forced to move around more, and that’s when odds of success increase.   

Water is the key to locating wild boar. It is the single most important geological feature to keep in mind when pursuing these animals.  A boar will normally water twice a day, once in the morning and once in the evening.  It’s quite common for a boar to eat, drink and then wallow in the mud before heading to bed.  When wild pigs find areas with adequate water supplies, food and cover, they want to stay until conditions change. 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:08 | 2359085 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

I bought a long legged Jack Russel near Chico CA. from some hog hunter's that raised them back in the 90's. Amazing dog for sure, I never did hunt there but they told me there are some nice one's. Texas and LA. have some monster's also.

The point of my post was what the DNR is doing to farmer's in Michigan, it is just un-real. I thought it was all hog wash so to speak when I first found this post the other night by slewie. After research and contacting Michigan, it's not. There making them farmer's kill those hog's in there pen's or there a felon.  

.gov and big business is doing all they can do so local communities are not self sustaining. MFer's have gone way to far. I turned the other cheek on NAFTA in Oregon logging when that BS rule crippled the pacific northwest. Not again.


Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:31 | 2359066 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

I'm in East TX, too....we shoot 'em as often as possible!  You can never shoot too many....kill the smaller ones and you have some pretty tasty eating!

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 11:58 | 2358541 Dr. Crime
Dr. Crime's picture

I agree with Milllion Dollar Bonus. This is just stupid. "The inevitable collapse of the dollar" and "alternative currencies". This bullshit continues to be tried by "freemen" as a way of getting out of paying bills and conning others into their ponzi schemes. But more importantly, this country went through something like this about 150 years ago with some pretty serious consequences. Spewing this crap now does not do anybody any good.

Just because you have some guns in the basement and you have your wife and knucklehead nephew nodding along with you doesn't make you a prophet or right.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:03 | 2358558 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

How can you agree with someone who doesn't even post their own opinion?

Damn you Poe's Law! *shakes fist at cloud*

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:42 | 2359295 Spacemoose
Spacemoose's picture

i hate to break it to you but MDB posts to illustrate the absurdity of the argument being advanced in the post, not as support for the content of the post.  hang around a while, you'll see.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:01 | 2358548 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

Goood suggestions.  However he forget the biggest one:

"Grow some balls"

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:03 | 2358554 xela2200
xela2200's picture

Here in Florida the governor took a lot of flack because He refused government money for a speed train. Basically, people want government to stop spending money as long as it isn't the one coming to them.  Any governor refusing FREE money from the government will probably be a one term governor. Just like any president that tries to cut the spending (Carter, Bush Sr.) won't get re-elected. That is lesson not lost on politicians. They cannot stop the gravy train. That is why Ron Paul will not get elected, and the FED will have to monetize the debt.

People get the government that they deserve.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:05 | 2358568 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Which is why I'm a proponent of self-government, as it's the only coherent version. The rest are nothing but armed criminals, incoherently pretending to do good, all while plundering the populace.

And it will NEVER change (because that's how incoherency works).

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:33 | 2358656 DosZap
DosZap's picture

Here in Florida the governor took a lot of flack because He refused government money for a speed train. Basically, people want government to stop spending money as long as it isn't the one coming to them.

What I cant figure out is that the dumb SOB's are caving to the knee of Tryranny, for their OWN money coming back,gift from the Fed? arse, it is the states $$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:14 | 2358596 hardcleareye
hardcleareye's picture

Let see, Idaho wants to issue a state of emergency because of the health risk of tape worms found in wolves?

Setting aside the state's right issues, using this as an excuse to challenge the feds is really lame.. and seriously hurts their creditability.



Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:20 | 2358611 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

the system in Utah for ACCEPTING PM's as money is just another Cash for gold ruse. Until ALL the bad money is dead this will never work. Iduviduals pay in PM's at grossly undervalued rate of excange. Nobody should even consider this untill the whole country does it and the government gives out PM based currency to get the whole thing going. Why use good money when the confetti is still flying? 

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:27 | 2358633 1000yrdstare
1000yrdstare's picture

The states are whores, think smaller, like your county, create a microsystem for your community, then you will personally know your representatives, and your vote will truly count, it may eventually come down to that anyway...

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:28 | 2358635 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

Light up.  We just passed through 13000.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 12:54 | 2358717 tahoebumsmith
tahoebumsmith's picture

I have been preaching the 10th ever since Obama introduced his stimulus plan which lured more States into the control of the FED by giving them handouts and making them more reliant on these handouts. I say we need more Jan Brewers in this Country, a women that has pretty much told the Government to go fuck themselves...My guess is Texas will be the first to go and when this happens, it will be like Dominos. Nice to see this topic being discussed here. The United States will become un United before this is all over, Count on it...


Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:00 | 2358731 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

invite a neighbor to dinner at least once a week... best investment you can make in this evironment

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:14 | 2358786 rish
rish's picture


Retaking of State sovereignty has supposedly already been accomplished.  Why doesn't zerohedge talk about it??

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:33 | 2358919 Money 4 Nothing
Money 4 Nothing's picture

Bullshit, the Job's Bill that just passed and was signed into law trumps state Soverignity, your being lied to. Read the link above.

click here for proof the Bill passed.

Click link for proof Bill was signed. 

Overwhelmingly Bi Partisan, you know what that means? Both Repub and DemocRATS equally fucked every citizen of the United States over by passing this Bill.

I told everyone these Represenatives do not Represent you, proof that both houses do not work for the citizens of the USA, Now, I told you so. You should have figured that out with the passage of the NDAA. They all voted aginst you.

Vote with your feet and your God given inalienable rights or live on your knees.

Obama’s tax and spend “jobs” bill is a stealth move to end state sovereignty and transform what made our nation the greatest country the world has ever known. If Obama’s bill passes, kiss freedom goodbye and say hello to tyranny.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 16:17 | 2359415 theTribster
theTribster's picture

Already here, tyranny that is! Europe too, in fact they exported it. Obama is the closer, he will implement the final phase of the transformation to a, you guessed it, a New World Order. We've lost the war, everything is in place to handle whatever the public does and however it reacts - including but not limited to martial law. How will it feel in America when we see tanks and troops on our streets?

So many things are already dead including countries, counties, states, regions, you name it - walking zombies! The gubmint last gasp for life will be to privatise our retirement funds, this is coming soon after the European crash...

The political class is completely corrupt, everywhere and regardless of the underlying system. Corporation rule the day, money and power is theirs - all the politicans can do is suck their .....

Disgusting it is, the politicians and corporatcrats need to pay for what they've destroyed! They are all fundamentally treasoness in their actions, when your global you have to be at some point (at many points). I hate where the world is, such a shame when you consider where it could be!

All about the politics, all about the power, all about the money! Period, nothing else matters. Corporate anonymity allows this to happen and capitalism reinforces the decisions - that and a fundamental belief in Darwinism superseding all laws including natural law. In some and maybe most cases it is subconscious but its there as a means of justification - subtle though it may be.

But I ramble :) Tyranny it is, let's all have some shall we? You know, everybody's doin' it...

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:53 | 2358917 Money 4 Nothing
Money 4 Nothing's picture

All states will soon lose their Soverignity. Total Fed control.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 13:56 | 2358925 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

The "reformations" of the Civil War?  LOL, the "victory" by the North guaranteed the eventual destruction of their own populace.

On the plus side, Sherman has now been repaid with Bernanke and the descendants of Lincolns army along with all his worshippers will be ground into bone meal through the same power of the centralized state they fought for.

Excellent song from the Long Riders written long ago yet still applicable...

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 14:12 | 2358994 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

"The states of America are, truly, children of the Constitution....  States were designed to decentralize and keep in check the power of a subservient Federal Government. "

You need to go back to school. The States pre-dated the Federal Government, and the Federal Government is a child of the States ... or at least it was. Seems more and more like a Frankenstinian creation that is slowly killing its creator.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 17:20 | 2359607 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

It was not entirely unheard of for princes/sons to kill their kings/fathers. This is just a modern, updated version of the same old story.

Thu, 04/19/2012 - 19:46 | 2359873 MeelionDollerBogus
Thu, 04/19/2012 - 15:24 | 2359244 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

my dogs has Fleas!! they came from Canada!! its and emergency..

just to be clear..

You live in the Woods?

You live in the Middle of No Where! and you are PISSED that Nature is ALL! Around?

If YOU! dont like Nature! then Move to the City Stupid!


my response on YouTube was above and..

I hope those Wolves eat all? of you ignorant wall mart shoppers! maybe it will get rid of enough of you Planet Kolob freaks that i wont have to worry about you freaks any more!



These are the idiots that think Bush did a Good Job!

and that Cheney was a GREAT! American!!

Halliburton charged with selling nuclear technology to Iran


The Stupid Majority in America keeps these bottom feeders in Power!


Thu, 04/19/2012 - 19:42 | 2359870 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

so... pretty much, if you google search for "milliondollarbonus" you can be fairly assured of the best articles to share around with people. Not the MDB comment of course but if the rating is a very sharp negative vote count, or in plain language shows severe retardation, that might even be a heuristic for the articles to share first.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!