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Guest Post: Regardless Of What The Propaganda Says, This Is Not How A Free Society Treats People

Tyler Durden's picture


Submitted by Simon Black of Sovereign Man

Regardless Of What The Propaganda Says, This Is Not How A Free Society Treats People

I’ve been in the US for a little more than 24-hours. And having flipped through the TV channels trying to figure out what useless drivel big media is passing off as ‘news’, I realized that I’m going to vomit if I hear the word “fair” one more time.

This concept of ‘fair’ seems to be dominating discussion of the US government’s dismal fiscal condition. The talking heads say that it’s ‘fair’ for wealthy Americans to pay higher taxes and bail the country out… or that everyone needs to pay his/her ‘fair’ share.

The whole logic is absurd: you do not ‘fix’ the country’s fiscal imbalances by giving the idiots in charge even more resources to squander… it’s like dumping gasoline on a forest fire. Somehow the debate seems to have missed this point.

This ‘fair’ nonsense is also very dangerous.  Just ask any three-year old– ‘fair’ is completely arbitrary. It’s like a Wiki version morality… if enough people agree on it, it’s fair.

In this case, ‘fair’ is defined in the sole discretion of those who are the direct beneficiaries of confiscating other people’s money. But let’s look at the numbers:

According to the IRS statistical database, the top 1% of income earners in the United States pays roughly 40% of all US individual income tax. They also get audited at least 5-times more than anyone else. Fair?

The other major complaint seems to be that the wealthy are ‘abusing’ capital gains rules in order to pay a 15% rate instead of a 35% rate. Duh. That’s why they’re wealthy, and stay wealthy… they don’t WORK for a living, they OWN assets which are subject to capital gains.

It seems so bizarre that a country once regarded as the freest, most economically enviable in the world would treat its productive citizens with such hostility.

This is where Eduardo Saverin comes in. The Facebook co-founder, who finds himself a few billion dollars richer this week, recently renounced his US citizenship. And, to the intelligentsia, it’s not ‘fair’.

‘Saverin needs to pay his fair share! He owes America more,’ they whine, completely ignorant that the 30-year old is already forking over a $500+ million exit tax (which may end up in the billions).

Apparently it’s not good enough that the company Saverin co-founded has created tens of thousands of jobs, spawned entire industries, and produced oodles of new millionaires. Oh yeah, it’s also made things damn easy for the CIA, NSA, and FBI. You’d think Uncle Sam would pin a medal on his chest.

But no. Saverin left behind a lot of value and decided to move on to greener pastures in Singapore. Now the do-gooders in Congress are cooking up new legislation (the EX-PATRIOT Act) designed to permanently bar ‘renunciants’ like Saverin from re-entering the United States.

It’s interesting that, rather than change their ways of doing business and introducing legislation that provides incentives for productive people to come here and stay here, they maintain policies that chase people away, and introduce new ones to lock the door after they’re gone.

The lesson here (especially for natural-born citizens) is this: simply by accident of birth, you are born with a lifelong obligation that you never signed up for to finance the corrupt misdealings of the political class. And if you choose to abandon this obligation, they will bar you from ever entering your homeland again.

Regardless of what the propaganda says, this is not how a free society treats people. It might look and feel like a representative democracy on the surface, but under the hood it’s the modern day equivalent of feudal serfdom.

The land of the free has certainly fallen a long way


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Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:38 | 2436569 redpill
redpill's picture

And people laughed at Ron Paul when he said he was more concerned with border fences being used to keep us IN.


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:40 | 2436587 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

America = Dead Man Walking!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:43 | 2436600 BigMike
BigMike's picture

It is on life support -- one more chance in November. Ron Paul!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:52 | 2436653 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Ogolfer's 2012 election campaign slogan:

From each, according to his abilities. To each, according to his needs.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:32 | 2436863 Convolved Man
Convolved Man's picture

Hmmm,  where did I that phrase before...?

Oh, Yeah.  On the other side of that big f*cking wall in Berlin.

I guess we can think of this piece of legislation as more barbed wire on top of the virtual border fence.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:11 | 2437033 porrannor
porrannor's picture

"According to the IRS statistical database, the top 1% of income earners in the United States pays roughly 40% of all US individual income tax..."

This is yet another dumb statement... The way it is working out the so called 1% will be paying a 100% of taxes since the rest of us will join the growing destitute part of the poluplation.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 20:32 | 2437948 Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

So, shouldn't the destiny of the country be defined by those who pay the taxes?

Let's look at this. Surely, if Joe sixpack who pays no tax and relies on handouts should have no vote, and Severin and his 1% ilk should have 40% of the votes, do you not agree, that the US would become a true capitalist society in which those with capital would thrive, and those that provided the labour would enjoy a good living? Or do you think those with capital should be coerced into staying by a govt hell bent on taking that capital and giving it to someone else, (either someone who does no work or a bank) on pain of losing his birth right ever to return?

or do you think that the workers should have all the benfits (since they are the ones doing the labour), and that those that take the investment risk should be entitled to 'a little bit off the top' in fair compensation?

Let's face it, democracy hasn't worked, anywhere, has it?

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 00:44 | 2438538 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

like all other political systems, that depends on the following condition: are you a crony?

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:01 | 2438685 Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

Not sure how that statement relates to the topic...

but do elaborate, please...

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 09:29 | 2439279 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Nothing has ever worked anywhere, but if you want to return to monarchy, maybe you should start a political party.

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 10:40 | 2439723 Dr. Kenneth Noi...
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater's picture

No representation without taxation!


Me, I'm thinking a whole lot of good would come out of simply undoing everything the US gov't did in 1913, and perhaps desecrating the grave of Woodrow Wilson.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 19:07 | 2437760 smlbizman
smlbizman's picture

in howard county maryland today the news reported road blocks for seatbelt inspection......and if you were wearing your seatbelt they would give you a dollar.....i really dont know what to say at this point....

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 20:33 | 2437960 Harlequin001
Harlequin001's picture

Just keep driving round the block...

you'll soon be fucking loaded...

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:54 | 2436657 Colombian Gringo
Colombian Gringo's picture

The Presidents  NDAA executive order means that  you can be taken in the night from your home, without a warrant, without habeas corpus,  be tortured and  be locked away forever. But, he believes that you should have the right to marry your butt buddy.


If that is considered upholding civil rights, the loss of liberty but the solemnization of sodomy, no wonder increasing numbers of  americans want out of the USA.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:56 | 2436668 CH1
CH1's picture

America is OVER.

Those who claim otherwise are holding to the dreams of a dead past.

Have a good cry, then get up and DO something. Not talk, DO.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:00 | 2436699 Michael
Michael's picture

Welcome to The United States of Bankistan.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:47 | 2436944 malikai
malikai's picture

The United Prisons of America.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 21:07 | 2438027 dryam
dryam's picture

FUCK YOU U.S.A.!!!!!!!! 


Never thought I'd ever say that growing up, but this shit seriously has me thinking about moving to New Zealand & taking my much in demand job skills, insane work ethic, and capital with me.

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 01:44 | 2438651 USKiwi
USKiwi's picture

Do it.  Life is awesome down here in NZ and it is not hard to do.  We bailed from the US in 2009 and life has never been better for us. 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:41 | 2436923 Klazy Plick
Klazy Plick's picture

I blame Jesus.  He put the idea out there: "render unto Caesar that which belongs to Caesar".

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 17:10 | 2437344 Grinder74
Grinder74's picture

And that statement was based on the fact that Ceasar's face was on the coinage--therefore it presumably "belonged" to him.  Neither Turbo-Tax Timmy nor Obummer's image is on any of the money, so it definitely doesn't belong to them.  Ergo, render nothing to them!

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 01:32 | 2438634 USKiwi
USKiwi's picture

I already did something.  I left for New Zealand while the option still existed.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:02 | 2436998 garypaul
garypaul's picture

Columbian Gringo:  If I may add my two-cents, it seems that in Western countries the only kind of sex that is clamped down upon by the law is sex between a man and woman!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:28 | 2437138 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Oh please. Of course, if you give up that easily, you certainly make things more difficult.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:58 | 2436686 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

You're very naive.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:45 | 2436615 onelight
onelight's picture

Kind of odd how Schumer did not do this when Jim Rogers moved to Singapore, saying sell US assets.. Guess ya gotta write the right checks. 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:52 | 2436648 cliffynator
cliffynator's picture

Jim Rogers did it early.. before it became La Mode to exit or talk about exiting the country.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:31 | 2436868 Id fight Gandhi
Id fight Gandhi's picture

Rogers did it on the sly. This FB is a clearly ducking out to pocket the tax money.

He's young and thinks he's smart. He'll end up pissing it away on investment failures from here on out. Always happens to lottery winners.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:54 | 2436970 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Eh?  So he's paying a half a billion in exit taxes to duck a $64 million tax bill?

Not FAIR!!!!!  I say we take all of his assets, and take him out back behind the chemical shed and shoot him, then sell his organs, and use what's left as cow feed.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 18:39 | 2437680 BigJim
BigJim's picture

 He'll end up pissing it away on investment failures from here on out. Always happens to lottery winners.

Maybe. But it's his money, not Uncle Sam's, and, frankly, I'd rather he pissed it away on stupid investments than our overlords used it to buy more drones to control us with.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:57 | 2436673 t0mmyBerg
t0mmyBerg's picture

Who introduced this legislation?  Oh yeah, Chuck Shumer.  One of the most useless pieces of shit ever to draw breath.  Whatever.  Another reason I will never again reside in NY.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:21 | 2436814 Doubleguns
Doubleguns's picture

Eduardo Saverin should not be allowed back because now we HAVE TO LISTEN TO SHUMER with that horrendous nasal whining voice on the tv for the next few weeks. Actually Saverin is welcome back in my book, but I really hate to listen to Shumer....ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!  Its a damn nightmare.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:24 | 2436829 William113
William113's picture

Don't worry about Saverin he still has his Israeli and Brazilian passports. This is all a big scam nobody with money like that comes out and says I'm renouncing my citizenship. Smoke and mirrors. Just like when Munger said don't buy gold what he was really saying was only certain people quietly buy gold. Saverin is telling certain people that its time to go away but do it quietly.

Google search how many CEO's have quietly retired and have disappeared. If any of this sounds familar it should it happened 70 years ago.

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 00:13 | 2438477 Cathartes Aura
Cathartes Aura's picture


while some of the angry snark here is hella amusing, it's good to see the critical thinking is still bubbling.

the heat under the pot just got turned up another notch, feeling it yet?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:06 | 2437016 smb12321
smb12321's picture

The other cosponser (Sen Kerry "D" Pa) was interviewed on CNBC about this and was asked three times, "Don't you think we should have tax policies that attract productive people rather than force them to leave" and each time his answer was, "People gotta pay their fair share.  PA has poor people."  The interviewer finally gave up. 

Few are aware that he would face a host of new taxes and fees besides the IPO tax.  How odd that it's liberals would who introduce border controls for US citizens.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 17:03 | 2437314 CaptainObvious
CaptainObvious's picture

It's actually Bob Casey, Jr. (D) who co-sponsored the bill.  Please, don't accuse PA of having foisted Kerry on the world...PA is already responsible for having foisted Santorum on the world. ;)

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 18:47 | 2437705 RafterManFMJ
RafterManFMJ's picture

Great insight SMB - liberals want to import third world masses and get them on welfare, yet prevent the productive from getting the hell out and escaping the cesspool they are making.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:47 | 2436623 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

People laugh at Ron Paul in general. Although his message sometimes resonates, the messenger isn't helping.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:54 | 2436661 Dr. Richard Head
Dr. Richard Head's picture

Tis a shame that the American population care more about the gift wrapping of the package rather than what the gift itself is.  Fucking bunch of toddler/puppy/kitten fucktards if you ask me.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:58 | 2436679 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Well, one needs to be a persuasive communicator to get one's message across. Dr. Paul may be a nice guy, but he's neither a communicator nor a leader.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:10 | 2436739's picture

If your definitions of communicator and leader fail to recognize the efforts of a man who has enlightened and motivated millions of people then may I suggest that you buy a dictionary. When you get a handle on English vocabulary perhaps you'll be able to communicate more effectively yourself.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:20 | 2436799 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

He's had 30-some odd years to accomplish something meaningful; he hasn't done it. While I agree with some of his ideas, he just never makes them persuasively.  His son's much better, frankly.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:26 | 2436847's picture

Meaningful to whom? Ron Paul's words and actions have been very meaningful to me and millions of other people. I understand that you are unmoved by the man but it seems odd that you can't see the obvious effect he's had on the lives of a great number of people.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:35 | 2436890 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Well, if he had actually accomplished something, the states united would be more "free" today than when he took office in the 70s.  As far as I can tell, the states united are far less free than when Dr. Paul assumed office.

Are you claiming that we would somehow have slipped into totalitarianism if not for the miraculous efforts of the Congressman from TX 14?  That sounds like a bit of a stretch.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 18:44 | 2437694 BigJim
BigJim's picture

 Well, if he had actually accomplished something, the states united would be more "free" today than when he took office in the 70s. 

Er, yeah, that's right, why didn't he single-handedly stop all that 'patriotic' legislation all the other scum in congress passed? What a loser he must be!

Tell you what, 'Bastiat', why don't you single-handedly vote him into the presidency in November yourself?

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:17 | 2438701 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Good grief; it's called "leadership" - not "cult" leadership.

My point stands - he has accomplished virtually nothing in spite of 30 some odd years of opportunity to take a stand for liberty in some respect.

Don't get me wrong - I generally agree with his ideas.  The problem is not the "message" it's the pseudo-cult-shaman messenger who talks a talk but doesn't walk a walk.

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 09:48 | 2439386 BigJim
BigJim's picture

 he has accomplished virtually nothing in spite of 30 some odd years of opportunity to take a stand for liberty in some respect.

He's constantly taken a stand for liberty, not in 'some' respect, but in all respects.But he's only one man, with one vote, in a legislative body of hundreds of Statists.

 Don't get me wrong...

We don't get you wrong, shill; we can see exactly what you are.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:35 | 2436892 Dr. Richard Head
Dr. Richard Head's picture

He has changed my life in more ways than I can count.  The message of his got through to a hard core KILL ALL THOSE FUCKING MUSLIMS REPUBLICAN that I once was.  I even have a Muslim neighbor and he and I have the best conversations I could ever have imagined.  He loves the fact that I have so much knowledge and am SO DIFFERENT than the other Americans he has met.  The same can be said of my Indian neighbor as well. 

I read heard and understood the message fine and well and have never turned back.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:50 | 2436955 malikai
malikai's picture

Obamney just wants to be president(puppet). Paul has started a revolution.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:30 | 2437151 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 17:42 | 2437489 General Decline
General Decline's picture

You've got Muslim and Indian neighbors? It's time to move.

Romney 2012


Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:14 | 2438697 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

And leave New Jersey?  Who are you kidding?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 21:56 | 2438152 long-shorty
long-shorty's picture

thanks for that. I've been thinking the grand I gave to his campaign was a waste, but I'm glad to see maybe some good has come/will come of it.

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:13 | 2438694 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture


Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:13 | 2438696 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Fair enough. I counted "one" - barely.  When you can count beyond a bit flip, please let us know.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:57 | 2436980 tmosley
Fri, 05/18/2012 - 14:58 | 2438708 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Good grief; any member of Congress can "sponsor" legislation.  If you're complimenting someone for being a member of congress, why not compliment Nancy Pelosi?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:28 | 2436855 AmCockerSpaniel
AmCockerSpaniel's picture

That's what I want; A communicator & leader who works for the other side. Two men are in the ocean at night. One a very strong swimmer, the other a weak swimmer. The strong one swims in circles, while the weak swims to shore. 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:10 | 2437029 smb12321
smb12321's picture

You are correct, of course. And I say this as a big Ron Paul fan.  The trouble with his message is that one must actually THINK about issues, history, economics and politics. Few ever get to that point, caught by Romney's high school antics or Obama's birthplace.  Ron often comes across as an elderly lecturer.  I wish he were about 40 years younger. 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 19:33 | 2437842 margaris
margaris's picture

lol, so what do you expect from ron paul?

To chime in with the soap opera?

The stupidity and lies spread by the establishment are effective.... yes.

That doesnt mean we cant do anything about it.

First rule of Ron Paul: Dont play by their rules!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 20:43 | 2437984 Clashfan
Clashfan's picture

What I expect from him is to support the 911 Truth movement. If he can't do that, I can't support him. Sorry, not worth the effort.

As for the guy who says he can't communicate and that his son's better, I have to disagree strongly on both matters. Check out RandyRand telling students that mountaintop removal is none of their business:

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 22:04 | 2438167's picture

Rand Paul single-handedly stopped a Senate vote which would have covertly authorized war against Iran.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 22:33 | 2438249 Clashfan
Clashfan's picture

Thanks for teaching me something, Crockett. Links?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:24 | 2436830 LFMayor
LFMayor's picture

You a big fan of Meatloaf, or Molly Hatchet?  They got killed by the video star, too.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:50 | 2436636 Transitory Disi...
Transitory Disinflation's picture

laughed, I just wonder who else is laughing



Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:59 | 2436692 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

David Axlerod's got some splain'in to do.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:57 | 2436675 Gully Foyle
Gully Foyle's picture

What fucking kills me is this type of treatment has existed since the founding of the nation.

Off the top of my head there was the Molly Maguires trial


The Molly Maguires were a secret Irish-American organization that consisted mainly of coal miners. Many historians[who?] believe the "Mollies" were present in the anthracite coal fields of Pennsylvania in the United States between the time of the American Civil War until a series of sensational arrests and trials from 1876?78. The Molly Maguires were accused of kidnapping and other crimes, largely because of the allegations of one powerful industrialist (Franklin B. Gowen), and the testimony of one Pinkerton detective (James McParland). Fellow prisoners testified against the defendants, who were arrested by the Coal and Iron Police, who served Gowen, who acted as prosecutor in some of the trials.[1]

The trusts seem to have focused almost exclusively upon the Molly Maguires for criminal prosecution. Information passed from the Pinkerton detective, intended only for the detective agency and their client — the most powerful industrialist of the region — was apparently[vague] also provided to vigilantes who ambushed and murdered miners suspected of being Molly Maguires, as well as their families.[2] The industrialist standing to gain financially from the destruction of the striking union acted as prosecutor of some of the alleged Molly Maguires at their trials. Molly Maguire history is sometimes presented as the prosecution of an underground movement that was motivated by personal vendettas, and sometimes as a struggle between organized labor and powerful industrial forces. Whether membership in the Molly organization overlapped union membership to any appreciable extent remains open to conjecture


The Chicago Seven

Early in the course of the trial, Black Panther Party activist Bobby Seale hurled bitter attacks at Judge Hoffman in court, calling him a "fascist dog," a "honky," a "pig," and a "racist," among other things. Seale had wanted the trial postponed so that his own attorney, Charles Garry, could represent him (as Garry was about to undergo gallbladder surgery); the judge denied the postponement, and refused to allow Seale to represent himself, leading to Seale's verbal onslaught. When Seale refused to be silenced, the judge ordered Seale bound and gagged in the courtroom, citing a precedent from the case of Illinois v. Allen.[9] (This was alluded to in Graham Nash's song, "Chicago", which opened with: "So your brother's bound and gagged, and they've chained him to a chair"). Ultimately, Judge Hoffman severed Seale from the case, sentencing him to four years in prison for contempt of court, one of the longest sentences ever handed down for that offense in the US up to that time.[10]

And all the GITMO bullshit.

So one rich fuck gets tagged for some money and everyone suddenly has their panties in a bunch.

You should have opened your eyes fucking years ago!


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:18 | 2437087 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

excellent gully --- 'from past to ancient is only a yesterday away in a wise man's mind'

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 18:49 | 2437707 BigJim
BigJim's picture

That's right Gully, any article that condemns a topical evil without listing all and every previous evil throughout the history of America, is without value, and written by someone with their eyes shut.

Troll much?

Oh yeah, I forgot, you do.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:02 | 2436712 Vincent Vega
Vincent Vega's picture

Indentured Servitude, Bitchez!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:04 | 2437012 lotusblue
lotusblue's picture

And the fellow didn't braek one law-never permitted to reenter.

My grandfather was a State Dept. commercial attache-he never returned to States after he retired,my Grandmother returned once-on the way home from JFK with her,she wanted us to turn the car around so she could get next flight back to Suisse!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:16 | 2437071 dunphyben
dunphyben's picture

Serously. The United Farms of America want to keep their cattle from straying. Gotta milk every last drop -- even if all the green grass has since left our fields. 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 20:12 | 2437901 batz
batz's picture




From a comment I read somewhere else:


In a democratic society, the police and security services are not the authorities, they are the help.


Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:25 | 2438713 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Makes sense; sounds like a Popper quote.  Recommend replacing "society" with "civilization", though - the term "society" is completely meaningless.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:38 | 2436572 BigMike
BigMike's picture

This story makes me want to quit my job, get on food stamps and the dole. Seriously, fuck this shit. 


We all need to write in Ron Paul this November.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 17:48 | 2437516 General Decline
General Decline's picture

I wanted to write Paul in last election but the old man election judge said they would just "throw away" my ballot. Cant even write F-ing Snoopy in anymore.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 21:28 | 2438075 Vlad Tepid
Vlad Tepid's picture

If you can prove that he does that you've got a good disenfranchisment suit on your hands...

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 15:00 | 2438703 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Dr. Paul's just playing you; he's going to endorse the anti-socialist nominee, at the end of the day, in order to solidify his son's position. Which is much better than his is, or ever was, by the way.  Such fools buy into Dr. Paul's 30-some odd years in Congress - he is the status quo in many respects.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:38 | 2436573 SHEEPFUKKER

Tax more if you leave, tax more if you don't. 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:38 | 2436574 veyron
veyron's picture

So will the US become fascist or communist?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:48 | 2436631 laomei
laomei's picture

In the typical american way of doing things, it'll just take the worst aspects from both and call it "freedom".

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:48 | 2436632 Darth..Putter
Darth..Putter's picture

It is already a fascist system.  Just look at the SEC, CFTC, Corizine, JPM, GS, WF, CITI, FED monster conglomerate.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:50 | 2436639 reader2010
reader2010's picture

It has been since 1913.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:53 | 2436656 semperfi
semperfi's picture

will become?  come again

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:56 | 2436669 veyron
veyron's picture

The eventuality was accepted.  I wasn't sure if it was turning left or right.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:57 | 2436674 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

Capitalist for the poor
Communist for the rich
Fascist for those who think different

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:41 | 2436922 blindman
blindman's picture

you nailed it. we have it all!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:49 | 2437257 Ricky Bobby
Ricky Bobby's picture

Sudden that is Brilliant!

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 00:14 | 2438481 Iwanttoknow
Iwanttoknow's picture

Suddendebt,in USA it is socialism for rich and poor,free market for middle class.

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:24 | 2438710 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Well, free enterprise rules. Collectivism is for loser dummies.

Fri, 05/18/2012 - 02:21 | 2438704 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Frankly, I doubt you can define "fascist".

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:05 | 2436727 JohnG
JohnG's picture


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:39 | 2436909 Whalley World
Whalley World's picture

According to Von Mises, if you draw a circle and split it in half from top to bottom, the top left is commy, the top right is fascist.  They are both totalitarian and work to suppress freedom and filter the wealth to the oligarchs.  So, does it matter what you call it, if they both smell like "napalm in the morning"?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 18:52 | 2437715 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Exactly, seeing politics in terms of simple 'left' and 'right' is like trying to escape your direction in flatland.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:38 | 2436575 Fox-Scully
Fox-Scully's picture


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:40 | 2436585 vast-dom
vast-dom's picture




Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:41 | 2436588 New England Patriot
New England Patriot's picture

Who is John Galt?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:43 | 2436604 BigMike
BigMike's picture

Not WHO, but WHERE?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 17:10 | 2437343 CaptainObvious
CaptainObvious's picture

So far, he is in Singapore, Canada, New Zealand...

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:44 | 2436611 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Let atlas shrug, fucking bring it, the paper-pushers will find out precisely how productive they are.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:08 | 2436740 Joe The Plumber
Joe The Plumber's picture

Lol we are all shrugging a little bit

Dont buy stuff
Hoard gold and silver
Never buy a new car

Cheat the tax man any way you can. Even if you only cheat the tax man out of ten dollars it is something

Go galt in little ways. It all starts adding up

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:31 | 2437165 F. Bastiat
F. Bastiat's picture

Absolutely.  Bottom up - the whole is made of the parts. It all adds up - ultimately to victory.  Not gonna be easy, though.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:41 | 2437218 Sorynn
Sorynn's picture

Buy local.  Use cash and barter.  Minimize taxes and minimize the merchant account fees.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:43 | 2436926 Whalley World
Whalley World's picture

When I read Atlas Shrugged about 5 years ago, I never thought Wesley Mouch would sit in the White House so soon.  This is so f'n surreal, say what you will about Rand but she could see the future and portrayed it to the letter.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:41 | 2436592 sdavis
sdavis's picture

Is he renouncing his citizenship to avoid paying taxes? If so, that is not good.

So long as he pays, then that should be the end of it.

Barring him from ever coming to the United STates again is crazy. No wonder he wants to leave!



Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:59 | 2436694 CH1
CH1's picture

Is he renouncing his citizenship to avoid paying taxes? If so, that is not good.

Why not? To support lying, thieving thugs is no virtue.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:37 | 2436900 New England Patriot
New England Patriot's picture

At some point, citizenship has to be a total cost/benefit analysis. I applaud somebody who makes a choice based on the economic realities of the total package.


There is nothing inherently special about the United States of America. The United States of America has been a special place because it has traditionally done a certain set of things right. Absent those things, there is nothing exceptional.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 22:32 | 2438241 Solid
Solid's picture

Consider the tax net the US has on you. One of the only countries to tax expats. You can't escape the IRS, they will get what they think is theirs.
That's why he left. I'd leave too.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:42 | 2436595 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:42 | 2436597 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

I heard a story that a python swallowed a small gator live. The gator tried to eat its way out but died in the process however it was enough to kill the python.

Hopefully, these fabulous 'job creators' and government can cannibalize each other in a similar manner.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:43 | 2436598 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"It seems so bizarre that a country once regarded as the freest, most economically enviable in the world would treat its productive citizens with such hostility."

Productive as in pushing fucking paper around or productive as in actually producing something of real value?   Fucking stupidity, cry me a fucking river.  How about speaking to the importance of maintaining the fucking rule of law and real consequences for bad behavior idiot.  FYI- having your bonus go from 50 million to 25 million is not a real fucking consequence.

Fine with me f no one wants to have an adult conversation, the collapse will come and compensation (in numerous forms) will return to those people who are actually worth a shit, bring it.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 18:57 | 2437727 BigJim
BigJim's picture

Unlike the elite within the banking cartel, Savarin's wealth was derived from free and voluntary transactions. Whether it's 2.5 million or 250 million. he earned it. Why should he hand over disproportionate amounts of it to a government that has done no more to help him than any other citizen?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:43 | 2436602 ItsDanger
ItsDanger's picture

Its still part of the problem of extraction of wealth from the country.  Not unlike high oil prices.  He's not breaking any rules per se but it highlights how screwed up the current system is.  Your argument of creating jobs is seriously flawed.  The users create the jobs.  Without them, facebook is nothing.  Perhaps a tax on the FMV at time of the renouncement?  Everyone else paying taxes should be pissed.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:12 | 2436757 Joe The Plumber
Joe The Plumber's picture

Economics is not a zero sum game

Go back to daily kos and play with the children. Stay out of adult conversations until you are educated

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:19 | 2436796 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

eCONomics is not a science  either, and as it turn out your life is a zero sum game.  Stop making excuses for the criminals and prosecute the fucking fraud already.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:32 | 2436878 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Facebook's co-founder is a criminal now,  "Stop making excuses for the criminals" who knew..

Life is a zero sum game, really, do you and the kids knife fight over the scraps on the dinner table?  If your time here leaves zero impact I empathize.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 17:23 | 2437406 CaptainObvious
CaptainObvious's picture

So by your logic, the users of any company, be it Facebook, Kellogg's, Ford, or Apple, create all those jobs, right?  One problem with your argument...none of those companies caters exclusively to Amerika.  So if we're going to tax the shit out of the founders of those companies (who created the product that drew in the customers, and thus created the jobs), why should only Amerikans benefit since the product(s) is/are sold/offered worldwide?  Answer:  they shouldn't.  Reason:  Because the customers got what they paid for...the product.  There is no earthly fucking reason they are entitled to any more than what they paid for under our current system.  Now, if you were planning to go full-retard (ie communist), then fine, your idea works.  But we aren't communist yet, so I say bravo to Saverin for preserving his wealth before the communists were able to snatch it all away for the "benefit" of the proles (but really, for the benefit of the Inner Party).

People like you miss a central point...if the idea wasn't thought of, invested in, and made reality in the first place, those jobs wouldn't exist.  And day by day, we're chasing those innovators away.  So the next new idea they have will be thought of, invested in, and made reality some place else, and Amerika won't be able to tax it.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 18:59 | 2437732 BigJim
BigJim's picture


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:43 | 2436605 nickels
nickels's picture

He's working pretty hard to get something into the 24 hr news cycle other than the demise of the world. Hey- did we finally round up all those flag-burners?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:43 | 2436606 pauldia
pauldia's picture

Uh Oh.."“Oh what a tangled web we weave, When first we practice to deceive” Sir Walter Scott 
The Vetting - Exclusive - Obama's Literary Agent in 1991 Booklet: 'Born in Kenya and raised in Indonesia and Hawaii'

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:48 | 2436627 pods
pods's picture

Wow. If that pans out it will be a ..........................

Forget it.  We get what we deserve.

They do not follow any other rules, why is this one so important?

I would prefer they follow the first 10 amendments.


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:12 | 2436756 BlackholeDivestment
BlackholeDivestment's picture

...if you voted for this evil bastard, that means you did not vote for Ron Paul ...because you are an evil bastard, and are, at best, a complete dumbshit.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:48 | 2436607 Mercury
Mercury's picture

I don't care how pretty or rich you are, you can't come to my party!
Oh...did you get your contribution form?  This is going to be an important election.

Go stuff yourself into a locker Chuck.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:44 | 2436609 pods
pods's picture

Some things are just not worth saving.


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:44 | 2436612 overhere2000
overhere2000's picture

Facebook will probably go down as the single biggest stock swindle in history.  He is just preping for the fallout.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:26 | 2437132 Tijuana Donkey Show
Tijuana Donkey Show's picture

Sorry, the financial sector is WAY ahead of them. 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:49 | 2436618 spooz
spooz's picture

Maybe I'm thinking like a fascist, but I have no problem with this.  If the 1% wants to move on to greener pastures to hoard more of their money and avoid taxes, I say lock the door on their way out. Oh, but I would allow them to come back in if they paid a sizeable fee, based on avoided taxes.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:57 | 2436671 Mercury
Mercury's picture

Yes, let's incentivize the poorest, least skilled people to immigrate here and the smartest, richest citizens to emigrate...

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:13 | 2436761 AchtungAffen
AchtungAffen's picture

Of course. America needs to incentivize the most skilled paper flippers to immigrate there.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:58 | 2436681 pods
pods's picture

As long as you are happy.........

Did you ever play Calvinball?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:48 | 2436950 TimmyB
TimmyB's picture

You are absolutely right.  I find it amazing that this community is all for a billionare dodging his taxes.        

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 19:03 | 2437745 BigJim
BigJim's picture

 You are absolutely right.  I find it amazing that this community is all for a billionare dodging his taxes.

'His' taxes? They're not his taxes - they're some completely arbitary amount of money the government wants to take from him as part of their protection racket.

People like you never appear to question how much tax a government should be able to take from people - no, whether it's 10%, or 90%, they're somehow 'his' taxes.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 19:15 | 2437786 debtandtaxes
debtandtaxes's picture

Since business owners benefit from taxpayer funded infrastructure (roads, mass transit, policing, fire dept, streetlights, water) in the region where their workers must attend offices and/or factories, perhaps taxes should be paid in the region where the income is earned rather than upon place of the business owners' residence.

They can move to the moon, but still pay taxes to the region where their income came from.

There.  Fixed it.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 21:12 | 2438038 CaptainObvious
CaptainObvious's picture

Dude, he didn't "dodge" anything.  He renounced his citizenship before the IPO was announced.  He no longer lives in this nation.  He lives in Singapore.  IF he renounced his citizenship AFTER he got his disbursal from the IPO and THEN moved to Singapore, THAT would be a tax dodge.  However, he abandoned ship long before the disbursal so he owes no more than what the exit tax is on what he had when he left.  He followed the law as it is written, which is why Schumer and Casey are so pissed.  They can't get him because he didn't violate the law, so what the hell, let's just write a new law and fuck him over that way.  After all, the USSA is "due" that money and it's only "fair".  And what is the USSA gonna do with the money they are "due"?  They're going to piss it away on hookers and blow for the Secret Service, and drones to spy on your kids splashing in the backyard pool, and TSA agents to strip search 90 pound grandmas with colostomy bags, and 1 round of ammunition per citizen.  I applaud Saverin for not enabling all that to happen.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 16:54 | 2437280 Ricky Bobby
Ricky Bobby's picture

No Spooz you are not thinking like a Fascist - Your thinking like a Moron.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:51 | 2436630 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Why can't we just ship them out? It's 320 million vesus 537. Seems like the odds are in our favor.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:00 | 2436695 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

"we"???? Schumer is acting on the majority of people in this countries philosophy. Even very conservative people believe that you owe the state part of your life. It is a philosophical problem it can't be solved by getting rid of 537 people. They would instantly be replaced by the same people.

Until people say you have no right to my life. You have no right to take what I earn and redistribute it to someone else it continues and gets worse.  

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:13 | 2436765 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Yeah.... I know..... a man can dream ca't he ?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:54 | 2436971 Milestones
Milestones's picture

All depends on HOW you get rid of the 537. If it's permanent kinda deal, I doubt it.          Milestones 

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:01 | 2436706 CH1
CH1's picture

Sadly, you're forgetting the other several million unseen members of the Fedguv.

The 537 are only the faces in the front window.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:04 | 2436720 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

...Or give them the full NDAA treatment. Hey, they thought it was a good idea when they voted for it!

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:50 | 2436634 SeanJKerrigan
SeanJKerrigan's picture

They said 2012 was going to be like 1968 on crack.  So far I wouldn't compare it to 1968, but it does feel a bit like 1932 in Germany. There are warning signs everywhere. The new thing now is these street light poles that will be able to play government messages, record conversations of pedestrians and even take pictures of people passing by.

Think about this for a second.  If the government links these street lights to the NSA data centers begin constructed, they will have recordings (and by extension, searchable transcripts) of our public conversations just walking down the fucking street. Combine this with the ability to take pictures and they can file it under your name, right along side your book purchases, online posts, etc.

Morris Berman had something interesting to say about this.  Too long to post the entire thing, but here's an excerpt:

Anyone is a potential terrorist now; anyone can be persecuted, prosecuted, and in effect, destroyed. Democracy is only possible if dissent is not only permitted, but also respected. This too is finished.


What does this mean for someone such as myself?, is something I lay awake nights thinking about. I have published three books, and half a collection of essays, showing where we have gone wrong, predicting our eventual collapse—indeed, this repression is part of that collapse—and arguing that the U.S. no longer has a moral compass; that it is spiritually bankrupt.


I run a blog that is anything but polite: it says the U.S. is finished; that it is basically a corporate plutocracy, run by a gangster elite; that the American people are basically morons, with little more than fried rice in their heads; and that anyone with half a brain and the means to do so should emigrate before it’s too late.


I’m not really a threat to the U.S. government… But as the definition of terrorism widens in this country, what is to prevent the creation of a category known as “intellectual terrorism” from arising, and putting folks like myself in that category?What is to prevent the government from calling such activity a clear and present danger to national security? As must be obvious by now, the government can do anything it wants to now; as in Nazi Germany, we now have a government of men, not of laws. Indeed, the “laws” are little more than a pretext for whatever the government wishes to do.


Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:52 | 2436647 spooz
spooz's picture

I did read a tiny bit of good news about the encroachment of Big Brother today.  

"An Obama-appointed judge rules its indefinite detention provisions likely violate the 1st and 5th Amendments"

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:16 | 2436782 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

Someone told me that Malaysia just succeeded in getting a War Crimes motion filed in The Hague, naming George Bush and Dick Cheney. Now they just need to add Obomba to the list. Anyone confirm this?

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:53 | 2436655 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

I'm already at the point where I assume everything I do and say is being recorded by the government.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 14:57 | 2436670 crawldaddy
crawldaddy's picture

sad but true.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:06 | 2436729 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

Nah, the government's not doing the recording, they just have access to the files.

For government to do the work themselves would be socialism.  A waste of money on taxpayer-funded salaries.  It's better they buy such intelligence on the free market, and double-plus good for the job-creators.

Thu, 05/17/2012 - 15:20 | 2436810 Joe The Plumber
Joe The Plumber's picture is a front for government spyware. If you ever get an email from it will have a nice trojan attached

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