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Guest Post: Unseemly Scramble For Libya’s Post-Gaddafi Oil Assets Underway

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Submitted by John C.K. Daly

Unseemly Scramble for Libya’s Post-Gaddafi Oil Assets Underway

While NATO members, led by France, piously proclaimed at the onset of their military offensive in Libya that their concerns were solely humanitarian, a covert tussle to gain a commanding lead in developing the country’s energy riches in light of Colonel Gaddafi’s departure is well underway.

The Libyan economy depends primarily upon revenues from the oil sector, which contribute about 95 percent of export earnings, 25 percent of GDP, and 80 percent of government revenue.

Prior to the outbreak of conflict, Libya was exporting about 1.3-1.4 million barrels per day from production estimated at roughly 1.79 million barrels per day, of which approximately 280,000 barrels per day were indigenously consumed. But analysts believe that with reconstruction Libya could soon be exporting 1.6 million barrels per day of high-quality, light crude.

But current production is the proverbial mere drop in the bucket. Libya has the largest proven oil reserves in Africa with 42 billion barrels of oil and over 1.3 trillion cubic meters of natural gas. Causing oil company executives from Houston to Beijing to drool on their Gucci loafers, only 25 percent of Libya’s territory has been explored to date for hydrocarbons.

Libya is already Europe’s single largest oil supplier, the second largest oil producer in Africa and the continent’s fourth largest natural gas supplier and already dominates the Southern Mediterranean’s petroleum sector. According to the Libyan National Oil Corporation (NOC), more than 50 international oil companies are already present in the Libyan market.

So, peering into Libya’s future, who’s actually ahead?

France, apparently.

On 3 April a letter was allegedly sent by Libya's National Transitional Council (NTC) to a coalition partner, Qatari Emir Sheikh Hamad bin Khalifa Al Thani, which mentioned that France would take "35 percent of crude oil...in exchange for its total and permanent support" of the NTC. France’s Liberation daily reported on Thursday that it had a copy of the letter, which stated that the NTC’s Information Minister Mahmoud Shammam, would negotiate the deal with France. In 2010 France was the second purchaser of Libyan oil after Italy, with over 15 percent of its “black gold” imported from Tripoli.

Zut alors!

The number one National Transition Council, Moustapha Abdeljalil recently reported that the States would be rewarded" according to support "given to the insurgents.

While NTC head Mustafa Abdel Jalil has not hidden the fact that the NTC would assign a higher priority for reconstruction and the allocation of oil contracts to countries that supported their uprising, remarking that nations would be rewarded "according to the support" given to the insurgents, the NTC’s UK representative, Guma al-Gamaty, said that future oil contracts would be granted "on the basis of merit, not patronage. The contracts will be concluded in a transparent manner. "

French Foreign Minister Alain Juppe solemnly denied during a radio interview any knowledge of a "formal" or specific deal but brightly added that it would be "logical" for countries like France, which helped the NTC in its struggle against Gaddafi, to take part in reconstruction.

French President Nicholas Sarkozy was the major European advocate for armed intervention in Libya and his administration was the first officially to recognize the NTC as "the sole, legitimate representative of the Libyan people" and the country’s sole governmental authority, as well as lobbying other nations to recognize the NTC.

Seeking a share of “la gloire,” France was also the first state to commence attacks on 19 March against Gaddafi’s armed forces in Benghazi and along with fellow NATO member Britain, have since provided the majority of the military equipment and personnel used during NATO’s operations in Libya. Going into grey areas of international law in its eagerness to oust Gaddafi France also supplied some weaponry to opposition forces in Libya, a move that came under harsh criticism because of the total arms embargo imposed by the UN Security Council on arms deliveries to any side in the conflict.

NTC’s Paris-based envoy Mansour Sayf al-Nasr denied that such a letter had been sent or that any such pledge had been given. But no one was backpedalling more furiously than Information Minister Shammam, who intoned that such an arrangement was unthinkable.

“It's a joke. It's false,” Shammam said.

Well, if you cannot believe an Information Minister, who can you trust? Sleazy journalists?  It will certainly be interesting to see how the issue plays out in the days ahead, and if France does indeed get it 35 percent cut of the loot, which at present production rates, would average about 500,000 barrels per day.

 

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Mon, 09/05/2011 - 15:54 | 1635619 Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

What?

This wasn't about Oil or Gold... It was about freedom. 

<sarc>

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:19 | 1635704 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Actually, it's as much if not more about the water.

Heard of the Nubian Sandstone Aquifer? World's largest Fossil Water Aquifer.

Wrote about it not 20 minutes ago.

This Libya thing is much deeper than anything obvious and on th esurface, literally and figuratively.

V

http://aadivaahan.wordpress.com/2011/09/05/water-branding-and-thoughts/

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:28 | 1635733 Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Makes me happy I hit an artesian well a few years back.  All the time/effort in stacking, freshwater may be the real commodity.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:34 | 1635754 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Indeed. Keep in on the quiet though. If in the Us, gubbermint owns it. ;-)

V

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:19 | 1635884 silvertrain
silvertrain's picture

There isnt any "may" to it..It will be the commodity of the future..

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:08 | 1636380 Stumpy
Stumpy's picture

Well American Water Works (AWK) is the best performing equity in my portfolio (aside from PM). Sure it's a utility, but damn its solid.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 21:19 | 1636671 Joe Sixpack
Joe Sixpack's picture

Invest in desalination membranes and live near the ocean, a salt lake or the salton sea.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:30 | 1635737 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

95% of libya's export earnings is oil. PIIGS import tons of oil from Libya. This is for Euro bailout.

% of total crude import from Libya:
Austria 21.2%
France 15.7%
Germany 7.7%
Greece 14.6%
Ireland 23.3%
Italy 22.0%
Netherlands  2.3%
Portugal11.1%
Spain 12.1%
Switzerland 18.7%
United Kingdom 8.5%
United States 0.5%

 

http://www.iea.org/files/facts_libya.pdf

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:39 | 1635776 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Sure, what is actually delivered is all that matters.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:47 | 1635780 macholatte
macholatte's picture

RECONSTRUCTION

 

Isn't that where the tax payers are sold a bunch of lies in order to justify the wasting of their resources in the destruction of a whole lot of real estate and infrastructure for the benefit of the kleptocrats and then the tax payers are sold a bunch of lies in order to justify the wasting of their resources to rebuild that which was destroyed for the benefit of the kleptocrats?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:55 | 1635831 Anonymouse
Anonymouse's picture

Makes you wonder why the US ever got involved at all

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:22 | 1635897 silvertrain
silvertrain's picture

because we all tied together..why do we continue to bailout foreign banks? why did the rebels stop in the middle of a civil war to setup a central bank?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:25 | 1636040 eureka
eureka's picture

1  To get 30,000 to 50,000 Chinese engineers etc. out of Libya.

2  US "owes" Europe for participating in the coalitions in Afghanistan and Iraq - against EU self-interest.

3  US' Middle- & Far-East wars are to secure USD hegemony from replacement by EUR.

4  UK is US proxy and conduit in all EU continental interests. 

5  US maintains Big Brother status over Europe by thus "gracefully" lending EU some small muscle.

6 EU will "reward" US with some extended "submissiveness" - i.e. support USD hegemony for yet a while.

Give & Take - Fair Exchange - or some proximity thereof.

Business, Bitchez!

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:22 | 1635896 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Lemme guess......  Syrian oil reserves are about ZERO?  I guess they could be thankful for that small favor.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:24 | 1635900 silvertrain
silvertrain's picture

Or the ivory coast..

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:16 | 1636031 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Actaully Rock, Syria produces about 300,000 bpd.... none for export though..

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 21:32 | 1636723 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

I think that much is burned on the Dallas freeways 7-9AM on Fridays?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 22:46 | 1636923 Hephasteus
Hephasteus's picture

What syria has doesn't matter. What it doesn't have is what matters. It doesn't have a rothchids controlled central bank.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:52 | 1635982 Herman Strandsc...
Herman Strandschnecke's picture

Err, I think the figures for UK and France are maybe outdated?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:43 | 1635793 PY-129-20
PY-129-20's picture

Under the Surface. Like that underground volcano that is getting louder and louder with every passing day, ORI. Hundreds of little earthquakes (4.0) in the recent months and magma is rising, a volcano that was long forgotten, slept for over 300.000 years. Local people are alarmed, scientists are surprised of the amounts of Helium-3 (never seen before in such amounts in Central Europe - comparable to the volcano Aetna)

That would be the ultimate black swan. Ha! But scientists say it could take thousands of years. According to local people there, it seems to speed up lately though...louder and stronger...

http://www.spiegel.de/wissenschaft/natur/0,1518,784468,00.html

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:50 | 1635818 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Fascinating PY. Thanks for the link. The picture tells the story.

looks like a lot of long buried stuff is coming to surface now, eh? Facinating times.

V

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:54 | 1635829 formadesika3
formadesika3's picture

But how does France exploit that water? I'm not sure I understand how that would work.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:02 | 1635851 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Can you foresee a world where water is the new oil? Think _____ tankers, _____ pipelines, _____ wars..... like that. Plus, France is not the sole victor, not by a long shot and even victory si not yet a done deal. This is more like the Baby Bush on A carrier shamelessly saing mission accomplished.

Propaganda.

V

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:14 | 1635876 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

If the US is really thinking about water this far in advance, why would they allow fracking and the poisoning of our own water supply? I think it's more about oil than water.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:23 | 1635899 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

There are multiple angles to it, no? The US has a strategic presence in the ME for Oil? Similarly.... Control is as important as usage, right? Geopolitically anyways?

And this is elite water...underground aquifer, pure. And the Good Colnel had all the pumps and pipelines in place already to "mine" the aquifer anyways. It's what was feeding the greening of Libya.

V

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:43 | 1635951 formadesika3
formadesika3's picture

The ancient Roman province of Africa (littoral area of Tunisia and Libya) was the "breadbasket" of ancient Rome. When the Vandals seized this area, the Roman Empire was doomed. I still prefer the oil angle however. Occam's Razor.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:56 | 1635995 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

All this talk of moving all this water around by pipeline and boat is bullshit.  If the oil is gone, what are you using as FUEL to generate the ENERGY to move the water?  I irregate, moving water around is expensive, even when you are moving it out of your own aquifers and cisterns.  Come on ORI, you can do better.  The price paid on both will rise simutaneously.  

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 00:06 | 1637101 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Laws Of P, I suggest you google and study up one Viktor Schauberger! :-)

He pretty much broke all th elasws of physics, with Water! 

V

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:09 | 1636012 e2thex
e2thex's picture

This is the century of potable water. China has lakes that are yellow in appearance oozing yellow gas.  At some point people will take notice. (It's not linked to industrial factories.)

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 22:47 | 1636925 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

what is it linked to?

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 00:13 | 1637115 e2thex
e2thex's picture

cyanobacterial blooms...

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 01:26 | 1637289 tip e. canoe
tip e. canoe's picture

aka algae.    is that yellow gas some type of nitrogen gas you think?

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 00:42 | 1637153 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

@ ORI 16:19

L0L!!!  20 minutes ago?  i've been writing about the water play since april. given all the pieces i've written, and articles and maps (yes the water maps) and the recent post( after "we're in tripoli")  & link to the "european" water development plan~~nice to see you're paying attention, especially after you "agreed" with my "silver looks stronger than gold" here, today, also something i've been posting for several weeks, along w/ charts showing the "base" in silver and why gold, by comparison, looks "tired";  again, acting like it's "ORI's" original thinking, after i stood up to tyler's GOLD! call with it.  not you.  slewie

i'm flattered, but this is ridiculous!

again. when are you gonna tell us what the fascists are doing in india?  how they're organized?  who they control? what their plans are? 

carry on, but maybe give credit where credit is due?  very few here except your "fans" will fail to understand exactly what i'm talking about, b/c many zHeads have read my developed ideas & theses here, dude

"This Libya thing is much deeper than anything obvious and on th esurface, literally and figuratively."  dude, this is in its 7th month!  and, they still haven't gotten to the moQ, have they? where tf you been, boy?

we may be on the cusp of a counter-revolution, as the Transitional Council continues to "threaten" the moQ's tribal strongholds.  then, maybe after a few weeks of it (i hope!), you can inform everyone what is "really happening" abt that, too...  can't wait!   who knows? maybe i'll have "guessed right" again? 

i'm glad you're getting more real, but you those are my shoulders you're standing on, here, swami salami vivekananananananaduh...  and i'm pretty sure you must know it, too!  oh, well, it's better than your usual self-advertiZing pablum and psuedo-spiritual bullshit!

good for you!  thanks for the "flattering" ideas;  mine, originally.  if you have some original ideas which aren't crap, i'll give you credit, as i did when you absolutely nailed the "market's fall" from 12,500+++ b/c you saw "mercury going retrograde"

one of the finest calls on zHedge in 2011, and this is not the first time i have put out how freaking great that was, ok?  but the recent silver v. gold call and the libyan water call, each  developed into several paras, more than once here, are pretty much zHedge slewie originals, ori.  stop trying to be somebody you ain't

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:08 | 1636011 eureka
eureka's picture

Neither France, nor pathetic secret US agents, wound up the GaDaffyDuck to declare that HE would wipe out the entire East Libyan population if they did not continue to suck his cock. 

Ipso Est: "it" was not "just" about one "thing" - rather, it was - as life always is - about many things, one of which was freedom from the GaDaffyDuck dictatorship, and another - logically - about mutual future benefits - i.e. business - something zerohedgers and free marketeers and enlightened self-interest adherents should understand far more thouroughly than the average citizen knucklehead.

Whom enlightened, does not appreciate tangible thanks from those helped out from under a rock?

Business, Bitchez!

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 02:30 | 1637383 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Dont forget the freedom to round up people based on their skin colour and carry out an ethnical cleansing under the guise of humanitarian concern.

That is US citizenism.

No differences between Europeans and US citizens relatively to US citizenism. Both love it, both breath it, both live by it.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 15:55 | 1635624 ZeroAffect
ZeroAffect's picture

Libya has the largest proven oil reserves in Africa with 42 billion barrels of oil and over 1.3 trillion cubic meters of natural gas. Causing oil company executives from Houston to Beijing to drool on their Gucci loafers, only 25 percent of Libya’s territory has been explored to date for hydrocarbons.

This has to be a LIE - haven't those bitchez heard of Peak Oil?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:01 | 1635645 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

For Christ's sake, Peak does not mean it's gone, there is still lots of oil, just less and less each year.

Also the 42 billion quoted probably includes the miraculous OPEC doubling of reserves in the 1980s and refers to OOIP not what is recoverable....

 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:08 | 1635859 bakken
bakken's picture

YES,  very good point.   Middle East reserves in general are overstated by a likely 30-40%.   Alot of oil but it doesn't save Europe or China.    PS the Chinese aren't done with Libya yet either.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:17 | 1635700 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Humans will stop using oil with plenty still in the ground.  OVERALL production has been slowly declining, so what.  The real issue that any corporation cares about is the recovery costs relative to the price paid for the recovered oil.  The energetic and captial costs to recover have been increasing almost exponentially.  Like any good corporation, when the process becomes unprofitable, it will be abandoned.  The only way oil won't be abandoned is if the price per barrel continues to climb.  If everyone is broke, who will be buying?  Maybe this troll?  Try harder dude.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:44 | 1635797 infinity8
infinity8's picture

yours is a valid alternate definition of "peak" oil but, when the process becomes unprofitable, it will be subsidized by the government.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:48 | 1635809 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

For military and agricultural use....

Hey, wait a minute, isn't it already for those purposes?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:58 | 1635838 infinity8
infinity8's picture

absolutely - I meant more broadly and by more nefarious means. like war. like what's already been going on but to ? degree. these fuckers won't go quietly.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:47 | 1635964 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

It HAS BEEN subsidized by the government for some time now, unfortunately you didn't read carefully enough.  There are two inputs to be concerned with, the capital input AND the energy input.  The question is how much inflation can people really handle.  Inflation allows the government to supply the former to offset the latter.  Works until it doesn't.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:29 | 1635916 Potemkin Nation
Potemkin Nation's picture

42B barrels is about 18 months of global consumption.  Conclusion: we're still fucked.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:09 | 1636382 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

If Libya was the only oil producing nation in the world, your conclusion would be correct. Reality is they are one of dozens of oil exporters. Combined, they have 50-100 years worth of oil consumption

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 09:57 | 1638117 Potemkin Nation
Potemkin Nation's picture

First of all, oil reserves are depleting.  We are using up existing reserves much faster than new reserves are being discovered.  Second, peak oil is about production rates.  You may have 50-100 years of oil in the ground, but that doesn't mean you can get it out fast enough to meet demand.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 15:57 | 1635630 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Juppe is still Foreign Minister? Wasn't he foreign minister in the 80's? He's gotta be a hundred years old by now. This just in from Tripoli btw:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4BNbHBcnDI&feature=player_detailpage

not easy being an Oil Fish.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 15:57 | 1635632 DosZap
DosZap's picture

No, it's about Brown people, rounding up Black people, and getting ready for a CLEANING HOUSE.

The Rebels are taking all Blacks hostage, and imprisoning them.

No word on their fate, or intent.

Where are those sorry WHITE ass racists!!!.Ethnic cleansing.

http://news.yahoo.com/libyan-rebels-round-black-africans-130723394.html

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:14 | 1635686 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

What did you expect? Kadafi hired mercenairies from Soudan and other African countries to kill and rape the Libian people.

This might even lead to another war.

 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:37 | 1635767 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

That's good news, right? And personally i've never heard of the term "scramble for oil" and "unseemly" in the same sentence either. I think the technical term is "shameless scramble for oil." Right up there with "naked power grab." Wait 'till the lobster and caviar dinners start appearing at "what's his name's" place.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:39 | 1635775 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

Arabs selling out black africans who have no unity.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKjuu1ZOF-o

 

 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:17 | 1636033 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Party like its the 10th century....

So what else is new?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 19:22 | 1636247 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Ahhh the "cool metal headwear" century. Just when you thought it was over no less!

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:57 | 1636575 pods
pods's picture

Don't try and trot out the CIA favorite of rape teams, rooms, kits, squads.  BS to high heaven.  CIA has a fascination with rape for its raw emotional appeal, and they are a bunch of sadists.

Where are the good old days where the Iraqis were taking Kuwaiti babies out of incubators?

pods

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 21:55 | 1636795 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

You belive Shrillery's bullshit about the rape teams with viagra? Yeah all those massacres and thousands of dead bodies, but the media couldn't produce any pictures or videos.

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 02:36 | 1637388 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

What did you expect? Kadafi hired mercenairies from Soudan and other African countries to kill and rape the Libian people.

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Quite a strange point of view to hold when one is from the Western world.

Ummmmmm, what do Westerners state when they are to face the responsibilities they have in the wars declared by their government?

Not only that but mercenaries are private persons and their actions by such do not commit a the responsibilit of the people of a nation as a US style goverment does when waging a war.

But yet, if someone gets to a Westerner and kills him/her outright for his/her commitment in a war, very few people come up with "what do you expect?"

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 15:59 | 1635635 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

France soon to re-learn the difference between theory and experiment.  Will be interesting to see who gets the oil in this "new democracy" and at what price.  If I were leading the libyians I'd ask for payment in gold.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:19 | 1635706 WonderDawg
WonderDawg's picture

The battle for Libya's oil will be won by the black ops spooks. I like our guys vs. the French guys or the Italians. Who else has a dog in the hunt?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:40 | 1635778 scatterbrains
scatterbrains's picture

actually I wouldn't be surprised if nobody gets the oil, between allegations of China smuggling weapons to Kdaffy's peeps and now this phsy-ops deal where we drum up stories about terrorist factions breaking off from the main rebel group...  could this be the pro China/Russia/Iran rebels they're talking about ?

 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:48 | 1635810 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

When China and Russia have an innovative soldier, then you can sweat.  The current generation of Russian and Chinese soldier was brought up in socialist states where being different was bad and the state provided everything, you just needed to memorize everything, including your task.  Wait until the children growing up in Russia post 1990 start really earning rank.  Then you can sweat.  All is fair in love and war, soldiers that think outside of the box are very valuable, most who were raised in a socialist state can not do that, they lack critical thinking skills.  Prohibition and a depression in the U.S. made for great soldiers during WWII.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:20 | 1635890 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

"The current generation of Russian and Chinese soldier was brought up in socialist states where being different was bad and the state provided everything, you just needed to memorize everything, including your task."

 

In school, I remember the comformist (sheeple) and the non-conformist (innovators). You were more accepted into the group if you were a conformist than a non-conformist. While it's not as bad in the US when it comes to individual thinking than China, people in glass houses..


Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:35 | 1635927 Are you kidding
Are you kidding's picture

My God!  We've SWITCHED!  What you described...brain dead...that's Americans now!

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:57 | 1635957 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Yes, but these Americans are still relatively young and not in power.  What matters is who is in power and leading the ranks.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:20 | 1636042 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

LoP, you do recall seeing the photos of young soldiers in early 40's or of the general population in the 30's....

Hell, 40% of our youth now is unfit to serve.... 

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 02:47 | 1637398 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

All is fair in love and war, soldiers that think outside of the box are very valuable

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Makes me laugh. Cheap shippment of propaganda again.

Not everything is fair in war. What is fair is determined by the mighty in this US world order.

And nobody is better placed to think out of the box than people who determine what is fair or not.

Not only that, but being the one who determines what is fair allows to measure up what is fair against your own capacities, that is declare things you can actually perform as being fair, without relying on fantasy attempts.

And to that, when in position, one can also turn a blind eye to stuff that are not considered fair.

Covering up for an ethnical cleansing with humanitarian concern is nothing new, it is US citizenism trademark. I think NATO treaty or something might even have a point against it.

It does not prevent Libyans from performing that old trick, being known and visible to the most.

That BS of innovation, thinking out of the box, is cheap propaganda to hide the fact that people setting up the rules are in the best positions to know the loopholes and exploit them in an actual way.

Dont speak latin with a clergyman.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 23:58 | 1637088 Migrated Bird
Migrated Bird's picture

Is libya the next afghanistan?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:16 | 1635681 Bend
Bend's picture

Freeeeeedom!!!!! Not oil, never oil, what's oil? Try to think whitout the tin foil for once.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:32 | 1635749 formadesika3
formadesika3's picture

 

All you need to know. No tin foil hat required.

"The Libyan economy depends primarily upon revenues from the oil sector, which contribute about 95 percent of export earnings, 25 percent of GDP, and 80 percent of government revenue."

 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:39 | 1635772 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

I'm sorry. Did you say "government"?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:44 | 1635796 formadesika3
formadesika3's picture

No I didn't. The author of the article said it. Should we distrust everyone with two middle initials? Personally, I'm open-minded about such things.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:49 | 1635973 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

I don't know how open minded i am in actuality but i can be convinced of pretty much anything. Since i have two middle initials as well u are of course absolutely correct in trusting people with that condition.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:14 | 1636022 formadesika3
formadesika3's picture

It is after all an inherited condition and nothing you chose for yourself. And you honor your parents by continuing to bear that burden. So you're okay in my book and I will trust you or anyone else until they prove that trust misplaced ; -)

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 19:25 | 1636263 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

May you ignore those who claim i am a lying, thieving scoundrel who cavorts with unsavory women fine sir!

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:11 | 1636386 Jendrzejczyk
Jendrzejczyk's picture

Elegant fencing sirs.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:46 | 1636541 formadesika3
formadesika3's picture

Just to ease your mind, DV, I haven't heard a single person who claims you cavort with unsavory women ;)

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:23 | 1635715 lynnybee
lynnybee's picture

the entire YOUTUBE video is good; it's long, but the first 10 minutes says a lot .    pray for the innocents in LIBYA .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qNLqQ2cN-PA&feature=player_embedded

 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:32 | 1635748 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

They may never understand.

WTI oil hit $147/barrel just 3 years ago -- and sports fans, Libya was in full production that year.  It didn't matter.  And it won't matter.

The flow rate can't keep up with population.  This is not rocket science.

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 00:53 | 1637211 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

mebbe

is there something about "cartel" and "price" that you're having trouble coming to terms with? 

is there something about iraq and libya being members of "opec" which "our coalitions" have taken down, military, that is "news to youse"? 

or is it just "other people" who "may never understand"???

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:35 | 1635758 Soul Train
Soul Train's picture

Without France, the fledging Americans could never have beaten the tax fu*king English empire in the late 1700's.

Afterwards, even Napoleon also gave the States all that Lousiana territory.

Got to love France if you're for liberty.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:25 | 1635901 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

We didn't beat England, they gave up. The whole way the war was fought by England reminds me of the way the US fights wars now (in Iraq and Afghanistan). Read a history book and get realistic. Also the French didn't help the US out of the kindness of their hearts, they did it to balance power in Europe. Think of what would have happened if the US grew as much as it did (along with British controlled Canada). France would have ceased to be a world power.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:43 | 1635952 KinorSensase
KinorSensase's picture

Didn't we lose the Rev War?  Why fight for a colony openly with armies if you can control its finances through stealth?

This thought is based on general intuition more than anything, but I've got a hunch the Brits let us have our illusion of freedom simply because it served the interests of the Rothschilds et al to not waste a bunch of time paying soldiers when there were monied elite within the colonies who would continue fighting for their interests regardless of who "won" the war.  Of course, I could be wrong here.

Also intuition: I'm thinking Benny Franklin, the maestro of paper money, sold our asses out on this one.  I'm guessing I've got a couple junks coming for this one...I'll wear them with pride.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:18 | 1636406 Jendrzejczyk
Jendrzejczyk's picture

Your foil hat is shiny and magnificent.

Would the personal papers of those involved prove your theory correct?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:36 | 1635764 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

A very nice, albeit somewhat technical article on Libyan oil potential

http://www.businessinsider.com/libya-oil-exports-2011-2

It is a reprint from a couple of years ago...but still relevant

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:39 | 1635773 RobotTrader
RobotTrader's picture

Crude oil was sacked this morning.

Let's bring it back down to $35/barrel.

It is the ultimate "tax cut".

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:41 | 1635781 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

That would be nice, but then again there are a lot of other bidders in the room.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:46 | 1635805 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Umm... ok.

Are you and Michelle Bachmann going to "git er done?"

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:37 | 1635934 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

soon one ounce of gold will buy 100 bbls of oil because gold is so damn valuable and oil ain't worth squat. lulz

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:53 | 1635984 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

We will see $35/barrel WTI, but price is not informative.

Brent will be $85 then, but that's not really the point.  You get to $35 by having only 2 flights per WEEK from NYC to LAX, because there are not enough passengers to fill any more than 2.

Oil scarcity destroys economies, then if they try to grow, it destroys them again.  

Forever.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 19:30 | 1636278 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Add in a solid dose of 30 percent unemployment and we'll be ready to rock!

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 16:42 | 1635787 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

Pepe Escobar calls it "Humanitarian Imperialism" 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:10 | 1635864 tempo
tempo's picture

"Let's take the SOB's out", Labor leader at Obama rally today. The SOB's are anyone who dissents or has a different opinion. Sounds like a Nazi rally in the 1930s.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:27 | 1635908 Bobbyrib
Bobbyrib's picture

or anyone not for the War in Iraq in 2003.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:19 | 1636409 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

or anyone not for the libya war. head over to the huffpo and there's nothing but warmongers calling for war with libya and pakistan. anyone who opposes is a racist and traitor

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:13 | 1635869 King_of_simpletons
King_of_simpletons's picture

Operation Initialize Libya (bitchez).

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:35 | 1635929 KinorSensase
KinorSensase's picture

Water is also key in refining crude, right?  Max Keiser interviewed Isa Blumi recently and he talked at length about Yemen's water supply and it's role in oil production regionally.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgIKMGQTSnM

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:36 | 1635931 mt paul
mt paul's picture

trashed a functioning society 

for a few more barrels

of dinosaur  goo...

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:53 | 1635985 X.inf.capt
X.inf.capt's picture

but havent we always trashed 'other' people for thier 'stuff'?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:58 | 1635998 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

well, not "always", but then again "kill people and break things".

- Ned

{OT: 11A?}

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:15 | 1636024 X.inf.capt
X.inf.capt's picture

11A NG and C.S.M.R. enl before that 11B. but that was a long time ago...

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:18 | 1636405 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

:-), ya, me 0802 (lending dignity) but, well, I got recycled to 0302, kinda' same.  Esp. cuz' I worked for Kelley.

s/f

- Ned

{and yes, a long time ago.  But "keep the faith" for all the bruthaz and (nowadays) the sistaz.}

{{and, well, "Welcome home, brother.}}

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 22:40 | 1636916 X.inf.capt
X.inf.capt's picture

im serv con dis. myself. do alot of  volunteer work for vets (homeless, etc) and we have a food bank just for vets.  man, is it ugly. when i first started there we would have maybe 60 vets to give food to......the last time i volunteered there, there was, no joke, 741 vets looking for food. most were middle class before they lost everything.....geez, guys, thank you for service, now go live onthe street. man, somethings gotta give....

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 01:44 | 1637329 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

amputee? 

or are you one of the hundreds of thousands of "men" who didn't "feel good" after they got home and cashed in for $3000/month, forever? hard to tell, sometimes...

you sound pretty healthy "captain of infantry".  hope you're really disabled, for your own sake, and not just another scam-artist who usta wear a uniform, with a "medal he won in the war, weighs 500 pounds and it sleeps by the door..."

you sound like your identity is totally "tied up" by your "X" job.  food stamps not enuf for these guys to eat on?  you help them "get on VA dis"?  i had a guy who came to a garage sale i was having several years ago.  he bought the nikon system i "shot" vietNam with, by lo-balling me, and i took his offer.  he said:  how much you getting?  i told him:  zero.  he couldn't believe it and started writing down for me the name & ph.# of "the woman" to contact to apply and the name & # of the local "vets group guy(s)" who would show me exactly what to say and write to document my "disability" and "get with the program, like everybody else".  when i told him i wasn't interested and hadn't been for almost 35 years till then, he looked at me, my old car, the stuff i was selling, and told me i was "crazy"!  very sharp guy, w/ a brand new truck and also owned several rentals, too!  perfectly healthy, too, as far as i could tell.  real "winner" too, just ask him!

now, i know a lotta guys that can't walk, think, see or fuk right due to their "tour", but i'm not one of them.  sorry that you are.  hang in there, dai wi!

JOAN BAEZ & JEFFERYSHURTLEFF ~ He`s A Drug Store Truck Drivin` Man ~ - YouTube

 

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 16:11 | 1639360 X.inf.capt
X.inf.capt's picture

i understand you, p-rat. when i was a private e- nothing in the mid 80's, my first squad leader was a nam vet. WOW, you sound just like him. cynical, not afraid to say it like he saw it, a realist. it was by the leadership and training of guys like him to took their experience in nam and created the army of desert storm, and handed iraq its ass on a plate....

so ill answer your questions, one grunt to another...

i have good days and bad days, and i use a cane, and its not for show...

i weigh 175, not 500. 

my medals, dog tags, cib, and blue cord lived in a shoe box, till my daughter ask for them.

i have NEVER directed anyone to AMVETS or DAV, god as my witness.and finally, yeah, i may be proud of my service of my service in the inf., now, but it wasnt always like that, too many friends gone, one way or another..., too much pain, and enough blood for 2 lifetimes. you know EXACTLY what talking about...

thank you for yoyr service to our country, and us kids couldnt have pulled off what we did without your experience...

so, keep your cannons loaded, fly that black flag, take no prisoners and keep your sails full, for we still a ways to go on this journey..

fair winds, p-rats, fair winds....

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:41 | 1635946 Mediocritas
Mediocritas's picture

France was behind this thing right from the start. The Arab Spring was just convenient timing for them. Good article here: http://whowhatwhy.com/2011/08/31/now-that-we’re-celebrating-qaddafi’s-end-can-we-get-a-little-truth/

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:26 | 1636431 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

"France was behind this thing right from the start."

Say it isn't so!  They told us it was a) the Muslim Spring, and b) an indigineous uprising, with c) no involvement of any "outsiders".

Go figure.

- Ned

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:44 | 1635956 dexter_morgan
dexter_morgan's picture

Where has Cindy Sheehan gone? Shouldn't she be camping out on Obama's front lawn calling him a killer and starting a war for oil and all that good stuff?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:49 | 1635972 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

One word - "settlement".  She is quite happy now.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:15 | 1636029 bugs_
bugs_'s picture

it wasn't about what she said it was about.

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 00:20 | 1637129 sun tzu
sun tzu's picture

It wasn't about oil - that's what the simpletons always think. It is about world dominance. 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 17:51 | 1635978 Wave-Tech
Wave-Tech's picture

The NAVIGATOR Weighs in on Jobs and the Economy: >>

I think most everyone will like this feature, check it out.

 http://www.elliottwavetechnology.com/news/929.cfm

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:10 | 1636015 ISEEIT
ISEEIT's picture

They have picked you all off first from the beginning. Paradoxically you are the best and the worst.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:19 | 1636041 hinter uns das all
hinter uns das all's picture

Vitol (Ru) seems to loose contracts, Glencore (CH/GB) seems to establish its position in Libya. 

 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:27 | 1636050 falak pema
falak pema's picture

The french will improve their balance of trade on this one. Bunga bunga will lose a big one there. You can see the Italians are beginning to sweat on this one. With Qatar in there we see the outlines of Sarkozy's new MENA strategy. He is Frederick 1I to GWB's play of unilteral clash of civilizations as Saint Louis. Frederick II believed in negotiating for Jerusalem with the Ayyoubid kings. He  succeeded for eight years. Then lost control of Jerusalem because of local rebellious frankish barons who rebelled against his suzerainty. 

The aftermath of this play, complicated by his ongoing war against the Pope, led to Saint Louis's disastrous crusade. 

Today Sarkozy is doing a reverse historical play; GWB played at Saint Louis and Sarkozy plays at Frederick II. By trying a multilateral approach to achieve the same strategic aims of dominating the Oil patch. 

This new approach is worth noting. Will multilateral management of Oil patch and financial architecture be his strategy to put Europe back on the Map? 

It all depends on Merkel on the financial front. Whereas on the military side, its France and Britain + Qatar's financial and Arab influence.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 18:26 | 1636054 Sparkey
Sparkey's picture

OK! The tale told to us features "Rebels" fighting to protrct prople with NOTO's help. What do other people in the World hear?

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 20:48 | 1636387 scrappy
scrappy's picture

Not so sure, 3/4 of the planet is underwater, it seems we have barely scratched the surface, (pardon the unpun).

 

Thomas Gold deserves a second look IMHO. 

 

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Thomas_Gold

 

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Abiogenic_petroleum_origin

 

http://freeenergynews.com/Directory/Theory/SustainableOil/

 

I really like the last above article, b/c I think the idea we should concerve oil wisely for specialized uses will be imperative as we necessarily transition to the next energy solution mix.

 

Just a thought... Happy Labor Day ZHers.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 22:02 | 1636819 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Reposted from another thread:

Let's play a game:

Compute the depth at which the required pressures exist, take into account the fraction of material in the mantle that comprises your three inputs. Fold in the reaction rate. Now integrate over the volume where the requisite conditions exist. 

Finally diffuse the putative oil to the surface, taking into account that complex hydrocarbons will cook down to NG and the permeability of the mantle and crust.

Do this calculation and estimate a rate for contribution of abiotic oil.

If you cannot do this calculation, simply STFU as it demonstrates that you do not understand the science enough to see through the bullshit.

Edit: Another version of the game, perhaps one that you can understand....

The most optimistic estimates of original oil in place is about 10 trillion barrels. The earth is ~4 billion years old. This gives a rate of 2,500 barrels a year.... Hell, I'll give you 100 trillion barrels.... are you starting to see the problem?

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 04:15 | 1637474 falak pema
falak pema's picture

I think you've lost him in transient abiotic levitation; bemused by scientific transalation, incredulous to transmutation of wood into precious black gold over a billion years. Some people NEED to believe in black magic! 

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 22:36 | 1636904 Van Halen
Van Halen's picture

It's also interesting to note that Obama has sent our military to Libya (One of six conflicts our troops are in right now) to back 'rebels' who are rounding up blacks and killing them. Don't expect to hear any complaint from the Congressional Black Caucus though, they're busy screwing their own black neighborhoods and trying to start a race war here.

 

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 02:55 | 1637407 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Or they are pretty aware of what it means to be a US citizen.

Contrary to the fantaisists' claims, Obama is no better defined than by the US citizen tag. US citizens who can not admit that they have a negro in office want him to be a black man (with what it is supposed to mean in US citizenism), a marxist, a third world supporter, a muslim...

But first and all, this negro has been a US citizen, working to further and protect US best interests.

All these people are US patriots.

Mon, 09/05/2011 - 22:50 | 1636930 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Who would have ever guessed Libya had oil /

Fucking NATO....

World police for the Americans.

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 01:10 | 1637182 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

 

 

Under Gadaffi Lybian banks loaned money interest-free, gas was 14 cents / gal, home ownership was considered a citizen right, and Lybians had the highest standard of living in Africa.

Let's see how well they do under the new "humanitarian" America-Wall-Street-CIA-NATO-rebel-proxy regime.

Tue, 09/06/2011 - 03:07 | 1637415 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Let's see how well they do under the new "humanitarian" America-Wall-Street-CIA-NATO-rebel-proxy regime.
::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

In the US world order, this question is already answered.

They will do better no matter what. Complainers (who might bring in facts) will do it because they are Gadaffi's supporters.

This is what one earns when one is freed in this US driven world.

The day previous to the liberation, a struggling person was a person oppressed by an odious tyrant who was responsible of all this person's woes.

The day after the liberation, the same struggling person is rag tag, a sore loser, a good for nothing, somebody who lacks initiative, work ethics and entrepreneurship spirit to fare in a free society.

Expect the free press to tell stories about Libyan who knew how to seize opportunities, which means in US speech, sell your country out to support West standards of life.

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