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Guest Post: What "Average Joe" Really Thinks

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Submitted by Lance Roberts of StreetTalk Live

What "Average Joe" Really Thinks

gallup-consumer-spending-110911Every day we are blugeoned with a variety of economic reports from various government agencies about the state of the economy.   Most of these reports have some form or another of "seasonal adjustments", speculations, estimations or just flat out "guesses" about what is going on in the economy.   What we tend to find out over time is that these numbers are generally overly optimistic during recessionary periods as we are in today.

Today, we are going to look at three different polls from the Gallup organization on consumer spending, the economy and employment.   The Gallup organization has studied human nature and behavior for more than 75 years and focus on what people "think and feel" about various issues.   They employ many of the world's leading scientists in management, economics, psychology, and sociology, and other consultants to identify and monitor behavior.

The key difference between Gallup and the various government agencies is that these polls are direct questionnaires to individuals and the responses are tallied and reported.   There are no adjustments, assumptions, guesses, etc.   In the famous words of Bill Clinton; "What is...is."

Consumerism

So, with that in mind, let's start by taking a look at the consumer spending poll.  In the recent 3rd quarter GDP report we saw the personal consumption expenditures made up a very large portion of the increase in GDP.   While the media trumpeted the consumption as a return of the consumer the reality was it was spent on utilities and healthcare rather than "other" types of consumption.   

This clearly shows up in the consumption spending of average Americans that were polled by Gallup.    The consumer spending poll tracks the average dollar amount Americans reported spending or charging on a daily basis NOT COUNTING the purchase of a home, auto or normal household bills.   Therefore, this survey strips out the spending on utilities and focuses on the actual purchases of "stuff" that drives final demand for businesses.   As you can see there has been virtually no movement in the index since the recession took hold in the U.S. which is indicative of their attitudes that we never left a recession to start with.

More importantly, the index was at 81 at the beginning of July when 3rd Quarter GDP started and ended the 3rd Quarter period at 59.   So, while GDP reported a surge in Personal Consumption Expenditures (PCE) in the first "ESTIMATE" of 3rd quarter GDP; the Gallup survey of consumers actual spending patterns DECLINED by 27% during the same period.

Employment

gallup-employment-110911Not surprisingly, employment plays a big factor in consumer spending.  If the consumer is unemployed or underemployed they tend to have less money to spend.   Therefore, this shows up in consumer spending patterns.  While the Bureau of Labor Statistics does a lot of estimating with seasonal factors and "birth/death adjustments" when reporting employment and unemployment in the U.S.; the Gallup survey simply asks individuals in they are under-or unemployed.

Gallup's U.S. employment measures report the percentage of U.S. adults in the workforce, ages 18 and older, who are underemployed and unemployed, without seasonal adjustment. "Underemployed" respondents are employed part time, but want to work full time, or they are unemployed. "Unemployed" respondents are those within the underemployed group who are not employed, even for one hour a week, but are available and looking for work. Results for each 30-day rolling average are based on telephone interviews with approximately 30,000 adults.   The BLS report includes individuals that are 16 years and older and uses seasonal adjustments for comparison.

While the number of those directly unemployed has fallen from the peak of when this poll was began at 11% to 8.5% today the number of individuals that are underemployed has fairly stagnant and close to its peak of just over 20%.    The recent decline in the percentage of unemployed does confirm the recent slight upticks in hiring seen in the recent employment reports.   However, it also shows that a lot of that hiring may be occurring in areas that are part time or lower paying wage jobs as shown by the larger uptick in the "underemployed" status recently. 

Regardless, the levels of unemployment and underemployment are high, and while recent improvements are encouraging, any economic shocks could send these numbers higher in a hurry.   Notice the spikes in both reports early in 2011 as the economy was struggling through a very weak patch.   With the "super committee" now effectively out of commission and automatic spending cuts looming that will subtract from GDP growth, international worries and a potential recession in the next year there are plenty of catalysts to send workers back to the unemployment line.   This leads us to the confidence in the economy as a whole.

Economic Confidence

gallup-economic-confidence-111011Gallup's economic confidence survey which is the combined responses to two questions: 1) rate the economic condition of the country today, and; 2) is the economic condition getting better or worse, really ties into consumers employment status and their ability to live.    The chart compares the results of the economic confidence survey to the S&P 500.   What is important to note is that economic confidence is closely tied to the performance of the S&P 500.  

This was "The Bernank's" direct remarks when launching QE 2 in 2010 when we said that by targeting asset prices it would boost consumer confidence.  He was correct.   As the market rallied consumers expectations about the economy improved but unfortunately there ability to consume didn't improve along with it.

However, there is another way to look at this chart.   The economic survey has tended to be a leading indicator of the economy as a whole and the markets.   The last time that the survey had declined to these levels the economy was mired in a deep recession BUT the market was still near its highs.   As we have discussed in recent missives on the economy, and as confirmed by the ECRI, we are likely in, or about to be in, a recession.   If that analysis is correct then the economic survey may be confirming the same which means the stock market has some catching up to do.

It's All About The Consumer

While we watch the almost daily deluge of government reports that the media focuses on from one minute to the next it is important not to forget that it really all revolves around the consumer and primarily the small businesses that make up the bulk of hiring in the country.  With real incomes declining, debt burdens stripping cash flows, home values falling, international turmoil, domestic political infighting and concerns about keeping a job if they have one, or finding one if they don't, there are not a lot of positive inputs to spur a strong consumer driven recovery.   This lack of demand by the consumer is also why small businesses have no appetite for obtaining credit, increasing production or expansion of hiring beyond absolute necessity.  

So, while "Rome burns" and our government "fiddles" while warring amongst itself over what policies to enact, where to cut spending or how to increase revenues it is important to remember that there are "real" people affected by the decisions made and actions taken.   This is why I find the Gallup polls interesting - it is the voice of the "average American" ringing through and it is only a shame that our leaders aren't listening.

 

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Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:45 | 1867227 transaccountin
transaccountin's picture

the worse the numbers and dread the higher the funny magic retail sales climb, no inflation /sarc

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:53 | 1867266 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

Average Joe Sixpack does not think.
He just follows the herd into the abattoir.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:55 | 1867282 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

If that comment doesn't get you 50+ arrows, then ZH readership quality is being diluted faster than GRPN or something.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:10 | 1867336 Herd Redirectio...
Herd Redirection Committee's picture

"our leaders aren't listening"

Are you talking about the politicians?  Because they just put on a show of power, really their strings are being pulled from much higher up.  We all know its the 'Money Powers' who are running things, and things are going as they planned, thank you very much!  If there is a way to rid the world of a few billion 'useless eaters' you can be sure these guys will already have the groundwork laid.  Iran/Israel, any one?  I hope I'm wrong, I really really hope so.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:47 | 1867511 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

'Our leaders arent listening'...

No, its just that puppets do not have ears.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:14 | 1867347 oddjob
oddjob's picture

ZH readership quality took a big dive 43 weeks 2 days ago.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:39 | 1867397 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

I see I've struck a nerve. Good. So... you've been feeling helpless for a year and 23 weeks or much longer?

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:52 | 1867547 oddjob
oddjob's picture

Maybe just lighten up on the patronizing just a tad.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:36 | 1867696 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

Why you and a few others(GRPN investors/members) took this as a personal attack is beyond me. As you can see most people here see 'average joe' marching to his own slaughter. Nobody is happy about it but it's so.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:16 | 1867919 oddjob
oddjob's picture

Don't attach your groupon shit to me. If it doesnt produce Gold or Silver(or Oil) I won't touch it. I will leave those shit stocks to you and Robo.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:30 | 1868007 Sgt.Sausage
Sgt.Sausage's picture

I had to look up abbatoir first, and then I gave him an upboat.

 

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:37 | 1868026 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Isn't it a nice feeling when you finally meet your roots Sgt. Sausage?

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:30 | 1868008 Sgt.Sausage
Sgt.Sausage's picture

I had to look up abbatoir first, and then I gave him an upboat.

 

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:50 | 1868070 traderjoe
traderjoe's picture

I hate holier-than-thou statements. A pox on you and the high horse you rode in on.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:04 | 1867317 Shocker
Shocker's picture

I think the Average Joe, knows there are some serious problems in the economy. Its not that things don't look/work right, its because they are not.

All theses numbers are just used to keep you continually guessing, and to never have a clue

http://www.dailyjobcuts.com

.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:50 | 1867531 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Yes, he knows something is wrong but he has no life experience to triangulate what is going on, all he has is neo-classical economic hacks of all stripes blowing smoke up his ass.... He does not have a sufficiently well rounded education to figure out who is lying and why. He is getting frustrated and angry....

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:58 | 1867486 GeoffreyT
GeoffreyT's picture

"Average Joe Sixpack does not think." 

 

And yet, those who believe in 'democracy' (mythologised gang rape) would have you believe that the votes of the non-thinking schlubs ought to determine which political parasites get to live palaces at everyone's expense.

That aside, I am less inclined than you to reprise the ideas of that tawdry cunt Lippman (who, like Leo Strauss, believed that the masses were too stupid to be trusted - and thus NEEDED to be lied to for their own good).

That might seem at odds with my contrarianism - my trading style is specifically based on the idea that the bulk of the crowd makes systematic, exploitable errors during periods of entreme sentiment: that is, that the crwod is usually wrong.

On balance, it seems to me that most of the people I've ever met are fundamentally pleasant and wish no undeserved ill on others... until they get told who to hate: usually it's the State  telling them who to hate, and especially so when the bodycount is significant.

One of the best expositions of this idea is "PsyWars" - see http://bit.ly/w1Q7da - which is similar to the (lower-key) "Manufacturing Consent".

 

Also, maybe we all need to cut Joe Six-pack some slack: the poor fucker spent twelve years being indoctrinated to pledge allegiance to a piece of cloth, and recite a socialist mantra like a Soviet-Style automaton. Then he gets chucked into a cubicle or a factory floor, and spends the rest of his life trying to make ends meet while being nickel-and-dimed by the system... by the time he gets home he's spent, and sits in front of the TV and gets hypnotised into believing all sorts of shit that his overlords want him to believe (we call that 'news').

His best bet is if he figures out that he can suckle at the tax-payers tit and become the BIG drain on humanity: the bureaucracy. 

If he becomes a soldier, or a pig (of whatever-the-fuck agency), or a prison guard or a TSA agent... THEN he's a valid target for disdain unless and until he changes his ways. Those cunts are WAY worse than Joe Sixpack, because they're the ones whipping so Massa don't needs to git he hands doity. They're the kapos, the house niggers - the people who actively work so that people who despise them can live in palaces.

 

Y'all might think I've had some Damascene conversion - after all, I bang on all the time about how 68% of Yanks believe that angels and demons are active in their everyday lives (according to a Pew Poll in 2007: see http://bit.ly/tkNBWN )... and of course there's the whole thing that people believe in a genocidal Sky Wizard who granted some sister-fucking nomad the keys to the kingdom in exchange for cock-snippings, blood sprinkles and burnt offal.

But that's my point entirely: if you take a child of normal intelligence and fill their head full of shit, you wind up with a person of normal intelligence whose head is full of shit.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:22 | 1867709 nowhereman
nowhereman's picture

+1000

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:29 | 1867750 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Damn fine rant....

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:17 | 1868750 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

GeoffryT,

I consider you a brother of mine after that spectacular, bare knuckled fury of truth you unleashed.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:58 | 1867587 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Hope & Change.  Idiots brainwashed by TV and every channel and network are all the same.  Stupid sheep who watch TV.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:55 | 1867652 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Speaking of idiots, you are making some noteworthy contributions... Haven't heard a well articulated thought come from your way yet, just a bunch of empty platitudes and rhetoric and some really misguided shit about energy...

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:03 | 1868278 Snidley Whipsnae
Snidley Whipsnae's picture

Flakmeister... Freddie is just visiting this planet... from planet 'The Oil Drum'...

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:42 | 1868367 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Naw... he escaped from the Yahoo! or Marketwatch boards....

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 21:21 | 1868467 Think for yourself
Think for yourself's picture

Now now, don't be too hard on the kid. Flak's criticism was tough but could at least be taken constructively. Now your devolving to name calling will definitely not show him how things are done around here, while doing yourself the dishonor of lowering you to his level conversationally. How about we clean up our rethoric a little?

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 22:32 | 1868609 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

Fight Club is a tough place, fools of any stripe are not coddled....

If anything I was defending the Oil Drum....

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:46 | 1867232 WineSorbet
WineSorbet's picture

Explain to me why every restaurant is literally packed wherever I go almost every day of the week.  Granted I'm looking at Brooklyn and Manhattan but it's full of relatively young patrons spending a lot of money.  Bah.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:47 | 1867246 malalingua
malalingua's picture

I bet it's on credit or on their student loans, same thing I guess.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:52 | 1867263 ArkansasAngie
ArkansasAngie's picture

It isn't true here in Arkansas.

I have actually noticed my grocery store is fuller.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:23 | 1867381 I Got Worms
I Got Worms's picture

For the past year, every time I've made a trip to Lowe's (in Texas) it's been damn near empty.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:16 | 1867674 11b40
11b40's picture

For the first time in memory, both Lowes & Home Depot are closing doors and reducing store count.  New stores are coming that will have smaller footprints, fewer items.  More emphasis on their web sites, too.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:05 | 1868282 Snidley Whipsnae
Snidley Whipsnae's picture

ArkAngie... Perhaps your grocery store is 'fuller' because more people are preparing meals at home?

...and the Lowes/Home Depot in my area are like ghost towns.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:11 | 1867288 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Explain to me why every restaurant is literally packed wherever I go almost every day of the week.  Granted I'm looking at Brooklyn and Manhattan but it's full of relatively young patrons spending a lot of money.  Bah.

 

Because a) Manhattan and various other welfare state areas, bailed out and blessed by Paulson, The Bernank, Geithner, ObaMao & Daley, (having the all important /s financial industry subsidized by taxpayers in the rest of the nation thanks to The Bernank & Geithner), hasn't had its day of true reckoning yet, and b) even those who can't make it in that highly subsidized space still have their plastic fantastic and have to "fake it until they make it - or crash and burn, tapped out."

Don't worry, though. Basic arithmetic forecasts to all with their eyes and ears open, with a 100% successful track record, that the subsidization is closer to the end, one (less violent and messy) way or (more violent and messy) another.

Wall Street & K Street - the two true welfare, taxpayer subsidized clusters in Amerika.

 

"I'll have some of the yellow -- oh, and some of that blue."

-- Cousin Eddie

(Cousin Eddie, who used to make 200k+ a year as a mortgage broker in Las Vegas during the housing bubble, and who typically then ate at Craftsteak & Del Frisco, was recently spotted in a buffet line at Filthy Sam's Casino & Truck Stop in Reno, flouting a Hawaii print shirt, splurging on the $1.99 all you can eat jello buffet.)

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:51 | 1867262 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

Go to a restaurant where they accept only cash.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:54 | 1867270 scatterbrains
scatterbrains's picture

because your either not paying your mortgage or your living in mommy's basement... leads to enough spare change to go out and pretend all is well and forget your problems over a burger and beer.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:53 | 1867273 sabra1
sabra1's picture

RobotTrader , his family, and friends, living it up on his daily winning stock market picks!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:53 | 1867274 tickhound
tickhound's picture

18 yr olds being bombarded with credit card applications... One last market to tap out.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:55 | 1867283 Thorny Xi
Thorny Xi's picture

80% of the people are still working on average, with 20% under/unemployment, and 90% of the younger ones don't know how to cook? 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:50 | 1867535 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

No, 80% of 'the people' arent working, only 1 out of 5 'work' in the first place. You mean 80% of the workforce is working.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:57 | 1868097 Sgt.Sausage
Sgt.Sausage's picture

I don't know who upvoted that, but I should downvote you both. "only 1 out of 5 'work' in the first place."

I call shenanigans on that. [1]. That's only 20% of the population.

Let's get to a, y'know, actual source: the Bureau of Labor Statistics. BLS puts the current number at 58.4%[2] - call it three times your 20%.

I fully understand the nature of some "fudging" of data here and there, especially by FedGov[3], but to inflate the workforce numbers by 300%? I want some of what you're smoking.

 

[1] Actually, I call "bullshit".

[2] http://www.bls.gov/news.release/archives/empsit_11042011.pdf  Table A1, "

Employment-population ratio"

 [3] http://www.shadowstats.com/

Here's your downvote.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:57 | 1867290 karzai_luver
karzai_luver's picture

Well where we go lots of places are packed and just around the corner or down the block are 5 places that are closed.

Look around , you may or may not find the same.

There are spots where the "downturn" never really hit hard and other spots that were wiped out.

 

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:03 | 1867310 pods
pods's picture

And of course picking one of the most densely populated areas in the US where most do not have a day's worth of food stored translates well to the rest of the world.

pods

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:07 | 1867326 Hippocratic Oaf
Hippocratic Oaf's picture

If you walked into said restaurant you would notice what they are NOT eating and drinking. My wife and I notice a lot of shared meals and the city is always running 'restaurant weeks'. Restaurants are places to meet and chat because most people live in apartments that they are embarrassed of. Even 'full', restaurants suffer to an extent.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:21 | 1867702 11b40
11b40's picture

Go long "to go" boxes.  I am seeing more of them.  At the end of the meal, what hasn't been eaten is going home to be eaten later.  Just watch when you go out to dinner.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:12 | 1867340 Moe Gamble
Moe Gamble's picture

It's definitely not what I'm seeing in Vegas. Restaurants are less crowded, stores are less crowded, casinos and shows are less crowded. Plus long-established restaurants, stores and businesses are still closing.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:55 | 1868087 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

Vegas is doomed.

It is based on an economic model depending on people having money to lose, and is located far from its customer base - requiring gas or jet fuel to vitsit.  Furthermore it's in the middle of a desert - in a place no sane humans would otherwise live.  Eneregy and water will both be in shorter and shorter supply in the future - with fewer and fewer customers for the vices Las Vegas offers.  The whales are going elsewhere - especially the Asians who are staying closer to home - while the small fish don't have any money to lose these days.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:14 | 1867341 bbq on whitehou...
bbq on whitehouse lawn's picture

Margin squeese. Less places less places to go, if you have the money.

Dating is still occuring dispite the ecomomy.  Some forces are stronger then others. Ask any phd, or teen.  Since teens have all the answers and know everything.

 

Ps. I guess you got your explination.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:22 | 1867379 Cugel
Cugel's picture

Ask any phd, or teen.  Since teens have all the answers and know everything.

Yeah, and Ph.Ds, too!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:19 | 1867366 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

That's elementary, American women (generally speaking) can't cook. Hence the restaurants are always full, plus the 'food' served there has an addictive component.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:20 | 1867373 paterphysi
paterphysi's picture

Living in NYC I see this too, especially where I work. But then in my office the vast majority of people come from money -- there are people here in their 30s whose apartments are paid for by mommy and daddy. I guess they are immune from the day-to-day worries of the middle class.

 

I bet if one went to the real Brooklyn (not Park Slope, Brooklyn Heights, Williamsburg, etc.) one would see those having trouble with paying for groceries and all that.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:23 | 1867382 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

I'm fairly certain that Versailles and all the other palaces of the little Lords and Ladies were full of merriment almost up until the moment they were all dragged off to the guillotines.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:32 | 1867429 adr
adr's picture

mmmmm NYC?

Wall Street banks generating more profit in the past 2 1/2 years than the previous 8 years combined probably has something to do with it.

Walk into Morton's Steakhouse in Cleveland. Nobody is there except for the bar at happy hour. I spend my days selling product in the middle of the country and the middle of the country is in deep shit.

people eat out because it is virtually impossible to buy food at a grocery store for less than you can buy it on a dollar menu at McDonald's. Seriously you can buy 10 double cheeseburgers for $10. Yeah buying your own fresh meat will probably taste better but at $5 a pound, 8 buns for $3.49, $5 for a pack of American cheese, $2.99 for a head of lettuce you'll be out $20 or more just to make the equivalent of that $10 worth of McD burgers.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 19:01 | 1868104 cynicalskeptic
cynicalskeptic's picture

NYC may have some action still but the restaurants in the burbs are slowing dramatically - lucky to get one turn in a night.  The employed 20 somethings that were sharing apartments in Manhattan or Brooklyn are moving back home while the newer grads are still looking for employment - and never left home.  

A good overall indicator is the liquor industry.  Sales to bars and restaurants are down - store sales have increased.  People are still drinking, but at home- they can't afford to go out.

 

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:52 | 1867549 Nation of Imbeciles
Nation of Imbeciles's picture

Most young people (those under 40) are averse to cooking so they eat out.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 19:48 | 1868237 lotsoffun
lotsoffun's picture

because daddy doesn't want to see the little ones deprived of anything.  and also because it doesn't matter if you don't pay your condo mortgage or credit card bills.  try getting outside of one of the biggest metro areas on the planet.  it's not the same.  they are empty.

 

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:46 | 1867233 I think I need ...
I think I need to buy a gun's picture

SHITTERS FULL

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:19 | 1867689 Shitters_Full
Shitters_Full's picture

You rang?

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:46 | 1867235 malalingua
malalingua's picture

I can no longer afford to be a consumer so I guess that just makes me a citizen. 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:54 | 1867278 s2man
s2man's picture

Nope.  Sorry to tell you.  Citizens have rights.  You are now just a person. 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:00 | 1867302 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

"Citizen" is the label of the self-enslaved who wants to equally enslave all others who desire freedom.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:00 | 1867304 pods
pods's picture

Actually citizens have privileges, people have rights.

pods

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:09 | 1867333 s2man
s2man's picture

Aggh.  That sounds correct.  If so, and they have taken away so many of our rights, what is below people?  What are we now?

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:16 | 1867355 bbq on whitehou...
bbq on whitehouse lawn's picture

People dont have names. Taxpayer's and citizens do.

I am a member of the people, i have no id, sign or mark.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:30 | 1867413 pods
pods's picture

As bbq said above, people are sovereign.  We the people ordained the constitution.  We the people made it the law.  How?  By our sovereign authority.

Most people have given up their rights in exchange for the privileges afforded in the 14th amendment.  By doing so, you have waived your rights. Of course, this is without your knowledge.

They technically have not taken away your rights, you have waived them to be a part of the 14th amendment trust, ie became a citizen.

pods

edit:  http://1215.org/

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:44 | 1867494 s2man
s2man's picture

I think they erased about 1/3 of the Bill of Rights with the patriot act.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:02 | 1867610 pods
pods's picture

Well technically they have sort of adopted the organic constitution for citizens, but as revocable privileges.  So yes, the Patriot act did take away those "rights" even though they were merely civil rights, which is code for a state granted privilege.

A right is something you exercise independent of anyone else, and rights are anything that the sovereign declares they are.  The Bill of Rights was actually looked upon very badly when proposed, for good measure.

Read Federalist 84 and what Hamilton (yeah, that central bank Hamilton) said about the bill of rights.  It shows why there was an objection to it, and it came true.  Any listing of rights would certainly omit something, and that would be taken as it wasn't there, it wasn't a right.  The constitution was framework of rules for the government, ordained by the people, to abide by.  If it wasn't in there, they had no business being involved.  The bill of rights blurred that and seemed to place certain constraints upon the people.

Fast forward to today and the constitution is merely a paper shield or permission slip.  Never was meant to be that way.

I laugh when I hear people speak of getting a permit to exercise a right.  If you have to ask permission, it ain't a right!

pods

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:22 | 1868762 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Damn straight, pods.

And they tax our asses on the permits we have to obtain in order to exercise our so called 'rights,' to rub salt into the wound.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:36 | 1867452 hidingfromhelis
hidingfromhelis's picture

Serfdom.  But don't despair, corporate personhood still has rights...even if you don't.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:28 | 1867978 poor fella
poor fella's picture

One can strive to work for a corporation and become [1/(total number of employees)]th of a 'person'....   it's something.

As a corporate peon there's only about 6 degrees of separation between you and a human. (worker -> tax payer -> consumer -> person -> citizen -> human being)

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:53 | 1867555 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Yes Pods, thats why the USSC went out of its way to classify corporations as 'persons'. Only they have rights and special protections....citizens have no rights and only granted 'privileges' that is as long as youre a good slave and dont break any rules.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:53 | 1867867 pods
pods's picture

Well I think that the SC recognized that corps could be looked at legally the same way as a citizen.  From what I have read, person is not the same as people, lawfully speaking.  I think that might be up for debate, but the context where corps were given personhood is clearly not the same as people.  As they were given the privilege by a construct below the people.

I absolutely agree that citizens have been duped into thinking they have rights.  Technically they do, but they waive them shortly after entering a court.  

pods

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 22:53 | 1868662 Island_Dweller
Island_Dweller's picture

Last I checked I don't have Limited Liability which means corporations are "more free" than me.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:58 | 1867583 AGuy
AGuy's picture

1. You have the right to be taxed!

2. You have the right to be probed and prodded when you travel by air

3. You have the right to being nickeled and Dimed with hiden fees

4. You have the right to choose between elected criminals (Criminal A or Criminal B - You choose!) - Much like the in the movie ghosts busters when the team had a choice of the form of there destroyer.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:02 | 1867607 nowhereman
nowhereman's picture

wrong again, corporations are persons.

you are in fact enlightened.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:24 | 1867675 malalingua
malalingua's picture

Sovereign citizenship. 

http://www.civil-liberties.com/pages/art1.html

 

"When men entered into a State they yielded a part of their absolute rights, or natural liberty, for political or civil liberty, which is no other than natural liberty restrained by human laws, so far as is necessary and expedient for the general advantage of the public. The rights of enjoying and defending life and liberty, of acquiring and protecting reputation and property, - and, in general, of attaining objects suitable to their condition, without injury to another, are the rights of a citizen; and all men by nature have them"

 

 

"These are the rights inherent in Sovereign Citizenship. So long as we remained Citizens, they couldn't be taken away from us. So the key was to take our Citizenship away from us."

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:48 | 1867242 The trend is yo...
The trend is your friend's picture

The average american needs to be told marketed to cuz he doesn't know what's good for him the corporations do

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:05 | 1867621 nowhereman
nowhereman's picture

I recognize snark when I see it, the problem is, it's also true.

Please, somebody, tell me what I want.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:20 | 1868758 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

Green Apple Jellybeans.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:47 | 1867243 The trend is yo...
The trend is your friend's picture

The average joe needs to be told marketed to cuz he doesn't know what's good for him the corporations do

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:47 | 1867244 Undecided
Undecided's picture

http://rt.com/news/israel-attack-iran-report-981/

 

Its ok jobs will be created soon...see above link...

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:49 | 1867254 pods
pods's picture

The average Joe doesn't think, that is why this charade has gone on so long.

pods

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:49 | 1867255 Snakeeyes
Snakeeyes's picture

What people think? Look at the mortgage purchase applications and continuing unemployment claims. The government has stabilized the patient IN A COMA.

Republican Presidential Candidates And The Housing / Mortgage Market Miralce Fix

https://confoundedinterest.wordpress.com

Look at the employment claims and Case-Shiller numbers. We are stable, but so are many coma patients. Is this the NEW NORMAL?

No wonder Republcans don't propose a solution. There IS NO GOVERNMENT SOLUTION to the probkem.

Obama has to stop thinking like an Italian or Greek.

Obamalini?

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:51 | 1867259 ArkansasAngie
ArkansasAngie's picture

We are in a recession.  We have been in a recession.

Government spending and the extend and pretend of the banksters does not constitute a recovery.  Especially since the bulk of this goes directly to the 1%'ers.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:14 | 1867348 OutLookingIn
OutLookingIn's picture

Recession? What recession? You must be joking?

Try - DEPRESSION! It started four years ago. Things are not better, they are getting worse!

Wake up and smell the coffee! Thats if you can afford a cup!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:52 | 1867261 Ganja Jane
Ganja Jane's picture

The 'average' American is in the middle of the 'traditional bell curve' and are that stupid; what's scary is the 50% that are dumber than that!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:08 | 1867630 nowhereman
nowhereman's picture

And they all work in the FIRE sector, or the MSM

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 19:12 | 1868132 Sgt.Sausage
Sgt.Sausage's picture

Someone doesn't really understand a Gaussian Distribution. Half that curve is on the *other* side, too.

What's really scary is that 50% are *smarter* than that ... and a good portion of those are taking advantage of your 50% in every way they can.  That's the truly frightening shit in that distribution.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 22:51 | 1868509 Ganja Jane
Ganja Jane's picture

What's really scary is that 50% are *smarter* than that ... and a good portion of those are taking advantage of your 50% in every way they can.  That's the truly frightening shit in that distribution.

Yes, but not much smarter; how many near the top of that curve??? It's the ones on the step down curve that are a smaller percentage.

http://opass.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/iq100b.jpg

I understand IQ doesn't always imply 'book smarts.'

I personally believe intelligence to be the capacity to learn and use of critical thinking skills.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:13 | 1868301 lotsoffun
lotsoffun's picture

response to dear ganja jane - i paraphrase something i saw here a while back , and my eyes teared up from it laughing.

'by definition - 50 % of the population is below average intelligence.  so all you need is some guy with one idea (change, hope?) that they can grasp, and one guy having a bad day - and you're elected.  that's our government.'

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:52 | 1867269 Ruffcut
Ruffcut's picture

Average joe has cash, buys stuff. No cash but credit still buys stuff, but not as happy. No cash or credit and getting hungry joe is getting a little pissed. Kicks the dog, gets drunk and blames it anyone that MSM says too and many of those who had nothing to do with it.

Congresscritters work on the average joe level. IT makes it easy for them to fist fuck us actual thinkers.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:18 | 1867362 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

If all purchases were cash only, American (and European Member State) economic activity would shrink by 60% (Germany), to 75% (the U.S./UK) or 90% (Spain).

Charge it, even though we make the minimum $20 payment on our $2,349 per card balances monthly, our FICO is 522, we've declared bankruptcy 3x, we owe the equivalent of 740% of what our future lifetime gross earnings will ever hope to be, and we've applied for 27 more credit cards (as well as SNAP).

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:10 | 1867644 nowhereman
nowhereman's picture

Hey, my one credit card cut me off months ago.  I hope they have come to the realization they ain't getting paid.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:54 | 1867272 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

this is what the average zeroHead (L0L) is listening to, today:

Fukushima Mama by Radio Free Earth - YouTube

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:15 | 1867344 fuu
fuu's picture

That song is going to have a decent half life. I found the backup singers to be particularly radiant.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:51 | 1867541 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

hahaha!

i saw you're earlier comment--i wish!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:05 | 1867616 fuu
fuu's picture

good find all the same

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:08 | 1867635 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

went to make you're = your

missed it by that much!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:56 | 1867285 death_to_fed_tyranny
death_to_fed_tyranny's picture

Run up your credit cards and then don't pay! Fuck the Banksters! Unsecured debt is the only way to fuck em!:)~

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:03 | 1867315 sabra1
sabra1's picture

but of course, all you'd buy is silver and gold!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:56 | 1867286 sabra1
sabra1's picture

this is the first time i can remember, that there is no Thanksgiving Black Friday sales propaganda!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:02 | 1867308 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

That's not for two more weeks. Just you wait.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:20 | 1867372 Audit the beaver
Audit the beaver's picture

Pretty sure Walmart did/is doing a Black Friday sale before Thanksgiving.  I went to an H & M store pre-opening party in Denver last night, and you'd never know the economy is in the shitter.  The asshole and his fake-bake, shotgun blasted makeup kit, bitch of a girlfriend in front of me purchased $700+ worth of cheap, trendy crap.  The whole store was overrun with 20 to 40 somethings dying to remain hip by squeezing into skinny jeans and rolling up the sleeves on their sweaters and blazers.  I felt like a piece of shit for buying a 5 pack of socks for $8.  

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:27 | 1867400 MachoMan
MachoMan's picture

Most businesses aren't too excited about making up the margin squeeze (loss) on volume...

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:05 | 1867309 KickIce
KickIce's picture

Average Joe/Jill

"What time are the "insert favorite team" playing?

"What time is ESPN sports center on?

What's on sale at the mall?

What time is DWTS on?

What's the newest product from Apple?

And this is why gold tanks on the announcement of money printing, banks going under, countries in trouble.....=

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:03 | 1867313 1835jackson
1835jackson's picture

Bernanke is a cunt

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:17 | 1867358 OutLookingIn
OutLookingIn's picture

You should apologise!

To call Benny that is an afront! Because those things are useful! Now Benny - not so much!

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:21 | 1868314 lotsoffun
lotsoffun's picture

useful, practical, functional, sometimes good eating.  the positive list goes on endlessly.  even spiders and snakes can serve a positive influence on humanity.  but bernake?  regarding cunts - i once read something along 'it is hard for me to believe that such a creature was borne of a human v.....' 

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 21:29 | 1868487 spdrdr
spdrdr's picture

Remember, you are what you eat!

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:22 | 1867966 Ganja Jane
Ganja Jane's picture

You've offended cunts everywhere.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:12 | 1867320 LouisDega
LouisDega's picture

When im dead, Im dead. Until then, Im still here. Live your life and love your family. 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:38 | 1867456 bbq on whitehou...
bbq on whitehouse lawn's picture

That is not yet known. How much of the flesh can be resurected in 300 years. Science never stops it is the greatest of long term plays.

You can freeze some beef and in 500 years you could create a cow, or bull from that dead dna.

But what would the cost be in 500 years and would you wish be be born again with know knowlage of what you have now.

 

Or that frozen beef will just be rancid beef and some old fungus modering your low cost tomb.  The future, Will it ever attain sanity and reason?

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:09 | 1867325 Waterfallsparkles
Waterfallsparkles's picture

Wall Street is in their own La La Land.  If the Market is going up they are Making money Hand over Frist.  What do they really care about the real economy as long as the overinfalted numbers come in.

As far as Main Street, everyone is suffering.  Cutting spending, paying down or off loans.  Losing their Jobs and cutting back, even sometimes on essentials.  A friend just lost his Home Depot Job.  Now they have to depend on his Wife's income.

My Tenants are having trouble.  One of my Tenants was an Appraiser and lost a substancial amount of his income when the Banks took over the Appraisal process.  I had to reduce his rent by $400. to keep him as a Tenant.  Now he pays bi weekly.  Better than having an empty unit.  Plus, he was a really great Tenant for 4 years, so he deserves a break. Another Tenant is now paying bi weekly.  Again better than having an empty unit.  I know they are having a tough time.  I am not charging them late charges although I know I can. This also affects my Income so I have to cut back from reduced rents.

A lot of suffering for Main Street and unfortunatly it really does not affect Wall Street.  They just keep printing Money Literally, thru the Federal Reserve to keep their living standards the same or better.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:17 | 1867442 uno
uno's picture

Zero percent raises with much higher (40%) health care plan costs.  The real world is cutting back on haircuts, anything salon related, starbucks, lunches.  Small businesses are constantly closing, nothing reopening in their spots.  The best business I have seen do well in the last 4 years is the Hot Yoga, but that is because the clientele substituted gym membership for it.  I am always hearing of layoffs, very little hiring (it makes local news when over 100 hired somewhere).  If people had to pay the mortgage, it would be completely dead in consumerville.

 

I'll add that the Yogurt franchises are opening up and for some wierd reason furniture stores are opening -- cannot understand that.  Otherwise, businesses closing, car dealerships closing.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:09 | 1867334 Campagnolo
Campagnolo's picture

Averange Joe doesn't know and even worse, doesn't understand shit about what is going on with the world. Mayority of people live in a fantasy world.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:14 | 1867339 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

I think the moral contract has been broken.

I think the average person has been bludgeoned by a conspiracy of crony capitalists and socialist sociopaths.

I think we have lost fundamental rights dating back to the Magna Carta.

I think I am sick of hearing the sock puppets on the left and right talk in bi-polar modalities of long dead memes.

I think the only thing that will solve the imminent collapse of Western Civilization is blood in the streets.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:36 | 1867450 pods
pods's picture

"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats."

 

H.L. Mencken

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:49 | 1867559 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

The sock puppets on the right can be very proud of their contribution to this shitshow.... "Greed is Good" is no basis on which to operate a society. I don't think it would come up in the WWJD rolodex of pat answers to societies ills.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 22:27 | 1868603 Dantzler
Dantzler's picture

Greed is fine as long as the playing field is fair. Nothing wrong with desiring to better ones situation in life. It is only wrong when you trample upon others to get there.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:15 | 1867352 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

Note to TPTB: I'm a citizen; you can shove the consumer up your ass.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:18 | 1867363 xcehn
xcehn's picture

Average Joe really thinks the markets are rigged. Right now the Dow and S&P are up because per marketwatch: "Stocks recapture momentum after S&P reiterates France's triple-A credit rating and its stable outlook." Give us a break.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:20 | 1867371 Sammy Ich
Sammy Ich's picture

Heineken, bud/lite or naty lite - dat's the question

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:27 | 1867398 LFMayor
LFMayor's picture

Average Joe isn't going to think about much until his TV is gone, his kids are hungry and his wife is bitching cause he don't make enough money

Idle minds are the devils playground.  No boob action on jersery shore tonight...  gonna be some violence.

Lower IQ's revert to violence first, quicker and that means he'll be targeting all you fat cat fincial services "rich folk".  So he'll grab grandpappy's scattergun and him, 3 buddies and the last of the olympia beer will pile into the buick and eta your mcmansion in about an hour and a half.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:30 | 1867417 tongue.stan
tongue.stan's picture

heres what avg jo thinks

 

(if employed) I swear I'm gonna splatter these motherfukcers (coworkers) brains all over the walls

 

(if unemplyed) if I never get out of bed maybe the world will go away

 

This Depression is messing with everyones minds.

 

No one has the answer or a way out.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:37 | 1867453 quacker
quacker's picture

 

I’ll tell you what I really think, and many find it shocking because I am Jewish. Ethically Jewish that is, my mother was Jewish, my father Jewish, and as far as I know pure Jew all the way back to the 12 tribes. I had my bar mitzvah at 13 as required. Religiously though I am a Christian convert in adulthood.

But I know my people well, inside and out and what makes them tick.

Remember The Merchant of Venice, how despite all reason, all common sense, all MERCY, Shylock thought he had the law on his side, and no matter what carnage it caused, there he was, scalpel in hand, determined to get his pound of flesh.

Well I would note that we could be out of this crisis in just a few months. The world is hopelessly clogged with uncollectable debt that ultimately traces up to the Rothschilds and the other banking families.

I’ll get called all kinds of names, but I know this as a fact:

Every few decades or so the world gets hopelessly caught in financial quagmires that cannot be resolved. One scheme after another is tried all for the ultimate purpose of keeping the debt intact, even though the ones owed the money are already the richest people in the world.

Follow the money. Each and every time, without exception, the money trail terminates with a Jew standing there with his scalpel. And he will not give in and he will not forgive until he gets every little scrap of flesh he thinks he has owed to him.

That’s my people.

Follow the money; it always terminates with an unforgiving Jew.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:54 | 1867545 adr
adr's picture

because the Jew did not produce anything of value in the first place but conned people into believing what the Jew gave them held value.

Still it really doesn't apply to you but the Ashkenazi Jews. The real Jews of the middle east didn't really destroy the world, it took the garbage thrown out of every civilization that converted to Judaism and infested Europe to do that.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:14 | 1867660 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

I suggest therapy for you.... make sure the shrink is jewish, it'll be even more cathartic that way.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:53 | 1867866 quacker
quacker's picture

One can go back even as far as the Old Testament, and we see there the Jewish profits endlessly ripping the Jewish people a new one for being overly concerned with vain things and endlessly lost in their money games and schemes. Also many rabbis over the centuries have extensively commented on it.

In fact many people have had gripes with their own. No therapy needed thank you.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:26 | 1867872 quacker
quacker's picture

double

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:42 | 1867483 reader2010
reader2010's picture

They forgot to include the viewership at youporn.com has been going up week after week since the recession started.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:46 | 1867510 adr
adr's picture

The answer is easy. Tell the US government to go fuck itself and make sure you live in a town that can support itself. Make sure the town has a lot of guns and people that know how to use them. If there are union people in your town make sure to kill them first.

The Unions had a great victory party in Ohio on Wednesday but it won't last when 60% of them lose their jobs next year. Issue 2 needed to pass to keep the state solvent. Now it is assured to go the way of Jefferson county.

My city is affordable to live in, pumps its own water from underground aquifers, generates its own power, and owns the sewage treatment plant for the area. We have a major river and lots of farmland. The states busiest railway for coal and industrial products runs through the town as well. My city gave a collective FU to the unions and issue 2 but the paid Union voter horde had other ideas. Maybe we should just say fuck you to the Department of Education and the teachers union and cut ourselves off. Screw the national curriculum and the pensions of 100 teachers who retired and think they deserve $50k a year for not working until the day they die.

The answer is to take America back to a time where localities actually mattered. You want to give people a free ride and load up on welfare, fine but when you come crying to me after it didn't work I'll just shoot you in the head to put you out of your misery. Make sure that my family has some extra food to eat.

 

I'm not in a very good mood today.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:59 | 1867595 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

i like your attitude

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:16 | 1867673 web bot
web bot's picture

My daughter and I just had a great laugh! I love your honesty.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:18 | 1867680 Sammy Ich
Sammy Ich's picture

ditto on the poll stuffing in OH-IO yesterday

Guess what? Jobs will be eliminated. So much for dumbing down the bullshit piled up for too many years.

Wonder how Christie NJ avoided this Kasich black eye.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:19 | 1867686 Flakmeister
Flakmeister's picture

See my comment to you above, it is clear that you are a somewhat twisted puppy....

Mon, 11/14/2011 - 14:58 | 1876288 Diogenes
Diogenes's picture

It's not the teacher getting a $50,000 pension for teaching your kids for 40 yearsthat's the problem. It's the Goldman Sachs trader getting a $5,000,000 a year bonus for screwing your city,county, state, federal government, pension fund, and 401K out of your money that's the problem.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 16:56 | 1867571 luna_man
luna_man's picture

Tyler, I know you can hit harder than that!...Now, let's try it again.

 

This time, DON'T HOLD BACK!...Remember, we're fighting for our lives!

Against the MOST UNSCRUPULOUS of VERMIN!!...

 

By the way, YOU'RE MY FAVORITE :)

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:15 | 1867602 marcusfenix
marcusfenix's picture

It's funny, I was out last night doing my part to be a good consumer, when I just stopped and looked around for a moment. that is when it hit me, most of these people, out milling around, talking on cell phones and rushing to get there chores done before dancing with the stars, the big game or whatever life affirming and sustaining event they absolutely can't miss happens...most of these people have no idea what is about to happen. 

and it's not that they are stupid or even necessarily all sheep.

It's the normalcy bias...dancing with the stars was on last week, will be on tonight and therefore it is guaranteed to be on next week as well, no matter what happens one will always be able to run to wal mart to get the essentials along with whatever other stuff from china one may desire...Amazon, facebook, twitter, netflix, xbox live, the internet, telephone service, atm's, gas and electricity, all this stuff is always there and always will be. most people simply can't be bothered to contemplate or simply can't comprehend a world without it. they believe that their will always be somebody who can "fix it", no matter what the problem is somebody will "do something". that's at least a part of the reason we have a massive and over bearing central govt, because usually that somebody people are calling upon to do something is from the that very same government that is currently crushing ideas like self determination and individualism. a global economic collapse is incomprehensible to joe sixpack because of what the consequences of such an event implies, an end to "the way things are and therefore, should continue to be".

this is the matrix. every time you here a friend or family member or some joe sixpack say "that can't happen here" that is his or hers attempt to defend that normalcy bias, even some of the so called experts on MSM talk shows have said little more, though warped in lengthy terminology.

"that can't happen here" or "somebody will do something" or "Washington can fix the economy, we just need the right POTUS in the oval office so vote in 2012" ect. ect.

but it is happening right here, right now and right before our very eyes, and no Washington can't fix this, and yes it is the end of the world as we have come to know and understand it to be. Yet still the normalcy bias prevails and that is going to cause a lot of people a lot of needless suffering before the end. 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:49 | 1868389 gminorkey
gminorkey's picture

I aggree with most of what you say marc. I consider myself an "average joe". Until about 4 months ago, I didnt know or care about our economy, leaders, politics, etc. I dont consider myself stupid, i just have other interest in life. I feel like if i have to constantly monitor and judge what our "leaders" are doing, then what the hell good are they? Thats their damn job. I have my job, my life, family to look after. I dont have all day to surf the web and keep on current events. I have a lot to do and it involves very little TV. Most of the average people are just too busy and tired too look over the shoulders of those who are supposed to keep the country running, keep the banks going, etc. We when we do get a little "free time", the last thing we want to do is spend hours on the web looking for reasons why things are so fked up. We know its all FUBAR, but what the hell can we do about it. Voting doesnt work, so what can we do. Our power is supposed to come from electing people who we believe will do a good job and look out for the good of our country, but our power is gone with our bought and paid for leaders. The average joe doesnt have enough money to "prepare" for whats coming, not unless you call saving a few bucks a week will really help. No, when it comes, and its coming, all of us average joes will get hammered to shit, but some will survive, some are tough enough. Some , like myself, have come from poverty and know what it takes to survive on almost nothing, its not fun, but we know how to do it. I hate feeling like i have to constantly monitor the news now, what a waste of life. There is a lot more to life than wandering what Ben is up to, or what the euro is doing, i dont really care. But if i am going to make any sense out of all this i am forced to learn about things that to me are a waste of time and hold zero interest for me other than to see whats coming. I am sure that i speak for most of the "average joes", i am one and most of my friends are average joes. We value spending time with our family, friends over time spent surfing the web for bits of info on the latest crisis situation. That time may involve watching tv together, or shopping, or going out to eat. Our lives are not about what is the GDP for Q3, what is the latest yeild on bonds, etc. We are about the everyday simple things in life, the things that i would say are the most valuable ( family, friends, neighbors). Having said all that , i do appreciate this site and all the people who post here, this site has helped me to understand what is coming. I just really wish i didnt have to visit this site, if i didnt need to visit this site, the world of "average joe" would be fine, and I could go back to my simple but fulfulling life.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:49 | 1868391 gminorkey
gminorkey's picture

I aggree with most of what you say marc. I consider myself an "average joe". Until about 4 months ago, I didnt know or care about our economy, leaders, politics, etc. I dont consider myself stupid, i just have other interest in life. I feel like if i have to constantly monitor and judge what our "leaders" are doing, then what the hell good are they? Thats their damn job. I have my job, my life, family to look after. I dont have all day to surf the web and keep on current events. I have a lot to do and it involves very little TV. Most of the average people are just too busy and tired too look over the shoulders of those who are supposed to keep the country running, keep the banks going, etc. We when we do get a little "free time", the last thing we want to do is spend hours on the web looking for reasons why things are so fked up. We know its all FUBAR, but what the hell can we do about it. Voting doesnt work, so what can we do. Our power is supposed to come from electing people who we believe will do a good job and look out for the good of our country, but our power is gone with our bought and paid for leaders. The average joe doesnt have enough money to "prepare" for whats coming, not unless you call saving a few bucks a week will really help. No, when it comes, and its coming, all of us average joes will get hammered to shit, but some will survive, some are tough enough. Some , like myself, have come from poverty and know what it takes to survive on almost nothing, its not fun, but we know how to do it. I hate feeling like i have to constantly monitor the news now, what a waste of life. There is a lot more to life than wandering what Ben is up to, or what the euro is doing, i dont really care. But if i am going to make any sense out of all this i am forced to learn about things that to me are a waste of time and hold zero interest for me other than to see whats coming. I am sure that i speak for most of the "average joes", i am one and most of my friends are average joes. We value spending time with our family, friends over time spent surfing the web for bits of info on the latest crisis situation. That time may involve watching tv together, or shopping, or going out to eat. Our lives are not about what is the GDP for Q3, what is the latest yeild on bonds, etc. We are about the everyday simple things in life, the things that i would say are the most valuable ( family, friends, neighbors). Having said all that , i do appreciate this site and all the people who post here, this site has helped me to understand what is coming. I just really wish i didnt have to visit this site, if i didnt need to visit this site, the world of "average joe" would be fine, and I could go back to my simple but fulfulling life.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:03 | 1867613 Waterfallsparkles
Waterfallsparkles's picture

The real shame is that all of our Manufacturing, Engineering, and service center Jobs have been sent overseas.  

China and Asia are booming.  America is dieing.

With the lower cost of Jobs overseas it decreases the wages of Americans.  How on earth can we pay for all of the Debt being created when there are no workers or lower paid workers to pay it thru Income Taxes?

For the Average American it is a slow bleed into a lower standard of living.  It is going to be hard but many even today are lowering their standard of living by choice just to survive. 

You know what I mean.  You cut cable to basic.  You cut the physical phone cord.  You cut down on eating out.  You cut down on your cell phone.  You turn the temperature down in your home to cut the cost of heating.  You cut down on your groceries and preprepaired foods.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:50 | 1868392 lotsoffun
lotsoffun's picture

at the same time all the big banks C, BAC, ML, GS, MS, etc were being bailed out - any hiring they had to do was being sent mostly to india.  so - not only were they spending the tax payer money - they were diluting any further tax payers.  disgusting.  shameless.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:07 | 1867627 earnulf
earnulf's picture

The aveage american in the cities is toast.   He can't grow enough food to feed himself, let alone his family and is totally reliant on the infrastructure to sustain life.

The average american in the sticks can at least grow some food, knows how to hunt and has land near to hunt on with actual live game as a food source.   Water is reasonably pure and available.

309 million people in the US

90% of American's live in the cities.

Ah, the Winter of our Discontent

 

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:19 | 1867684 GCT
GCT's picture

Well hot dam ! Deer season is open and all you gotta do is got sit in the tree stand and shoot yah one.  Meat for a while if you have a large family you can get up to 4 tags, make sure yah have plenty of freezar room though.  High quality meat for a while.   Thay way all yah gotta do is buy some taters and veggies and use your BBQ.  Hot dam that be some fine vittles!   Just think you can make sausage, stew meat and even have some back steaks.

 

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 18:45 | 1868049 Waterfallsparkles
Waterfallsparkles's picture

Funny.  My Father went Deer Hunting for years and never got a Deer.   Were I live the Deer come up right to the House.  I was in the Garden pulling weeds and a Deer was about 5 feet away.  I looked at the Deer the Deer looked a me and we both went about our business.  It did not run away.  With my garden there are Deer in my Yard all the time.  I keep thinking about my Dad who could not get a Deer and how they are all over my yard now.

I think the secret is Flowers.  I for years planted Flowers.  The Deer loved the Flowers.  They ate them all.  I kept trying to plant them but they ate them.  I in a way did not really mind as they have to eat too, but I really love flowers and I really cannot plant flowers any more. P. S. their favorite is Tulips, they eat them bulb and all.

So, if you want to bag a Deer take it Flowers.  Like Tulips and Day Lilys.  Put them under your tree stand, you will be sure to bag a Deer.

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 20:57 | 1868412 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

hi.  i just mentioned this post to one of my local deer, w_f_s

he said your place was reknown and you deserved your xlnt michelin rating

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 17:39 | 1867802 Your Creator
Your Creator's picture

Real Unemployment rate around 23% for the last 2 years.  That's not a recession that's a depression.  All propped up by money stolen from the workers.

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