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Guest Post: What Is The Consequence Of Printing Money That Nobody Wants?

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Submitted by Tim Price, Director of PFP Wealth Management and Sovereign Man contributor

Guest Post: What Is The Consequence Of Printing Money That Nobody Wants?

In a week that saw Britain slide into its first double-dip recession since 1975, we quite fittingly also saw evidence of the sort of insular bigotry and protectionist narrow-mindedness that one associates with that same ugly, painful decade, when Barry Sheerman, Member of Parliament, said:

"I'm getting increasingly worried about the free movement of people across Europe. It's a very competitive world out there, and my constituents resent that."

The signs of unravelling are not confined to British shores. French voters in the presidential elections shocked markets by

(a) favouring the socialist Francois Hollande; and
(b) giving almost a fifth of their votes to the far-right extremist Marine Le Pen.

Meanwhile in another turn of the sovereign debt screw, Spain was downgraded toward reality. And the Dutch government collapsed altogether.

Amazingly, the people of Europe just don't seem that keen on austerity. Yet it's worth asking-- why hasn't the recession of today produced the same sense of crisis from the 1970s?

Chris Dillow of the Guardian newspaper suggests that average real wages are much higher now, so although standards of living are falling, they're falling from a much higher level that softens the pain (even though the real pain of austerity hasn't even really arrived yet).

But there is one outcome from the 1970s that is genuinely to be feared... the risk of which seems to be rising every day, if it has not indeed already arrived: Stagflation.

Stagflation-- the utterly painful combination of stagnating growth and steep inflation that marked the 1970s-- and will be the natural side effect of extended central bank quantitative easing during a period of widespread deleveraging.

In other words, stagflation is the consequence of printing money that nobody wants.

Moreover, an outbreak of serious stagflation will decimate conventionally managed debt and equity portfolios. And given that most people invest with the crowd, with conventional investments or conventionally managed portfolios, stagflation will wipe the savings and livelihoods from untold masses.

But, we live in strange times-- times, for example, that reward bankers handsomely for bankrupting the economy. This is why the likes of so many politicians and financial commentators are able to insist with impunity that central bankers should 'keep printing more money' despite never having provided a scintilla of evidence that such tactics work.

Case in point-- in a letter to the Financial Times from April 26, 2012, economist Roger Alford remarked:

"The utterly disparate time horizons and the very different experience and skills required... make it virtually impossible for any one person to have the experience and depth of understanding to provide effective leadership [as head of a major central bank]."

Intellectually constrained by his faux science "profession", Mr. Alford does not take this argument to its logical conclusion: if the institution is so difficult to govern and the role so difficult to effect, why have it in the first place ?

We know the answer to this question. Central banks exist to protect the banking system and to finance the government's debts at all costs... even if it means bankrupting the taxpayer and productive economy.

Yet the urgent need for austerity and an insoluble sovereign debt crisis make for uneasy bedfellows.

By definition, we cannot shrink our way back to the sort of growth required to service the West's accumulated debts. Something has to give.

That something will ultimately be social and political disorder on a continent-wide basis, particularly as the taxpayer becomes increasingly frustrated in his obligations to fund the rapidly growing and untenable costs of Big Government.

Such disorder is almost universally feared-- by politicians, by markets, by institutions. As the London-based marcoeconomic research consultancy Capital Economics recently commented:

"The last thing that the markets need right now is increased political uncertainty at the heart of Europe at a time when the economic outlook is already bleak..."

The only reasonable response to this is: tough. If social and political disorder is what it takes to shift an unsustainable status quo in which vampire banks and clueless bureaucrats suck the life out of the productive economy, bring it on.

 

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Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:11 | 2385243 RacerX
RacerX's picture

Is this in the same vein as "if a tree falls and nobody is around to hear it.."?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:24 | 2385269 battle axe
battle axe's picture

And ISRAEL/IRAN/USA/ETC ETC/WAR, has not even started yet, then you will see this slow moving death by a thousand cuts speed up. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:31 | 2385284 HarryM
HarryM's picture

Iran is just another card in the Feds hand - waiting to be played if so required.

Maybe as a last ditch Obama effort 

No one likes to change presidents in the middle of a war

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:40 | 2385308 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

Yet the urgent need for austerity and an insoluble sovereign debt crisis make for uneasy bedfellows.

Urgent need?  Uneasy bedfellows?  I don't think you know what you are talking about.  Just read the headlines...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:42 | 2385313 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

What Is The Consequence Of Printing Money That Nobody Wants?

For Washington and Wall Street there are only positive consequences!

But the tax payer is FUCKED!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:51 | 2385345 Canaduh
Canaduh's picture

What Is The Consequence Of Printing Money That Nobody Wants?

2. ?

3. Profit

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:25 | 2385806 odatruf
odatruf's picture

I'll take every dime the Fed wants to print and lend me at near zero rates. I won't even play some silly deposit spread. I'll put it to productive use in the economy.  At some point, there is a limit to what I could scale, but it would be in the hundreds of millions.  Try me.  :)

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 16:21 | 2386256 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

 

 

                                                     The NEEDS! of the Many Outweigh the GREED! of the Few!

 

                                                                          Printing ONLY! Helps the Top 1%!

 

 

It is The Top 1% People Verse at Least 300 MILLION of US!

 

The Top 1% Stole 93% of ALL! Profits Last Year!!

 

The Top 1% Started the War against the Poor! They Started it!

 

Think about it.. $0.93 of EVERY! Dollar of Profit! Went into the pockets of Top 1%!

 

And 300 MILLION of us got to split 7% of the Profits!

 

Think about it.. $0.07 of EVERY! Dollar of Profit! Was Split by over 300 Million People in America!

 

How very civilized of them! The WAR!! The CLASS! WAR!! Has been going on for 40 PLUS Years Already! It is not starting now because the RICH! Should pay what the rest of us Pay! We pay 30% and so should they! Period! And then!! America has enough money to pay its debts and still send children to school and not ROB Grandma’s Social Security!

 

There is PLENTY OF MONEY!! But the Rich DO!! NOT!!! Pay what everyone else Pays!

 

And we Pay MORE!! On our $0.07 of EVERY Dollar of Profit!

 

WAKE! UP!!

 

WAKE! UP!!

 

WAKE! UP!!

 

WAKE! UP!!

 

America!! We can take the Top 1% Down! and the System that has provided them protection!

 

WE! Outnumber them! 300 Million PLUS! of US! Verse 400 of them!!

 

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2012/04/growth-of-income-inequality-is-worse-under-obama-than-bush.html

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:43 | 2385317 The Big Ching-aso
The Big Ching-aso's picture

 

 

"Printing Money Nobody Wants".............

TARPal Printer Syndrome?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:00 | 2387064 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

[quote]No one likes to change presidents in the middle of a war[/quote]

There's a first time for EVERYTHING!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:31 | 2385288 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

A bit like "if a nuclear reactor explodes in Japan 5000 miles away, should we care?"

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:47 | 2385333 spentCartridge
spentCartridge's picture

Four reactors.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:29 | 2385246 q99x2
q99x2's picture

I don't know. But do you think Abby Cohen had to turn her head to cough in grammer school?

Hmmm must have said something wrong I'm getting the triple obama gang rape by the site ads today.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:16 | 2385248 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture

"...stagflation of the 1970's..." and just as then, we are financing war....today multiple ones....Ron Paul is 100% correct and he stands no chance.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:29 | 2385271 j0nx
j0nx's picture

Look at Wisconsin for what happens to politicians who do the right thing. I see it every day in my travels. People don't want to hear the truth. You tell them the truth and you are crazy, racist or any other flavor of adjective that pops into their head. People just want to suck beer and watch Jersey Shore and be told that everything will be OK. 1 in 10 might actually be interested in hearing the truth before the eye rolls start or the looks of crackpotism being thrown your way. We are lost as a species.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:33 | 2385293 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

So being a prostitute to the Koch Brothers and their ilk is doing the "right thing?"   

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:28 | 2385504 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

No. Free money for everybody is the right thing. Only a hater would think differently. When everyone is given an infinite amount of cash no one will be poor. It's a perfect and permanent fix for all social and economic problems.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:29 | 2385520 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Of course, because I advocate free money for everyone, right?  Can't argue on the merits?  Make shit up.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:59 | 2385632 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

You are making shit up. I never said you advocated free money for everyone. I am advocating for everyone to get free money and I'm pointing out that haters like you are the only ones who want to hurt people by opposing it.

Why don't you stop hating or at least explain why you believe that unlimited free government money for everyone is not a good idea, Mr. Tea Party?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:27 | 2385511 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Heh, I logged in to say almost exactly the same thing--what happened in Wisconsin went something like frying pan to fire.  You can't have unions sucking the life out of everything anymore than you can have the Koch's do it!  It was like when the Soviet Union fell apart and the people running certain key facilities became the new owners by default.  WTF?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:39 | 2385594 crawldaddy
crawldaddy's picture

unions arent the problem dipshit

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:09 | 2385731 harleyjohn45
harleyjohn45's picture

So being a prostitute to the Koch Brothers and their ilk is doing the "right thing?"

No, voting for a Union that has bankrupted the state is the right thing to do,

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 15:24 | 2386038 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

No matter how often you watch, Fox and Friends does not really consider you their friend.   

AP: Wisconsin Faces Shortfall "Due Largely To Anticipated Medicaid Expenses And A Court-Ordered Repayment To A Fund That Was Raided Four Years Ago," And Walker's Tax Policies "Actually Make The State's Ongoing Budget Problem Worse." 

It appears that you believe the answer to this country's problems is to shrink the middle class and pay people less.  The Koch brothers -- who inherited their wealth -- agree with you.  I don't.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:06 | 2387076 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

So, on one hand you want the Govt to tax the middle class less; on the other, continue to provide all the services (gleaned from yer previous posts)...check yer premises, you've reached an illogical position.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:18 | 2385773 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Better than a prostitute for the State. The State has all the guns, and makes the rules. The Koch brothers do not.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:47 | 2385336 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

Evolutionary dead end.

Something will be digging up our bones in 60m years

and saying WTF.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:29 | 2385516 aerojet
aerojet's picture

You may be right--our culture has become a total piece of shit.  Jersey Shore?  Reality TV that isn't reality?  Might as well call in the comet!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:04 | 2385699 harleyjohn45
harleyjohn45's picture

We are lost as a species.

 

Not everyone is lost, people those who invested in precious metals 10-15 years ago, the ones who are debt free, the ones who maintain a store of food.  Sure they will have it rough, but at least they have a chance of surviving.  You are right about the majority, as evidenced in Wisconsin, they deserve what they get.  They will get it good and hard too.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 18:02 | 2386637 fiddy pence haf...
fiddy pence haff pound's picture

nonono

just 20 more 3-month plans and we'll be free of financial problems.

CTRL-P CTRL-P

It's like in order to make the TCrookedTF banks whole again,

they're ready to starve or kill several billion people.

rotsa ruck.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:26 | 2385275 HarryM
HarryM's picture

If Obama wins, it will be Rand Paul in 2016

 

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:33 | 2385298 Ancona
Ancona's picture

If Obama wins.......there may not be a 2016 election.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:16 | 2385435 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

If Romney wins..........there may not be a 2016 election. What the hell's the difference?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:30 | 2385527 aerojet
aerojet's picture

They will always hold elections, they just won't mean anything--just like, well, now. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:18 | 2385455 AnAnomalous
AnAnomalous's picture

USA erections much overlated --- much better as having one-party dictatorship like we are in Communist China, where Party decides all.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:29 | 2385531 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

But what about American citizenism?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:36 | 2385566 AnAnomalous
AnAnomalous's picture

USA American citizenism will fall to ground in soon fashion, like feces on roadside from good patriotic Chinese citizen.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:08 | 2387083 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

'Tis a blobbing devoutly to be wished... :>D

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:21 | 2385790 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Tide was turning in 2008 when China had Orympics. USA had Erections.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:16 | 2385761 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

The guy draw crowds by the thousands, even in liberal california (LA/SF). People are willing to stand in the rain to hear him speak. Rombomneybot cannot even fill a conference room. Past the primary beauty contests, Paul is picking up delegates, and winning entire states. Yet they expect us to believe people will not vote for him?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:46 | 2385899 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

Ya gotta have DOPES.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 16:18 | 2386263 skepticCarl
skepticCarl's picture

"The guy draw crowds by the thousands"

In a nation of millions, that's .1%

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:09 | 2387086 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

The couch and cheese doodles awaits...do I have to spiel it out to ya?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:16 | 2385249 YesWeKahn
YesWeKahn's picture

How does Bernanke answer this question?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:20 | 2385261 Robslob
Robslob's picture

"CTL-P"

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:53 | 2385352 flacon
flacon's picture

"CTRL-ALT-DEL"

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:35 | 2385536 gdogus erectus
gdogus erectus's picture

Between the lack of time that I have and my swolen prostate, that's hard for me to do at my age. (I know, I'm ripping off someone's joke from a few weeks ago on ZH but maybe not everyone read it.)

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:28 | 2385277 HarryM
HarryM's picture

The only way he knows

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:17 | 2385440 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

Using taxpayer and sheeple's money.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:20 | 2385259 jpmrwb
jpmrwb's picture

Thanks Tyler for a great article. I now know why Valium was so big in the 60's. I would suggest we buy some of the stock and make a mint.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:31 | 2385837 CrashisOptimistic
CrashisOptimistic's picture

A very poor article that brought nothing to the table.

The title suggested that it would examine the concept of QE and what happens when the money used to purchase the bonds stays in banks and is not loaned.

It never touched that at all.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:12 | 2387092 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Allow me to fill in the blank:  We end up precisely where we're at now.  Why would the lead lemmings be jumping off of cliffs?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:20 | 2385263 vh070
vh070's picture

In other words, what goes around comes around, so be it.  Actually, we've got no choice.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:23 | 2385267 MichaelNY
MichaelNY's picture

I tried to persuade my second wife that there was a time when it would have been worth a couple ounces of gold to go to Zimbabse, purchase a few pallet loads of bills, and sell them on eBay as gifts.  Now that the divorce is long over, she gets it. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:25 | 2385270 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

The bankers want the money that is being printed, and they are getting it.   Several thousand people are gaining dynastic wealth from this exercise while austerity in fact is here already for the middle class (shrinking employment, shrinking wages, shrinking home values, shrinking retirement benefits, etc).   It is no coincidence that the money being printed is not trickling down.  These people aren't stupid, just incredibly greedy.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:39 | 2385309 tickhound
tickhound's picture

 

 

Terror rains drenchin', quenchin' the thirst of the power dons,

That five sided fist-a-gon,

That rotten sore on the face of mother earth gets bigger,

Tha triggers cold empty ya purse.

BULLS ON PARADE

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:04 | 2385389 Ripped Chunk
Ripped Chunk's picture

Agreed. Unprecedented time in history right now. Our leaders do not want to do anything about it. But certain people are getting rich trading on this situation.

Headline in yesterday's local paper: Propery Values Expected to Drop (another 18% to 23%) County & school systems wondering how they will make budget.  They won't.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:15 | 2385432 narnia
narnia's picture

This highly leveraged, centrally planned world is funded on the overnight market.  This liquidity is a matter of survival.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:18 | 2385454 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

When the derivatives market blows up and a credit crunch begins, it will be over very quickly.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:32 | 2385546 narnia
narnia's picture

That's when the bank holidays start.  

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:29 | 2385829 mammoth mo
mammoth mo's picture

Exactly...

 

This is why I see a crash coming.  They will make all the money they can on both the up and the down.  Then it will go up again.  This is nothing new - calamity favors the wealthy who are immoral - they will preach values to you while doing just the opposite.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:26 | 2385272 Alcoholic Nativ...
Alcoholic Native American's picture

We need austerity to correct our wild fiscal behavior.  If we don't crack down now we will never be able to pay off our debts.

Shrink the government to vital functions such as military and law enforcement to protect property/intellectual property rights.

We need to start selling off infrastructure too, let the private sector take over.  They can actually turn a profit unlike these bureaucratic statists who just want to suck the life blood out of the country for a parasitic welfare class.

ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:45 | 2385325 Alcoholic Nativ...
Alcoholic Native American's picture

Why am I getting downvoted?  Jesus you people are stupid. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:52 | 2385348 kralizec
kralizec's picture

Easy.  You forgot to mention only Ron Paul can achieve the results you desire.

 

PS-I gave you the +

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:05 | 2385396 Ripped Chunk
Ripped Chunk's picture

Thanks for the superior attitude. Yet you crave acceptance? Odd combination.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:54 | 2385655 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

hear, hear :)

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:08 | 2385399 Crab Cake
Crab Cake's picture

Youre funny. You think this is about making our country work? The problem is not that there arent solutions. Youre playing checkers, and the game at hand is chess. The stakes are the notion of the sovereign state, the Constitution, and a representative form of government.

There are no viable solutions under the current system because we are not thhe government anymore, it has been cornered and purchased.

Also you expect the common serf to eat austerity when the Fed is printing and bailing the very entities that have cornered and purchased our government?

We as citizens are at war, right now, it just hasnt gone hot yet. You arent stupid, just naive.

PS I didnt down arrow you, but what do you care anyway? Do you need others to say youre right or wrong? Think critically and stand where you are.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:48 | 2385625 odatruf
odatruf's picture

Ever so often, there are moments of clarity out there. 

"The problem is not that there aren't solutions."  <--- this is one of them.

Day after day we can read about problems and what's being done.  All the while, I (and I think many others) have this unease that no one is really trying to solve them.  Instead, keeping the party going is the goal.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:30 | 2385831 Matt
Matt's picture

It's too late for austerity; the debt is at such a point that default is inevitable. I once, not so long ago, believed it was possible, but the time for that is gone. If this was the year 2000 and people were discussing austerity, tightening mortgage requirements, etc then maybe.

BTW I didn't junk you.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:14 | 2387099 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

I'm only interested in buying a "bridge to somewhere!" :>D

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:26 | 2385274 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

People do want the money, they just ain't getting it.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:43 | 2385602 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

In a sound money system people have to produce goods and services if they want money. Money arises through productivity rather than debt.

In a debt based system money can be created even though no one perfroms the productive tasks needed to bring real wealth into existence. Money can be created while the availability of actual goods and servcies stays steady or decreases. The new money has nowhere to go except into raising the prices of the existing supply of goods and services. The new money has no real value. Money can't have value unless people want it enough to work for it and thereby bring new production to the market.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 20:21 | 2386989 ToddGak
ToddGak's picture

Produce goods and services in exchange for money?  My, how quaint.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:17 | 2387111 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Green is the color of munny, Gold or Silver is THE COLOR of MONEY!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:29 | 2385280 SemperFord
SemperFord's picture

Unfortunately, it seems they can keep the ball rolling and rolling...SNAP for all because I don't think anybody will really start to hold the bankers responsible!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:28 | 2385281 debtor of last ...
debtor of last resort's picture

Yeah! Bring it on. Time to burn the debt.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:29 | 2385283 Jim in MN
Jim in MN's picture

Heh...he said 'masses'...heh

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:32 | 2385285 Dre4dwolf
Dre4dwolf's picture

"why hasn't the recession of today produced the same sense of crisis from the 1970s?"

 

Well, seeing as how thats your goal, well the elitist goal (to destabilize all the economies and make the free world adopt a new one world currency that they and only they have exclusive control over the printing presses for)... (vera chip, cashless society, green society, call it what you want).

 

The reason you are failing at achieving maximum crisis fear points in the minds of average people is because, everyone is accustomed to being ripped off from birth....  you have breed very good slaves, you have domesticated the people very well.... infact they are completely fine with you wiping out whatever savings they have.... as longs as they get to keep watching football, drinking beer and uploading pictures on facebook, they could give a rats ass about what direction their economy and their country is going.

 

People are domesticated trendy zombies...... even during 9/11 not even 1 / 4th of the population "really gave a shit", 5000 people died? o... thats a normal day! if the media didn't  hype things up.... no one would even know that 9/11 happened.

People "just don't care" anymore.... everyone lives in their own little bubble.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:07 | 2385406 Ripped Chunk
Ripped Chunk's picture

Ripe for total domination

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:25 | 2385483 Crab Cake
Crab Cake's picture

Yeah... until that bubble gets even a little pin prick. Dont understand? There is a rage thats been building for generations, boiling just below the surface. Cut someone off in traffic to see what I mean. People get killed for getting an order wrong at McDs. This rage is seeking a way out, and eventually tptb will open a release accidentally. Theyre doing there best not to open this outlet moving slowly and purposefully, but just by the nature of institutions like the tsa... its inevitable. Control is an illusion, both the citizenry at large and tptb are going to relearn this the hard way, and our country is going to burn for better or worse.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:24 | 2385802 aerojet
aerojet's picture

I disagree.  The people in Germany were very complacent which allowed the Nazis to come to power.  Americans are distracted, but they are not as complacent as the Germans.  9/11 was that old Reichstag "create a crisis to solve" event and it has sputtered because everyone just went right back to their video games.  The TSA just isn't the brownshirts...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:19 | 2387115 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

"Life is a cabaret, old chum..."

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:31 | 2385289 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

Deadbeats want the money, and they are getting it too. $10K cash back loan on a new car anyone? Repo depo coming to a town near you.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:16 | 2385290 Bartanist
Bartanist's picture

Inside any individual company growth is ALWAYS constrained by the inability to distribute power (empowerment).

Similarly within an industry innovation is ALWAYS choked by monopolization of the markets.

Anthropologists, Sociologists and the military agree that the optimal size for managment of human beings is in units of about 150 ... a tribal size.

So, while bigger (think a global power structure headed by people who think of themselves as "elite" at the top) allows for the consolidation of "resources", what it does not do is remove the constraints on growth, innovation or create social wellbeing. It is a recipe for stagnation and disharmony.

With all of the so called parasitic think tanks that are funded by the elitists, one would have to assume that they know this and that ultimately their position is desired (for them) but untenable. I have to assume that they think is would be more manageable for them if only there weren't so many of us. So, they are admitting their own weakness and incompetence (the inability to run this large of a world) and their only solution is to make is smaller.

My guess is that their plan will come at a very heavy price for them as well as "us".

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:35 | 2385300 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

Tim Price, Director of PFP Wealth Management 

Is he in favour of a Closer Political Union of the United States with Mexico, Brazil, Colombia and free movement of peoples and a Common American Citizenship ? If not he should not criticise Barry Sheerman - an MP I personally detest - but is frankly raising the issue of unlimited mass migration. The United States has a mere 313 million people but the European Economic Area has 550 million ALL entitled to move to Britain, to claim British Welfare and to send their children to British Schools and Universities FREE and get free health care. The US has never offered that to Mexicans....but it should so Tyler does not accuse Americans of

the sort of insular bigotry and protectionist narrow-mindedness Americans display to EDUCATED foreigners trying to get an H-1 Visa.

If the United States had the population density of England it would nbeed another TWO BILLION immigrants.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:06 | 2385397 zuuma
zuuma's picture

Re:

"If the United States had the population density of England it would nbeed another TWO BILLION immigrants."

 

 Define "Density"

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:05 | 2385708 odatruf
odatruf's picture

The UK has about 62 million people living in about 94,000 square miles.  The US has about 315 million people spread across about 3,800,000 square miles. So in the US, for every square mile there are roughly 83 people while in england there are about 660.  If you exclude Alaska, where you'd never expect people to live in a normal distribution pattern, there are about 95 people per square mile.

If the US had the same density (person per sq mile) as the UK, then you'd have an additional 560 people living in each square mile.  Since we have about 3.8 million of those squre miles, you'd need about 2 billion more people.  Put another way, the UK would only have about 7.8 million people living there if they had the same density as the US.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:11 | 2385742 WAMO556
WAMO556's picture

That statement is utterly STUPID. You just gave a theoretical statement (which means that you live in a ivory tower) which would be disproved in a heartbeat in the real world. Britian is a island, not a continent. Of course living is going to be more cramped. What did you fooking think, Einstein???!!!

Tue, 05/01/2012 - 03:38 | 2387554 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

The United States is not a Continent - North America is. ASnyway the point is that to condemn Sheerman for saying an Island is overcrowded reeks of hypocrisy. Let Mexicans have free movement into the United States....

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:07 | 2385718 WAMO556
WAMO556's picture

Who YOU calling a Bigot. You resemble that remark!!!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 21:20 | 2387118 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Open borders, or a welfare state; pick one, you cannot have BOTH in perpetuity!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:38 | 2385310 Crab Cake
Crab Cake's picture

1 somethings got to give...
2 somethings got to give...
3 somethings got to give...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:41 | 2385314 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

...and my bet is on freedom.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:48 | 2385340 Crab Cake
Crab Cake's picture

Guess Ill be dead soon then. Ive made my separate peace, and I aint going out like that.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:41 | 2385315 thebigmozey
thebigmozey's picture

  Starve the beast - leave the country and stop paying taxes.

  Get off the grid, out of the system - pull a "John Galt".

  Civil unrest, like the 60's?

  The demonstrators lost, and nothing really changed.

  You want to participate in civil unrest? Nock yourself out.

  My answer is to get out of the system, and let the beast starve.

  Of course, it would also be beneficial to kick the liars and cheats we have "representing" us out of office, but like civil unrrest - good luck with that idea!

  Republicans and Democrats - what the heck is the difference?

  Both screw their constituemts. I'll choose a country at least that shows me their guns when the tell me I have to do something.

  America and the rest of the western world is screwed - they just do not know it yet.

  Have a happy day!

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:44 | 2385323 Squid Vicious
Squid Vicious's picture

BTFD muppetz!! and make sure there's some AAPL and AMZN eggs in your easter basket

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:46 | 2385331 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

Elliott wave counts on the Dow and SP500 both show a pending and major decline below the March 2009 lows.

http://bullandbearmash.com/index/djia/weekly/

 

You can get notified by email if this changes:

 

http://bullandbearmash.com/members/signup/

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:22 | 2385472 zuuma
zuuma's picture

"Elliott wave counts on the Dow and SP500 both show a pending and major decline below the March 2009 lows."

 

Are Elliot Wave charts (or any predictive financial chart) useful?

It seems akin to ancient Greek & Roman reliance on Experts & Tecnical Analysts who sliced open a live bird, spilled the blood & entrails on the floor. They then were able to clearly predict future trends & events from the splatters & positions of the various organs where they landed.

We see this nowadays also where individuals stare at a "Check Engine" light for a while & then declare what is specifically wrong with the car.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:52 | 2385349 Madcow
Madcow's picture

They're dropping money out of helicopters - but only to bankers and billionaires.  The average person is not seeing any of that money - but does see the writing on the wall - a future of higher taxes (deflation), less governemnt spending (deflation) and a higher percentage of income required to service debt (deflation).  The only logical response is for people to prepare for 3 decades of bankruptcy, system failures, liquidations, etc - by taking sticking to cash and avoiding risk altogether. Deflation is doom for "re-hypothecated" assets.  as the tide goes out and the well runs dry, risk asset investors will be shocked to realize that what they thought they owned is not theirs to keep. Asset integrity becomes critical.  Money will continue to increase in relative value as the deflation gathers steam. Ignore Keen, Shedlock, Van Hoisington, etc - at your own risk. "Convemtional wisdom" expects that the Fed will be able to produce inflation - if not hyperinflation by "monetizing the debt."    Inflation is going to be quite a trick when the money supply vaporizes.

 

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 16:55 | 2386402 Matt
Matt's picture

I don't think it will take 3 decades. If you are using Japan as your reference, the Western World is on a much steeper trajectory, with much more velocity than Japan. America has nearly caught up with Japan already on borrowing versus tax revenues ratios. It is too late for minor tweaks to correct; its full throttle till we hit the wall, I suspect.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:05 | 2385391 Eric L. Prentis
Eric L. Prentis's picture

The financial elite are completely unreasonable and refuse willingly to give up any power. The financial elite control the economy, political process—before and after elections—and most of the judges.

 

The financial elite think that capitalism is more important than either democracy or the rule of law. They are wrong! Capitalism is only third in importance.

 

Americans are fed up being ruled by narrow-minded banksters. Besides, these fraudsters are ruining the country. Five trillion dollars added to the national debt in the last four years signals complete failure on the banksters’ part.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:24 | 2385488 eddiebe
eddiebe's picture

What are the consequences? The rich get richer and inflation.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:33 | 2385559 Bartanist
Bartanist's picture

One might as well ask: "What is the consequence of not creating value through labor?"

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:35 | 2385567 Poofter Priest
Poofter Priest's picture

Again....the large reason we are in this mess is because of the finanical manipulations of an industry that [was] suppose to serve the real economy.

Now that industry is a 'thing' unto it's self and only sucks the life out of the actual economy.

Yes...we now need austerity as part of the fix. But the real big  problems did not come from welfare queens and food stamps. They came from the acts of banks and Wall Street.

If you just attack the austerity front, you will end up with a feudal system. Wait...we are pretty much already there.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:38 | 2385572 Bartanist
Bartanist's picture

Has anyone else noticed that the term "elite" just popped up a few years ago ... as if it is a conditioning tool to try to make people believe that there is an actual "elite", as opposed to people who are elitists and think of themselves as "elite"?

And so it was with the "Star-Bellied Sneeches".

Elites would be better than non-elites and therefore have some sort of right to rule because they are better. Just more propaganda.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:00 | 2385680 nick howdy
nick howdy's picture

The people who have their hands on on the levers of power are the "elite"...That isn't you and it's not propaganda...Because these people are manipulating everything at this point...YOU are less able to make proper decisions on what counts in YOUR life.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:49 | 2385633 Poor Grogman
Poor Grogman's picture

The. Bernank and the central bankers are quite rightly scared,

They know there is too much money and cash on the sidelines.

The demand for even more free money is enormous (germany 1921)no one wants austerity, most sheeple / voters would prefer free handouts.

The endgame of runaway inflation must be avoided at all costs, otherwise the casino goes up in smoke, and with it the bank-sters.

The PTB will try and finesse the situation, by providing just enough cash from thin air* to offset the worst of the deflation (think Japan).

Will they (can they) hold it together?

Perhaps... for a while.....

Prepare accordingly.

*e-cash anyone?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:16 | 2385768 jomama
jomama's picture

one thing is for sure, PMs are getting a beat-down in FRNs again.  price still well behind inflation.

manipulation? deflation?

economics just don't make any sense.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:48 | 2385909 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

I want all they'll give me -- those digits will still buy real things.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 19:54 | 2386929 ekm
ekm's picture

I don't know who Mr. Tim Price is but I salute him.

Great, great and simply great.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 22:26 | 2387238 Youri Carma
Youri Carma's picture

I think that if they should print at all, they should print for the people and not solely for the banksters.

That indeed doesn't work so begs the question if 'Money That Nobody Wants' really pinpoints the real problem.

Peoples wages have been freezed in an high inflationairy environment while banksters still ask a lot of money for lending to the private sector.

They don't get the zero percent interest rates which the banksters get. This situation is unbalanced and destroys savers and thus pensioners.

I agree with Webster Tarpley that printing for the people is necessary to restart this bankster damaged economy but not after calling void all bogus bankster derivative debts.

Because paying off these trough fraud induced debts have become a technical and practical impossibility.

Also see: THE REAL PROBLEMS & SOLUTIONS http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=216627.0

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