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Guest Post: Why Everybody's Going To War in the Middle East
Submitted by Ron Holland of The Daily Bell,
"Everybody's going to war but we don't know what we are fighting for."
– Nerina Pallot, from "Everybody's Gone to War"
Iran Wants War
Although a peaceful nation for hundreds of years, Iran was invaded and occupied by the Allies in both World War One and Two. Then in 1980, at the urging of the United States, Saddam Hussein invaded them and used poison gas against both Kurds and Iran. Over 500,000 civilians, Iranian and Iraqi soldiers died in the longest war of the 20th century, which lasted until 1988.
Iran wants war because they believe they can withstand an Israel and US air assault and that unless they are invaded and occupied they can claim victory. No Middle East nation has ever been victorious against either the US or Israel and to declare victory against both will make Iran the leading nation across the entire region, at least for the people in the street. An Israel/US assault would also solve growing domestic political problems against the regime.
Israel
Bibi Netanyahu obviously believes Iran threatens the survival of Israel, as no major domestic political reasons to go to war are evident. The majority of Israel's population appears to be opposed to a military strike against Iranian nuclear facilities because of retaliation from Iran and Hezbollah. But as in the US, what the majority of the people want is of no consequence.
If the war plan leaked several days ago is real (see "Bibi's Secret War Plan") it's excellent but no war plan survives the first contact with the enemy. It appears to be an exact reverse of my fictional "The First American Dollar War Defeat" in which Electromagnetic Pulse weaponry is deployed.
So Netanyahu believes Israel can delay Iranian nuclear advances by bombing them back into the Stone Age with the help of America, who will surely be drawn into the conflict. Although most neocon experts believe the war will be short with a minimum of retaliation I fear the war could be a long one, pulling in many other nations in the Middle East. Again, Iran showed its resolve against Iraq in their long war and this same determination would rise to extreme levels against an Israeli strike.
USA
The old war against terror propaganda is losing ground to alternative news and opinion now available because of the Internet Reformation. Frankly, few people believe anything from either the American government or its establishment propaganda outlets and this is a frightening situation to the power elite that rules America.
Due to the growing economic crisis, the government needs to take strong actions that could be violently resisted by large segments of the US population unless a major financial or military crisis can be used as an excuse and cover for coming dictatorial actions. Simply stated, there are not enough police and military in the US to control the population should an insurrection take place. A major war in the Middle East can provide a casus belli for a direct assault against US private wealth, liberties, benefit programs and opposition by the power elite.
For example, the imposition of a military draft will dramatically cut unemployment rates as well as limit inner-city crime and outrage over cuts in domestic spending and welfare. Remember, austerity is needed and a draconian cut in Social Security and benefit programs must be engineered against the 50 percent of the population who receive some type of government benefits.
In addition, gold will need to be confiscated. Forced retirement investment into collapsing dollar denominated Treasury obligations must be required when foreign investors stop buying US debt. Stronger TSA authority, drones and harsh domestic controls will need to be implemented for the duration of the conflict in order to squelch domestic opposition. Taxes must be raised, penalties and fines must be doubled and tripled at the federal, state and municipal levels and finally, severe limitations on freedom of speech and freedom of assembly will be forced on the American people, along with gun control and limited access to Internet news and communications.
Finally, a major, long-term war in the Middle East will provide an excuse for the deferment and rescheduling of US debt obligations owed to nations and governments that oppose the US/Israel war in the Middle East. For the $1 trillion owed to China and many Middle East nations, this is effectively debt repudiation.
China
China wants to see the US weakened long-term as a world power and a major war in the Middle East will do this. They also need a reason to dump US Treasury debt and an excuse to avoid the blame of the coming broader repudiation of US debt. The Chinese people will be justifiably outraged that the Chinese government and central bank accumulated $1 trillion in US debt, although there were legitimate global trading reasons and domestic economic justification for this over-concentration in US debt and dollar obligations.
A Middle East war would avoid direct military action between the US and China while protecting both US and Chinese politicians from the coming Treasury debt repudiation, Chinese dump and global run on the dollar and Treasuries.
Conclusion
All sides in the coming conflict – except for the civilian populations and the soldiers maimed and killed – will win if everything goes according to plan. However, nothing ever goes according to plan in wars and this is the problem the world will face. Prolonged recession or depression, wealth and benefit confiscation throughout the EU, US and other Western democracies and the risk of a Middle East conflict spreading around the world is my fear.
Who is guaranteed to win regardless of the outcome of the war and whether it can be contained? The Anglo-American financial elites and the bankers always win every conflict regardless of the military outcome. This is the history of the 20th century and I see no reason that will change now.
Forty-plus years ago, when I was in basic training, we sang the patriotic and somewhat funny marching songs. But when our drill sergeants were out of range, we would shift into "1, 2, 3, 4 what are we fighting for?"
Looks to me like nothing has changed. American soldiers are still fighting for the power elites and their favored industries. I wish it were different.
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Seems about correct to me. Maybe something will change this time with more people being more aware, but i have a feeling the ones more aware will already have gone to greener pastures...
Modern banking relies on mindless consumer behavior, mindless going-into-debt.
Stop for a moment to contemplate your consumption, and you've done a lot to cut into this tendency.
Change the paradigm, win the war.
Isaac a media confab
watch NO tv
live
http://bit.ly/Rl4n0J
Middle East has oil
they aren't going there for falafel, for sure....
but idiot americans probably thinks US military brings "freedom" to Aladdin so that he can engage in "free trade" of magic carpets and somehow that's going to make every American in the top income tax bracket.
Ron Holland of The Daily Bell is neither bright nor knowledgeable. I have read and argued with him at The Daily Bell.
The Daily Bell is a zionist publication masquerading itself as an independent website.
A few months ago, Ron Holland advice to Ron Paul supporters was to work inside GOP to change the Party. As I indicated, GOP will not allow to R. Paul or to his supporters any room or any voice during the Convention as long as they agreed to kiss the GOP bosses ass.
PS
Ron Paul's family members are Romney supporters. His son is a staunch Romney supporter and Ron Paul is a "limited" Romney supporter. I don't know what does it means to be "a little bid pregnant."
Short sighted article.
Fact: The banking elite pushing this conflict are the same ones in power in the US, EU, China, Russia, and Israel.
Fact: The horrible economic storm sweeping over the world is not a random act, as more and more evidence shows, it is a coordinated manipulation of all markets, leading to ruin.
Fact: The self distructive policies of importing muslim immigrants to the Western world is a coordinated effort, happening all over at the same time, against the will of the majority of the populace.
Fact: The US has been supporting the revolutions bringing the Muslim Brotherhood to power all over the Middle East.
Fact: The Muslim Brotherhood has called on all muslims, worldwide, to join in a world revolution starting in 2016 to restore the caliphate.
Where does that lead your thinking?
The depression and the horrible situation it places the people of the world in is a primer to condition the populace for the carnage to come, just like it was the last time.
The entire muslim world is being tricked into starting a war they can not possibly win. The "allies" they have in China and Russia will turn on them, invade and loot along with everyone else.
Jew bankster-plutocrats don't rule Russia. Putin chased them out. That's why Isramerica wants to bring down Syria, Iran, and Russia. And it's not Islam that most directly threatens the West. It's Zion that's ravaging us with a lethal combination of State Socialism, Crony Capitalism, and murderous wars whose only purpose lies in keeping Israel on the map and oil-producing countries on the dollar. ZOG rules. But not for much longer. The Empire of Debt is doomed.
Fuck a doodle Jew. You nailed It. +1
I don't see why this is not obvious to everyone!
Kudos for your succinctness!
incognito
You are wrong.
Russia and China are NOT ruled by the same bankster elite as the Western NATO nations.
The entire Muslim world is NOT "starting a war" to "restore the caliphate".
The US dependent vassal state in Saudi Arabia is the main stalking-horse instigator of religiously motivated intolerance and violence.
Other nations throughout the Middle East, Africa, and Latin America are not "aggressing" but defending.
Were US-backed Israel to cease its land and water grabbing, and end its 'Warsaw-style ghetto' in Palestine, there would also be a remarkable lowering of violence.
Putin is a bankster commie. He and all his commie ex-KGB bretheren are the ones that have profited from all the "change" in Russia the last 30 years. They are still in charge. Nothing changed, they just tricked people into thinking it changed. It did not.
All the high level EU officials? "former" commies, in bed up to the eyeballs with Putin. Nigel Farrage calls them out by name on a regular basis. Obama was placed in charge by who? Bankster commies.
Can you read Arabic? Read "Al- Zaraqawi AL-Qaida's Second Generation" written by a Jordanian, Fouad Hussain. That book, written in 2006, has accurately predicted all the actions in the middle east since then, including the Arab Spring. The people that have just taken charge of the muslim world are going to lead them into the biggest war the world has ever seen. They are being set up as the fall guys for the bankster commies. This has been the plan all along, going back to before WWI.
This is the cover needed by the Zionists to destroy the people that threaten their little kingdom in the Middle East. The import of muslims into the rest of the world allows them cover to clamp down and instal a tyrannical world government everywhere to solve the "problem", that they themselves created.
THINK.
the system will be protected at any cost.
the system will be protected at any cost.
Just walk away from it. Start living your way, not theirs.
understanding the nature of the game is a part of my way.
you might not like what you find.....
@CH1: "Start living your way, not theirs."
That didn't work out so well for Randy Weaver and his family, or the Branch Davidians in Waco. Be very careful if you do decide to go off the reservation before the gummint goes tits up.
Stop Borrowing
Stop Depositing
Keep Stacking
fake systems TRY to protect themselves at any cost but always end up their own worst enemy. Nice comment CH1
Bring on the Rapture!!
and a gold standard!!
We had the rapture over a year ago.
We are whats left.
Sorry man....
Eat your cars & eat your bars...
I dont want a second hand second coming!
I'm afraid the best we'll get is a sloppy second coming.
sorry, we're all out of rapture. Would you settle for rap?
"saving grace" = mutually assured destruction
its the last thing americans are still good at
everything else has been outsourced
You lost me at "Iran Wants War", which is an utter nonsense.
Tell me again, when's the last time that country actually invaded someone?
Disregarding Q'ds Force, Hezb'Allah, etc.? Been a long time. - Ned
I wonder what for example Catherine Bell says about the intention of the USA to initiate war against Iran, because it is her mother's homeland.
I think it's been more than two centuries.
...'round about 480 BC. Xerxes got his ass kicked by the Greeks. The Persians learned theiur lesson well, and never invaded anyone ever again.
Now it's out turn for the same lesson.
LOL you and 4 people watched too many times "300"
Persians perhaps got their asses kicked BUT invaded many times greece, not only one
"Tell me again, when's the last time that country actually invaded someone?"
When was the last time that they really had the capability of invading anyone? Invading the Soviet Union would have been suicidal, invading Afghanistan would be pointless (and would have drawn in the Soviets and probably the Pakistanis), invading Iraq - for most of modern history, that would have drawn in the Brits back when that meant something (or the US/UN later), and an amphibious invasion of the Arabian peninsula would have been largely beyond their means and would have drawn in plenty of other powers. Plus, as soon as the Iranians got bogged down in a foreign adventure, the Russians would have jumped them to get those nice warm-water ports.
You assume a lot. Maybe, just maybe they don't have the capabilities to invade and occupy other countries because the Iranians don't want to.
I am afraid you project yourself onto Iran and Russia.
[damned double post]
Thanks for not posting a thread on the Convention.
/s
Quick summary of the convention for those who don't have time to watch the whole thing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRR3wPESDJQ
I caught about five minutes of what I've highlighted in bold below*, as it was all I was able to stomach. I will NEVER again cast a vote for any candidate of either 'major' political party in the USA. What a goddamn disgrace. Even if Ron Paul is controlled opposition, to see the party machinery's attempt to avoid any mention of his name guarantees my hate for the RNC for the rest of my natural born life. It was already there for 'the other side'. Full disclosure, I was once a registered Republican and the very first vote I cast after coming of age was for Ronny Reagan in 1980. Gawd I was a naive dumb bastard back then...because my family was Repub so was I.
excerpt from: The Platform From Hell
More disclosure, the last Presidential vote I cast was for Pat Buchanan in 2000 which was the year my local precinct went total electronic. Electronic machines to cast a ballot and electronic machines to tally those votes. I asked the lady working there for my receipt showing which way my vote was cast, and she replied "these machines don't give receipts." I said, "let me know when you go back to a more verifiable method of voting and I might be back." Needless to say I haven't been back since.
*in the five minutes I watched I saw the Iowa delegation report: "Iowa 40 delegates for Ron Paul, 6 for Mitt Romney." Little blonde Republi-bot with pasted on smile at podium: "Iowa 6 votes, Romney."
Fuck em...
I can relate.
I won't vote for anyone who does not answer "NO" to the three following questions:
Any politician who does not answer these questions with a "no" is neither smart enough nor brave enough to deserve the title of "elected official" (which should really be called "elected SERVANT"!).
Pure Hollywood
Not a big deal if Iran decides to take out a banking cartel family. Game over for the globalists. Peace and prosperity ever after and the globalists might even agree to an Open Source Monetary System that is closed and community run.
There is no us against them at this point. Greece and Spain are currently under attack as well. Everything is moving into place for the globalists to strike the US as well.
And they made me pay an additional $60 for DHS on my student parking this semester to help them do it. M'Fers.
Viewed through the prism of the reported realities, it (unfortunately) makes alot of sense. Bastards
From the Wikipedia entry on WWI: "Both sides believed, and publicly stated, that the war would end soon. The Kaiser told his troops that they would be, "…home before the leaves have fallen from the trees," and one German officer said he expected to be in Paris by Sedantag, about six weeks away. Germany only stockpiled enough potassium nitrate for gunpowder for six months. Russian officers similarly expected to be in Berlin in six weeks, and those who suggested that the war would last for six months were considered pessimists. Von Moltke and his French counterpart Joseph Joffre were among the few who expected a long war, but neither adjusted his nation's military plans accordingly. The new British Secretary of State for War Lord Kitchener was the only leading official on either side to both expect a long war ("three years" or longer, he told an amazed colleague) and act accordingly, immediately building an army of millions of soldiers who would fight for years."
If the prospect of war looks ugly to both sides, a diplomatic solution is always found. It's when war looks cheap, quick and decisive that it winds up happening.
it is just like when germany bombed pearl harbor in the first world war, everyone thought that we would beat canada by september but then the mexicans invaded japan...man this medical weed is screwing me up...?
Germany only stockpiled enough potassium nitrate for gunpowder for six months.
Yes and there was no chance to get supply because the Brits blocked the German trade streams effectively since Britannia ruled the waves. This was the reason why the Brits thought WWI is going to be a joy ride and the dumbass Germans run soon out of ammunition. The events leading to WWI were exactly planned by the Brits and the Germans were caught in this net. Just to give you an idea about the predatory character of the Brits is the fact that Germany after its founding in 1870 had not fought one war till 1914 ( except a colonial massacre in Namibia to have full control of the only German colony which had importance) . The Brits during the time 1870 and 1914 were very much comparable with the US nowadays. Never ending small wars interrupted by a set of mayor strategic wars.
WWI was a miscalculation by the Brits. They underestimated Germany, or in that case the develish genius of one man, nobel laureate (1918 !!) Fritz Haber. He managed the unexpected to happen. Under his hands and guidance BASF was capable to produce synthetic gunpowder on large scale within 3 months after WWI had started, thereby eliminating a crucial factor in the calculation of the Brits.
Haber was also the guy developing and producing poison gas in big style to be used as a weapon.
But here comes the most hidden fact of this controversial personality.
Fritz Haber became later the first director of Degesch, which was the company producing Zyklon B gas to poison millions of Jews. The irony is that Haber itself was born as a Jew. Excerpt from Wikipedia: Haber was born in Breslau, Germany (now Wroc?aw, Poland), into a Hasidic Jewish family. His family was one of the oldest families of that town.[1] Haber later converted from strict Judaism to Lutheranism.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degesch
Nobel laureate: Haber started to introduce poisonous gas a a big style killing tool during WWI but he received the Nobel laureate for helping to feed half of the population of the world: From Wikipedia: The Haber-Bosch process was a milestone in industrial chemistry, because it divorced the production of nitrogen products, such as fertilizer, explosives and chemical feedstocks, from natural deposits, especiallally extracted nitrate production in Chile fell from 2.5 million tonnes (employing 60,000 workers and selling at $45/ton) in 1925 to just 800,000 tonnes, produced by 14,133 workers, and selling at $19/tonne in 1934.[5] The annual world production of synthetic nitrogen fertilizer is currently more than 100 million tonnes. The food base of half of the current world population is based on the Haber-Bosch process.[6]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fritz_Haber
http://www.chemheritage.org/discover/online-resources/chemistry-in-histo...
Fritz Haber the worlds best example how the talents of a man can generate evil or good. It just depends on the circumstances. The Haber Bosch process is regarded by many as the most important invention of the 20th century. And the cowardly poisoning of people is one of the most heinous crimes since ever. My opinion: Hitler might be in the same category as Haber. Both highly talented but lacking totally moral control. Extreme thinkings and extreme doings.
The "millions of Jews gassed" number has been thoroughly debunked, even by honest JEWISH historians and researchers.
From 1870 to 1871 there was a thing called Franco-Prussian war...
but i bet that on americans history books there is no suck things
You say it. The Franco Prussian war. Not Germany which was re-united under Prussian dominance as a result of this war. The old Germany had ended (after roughly 1000 years) with Napoleon taking over the German Cesars crown.
I doubt that Iran really wants a war with America, but if we do go to war with them that will be the one that breaks our backs. Our over reliance on technology is going to prove to be a weakness as other nations develope ways to counter it.
i'm not aware Iran has made any threats to America, has no navel vessels around US shores and has no invasion force ready to storm either bankrupt California or equally bankrupt New York at the mo
so under International Law, written ironically by the US itself after WWII and the Nuremberg Trials to prevent deranged Govt warmongering/murdering, the US has no grounds to attack Iran. Period.
It would be illegal (anarchy) for the US to attack Iran
but it is the right thing to do, you fucking Child
only if you are a hasbara zionist shill.
The US has abandoned Nuremberg. The defence of Superior Orders is in full effect. Case in point: Obama has promised CIA torture teams that they are safe from prosecution.
Time for you to update your model of reality. Nuremburg is kaput.
"It would be illegal (anarchy) for the US to attack Iran"
Sorry, no. Iran attacked sovereign US territory when they stormed the embassy back in the day. Legit causus belli under pretty much any established rules of war whenever someone feels like dusting it off. If they were to give it back, though...interesting.
"It would be illegal (anarchy) for the US to attack Iran"
Sorry, no. Iran attacked sovereign US territory when they stormed the embassy back in the day. Legit causus belli under pretty much any established rules of war whenever someone feels like dusting it off. If they were to give it back, though...interesting.
that makes sense, aipac clerk
Simon Endean
Apparently, your "knowledge" of Iranian-US relations is limited to the embassy seizure, with nothing either before or after.
To start, check out the Algiers Accords, the US-Iranian agreed settlement of the embassy seizure incident.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algiers_Accords
illegal? was iraq legal?
Dr. Engali:
Already done. It is called IED and "Martyrdom Operations".
- Ned
All I read was "Electromagnetic Pulse weaponry" and than all I thought was "come on 15 Kill Streak" and then "10 more till NUKE! baby"
Time to get LONG war stocks. GS, JPM, BAC
fuck war
.
lets just starve people until they can no longer piss on themselves
Anglo - American ?... Are you for real ?. Jews will profit. Goyem will die.
Dude, it's G-O-Y-I-M.
Any self-respecting Joo hater should at least know how to spell the requisite derogatory epithets.
Dumbass.
yeh - the last time i ( not jewish) went to yom kippur, all the old jews were muttering yada yada yada goyim about the table. just lovely open minded people.
* i did have my i-heart-arafat t-shirt on thou....
So you were drafted just in time for the end of the Vietnam war? Buddy we're well past that now. The "elites" as you like to call them "won" precisely because that draft could be ended. Once we shifted over to a professional military (after they went on strike when Jimmy Carter refused to pay them) "all they did was win." is it their fault that Wall Street determined national bankruptcy was better alternative? I fail to see how. Will they now have their pay cut to zero as a consequence? You tell me. This is easily the most ambitious war in US History...the fact that the nation's survival does not depend AT ALL by what goes on over there makes it all the more amazing to me. What is going on over there? Obviously you have no clue.
Wrong. ZOG's debt-based "economy" cannot survive dollar-collapse. If Iran is allowed to drop the petro-dollar - BRICS already are - others will follow, and the dollar will rapidly approach its real value: 0. Result: ZOGFALL. Looking at the main players - Isramerica vs. RussIran - I'm betting on the latter, mostly via Iran's ability - via asymetric warfare - to close the Straits and spike oil. Should be interesting...assuming the DC fuckheads don't just deepfry the planet.
I am not prejudiced against any creature
even those composed of re-animated flesh
"You Didn't Build That Frankenstein!' sez President Obama
- YouTube
"In addition, gold will need to be confiscated."
How, exactly, Mr. Author?
Buncha bunk.
you know all those illegal aliens that we put in our armed forces...yes those guys that will be glad to kick your door down and conficatio your goldio gringo.
national guard? police officers? army?
Gold could be confiscated easily through gold ETFs such as GLD.
You buy shares they buy gold and store in in one location in HSBC vaults in NYNY.
The book value of gold is $42.22/ounce according to the Treasury.
"The book value of gold is currently $42.2222 per troy ounce. The information used to compile this reporting is received from the U.S. Mint, Federal Reserve banks, and FMS.
Current Report: August 31, 2012
Contacts:If you have questions about this report, please call (202) 874-9866.
http://fms.treas.gov/gold/index.html
So the Gold ETFs, such as GLD are designed to concentrate all of the publics private stock opf gold in on place for ease of confiscation when they will give you $42.22/ounces as compensation.
THAT IS HOW THE GOV'T WILL CONFISCATE GOLD.
My facts are irrefutable.
"Everybody's going to war but we don't know what we are fighting for."
South African reverend Desmond Tutu this week refused to share a stage with ex British Prime Minister, Tony Blair, on the grounds of waging war in Iraq under false pretences
Tony Blairs 'office' stated it was a very hard decision both morally and politically
Here's your choice:
1. Go to war on piss-poor intelligence Saddam has WMD, murder 200-300,000 innocent civilians in collateral damage, put British lives at risk and cost the country tens of £billions per annum
2. Say No (ie. no pissing away peoples lives or spending £billions)
Someone tell me what was "hard" or "difficult" to decide between these 2 options??
The US made him an offer he couldn't refuse.
then Blair should have made the US "offer" public as he is on public duty
Tony is a Fabian, I believe this is the group Woodrow Wilson was referring to when he said “Since I entered politics, I have chiefly had men’s views confided to me privately. Some of the biggest men in the U.S., in the field of commerce and manufacturing, are afraid of somebody, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they had better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it.”
The Fabian Society is a very old group originating in England in 1884, with the purpose of forming a single, global socialist state. “Fabian Socialism” uses incremental change over a long period of time to slowly transform a state as opposed to using violent revolution for change. It is essentially socialism by stealth. Their original emblem was a shield with a wolf in sheep’s clothing holding a flag with the letters F.S. Today the international symbol of the Fabian Society is a turtle, with the motto below: “When I strike, I strike hard.”
http://theweathereye.wordpress.com/2010/06/27/the-fabian-society/
To see how motivated and twisted these people are, one just has to look at the Beatrice Webb House in Surrey, England. That house has a pretty creepy stained glass window which has the following written on it:
In describing the stained glass window, G. Edward Griffin in his book “The Creature from Jekyll Island” wrote:
Great info. Keep it up!
Well done
The fabians were/are often spoilt rich kids with oxford and cambridge as alma mater.
they love the worker when trying to get laid at university but are appalled by his smell when they finally meet one.
shit on 'em.
He was certainly NOT inferring the Fabians in this quote. Do you know who his "handlers" were? He was controlled by Jewish bankers all the way. Besides, his core political beliefs actually lined up with Socialism. Why would he be scared of his own pals?
Connect the dots between the banksters and the Fabians here:
The Fabians, the Round Table, and the Rhodes Scholars
http://modernhistoryproject.org/mhp?Article=FinalWarning&C=5.1#Fabian
As for Woodrow Wilson and his "alter ego" and advisor Colonel House, this from a review of Col. House book Philip Dru: Administrator:
"Tony Blairs 'office' stated it was a very hard decision"
Translation: Blair had a raging boner when he decided.
you left out option 3. britain gets all the oil contracts and the usa pays for all the bombs and bullets...WIN!
kind of like when the pussy Brits got kicked out of Iran's oil fields in the 50's and got the CIA to depose the democratically elected Iranian Prez and put the POS Shah in power-you mean like that?
0G:
Nope, nothing to see here after >14 months of anticipation. But as stated not only in the article:
This is universally known to be fact, based upon survivors, bodies, injuries, and Chemical Ali.
So these are "extra special" WMD that kill when ordered to and vanish upon command.
I get it now.
- Ned
so, in 1980 they didn't invade Iraq why? if the last invasion was based on WMD why they didn't do it in 1980?
the reason is called OIL.
Oil was not the only reason or even the biggest reason. Here Philip Zelikow admits the real reason:
Mr. Zelikow also went on to become the excecutive director of the September 11 Commission...so as to 'sheperd' that body in the 'right direction' and avoid embarassing details that might conflict with the official story.
Let us not forget that Saddam plotted to assasinate George H. W. Bush and Junior had to exact revenge for his daddy's honor.
http://twitpic.com/8v4xw0
Who is it that wants war?
Classic!
There's no reason for Iran to do anything but build schools roads and service infrastructure and pay for it with oil. Keep themselves out of trouble, import great technology and educators from around the world, and acquire long term prosperity. They have assets of value. They would do well to prioritize better. It's very, very easy if given latitude.
latitude aint got nothing to do with jihad....
You must be joking?
After Churchill, MI6 and the CIA launched a coup de tate to overthrow, and murder, the first democratically elected Prime Minister in 1953 because he nationalized the oil companies to do all those things you wrote above?
I is better that you read and learn WHY the Iranians HATE and mis-trust the West for very good reason!
That is like saying the native Americans should just get over it.
Who is guaranteed to win regardless of the outcome of the war and whether it can be contained? The Anglo-American financial elites and the bankers always win every conflict regardless of the military outcome.
OK......let's just get rid of the elites and bankers...... problem solved.
I could support that.
Who needs bankers when you can get financing through online lending?
I say fuck the banks. Outlaw short term repurchase agreements (REPO) and let them, fail!!!!!
Let small investors, collectively, become lenders. Use credit unions.
I strongly doubt that Iran wants a war.
Look for the US or Israel to stage a "USS Maine" incident soon. You can take that to the bank.
the Republicans meeting in Tampa
roll the Fuhrer!
'Nazi Party? Adolf Hitler... You Didn't Build That!' sez President Obama
- YouTube
Sie bauen nicht, die!
"...but we don't know what we are fighting for".
Sing it now
...
and it's 1, 2, 3 what are we fighting for?
Don't ask me, I don't geve a damn
Next stop is....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuUBCF3KKxc
PS
Also a refrain about Wall Street ;-)
I highly doubt that Iran sees itself as wanting a war and is willing to absorb a massive USA air campaign. To be real, and Iran's leaders are very real, Iran would be devestated and laid waste. Modern society and mordern civilization is easily disjointed by even a minimal air campaign. So NO, I would not say Iran wants war.
Israel wants war, but they want the USA to fight it with them just playing a secondary role and using the US air war as cover to accomplish some of their Middle East goals and to take out those in Iran they suspect of really being a threat to Israel.
China, YES, I do believe they see the USA as being greatly weakened if it gets sucked into fighting Iran. China does not want to see Iran fall to the USA, so they may supprt Iran via backdoor aid.
NATO/Europe. Hard to say. There is a hard core pro USA warmonger element in the elites of Europe. They may want war.
The USA wants war, and for all the reasons the writer mentions. On this score he is right on the money!
What was left out is Russia, Russia though vastly weaker than the old USSR, does still present a potential threat to USA/NATO conquest of the entire Middle East and Central Asia, which is their clear goal. Russia has until recently backed down at every step and surrendered to every USA demand short of given over sovereign status to a USA puppet ruler. But Putin seems to have decided to caving in to US demands only ups the US demands and leads to further demands. Putin has had enough and now clearly see the USA as a direct and strongly motivated threat to Russia. He believes, and is correct, that the USA is determined to subvert the Russian state and to break apart the Russian nation along ethnic and regional lines. To copy Yugoslavia and create a series of weak powerlus US puppet states that are controlled by the US Pentagon and the world IMF.
Putin and China are not natural allies, but the grave threat that the US and NATO pose to them makes them allies in desperate need of eachother. Iran is not part of the club, but the Russians and Chinese are thinking about letting them become closer to their alliance.
The Russians would be fools to let NATO and the US conquer Iran and run it as an anti Russian and anti Chinese puppet state while turning over the oil concessions to the US oil compnaies. Look to Iraq and Libya to see who now runs the oil operations and who owns them.
Damn Jack, you're good.
Agreed. A thoughtful and cogent analysis.
China is really the wild card, they could back the Iranians like they did the N Koreans and give Uncle Sam a (fatal?) bloody nose. Guns/weapons/ammo tech for oil. They need that Iranian black gold like an addict needs his fix.
jack jack - i think the real question is....how many smart bombs do we have left? if we are printing 100% of our fed budget right now, can we buy more' million dollar a kill bombs'. when american soldiers have to actually fight on the ground with a real major enemy like russia or china (or korea by proxy) and we see 5000 dead EVERY FUCKING DAY...well ....are americans going to sit still for that. killing people with a smart bomb from 1000 miles away on a computer screen is easy. when we really have to fight a real enemy, will we have the balls to do it for years....?
i think the answer is no, as happened in the 10+ years war in Vietnam.
North Viet lost something like 1.5 milions soldiers and probably 3 milions civilians.
U.S.A had 50k + dead and 300k + wounded. and they lost......................
Jack:
And when playing vs. our Poker Player in Chief, who begs patience until the second term, when he can fold us, that is a smart strategy.
Good post, thanks,
- Ned
Sorry, but Iran does not want war.
" No Middle East nation has ever been victorious against either the US or Israel."
Stopped reading after that.
How we doing in Afghanistan? How'd Israel do against Lebanon?
"Lebanon". You mean Shia Hezbollah. And that's why Isramerica arms the Sunni-Terrorist uprising in Syria. Must break Shi'ite Crescent, cut Hezbollah supply lines before attacking Iran. If the Iranians fight half as well as Hezbollah did in '06, Isramerica is in deep trouble.
saw some MSM BS story today about how the poor widdle Israelis built a rocket-proof grade school. IT WAS BUILT ON STOLEN PALESTINIAN LAND. but what do you know- no mention of that.
Afghanistan’s military and political situation through the years including the USSR attempts to capture the country and the US attempt to “pacify” the country along with the US “success” in the invasion of Iraq and the “freedom” of Egypt from the bad guys to the worst guys says loud and clear that the US is not ready for another war. That is not inclusive of the “maybe” fact that as a Nation we are broke and our Military has been pushed to the limit and we need to reduce the wear and tear and rest and regroup.
An army need to be fought just like a prize fighter, Training is not enough. Germany in Spain before WW2 is a perfect example. However, we don’t need any more right now. We cant take care of the returning troops with health care and jobs. We don’t need more of the same problems without solving some of the present problems.
WE need to sit the next few dances out and let MENA go. The proposed purpose suggested in this article is that WAR will be a diversion to keep the American people passive. I think not. The American people were NOT passive during Vietnam.
Piss on your WAR and your nutty concepts of who America is.
I would be extremely surprised if Iran had not prepared many years ago for war with the US by planting sleepers in the US with CBW capabilities. Like pest control companies with spraying capabilities. If Israel/US attack Iran with airpower I would expect plagues to break out in major US cities as well as mass deaths due to chemical clouds - how difficult is it to mix ammonia with bleach, for example? Our government has not begin to explain to the people what the consequences of this war will be - IMO it will not just be played out at a safe and entertaining distance on tv. It will come through your windows and AC vents and it will kill you in your sleep.
The good news from the government's point of view - a lot fewer pissed off people with guns to oppose their takeover. Eminent domain will allow governments at all levels to seize the property of all those killed by "terrorists". The international banks will of course have to manage the sale of all those 'abandoned' properties. And that crazy judge in West Texas? Maybe not so crazy.
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean you're not being followed - H.L. Mencken
Sorry - have to go. There are some guys dressed in funny black uniforms at my front door.
a-spirit:
No-No-No!!! Ask almost anyone around here, there ain't no stinkin' or odourless chems hangin' around anywhere in the MENA area. Our borders are so tight that the stuff that doesn't exist couldn't cross the border anyway.
</sarc>
- Ned
what you just said mean nuclear explosion on Teheran, do you realise how hard these thing are likely to happen?
War will "solve growing domestic political problems" in Iran?
Are you high?
Indeed! That statement was really "off the wall" and serves to discredit anything written in the rest of the article.
Iran being laid waste in a vicious and prolonged air war that takes out all the supports to it's military and civilian structures hardly qualifies as "solving domestic problems". You would have to be as high as Rush Limbaugh on 1,000 mg of oxy to believe that.
Though I will have to say that the 9/11 attack on the USA did solve a growing number of problems for the US elites and for the US military and intelligence structures that serve the elites. But this is FAR different than a full blown air war against a nation with minimal air defense capabilites due to Russia's unwillingness to honor their contract to sell modern mobil S-300 air defense system to Iran. The contracts were abrogated on demands from the USA and Israel. Another case of Russia backing down to western demands. In future, we may see less of this surrendering by Russia.
All the recent Russian leaders had to be bought off.
Nobody could have played this game as stupidly as they have.
coat of arms of the Russian Federation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coat_of_arms_of_Russia
double headed Eagle on a Red Shield. could mean nothing.
mate i respect you cause you're a clever guy BUT
can you imagine a war with Iran with 50k+ casualities? with modern days media coverage?
impossible to sustain..... really..... that would mean uprising in some city of the USA probably
This article has the distinct feel of having been written and edited by a college freshman for an intro politics class.
totally agree with you. this is really poor
Yes but, the comments give exponentially more information. Therefore:
Article worth reading.
Israeli does not have the balls or the logistics to start a conflict with Iran independent of anybody. They need Turkey, the US, NATO, and at least one of the 'stans to even launch one sortie.
There is not going to be any prolonged air to ground campaign into Iran, unless Obama is so blackmailed and then the Buffs fly 24/7 for 10 years.
Pull up a map of Iran. It's huge. (That's what she said.) Fact book says its the size of Alaska, with terrain to match. You are talking about a nationalistic war fighting population of 30 million backed by Allah - 3 times Iraq/ How did that work out?
Iran wants to be a martyr against US/Israeli "imperialism." The War starts and guess what?
It NEVER ends. Like the war of terror.
Sadly, it will be in the US interest to shut down the Gulf, freeze China out of that oil and otherwise co-op another generation in Arabia - which is what bin ladin railed against in the first place. At some point the paid off Wahhabis are going to see the light along with the millions of poor in Egypt. The ISI will provide a bomb just for spite.
Maybe by that time the war-bots will be rolling.
Madness.
very mountainous terrain in Iran-much like Afghanistan and that is goig well-right? US army is built for a European plains Cold War scenario.
Just to clarify, according to my brother who was an Air Force pilot, "Buffs" are Air Force slang for B-52's, or maybe now updated to indicate any Big Ugly Fat Fellow heavy bomber aircraft. Fat Man was slang for one of the first atom bombs. I doubt that any air war would endure for 10 years.
The USA may wish to block China access to oil, but not at the cost of shutting down the Gulf. More likely just block China access to oil pipelines across central Asia.
So true!!!!
As long as the military imperatives of "kill them before they kill you" do not runaway, then the article above is correct. However, the REAL weapons availiable are MANY ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE greater than anything that was available before 1950. If the military imperatives to "use it, before you lose it" fully kick in, then nobody wins, not even the elite banksters.
The American Civil War was the "first modern war."
The war in this article is the first postmodern war.
How is the Civil War "first modern war" and not the last Napolianic type war?
rifling? smokless gunpowder? iron clads? repeating rifle?
They still lined up to take it in the face!
I don't concider that "modern"!
Two little questions: How will the U.S. cope with Sunburn anti-ship missiles and how will it cope with thousands of smart mines in the Straits of Hormuz?
like shooting fish in a barrel. sunburns will prove to be the death-knell for the carrier just as the carrier killed off the battleship in WWII
as USA already sent there 2 minesweeper.............................................................
I disagree, china and iran wants us doing indirect war until they get a civil war and go broke. Dumb US are doing just as Iran, Russia and China planned.
Yep, Project 100,000 worked for Ol' Mac and it will work again.
I'm with above comments re: drug-induced psychosis and jejeune thinking.
- Ned
"..Frankly, few people believe anything from either the American government or its establishment propaganda outlets ..."
and those who do are fucktards....or neo-stassi agents ingratiating themselves in collective ass of the bush crime syndicate.....war in the middle east is a long held dream of the neo-cons who crafted this longterm plan at least as early as the 1970s but which blossomed in the 1990s after gulf war 1.....and yes its only purposes are to grab oil and to impose martial law....
see general wesley clark for some of the details.....
few?
if someone still has to understand, WE ARE THE FEW reading zh and not swallowing all the news MSM expect us to believe.
Tony,
Might I offer the following observation?
The USD was, absolute, KING until Nixon took us off the gold standard. Now the USD is a petroleum based currency i.e. the petro-dollar.
This relationship is the only guise supporting the USD as the worlds "reserve currency". Once the world exchanges start pricing a barrel of oil in a curreny other than the USD the game is over, the jig is up etc.
I believe your "neo-con....longterm plan" and Nixon taking the USA off the gold standard was no coincidence. The neo-con long term plan was a result to convert from a gold backed USD to the current petro-dollar regime. All of this fuss is to maintain this status quo.
I saw Clark's speel but, find him slightly disingenuous since he is incumbered and lobbyist in support of the ethanol subsidy.
US needs a war because the truth is going mainstream. On the Colorado Public TV website, the nitty gritty from Architects and Engineers: an hour and a half on the overwhelming evidence for demolition. Complete with Cog Dis therapy at the end.
9/11: Explosive Evidence - Experts Speak Outhttp://video.cpt12.org/video/2270078138
Only those who lose a war get tried and hung....
SPF 10 Gazzillion will protect the US Navy against Sunburn Anti-Ship missiles... Will you put some on my bow?
If WW2 was all about the Spanish Civil War, then the coming war will be all about Syria.
The Salafists (aka Wahabis, aka Al CIAda) make the Ayatollahs look like Sunday School teachers... make that Sunday School teachers who really hate kids and have a bad hangover, but nonetheless.
The battle for Syria is about Sunni vs Shia. To make it simple, the Sunni are like really grouchy Calvinist Protestants, and the Shia are like the Pope, but without the Jesuits. In this case, the Calvinsts(Sunni) have alll the money and all the power, and the Pope and his minions (the Shia) are fighting an uphill battle.
The Sunni want to break the Shia crescent that stretches from Lebanon to Iran. The Americans have had good luck with the Salafists (Sunni), but they get so confused, first the USA doesn't like Sunnis because the Israelis took down the World Trade Centers. So the USA attacks Iraq and sets up a Shia government there, but then the USA wants to attack Iran, which is Shia, and supports anti-Shia Al CIAda salafists in Syria to take out Assad, who is an Alawite (that is, an apostate heterodox Protestant sect, according to the Ayatollahs- think of Alawites as Mormons or Seventh-day Adventists who like to electrify the gonads of their political enemies).
So, what goes down in Syria is going to show us the template for the next war. I hope that cleared up the confusion for everyone.
"first the USA doesn't like Sunnis because the Israelis took down the World Trade Centers"
explain me this sentence plz
Presumably he meant, USA pretends not liking Sunnis who were falsely blamed when the Israelis took down the World Trade Centers. Of course, it was actually the USA Government which took down the World Trade Center towers.
"If WW2 was all about the Spanish Civil War"
plz explain this cause i m really LMAO
oups, too much foreplay!
I think he means Hitler used the Spanish civil war to test the mettle of the West's ability to fight his regime. When France and the Anglos chickened out to stop fascism in SPain aided and abetted by Hitler; he knew he could march into Czecho and Poland.
The west, especially France, had no stomach to fight after WW1. It paid the price of Maginot illusion.
Foreplay is important in love and war! Ask Tolstoy!
Since it was the Sunni sect that poisoned ten or eleven prophets (Shi'ite) decendents of Muhammud. I offer the following allusion:
Shi'te: Like Christians worshiping Christ
Sunni: Like Christians worshiping the Pope
Twelvers believe that the descendants of the Islamic prophet Muhammad through his daughter Fatimah and his son-in-law ‘Al? are the best source of knowledge about the Qur'an and Islam, the most trusted carriers and protectors of Mu?ammad's traditions and the most worthy of emulation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelver
The Twelve Imams are the spiritual and political successors to Muhammad, in the Twelver or Ithna Ashariya branch of Shia Islam.[9]According to the theology of Twelvers, the successor of Muhammad is an infallible human individual who not only rules over the community with justice, but also is able to keep and interpret the Sharia and its esoteric meaning. The prophet and imams' words and deeds are a guide and model for the community to follow; as a result, they must be free from error and sin, and must be chosen by divine decree, or nass, through Muhammad.
Ten decendents of Muhammad were poisoned by Sunnis, the Twelth vanished to Allah and is supposed to return.
I do agree that Sunnis are Salafists and Wahhabis are Sunni and not Shi'ite.
The author forgot to mention the Saudies. They want to spread their Sunnie influence and dominate the region. They also want to destroy Iran because they are Shiite. I think they are the worst war instigators in that region of the world.
Indeed, a very big miss.
L0L!!!
everybody is going to war in the middle-east? and here's why?
and people think they understand this?
what if it is just "facts and opinion" + bullshit = "factual" opinionated bullshit?
i mean at least he didn't make the fact that he has smelly feet a 'reason' too
there are much better reasons for people not to goto war
here's something i fired off a bit ealier tonight on a string i didn't have time for before the slots; this is by an oil analyst and the string was about "the endless war"; zH means bidniss and war is biiigBidness so we'll never get an aticle on a neoCon "fringe" site the maybe war is NOT in the best intersts of... us?
oil? cunts? war cunts? war mongering cunts? war mind=gering cunts with MONEY for tyler? republicunts? no problemo!
but people? that would be radical to the asses fascist asses tyler has his lips glued upon
[Paste re-post] :>
i appreciate your comments here, jr
it seems it is de rigeuer for any oil analyst to "expect" belligerency; that helps keep prices up!
since late last year it hasn't been in the cards, imo
libya cost the EU a FORTUNE; syria ain't cheap; other "allies" don't have the flexibility the global currency and we're tapioca too!
the article is ok and although his facts about saudi interest in overthrowing assad in syria may be factual, i do not consider them fully contextual
syria borders iraQ and we went in there under totally false pretenses in march 2003
but the border to/with syria was quite porous and open and there was a LOT of "diplomacy" around that issue as i remember; and assad wasn't pro-american; he wasn't anti-american totally i don't think, but for size of turf and population, his country is as diverse as ours isn't it?
a lot of middle-easterners were probably pretty pissed off about the invasion in 2003. i was and i'm not m-e; so assad let his diverse citizens use the border as usual; the US is the one that made all the "changes"; and it may have "cost american lives" when we couldn't control HIS borders
turkey? they responded more willingly to the US diplomacy i'd say
bilary's "handlers" want him out b/c of regional strategies and also once you piss off a neoCon stateDept, they have a long memory; near-legendary w/ the bushDynasty, for those who can think straight
i piss them off all the time, but not on the ground
so i think it may be more than "coincidental" that they had the same program as the US for different "reasons" of course
if the US were backing assad, i don't think the saudis would be 'arming his enemies' if ya catch my drift
when kofi quit i predicted there would be a buncha bloodshed and another push to the peace talks, b/c with russia this involved and friendly with assad, militarism almost certainly can not "win"
china and the rooskies will not "look away and hold their noses" as they did over libya so the US can not get the no-fly done "legally" thru the UN which i've been pointing out since last year and finally a "news" item appeared appeared this summer where men'devilish' said the same thing; around the end of kofi's 'term'
so this is 'nam-like in that a military "solution" is not in the cards and never has been
that's how much propaganda we are getting tho; the "press" is just beginning to realize there may actually hafta be peaceTalks
fuking propagandists! thousands of people are DEAD because the PRESS is not doing its job; the groupthink is beyond belief for MSM TV; put two rounds thru the TV:> his & hers
hopefully the US will see the NEED to get the hell outa the budness of organizing the trashing of the peaceTalls soon; the problem is: criminals have their blind spots, toooo... and we'd all like to rob a hundred banks; i'm sure that is why we have bankster-envy:> they rob them all the time!
even tho the saudis are fighting iranian interests in syria, they are not fighting iran
maybe somebody thinks they "should" but they weren't born last night either
not that they would fear joining the cause; it simply is not their cause
the telecommunications and internet revolutions have much more impact on traditional societies than the more westernized ones, educationally
a decade ago were were hearing all about the "schools" and perhaps some of the "teaching" was pretty crude at least by western standards
i don't know if or how much education of these children is changing, but we aren't hearing about anti-americanism being 'taught' as much at all
this is the point i was trying to look at below, earlier, too; when people realize they have been trained to hate other people mindlessly b/c they are "supposed" to and their children are now receiving the same training, some of them stop and get their kids outa there, too
we had jimCrow laws in 1950 didn't we? we still have our "attitudes" about those not "like us" but it they are not the same any more either
egypt: egypt is a very close and strong ally of the US, and this country has now elected an engineer who taught at zag-a-zig U! i want a T-shirt and a hat! he got his phD in soCal too! when he changed the military leadership he didn't take them out and shoot them, he took the new guys out in the sinai! the message may have been: i can order you to fight and die; and i can also order you to stop killing egyptians now!
now if that is close, that is a "long way, Baby" for egypt
egypt and israel have both been close US allies since jimmyCarter performed the wedding and the republican completely freaked out! but they WERE able to do it!
we spent decades getting "informed" about arafat; he'd look pretty good right now!
the CFR and foggyBottom can take their foot off the gas, too
it's not thay they haven't had their military and diplomatic successes over the last decade; it's just that most of the foreign policy was based on LIES; i don't even hafta assert that 9-11 was based on lies: yea or nay on 9-11 iraQ didn't 'do' it and iraq was based on lies
and 5 years later, the USA was BK by the neocon liars! timmah packed up a plane-load of benjamins and the plane landed in araq and the money~~nobody knows what happened to it and i'm not sure rummy did anything about those responsible; probably b/c they were above him in the chain of command? or it just wasn't "approprite" b/c the criminals and/or operatives might not like it
i think america deserves and answer b/c it wasn't a military deal; they just made the delivery; i guess the "oil analysts" don't "need" this piece of the puzzle to understand wtf is going on the mid-east
but i do; our citizenism does; this was a "mission" and was probably political or "diplomatic/spook"; maybe it was the cash to purchase the next 100 tons of smack; fine! who would be surprised at that? if the republicunts are gonna run drug & arms trading out the white house, why shouldn't the NY FED supply the financing? all the fuking proceeds are gonna be laundered thru the banking system too; i don''t care; i don't want to punish anyone; i just want to know wtf IS going on; i wouldn't be surprized if the NY FED got the money back! it was a 'bridge' loan
maybe the clintons & prez0 roll this way too but just didn't 'lose' a planeload of cash when the business plan hit the ground for the "supply chain"
and i think if we were given this "part", the "picture" we are sposed to see would change, too!
this isn't ancient history, this is 9 years ago
so maybe even the corpo-fascist internationalists who are exporting the "human rights that don't mean anything-democracies" under happy-happy-joy-joy UN cover can at LEAST back off long enuf to get the checkbook balanced again like it was when their fuking neoCons "won" the 2000 election
yeah:> i'm talkin to the CFR here wid ya; so i hope you see it, too L0L!!! what the HELL is going on here? maybe we should legalize H and use it to fund obamaCare & SS? the methadone industry would shit!
all i know is we're freaking BROKE from these clown acts
we don't MIND working for our livings ya know! but the people running the 'debt-enslavement' better stop w/ the fuking guns and get w/ the fuking butter:> we need 20 million jobs back
they can engineer the export; they can engineer the IMPORT; so lets see them get started with THEIR money, ok?and maybe we can simplify things a bit so they'll work better for everyone; we DO allow jobs don't we? and yes, not using the creek as the dump IS "expensive"
china can go on printed SS, foodStamps, and unemployment; we can redeem our bonds to help them!
they don't wanna freeTibet? fuk em!