It's Official: German Economy Minister Demands Surrender Of Greek Budget Policy, Says It Is First Of Many Such Sovereign "Requests"

Tyler Durden's picture

While over the past 2 days there may have been some confusion as to who, what, how or where is demanding that Greece abdicate fiscal sovereignty (with some of our German readers supposedly insulted by the suggestion that this idea originated in Berlin, and specifically with politicians elected by a majority of the German population), today's quotefest from German Economy Minister Philipp Roesler appearing in Germany's Bild should put any such questions to bed. And from this point on, Greece would be advised to not play dumb anymore vis-a-vis German annexation demands. So from Reuters, "Greece must surrender control of its budget policy to outside institutions if it cannot implement reforms attached to euro zone rescue measures, the German economy minister was quoted as saying on Sunday. Philipp Roesler became the first German cabinet member to openly endorse a proposal for Greece to surrender budget control after Reuters quoted a European source on Friday as saying Berlin wants Athens to give up budget control." And some bad news for our Portuguese (and then Spanish) readers: you are next.

More:

"We need more leadership and monitoring when it comes to implementing the reform course," Roesler, also vice chancellor, told Bild newspaper, according to an advance of an interview to be published on Monday.

 

"If the Greeks aren't able to succeed themselves with this, then there must be stronger leadership and monitoring from abroad, for example through the EU," added Roesler, chairman of the Free Democrats (FDP) who share power with Chancellor Angela Merkel.

 

Reuters reported on Friday that Germany wants Greece to give up control of budget policy to European institutions as part of discussions over a second rescue package.

 

Greece, which has repeatedly failed to meet the fiscal targets set out by its international lenders, is in talks to finalise a second 130 billion-euro ($172 billion) package.

 

With many Greeks blaming Germans for the austerity medicine their country has been forced to swallow, officials in Athens dismissed the idea of relinquishing budget control as out of the question.

 

Finance Minister Evangelos Venizelos said on Sunday Greece was perfectly capable of making good on its promises.

 

"Anyone who puts a nation before the dilemma of 'economic assistance or national dignity' ignores some key historical lessons," he said in a statement before heading to Brussels for a European Union summit on Monday.

And by the way, this is just the beginning:

A government source in Berlin said Germany's proposal was aimed not just at Greece but also at other struggling euro zone members that receive aid and are unable to make good on their obligations.

So yes, it is true, and Germany is dead serious. Ball is in the Greek court now: just how far will the new technocrat PM go to sell its people in exchange for a few banker smiles?

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John Law Lives's picture

Cue Sausage the riot dog.  Maybe a few Molotov cocktails will fly as well..

lolmao500's picture

At least one guy in Ireland found a use for the Euro :

Jobless man builds a house out of $1.82 billion worth of shredded money

"Whatever you say about the Euro, it's a great insulator."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=beK0O25O9aY

You can't eat fiat currency, but you can build a house out of it!

Father Lucifer's picture

3 words "this is Sparta" "lock and load".

Pseudo Anonym's picture

over the past 2 days there may have been some confusion as to who, what, how or where is demanding that Greece abdicate fiscal sovereignty

there's never been any confusion on my part that it is the hofjuden that are demanding greek's sovereignty and tangible assets; not the german people via their stupid Bundestag.

Quintus's picture

This fits perfectly into my long held opinion that Germany is done rescuing peripheral EZ countries, but for the sake of appearances, does not want to be the one that actually pulls the trigger.

My suspicion all along has been that Germany will resolve this issue by making impossible demands from the PIIGS countries in return for 'Assistance'.  When the target countries inevitably decline to sell their souls to Berlin, the Germans can walk away with a clean conscience and say 'Well we did our best to help, but they refused to accept'.

 

ucsbcanuck's picture

Agreed - this makes it palatable domestically as well. To the average German it looks reasonable, and since these guys don't want to accept a reasonable offer - time to leave the burning building. 

My feeling is that the Germans will firewall their banks while everything goes to pieces around them. Then buy it up and complete their dream of controlling Europe.

cnx's picture

"My feeling is that the Germans will firewall their banks while everything goes to pieces around them."

They have already done so. On Thursday, the 2008 banking bailout fund SOFFIN was re-passed by the Bundestag and has a size of about half a billion- to be reactivated for the next emergency soon to come:

http://www.handelsblatt.com/politik/international/risiken-durch-die-euro...

 

ucsbcanuck's picture

Half a billion isn't enough. They're going to need a lot more than that. 100 - 200 bn is closer to the mark (no pun intended)

alfa's picture
Hymn to Liberty or Hymn to Freedom
National Anthem of Greece.
Rudyard Kipling (1918)
We knew thee of old,
O, divinely restored,
By the lights of thine eyes,
And the light of thy Sword.
From the graves of our slain,
Shall thy valour prevail,
As we greet thee again,
Hail, Liberty! Hail!
Poetic
I shall always recognize you
by the dreadful sword you hold
as the Earth with searching vision
you survey with spirit bold
From the Greeks of old whose dying
brought to life and spirit free
now with ancient valour rising
let us hail you, oh Liberty!
frenchie's picture

hm

now are all german nazis again or what ?

lolmao500's picture

If Germany doesn't want to lose their money, they should give anything to Greece. Simple.

Let us control your budget or NO MONEY.

No money it is then.

Problem solved.

williambanzai7's picture

There are nefarious people who look at this as opportune conquest rather than bailout.

Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

That's what I'm saying.

-From my mom's kitchen ipad

tony bonn's picture

"just how far will the new technocrat PM go to sell its people in exchange for a few banker smiles?"

he would walk a million miles....piece of shit that he is....

jcaz's picture

Spoke with a Greek on Friday,  was illuminating to say the least-  Greece is laughing at the rest of the world, believing that they have all the leverage they need to continue on "as-is", and see no reason to make ANY changes in their system....

Can't blame them-  gutless ECU has been all talk thus far.

Nice to see that Germany sees thru their bullshit.

C-B77's picture

You spoke to a Greek? REALLY??? 

Was she a 6ft blonde Greek goddess with huge boobs, was she named "Mary"? Did you fuck her but lost her phone number and you don't have a picture of her either?

 

You lucky statistician, you 

 

 

 

Wipeout2097's picture

"also at other struggling euro zone members that receive aid and are unable to make good on their obligations"

As a Portuguese I know what this means, and it does NOT mean "some bad news for our Portuguese (and then Spanish) readers: you are next".

Ergo rated 4*

 

C-B77's picture

And as a person who loves Portugal, I'm afraid that that is exactly what it means.

I'm afraid this is wishful thinking on your part, beeing Portuguese doesn't necesseraly qualify you to predict the troubles that are coming your way. In fact Portuguese, as well as Greek, people TEND (this is not personal and I don't mean to generalise either) to be more in the dark than the rest. Courtesy of their goverments....

Acet's picture

As a Portuguese who doesn't live there anymore and keeps up with the state of things both there and in 2 other EU countries (one I lived in before and the other one where I am now) I'm afraid you can be pretty damn sure that Portugal will be next.

Given the exceptional ineptitude of Portuguese politicians (note the one-off raiding of the Banker's Association Pension Fund to slice off a tiny 1/4 of this year's public deficit), the policies of austerity for the middle class but not the local elites, the unresolved housing boom, the almost constant discovery of yet another previously unknown debt from the Madeira region, the fact that, frankly, nobody else in Europe really cares about Portugal (and they have really silly prejudices, like the notion that everybody in Portugal sleeps the siesta) and, above all, the spectacularly bad level of management in Portugal (exceptionally good workers, really bad management) it's pretty much guaranteed that when shit hits the rotating impeller, Portugal is going to be left out to dry.

In fact, after a Greek default, expect the focus to completely bypass Portugal and Ireland (who will be left to fend for themselves) and go directly to Italy and Spain, the real Too-big-to-fail of this show.

props2009's picture

The most imp data point that FED looks at and it cannot be easily faked.

http://capital3x.com/trades/one-data-point-that-fed-look-at-more-than-ot...

prains's picture

props, that chart is only gonna get worse

Eclipse89's picture

I doubt very much that Greece, the first ????? (démos): people and ?????? (cràtos): power, will give up its democracy for money.

I mean, in both cases (accepting lost of sovereignty or the default) the Greeks will face a long period of sacrificies, so I won't be surprised if tomorrow they say: "Fuck you all, Greece is in default."

At least by doing so they can avoid a revolution, because no one, homeless or rich, will accept a german dictatorship.

Plus, we have goldman saying to short USD heavly..... mmmhhhhh.......

2012 bitchez.

prains's picture

you're forgetting Goldman runs Greece.....

Divine Wind's picture

I doubt very much that Greece, the first ????? (démos): people and ?????? (cràtos): power, will give up its democracy for money.

 

Ever been to Greece?

Bunch of frickin loons.

When they realize everyone is serious, they will sell their souls for another round of Ouzo in order to keep the party going.

 

smiler03's picture

Your name should be "Stinking Flatulence" considering that you are talking out of your asshole.

no life's picture

It's funny, they finally hit a snag in their little plan..  Here they've been effortlessly throwing billions into the PIIGS, gloriusly creating the audacious next day market melt after the humpteenth summitt meeting in Brussells..  Only now they got a small problem with the country that just keeps taking all the bailout billions and never does anything they were supposed to. So it becomes unavoidably clear that these guys have just decided to suck up all these billions and then head off into the sunset..  Which means that now, instead of a summitt, speech, launching of billions - with ensuing market melt up - they are forced to snipe each other from afar all weekend, no billions are released to the destitute nation, sit around the office sweating the next day as the market falls off a cliff.  They don't like this!  Don't be suprised if you see an 'unexpected' international conflict magically appear out of nowhere.

hooligan2009's picture

don't forget a lot of the money goes to repaying the debt (i think 70%?) previosuly borrowed by greeks and owed to....germans and french and americans!

MsCreant's picture

If any of this was real, Greece would call Germany's bluff:

"Hey Germany, you're broke bitchez too!"

"Hey Francy pants, the farce is strong with you too. Liar, liar, France on fire."

It isn't real. I love how we track this fiction soap opera shit like something real is going on.

allenaki's picture

One wouldn't expect less from an an allienated Vietnamese, a mentally bastard, a demi-"German", and not at all Vietnamese anymore, who is changing to the yellowisher shade of yellow, at the hearing of the word Vietnam, from a yenissary of his country.

He is a shame and a traitor of his origins, in the first place.

So, no wonder what he plans on Greece THE FUCKING BASTARDO !!!

We have declaration of war.

My opinion is they prepare for the "final solution", just like in 2WW, when the Jews and Polands denied to accept the PLOT against them, until the moment they were stacked onto the wagons to the Lagers.

And even then, until the last moment, they were looking each other.. wondering...

Stockmonger's picture

Bankers: monetary Lebensraum, bitches

UGrev's picture

History Rhyming again.. this must be the chorus. All together now...  WAR WAR WAR WAR..

Bagbalm's picture

Twain said - History does not repeat but it rhymes. Well it's starting to feel a whole lot like 1939.

ebworthen's picture

Kind of humorous to see Germany making demands after playing patty-cake for the past 3 years.

Did you really think they were going to pay you back Frau Merkel?

 

pain_and_soros's picture

One of the questions that I have yet to see receive much attention, or discussion is what have the Greeks done with all debt money that has been accumulated to date???  or more simply, where did it all go?

Yea, some went to deficit financing of government capital & operating budgets and some went to pay interest on sovereign debt.

How much was borrowed by Greek banks at lower than would have otherwise been available interest rates to encourage Greeks to buy Mercedes & BMWs and generally live beyond their means?  and how much was diverted to Greek politicians & pork souvlaki spending on "greecing the wheels of Greek economic life" so to speak?

It also seems apparent that the Greek government distorted their financial reporting which in part made them look more credit worthy than they otherwise would have, and hid the problem longer and allowed it to get bigger, so they must bear some responsibility.

In the end, though it seems both borrowers and lenders are to blame, though just as with the US subprime mess, ultimately the lenders have control and if they decide to lend to credit risks that are known (or should have been known) to be bad, the losses should be on them.

A Greek default won't be the end of the world - let each creditor bank take the hit & let each sovereign recapitalize its own banks, which in turn will spotlight the bad decisions the banks took in lending this money and give the taxpayers in their respective countries a chance to identify who really caused this mess and take action to change things that will prevent it from happening in the future.

unfortunately, that seems to be a pipe dream - but the alternatives seem much worse with politicians continuing to try to pass the buck, er euro debt, on someeone else's taxpayers...

 

MsCreant's picture

Went to buy military equipment, muwahahahahaha!

Greece Spends Bailout Cash On European Military Purchases

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/greece-spends-bailout-cash-european-military-purchases

Is it adding up yet?

Oh wait, it can't add up, can it? 

There is no balance sheet!!!!!

There is no spoon!!!!

 Muwahahahahaha!

allenaki's picture

I agree, a default is not the end of the world, but the lenders don't let the victim free...

Such GIGALOANS are very attractive to the brokers also (PM's...) because of the provisions (10% said Mr. Stiglitz)...

GeneMarchbanks's picture

'It also seems apparent that the Greek government distorted their financial reporting which in part made them look more credit worthy than they otherwise would have, and hid the problem longer and allowed it to get bigger, so they must bear some responsibility.'

In tandem with Goldman only. Since Goldman are the "Untouchables", we can always go after the Greeks. Yes, yes those do-nothing lazy bastards. Sprinkle in some oversimplified shit about 'productivity' and: Viola! The perfect formula for Yankee ignorance of things outside their very own immediate issues. Carry on, the MSM has taught you well you sad, sad solipsists.

hooligan2009's picture

oops, sorry mscreant...gmta anyway 

 

 

where indeed, you might check this out as part of how greek deficit spending went on buying german railways, gear and erecting stations..this is the tip of an iceberg i'm sure..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-12272153

or you might try this for how greece needs to buy german and french planes etc to protect themselves from those nasty turks who invaded the northern part of cyprus and, shock/horror want to join the euro

http://www.politicalworld.org/showthread.php?t=1408

 

smiler03's picture

They put on a fine Olympic Games. They also got a brand new shiny airport which I had the pleasure of flying into on its 4th day of opening. 

My longest holiday in Greece was meant to be 3 weeks, I stayed for 10, but then again that was before they adopted the Euro.

Mark123's picture

A lot of folks are focusing on Germany imposing its will on others....you are missing the point.  All governments are puppets for central banks - only paying lip service to their population.

What I see is the international banking cartel making a show of Greece to scare all the other countries into towing the line.  This is a long game and has been going on for hundreds of years - we are just in a more dynamic period right now (and that makes it more interesting).

To think that Greece was ever a country of free people is a pathetic joke.  Perhaps even more pathetic is to think there is a real election going on in the USA where the people will assert their control over "government".

But this is not just about economics is it? I love how there has been so much serious analysis of the aftermath of our wars of liberation in Iraq, Afganistan, Libya etc. (sarc). I mean, how can you not turn on the TV these days without seeing our reporters traveling into the hinterand of Iraq to see how the common people have suffered.  God bless you MSM....without you where would we be?

allenaki's picture

An deutschen Schweinen und lokalen (griechischen) Kollaborateuren:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAsDzAUa2Hc&feature=player_embedded

200.000 Athener starben in 1942 Winter an Hunger (from the fourth minute and then, in the video)

_____________________________________________________________________

Die kalten Exekutionen in Kontomari, Chania, Kreta Island (eine von den vielen Exekutionen in ganz Griechenland). They gather the people from the village and execute them (one example from a number of such revenge type executions against the greek people, because they resisted)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPYXmODt5M8&feature=player_embedded

The German army ordered the greek people to pay for the German Army's food and living (by seizing all food, etc.)

allenaki's picture

And also, the Germans demanded also a LOAN from occupied Greece !!!

AND SEIZED THE GREEK GOLD FROM THE NATIONAL BANC ETC, TOO, SHIPPING IT TO GERMANY !!!

 

ebworthen's picture

Not surprising that Greece is milking Germany for whatever they can get and playing the waiting game.

King George invested way too much to try and hold on to the colonies and was much too slow to realize that despite having the largest Army and Navy in the world the battle was already lost.

What is Germany going to do, invade?

What court is going to take away the sovereignty of Greece?

You can flash digital money from one end of the globe to another in milliseconds but you cannot force individuals, families, towns, regions, and nations to do something without physically occupying or subduing them.

Good luck with that Germany and Europe.

tongue.stan's picture

Banker Smiles are barbarous relics. There, I said it.

However, you can eat them deep fried, and they make a nice necklace for the mistress.

hooligan2009's picture

thats not an anagram..oh wait..nm

allenaki's picture

And the English "Allies" "of course, of course, bombarded Piraeus Haven, in an "experiment" of "trying the new types of bombs against the Germans" or something like that!!!

4.000 people in Piraeus Haven were killed then!!! (during the War and despite the fact, that Greece was on the side of the Allies!!!)

THE GREEK GENOCIDE HAS NOT BEEN DISCUSSED YET IN A INTERNATIONAL LEVEL, AS IT'S WORTH AND IT DESERVES !!!

lolmao500's picture

4000 ain't a genocide, tard.

allenaki's picture

TARD, OVER 700.000 TO 1.000.000 GREEK PEOPLE WERE KILLED OR STARVED DURING THE WAR

I'M TALKING ABOUT THIS GENOCIDE

(THE 4.000 IN PIRAEUS WERE THE "COLLATERAL DAMAGES..." AS IT IS CALLED TODAY, IN YOUR POLITICAL CORRECT LANGUAGE...)