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Ken Rogoff: Greece Should Be Given A "Sabbatical From The Euro" As Kicking The PIIGS Can Will Just Drag Germany Down

Tyler Durden's picture




 

There is nothing new in this interview of Spiegel magazine with Ken Rogoff, but it is refreshing to listen to a person who has at least some standing in the arena of grand self-delusion (i.e., economics and capital markets), telling it like it is. While he rehashes all the old points, these bear reminding as the key one is what happens to Germany as the can kicking becomes a new default exercise in preserving bank "solvency" at the expense of the last stable economy: when asked if in 2015 the Eurozone will be the same, his response: "It may well be the case that all current members remain in the euro zone, and that Germany keeps on shouldering the ever-increasing debts of other countries. But the price of such a scenario is very high for all involved: southern Europe would become embroiled in permanent stagnation and the German economy would eventually be dragged down to a slower growth trajectory." So even though everyone knows that Europe is doomed in its current configuration, let's all just pretend things shall be well, and keep the even more doomed banks alive for a few more quarters? Is the loss of a banker bonus truly such a great catastrophe to society that countries have to remain in a state of perpetual misery until it all finally unwinds? Judging by today's market action the answer is yes.

From Spiegel:

In an interview with SPIEGEL, Harvard economist Kenneth Rogoff, 58, says it was a mistake to bring all the southern European countries into the common currency. He also argues that Greece should be granted a "sabbatical" from the euro and that a United States of Europe may take shape far sooner than many believe.

SPIEGEL: Mr. Rogoff, the eurozone finance ministers are likely to soon provide Greece with new loans totalling €130 billion ($171 billion), with the aim of stabilizing the country for the next few years. Will that save the euro?

Rogoff: It is hardly the final word, even for Greece. The mountain of debt in Greece is simply too big and the country is not competitive. Indeed, it's going to be very difficult to keep Greece in the euro zone.

SPIEGEL: But the government has announced tough austerity measures. Pensions are being cut, wages frozen. Those kinds of measures are almost unheard of in Europe.

Rogoff: But they're still not enough. To make Greece competitive, wages would have to be halved. That is impossible to implement politically, but without a steep wage cut, the economy will continue to stagnate. Greece urgently needs the prospect of growth. It is currently experiencing its fifth consecutive year of recession. This is a failure of historic dimensions.

SPIEGEL:But surely it can't get any worse? Many economists are saying that the crisis in Greece has bottomed out and the worst is over.

Rogoff: I would be more cautious. The problem in Greece is not an ordinary recession but a full-blown financial crisis, something which countries usually take a lot longer to recover from. This kind of economic collapse goes much deeper than a normal slowdown. The longer the economy continues to shrink, the more restless the trade unions get, and the more pressure builds up on politicians to put an end to the misery.

SPIEGEL: What cure would you prescribe?

Rogoff: The government in Athens should be granted a kind of sabbatical from the euro, while otherwise remaining a full member of the European Union. The country would leave the monetary union and reintroduce the drachma, for example. The drachma would immediately trade at deep discount to the euro, making Greece's export and tourism sectors competitive again. Once the country had achieved a higher level of social, political and economic development, it could return to the euro zone.

SPIEGEL: Most European politicians seem to dismiss that as unviable. They see a Greek exit as the beginning of the end for the euro zone.

Rogoff: I don't see it that way. Of course, Europe would have to assure Greece that it would not be punished in any way for taking such a step. And there would have to be a credible road map for Greece's eventual return.

SPIEGEL: If Greece were to leave the euro zone, a wave of panic might engulf other countries struggling with debt, such as Portugal. How can we prevent the contagion from spreading?

Rogoff: If Greece leaves the euro, the markets will demand sensible answers to two questions. First, which countries should definitely keep the euro? And second, what price is Europe prepared to pay for that? The problem is that the Europeans don't have convincing answers to those questions.

SPIEGEL: What advice would you give Merkel and her counterparts? Should they tear the euro zone apart?

Rogoff: No, certainly not. We are talking about bending not breaking, with one or more periphery countries allowed to leave temporarily in order to enjoy greater flexibility. There is currently no simple solution for this unparalleled crisis. The big mistakes were made in the 1990s.

SPIEGEL: Does that mean the whole idea of the euro was a mistake?

Rogoff: No, a common currency for countries like Germany and France was a reasonable risk, given the political dividends. But it was a grave mistake to bring all the south European states into the euro zone purely for reasons of political union. Most of them were not ready for it economically.

SPIEGEL: That may well be, but the fact is that now they are part of the monetary union, and that can't simply be unravelled.

Rogoff: Which is why there is only one alternative: Either the euro completely collapses -- with all the catastrophic consequences that would entail -- or the core members of the currency union manage to turn the euro zone into a genuine political union.

SPIEGEL: Europe has recently agreed on a fiscal compact committing all members to better budgetary discipline. Is that a step in the right direction?

Rogoff: Yes, but it will by no means suffice. All this treaty does is give the markets the temporary illusion that the problems have been solved for now. It has achieved nothing more than that.

SPIEGEL: What is needed instead?

Rogoff: What the monetary union needs more than anything is a central government, including a a finance minister, with significant tax and spending authority. The individual countries should also stop insisting on national control of banking regulation. That is a matter that should be dealt with exclusively at European level.

SPIEGEL: Do you honestly believe that the countries in the euro zone can bring themselves to hand over that much more power to Brussels?

Rogoff: The terrible thing is that few countries in Europe seem genuinely prepared for that. Those politicians who know what is needed keep quiet, fearing opposition from the voters. But the pressure of this crisis will create a momentum whose scope and impact we cannot yet imagine. At the end of the day, the United States of Europe may well come about a lot quicker than many would have thought.

SPIEGEL: With all respect to your optimism, the Europeans are unlikely to play along with that. The popular opinion in most member states is that Europe has far too much power, not too little.

Rogoff: Europe is in an interim stage, quite similar to that in late 18th century America. The ratification of the United States constitution in 1788 was preceded by 12 years of a loose confederation, which sometimes worked but usually didn't. Europe is in a similar situation today. States are like people, it is difficult to sustain a stable half-marriage; either you go for it or you forget it.

SPIEGEL: Many politicians in Europe think that the introduction of euro bonds would pave the way for a marriage later. Do you share that opinion?

Rogoff: No. In the current situation euro bonds would be absolutely the wrong solution. How could Germany protect itself if the French minister of finance makes a few bad decisions? The subject of euro bonds will only become relevant once the political union has been established.

SPIEGEL: Economic imbalances within the euro zone are regarded as one of the main reasons behind the current mess. The southern European states accuse the Germans of exporting too much. Do they have a point?

Rogoff: That is absurd. Portugal's and Spain's problem isn't Germany, it's China. The south Europeans have to understand that they cannot maintain their current standard of living in the context of globalization without significant economic reform. There are great opportunities for those who can adapt to the new realities.

SPIEGEL: That's not really music to Spanish or Italian ears.

Rogoff: Perhaps, but I think most Italians and Spaniards well understand the challenges.

SPIEGEL: What reforms do the governments need to implement?

Rogoff: Wages in southern Europe have risen sharply over the past few years, but these countries traditionally produce relatively simple goods like textiles. They are no longer competitive in a global context, which is why production has shifted to Asia. The Federal Republic of Germany, by contrast, has an innovative industrial sector whose high-quality products are very much in demand in emerging economies. That is why Germany has been the winner in the globalization process, while Portugal, Spain, Italy and others are among the losers.

SPIEGEL: That is why some economists have suggested that Germany should increase wages to strengthen demand in Europe. Would you agree with that?

 

Rogoff: No, because Germany faces many competitors outside Europe, who would jump at the chance of seeing a less competitive Germany. There are only two options. First, the south European states have to invest a lot more money in education and aim to produce better-quality goods. At the same time, they also have to lower wages in some industries to keep up with the competition from emerging economies like China, India or Brazil.

SPIEGEL: Do you think the euro zone will have the same members in 2015 as it does now?

Rogoff: It may well be the case that all current members remain in the euro zone, and that Germany keeps on shouldering the ever-increasing debts of other countries. But the price of such a scenario is very high for all involved: southern Europe would become embroiled in permanent stagnation and the German economy would eventually be dragged down to a slower growth trajectory.

 

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Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:12 | 2177598 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture

 

 

Goodbye amigos......happy trails.

 

A time-out that's permanent.....you too can be an Icelander.

 

 

 

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:56 | 2177754 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Oh, another mixing-Greece-with-Portugal and one-size-does-not-fit-all message. Rogoff is still riding on his (albeit very good) book, though I get more and more the impression Ms. Reinhart made the bigger contribution.

So if we had a gold standard on the whole world? It would be the same as having the same currency, eh? Inflating your troubles away is the same as defaulting on them, for Pete's sake, with the crucial difference about who is going to get hurt more.

-----

this kind of comments "The government in Athens should be granted a kind of sabbatical from the euro, while otherwise remaining a full member of the European Union" give me the impression he has also no clue about the difference between the club called EU and the club called eurozone...

-----

this one is the best "States are like people, it is difficult to sustain a stable half-marriage; either you go for it or you forget it" LOL double LOL. says who? I know plenty of people who are not married and nevertheless happy! Hello? Cultural gap or just some religious-conservative attitudes? And whole Nations are not that similar to people, Mr. Rogoff...

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:09 | 2177605 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

I call a Time-Out!

Nice to see an ivy-league economist using an NBA analogy. Keep this man's checks coming for such brilliance!

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:16 | 2177619 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

I have an idea for a new Reality Show - "Banker Holocaust!" you put a group of bankers in the Amazon jungle among a tribe of Cannibals and see what happens

The Trailer would go something like this -

1st the bankers give the natives low interest loans and everybody is happy,

than the bankers abusing their wealth and power take all the pretty native women as sex slaves,

than the bankers hike the interest rates on tree-hut mortgages and evict some natives out of their huts,

than that bankers suddenly increase the interest rates on all loans and demand immediate payback,

and hilarity ensues .. tbc.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:35 | 2177699 slaughterer
slaughterer's picture

I like the plot line treatment, but we need a tribe of bond vigilantes to come in mid-season for an added bit of cliff-hanger surprise. 

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:47 | 2177748 dracos_ghost
dracos_ghost's picture

Why the Amazon? Syntagma Square would be a better location. Force the bankers to live under the austerity programs that they are demanding.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:12 | 2177628 kito
kito's picture

the only thing that truly boggles the mind is that greeks still hold money in greek bank accounts. what does it take for them to realize?????..................

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:14 | 2177631 taniquetil
taniquetil's picture

Maybe I'm not understanding here, but isn't this the financial equivalent of a battered housewife returning to her abusive husband because "he loves me and everything's going to work out this time"?

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:47 | 2177737 eddiebe
eddiebe's picture

And the banksters are telling us it hurts me more than it does you to beat you. I love you so much you fucking bitch.

And the sheeple to the banksters and their Diebolt elected masters: I trust you, just please keep me safe from all those baaad baaaad terrorists; I'll do anything... please.. baaahhhh

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:14 | 2177633 machineh
machineh's picture

Rogoff: What the monetary union needs more than anything is a central government, including a finance minister, with significant tax and spending authority.

On a purely technocratic basis, Rogoff's statement is indisputable. But culturally, ceding that much power from the national to the EU level is likely to be unacceptable.

Just look at how the US federal government lords it over the states, using its fiscal power to compel their compliance with health and educational mandates.

Let Brussels micromanage Europe, Washington DC style? Sounds like a non-starter to me!

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:02 | 2177814 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

it's just pure bullocks. the monetary union does not need a central government at all. It's like saying you cannot share a company or a membership in a club without being married to all the others in the fold.

and in the US the federal government would not be that more (fiscally and otherwise) powerful than the states IF the senate would be still (as originally envisioned and applied for 100 years) sent from the state's legislatures instead of being elected directly -  but of course this would sound strange to most...

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:15 | 2177636 sunny
sunny's picture

I can't help but feel that Euroland PTB are no longer interested in kicking the can down the road, kicking the Greeks down the road is the new game in town.  The Greeks politicos seem to be asking for it, why not. 

sunny

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:16 | 2177640 alexwest
alexwest's picture

#
The south Europeans have to understand that they cannot maintain their current standard of living in the context of globalization without significant economic reform. There are great opportunities for those who can adapt to the new realities.

There are only two options. First, the south European states have to invest a lot more money in education and aim to produce better-quality goods. At the same time, they also have to lower wages in some industries to keep up with the competition from emerging economies like China, India or Brazil.
#

THERE'S 3D OPTION.. IMPORT TARIFFS... AVG SALARY IN SPAIN/GREECE/ITALY 1/2.000 EURO, avg salary in China is 200 euro per month,,.

SO MAKE 300-500% (YES 300/500 PERCENT) tariff on any stuff that can be produced locally but #ucking corp shifted produciton into Asia to enrich a few on top

lets RUN THAT KIND OF WORLD ECONOMY FOR 5 YEARS and then decide is it good or bad ..

of course tariifs dont apply to higher cost countires like Germany/USA, or to stuff that cant be produced locally ..

alx

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:17 | 2177643 frenchie
frenchie's picture

always nice to read a guy protected from competition talking about how it would be cool to reduce wages to gain competitivity against China and so on...

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:17 | 2177644 Dick Darlington
Dick Darlington's picture

Rogoff: But they're still not enough. To make Greece competitive, wages would have to be halved. That is impossible to implement politically, but without a steep wage cut, the economy will continue to stagnate. Greece urgently needs the prospect of growth. It is currently experiencing its fifth consecutive year of recession. This is a failure of historic dimensions.

Wooot, didn't Mr Rogoff see the "Captain Euro" propaganda video for kids? According to EU, Euro has been a huge success for everyone. Huge!

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:15 | 2177838 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Dick, the EUR is a success, so far. Otherwise our dear global banks would be now busy shorting the southern currencies to oblivion and going long the DM the same way that already happened before. And we eurozoners could kiss our interconnected/integrated supply lines of the industry good by. Or ship all manufacturing to the East.

We are in a currency war and it's holding (so far). Witness the Greeks not wanting to leave it.

It may go all down in flames, yes. Greece is an epic setback, yes. But this can happen to the Pound as to the Dollar, too.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:20 | 2177651 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

They should put him in charge.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:06 | 2177828 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

bill, I know that from the height of your age, the propaganda you are exposed to, your citizenship and the city where you live we europeans seem all senile buffoons, but do you really think we are that incapable that we should "put in charge" this oversimplifyer from Harward? textile industries, just for example...

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 15:47 | 2178299 blunderdog
blunderdog's picture

We've put some of the dumbest buffoons in the country in the White House, and the USA is doing just fine.  It's so crazy it just might work.

Heh heh.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:27 | 2177675 gwar5
gwar5's picture

How about making Goldman Sachs liable for the entire Greek default and subsequent financial meltdown since they were the ones who cooked the books for Greece to get into the EU based on fraudulent accounting in the first place.

 

 

 

 

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:53 | 2177702 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

as i so elegantly developed the theme a week or two ago, markel has been beaten like a rented mule by the banksters on this one, and the rubi"con" is behind them, now

i can see where spiegel likez a harvardEconomist to help them thru the propagananda, but it is too little, too late

just my personal opinions, though;  my record speaks for itself!  L0L!!!

i've also said a few things about the german "growth trajectories"

they are hopium dreams based on false "interpretations"~~kinda like rogoff, here, actually!

he does get a nice big fat paycheck for doing this crap, ya know?

here: In an interview with SPIEGEL, Harvard economist Kenneth Rogoff, 58, says it was a mistake to bring all the southern European countries into the common currency.

ya mean the politicians, banksters and finiMinis made a mistake?  a "mistake" about EU = X+Y+Z+... 

chat among yourselves...  this is too fuking wonderful not to dedicate another 20-30 articles to the "subject", here, imo.  maybe somebody will have a "good idea" and send it mrFukingRogoff, the "doc-tor" for extra credit!

we go from pols to banksters, to economists...  be funny if he was just another "agent" getting wound up to stir the "soup", doncha think? 

here's his wiki bio, BiCheZ:

Career

Early in his career, Rogoff served as an economist at the International Monetary Fund (IMF), and at the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System.

He is an elected member of the American Academy of Arts and Science as well as a Fellow of the Econometric Society, and a former Guggenheim Fellow.[citation needed]

Rogoff was the Charles and Marie Robertson Professor of International Affairs at Princeton University.[citation needed]

He later served as Economic Counsellor and Director, Research Department of the IMF, from August 2001 to September 2003.[citation needed]

In 2002, Rogoff was in the spotlight because of a dispute with Joseph Stiglitz, a former Chief Economist of the World Bank and 2001 Nobel Prize winner. After Stiglitz had criticized the International Monetary Fund in his book, Globalization and Its Discontents, Rogoff responded with an Open Letter.

assuming you are here to try to think, of course...

again, to slewie, the best thing germany can do is walk away from this nonsense and stop wasting its political and economic energies fuking around with a buncha criminally insane commie losers in a poorly-designed, piss-poorly-administered, and clown-poorly-led operatic farce based on printing money and pretending

and i'm trying to be civil, here, as always, of course...

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:05 | 2177823 gwar5
gwar5's picture

Wow. Nice work there Slewie

 

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:23 | 2177874 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

nicely done, Slewie! but hey, Germany is not alone and does not want to be alone and won't be ever allowed to be alone.

manufacturing here in the eurozone is done with parts from all countries. industrially, Germany "alone" would have to rebuild many, many supply-lines. or ship the industry to China. just look at the parts for cars, trains, electrical equipments, pipelines, hell, even the steel production!

at the near-height of the Euro-Bashing, may I just remind everybody that the fabled "Euro-Project" is nothing more than a fancy currency agreement? a multi-peg? the need for the economy for Price Stability? something you don't need if all what you produce is fancy paper?

and you are being civil - it is poorly-administered, our center in Brussel. and it's fine the way it is. we don't want it to become a serious power-center, we don't need a Washington in Belgium

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 15:23 | 2178095 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

no, i agree that germany doesn't want to be alone

they want a EU which works, at least for them

unfortunately, until i learn more, that does not seem possible

so, they will try to stay and work from "within the EU system"

from within the system, i think their finiMini herrS is pretty good, frankly;  he seems to understand the protection germany will need to proceed safely

the problem is, as you say, germany is gonna proceed, here, and i ask: but can it do so safely? 

there are two aspects (oversimplifying, but maybe for an 'adequate' reason): 

  • the economic decision and
  • the political decision

and, it appears to me, they are in different hands, altho herrS does 'work for'  frauM.  however, these two aspect do not align well, if at all, for the germans, here, from what i see.  and, if i am incorrect about this, i am incorrect about the whole picture, which would be fine w/ me!

what is a "good" economic decision for germany is a "bad" economic decision for others (greece & perhaps the other periphery) or at least we can say it is a "bad" political decision b/c it doesn't take into account the banksters'  "needs" at the very least

msL (IMF) is the 'agent of reconciliation' with her chanelPixieDustTM bankstering and her nannyTroika feeds

now, within limits there is some slack/play/flexibility and maybe germany will throw the spanner into the works, soon, but it hasn't, yet, and i don't think it will do so, today.  this is going down, imo

germany needs to reconcile its own polical needs with its own economic needs;  personally, i don't see how it can do so in this clusterfuk, and i fear for that nations' well-being if it continues along on its dissonant path

how do they get the EU from where it is today to where it needs to be for them to maintain their economic dynamism and gestalt?  sadly, this pi-rat doesn't think they do

they may be willing to shoot the moon and say no to greece, the banksters, the imf, and the other "non-core" EU states.  that takes care of them, too, and is in the best interests of these "weaker" ecomomies

i would be most pleasantly surpriZed if they did, at this point; lQQk at all the "resources" that the EU had already committed to this!  also, the SNB, the FED and probably 3 more, too!  under the "auspices" of msL's IMF nannyTroikery

who can ya trust here, except germany?

and you say they don't "want" to trust themselves to go it alone?

they have already been carefully manipulated away from this option;  ergo, they either say NO or they are screwed, and i think they will continue to say:  weeellll,...ok, ....but,...

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:39 | 2177713 Jayda1850
Jayda1850's picture

atleast Rogoof is consistent. He says Geece's only option is to go back to the drachma and inflate your way out, same thing he advocates for the US. Too bad this inflation will destroy the poor and elderly. Glad to see him and krugman trumpted as the voice for the down-trodden.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:24 | 2177880 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

and of course he does not mention the banker's swear word: default

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:51 | 2177757 Snakeeyes
Snakeeyes's picture

And look at Spain. Debt and unemployment DOUBLED since crsis began. How will this end?

http://confoundedinterest.wordpress.com/2012/02/20/the-pain-in-spain-lie...

And Rogoff/Krugman are millionaire elistists to whom the poor and elderly are abstract figures. And don't forget, the Left REALLY hates the poor and elderly. They are non productive labor inputs in the glorious workers state!

Comrade!

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 12:58 | 2177789 eddiebe
eddiebe's picture

One world government and complete control for the .oooooooooo1%, oh..bitchez

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:00 | 2177803 AC_Doctor
AC_Doctor's picture

Yeah right, that would like trying to give the Brown Clown a sabbatical from his Homeypromter.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:17 | 2177850 Archduke
Archduke's picture

The Sunday Times reports on UK citizens handed 4 year prison sentences

for nothing but incitement of riots in Wales (no riots ever occured in Wales).

 

Meanwhile Iceland defaulted, and now it's forgiven 13% of onerous debt and

is prosecuting the most culpable  bankers, brokers, realtors, and lawyer...

 

In Italy, Monti's diktat reforms are underway, and only the court jester Sylvio

is facing any kind of prosecution -and for compeletly benign vagaries compared

to the mass plunder of the nation.

 

the message is clear: Greece has every incentive to default.

 

http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=202294

 

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:30 | 2177895 witm99
witm99's picture

Found this Greek default adventure game http://crookedtimber.org/2012/02/16/so-what-would-your-plan-for-greece-be/ and had to implement it in Javascript.

http://jsbin.com/abidah

http://pastebin.com/e9FSn8We

 

 

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:31 | 2177897 QuantumCat
QuantumCat's picture

When a "no shit" analysis comes from a Harvard professor... they call it profound.  His solutions based on more centralized power, however... pure evil.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 13:36 | 2177905 linrom
linrom's picture

Rogoff: What the monetary union needs more than anything is a central government, including a a finance minister, with significant tax and spending authority. The individual countries should also stop insisting on national control of banking regulation. That is a matter that should be dealt with exclusively at European level.

 

Ok, Mr. Banker. We're all a happy family where half the people are virtual production slaves and the other half are in hock to the bankers for the goods produced by slave labor. How long will this economic scam work?

Greece should default and keep the Euro.

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 14:26 | 2178059 Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

What a fucking joke.

The EU would have more credability if it would quarantine the offending nations and install the "technocrats" (if allowed) to help get the countries get "on track" instead of leaving it up to the entities who caused the problems, to correct them.

If the countries would not allow outside help, then boot their asses and move on.

Instead, the ECB shows what it is really concerned with (ECB bond holdings) and nothing or anybody else.

 

Mon, 02/20/2012 - 14:37 | 2178082 Olympia
Olympia's picture

World War III - The First Private Was in History

 

Those who won all battles shall lose the war. Bilderberg Group and the crimes against humanity.

 

In 1991, when George Bush senior attacked Iraq and tried to establish the New World Order, has actually provoked a World War. A war the human kind has never seen before; a world war that may not have had the provocative blood-letting of the previous wars, nevertheless its consequences were equally bad for all the peoples. A financial world war, the consequences of which may not have been dead or amputated men and ruins, but in any case they were equally disastrous for both the peoples and the environment.

 

http://eamb-ydrohoos.blogspot.com/2012/02/world-war-iii.html

 

Authored by PANAGIOTIS TRAIANOU

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!