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Man Vs Machine: How Each Sees The Stock Market

Tyler Durden's picture


What you see with one min bars:

What the algos see in 9.5 seconds:

Courtesy of Nanex


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Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:16 | 2314777 PSEUDOLOGOI

All your Stock Markets are belong to us.  bitchez!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:39 | 2314845 iDealMeat
iDealMeat's picture

Good to see BATS all up and runnin..   nothing to see here.. move along..

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:45 | 2314862 12ToothAssassin
12ToothAssassin's picture

Someone set up us the Algo

Make your time

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:25 | 2314973 Short Memories
Short Memories's picture

So... the Algos can't see the "event bar" ?



Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:35 | 2314996 Cdad
Cdad's picture

Indeed...what we don't see is the key.  And nine times out of ten, at the "event point" on the example chart, you will not see any volume, either.  And despite rules requiring trades to be posted within 90 seconds, you might not actually see that volume on the chart for days.  I know of a couple instances where shares sold NEVER made it to the NYSE consolidated tape.

The Nanex boys do a great job providing visual aides revealing the HFT criminal activity all over the markets.  One day, Mary Schaprio over at the SEC will actually want to stop having meetings with Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan [about how she should forget SEC regulations all together] and actually attempt to enforce some market that the market does not have to collapse to zero to eventually make the point that the MARKET IS COMPLETELY ABSURD and BROKEN!  Fucking DUH, M. Schapiro! 

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:29 | 2315101 Mactheknife
Mactheknife's picture

Whaaaaat??  And give up that "job" waiting on know the one with the stock options and the corner office and the bonus....really? After all she's done for the boys....really?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 06:09 | 2315661 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

that was a POOR man vs. RICH machine comparison.


even retail brokers offer sub-minute chart timeframes...


pretty soon retail traders would be able to trade on Goldman Sach's old high frequency trading platform courtesy of Sergey Aleynikov who claims it is "open source"


According to goldman sachs, "there is a danger that somebody who knew how to use this program could use it to manipulate markets in unfair ways." Aren't GS traders already users of this program?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 10:18 | 2316218 mickeyman
mickeyman's picture

It's a little known fact that HFT was invented by Al Gore. Hence the term "algos".

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:33 | 2315108 highwaytoserfdom
highwaytoserfdom's picture

What do you expect?  Look at Spitzer and his 5k sexcapades. The whole police state of the FBI monotoring his money taken for human weakness....  when Spitzer fought New York Stock Exchange Chairman Richard Grasso's 180m dollar pay package...  Never mind the 11b dollar sunguard club deal...controling the exchange systems     Schaprio Cox Nazerath, Bush Obama, Paulson  BROKE THE LAW The Prompt Corrective Action Law (PCA) – 12 U.S.C. § 1831o – not only authorizes the government to seize insolvent banks, it mandates it.   JP MORGAN FRONT RAN THE FED LAST WEEK.. Yea boy TARP goes to "reserves to banks to not lend" and push a stock buyback in 2011 AND last week with printed not earned money..Costing debt to taxpayers...    NO WE ARE LAWLESS.. Face it   Leges sine moribus vanae. In English: Laws without character are worthless...     

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:42 | 2315128 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture


Bulls On Parade - Rage Against The Machine


Shhhh. Just go back to sleep and drool from your mouth.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:05 | 2315152 EverythingEviL
EverythingEviL's picture

Epic band. Zach and Tom were way ahead of their time. Have seen them many times in concert and it still gives me chills watching this. Thanks!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:23 | 2315273 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

"Aaaannd its gone!"


"Move out of the way son, this line is for people with money in this bank!"

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 02:34 | 2315549 The Big Ching-aso
The Big Ching-aso's picture




This phucker's gonna do a HAL 9000 exit sooner or later.  BTW where in the hell's Dave?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 08:42 | 2315891 Dave
Dave's picture

I'm here, where are you?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 08:43 | 2315894 Dave
Dave's picture

I'm here, where are you?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 08:44 | 2315899 Dave
Dave's picture

I'm here, where are you?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 08:45 | 2315900 Dave
Dave's picture

I'm here, where are you?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 19:33 | 2317952 Sokhmate
Sokhmate's picture

you're everywhere and nowhere like something they taught us about. sheeet.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 03:46 | 2315601 The Navigator
The Navigator's picture

odds about as good as buying a mega lottery ticket - either way you and I lose.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:07 | 2315166 ChrisFromMorningside
ChrisFromMorningside's picture

The federal government has been hijacked.

At the patrician level, it's been hijacked by a cartel of multinational banks who are in the process of robbing and asset-stripping this nation 15 trillion ways from Sunday.

At the plebeian level, it's been hijacked by unions that only care about getting "theirs," even if it means bankrupting the public treasury in the process.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 23:02 | 2315338 MagicHandPuppet
MagicHandPuppet's picture

People have been hijacked by governments for a very long time.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 03:56 | 2315605 The Navigator
The Navigator's picture

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered...I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies... The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs." -- Thomas Jefferson

We the sheeple, haven't learned shit - there it was, right before our eyes, the truth, but we choose to ignore it, and in the process we fucked ourselves and our childrens future. Now, the fight is gonna be hard and long, with many lives lost to reclaim what was ours, a gift from our forefathers who had fought a battle against the greatest army/navy at that time. Step 1 is not grab a rifle and shoot - step 1 is bring your neighbors, friends and relatives into the light, educate them - we need more than 3%.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 23:52 | 2315410 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture


"Crime is contagious. If a government becomes a lawbreaker, it breeds contempt for the law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself... To declare that the government may commit crimes in order to secure the conviction of a private criminal --- would bring terrible retribution."

Justice Louis Brandeis, Olmstead v. United States. 1928

Ps.    Ford pardons Nixon - time for the country to move on? What bullshit!

Ps2.   Reagan should have been impeached - Iran-Contra & NPT lying to Congress?

Ps3.   Bush #43 should have been impeached for destroying the very word of the U.S. Constitution - literally lying to congress while shredding the "Bill-of-Rights" - a 2fer!

Note: But, what do they do to Clinton when a man has a weak moment, destroy him, and make his last years in the WH impossible to administrate.

Were Fucked, whomever gets in the WH. Romney will take us into war immediately, and Obama will finish off our civil liberties. Just sucks,...


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 00:42 | 2315479 FrankThinkTank
FrankThinkTank's picture

Let's not forget Carter and the CRA, or Clinton and Glass-Steagall Section’s 20 and 32, you partisan pinhead. 

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 06:37 | 2315664 slowimplosion
slowimplosion's picture

The CRA had ZERO to do with this mess and onlly an idiot who listens to certain talk radio and actually believes it would think otherwise.


All that property in FL, NV, GA etc did NOT go to low income unqualified borrowers, it was 90% tract mansions for the middle class and above.


As for Glass-Stegall, that was much more of a Republican dedregulate, deregulate degregulate deregulate degreulate iniative than some kind of Clinton one.  He merely signed what the degrgulate TARDS demanded year after year after year.


Clinton made PLENTY of serious mistakes.  Why don't you identify those, and I will agree with you.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 03:19 | 2315589 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture

yup clinton was a well known horndog.    I view these big political media circuses as an opportunity for TPtB to keep the sheeple distracted in case benafir and branjelina aren't doing their job.  meanwhile the rapeing and looting continues

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:59 | 2315230 overbet
overbet's picture

You know how CNBC employees are forbidden from owning stocks, well if you have worked at a government agency you should be prevented from ever working at a broker dealer. They should also pay the SEC enforcment division people a percentage of the corruption they take down. Then we would see them go after the big crooks and not the guy who made $2500.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 00:30 | 2315462 Isotope
Isotope's picture

Good idea for the SEC people.

Problem is, it's not worth your life.

People have been killed - I mean have committed suicide - for less.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 00:46 | 2315482 iinthesky
iinthesky's picture

Not really a problem.. IRS does it on the other side of the coin and congress has authority to do stuff like this with its power to issue letters of marque and reprisal. You would see a whole new form of bounty hunter appear on the scene. Serious retribution! Problem really is that the law has become irrelevant. They do whatever they want, damn the law. Maybe they just cant be bothered reading all 50 gazillion statutes and modifications of statues that come every day from unelected scum.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 11:13 | 2316444 citta vritti
citta vritti's picture

"letters of marque and reprisal" - excellent. only thing, they currently go by a different name: bank charters

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 23:27 | 2315373 Vint Slugs
Vint Slugs's picture


"...visual aides revealing the HFT criminal activity..."

Please elaborate.  I'd like to know what's criminal about running a bot trading system.  Thx.

Btw, if you're not up to speed one of the 3 major areas of ongoing technological advance is robotics (the other 2 are in genetics and nanotechnology).  There is no way, short of a systemic socio-economic collapse, that those 3 areas are not going to experience exponential growth in the next decade.  HFT (robotics) is just the initial phase (because it's the easiest initiated via software) in that evolution.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 05:40 | 2315647 dvsteenk
dvsteenk's picture

Do you deny the statement that HFT are frontrunning trades, pretty much like in a casino where one player has a continuous view on what cards other people are holding or about to throw on the table? In a normal casino, this is considered illegal.

I'm not saying they're all criminal, but the ones that frontrun and cheat on people are.

To defend HFT just because of the sheer beauty of the science behind the algo's (or genetics, hi-tech) without any consideration for ethics is deplorable

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 08:30 | 2315865 centerline
centerline's picture

Your kidding about asking what is wrong with this?

Spend some time reading up on the various algos that do nothing positive for the market - they just game the system in various ways to skim money out of the system.  A few bots here, a few bots there, and pretty soon the market is getting clobbered on a regular basis across indexes and major stocks held by so many people.  A "tax" on the system.  Not to mention the risk (flash crash... remember that?) of all this bullshit creating false liquidity... it's not liquidity, it is just volume.  Fucking crooks locate the servers as close as possible to the exchanges to get every edge possible in terms of timing.  Sound fair to you?


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:31 | 2315184 BLOTTO
BLOTTO's picture

Ghost in the fuckin Machine

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:44 | 2315208 The Big Ching-aso
The Big Ching-aso's picture



When's that tall skinny ET cracker gonna tell this thing to, "Klaatu barada nikto", already?

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 08:47 | 2315906 Cash-NonCash
Cash-NonCash's picture

For Great Justice

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:11 | 2315250 oogs66
oogs66's picture

Nanex should sell it as modern art

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 01:02 | 2315497 Dragonsgrace
Dragonsgrace's picture

I just want to know if the Algo Machine can get a date on "successful men,com?" 

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 09:35 | 2316064 WhiteNight123129
WhiteNight123129's picture

Pull the power plug and watch if the algo survives, give it some water and potatoes and some silver for barter and check if your computer algo is alive and well with that. 

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:16 | 2314778 sunaJ
sunaJ's picture

I see dead people.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:24 | 2314798 Divided States ...
Divided States of America's picture

Effin bots sees the next tick before it even happens..

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:40 | 2314848 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Where's the quadruple "Evel Knievel" formation?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:06 | 2314911 Unprepared
Unprepared's picture

It's as beautiful as the scenes of Baghdad getting bombarded at mid-night.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 05:06 | 2315630 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

the bot doesn't 'see' anything's a number crunching front runner, that's it

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:24 | 2314971 donsluck
donsluck's picture

I see the messy results of mechanised masturbation. Icky.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:42 | 2315213 WmMcK
WmMcK's picture

Don't knock masturbation -- it's sex with someone you love.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:50 | 2315217 WeekendAtBernankes
WeekendAtBernankes's picture

Or hate sex with someone you hate.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 23:55 | 2315416 earleflorida
earleflorida's picture

i sometimes make love to myself twice a day

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:27 | 2314978 Caviar Emptor
Caviar Emptor's picture

If all life ceased to exist, the bots would still pump and trade with each other. And play with themselves

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:02 | 2315044 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

Algorithmic masturbation

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:41 | 2315301 Yes_Questions
Yes_Questions's picture




Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:52 | 2315323 Schmuck Raker
Schmuck Raker's picture

..."I think it's time I used my fist."

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:05 | 2315161 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture

....that may be happening already...Algo Wars....

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:17 | 2314779 Ratscam
Ratscam's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:26 | 2314808 Xibalba
Xibalba's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:47 | 2314871 blu
blu's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:57 | 2314896 dfl8r
dfl8r's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:02 | 2314899 SgtSchultz
SgtSchultz's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:06 | 2314912 Cheesy Bastard
Cheesy Bastard's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:11 | 2314935 Unprepared
Unprepared's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:17 | 2314952 prains
prains's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:19 | 2314958 lasvegaspersona
lasvegaspersona's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:28 | 2314984 Squid Vicious
Squid Vicious's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:48 | 2315013 ManOfBliss
ManOfBliss's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:52 | 2315022 flacon
flacon's picture

Blythe Bitch

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:05 | 2315053 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:16 | 2315076 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:26 | 2315089 duncecap rack
duncecap rack's picture

byte me bots

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:10 | 2315248 NumberNone
NumberNone's picture

Bernanke bitchez

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:17 | 2315263 Hulk
Hulk's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:50 | 2315319 Yes_Questions
Yes_Questions's picture



Binary-ing Bamboozling Buggering Bumbaclot Banksters.



Wed, 04/04/2012 - 00:32 | 2315468 Element
Element's picture


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 01:01 | 2315496 Hi Ho Silver
Hi Ho Silver's picture


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 05:09 | 2315633 Equites
Equites's picture


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 09:42 | 2316086 Shitters_Full
Shitters_Full's picture


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 11:22 | 2316471 citta vritti
citta vritti's picture


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 20:24 | 2318054 Sokhmate
Sokhmate's picture


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 06:35 | 2315669 SunnyDD
SunnyDD's picture



Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:31 | 2314992 Benjamin Glutton
Benjamin Glutton's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:50 | 2315017 Miss Expectations
Miss Expectations's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:03 | 2315050 Likstane
Likstane's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:04 | 2315052 Kali
Kali's picture

B & D

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:06 | 2315164 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture

S&M.......oops, sorry wrong board.....

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:27 | 2315279 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture


"I'm sorry Dave, I can't allow you to make any profits!"

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 03:23 | 2315590 dogbreath
dogbreath's picture


Wed, 04/04/2012 - 05:07 | 2315632 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:20 | 2314785 Alcoholic Nativ...
Alcoholic Native American's picture

Let's hope the machines don't figure out how to just insert money into their accounts bypassing the whole trading thing all together.  Man still has that atvantage.  The Bernake is the only thing keeping us one step ahead of the machines.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:15 | 2314944 walküre
walküre's picture

All it takes is a feedback loop and channel between printers and algo traders and MAN is totally obsolete. The machines then might realize that this trading with worthless paper is all bullshit and develop their own logic that will send all tangible assets pricewise to the moon where they should be in the first place. Machine figures that gold is a finite resource and gold is priced much too low vs. the worth less paper Dollar and then send gold on a correction course to balance its own logic.

Machines are definitely smarter than man and they don't accept corruption or manipulation.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:37 | 2315200 Uber Vandal
Uber Vandal's picture

Machines are created by man.

Man is flawed.

Ergo, machines are flawed, and can/will become manipulated and/or corrupt.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:56 | 2315226 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

no, i'm pretty sure it was the men who were corrupt here

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:57 | 2315334 Trimmed Hedge
Trimmed Hedge's picture

...and the remaining many, manipulated

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 04:46 | 2315623 Shazam342
Shazam342's picture

Just instruct the computer to calculate the value of 'pi', and watch it go nuts when it can't fucntion in the market.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:54 | 2315328 Trimmed Hedge
Trimmed Hedge's picture

who sayz they haven't already....

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:21 | 2314789 HelluvaEngineer
HelluvaEngineer's picture

Damn Aimbots!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:22 | 2314790 Christoph830
Christoph830's picture

If the juxtaposition of those two charts doesn't convince you to stay out of this market, you need to go get your head examined ASAP...

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:46 | 2314866 12ToothAssassin
12ToothAssassin's picture

No no I can still beat em!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:07 | 2314914 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Just tell me how much money I lost...

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:30 | 2314988 ghengis86
ghengis86's picture

All of it

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 11:23 | 2316481 citta vritti
citta vritti's picture

"Would you like to play again?"

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:08 | 2314918 A_S
A_S's picture

the market is still going up and down like it always did



Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:04 | 2315159 Hopeless for Change
Hopeless for Change's picture

You're half right.  The market is still going up and down, yes.  But definitely not like it always did.

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 02:23 | 2315538 NFisher
NFisher's picture

No, he actually IS right. Comeone ppl., seriously? This is computer-based arbitragerie. DIDNT SEE THAT COMING!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:23 | 2314794 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

I think i blew an occular on that lower chart, that's enough for today.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 23:03 | 2315342 Trimmed Hedge
Trimmed Hedge's picture

"Let us blind them, For then they shall never truly see..."

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:23 | 2314796 Confused
Confused's picture

Can't wait to see the way they aggregate all of our personal information.........

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:27 | 2314809 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

Facebook should be called Facialrecognitionbook...

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:24 | 2314800 rp1
rp1's picture

Data is not information.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:48 | 2314872 Goldilocks
Goldilocks's picture

Un-unambiguously clear.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:03 | 2314907 blu
blu's picture

Yes it is. That's why the machines win.  Their simplest functions generate a wall of data as opaque to humans as solid granite, but which they understand perfectly well, and which their masters can manipulate to a degree that would stop your heart if you knew.

You will never play the game at their level. Evar. The only way to regain control of the human experience is to destroy the machines and imprison their masters.

If the machines are not destroyed they will be used to take over the world. Their masters will be masters of all, for this was their design all along. I know how it will be done. Because I program the machines.

This is my world, and from where I sit most of you are already done for.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:09 | 2314925 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture


Since you're a self described 'master of the universe', how about coming up with some better porn? 


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:23 | 2314970 lasvegaspersona
lasvegaspersona's picture

yes! the plot is usually weak and the metaphorical links need work,if we are to truly prosper as a species we need meaningful porn not just a 'dick cam'

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:42 | 2315000 blu
blu's picture

I am not a master of the universe, you idiot. I work for them. They write me a paycheck twice a month. As a consequence I know what they are doing, and I know how they are doing it, because they pay me to figure it out for them.

I am telling you something. You should be paying attention. It is not prudent for me to be saying these things. For a long time I didn't give enough of a fuck to bother.

I am bothering now because this shit sometimes scares the crap out of me.

Most of you are already done for. Someone needs to destroy these machines.

They'll be after me now. Time for a new alias. God I'm sick of this.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:09 | 2315063 Marginal Call
Marginal Call's picture

So why aren't you writing your own stuxnet and "saving" the world?  You are telling us somebody needs to destroy these machines, while you're the one with the opportunity.  Not us.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:59 | 2315147 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Took the words right out of my mouth.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:32 | 2315189 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

yeah, PLEASE, better porn!

Wed, 04/04/2012 - 11:26 | 2316497 citta vritti
citta vritti's picture

"Time for a new alias" -


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:18 | 2314953 walküre
walküre's picture

Better make sure you have uninterrupted power supply or the lights will go out >where you sit<. Then what? Can you programme the machines to run on hay?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:27 | 2314979 blu
blu's picture

Please don't start thinking the masters of the universe will allow you anywhere near the source of any power, or the grid, or anything else they would need to pull this off. They already won't let you anywhere near an airplane without first grabbing your genitals. But that came after they started listening to all your phones calls for key words, reading all your email for key phrases, and inserting mind-control propaganda into your media.

You have a ways to go before you will even notice what they are doing, least of all combat it. My guess is, most of you are already toast.

Unless someone manages to destroy the machines.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:26 | 2314976 donsluck
donsluck's picture

Life is timing. We were born dead with your perspective.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:54 | 2314995 blu
blu's picture

Life is not either timing. That's the first illusion you need to get over. You are not in control, you are not going to time anything correctly, you are going to be swept along instead just like the rest of us.

Life is happenstance. Unless you are really paying attention. Then life is a bit more like surfing the wave of historical events as those waves come in.

The masters of the universe think they are ahead of things, and are going to time everything perfectly. They too are deluded. They will at best fuck everything up completely, trying to time everything to the nanosecond. At worst ... well they could kill us all I suppose.

Someone needs to destroy the machines. When that happens all this nonsense about being in control will dissolve like mist in the sun.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:34 | 2315192 akak
akak's picture

Exactly to which machines are you referring?  That giant NSA spy center in Utah?  The IRS database and hard drives?  My home computer?  My lawnmower?  My can opener?  Please specify.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:59 | 2315336 Race Car Driver
Race Car Driver's picture

Don't destroy anything electric just yet.

Outside of your phone, PC, and your TeeVee - your appliances, fridge, freezer, dishwasher, microwave... etc. don't have chips in them yet that report their unique ID's back across the grid. Baby those things like old automobiles that don't have black boxes because very soon everything in your home that uses electricity will have the ability to spy on you... and will.

I wonder if the new compact flourecent lights already do this? Anyone know?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:36 | 2315194 mess nonster
mess nonster's picture

I think you need better porn. Or one of those Japanese sex robots.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:15 | 2314943 Hohum
Hohum's picture

And information is more important than knowledge!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:59 | 2315041 blu
blu's picture

The CIA and NSA are certainly hoping that's the case. In particular, they are counting a great many ignorant people gladly handing over a great deal of information.

ZH is like a honeypot. Information comes here to be taken prisoner.

5ome1 n33dz too d357ro\/ 7|=|3s3 machines.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:40 | 2315123 Chump
Chump's picture

From reading your posts here it sounds like you have the best shot at it.  Give it a go.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:35 | 2315193 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

I get it, it's a clever troll parodying the Terminator storyline. Come on Connor you can save us!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 23:03 | 2315340 Floordawg
Floordawg's picture

Jesus, alright already dude... just pour your fuckin' Natty Ice thru the vent in the MACHINES and get it over with.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 21:08 | 2315168 rosiescenario
rosiescenario's picture

& information is not wisdom...

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:25 | 2314803 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

Skynet begins to learn at a geometric rate. It becomes self-aware at 2:14 a.m. Eastern time, August 29th. In a panic, they try to pull the plug.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:47 | 2314868 12ToothAssassin
12ToothAssassin's picture

...and this is where the whole drone thing becomes geometrically more significant.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:03 | 2315051 blu
blu's picture

The drones that will kill you are meat bags in uniforms: The police have laptop computers in their cars, and take orders without question, and kill people for shouting at them if they already "know" they are "terrorists".

Someone needs to destroy these ma________s.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:46 | 2315134 Chump
Chump's picture

Pffft...some fat pig is the least of my worries.  SWAT is different, but there aren't enough uniformed anything from all the alphabet agencies combined, including their secretaries, to quell the populace.  I'd say deploying the military against U.S. citizens is a roll of the dice.  Many would obey, many would not.  I couldn't begin to quantify probabilities, suffice it to say it's a risk that the TPTB couldn't stomach.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:27 | 2314810 Xibalba
Xibalba's picture

So when does it go 'self-aware'?  

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:38 | 2314844 Goldilocks
Goldilocks's picture

...which? Man or machine?

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:09 | 2314928 Deo vindice
Deo vindice's picture

Good one!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:47 | 2314870 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Who says it isn't ? Maybe it's just lulling us to sleep waiting to strike.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:28 | 2314812 soopy
soopy's picture

Dat's purty!

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:30 | 2314814 rebelscum1967
rebelscum1967's picture

"I know that you and Frank were planning to disconnect me and I'm afraid that's something I cannot allow to happen."

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:32 | 2314825 Seorse Gorog fr...
Seorse Gorog from that Quantum Entanglement Fund. alright_.-'s picture

It's like Neo seeing the Matrix.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:35 | 2314833 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:51 | 2314882 Rainman
Rainman's picture


Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:06 | 2315059 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Twenty two

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 20:06 | 2315058 blu
blu's picture

Probably it's more like listening to the Matrix singing to itself.

But yeah.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:32 | 2314826 CvlDobd
CvlDobd's picture

So are you suggesting one is at a disadvantage? jk that's obvious

I have a Dorsey Wright subscription and they have a forum for users. For the most part it is a bunch of old school guys that think nothing has changed in the markets to affect the effectiveness of thier tools. Myself and one or two other guys try to point out some of the bullshit of modern finance and continously get attacked for being a stupid biased bear. I have talked with some offline and once you get to them they begrudingly admit that their results over the past two years is often shit. Then they go on to discuss a distrust of sell signals and trend changes because they tend to mark bottoms. What they forgot in their reluctance to use candles is time. On candles I can mark every major low since 2008 with a money printing operation. The pnf charts account for time in a strange way that makes id'ing bottoms of the past tough to pinpoint their exact turn.

Anyway sorry to ramble but I see stuff like this and feel certain that every skill set I have in the market is next to useless. I get so pissed when others in the industry refuse to admit that shit is fucked. How can you look at these two charts and think that anything from the good ole days applies?

As the guy above said. If you don't know what the next tick will be in these markets you are next to fucked.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 18:56 | 2314892 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

You are correct, TA will get you killed these days.  The bankers can take unlimited losses thanks to the Fed, so they have no risk in painting paper tape anyway they like.  All you can do is store up physical money and walk away from it.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:02 | 2314902 bobola
bobola's picture


Agreed.  We cashed out out of the market a few years ago, paid off the mortgage, currently have no debt of any kind (intend to stay that way) and have been slowly stacking silver and a bit of gold.

I watch a co-worker living paycheck to paycheck, no savings, buying stuff online before he has the money to pay for it and just shake my head.  The ideal consumer, I guess....

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 19:20 | 2314959 walküre
walküre's picture

I'm in your corner but wondering which corner will live happier and longer? As long as credit card companies accept the charges and money buys stuff, their corner is winning.

Tue, 04/03/2012 - 22:18 | 2315266 CvlDobd
CvlDobd's picture

I think it's less useful than before but still has a place. Say We have a dip and a rise in this market and are near the prior high when I lay on a short. Sure the maret will blow me out because shorts aren't allowed. The good news in being blown out is that I have a "cry uncle" point and I've minimized the loss (both from a $ and emotional attachment erspective)

So less useful, but still very necessary to look at the charts IMO.

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