MF Global Trustee Says Commingling Shortfall May Be Double Previous Estimate, Could Reach "$1.2 Billion Or More"
The day after MF Global filed, we calculated that contrary to widely accepted media expectations that the client theft at MF Global was limited to "only" $600 million, the true client loss (and thus, MF Global executive felony) was in fact up to $1.5 billion. Sure enough, three weeks in the Trustee has come to see things in a comparable light. From Reuters: "The trustee liquidating MF Global Holdings Ltd'sbroker-dealer unit said on Monday that the apparent "shortfall" of customer funds may be larger than the futures brokerage had reported prior to its bankruptcy. "The trustee believes that even if he recovers everything that is at U.S. depositories, the apparent shortfall in what MF Global management should have segregated at U.S. depositories may be as much as $1.2 billion or more," the trustee, James Giddens, said in a statement. He added that the amount could change. Giddens also said he expects in early December to transfer 60 percent of what is in segregated customer accounts for U.S. futures positions, pending court approval. He said the transfer would require $1.3 billion to $1.6 billion to implement, exhausting much of the assets under the trustee's control. MF Global was run by former Goldman Sachs & Co chief and New Jersey governor Jon Corzine before its Chapter 11 filing on Oct. 31. The filing came after the New York-based company revealed that it made a $6.3 billion bet on European sovereign debt. Corzine resigned on Nov. 4." In other news, major Chicago-based exchanges are fine (no seriously: they got some very sweet preferential terms in the account transfer... to the detriment of former MF Global accounts). And it goes without saying that Corzine has not even been questioned yet.
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Mother Fuckers going Global!!!!!!!!
What a confidence builder!
Yes, definitely bullish news.
Co-Mingle This, MFG'ers ...
A-Bamma Is gonna appoint Korzine As his chief Financial Advisor ...
Obama needs someone who knows how to STEAL other peoples money...it would be a good fit I think
Obama also needs someone who is really good at stealing votes.
This is really really gonna piss Celente off.
Imagine how pissed he'll be when he receives a 1099 that shows a gain.
I thought he had that one (vote stealing) figured out. It's the Chicago way...
Obama is missing in action again and again. When are we going hold him responsible for voting present again and again? The only thing he is good at doing is traveling on taxpayer's dime, pointing finger at others and playing golf.
That money is gone forever. MF clients are fucked and Corzine is walking free.
If those pursuing MF Global had any balls they would seek to clawback any missing deposits from the employees themselves, then throw a good 200 or so in BF prison. If there was more personal, direct liability to those that do this white collar bullsh*t fewer people would do it. Decisions are a lot different when it's your own ass on the line. Just another reason to dissolve corporate personhood.
Rest assured that many individuals will be added to the defendants' list... Just need to wait on a little discovery to figure out all the names.
I hope you're right... History tells me they will pin it on a handful of people and the rest walk free (perhaps on the deck of their victim paid yacht). Meanwhile, the people that lost their money (the victims) will spend years in the courtroom vying for scraps.
Our justice system is fine tuned for exacting maximum punishment for petty crimes, but totally impotent for crimes of real consequence. Being a manager it doesn't take much time to figure out who is at fault if something goes wrong in a business. I don't know why it's always nearly impossible for those in justice to make the same determinations.
Lawyers will get paid though. Why do you think they want the clawbacks, they're afraid what's there won't cover their fees.
The clawbacks are either through bankruptcy statute or via a court's equitable powers... "lawyers" don't want anything per se, it's clients that want things and lawyers are a necessary middle man to get what the clients want.
But back to the point, you all have to differentiate between criminal and civil actions... as far as criminal matters go, I wouldn't plan on there being many convictions... however, as far as civil matters go, I would plan on there being plenty of plaintiff judgments... the trick is how much... but, my guess is plenty.
Funny you should bring it up.
Rep. Deutch Unveils OCCUPIED Constitutional Amendment
Bans Corporate Money in Elections and Declares Corporations Are Not People
$1.5 billion. Think about that.
If we tallied up all the $ that all the prisoners currently sitting in American jails actually stole, do you think it would come to $1,500,000,000.00?
If I had lost my money I would make it my pet project to find Corzone and shoot him ,after all it is now leagle to kill American citizens , Obammer does it all the time.
MF Global is a fractal in a frying pan.
Trillions of CDS with nothing to back it
Europe's Voluntary Haircuts?, CDS Market Sham & B of A: Less Than Zero
The Disappearance of Chivalry - George Santayana & Murder By Joystick
*
TO FREE OURSELVES, RESTORE FREE MARKET CAPITALISM AND REESTABLISH OUR CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC, WE MUST FIRST ELIMINATE THE MOST PERNICIOUS CORRUPTING FORCE OF ALL.
END THE FED!
See:
Money Power And The Central Bank: Life Is But A MEME
END THE FED: THE FIRST STEP IN RESTORING OUR CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC
14 Reasons Why We Should Nationalize The Federal Reserve
Hopefully some of the clients are connected/rich enough to get some justice. If it's just normal shmoes, then yes, they are fucked and there will be no consequences.
Yes, that's called "letting the market decide" who gets their money back.
Fuck this. I'm withdrawing all my funds and heading for the local casino. The odds there are better.
The $1.2 Billion is 17% of customer assets. But the headline says $1.2 Billion or more, so I guess it's basically a complete scam.
That money is gone forever. MF clients are fucked and Corzine is walking free.
Money probably ended up in some CIA black-ops budget. Overthrowing foreign governments gets expensive.
Explains why Corzine won't be prosecuted. They don't want him on a witness stand under oath. No way.
On another note, silver decoupled from EURUSD today.
"Money probably ended up in some CIA black-ops budget. Overthrowing foreign governments gets expensive."
Nah... the American military protecting the opium fields in Afghanistan is where the CIA is getting their play money - this money most likely was funneled to Obama's slush fund.
Any pretense that we live in a free republic (Repulic = rule of law) should now be plain for even the most die hard nascar fans - the only question is so what is anyone going to do about it -? Nothing - when Casear overthrew the centuries old Roman senate - he still kept the senate around so as to give the sheep enough cover to live in denial - that is what people need - at least a modest amount of lies they believe so they can live in denial. Some will still be in denial even when their funds are all gone, their dollar is worthless and they are being herded into a FEMA camp - just like the some of the Jews headed into Auschwitz actually believed the sign above the gate "Work will make you free" ....nothing changes...
The media is already setting up the public to get Corzine off. http://money.cnn.com/2011/11/21/news/companies/mf_global_missing_money/ I like that..."missing." I'll have to remember that next time I go to the mall. "I didn't steal from your store. I'm sure the merchandise is went "missing" between me looking at it and walking out the store."
Yeah, "Shortfall" my ass. The only "shortfall" that should be involved here is someone taking an involuntary dive out a skyscraper window.
Where is Corzine?
Why isn't he being detained and interviewed as part of a criminal investigation?
Why hasn't he been cuffed?
Wish we could go back in time. The old west. Poster of Corzine at the post office - this man wanted dead or alive - reward. We need some bounty hunters to rid this world of scum. Get the hangin' tree ready. The walls of the post office would be papered solid, three layers deep with all the posters of all the scum who need to be dispatched from this world. Dissssssgusting.
Hell, Soros probably hired him to help fix the upcoming state bankruptcies. Volker's gonna need somebody with first-hand experience.
http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2011/11/soros-funding-paul-volcker-...
Same reason he was not cuffed after his accident in NJ. For people unfamiliar with this, Corzine as Governor had his staff drive his SUV at 90 mph on the Garden State Parkway. He caused an accident AND he was not wearing a seat belt, an unlawful act in NJ
Corzine received no fine for either
Is it any surprise this arrogant and reckless man would tank an entire company?
yeah, while joe biden's secret service drivers have kill pedestrians and created mucho accidents on official [?] business in the twilight hours,... and leave seen to let locals clean-up - nice
If I were Frere Jon, I'd be worrying about dorme'ing with the fishies soon.
That would involve enforcing the law and imprisoning those that break it. If that happens who's gonna run the fucking country?
,
Calm down people. The rest of the broker/dealers/banks/credit unions only hold very short term AAA sovereigns.. which are good as gold.. er well good as what ever bitches !
Yep, good rule of thumb- triple the initial number of any disaster, that's pretty much always the real number at the end.....
+ 1
Good observation, that does seem to be the pattern.
I think you're being too conservative on the spread.
The Iraq War was to cost American Taxpayers 5 billion, in total, when it was pre-announced.
I think it will end up costing in excess of 3 trillion, at least by the latest tabulations (direct monetary costs, not including hidden, off balance sheet costs, cover-ups, sludge account costs, or the human costs).
I'm too tired to do the simple calculation on the spread between 5 billion and 3 trillion right now, but that's pretty impressive.
LOLOLOL!!!!!!!
Wait..
LOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
FUCK CORZINE!!!
WHY ISN'T HE IN JAIL???
above the law. he was just doing "god's" work afterall... soon the sheople will understand what that really means.
This is just one more step along the path to the total failure of all markets.
Corzine wil likely never see court, either through obfuscation, "convenicide" ( he was so despondent over the losses to innocent victims), or some nonsense.
Of course, he won't mind the plastic surgery as he is so fugly already, that his new look and ID, basking in the South Pacific will suit him just fine.
Yup. This administration is the most transparent ever.
hmmmmm....let's put two and two together, shall we?
Corzine is the consummate insider
Corzine takes over a medium sized firm with a large presence in commodities
Commodities are the canary in the coal mine for inflation
Rumors of commodity price suppression abound
Corzine's firm explodes, and more than a $Billion is now found to be missing, money literally stolen from customer seg accounts
Rumors that MFG is not alone also abound
JPM and HSBC hold short positions amounting to hundreds of millions of ounces of silver
The trustee locks up the accounts
Corzine remains at large
Corzine was last spotted sharing a Bud Light with Jerry Sandusky at The Trail of Tears Truck Stop in College Station, Pennsylvania.
Too many people were buying PM futures and asking for physical delivery. They had to take it down.
And, a big "bundler" for the CSN too .....
DoJ is not some bunch of popgun rural DA's. They take the time to build a case, and when they bring one they hardly ever lose.
The key for criminal charges will be whether Corzine should have been aware that the segregated accounts were being raided. Given that he lobbied CFTC for a liberalization of the "assets" such accounts could be used to purchase, I'd say they are very likely to be able to build a good case.
If Corzine is not pleading this thing out within six months, I will be shocked. The real question is whether there will be jail time involved; I'll be extremely disappointed if there isn't.
Another interesting question is how the Corzine indictment will factor in the general election.
" Mother Fucking " by Banksters going Global! What do you call the offsprings of such incest?
democrats
Why isn't Democrat and Obama friend - John Corzine not in jail? Did the FBI move in to shred any evidence like Solyndra?
I knew the 1.5 billion from the start must be the number. They tried to obfuscate and change it to make it look like a "accident", but you can't accidently move 1.2 to 1.5 or more billion dollars that are in client accounts and mix it up in your's. It takes a person giving the okay to move that amount of clients money (essentially wiping out all their clients and stealing their money). If Corzine doesn't get prison time for this, we have no judicial system. Corzine refuses to talk and hasn't been seen, because he knows and everybody else knows that there is no good reason to move 1.2 to 1.5 billion dollars (essentially all his clients money) to his accounts and then woops it's gone. All the reasons to move them are bad and they have to do with him stealing the money.
must be why the euro just rockted; all the money went into /6e
Hey Hey.
Hey Ho.
From Iraq to Palestine. Leveraging your position using client funds is a crime.
Hey Hey
Hey Ho.
'Leveraging your position using client funds is a crime.'
Interesting. Now... has anyone in the department of justice or the obama administration been made aware of this?
We have a department of justice?
That is the third department Rick Perry wanted to eliminate.
Well they sure as hell don't do anything, that's for sure.
Nonsense..., they cover and clean for these thieves, just as planned.
I stand corrected.
DOJ also distributes guns to drug gangs just for the hell of it.
Oh, they coordinate the enforcement of local parks ordinances very effectively
Anarchy WOULD be more just.
Our current DOJ has no interest in pursuing their mandate, so eliminating it would actually create more justice.
Don't think that is what Perry thinks, not sure he does think (about anything)....but even a dolt Texan is right sometimes...
W and LBJ excepted...
Where?
no it's dept of Just-us as I read it somewhere.
You spelled it wrong. It's Justus.
Yup, they are chilling with the dept of energy...doing what? Who the fuck knows.
Former unapologetic Richard dick Cheney has the tools to get to bottom of it within the 24: enhanced techniques appropriate to key National Security issues. Corzine is bin Laden's 4th Plane into WTC 4, Ten Years After....
The Obama DOJ is too busy smuggling guns to Mexico, busting small-time retailers in the recreational pharmaceutical industry, shutting down medical marijuana outlets, and scamming low-IQ Muslims into thinking that they, too, can be world-class jihadis.
AG Holder can't be bothered when a major source of Obama money rips off hundreds of millions from his clients.
Billion-two pretty much funds the next campaign!!
Now there is a shocker.
I wonder how long the next doubling will take?
+ 1
Not long. Astute question
Wondering who the pudwacks buying JEF are? Retail.
Probably BLK & the iTalian sovereign 'wealth' fund.
So we have now gone from "to big to fail" to "to big to jail" fuckers....
What's a few hundred million between friends, Mortimer?
Ben Mortimer Duke Bernank:
I call your double and raise it double again good man!!
Too bad Madoff wasn't a partner at GS or he'd be a free man right now.
He should have spent more time raising campaign funds!
he'd never have been caught, if not for the very fact he screwed over his own people
All ends with an extended banking holiday. Physically banks won't shut their doors as in the depression but electronically you'll be denied access. The late great depression II. It's here!
...or more. <kinda jumped at me reading this>
My guess is more.
Otherwise why even bother with such a blatant theft? Well, other than the whole take-down the CME storyline.
Buy your turkeys now!!
to paraphrase: 'We lost so much money on our bad trades that we stopped keeping track of the money we were stealing from our customers.'
Markets are rigged. Governments are rigged. It's a gang in charge, and you aren't in it. Numbers are all you have. 99:1. Hang them all.
I guess you don't agree with Forbes Magazine. They said Alex Jones and Gerald Celente are crazy conspiracy guys talking about the wall street-to-washington crime syndicate.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2011/11/17/talk-show-host-alex-jon...