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The New-Normal Class Warfare: Old Vs Young?

Tyler Durden's picture




 

While the most commonly held perspective on the aging demographic in the US is a retiring Boomer generation that is increasingly risk-averse (rotating to fixed income) and in desperate need of a growing segment of the healthcare pie, it appears that this may not be the entire picture. The data shows, via UBS Larry Hatheway, that in fact asset preferences do not change much by age cohort and therefore is not the driving reason behind a secular rotation out of stocks per se (as opposed to more simple reasons such as mistrust) and more notably the perception of an increased longevity could actually incentivize older investors to extend investment horizons (whether in stocks or fixed income). There does, however, remain a clear correlation (intuitive rather than causal if one is splitting hairs) between equity valuations (P/E ratios) and the older cohort (implying expectations of dropping equity valuations). Critically though, it appears from the data that older investors are not more risk averse. There is one further issue that is quietly emerging and that is US fertility data which points to an 'eventual' rejuvenation of US society - which could eventually shift the demographic influence back in the opposite direction. The simple take-away is that while old people continue to desperately cling to wealth preservation in their longer-than-expected lives, with their notably higher-than-average net worths, there will be an increasing pressure to stealthily tax part the aged of their wealth to cover the costs of a growing and even more state-dependent youth demographic that is emerging. Forget the 99% versus the 1%, it appears the new and more clearly-defined class warfare could well be the old versus the young.

 

There remains a clear correlation between the older cohort of the population and equity valuations (P/E ratios) suggesting a falling equity valuation regime is currently occurring...

 

"Income tends to be correlated with equity returns, so that in periods of high equity volatility the uncertainty of future income also increases. Taking this into account suggests that working investors should hedge their income volatility by shorting rather than buying equities."

But as opposed to conventional wisdom, it appears the older cohort is more more risk averse as they hold on to their investments on perceptions of increased life-expectancy dominating patterns perhaps...

 

But the fertility rate continues to rise - outpacing the older cohort even with its increased life-expectancy - putting inevitable pressure on the state to cover more-dependent younger cohorts over time...

 

and where to get that much-needed additional funding to cover the costs of the younger demographic? Well, the older cohort dominates net worth and seems the most obvious place to start...

 

As UBS summarizes, although much discussion of US demographics is drawn to the ageing of the baby boomers, that focus ignores another important fact about US population dynamics. Specifically, the US fertility rate (defined as the number of children per woman) has been rising steadily for three decades and is now above 2. That suggests that the conventional wisdom of an America growing ever older may not be right, at least at more distant horizons. The demographic hump of baby boomers will move into the tail of the age distribution and the distortion created by the post-war spike in fertility rates will fade. In short, demographic change, as important as it may be, could also prove to be transitory as longer-run factors determining population growth change.

 

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Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:36 | 2384789 GetZeeGold
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We're spending our grandkids inheritance....screw'em.

 

I laughed the first time I saw that bumper-sticker.....I didn't realize how serious they were.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:38 | 2384796 Momauguin Joe
Momauguin Joe's picture

Stupid assholes.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:00 | 2384848 MillionDollarBonus_
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This is a war between common sense and purist libertarianism. Between those who support the construction of our economy by fostering aggregate demand, and those who seek to destroy this country through tight, stingy monetary policy and week, impotent fiscal policy. As Dr Paul Krugman eloquently points out, these purist libertarians are supporting the 1% with their anti-Federal Reserve nonsense, and I'm personally sick of it.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:00 | 2384863 economics9698
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Funny.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:42 | 2385010 FEDbuster
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The "boomers" will live longer and place an undue strain on the Medicare system demanding every advanced medical procedure to prolong their already extended lives.  This medical entitlement  generation will bankrupt America long before any new welfare queens with 2+ kids will.   Imagine millions of Americans each demanding a million dollars worth of healthcare in their final year of life, this is America's future.  A man made pandemic would wipe out many of them, look for out of the box "solutions" from TPTB.

Wed, 05/02/2012 - 03:28 | 2390415 MeelionDollerBogus
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"Medicare system demanding every advanced medical procedure to prolong their already extended lives.  This medical entitlement  generation will bankrupt America long before any new welfare queens with 2+ kids will"

I think you're forgetting something: some elders have more work to give, higher quality work to give, and support to their younger family members if only they are healthy enough through healthcare. net-profit is possible on a case-by-case basis.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:48 | 2385339 CIABS
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MDB:

I had forgotten that Paul Krugman was a doctor (a PhD, of course).  Maybe I should rethink my skepticism toward him.

By the way, "week" does not mean the same thing as "weak".

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:20 | 2384947 ultraticum
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And exactly how does one "foster" aggregate demand?  Take me through the mechanics in their more pedestrian details (i.e. IRS goon squad, facilitated by spendthrift congress and further empowered by your Fascist debt-based money printing monopoly, shows up to demand "the People's" property at gunpoint from the individual, then spends 50% of it on corruption and graft - for the real 1%, and with the remainder bombs other countries and doles out EBT cards to inner-city voter farms).  Have you ever lived in a country that pursued your Keynesian wet dream to its ultimate conclusion?  You probably will soon enough.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:09 | 2385240 goldfish1
goldfish1's picture

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha - Krugman - eloquent

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

 

Here's what's happening in the real world:

Philly - Huge property-tax increase

Comments indicate tax increases are good !

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/politics/city/149437745.html?cmpid=124...

 

 

 

Wed, 05/02/2012 - 03:08 | 2390388 MeelionDollerBogus
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The powerful elite 0.01% are the only beneficiaries of monetary policy by central controllers. No jobs are created or sustained. No prices are stable. Poverty increases due to high inflation. Foreign companies & banks are made stronger (making domestic companies weaker) by sending them free money (which is today's monetary policy).

There's no way to defend this.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:38 | 2384797 SilverTree
SilverTree's picture

Black vs White is what scares me the most.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:44 | 2384813 becky quick and...
becky quick and her beautiful mouth's picture

if obama loses...watch out. the nation will be on fire.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:55 | 2384840 WestVillageIdiot
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Not "the world" but maybe some shitty areas like Bronx, south central L.A., parts of Chicago, etc. 

Let's not use scare tactics to help Obama and his racist followers get him re-elected.  Let him and that scumbag Romney fight it out fair-and-square to determine which is the biggest corporatist big government loving piece of dogshit.  That seems only right. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:07 | 2384894 economics9698
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Blacks will never win any war anywhere against anybody.  Look at Africa.  Is there a single African country that is organized?  Hispanics will perform a genocide on blacks when the fiat dies.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:56 | 2384843 GetZeeGold
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Crap I hope not.....who's gonna buy my gas and pay my mortgage?

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:58 | 2384846 SilverTree
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I don't hate the person, I hate the system. Oh, wait just like corporations are systems people too?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:00 | 2384854 Manthong
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“old versus the young””

That’s what they want you to think. The real class warfare is the government elite (serving their .01% masters) with the aid of the government vested interest and handout classes in conflict with the remnants of the producer class and the last vestiges of freedom.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:00 | 2384856 economics9698
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You can be fucking guaranteed that here in Orlando we will be getting some massive negro rioting when George Zimmerman is found innocent.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:59 | 2385215 DaveyJones
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I thought it already was

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 18:14 | 2386665 earleflorida
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he's winning in chicago and look how that's turning out --- the united states has been homogenized for a reason --- think of the conservative south being sandwiched by the east and west? --- a subtle, but well planned demographic nudge, with the northern borders always a relief valve.

america, always finds its way, but to say that if one loses, all hell will break out,... is at best, naive.

Ps. never stop smiling :-))

jmo

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:47 | 2384826 Dr. Richard Head
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Too much TV will do that to a person, as well as getting scared of dem Muslems.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:58 | 2384849 WestVillageIdiot
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Boogeymen are so frightening.

An Obama re-election won't cause nearly as much violence as a bursting of the government bubble.  That is what austerity is all about.  It is a code word for government shrinkage.

The entitled upper class scare me on a macro scale.

The entitled lower class scares me on a micro scale.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:49 | 2384832 francis_sawyer
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Black vs. White will never really materialize in a collapse...

TW vs. Zimmerman is just a bunch of bullshit that the MSM likes to whip up & keep you distracted...

What went wrong in New Orleans? How come all the fotos you see were of blacks hangin around the Superdome? Yeah, that's right! because none of them wanted to venture out on their own (out of the city) to face shotguns & hillbillies...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:59 | 2384853 WestVillageIdiot
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Zimmerman is Hispanic.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:03 | 2384879 economics9698
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The natural combatants’ against black when the fiat collapses is Hispanics.  Both are competing for the sane resources.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:13 | 2384918 GetZeeGold
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Zimmerman is Hispanic.

 

Zimmerman is a WHITE Hispanic......fixed it for you.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:14 | 2384924 francis_sawyer
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Thus MSM & "whipping up"... My point is now validated...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:05 | 2385066 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

MSM manufactured Racism:  The propaganda machine NBC edited the 911 Zimmerman tapes and Aired them on TV to create a false impression of racism.  Disgusting!  and dangerous!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72zJvVQWutA

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:59 | 2385216 francis_sawyer
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True dat: "MSM manufactured racism"...

~~~

Above it was pointed out that if Obama doesn't win, or if Zimmerman gets acquitted, parts of certain areas will be 'on fire'... That is probably accurate (as most of the media has been replaying the 20 year anniversary of the Rodney King riots this past week)... None of that is considered racist behavior (nor were the celebrations when OJ Simpson was acquitted)...

But if someone like myself observes and makes an accurate comment about the behavior of people post Katrina, I get junked by liberal facists... God forbid that I say any of these things, even 'matter of factly' in normal conversation...

There are less RACISTS out there than there are people who simply get tired of 24/7 liberal facism...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:52 | 2384834 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

Blacks were 12.5% of the US population in 2010.  

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:59 | 2384855 WestVillageIdiot
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Not in prisons.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:04 | 2384885 economics9698
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About 33% of blacks end up in the clink.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:59 | 2384857 Sudden Debt
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I never really understood that. Especially in America. You talk the same langues. You both where born in the same country. And you ancesters are in America for the same time.
Yet yo are so different and both sides hate each other.
In europe, we complain about those that don't speak the langues and hate us because we don't share the same religion.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:00 | 2385052 GeezerGeek
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People always find some reason to hate one another. Look at Northern Ireland, or Rwanda, or Nigeria, or the Islamic split between Sunni and Shia. I find that in the US the problem is more cultural than it is racial. We don't all hate each other, but there are some self-appointed leaders who personally profit by stirring up racial antagonisms. Those who adhere to these race-baiters exhibit different cultural habits - such as a sense of entitlement - than others who don't adhere.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:01 | 2385221 DaveyJones
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post of the chain award

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:57 | 2385207 GCT
GCT's picture

Sudden- most Americans live out their daily lives without worrying about racism.  The media and the Jesse Jackson's of the world continue to play it out.  Most people get along to be honest and quite frankly most people are sick of it.  But our media and politicians place labels on people.  This is being done to divide the country and keep the idiots of the world from critically thinking.  Critical thinking is not something TPTB want people to do.  They do not want people looking at real issues in this country otherwise people would be demanding some justice for the theft going on.  The media is very successful at demonizing people or groups just look at the OWS and tea party.  Both are either racists or lazy people as portrayed in the media and people who have never attended either rally never knew what they were all about.  But the judgement has aready been passed.   This is what it is all about disinformaton, and getting people to buy into it without knowing a darn thing about either.  I have seen this in the USA and in Europe when I lived in Germany for 5 years.   

This is currently being played out in Europe with Hollande.  This is all about keeping the masses inline and not rioting all the while stealing your hard earned money.  Yes ZH has its hardcore racists as does any other site.  We have the MDB's of the world as well.  All towing the media and party lines.  You have them as well.  What separates us is throwing off the chains that shackle our minds.  This is dangerous for TPTB and they will do their best to stop it.  If you lived in the USA you would find most of us are actually tired of all the labels and political correctness.  Political correctness is just another label they put on you to shut you up and people believe the propaganda.  PSYOPS is alive and well around the world.

The real issues for me is the gun running operation our US government undertook to take away our gun rights. The monthly erosion of our rights to assemble and the taking away of our privacy.  Our rights as citizens are being eroded monthly, sometimes weekly, and nothing is begin said about it.  Executive Orders are being signed allowing the president to kill citizens and not allowing us our rights.  Both parties are all for it.  Those are issues, but instead we have to have the distractors as main headlines. 

Sorry for the long reply and part rant. I could type all day on this issue.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:37 | 2385307 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

Thats not quite correct- our ancestors werent here for the same time, didnt come from the same places and we dont share a common culture or values.  The closest the US ever came to any feeling of commanality was WWII and that was in reaction to an existential threat, the makeup of the country has shifted drastically since then.

A common language and currency do not provide sufficient grounds to make a people.  Right now we could make 3 or 4 solid countries with some sense of actually being a people, lashed together it will never occur. A Southerner, a New Englander, and a Californian in LA share the basic physical characteristics of human beings but not much more. The cultural differences are not the same as in Europe but every bit as strong.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:59 | 2385369 Bicycle Repairman
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Black versus white, young versus old, gay vs staight, woman versus man.  This kind of "politics of division" is right out of the 1970s handbook.  When times get bad, someone has got to be blamed.  Except, of course, for the culprits.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:41 | 2384803 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

If it were only our inheritance they were spending things would be fine.  Unfortunately, our grandparents tacitly approved of, and benefited from, the bastardization of our monetary system.  They are being paid out.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:46 | 2384824 WonderDawg
WonderDawg's picture

Our current malaise has been 4 generations in the making.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:01 | 2384870 WestVillageIdiot
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But I thought "The Greatest Generation" was filled with only angels and saints?

/sarc

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:25 | 2384967 shuckster
shuckster's picture

The Angels and Saints of that Generation are buried in Arlington and Normandy France. The rest rode on the glory of those who made a sacrifice. Then, they decided that since their buddies had all died in combat, it would be good to honor their memories by playing world police and subsidizing every country's national defense so they could retire at 50 and do all that European sexing and stuff

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:43 | 2385319 Harbanger
Harbanger's picture

"The Greatest Generation" fought in WWII and are long dead Einstein.  The hippies and their children are to blame.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:53 | 2385354 WestVillageIdiot
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How much did they take from the system before they went, Plato?  And what kind of offspring did they leave behind for our viewing pleasure?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:04 | 2384884 Silver Shield
Silver Shield's picture

We are way ahead of this new divide and conquer tactic of the Criminal Elite to draw our attention away from their crimes...

The young need to walk away from the ponzi scheme.
http://youtu.be/qzRUvCua0-E
No need to fight or sacrifice.
Just create their own reality that resonates with them.

The boomers need to provide the wisdom that they did not have in the 60's to steer this revolution into something sustainable.

We should be showing intergenerational love and support instead of sacrificing our young to sustain the unsustainable.

We have had huge discussions in our community over this

Silver Shield Report #12- Generational Dynamics Of The Revolution
http://dont-tread-on.me/?p=11868

Silver Shield Report #27- Bridging The Generational Gap
http://dont-tread-on.me/?p=16372

Silver Shield Report #28- Bridging The Generational Gap #2
http://dont-tread-on.me/?p=16799

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:02 | 2385381 Bicycle Repairman
Bicycle Repairman's picture

There is finally enough wisdom and we are all in the same boat.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:41 | 2384805 duo
duo's picture

That's what the cruise industry is for.  I actually sat at table with a couple (30 years older than us) who said they were going to spend all of their money on cruises so they wouldn't have any left to give to their children and grandchildren.  Great attitude.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:45 | 2384822 j.tennquist
j.tennquist's picture

They should spend it all now.  Cruises, Vegas, hookers.. whatever.  

Spend the money while it still has some value

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:02 | 2384876 WestVillageIdiot
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The Indian casinos have made that plan easier than ever. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:54 | 2384837 GeorgeHayduke
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That couple better hope they stay healthy. The kids will choose the nursing home. They better hope it's not the Under The Bridge nursing home.

However, I expect nothing less than that couple's attitude of "It's Mine, Screw You" from many, many Baby Boomers, because I'm a '61 boomer and I've grown up with them and know how they are. They define words like: avarice, selfish, greedy, self-centered, self--absorbed, self-serving, spoiled, etc... I can't stand a whole lot of them myself and I can understand why younger generations would hate them too.

That couple may want to spend that money before the younger generation takes power or they might find their cruise fund has been confiscated. Karma can suck sometimes, especially when you've been an asshole.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:04 | 2384883 WestVillageIdiot
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I have seen what inheritance can do to some of the spoled brat heirs.  Maybe it is better that the people spend it before their demon seed children get it. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:17 | 2384932 GeorgeHayduke
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I agree with your statement. A large number of Boomers inherited their wealth and look what happened to them.Although, I would claim it's an individual thing. Some folks probably do quite well with a large inheritance and aren't jerks about it.

Hell, I know a Boomer who inherited a nice sum from her dad's estate when he died, yet was pissed that she didn't get more. She plans on spending it all too and feels no need at all to give any to her kids or leave them anything. Yeah, she's pretty much a bitch that few people can stand being around.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:08 | 2384901 machinegear
machinegear's picture

As "gen Xer" I told my parents to enjoy their new houses because because once they get too old for them, its either the nursing home or the river.

This heartfelt commentary brought to you by a bitter Xer. Good day.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:44 | 2385324 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

Yep. I told my Dad he is getting dressed in a polyester golfing outfit, wheeled into the nearest Mall, and left there. He spent his life pursuing personal fulfillment and enjoyment and thats fine, but he needed to be corrected on his expectation that he was going to be cared for one day at the expense of his kids and grandkids.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:00 | 2384861 Zero Debt
Zero Debt's picture

With the yutes swabbing the deck

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:05 | 2384888 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

"What's a yute?"

And next time you post here I want you dressed appropriately.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:08 | 2384898 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

The kids have already been screwed. But what goes round comes round.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:57 | 2385212 tabasco71
tabasco71's picture

I was shocked in my business school when the finance professor (a 70yr old bostonian) described how he had stuck two thumbs up to a new fangled financial product (I think it was derivatives) which could be used to shift the debt that he was due to pay today onto the people to pay tomorrow.  This was in 2003, so he must have been talking about when he was in business 20-30 years before that. So, given his attitude, I'm holding no moral high ground about taxing that mofo out of his second condo and boat in order to give myself a chance.

However, things like inheritance tax are really designed to do just that - as an inheritor, you feel wrong done by when the government steals half of your deceased parents estate - perhaps they are actually only balancing the books... 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:39 | 2384798 SoNH80
SoNH80's picture

Message to the older set:  don't expect any young people to buy your house for 10X what you paid for it, at least not within the next 20 years.  If you're lucky, some trust fund kidz might do it.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:39 | 2384799 j.tennquist
j.tennquist's picture

Screw them before they can screw us?  Sure we f*cked them up financially, that's for certain. 

They are going to do far worse to us.    It's gonna get physical and it's going to be ugly.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:41 | 2384801 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

Will the old want to force the young to pay for their mistakes? Will the young accept being forced to pay for the old people's mistakes?

Almost a guarantee the old people feel they are entitled to what they have not earned or lost so it comes down to the question will the young accept being forced to pay. I think they will but the resentment will run high and apathy and productivity and wealth generations will suffer.

 

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:44 | 2384812 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Old people cant street fight very well.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:06 | 2384890 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Maybe not but they sure can act like bullies.

AARP for everybody!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:48 | 2384829 kridkrid
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This won't last that long.  I drive by a VA hospital every morning.  As I did today, I thought about what it's going to look like when those cuts get made.  The next 3-4 years (or until the whole thing completely unravels) is going to be a non-stop parade of "We can't turn our backs on XXXXX, we made a commitment to them and we have to see the commitment through".  Get in line... old people, vets, federal pension holders, public service pension holders, school teachers... name it.  If you aren't on that list, you'll be let go and will receive an ever dwindling amount of unemployment.  If aren't let go, your taxes are going to skyrocket.  None of this is avoidable.  It’s baked into the system.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:08 | 2384900 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

The granddaddy of them all is The Government Bubble.  Its popping is already taking place under the guise of "austerity".

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:13 | 2384922 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

Every bubble is a symptom, not a cause.  The cause is credit money that is loaned into existence with interest attached at its creation.  The gov't bubble may, in fact, be the final bubble.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:32 | 2384989 shuckster
shuckster's picture

Short Medicaid???

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:42 | 2385006 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

It can last a lot longer. You take all the wealth that exists, you take the productive capacity of the US which is dwindling but still enormous and there is a lot more wealth to redistribute and consume. Again the question is will the people getting that wealth be the ones who lost it through voting in corrupt politicians who would play along with their philosophy of statist wealth redistribution or wll the wealth be kept by the people producing it.

Unfortunately they dominate philosophy of todays world (altruism) suggests that the old people will be consuming the wealth generated by younger generations and using the guns of government to have it redistributed to them.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:31 | 2384984 shuckster
shuckster's picture

It's a simple question of enforcement. If the old folks want to bark out orders, they're going to need someone to enforce it

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:41 | 2384804 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

We still have some demographic distance to cover before the younger generation's numbers start to pick up. In the meantime, fewer and fewer young workers per retired person will be the norm. Try coping with that.

In addition to the above problem, the older generation are pretty much gutted by ZIRP and poorly performing stock markets as well as the fact that virtually all income increases in the economy (about 93%) are accruing to the top 1%.

Finally, when the young are starting life with sizeable college debt and poor job and income prospects, there is going to be a further disconnect between the old and young as they will find it difficult to pay off education debt, start a family and also pay off a mortgage.

Demograhics, income, jobs and debt are all out of kilter. Good luck trying to navigate such a swamp. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:10 | 2384906 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Retirees shouldn't be in the stock market.  That is too much risk on a short timeframe.  But you are right about ZIRP.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:17 | 2384931 WoodMizer
WoodMizer's picture

Right, they should be in the safety of sovereign debt and currencies.
Long PMs is the only safe play left at this point.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:16 | 2384928 machinegear
machinegear's picture

For many young, it boils down to a decision to be free without debit or to become a debt slave with kids.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:42 | 2384807 GeorgeHayduke
GeorgeHayduke's picture

Of course they will use this divide and conquer tactic. It will likely work well too as most folks will look at the "enemy" their controllers point towards rather than look and think for themselves.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:46 | 2384823 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

+1

Look at all these friggin' comments... Almost all of them have immediate sides being taken (us vs. them)...

It's the 99.9% ers vs. the .01%'ers people... FOCUS!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:00 | 2384858 CvlDobd
CvlDobd's picture

I think it's freedom v. oppression. Your middle class neighbor could be just as much an enemy as a .01%er if they support big government police state tactics.

As William Wallace said "FREEDOM!!!!!"

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:11 | 2384911 WestVillageIdiot
WestVillageIdiot's picture

Do you believe in freedom and responsibility or BIG Government?  That is the question.  

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:19 | 2384942 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

There are no 'numbers' in the middle...

A person aspires to be one or another... The lines are drawn at the gate, you're either IN or OUT... There is not on genuine 1%er on Zero Hedge... Everyone is a 99%er (except for Max Fischer, who is a 'wannabee' 1%er & thus gets his a55 kicked on a daily basis)...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:57 | 2385051 DOT
DOT's picture

I prefer the old In and Out.   Hmmmmmm... but that's where all these damn kids came from.

(btw: 99% is just a meme, as a class of citizens it does not exist.)

 

All the false divisions having no actuallity are subject to disagreement and debate ad infinatum.

All your life you have been lied to by those that seek to control you.  Those liars use any tool available to make you HATE.

 

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:51 | 2385919 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Your last sentence summed it up in a better way that I fumbled about trying to express... (+1)

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:13 | 2384920 onthesquare
onthesquare's picture

Over the centuries families like the Rothschilds have made sure they keep the money building from generation to generation and their kids do not marry outside 2nd cousins.  Through one generation to the next those incharge of the wealth are committed to make it grow, either by hook or by crook. 

Us oxydental european and asian descendies buy stuff of little long term value and when it is gone it is gone.

Without a serious change in inheritted drive and additude getting into that 0.1% is not going to be possible.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:30 | 2384981 toady
toady's picture

Agreed.

This young vs old is certainly contrived, but the differences are acute.

Older people, ones that were in the workforce pre Reagan, were indoctrinated in the job-for-life, full benefits, good pension America.

The middle of this issue is mixed, some got into job-for-life, others got into 'deregulated' industries, like me, and saw every benefit outside of a paycheck slowly taken away.

Those that are even younger are so indoctrinated on the other side it's hard for me to imagine. The word 'pension' is evil. The word 'healthcare' is evil. Work till you die is assumed.

Why can't people see that we have the corporations over a barrel? If they want us to purchase their products, they must provide benefits outside of just a paycheck.

Until younger generations reverse the Reagan revolution they, actually WE, will continue to decline.

Rant complete!

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:20 | 2385260 GeorgeHayduke
GeorgeHayduke's picture

+1

I agree completely.

In this post-Reagan word, work and conspicuous consumption are the only virtues that matter. Screwing over anyone else: neighbor, family, community, country; is fine as long as you come out ahead. This greed and avarice have always been inherent in America as those were the types of people who came to power here and made laws to suit their own greedy nature. However, it is looking like this scam may have finally run its course and a new model may begin and that model may not suit the scammers too well. We will see.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:46 | 2385329 Badabing
Badabing's picture

Divide and conquer the goyem

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:22 | 2385478 Will To Live
Will To Live's picture

In ten minutes this thread is lord of the flies. The real thing will be brutal.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:05 | 2384886 kridkrid
kridkrid's picture

This is certainly correct, and I'm even a bit guilty of it above when I say that they tacitly approved what has been created.  But in reality, they likely had no idea what was going on... still don't.  So it goes.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:47 | 2385027 riphowardkatz
riphowardkatz's picture

You are way off base. The cause of the division is philosophy not some powers that be group you made up in your head. 

The cause is the philosophy of altruism whose tenants are carried out by the state. When you have this philosophy a finite pie must be divided. when a finite pie is divided the inevitable result is group mentality and fighting amongst groups for their slice.

If you we had capitalism the pie would be growing and being saved. There would be no need for fighting only for competition which grows the pie for everyone.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:42 | 2384810 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Even though I always liked Bill Cosby, I guess old black guys will be my enemy then

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:43 | 2384811 ACP
ACP's picture

I guess we'll see if Dr Evil, er, Bernanke can break graph #1.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:44 | 2384815 WoodMizer
WoodMizer's picture

To bad all the "wealth" held by the boomers will be Corzined before most boomers have a chance to invest in physical assets. The old will blame the youth for the capital losses and government spending. Violent unrest of the youth will support the boomer argument, but the youth will write the history after the boomers meet their fate.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:53 | 2384835 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

Right. Old folks actually think their 'wealth' will not soon be Corzined? Theyre dreaming. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:52 | 2384819 ACP
ACP's picture

And who the fuck leaked ISM? Are there 2 tier leaks now? One for super-high rollers days in advance and one for the run-of the mill Wall St punks minutes in advance?

Edit: Ah, didn't realize you can buy non-public info 3 minutes in advance.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:21 | 2384821 Mercury
Mercury's picture

-->...the perception of an increased longevity could actually incentivize older investors to extend investment horizons

...or to preserve/hide their wealth from those who seek to vote it away.

-->There is one further issue that is quietly emerging and that is US fertility data which points to an 'eventual' rejuvenation of US society - which could eventually shift the demographic influence back in the opposite direction. The simple take-away is that while old people continue to desperately cling to wealth preservation in their longer-than-expected lives, with their notably higher-than-average net worths, there will be an increasing pressure to stealthily tax part the aged of their wealth to cover the costs of a growing and even more state-dependent youth demographic that is emerging.

So, the emerging, younger generation is going to grow the economy out of the doldrums by...taxing away the wealth of retired baby boomers to fund even more entitlements for those members of society with the highest productivity potential?  Doesn't sound rejuvenating to me. You also might want to take a gander at exactly which segments of the population are generating those above replacement level birthrates.

-->In short, demographic change, as important as it may be, could also prove to be transitory

 Wow really?  Thanks UBS...take the immortality assumption out of the model. Got it.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:53 | 2384828 Ignorance is bliss
Ignorance is bliss's picture

Interesting....So what demographic is showing increased population gowth? According to the census Latinos are the growing force. I am not sure how this will effect the baby boomers. We are going to have to a make a choice. Make war or take care of our elderly. We can't support this huge budget and care for our elderly. TPTB are trying to convince us that SS, Medicare, Medicaid, and other social safety nets should be gutted. Maybe...or maybe we cut back on the drones, military war machines, homeland defense, excessive Gov't expenditures such as massive Gov't projects. At the end of the day those expenses will be cut when U.S. bonds reach junk status.

 

report by the U.S. Census Bureau projects a decrease in the ratio of Whites between 2010 and 2050, from 79.5% to 74.0%.[54] At the same time, Non-Hispanic Whites are projected to no longer make up the majority of the population by 2042, but will remain the largest single race. In 2050 they will compose 46.3% of the population. Non-Hispanic whites made up 85% of the population in 1960.[55] The report foresees the Hispanic or Latino population rising from 16% today to 30% by 2050, the African American percentage barely rising from 12.9% to 13.0%, and Asian Americans upping their 4.6% share to 7.8%. The U.S. has 310 million people as of October 2010, and is projected to reach 400 million by 2039 and 439 million in 2050.[20][56][57][58] It is further projected that 82% of the increase in population from 2005 to 2050 will be due to immigrants and their children.[59]

 

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:01 | 2384865 SoNH80
SoNH80's picture

Latins have one huge thing going for them- they take care of their families.  Even in poor Spanish neighborhoods around here, the little kids are well-dressed, scrubbed clean, and their teen moms keep an eagle eye on them.  Oldsters hang out together playing dominoes and going to church, not warehoused in some nursing home.  Meantime, a lot of the poor white kids are dirty, disheveled, and left alone to wander around at will.  White oldsters warehoused in public housing.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:55 | 2384839 lead salad
lead salad's picture

The young will win the war as the old will be used for Soylent Green.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:17 | 2384933 Putty
Putty's picture

Yup.  The elderly's children won't be on their side.  They will want to eat as well.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:00 | 2385063 toady
toady's picture

You don't want that old, tough, dried-out soylent. We have some juicy veal soylent right over here...

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:56 | 2384845 kralizec
kralizec's picture

Everybody grows older right?  Or am I missing something?  The problem isn't generation vs generation, the problem is stupid & wreckless people voting for stupid & wreckless politicians who screw us all over with profligate spending, massive debt and crippling regulation.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:57 | 2384847 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

Chart 3 has me mystified. Is it really saying that the 55-64 group and the 65-74 group both have average net worths around $1 million? I keep reading about all the boomers who have saved next to nothing that this figure seems too high. And where would the numbers be if Bill Gates and Paul Allen were not included? Or where would they be if the top 5% of each cadre were excluded?

Or do I just need to get a new pair of Medicare-funded reading glasses?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:04 | 2384882 Jim B
Jim B's picture

Must be a typo or the uber-rich are skewing the numbers???

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:16 | 2384851 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

This happened in 1790's France, too.

I'll let you guess who won.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 09:59 | 2384859 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Written by a 1%'er.

Getting nervous much? Need to create a diversion do you? Nice try.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:02 | 2384869 eddiebe
eddiebe's picture

' Forget the 99% versus the 1%, it appears the new and more clearly-defined class warfare could well be the old versus the young'

I'm sure that would be exactly what the 1% crowd want.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:28 | 2384917 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

You are correct sir.  Only those that know the value of their labor is zero fear a collapse.  fucking bring it already, the sooner when purge the bad debt and crash the system, the sooner compensation (in numerous forms) can return to people who are actually worth a shit.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:02 | 2384878 CvlDobd
CvlDobd's picture

Are you telling me there are more stupid crying babies on the way? SHIT! Ive noticed an increase in single mothers in my immediate network. You would be amazed the % of people in their 20s and 30s that refuse condoms and safe sex practices. Somewhat terrifying IMO.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:10 | 2384909 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

stupid is as stupid does.  Long soylent green.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:18 | 2384943 GeezerGeek
GeezerGeek's picture

Apparently only 30-ish female law students use birth control. Of course, they want it for free, but that's a different problem.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:06 | 2384891 onthesquare
onthesquare's picture

I keep kidding my kids, after I do them a favour, of wipping my ass some day when I can't.  They laugh.

They will probably take my money (through power of attorney) and hire someone to wipe my ass then get more and more pissed as the account shinks.

If I have the balls I will take a long walk on a short pier.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:09 | 2384905 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

What's that old saying again?  They have got the guns, but we've got the numbers - same as it ever fucking was.  Quit your whining and get to work.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:12 | 2384915 ZackAttack
ZackAttack's picture

QE, stimulus and price supports represented a huge intergenerational wealth transfer, pulling demand forward to prop up the value of Boomer assets.

Just ask yourself, though: Will Xer and Millennial wages and savings support the current prices of Boomer assets?

Are there more or fewer of them than Boomers?

It's really hard to run a good Ponzi when you have a diminishing pool of suckers.  

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:14 | 2384921 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"It's really hard to run a good Ponzi when you have a diminishing pool of suckers."

And that in a nutshell is what the entire globe is facing, especially in the face of decreasing oil production in our current petro-society.  Hell look around, we pave the fucking roads with the stuff.  Now where the hell are those fusion reactors I ordered?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:16 | 2384929 insanelysane
insanelysane's picture

You mean the old people that worked from the 1960's on, paying into social security.  And then the same old people, vote people into power in the 80's on, that take all of the money out of social security so they don't raise taxes.  And the same old people, that paid into social security, took the money out and spent it on stupid government, and now demand their social security checks because they paid into the system.  Those double dipping old fucks that are received more from their social security payments than they ever paid in?

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:04 | 2385078 DOT
DOT's picture

Same as it ever was....

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:30 | 2385835 roadhazard
roadhazard's picture

I love how since you can't do anything about the Corporate fucking you you decide to take it out on the old folks who busted their ass all there lives.  Then stupidly decided to bring childern like you into the world.  Fuck you, loser.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:22 | 2384961 Offtheradar
Offtheradar's picture

I keep saying "bury your folks in the crawlspace and keep cashing their social security checks" -- Payback is a bitch.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:26 | 2384970 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Old people want free stuff and the young don't? Who was it that voted Obama in? Who is it getting all of these student loans and then bitching about how much they cost to repay? Who are the most recent graduates of our socialist leaning school system? The whole concept of our social contract centered about the aging, that's why they created social security and medicare. I just can't believe the socialists now want to dump us! You know, that has always been the hallmark of a good socialist system though, killing off the unproductive, so young against old makes perfect sense! They have always said that a conservative was just a liberal that had been mugged, so maybe this is a good thing with all the mugging going on.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:00 | 2385218 RoadKill
RoadKill's picture

Social compacts always go by the way side when its time to sacrafice.

As they should. You old people made these social compacts with yourself. You VOTED to make someone else's children pay for you to retire 30 years before you die.

I dont remember being given a vote on if I wanted to buy into SS. I was born into it and told that if I didnt want to pay I have to rennounce my citizenship and give you half my money on the way out.

Let your children take care of you the way they see fit and Ill take care of my parents the way I see fit. If you were a good parent you have kids that love you and that have the skills to make enough $ to care for them.

My parents were abusive religious nutcases, so Ill let their God take care of them.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:30 | 2384978 Downtoolong
Downtoolong's picture

increasing pressure to stealthily tax part the aged of their wealth to cover the costs

Take note all you young people what it really means when the government and Wall Street say you need to become more active and responsible in saving for your retirement. Who do they really think you are saving it for? Your money is their money. Among fund managers and the sell side of Wall Street they don’t call it “Asset Gathering” for nothing.  

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:46 | 2385024 Carnegie_IB
Carnegie_IB's picture

like taking candy from children. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:34 | 2384996 Carnegie_IB
Carnegie_IB's picture

I think young sharp minds and other operators may find a way to extract the baby boomer's IRA wealth levels because most plans do not have the ability to short and some plans do not really have a solid way to take the portfolio to cash in a non taxable manner.

Therefore, I observe a conflict of interest via asset custodians and their related trading operations.

Where through quickly falling market values, plans may be inherently raided should the older age group SELL AFTER or DURING declining asset value environments, and shrewd buyers take the trade while covering their shorts and BUYING.

This tactic may be indirectly employed by the plan's own related parties that have information about IRA holders account positions and trading orders such that fishing in a barrell may be no different for those operations with the ability and willingness to act such ways.  

In an environment of declining asset values, asset management operations may also be inclined to trade against their own client as a going concern. 

During of After a declining asset value environment, plans may begin to offer the ability to hedge long exposure more effectively, however, this would be similar to locking the barn door after the horse has already fled. 

Boomers may be well advised to consider selling 1/3 of their long exposure and certainly not hesitate to go against their "feelings" once declining asset values come upon them,

assuming one may have ENOUGH TIME TO ACT,

since a flash crash would make doing so not as attractive and

therefore, many will hold out for higher prices,

in the face of continuing market declines.

The market tends to just behave like that.

my $.02

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 16:11 | 2386228 emersonreturn
emersonreturn's picture

Perhaps young astute minds might consider making it easier for the aged to access pills (paid for by those requesting) to relieve their children and grandchildren of having to cover their long, expensive and often unpleasant passing?  Why forcefully burden the heirs, hospitals or system with those who would walk off a short pier if they could access the balls?  Why not allow those of us who don't want to burden our children or society to fall on our swords? Rather than having our noble young heirs suffer the expense, not to mention the burden of loathing both parents and elders, rather than making the act as dodgy as a 1950 back street abortion, allow both the aged and young some semblance of grace, alongside the illusion of doing what both ages can for the good of the group; thereby leaving what's left of the national safety net for those in dire need or suffering a disinclination for religious or self involved reasons from leaving the planet.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:41 | 2385007 pods
pods's picture

Just another way to divide and conquer the masses.  Works better than the race war pimps.

pods

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:43 | 2385015 Carnegie_IB
Carnegie_IB's picture

about those age-based average net worth figures,

how much of that net worth included estimated primary home equity?

What would those figures look like if the primary residence was removed?  

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:48 | 2385031 markettime
markettime's picture

Lots of comments today! I find it amazing how divided we all have become. You have economic status, race, religeon,different parts within the same religeon, political beliefs, generation, hobbies and activities, or anything else you have in common or do not have in common with everyone else. I could even classify iphone and android for goodness sake. I guess my point is, if we are all so divided what are we going to do when we are faced with a REAL problem? 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:57 | 2385362 Lednbrass
Lednbrass's picture

How divided we have become?  I would argue that this has always been the case, but most chose to believe feel good propaganda because the economy was propped up by literally stealing from the future through deficit spending and people were only united by having lots of stuff. Look at GDP for the last 30 or 40 years, factor out inflation, subtract deficit spending by the government and see how much real growth there was.

What are we going to do? Tough to say, but my guess is that when the wheels come off as they inevitably must we scrap it and reform as several separate entities.  I dont understand how someone can say "United" States with a straight face anymore.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:52 | 2385039 imapopulistnow
imapopulistnow's picture

The only hope for the young is to grow the economy - something Obama has proven he is incapable of doing.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 10:56 | 2385049 reader2010
reader2010's picture

Shit. They desperately need to take your money away. If you don't buy their shit, who they're going to sell too. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:09 | 2385085 curly
curly's picture

It's probably worse (or better, depending on your POV) that you might think.

US income distribution is so skewed that any charts/graphs showing *average* income or *average* net worth is misleading at best.

Show the median income and especially median net worth.  It should be clearer how screwed we all really are, at least if you're expecting to much of anything from SS or Medicare before you die.

The truly wealthy don't pay taxes, nor do the bottom 20% or so.  Would be helpful to know if the truly wealthy, including the Kennedys, Kerry/Heinzs, Bushs, etc. actuallly even have to report their entire net worth, or whether it's hidden well enough.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:18 | 2385101 DOT
DOT's picture

Paging Alex de Tocqueville.

 

Now that

government is the central power in our lives

we no longer need

to vote ourselves more benefits.

The benefits have become bribes to

secure support (more haters) for the

blues or the reds. 

 

The government will justify the means.

 

The beauracracy will enlarge.

 

The flock will respond and move

according to the yapping of

the running dogs of the State.

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:34 | 2385146 ian807
ian807's picture

Spinning our economic problems as an "old vs. young" issue is a red herring to distract from the real problem which is "the extremely wealthy vs. everyone else."

Unfortunately, there are plenty of people, young and old, who will be stupid enough to fall for this.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:42 | 2385174 gwar5
gwar5's picture

I've seen generational warfare being ginned up, along with race and class warfare, for some time. Just the name "Boomer" is being used as an automatic perjorative.

Bankrupt governments are just looking around for an excuse and any assets to grab. Older Americans are being demonized to make it acceptable to strip them of property. They're old, so I guess they don't need it anymore. You are a target especially if you are white, older, and successful. Oprah Winfrey and Jay-Z get a pass because their ancestors were slaves, or something. 

It is a sad fact that Obamacare was specifically designed to pull the respirator plugs on older, white Amricans to confiscate their estates through death taxes and accelerate generational wealth transfer.  The Obamacare review board decisions -- who will live and who will die -- are final, unless you are black, Hispanic, or Native American Indian. In these cases, there are politically motivated bureauracracies to give 2nd, 3rd, and 4th chances to get treatment and live. The stated purpose for his is to elevate the actuarial tables for non-whites. This is a willful redistribution of life expectancy, despite the real underlying reasons for any differences such as drugs, alcohol, and homicide rates.

A non-medical example of the same concept: When all the GM dealerships were being shut down, minority owned dealerships were off limits. As IG Barofsky pointed out, none of the dealerships actually needed to be closed at all, and that the closings actually harmed GMs long term prospects. No matter, the decisions were final and all the other dealerships got the death penalty based on politics.

Regarding healthcare and Boomer redistribution, rules put in place will criminalize doctors for treating denied, older Americans who wish to pay out of their own pocket. And new rules employing financial repression, will prevent older Americans from moving money overseas to receive needed medical treatment. More, transfer of private pension wealth has already begun with new taxes on 401Ks and IRAs slipped into the 2009 stimulus bill, to begin in 2013, and this is on top of the relentless transfer of wealth via debasement of USD assets.

By design, these measures result in massive "Disparate Impacts" (DI) on 'Boomers'.  DI has historically been used as presumptive institutional racism.  DI is now being openly weaponized to go after older Americans. This violates the fundamental concept of property rights and lowers the ceiling for everybody and does not raise the floor. 



 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 11:53 | 2385203 RoadKill
RoadKill's picture

WHAT? The old/young divide is about the old burdening the young with debt to payfor the promises that were made to them by pols trying to buy votes.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 12:05 | 2385235 JR
JR's picture

Perhaps it is not so much that there will be a war between the old and young as there will be the continuation of the on-going war of wealth-redistribution between opposing cultures.

The Census Bureau predicts that, by 2050, white people will only make up 46.3 percent of the population.

“If current trends continue, the population of the United States will rise to 438 million in 2050, from 296 million in 2005, and 82% of the increase will be due to immigrants arriving from 2005 to 2050 and their U.S.-born descendants,” according to new projections developed by the Pew Research Center.

“Of the 117 million people added to the population during this period due to the effect of new immigration, 67 million will be the immigrants themselves and 50 million will be their U.S.-born children or grandchildren.” – Pew Research Center, February 11, 2008

Under Keynesian socialism it is unrealistic to expect median household income formerly produced by a private market economy to hold steady. No immigrant to America until now ever arrived expecting instant income equality. Such a feat can only be achieved by socialism at the voting booth, i.e., income redistribution in the form of Obamacare, Medicaid, Food Stamps, Housing subsidies, and the compulsory Job displacement of higher paid American workers...  That, of course, lowers all boats, except for the State-connected.  That, of course, is the elephant in the statistics.  

Or perhaps that is what Zero Hedge means by an "even more state-dependent youth demographic that is emerging."

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:38 | 2385584 odatruf
odatruf's picture

I have to say, I think the massive immagration influx, if it happens, will be good for the nation.  Those who immigrate here and their direct offspring tend to be more productive than native Americans once you control for education level and language abaility.

Weed out the criminals, let the rest go through a sane and workable process to enter the country and make sure they can go to school and speak our shared language.  We'll be better off for it.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 13:00 | 2385370 odatruf
odatruf's picture

I wonder if anyone has done a calculation to figure the welfare suck of the generations.

Boomers will likely live longer relative to their projected life span and cost more in health, end of life care and SS (and other defined benefit plan) payments relative to what was projected for them than the following generations. As a result, the boomer pay in, even when adjusted for inflation / interest, is going to fall short of what is needed or would have been had the actual lifespan been known when the rates were set and adjusted.

On the other hand, because medical costs are especially increasing as a result of new technologies and drugs, it might also be true that the rate of spending on generations after the boomers is going to be greater than their pay in equivalent because the increase in these costs is always under planned - more so maybe than had been the case.

I don't know which is more true, and as a result, which age cohort is or will get more bang for their tax buck. For my purposes, I am interested only in direct transfers and not society wide benefits such as roads, defense, etc., science research, etc.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:24 | 2385803 roadhazard
roadhazard's picture

After reading some of the whining in this thread I can guarantee that some of your parents wish they had a do over with you. Should have got a dog.

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 14:30 | 2385834 SilverSavant
SilverSavant's picture

Bingo,  this needs to be said over and over and over and over.  We have a bubble in government, which is a symptom of the credit bubble.   Mainly it is the fedgov.   Until we get the gov out of edu. health, energy and business, there is no hope for progress.   Furthermore, the only possible fix is through collapse.   For year after year it has looked like the collapse is upon us.  With that said, we are now here.  Those who think that there is 5 more years of the crap possible are overly optimistic.   Those who think it will come tomorrow are being fooled by intelligence, which is no longer that reliable for predicting human behavior.  After being early with my predictions for 12 years now, I am not willing to take a bet.   However, you can bet we are all losing each day this house of cards stays standing. 

Mon, 04/30/2012 - 17:53 | 2386602 malek
malek's picture

 The demographic hump of baby boomers will move into the tail of the age

Right. Who cares about the next 40 years, before that will happen.

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