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NSA Whistleblower Speaks Live: "The Government Is Lying To You"

Tyler Durden's picture


Just a month ago we raised more than a proverbial eyebrow when we noted the creation of the NSA's Utah Data Center (codename Stellar Wind) and William Binney's formidable statement that "we are this far from a turnkey totalitarian state". Democracy Now has the former National Security Agency technical director whistleblower's first TV interview in which he discusses the NSA's massive power to spy on Americans and why the FBI raided his home. Since retiring from the NSA in 2001, he has warned that the NSA’s data-mining program has become so vast that it could "create an Orwellian state." Today marks the first time Binney has spoken on national TV about NSA surveillance. Starting with his pre-9-11 identification of the world-wide-web as a voluminous problem since the NSA was 'falling behind the rate-of-change', his success in creating a system (codenamed Thin-Thread) for 'grabbing' all the data and the critical 'lawful' anonymization of that data (according to mandate at the time) which as soon as 9-11 occurred went out of the window as all domestic and foreign communications was now stored (starting with AT&T's forking over their data). This direct violation of the constitutional rights of everybody in the country was why Binney decided he could not stay (leaving one month after 9-11) along with the violation of almost every privacy and intelligence act as near-bottomless databases store all forms of communication collected by the agency, including private emails, cell phone calls, Google searches and other personal data.

There was a time when Americans still cared about matters such as personal privacy. Luckily, they now have iGadgets to keep them distracted as they hand over their last pieces of individuality to the Tzar of conformity.


Part 1 - Exclusive: National Security Agency Whistleblower William Binney on Growing State Surveillance

William Binney's shocking facts start at around 15:00...



Part 2 - Detained in the U.S.: Filmmaker Laura Poitras Held, Questioned Some 40 Times at U.S. Airports

The Academy Award-nominated filmmaker Laura Poitras discusses how she has been repeatedly detained and questioned by federal agents whenever she enters the United States. Poitras said the interrogations began after she began working on her documentary, "My Country, My Country," about post-invasion Iraq. Her most recent film, "The Oath," was about Yemen and Guantánamo and follows the lives of two past associates of Osama bin Laden. She estimates she has been detained approximately 40 times and has had her laptop, cell phone and personal belongings repeatedly searched.




Part 3 - "We Don’t Live in a Free Country": Jacob Appelbaum on Being Target of Widespread Gov’t Surveillance

We speak with Jacob Appelbaum, a computer researcher who has faced a stream of interrogations and electronic surveillance since he volunteered with the whistleblowing website, WikiLeaks. He describes being detained more than a dozen times at the airport and interrogated by federal agents who asked about his political views and confiscated his cell phone and laptop. When asked why he cannot talk about what happened after he was questioned, Appelbaum says, "Because we don’t live in a free country. And if I did, I guess I could tell you about it." A federal judge ordered Twitter to hand over information about Appelbaum’s account. Meanwhile, he continues to work on the Tor Project, an anonymity network that ensures every person has the right to browse the internet without restriction and the right to speak freely.




Part 4 - Whistleblower: The NSA is Lying–U.S. Government Has Copies of Most of Your Emails

National Security Agency whistleblower

William Binney reveals he believes domestic surveillance has become more expansive under President Obama than President George W. Bush. He estimates the NSA has assembled 20 trillion "transactions" — phone calls, emails and other forms of data — from Americans. This likely includes copies of almost all of the emails sent and received from most people living in the United States. Binney talks about Section 215 of the USA PATRIOT Act and challenges NSA Director Keith Alexander’s assertion that the NSA is not intercepting information about U.S. Citizens.




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Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:06 | 2362389 YesWeKahn
YesWeKahn's picture

This is really not a news.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:15 | 2362413 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

Crap ... I have no idea any more who is lying to me!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:19 | 2362427 slewie the-pi-rat
slewie the-pi-rat's picture

Z|h is an oasis of truth, that you can bank on

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:32 | 2362465 1C3-N1N3
1C3-N1N3's picture

Lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of Slewies!!!!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:20 | 2362604 Pladizow
Pladizow's picture

Que suspicious death in 3, 2, 1.......

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:23 | 2362606 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture



So the Fed terrorizes the populace with monetary policies that are crashing the currency, the markets and the economy, the NSA breaks the law and lies, and Barry passes executive orders to seize private assets and suspend constitutional rights.

Time for a global currency, CO2 emisssion taxes, and a bigger global government.

And if you see something, say something.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:48 | 2362655 2discern
2discern's picture

I see nothing...Sgt. Schultz  (other than the scam of all time barry soetero as putative pres)

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:07 | 2362686 Teamtc321
Teamtc321's picture

Record this NSA, how many thieves are behind this? Now go do your fucking job serf. 


Obama Lawyer Admits Forgery but disregards “image” as Indication of Obama’s Ineligibility Damage Control

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:18 | 2362901 Bananamerican
Bananamerican's picture

their jobs?

Their jobs are to act as foot soldiers in a subset of the wealth extraction matrix...

Nothing more, nothing less. You heard Binney...Again, it's all about Contracting dollars and revolving doors between government "service" and and private Corps. "Another jobs program" (& he snickered)

We are NO different from the Soviets with all their bleating about Communism when the only ism that counted was Cronyism. There is NO system immune to the rise of its sociopathic, predator class over time. Communism, Socialism, Capitalism, or Bhuddism...

Our greedy sociopaths just have more efficient means of wealth extraction at their modern disposal. All else remains timeless, immutable, fixed...

feeling dessicated yet, or do YOU work for the government too?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:51 | 2362955 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

NASA wasn't some hippy scientists gathering to make star wars a reality. It was and is a military operation where astronauts have military ranks. It was US military control of the next become the super power over russia.


NSA and these data centers and DARPA hacker group aren't some hippy facebook programmers. They are military defense programs. It is US miliary control of the next stay as the super power over china. internet is the next global economy, media, exchange. controlling internet means you get to control the mind and thoughts of the world population.


Government's job #1 is control.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:35 | 2363123 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture

Its about enslavement and wealth extraction,  most likely just the military using the dollar as world reserve currency. Hang on to your bootstraps

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:58 | 2363162 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture



This Guy is a Plant!

there is NO! WAY!! the NSA would allow him or anyone else to Yap to the World!

He is talking about what he is told to talk about!

Mis-Information thru providing Information!


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:31 | 2363208 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

It's really quite simple.

Govern Ment is A system to Govern the mind. Governmind.

Mind your business. Mind your step. Watch what you say. Not as i do. Do as I say. Bend over.

I was watching/readign something about TSA horrors yesterday and realized that the world has really lost it's center.

Men can watch their wives and children being abused and keep quiet in the name of HAVING to FLY?

WTF? Guns in a gun-safe ain't no good baby. Stroke that barell, but keep limp like a rag when NSA man squeezes your jewels, you bomBASTIC man, and TSA lady feels your wife.

C'mon folks. It IS over at this rate. if anyone has flown, been groped and just "Aw shucks, gotta put with this shit, gotta keep my job" are lost. You have lost.

You might as well put your balls in formaldehyde.



Sat, 04/21/2012 - 06:01 | 2363365 Element
Element's picture

 Remember all those 'domestic' flights 'Tyler Durden' made in Flight Club.
Now add the TSA to that mix ...
What do you get?
And let it truly slide ...

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 07:07 | 2363388 Pegasus Muse
Pegasus Muse's picture

More Department of Homeland Security Brown-Shirt Nazism and coverup.  This Need to Know show aired last night.  There is no justice in the Department of Justice.  Under Eric "I helped pardon Marc Rich" Holder, the Dept of Injustice is a Culture of Corruption.


Need to Know, April 20, 2012: Crossing the line

In partnership with the Investigative Fund of the Nation Institute, Need to Know investigates whether U.S. border patrol agents have been using excessive force in an effort to curb illegal immigration. Eight people have been killed along the border in the past two years.

One man died a short time after being beaten and tased, an event recorded by two eyewitnesses whose video is the centerpiece of the report. Both eyewitnesses say the man offered little or no resistance. One told Need to Know that she felt like she watched someone being “murdered,” and the San Diego coroner’s office classified the death as a “homicide.”

The report raises questions about accountability. Because border patrol agents are part of the Department of Homeland Security, they are not subjected to the same public scrutiny as police officers who use their weapons. It also questions whether, in the rush to secure the border, agents are being adequately trained. And it raises the question: why aren’t these cases being prosecuted? 

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:42 | 2363211 AldousHuxley
AldousHuxley's picture

utah is a state with highest porn viewership.


It is a "data center" for mormons to sort through and provide SEC lawyers the best netpornos everyday.


NSA = National Sex filter out the terrorists who terrorize american with ugly faces and bad implants.


NSA director lost all his stash in the computers which were destroyed on 9/11. They wanted to make sure the new data center would be safe from future attacks.


“It’s caught everyone’s attention for sure,” Rindlisbacher said.


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:13 | 2363187 AndTheRest
AndTheRest's picture

Correct.  Much is made of "Chinese hackers stealing intellectual property" from Western businesses in the media, but nobody seems to want to talk about the fact that the Anglosphere surveils the entire internet and has been stealing intellectual property and conducting corporate espionage on a global scale on the behalf of U.S. corporations for 50 years.


But you have to understand that the U.S. is a fascist nation with no real separation between state and corporate power to understand why military signals intelligence could be used to win contracts for U.S. companies.  "Too Big to Fail."  It's a "national security" issue, you see.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 01:00 | 2363203 The Big Ching-aso
The Big Ching-aso's picture



How much valuable data mining can they extract from burned out completely excavated already robotized human minds?  We're talking minimum 99.9999% of the population here that watch tv to get their news.

I mean what the phuck is there to mine     Let's see.............

"I got up this morning, took a shit, wiped my ass with two sheets of Charmin, and then went to work."

"I got home, took another shit, this time using three sheets of Kirkland Brand toilet paper, had dinner, and then watched American Idol and the nightly news on CBS before retiring."

Yeah, with that kinda data extraction the complete control of human-kind is but a mouse click away.


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 05:38 | 2363353 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

Smirk away, pal, but the lack of decent toilet paper played a big part in bringing down the Soviet Union. This is important crap.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 09:12 | 2363466 11b40
11b40's picture

QUALITY toilet paper!

Today, during a factory visit in Northern China, I had to rip out pages from my notebook. Thank goodness I took my briefcase with me, but I was not surprised. I learned long ago to bring my own on these excursions, but just forgot this morning. Oh yes, crapping while squatting over a slit trench is a lot of fun, too.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 07:08 | 2363390 onthesquare
onthesquare's picture

2 different brands of toilet paper?  That is very revealing.  No mention of breakfast?

This email tells says alot.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 08:46 | 2363450 goldfish1
goldfish1's picture

They mine for those with a working consciousness. The drones are chaff to the wheat.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:33 | 2363209 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Well said ATR. Well said. The scam is of staggering proportions...


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:37 | 2363212 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

NSA: No Sovereign Authority

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 03:51 | 2363308 Xkwisetly Paneful
Xkwisetly Paneful's picture

There is no system that does not end in rioting and violence either but keep pretending the largely obese leech class has it bad and if only.............. you could make the outcome different this one time.



Sat, 04/21/2012 - 08:43 | 2363445 goldfish1
goldfish1's picture

This past week, Richard Daughty said:

"...more people are getting money (160 million people) than the number of people actually working (120 million people).

And when you exclude government workers, school system workers, non-profit workers and GSE workers from the pool of "workers", you have the ugly, distortedeconomic monstrosity of only 60

million private-sector workers (20% of all Americans) supporting both themselves and 260 million citizens who do not work for profit or do not work at all (the other 80% of the population)! "

When things are this far out of balance, how can it not fall over?

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 08:59 | 2363459 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture

"There is NO system immune to the rise of its sociopathic, predator class over time. Communism, Socialism, Capitalism, or Bhuddism..."

That is absolutely not true.  Historically, we the people never had enough will or wit to figure out the corruption, but now that we can see it, we can easily construct social organizations and means of governance which are not susceptible to the whims of the sociopaths.  Of course, before we begin, we'd need to define in clear and precise terms what it is that society actually wants, and then we'd need to define precisely who is the sociopath. 

Yes, we have a lot of work to do, but there are many amongst us who have long been working on these issues.  Just because this may be the first time some are hearing of the inadequacies of the systems we have been forced to live under, does not in any way mean others have not been critical of these for the very reasons cited, and that these others have not in fact been actively engaged in research / consideration / discussions / planning about how to eliminate or at the least significantly minimize the impact of the corruptibility of social organization. 

Limit duration, eliminate self-nomination, eliminate nomination of any related party, eliminate profit from.  There is a reason the axiom exists - none of those who are worthy of leadership will choose to lead.  So you prevent those who want to lead from leading.  You prevent those who lead from selecting or nominating the successor.  You prevent people from aspiring to these positions of "authority".  You prevent people from making a career out of this role by enforcing a period term limit that cannot be overruled. 

And, you eliminate the notion that profit is something that every person should aspire to.  You thereby eliminate the notion that "authority" figures can profit from their role.  You establish criteria for selection of participants, agenda for the society at large, and assign people to perform tasks as needed, for the interest of the broader community. 

It is no different than Jury Duty, except expanded to be the mechanism by which all "officials" can be selected.  That and you establish true Democracy where everyone has a voice.  The idea of a Republic is so corrupt I cannot fathom how it was ever praised.  Some assholes decide that not everyone can have a say, and that said assholes know what's best for everyone, so they decide everything.  Who's to say that your desires will not be on that list of things to be dismissed?  Who is to prevent this mechanism from priviledging select individuals while devastating vast billions of people?

At the very least, Capitalism fails because the Republic facilitates the corruption.  At the worst, The Republic exists only because Capitalism is inherently corrupt.

There are lots of ideas in this world... take the ear plugs out and pay attention, do your own brainstorming, meet me at the big tree and we'll have the discussions. That's how life works. If you ask someone to take care of your unwanted tasks, they will take care of them in a manner that satisfies them.  If that someone is compassionate, they will tr their best to satisfy your intent.  If that someone is a dick, they will take care of your business to their self satisfaction.  That's what we need to eliminate.  No more someone.  It is every persons responsibility to participate in the running of our world. That does not mean we all hide in our house and do nothing, it means we start doing the real work of this world... communicate / cooperate / achieve.

(I don't have many answers, I have many thoughts that we can consider together, to see if they can be perfected to be implemented to produce a more harmonious civilization.  One thing is clear, the reason we end up in this messy situation is because the same people (oligarchs) have been defining the options and we have not protested "These are not choices!".)

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:13 | 2362992 bigkahuna
bigkahuna's picture

I sent that story to Drudge. He never puts on anything I send though.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 08:44 | 2363448 goldfish1
goldfish1's picture

Drudge? lol. wake up.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 22:43 | 2364312 Taint Boil
Taint Boil's picture



Drudge – you have GOT to be kidding. Shawn Hannity mentions The Drudge Report almost EVERY day on his radio show …. That should tell you something. Close ties to fox news and we all know they have an agenda.


I read Drudge every day, but its just news links and he doesn’t try to come off as real news – unlike fox news - so I’ll give him that. I take it with a grain of salt. But do get a kick out the pictures he posts – obvious bias and slant, I’m sure 98% of the K-Mart republicans don’t even click or read the article. So in the end ….. mission accomplished, LOL the sheeple have been fooled and lead as always. Check out this clip. A perfect example of the sheep being fooled.





Sat, 04/21/2012 - 02:35 | 2363268 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

It was the one fucking armed man

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:40 | 2362850 Buck Johnson
Buck Johnson's picture

They don't have enough people to sort all of it, but they do have enough to build a SQL search query function that essentially will look for what they want from the dragnet of data in the super computer center.  So for example let say that someone in one of the alphabet agencies want information about a guy named Buck Henry.  The search would be done and all the information would be put into a dosier.  it would have Buck Henry when and where he was born, everywhere he lived, his credit card accounts he had, what he bought, email accounts that where sifted from purchases of services and/or goods bought online, online search queries from the person etc. etc. etc. 

Then all of this data would be broken down into their specific categories and also times things where done etc. etc..  I'll stop here but they could do alot, and before you know it they would have a good picture of your TRUE SELF and not the face you show to the public and your family.  Also a tool like this would be real good to use to blackmail someone also, so these politicians that think this won't be used against them better watch out because someone will know what you like to do on your days off.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:29 | 2362916 DCFusor
DCFusor's picture

I think they already blackmail the pols.  What bureaucrat wouldn't think of it in the first ten seconds?  Why do you think they always get every dime they want - at a time when it's not really popular.  TSA and DHS are a joke - but never underfunded.

When you go to get a security clearance, the main thing they worry is can you be blackmailed.  If you have secrets (who doesn't?), the real issue is do you care if they become public or not.  Most people can pass through that one - our secrets aren't that secret or world-ending after all, even if we're vain enough to think so.

But any politician?  They're all dirty as can be, but also intent on it not getting out - the easiest class on earth to blackmail, that is.  Used to be handled by law enforcement making the blackmailers disappear.  But what if law enforcement IS doing the blackmail?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:11 | 2362985 john39
john39's picture

They all work with or for the bankers.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:38 | 2363129 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 10:20 | 2363537 toady
toady's picture


industry is/has collapsing/collapsed, and is replaced by 'financial services', taking over the coveted spot in the famous acronym.


It doesn't roll of the tongue like MIC though...

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 11:49 | 2363626 zanez
zanez's picture

How about 'Military-Financial-Terrorist-Complex'?

Or 'Running-Dog-Crypto-Fascist-Complex'?


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:41 | 2363215 palmereldritch
palmereldritch's picture

That is the data that controls the most.

The issuance of debt is the issuance of control.

Oh and the keep the really gullible distracted.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:19 | 2363192 AndTheRest
AndTheRest's picture

The power to access practically everything about anyone in the world is too tempting not to use.  Who wouldn't look up their friend's and family's profiles in these systems?  Then maybe some politicians?  Why not right?


After all, God is all seeing and the NSA is all seeing, so the NSA is God.  And the Roman Catholic Irish at the FBI are God's enforcers.


It could be a novel, except it's all true.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:52 | 2363226 acomfort
acomfort's picture

I don't think you give the blackmailers enough credit.  I doubt that you need to have any embarrassing secrets.  I suspect they could easily plant embarrassing stories about whomever they want to or a loved family member.   Then threaten to release it to a complicit MSM if needed.    I also suspect they don't have to threaten at all as the pols at they top know the routine.  


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 03:39 | 2363298 Island_Dweller
Island_Dweller's picture

That's right.  We confiscated your compueter and "looky here, we found kiddy porn".  No different than, "we searched your vehicle and we found this bag of marajiuana".  Also,  the troops in Iraq use this ploy and carry around spare AK-47's to plant on corpses.

This technique is as old as sin.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 07:16 | 2363394 onthesquare
onthesquare's picture

eventually then we will redefine our politicians as being low life pedifiles.  But no body will cares.  The strings become visible. 

So we are now there.  What next?  Or are we now there?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:54 | 2363058 GlenD
GlenD's picture

All done with data mining, anyone that goes specific sites will be identified accordingly and marked up, as a potential threats to their war of terror against freedom. This was known some time back by another whistleblower, so many used sweden web proxies etc to hide their tracks but US got records from swedish web proxies around 2004.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:03 | 2362974 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Don't forget ALL of TV, the newsmedia and Hollywood who's main job is to brainwash the sheep.   If you watch Tv then you enable it.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 04:08 | 2363316 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

BTW, have you heard the See-Something-Say-Something jingle?



Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:08 | 2362687 Crab Cake
Crab Cake's picture


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:27 | 2362822 LetThemEatRand
LetThemEatRand's picture

Poor guy shot himself in the back.  Four times.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:48 | 2363144 HD
HD's picture

Odd how contortionists always seem to have the highest rates of suicide...

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 03:24 | 2363292 savagegoose
savagegoose's picture

best maxwell smart voice 

"ahhh the old secret service, suicide trick."

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 10:25 | 2364674 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:13 | 2362795 Normalcy Bias
Normalcy Bias's picture

...Suicide by karate-chop to the back of his own neck?

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 09:09 | 2363453 BlankfeinDiamond
BlankfeinDiamond's picture

That's "queue"

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:20 | 2362704 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

L0L!!!  @ Lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of Slewies!!!!

i wonder what it's like to get all those greenies?

this is clonie3's first post

so, welcome?

probably the fukingPentagon jealous of spook-bot clonie from foggyBottom?

i'm having kitties, BiCheZ!


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:40 | 2362734 i-dog
i-dog's picture

I believe the correct term is 'pups'...but he/she/it fooled me, too. You should be flattered. :-)

What will your next pup be named - Slewie-the-pi-rat?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:08 | 2362785 nmewn
nmewn's picture

lol...I think the "hyphens" been popped (for all the spelling nazis).

Next he'll have to go for a one...instead of the L or some such nonsense.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:04 | 2363075 UP Forester
UP Forester's picture

Gotta be a "1" instead of the L.  "I" has already been used.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:19 | 2362908 1C3-N1N3
1C3-N1N3's picture

There yinz are! Have a greenie! Actually, keep having kitties and receive even more green(ies)!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:11 | 2362990 trying to make ...
trying to make sense of it all's picture

Wait. Which is the Slewie that called me a c*nt? I don't like that one.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:37 | 2363022 fuu
fuu's picture

Well that takes care of who slewie pissed off, it was vic.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:52 | 2362516 Unprepared
Unprepared's picture

MSM is a mirage of lies that can ruin you.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:04 | 2362558 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

I linked it this morning. Thanks for picking it up Tyler. 2361116

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:17 | 2362587 Triggernometry
Triggernometry's picture

Old news, but critical to liberty as is an informed public.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:21 | 2362602 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture

double post

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:14 | 2362695 Paul Atreides
Paul Atreides's picture

Respect Davey I watched it this morning, thanks!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:07 | 2362564 ChrisFromMorningside
ChrisFromMorningside's picture

"We know who the active denialists are – not the people who buy the lies, mind you, but the people who create the lies.  Let’s start keeping track of them now, and when the famines come, let’s make them pay.  Let’s let their houses burn.  Let’s swap their safe land for submerged islands.  Let’s force them to bear the cost of rising food prices."

Eco-fascist on Forbes:

Yep, if you are a global warming "denialist" -- in other words, if you commit Thoughtcrime by challenging the Obama administration and the academic status quo -- you are persona non grata in "the American family" (as Rahm Emmanuel likes to call it). Do not expect any conventional social or legal protections from the rest of society anymore. Prepare for land expropriation and starvation.

[sarc]Gee, even though free enterprise and free markets are under attack, I'm glad we have that paragon of liberty, Forbes, to give us to real news.[/sarc]

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:21 | 2363196 AndTheRest
AndTheRest's picture

Environmentalism is just one more tool of the modern tyrant.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 09:03 | 2363462 goldfish1
goldfish1's picture

There's environmentalism and there's environmentalism. Which are you talking about?

"...Let’s start keeping track of them now, and when the famines come, let’s make them pay.  Let’s let their houses burn..."

I'd be careful, Forbes, of giving the rubes any ideas. They may take a page from your playbook and substitue "bankers" for "environmentalists". 

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:18 | 2362802 fuu
fuu's picture

You have an extra hyphen.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:13 | 2362897 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 Well done Slewie!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:28 | 2362454 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture


The patriot act has been deemed constitutional by America’s Supreme Court – the most learned constitutional scholars. But spotty libertarian computer nerds still won’t stop whining about “national surveillance” and "the fourth amendment". These libertarian nerds and weedy anarchists were even opposed to America going after Sadam Hussein for 9/11, such is their total hatred for American values and American freedom. 


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:45 | 2362495 Beam Me Up Scotty
Beam Me Up Scotty's picture

There won't be anymore freedom.  Of that you can be sure.  Go watch the Hunger Games.  You want to see what government control could look like?  They won't even have to shove a cattle prod up your ass to make you smile about your own death.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:47 | 2362653 Father Lucifer
Father Lucifer's picture

Watch the movie "The Road" to see what the future REALLY has in store.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:47 | 2362503 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

I do wish you would put a /sarc tag at the end of your posts.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:39 | 2362737 Max Fischer
Max Fischer's picture



I agree! It's so irritating!  Is he serious today??  Is he NOT serious today??? YOU THINK WE HAVE SPECIAL ESP SKILLS!!?????  WTF!!! Even "/sarc" can be confusing.  Does /sarc mean "on" or "off"? 

I think he should write a disclaimer before the post starts... something easily understood, like "THE FOLLOWING COMMENT IS INTENDED FOR HUMOR AND SARCASM, AND SHOULD NOT BE TAKEN LITERALLY."

then, as an extra layer of clarity, perhaps Tyler can shade the entire post in a deep burgundy color. 

I'm so fucking sick of people thinking we can read minds.  The first step to changing the status quo is effective communication.  IDIOTS!

Max Fischer, Civis Mundi


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:33 | 2362807 fuu
fuu's picture

It's nice that all the members of Truth Team 6 could be in one thread.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 19:31 | 2364149 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

Det-F to you, Nancy.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:31 | 2362834 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

You should consider everything coming from MDB as satire. Just enjoy it for what it is, pointing out the absurdity by being absurd.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:40 | 2362851 RichardP
RichardP's picture

That was sarcasm, right???

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:08 | 2362978 the PTB
the PTB's picture

Try to relax.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:51 | 2362508 Ol Man
Ol Man's picture

Here is the problem, MDB.  You can't force anyone to act to their detriment for very long.  They wake pretty quickly when it starts hurting.  To enforce beyond that requires lots and lots of troops.  More than you have...

Welcome to the revoltion...


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:17 | 2362594 metastar
metastar's picture

Lacking troops, some of the tactics appear to be:

Going after one small group at a time (e.g. Raw milk, silver coin producers, etc)

Classic divide and conquer

Slowly building the infrastructure and laws to erode personal liberty and power (e.g. going after guns, FEMA camps, national control of local police, an IRS who can take your passport, NDAA, CISPA, etc...).

We have a criminal corrupt and illegitimate government which no longer represents We The People.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:49 | 2363145 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture

you forgot DESPOTIC

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:49 | 2362511 French Frog
French Frog's picture

Can't even be arsed to reply ... and no, it's not about lazyness but sometimes one doesn't even know where to start as there's so much wrong with your statement (on purpose I guess)

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:14 | 2362698 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

Cheney is that you?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:39 | 2362742 Max Fischer
Max Fischer's picture





Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:21 | 2363194 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

I laughed when I heard he got a heart transplant - couldn't happen to a nicer guy.  Our boy, Cheney, is enjoying a preview of Hell. Recovering from that surgery, if he ever really does at his age, is the easy part. You wouldn't believe the things they will do to him to make sure that heart is functioning properly and he is not rejecting it.  Believe me, the Spanish Inquisition had more mercy than a heart surgeon. The smart ones accept their fate and go quietly into that good night.    

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 08:36 | 2363439 DOT
DOT's picture

Thirty-one years of "still breathing" says you are so wrong.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 10:30 | 2363544 Things that go bump
Things that go bump's picture

You obviously weren't in your 70s when you got one.  

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 11:14 | 2363587 toady
toady's picture

What do you get a heartless bastard for Christmas?

A heart transplant!

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 08:57 | 2363455 MFL8240
MFL8240's picture

Still Cheney who is at fault after 3 years?  You liberals make me laugh!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:29 | 2362826 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

-1 for not even being a good troll.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:36 | 2362840 El Oregonian
El Oregonian's picture

Dude, can you ever get on the right side of any issue?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:42 | 2362849 Fred Garvin
Fred Garvin's picture

MDB-Please explain the connection between Saddam Hussein and 9/11

(yes I know you are just a troll, but stay in character and torture the facts a little to try and make the non-existant connection)

Go ahead, amuse us!


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:04 | 2362878 Waffen
Waffen's picture

this seems to be fitting, from the unequaled "les visible"


"Mr Apocalypse is dancing across the world’s stage like Gene Kelly. He’s singing in the rain. He’s wearing mirror shades. He’s humming an old Robert Johnson tune. He’s on his way to the crossroads to collect on some debts. It’s is a wonderful irony that those who have spent their lifetimes putting people into debt and operating off the principle of debt, are now going to find themselves very, very deeply in debt and unable to resolve it, except in a most timeless and ancient fashion.


It’s all under control and beautifully so. There’s nothing unpredictable, except for those of us, most of us, who can’t predict what is coming because; why spoil the surprise? In the meantime, that uncertainty is meant to provoke and inspire us to be better than we might have been in the process.


Keep holding the truth to be self evident and it will certainly become so, sooner or later, once it burns away the rubbish and rags that conceal it. It’s all about the right kind of desire and aspiration. This is what burns away the veils.  Some say that passionlessness is the key but that’s just another way up the mountain. You’re either climbing it or you are at the base camp arguing with the experts."

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:45 | 2363141 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture









Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:53 | 2363156 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

this is why we used to have the captcha


man oh man was what you just said hilarious!  hahahahaah good on ya!

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 03:56 | 2363310 MeelionDollerBogus
MeelionDollerBogus's picture

"The patriot act has been deemed constitutional by America’s Supreme Court"

In what case? If they faced no case over it they didn't pass a judgement on it yet.

"were even opposed to America going after Sadam Hussein for 9/11"

Iraq & Saddam Hussein had no involvement with 9/11. Everyone knows that. No one denies it today who did it. Why pretend?

"total hatred for American values and American freedom"

You mean freedom to murder brown people? Well ya, all the brown people are gonna get mad about it.


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 11:53 | 2363633 zanez
zanez's picture

"spotty libertarian computer nerds"  - classic MDB.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:16 | 2362584 lemonobrien
lemonobrien's picture

well, being daoist/buddhist, "it's all a delusion"

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:21 | 2362808 Larry Dallas
Larry Dallas's picture

Here's a trade: This guy will be dead like Breitbart inside of 90.

Does Intrade have death pool products to trade?

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 14:03 | 2363793 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:14 | 2362416 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

Actually, IT IS NEWS about Binney's door being busted down, and the FBI putting a gun to his head while he's in the shower, and the FBI associated busts of the other signers of the DoD/IG complaint --- for the only reason being they were signatories to said complaint!

I keep pretty current, and even I wasn't aware of that, dearie.

Now the item below should not be news to anyone by this time:

Ten months prior to 9/11/01, it is publicly announced the Financial Management staff (D.I.A.) at the Pentagon is undertaking a DoD-wide audit.

One day prior to 9/11/01, the comptroller of the Pentagon announces the results of that audit: $2.3 trillion unaccounted for.

Seven hours prior to the morning of 9/11/01, a last-minute email is sent out requesting the presence of all onsite and offsite Financial Management staffers to report that morning for conference (located by the Pentagon's west wall).

That morning on 9/11/01, an airliner performs some amazing aeriel feats, flying directly deadcenter into the Pentagon's west wall, killing or severely injuring almost the entire Financial Management staff from the D.I.A./DoD.

But, as many Ameritards would say, nobody would ever kill for a lousy $2 trillion ! ! !  

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:41 | 2362484 Peter Pan
Peter Pan's picture

Ah yes. And how much more has gone missing since then? Thank God Ben can make up the dfference.

Sun, 04/22/2012 - 20:36 | 2365682 NoClueSneaker
NoClueSneaker's picture

Hank Paulson generated 16 Tr. out of the thin air.  They have actually never existed - so they r not missing.

GAO Fed Audit is unfortunately an off topic, on the both sides of the pond.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 22:28 | 2363011 The Squid
The Squid's picture


I don't know what all the fuss is about. After all, we live in dangerous times. Religious fanatics want to kill innocent Americans for deluded religious reasons. Sure American foreign policy is not perfect, but that is true for most countries. President Obama has done a good job of restoring faith in America's ability to lead western nations and the rest of the world into a new age of harmony. For this, we in the west are hated. These fanatics will not stop until we are destroyed and they will happily give their lives to achieve this end. Against such determination and blind pathological hatred, drastic measures are required.


The NSA and CIA protect American civilians from external threats and threats from within. After all, when you are the greatest country on earth, there are going to be a never ending list of evils, all trying to tear you down. The NSA and CIA also collaborate with other western nations, in order to ensure the free dissemination of information and concerted approach to avoiding threats, at a global level. Through the NSA and CIA, America also identifies and forges strategic alliances with political groups in developing nations, so as to ensure the development of democracy in countries that would otherwise be subject to oppressive regimes, which has an unbelievably positive effect on the populations there. Without these agencies operating, people in America and most western countries would also be in grave danger of being infiltrated and attacked, on a grand scale.


I think that giving these organisations the tools required to do their jobs is a very small price to pay for the peace of mind they afford the citizenry. Anyone trying to compromise the operations of these organisations, would logically be scrutinised, as they could pose a threat to the security of America. Hence the visit from the FBI, in this case....


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:11 | 2363084 herewego...
herewego...'s picture

not as funny as mdb

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:52 | 2363155 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture










Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:27 | 2363200 AndTheRest
AndTheRest's picture

You talk the talk.


I smell a member of the police state.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 05:41 | 2363355 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

Would that be Barney Fife?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:17 | 2363081 essence
essence's picture

concerning your 17:14 post

Have you any supporting evidence concerning your allegation that the Financial staffers were specifically requested to meet near that portion of the pentagon?

I've read from many sources that prior to the hit, an onscene Dick Cheney was queried by an officer if the "orders still stand" and he replied "yes". Would that be the order for defenses to stand down?  Ive also read that some assistant sectary of transportation was there also and testified somewhere/sometime that he personally heard those "orders still stand" words from Cheney.

I'm also aware of the statements that the auditing section of the pentagon was where the hit was, however the thing about a meeting being called that morning ....that's new, and whoa, if true, that's huge.

More and more, everything about 9/11 reeks of false flag.

P.S. , I've also read that the NSA was created by an executive act by Pres Harry Truman. We all know about those 'executive acts' now ... don't we. Fully meant to bypass the constitution.



Sat, 04/21/2012 - 13:43 | 2363766 sgt_doom
sgt_doom's picture

It's very tiresome to respond to the same tired and tedious questions, question which could easily be answered by self-informed people (assuming you are actually a person, not a chatbot nor a paid stooge at the USCoC or N.A.M. call center),.......

It was frigging broadcast nationally, over this past 9/11/11 Tenth Anniversary weekend, on NPR, during an audio show financed, oddly enough (but then who was paying attention other than myself and a few other thinking people types) by Booz Allen.

You have any idea the number of times one is requested for a link for every banal, public domain factoid out there?  Were you perhaps just born yester-effing-day?

I have previously posted this audio from that NPR broadcasted show over 1,000 times already, sonny.

Where's the evidence.....where's your vagina? ? ?

Can you actually find your own vagina ? ? ?

 For the very last, effing, frigging time, rube, here it is, because you are incapable of finding your very own vagina, sonny.



Sat, 04/21/2012 - 02:40 | 2363270 Larry Dallas
Larry Dallas's picture

9/11 was bullshit.

I think some of the smarter Americans and those returning home from the Iraqi / Mid East war have figured it out.

There is a PBS documentary that delineates the whole deal well. Don't remember the name, but it is well done.

It's a timeless tactic: "us vs them".

Go get 'em.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:47 | 2362590 TheGardener
TheGardener's picture

New tower of babel is no news ,you are somewhat right.

Information overload , since they want all information,
they will get nothing in return, just the usual suspects
could be rounded up .But they will want and just claim evidence of any supposed wrongdoing each time you are targeted just because of want, not because of supposed science based methods or advanced data mining tea leave extraction.

Complete nonsense to scare you all off.
Not you though, ZH'ers, I suppose.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:25 | 2362612 MFL8240
MFL8240's picture

In Russia!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:45 | 2362750 kita27
kita27's picture

Except for some, your all a bunch of parroting nutcases who have very little idea how economies work in reality. You all just parrot the same propaganda spread by the Mises backers instead of the propaganda of the incumbant Keynesian backers. How about some real intellectual study and critical thinking of your own before typing your stupidity for all the  world to see.

you can start by listening to a series of 34 lectures titled 'Money and Banking- What everyone needs to know' by Professor Micheal K salemi, TTC lectures. You can rip from the pirate bay.

Very few individual minds 'if any' can understand the way the modern economy functions, except on the most fundamental of levels. I welcome people at least trying to explain it, with new terms, and ideas, not the same shit, fiat is bad, its not real money, gold is money blah blah, blah.

Fiat is wealth, physical fiat has value by its scarcity alone, not including the military and legal power that props it up. To think that this is going to change anytime soon is ludicris wishful thinking. 

oh before you all junk me,    'Down with the Fed!',  'death to fiat monetary systems!' 'Buy physical!  'Inflation is bad', 'your government is run and controlled by evil bankers who are sociopaths and only care about their own personal empires', 'deficit spending is bankrupting the country',  'credit finance is evil', we are all debt slaves',  'Death to Goldman Sachs!'

How about a Zero Hedge WORDCLOUD?  Lets see the propaganda for what it is. 

Appart from this complaint i have, this is still a great site, with great information. Unfortunately it is being hijacked by mental cases who gorge themselves on anger and bad news.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:28 | 2362821 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Anthrax...I don't know why...I just like saying it ;-)

Sooo, "Professor" Krugman what brings you out slumming tonight? card limit?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 20:43 | 2362854 Bollixed
Bollixed's picture

"Fiat is wealth, physical fiat has value by its scarcity alone,"

In theory. But try using that line with a farmer once the shit hits the fan. See how much bacon your fiat buys when people are stealing the wheelbarrows right out from underneath it.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:43 | 2363139 CoolBeans
CoolBeans's picture

Appart from this complaint i have, this is still a great site, with great information. Unfortunately it is being hijacked by mental cases who gorge themselves on anger and bad news.

You mean trolls like you who can't spell, have no idea how to use commas and quotation marks, who stutters on the space bar and can't identify contractions properly?  How about folks that post worthless commentary that doesn't even follow the story posted for comment?

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 00:02 | 2363170 engineertheeconomy
engineertheeconomy's picture

Getting a little high off the ink from your printing press ? ? ?

Amazing how you central banker types even bother to waste your time trolling when you could be figuring out new ways to torture americans and blow the limbs of innocent children

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 06:56 | 2363387 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

kita27: You've a child's mind in what I assume to be an adult body.

That anger and bad news is bringin' you down, huh babe?

You'd probably be better served reading USA Today.

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 03:59 | 2363313 Gringo Viejo
Gringo Viejo's picture

YesWeKahn: You is really not getting it.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:07 | 2362391 ZeroChance
ZeroChance's picture

Keywords, bitches!!!

or .... capture, mine, analyze, act (hellfire?) ;-)

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:05 | 2362561 optimator
optimator's picture

So, make sure your spell correctly, wouldn't want them to miss a word. 

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:22 | 2362705 TheGardener
TheGardener's picture

hellfire being cool technology at the time, but relying on a friends/foo database that seems so much out of touch as the times have changed...

Good news they still think of themselves as invincible , as
they still try to figure out intercepting advancing tanks. (Thanks but no tanks crossing the sea)

Might as well fire into the sky knowing there are stealth
aircraft somewhere as did the Serbs, downing the evil invincible thing eventually.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:09 | 2362395 ABG LINE
ABG LINE's picture

FUCK YOU NSA.. Input that into your fucking database in Utah.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:17 | 2362422 junkyardjack
junkyardjack's picture

They did.  I love you NSA, please add that to my list

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:28 | 2362614 lemonobrien
lemonobrien's picture

i got a BIG DICK and love to fuck hot chicks.... add to list please.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:56 | 2362769 kita27
kita27's picture

Good for you!  A nice simple, easy to understand sentence that makes more sense than the rest of the shit im rteading here.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:30 | 2362925 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture

i got a BIG DICK and love to fuck hot chicks.... add to list please.

Chaz Napolitano, is that you?!

Sat, 04/21/2012 - 13:55 | 2363783 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture


i got a BIG DICK and love to fuck hot chicks.... add to list please.

Chaz Napolitano, is that you?!




Sat, 04/21/2012 - 01:17 | 2363244 LouisDega
LouisDega's picture

Is that you Johnny Wadd? Is this me? Private Joker gotz ta know.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:17 | 2362426 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

The internet is patrolled by Romneybots, for your protection.

Dunno 'bout you, but I feel safer already.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:46 | 2362505 beaker
beaker's picture

Oh boy, now you're going to get them mad at all of us.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:05 | 2362683 krispkritter
krispkritter's picture

I think the entire board needs to quaff a 12 pack or 4 shots of straight scotch or a double of good red wine(aw hell, do all three) and then get back on this post and let Big Brother know how you really feel...this could get real interesting...(and we'll find out if NSA stands for 'Never Seen Again')

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 21:33 | 2362930 Ljoot
Ljoot's picture

I sopped up a 12-pack and 4 shots of Bushmills yesterday and had a dyspepsia attack today. I barf on you, nsa.


Sat, 04/21/2012 - 10:28 | 2363542 The Alarmist
The Alarmist's picture

Not me ... they know where to go to get the good stuff. Let's party, guys!

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:10 | 2362399 Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

Not a surprise.

Since "carnivor" the government has been able to spy openly and not so openly.

You want to give them fits (and probably end up with your door kicked down) include the words: ammonia nitrate, diesel fuel, nitro-methane (that one really raises flags!), and brotherhood in any email.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:39 | 2362480 mvsjcl
mvsjcl's picture


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 19:18 | 2362701 mayavision2012
mayavision2012's picture


Fri, 04/20/2012 - 18:55 | 2362668 GoodMorningMr.V...
GoodMorningMr.VanRumpoy...'s picture

Carnivore is just one packet sniffer of many in the Gov't arsenal.


Full list of every spook agency and program watching you.

More Importantly scroll to bottom for how to "Mitigate" this for those who wish to surf an on omously

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:13 | 2362406 Bunga Bunga
Bunga Bunga's picture

Every breath you take ....

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:12 | 2362408 jarrollin
jarrollin's picture

Finally someone with a level headed take on Bernanke =====>

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:13 | 2362409 Haddock
Haddock's picture

We are already living in an Orwellian State: the vast majority have nothing of interest to be discovered about themselves, so why should we care?

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:19 | 2362429 junkyardjack
junkyardjack's picture

NSA's tracking database is likely 85% porn

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:26 | 2362445 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

I can see it now. "Say there Mr. Anti-American, how about you behave lest everyone find out those bizarre fetishes of your's. Oh, and while your at it, you should really consider making a campaign contribution. No, I mean really consider it."

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 23:32 | 2363120 CoolBeans
CoolBeans's picture

Yep, even if you didn't really visit the links.

The can be manipulated and misused.

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:30 | 2362462 slewie the-pi-rat
slewie the-pi-rat's picture

Haddock your words are those of a troll but in case your are just plain naive


We’re All Branch Davidians Now

Fri, 04/20/2012 - 17:45 | 2362499 JohnG
JohnG's picture

Imposter POS.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!