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The Politicians Have To Stop Doing What They Have Done Since WWII Or "The Markets Will Do It For Them"

Tyler Durden's picture


In an interview on Bloomberg TV, RDM Financial's Ron Weiner summarizes the thing that keeps him up at night as in over thirty years he has never seen "The fate of the world economy rests so much on politicians." Pointing out the sad reality that since WWII the US has always spent more than it earns; he warns that if the politicians don't make it right, then "the markets will!" The heuristic bias to accept the spending status quo, as for most young-to-middle-aged people 'it has always been this way' - just like rising home prices (and the current hope-for-a-housing-recovery myth - which Bloomberg's Joe Brusuelas destroys in a single-chart of shadow inventory and discussion of the opacity of bank balance sheets), is so entrenched, thanks to the last sixty years or so of 'growth', that when asked 'if it is possible to cut spending', he replies "you have to!" and if it's not politically possible then once again "the market will take care of it". This brief three minute clip reminds us of the disbelief and head-in-the-sand mean-reverting bias so widespread in developed nations (citizens and politicians) and summarily dismisses it with a reminder that 'it just has to be reasonable men that we elect to do it" - and better that than let the market force their hand.


Weiner's epic (and realistic) rant is the first 2:30 followed by Joe Brusuelas' destruction of the housing market recovery myth:



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Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:33 | 2616684 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 I'm spent.  My SNAP card reaffirms that!

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:55 | 2616716 flacon
flacon's picture

But.... doesn't that mean the politicians and the Fed need to TELL THE PUBLIC THE TRUTH? I'm confused, I thought the last duty of a central banker is to tell the truth so that those "free market animal spirits" are kept tame.... /sarc

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:55 | 2616787 LowProfile
LowProfile's picture

I'm shocked this shit manages to make it onto television.

Didn't those assholes get the memo?!  Don't rock the fuckin' boat, there's still a few middle class muppets to loot!

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 03:01 | 2616947 James_Cole
James_Cole's picture

Do these "assholes" look like they actually want to rock the boat?

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 06:47 | 2617011 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Yea to minimum wage cops and judges.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:37 | 2617069 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



Or we could stop the pork spending and double the cops salaries....but then we couldn't use them as propaganda tools any's totally out of the question.


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:52 | 2617078 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Never ask of money spent,

where the spender thinks it went.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:57 | 2617082 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture



You paid how much for that again? On purpose?


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 17:11 | 2618387 negative rates
negative rates's picture

About a dollar two eighty.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:55 | 2617218 Silver Bug
Silver Bug's picture

The markets are completely saturated in debt. They can't continue on this way for much longer.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 14:27 | 2617904 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

The interviewees show a quaint belief that there is something called "the market" that will correct this for us. But the Fed buys 60+% of all debt issued by the Treasury and stuffs it under the rug, as if it doesn't exist. That's not a "market".

Until somebody pulls back the curtain on the Great Oz, we continue down the Yellow Brick Road...

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:58 | 2617079 Monedas
Monedas's picture

A steam engine has a governor .... it accounts for less than one per cent of the engine mass .... it keeps the engine from running away and scattering it's flywheel over the country side .... the governor is an aid, a safety valve and enabler of the engines main job .... converting thermal energy to mechanical energy !     A governor that consumed 50% of the output would be unthinkable !   Why do we tolerate it in our economy !  Naked corruption !   Government is at best a necessary, collective evil; which, like the fixed expenses in your private life or the mechanical inefficiencies in a machine, must be continuously kept at bay and reduced !          Monedas       1929          Comedy Jihad Efficiency Expert 

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 17:16 | 2618400 BigJim
BigJim's picture

My God, there's actually a brain in them hills!

Steam engine/governor, economy/government... nice analogy.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:33 | 2616686 Debtonation
Debtonation's picture

Is it safe for me to come out of my bomb shelter yet?

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:39 | 2616696 surf0766
surf0766's picture

No not until everyone plays and understands the game.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:18 | 2617254 Implicit simplicit
Implicit simplicit's picture

Sure! just bring an uzi, bullit proof vest, night goggles and a walkie talkie, but wear a tie.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 15:07 | 2618016 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Be sure to let the little boy that's tied up out too.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:36 | 2616692 wisefool
wisefool's picture

Romney picks herman cain for VP. Implements 9% 9% 9%. The WWII based US tax code is eliminated only 70 short years after the war.

a peacetime economy roars to life.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:59 | 2616792 LowProfile
LowProfile's picture

You mean after the whole ponzi implodes, bankers are hung, 75% of all gov't employees are fired, pensions are paid in old devalued USD terms, manufacturing is restored?

And Mittens & Co. is forced to hang his corporatist buddies out to dry, or face a military coup?

Well, yeah sure then.

Otherwise, pass the bong.  We could all use some of what you got in that bowl.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:38 | 2616850 The Navigator
The Navigator's picture

Military Coup eh?

Interesting it hasn't happened yet considering they all took the oath to uphold the constitution, to protect our country from enimies foreign and domestic, etc.

In one bloodless day, they could fire everyone in the 3 branches of government and the restart could begin.

But they (that control) all feed at the pig trough too.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 04:48 | 2616969 MillionDollarBoner_
MillionDollarBoner_'s picture


I want to float an idea to whomever will give it some consideration and invite comments. I will post this a number of times, where it seems appropriate and in an honest bid to gain some traction; so apologies in advance to any who see it more than once and is offended. If moderators object - please let me know and I'll immediately desist.

Firstly, crying like a bitch - which seems to be the main occupation of many posters - will not fix anything. It is essentially an appeal to authority and that's not going to change anything. It is playing the game the way TPTB wants you to, by their rules. So, instead of whining, how about some constructive discussion aimed at solutions?

It seems our particular (if not overall) problems have grown exponentially since 1971 when Nixon closed the gold window. Up until then, all fiat currencies were either directly or indirectly underwritten, to some extent, by gold. This is not to say that a gold-backed currency is the be-all and end-all, only that there is a "fit" between the two events; fiats going totally off the gold standard and a growing differential between the haves and have-nots. There are plenty of stats, articles and graphs which illustrate this and I trust most reading this will already be familiar.

So, cutting to the chase, how about this for a proposition? Forget gold standards. Forget outsourcing. Forget immigration. Forget race, colour, creed, status, background, political affiliation. Forget whatever bug-bear you personally are hunting. Focus on identifying a game-changer. Keep your eyes on the prize. Swallow the bile, no matter how bitter it tastes.


Remember: back then things were not nearly so bad. The little guy had a chance. If you worked hard and kept away from unsavoury characters, chances were you could "make it" and so could your kids. Not everything was on credit because you could save and afford to buy, cash on the barrelhead, once you had the money. Deposit accounts payed interest and capital formation was out of savings, not debt. Derivatives were a gleam in some moron's eye. Mortgages were helpful and property was affordable. People were generally less stressed and happier.

No doubt there have been some good laws passed since then but, for sure, there have been a lot of very bad ones too; and those bad laws enabled the bloodsuckers, cheats, liars, sociopaths and psychopaths. That's how we ended up where we are now. So, repeal all the laws, in toto, and the net result must be a plus.

Don't be partisan about this. Don't try to game it in your favour - that's what "they" expect you to do and that's why "they" always seem to win. Allow some sacred cows to be slaughtered. Take some hits "for the team". But keep your eyes on the prize.


What do you think? Too simplistic? could do with some tweaking/fleshing out? Let's hear it.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 06:12 | 2616993 RECISION
RECISION's picture

The politicians have to stop doing what they have done since WWII, or the market will do it for them.

The politician will keep doing in until they Can't do it any more. And then they will move onto the next easiest scam.  They will stop when they are stopped.  They do what they do because they can - and it works.

Stopping them will require something they can't control.

Amending the laws, or repealing them back to some arbitrary date changes nothing, or at least nothing that matters. All of that is still playing within their system - exactly like you said.  So I am left in a quandary as to why you imagine your suggestion would ever work.

You can't amend their system, because it is theirs (not yours).  You either set up a separate parallel system, or you destroy the supports of their current system.  Their laws can-not/must-not apply.  

They have already proven that they will use their position and control to change the rules whenever it suits anyway.  Heads they win, tails you lose.

At the moment, dictates from the centre spread out likes ripples into the wider community and have power and authority - that has to end.

When our current leaders speak it must in future be to an empty room, their voice on the phone must go nowhere. Then what they say, what they do is meaningless.

Our job now is to isolate them, to make them irrelevant.  There must be no chain of command, no reach and influence, no authority.

The debate needs to be about how we achieve that.  Not about changing laws, that is meaningless.

What does their power rest on, what are the mechanisms, connections and levers they control with? Those need to be subverted, distracted, disabled or destroyed. 

Let's hear your ideas about how to do that!


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 06:53 | 2617015 MillionDollarBoner_
MillionDollarBoner_'s picture

I'm not suggesting amending the laws - I am suggesting a reset back to 1971. I chose that date as it corresponds to both the closing of the gold window and the beginning of the disproportionate growth in living standards. Maybe the two are linked, maybe not but there is a definite fit.

"what are the mechanisms, connections and levers they control with? Those need to be subverted, distracted, disabled or destroyed."

The bad law is highly interconnected and self-reinforcing. Attacking one pillar/support of TPTB at a time will not work and anyone who tries it will be marginalised as criminal, crazy, extremist, terrorist, obsessionist, whatever. In order to succeed, all the supports will have to be subverted, distracted, disabled or destroyed at the same time. I don't think this can be done without a violent revolution and at least a period of anarchy. The chances of a better world emerging from that within an acceptable timeframe are severely limited - just look at Libya for a conrete and vivid example. Also look at Cambodia under Pol Pot for an example of a complete reset. When the dust settles, the chances are that the succeeding regime will simply be a different shade of the same shit we have now.

A reset back to the Rule of Law as at 1971, if enacted within the next 8 years, will be the modern equivalent of a jubilee and co-incidentally be a 50 year event. It would not require anything like the upheaval of a full and violent revolution. It could not be hijacked by special interest groups as it would be a broadly neutral event due to its wide scope.

Hopefully it could eliminate the majority of our current problems and narrow the balance of remaining issues to something manageable. It will not solve all ills but will provide a much firmer foundation to rebuild our societies for the better, with the knowledge and hindsight to ensure we don't make too many of the same mistakes.

Crucially it is easily understandable for the majority of our populations who either can't or wont understand what is being done to them. As a result, it has a much higher chance of succeeding in the face of the total, focussed and violent opposition of TPTB.


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 07:26 | 2617030 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture

I love the idea.

Make it so.

Shouldn't be too much opposition.


BTW, I have to ask: Does your MillionDollarBoner keep YOU up all night.

Or does it keep itself up all night.

I know it's keeping ME up all night just typing dumb things about it.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:07 | 2617052 RECISION
RECISION's picture

In a way i do kind of like where you are coming from with this idea.

But you can't wind the clock back - because so many things have changed as a consequence of what we are now, the whole world is different.

And harking back to some mythical golden age has been dreamed and attempted for millennia.  It has always been a miserable failure too.

Sorry, it is just unworkable.

And... of course it could, and would, be hijacked by special interest groups.

(ps. good one Sandi ;-)

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:26 | 2617102 Monedas
Monedas's picture

A "Jewbilee" ?  You got my vote !          Monedas       1929         Comedy Jihad Unofficial Spokesman For The Jewish Ether 

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:28 | 2617104 MillionDollarBoner_
MillionDollarBoner_'s picture

Hi Recision,

I didn't say it was workable. It was only intended as a straw man to stimulate debate and ideas, as opposed to the bitching and "hang/burn/jail them all" rhetoric we usually get on ZH. There does seem to be an inordinate amount of focus on the symptoms (banksters and complicit politicos) but very little on the disease (a fundamental breakdown in social structures, mores and the Rule of Law) .

Sadly I'm not hearing anything which adds to the debate or carries us any further forward.

Ho hum! 

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:07 | 2617236 Abitdodgie
Abitdodgie's picture

If we all took back our strawman the system would collapse anyway.

Mon, 07/16/2012 - 04:59 | 2619528 RECISION
RECISION's picture

Sadly I'm not hearing anything which adds to the debate or carries us any further forward.

I sympathize with your feelings on that.

We know where we are -  and more or less where we want to get to.  But how do we get from here to there?

You are right, we need to get that debate and discussion and brainstorming much more advanced than currently.  Bitching about how unfair it is and how some-one should do something is historically redundant at this point.

There is yet to be any sort of coalescing around any credible alternatives or solutions (and perhaps even any credible hypotheses - your idea not withstanding ;-).  I have put some work into that myself (re my bio).  But we are still well short of where we need to be.  So you are right at the very least about the need to dramatically evolve our argument.

I am afraid we are still at a stage where the opposition to the status-quo is fragmented over 101 different theories (including ossified debates over historical political slogans).

Until everyone swings around to my way of thinking we aren't going to get any traction...  Haha  ;-)

Although, on that note, I currently don't believe we can achieve much without effectively first burning our current systems and institutions to the ground.  Much like a snowflake growing its structure from a seed particle, if we leave parts of the old system in place, then what grows from that will be just new versions of our old problems.   Your views may differ.

I will just add finally: what will eventually cause a change will be having sufficient Mass and Momentum.  There needs to be a big enough constituency all pulling in the same direction.

Our mission (should we choose to accept it) is to build that constituency (very difficult) and decide on a direction (even more difficult).  

Congratulations though on wanting to try, making an effort, and offering up some options and creativity.

I commend you hugely for that.  :-)

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:18 | 2617160 Max Cynical
Max Cynical's picture

I think I would rather see a sunset clause placed on each and every law...say three years. And I mean everything! If a particular law is beneficial it will have to be passed again every three years and those that are not supported will simply go away.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:22 | 2617167 Max Cynical
Max Cynical's picture

A final seems to me that a mandatory sunset clause on every law would bankrupt special interests...

Wed, 08/01/2012 - 12:44 | 2617209 Turin Turambar
Turin Turambar's picture

I think I recall reading that Thomas Jefferson thought that ALL laws should expire after 20 years because people should be governed by laws that they have agreed to, not something necessarily passed by their great grandparents 80 years ago.

I'm not sure if Jefferson is an accurate source, but the idea is very appealing to me.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:47 | 2617202 Turin Turambar
Turin Turambar's picture

Nixon took the US off the so-called gold standard because of the gold outflows.  The US would've gone bankrupt because it didn't have enough gold to pay for all of the notes being redeemed.  The Bretton Woods gold standard was just a fiat based currency masquerading as a gold standard.

If you'd like to read something short and very good about a gold standard then read:

The Case for a 100 Percent Gold Dollar

by Murray N. Rothbard


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:29 | 2617266 wisefool
wisefool's picture

+100000000 It is so hard to get people to understand this. All these USA gold bugs are retarded if they can't understand this simple fact. If the gold window stayed open 6 months after that date, there would not be a single ounce of gold within the borders of the USA. They would have to travel to France, the U.K., China, and arabia to have ever got a peek at shiny in their lives. Every wedding ring made in the last 40 years would have been made of stainless steel.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:55 | 2617336 chubbar
chubbar's picture

Why is it that folks using your retort don't understand the OTHER OPTION that was presented to Nixon at the time? Revalue the fucking gold instead of having it fixed at $42/ounce? Is that so fucking hard to understand? That's all they have to do right now. Just revalue the gold high enough so that the reserves held can be used to pay off debt! See what happens when that occurs? The debt goes away and if they price it high enough, money is left over to restructure the system. Yeah, other issues are still around but how would it help if the total U.S. debt was wiped out in one fell swoop?

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 13:51 | 2617767 wisefool
wisefool's picture

It might have wiped out the debt at the time, however, there was a good chance TPTB who took the gold in exchange for the foriegn debt woud have restored terrible fuedalism/facism and the Euro savages would have eventually started hurling nukes around.

The post WWII era was basically the USA pulling the wagon, cooking the meals, breaking up the fights and at the same time proffering to the "sophisticated" types around the world who "held" our debt that we did it 'cause we did not really have anything else to do with our copious resources, that had not been bombed to rubble, in the self imposed wars the old world insisted upon. read both treaties of versallies.

The USD is the reserve currency because we have an IRS. if gold becomes the currency again in any measure, or especially the measure you offered, the dead will literally rise when people dig up corpses for wedding rings and teef.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 20:06 | 2618841 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

How would Europe go about hurling Nukes they didn't have then? France didn't have nukes until the 80's. 

Mon, 07/16/2012 - 02:44 | 2619470 bruiserND
bruiserND's picture

Why stop at 1971? Lets go all the way back to 1787

Why not go full bore for decentralization as provided in the 10th amendment ?? Dual sovreignty means that the central government was created by the states and exists at the pleasure of the people and the states. Clearly this central government and it's central bank are dismal failures by any measure.

A super majority of state governors can dump the DC globalists like a hot steaming turd and have state banks. 

This isn't experimental rocket science this is the Original Intent as explained by Dr Edwin Vieria in "The Purse and the Sword".



Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:15 | 2617153 jeffgroove102
jeffgroove102's picture

Great post! Things need to change at the horizontal level, ie how people act in relation to one another. Unfortunately, it would seem that alot of old people with bad ideas need to die off first. Change is extremely difficult, and unfortunately, contradiction is a central theme of the human condition. I work white collar jobs for big corps, and it is very disturbing to me how seemingly smart peeps will embrace the current paradigm.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 15:40 | 2618125 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Except for autists, people always join mobs of like-minded people.


The problem is that the vast majority of the people think that the United States (especially the govt) is a necessary condition of their existence-that if it fails, they will fail.


More than likely, the opposite is true. Fifty Hong Kongs, Switzerlands, Singapores and Chiles would be far better for the people.





Sun, 07/15/2012 - 16:47 | 2618318 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

I have proposed a similar idea in the past.  My twist was to stop passing ANY new laws, and start repealing laws in reverse order on the same time frame that they were passed.  It's a lot less disruptive that way and provides a glide path for accommodation.  That includes both State and Federal laws.   Of course, dealing with the States could get sticky, and I understand that.  Imagine the change when Glass-Steagal is reinstated... let alone numerous others.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 20:52 | 2618930 All Risk No Reward
All Risk No Reward's picture

End debt based money and control the quantity of sovereign money or you've done little in the big picture.

Stop the looting and start the prosecuting...  starting with treason for everyone involved with the black letter law criminal and lying Federal Reserve System Trojan Horse...

That means that at least one one 1913 law has to get repealed, too.


Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:37 | 2616693 Lost Wages
Lost Wages's picture

The fate of the world economy rests too much on politicians, but thankfully all the politicians are being replaced by bankers, so it will all work out OK.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:40 | 2616698 zero19451945
zero19451945's picture

Getting the reserve currency was the worst thing that ever happened to America.

Any country would have been stopped long ago by the markets if it were deficit spending at the levels we are now.

The only true recovery happens when we lose reserve currency status and have to live within our means again. 

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:58 | 2616727 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 You need to hop on the " HOPIUM" Train!   Petrol by the liter!

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:39 | 2616774 AurorusBorealus
AurorusBorealus's picture

Reserve currency has not caused only too much government spending, it has produced inefficiencies throughout the American economy.  Suburbia is built on cheap gasoline, the price of which in dollars, is distorted by the reserve currency.  This is a massive structural inefficiency.  There is little functioning public transportation in the United States, adding to the inefficiences.  American automobiles are large, inefficient and consume too much gasoline.  Most Americans have a pickup truck (with no practical use) or an S.U.V..  This has allowed American automobile manufacturers to overspend on production for these vehicles.  American houses are too large, which results in too much consumption of home heating fuel, electricity... all paid for with the global reserve currency.  Property is still overvalued.  School districts and local governments overspend based upon misperceptions about the true value of the property tax base that supports these projects.  Too much was spent on construction.  This bubble is burst, but the real consequences of this misallocation of resources have yet to be fully realized.  One could go on for quite some time about how the reserve currency has masked economic weakness and allowed inefficiencies to build up.  And certainly having the reserve currency has led to outsourcing and the hollowing out of the ability of Americans to make and do things for themselves.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 07:37 | 2617035 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture

All of this is too true to be good. And yet, somehow, our collective face hasn't yet hit the pavement.

I guess they built this place to last a long time. And now, it's been almost a long time.

I'm learning to grow food without spendy chemicals, and I can cook the stuff pretty well. But I don't know where the next cow is coming from, even if they'd let me grow it here in town, which they won't.

So I buy it at this little local meat market. They get some of it from little local meat producers. But most of it comes from a big multinational butcher in Omaha.

It's not easy to do it yourself when even the places we live are created to eliminate our independence.

And I'm not quite tough enough to move outta town if I don't hafta. But I'll do it in a heartbeat to save the clan.

And our useless silver is coming with us. In abundance. I know people not far from here who are so damned stupid that they'll actually accept my useless silver for half of a dead cow right now. Poor fools, don't even know it's just a metal, and not real folding cash.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:33 | 2617067 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

The biggest problem with "reserve currency" is, as Robert Triffin showed, that it results in large trade deficits. However, the trade-off is, the country which issues the reserve currency has great influence over the rest of the world. 

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 15:48 | 2618147 Anusocracy
Anusocracy's picture

Spain plundered the New World of gold and silver and undermined its own economy.


Such is the effect of having the reserve currency status.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 20:09 | 2618843 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

None of that is based on reality, and sound more like your nationalism and hatred of America seeping through. 

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 14:15 | 2617853 OpenThePodBayDoorHAL
OpenThePodBayDoorHAL's picture

"Pointing out the sad reality that since WWII the US has always spent more than it earns..."

We used to have a pretty nifty self-balancing system before 1971 that made sure these imbalances couldn't persist. If a country tried to live beyond its means, they put their gold on a boat and shipped it to a country that was managing its affairs sensibly.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:49 | 2616704 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Politicians aren't going to balance shit. They are going to steal as much as possible and then attack us with as much military force their stolen wealth can buy.

What is so hard for those idiots to see?

Time to start over again after WWIII.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:34 | 2617113 MillionDollarBoner_
MillionDollarBoner_'s picture

To be a successful politician, you only need to be able to make two simple calculations:

1) just how little can I promise and still get elected? 

2) once elected, how much of that can I renege on and still get re-elected? 

Simples ;o)

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:48 | 2616708 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Just the visual of 3 stupid fucks sitting on a lighted sound stage in 3 piece suits makes me want to go find the nearest TV set I can find and toss it crashing out of a 5 story window and watch it vaporize on a concrete pavement below...

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:07 | 2616739 wisefool
wisefool's picture

+1 We are winning. you and I are the only ones so far who got junks. But the ideas are even making it through to the MSM.

"The kids think it was always this way ... 51% vs 49%" If that aint how the tax code works junk me here too.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:00 | 2616797 francis_sawyer
francis_sawyer's picture

Look ~ I'm going to tell you right now that I was 'hoping' for a couple junks so that I could add something (which I'll add here)...

The TV discussions (with so called 'experts') only end up accomplishing one of the following two results...

#1 NOTHING (as when you have a bunch of CNBC hacks talking on a set with fucking Paul Krugman), or, a bunch of political hacks on a Sunday Morning show like 'Face the Nation'... All it ever amounts to are a bunch of self important talking heads which would be better served if they were Pez dispensers...

#2 Occasionally you'll get one person (like a Hugh Hendry, or Jim Grant, or somebody) that'll say something worth repeating... But really, all it is is a quest for a sound byte... & whatever that sound byte is, it is something that you knew intuitively all along (yet THEY get credit for saying or thinking it because they did it on the boob tube)... So it's all basically just "Contemporary American History" with professor Turgeson...

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:21 | 2616825 wisefool
wisefool's picture

Lets do this, cause Fight club sucks lately with the drive by junkers. I am not allowed to have cable TV according to the settlement agreement I have with the IRS. But I recently spent some time taking care of livestock for freinds who have it. Flipped on civilization and I found Paul Krugman has a "proper infomercial" on sattelette TV called "end this depression now" you can buy the DVDs for $149.99

I type this with Jim Cramer looking at me on the left banner ad, and knowing he'll be on my terrestrial FCC OTA anttena tonight at 03:30.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:23 | 2617261 vast-dom
vast-dom's picture

the IRS did you a favor, unconstitutional and illegal as it may be. i hope you are joking re: "settlement agreement I have with the IRS". that's some scary shit!

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 12:00 | 2617355 Overfed
Overfed's picture

When has Constitutionality and legality ever stopped the IRS? Or any other branch for that matter?

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 07:38 | 2617038 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture


makes me want to go find the nearest TV set I can find and toss it crashing out of a 5 story window and watch it vaporize on a concrete pavement below...

Classic. SCTV is ON THE AIR!

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:37 | 2617070 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

Yes. We should have all listened to, and imitated, Wendy O back in the day.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:05 | 2617230 Implicit simplicit
Implicit simplicit's picture

One of the reasons people wear suits (costumes) is to conforma to gain trust. It has the opposite affect on me, except at weddings where it may be looked at as a true costume party for fun.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:50 | 2616710 q99x2
q99x2's picture

This might keep Weiner up at night but my weiner keeps me up at night.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:01 | 2616730 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 You never cease to amaze me! Nice work!  That dysfunctional N.Y. wanabee!

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:50 | 2616712 Imminent Collapse
Imminent Collapse's picture

Politicians are owned. The owners are criminals. Can the criminals be trusted to solve these problems? No. Do they even want to solve them? Doubtful. Is this all part of their master plan? Probably. Good luck.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:31 | 2617063 spanish inquisition
spanish inquisition's picture

Yes. All you will see is a calculated change of ideology on the eve of collapse so they can get reelected while they look for a new trough of contributions. And the new term will give them time to rebuild the old stream of contributions to get back to business as usual.....

Mon, 07/16/2012 - 02:56 | 2619476 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

Politicians are owned. The owners are criminals.


In US citizenism, politicians are empowered by the consent of the governed. Voting is a US citizen middle class thing.

In US citizenism, the US citizen middle class is the king class.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:51 | 2616715 BlackholeDivestment
BlackholeDivestment's picture Read the post title and laughed. Hello Carmen Reinhart Bad News.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 22:52 | 2616719 spooz
spooz's picture

Let me know when "the market will take care of it" so I can short dollars and bonds.  I've been waiting, but the rest of the world seems more fucked up than we are. So tired of these pundits crying wolf. As if spending is a bigger problem than parasitic banksters looting our economy.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:28 | 2616836 toady
toady's picture

The 'cut taxes' vs 'cut spending' debate is getting as tired as the D vs R debate.

The only angle I haven't heard yet is 'even if you cut spending to the bone it won't make a difference', although I do hear 'even if you raise taxes it won't make a difference' all the time.

It's all starting to sound like 'blah blah blah' to me...

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:00 | 2616729 world_debt_slave
world_debt_slave's picture

The Siren song can't be overcome.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:04 | 2616733 Yen Cross
Yen Cross's picture

 From an F/X stand point. The markets will probably ( gap up) Initially. The curve has been Wednesday peak.

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:08 | 2616741 catch edge ghost
catch edge ghost's picture

market takes care of it = ctrl+p

what's the dfference anymore?

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:34 | 2616766 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

The fx market will eventually take care of Ctrl+p

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:04 | 2616802 LowProfile
LowProfile's picture

I believe you mean the phyzz and oil markets...

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:35 | 2616768 monad
monad's picture

"The insidious crime of secretly or surreptitiously altering the monetary laws of a State - than which no more dastardly or fatal blow can be dealt at its liberties - is not a new one."   A History of Monetary Crimes by Alexander Del Mar, 1899

Sat, 07/14/2012 - 23:42 | 2616778 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

The politicians aren't going to stop what they are doing until the American people get off their fat lazy asses and do something about it. Until we reach that point,if ever, the looting will continue.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:17 | 2616820 newengland
newengland's picture

Agreed. Stop the looting. Stop the tax without representation. Start the prosecuting, and jail time.

End the Fed.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 07:40 | 2617040 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture

When the bus comes to a complete stop, the citizens will just get off and wait for the next one.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 15:49 | 2618153 HungrySeagull
HungrySeagull's picture

And they are shot, mugged or robbed at the bus stop which is no longer being lit or monitored.

Wed, 07/18/2012 - 06:48 | 2627368 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture

That's all just part of the fun of public transit.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:15 | 2616817 newengland
newengland's picture

Politicians spend other people's money. Markets will 'do it'.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:15 | 2616818 JR
JR's picture

The “markets will do it for them,” is right, and it won’t be the controlled markets, it will be the supply and demand markets.

As for the politicians, “When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.” -P.J. O’Rourke

The central bankers in their greed thought they had the whole enchilada; but they didn’t get it all; they just bought as much as they could get away with. They came sooooo close, but it’s as close as they’re going to get.

“There are men regarded today as brilliant economists, who deprecate saving and recommend squandering on a national scale as the way of economic salvation; and when anyone points to what the consequences of these policies will be in the long run, they reply flippantly, as might the prodigal son of a warning father: ‘In the long run we are all dead.’ And such shallow wisecracks pass as devastating epigrams and ripest wisdom

“But the tragedy is that, on the contrary, we are already suffering the long-run consequences of the policies of the remote or recent past. Today is already the tomorrow which the bad economist yesterday urged us to ignore. The long-run consequences of some economic policies may become evident in a few months. Others may not become evident for several years. Still others may not become evident for decades. But in every case those long-run consequences are contained in the policy as surely as the hen was in the egg, the flower in the seed.” – Henry Hazlitt

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:22 | 2616824 newengland
newengland's picture


Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury
Signifying nothing.
 — Macbeth (Act 5, Scene 5, lines 17-28)


The Federal Reserve Board has excelled at one thing since its founding: demeaning the purchasing power of the USD.

Everything else it says is mere 'sound and fury'.


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:26 | 2616829 khakuda
khakuda's picture

What is toughest is that the equity market validates every idiotic move of government and gives them cover to mindlessly continue printing and spending.

Of course, that is until the day it doesn't and then we are screwed like Internet stocks, housing, Greece, etc.

The US needs a great reset to downsize government dramatically. We should start with the Fed.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:32 | 2616843 kito
kito's picture

"we have to cut!!!!"....ha ha...not gonna happen by either party.....both sides know that the 1.3 trillion dollar deficit spending is the only thing propping up the meager 1 percent growth rate....take that away and Kaboom......neither party has the guts to do the right the dems will funnel money into the economy under the guise of feeding and caring for the poor and the repubs will continue to back-door the money into the system through the guise of defending our freedom........both sides know that without it, the house of cards collapses.....

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 00:38 | 2616853 sablya
sablya's picture

What do you guys think of the Russian offer to bail out Greece?  


Three weeks ago, rumors emanating from London indicated that Russia was prepared to lend money to Greece on terms more favorable than those offered by The Troika — the European Union, the European Central Bank and the International Monetary Fund.

Although deeply concerning to the EU, it remained only a rumor. However, on July 4, Cypriot President Dimitris Christofias announced that Cyprus was seeking favorable funding from Russia on top of the bailout it had requested from the EU.

This stunning news appeared to add credibility to rumors that Russia would offer financial aid to Greece if EU help was not forthcoming.

Russia’s potential presence in EU’s waters received little comment in the mainstream media. However, it must have alarmed most European capitals, particularly Berlin. It also must have caused acute concern in London and Washington.

No longer merely a matter of money, a Russian bailout sent shark warnings to Mediterranean shores, until now a key strategic “preserve” within the Anglo-American and EU, or German, spheres of influence.

For centuries, Great Britain maneuvered adroitly to deny Russia access to warm-water ports and influence in the Mediterranean. In 1927, in negotiations to create modern Greece, the United Kingdom succeeded in retaining recently defeated Turkey as an allied barrier against Russian expansion while simultaneously excluding Russia from the Mediterranean.


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 06:57 | 2617018 Sandmann
Sandmann's picture

Russian influence is self-evident. Already more Russians than Germans visit Turkey. Greece should take Russian money - there is so much binds them - Orthodox Christianity, St Cyril, the alphabet and Moscow as The Third Rome after Constantinople. Greece would do well to trade with Russia - Turkey had a huge trade with Russia and lots of investment there.  Russia is a major European economy and it seems logical for Greece to work with Russia - after all France is building warships for Russia !

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 01:15 | 2616897 MedicalQuack
MedicalQuack's picture

Pretty close, but "it's the technology of the markets" that will take care of it.  Politicians are getting dumber all the time.  I was disgusted again this week with the vote on the total repeal of healthcare.  The folks making the laws have no clue on what it would cost for the IT infrastructure re-do for all of's prohibitive. 

So sure the markets will take care of it, but with technology, as thats' how they are where they are today, the algorithms of profit.  There are two kinds of queries written, one for "accurate" results and those that produce "desired" results and the 2 should be the same but read one day's worth of news:) 

I just flat out call our lawmakers "digital illiterates" as you can't make laws of governance in area where you don't have any comprehension.  The queries and algorithms for the "desired" results seem to be winning out with the banks and brokers as nobody's checking the math.  The guy who used Photo Shop and scanners who's got caught proves that and again glad that I read that letter here so we know that low tech crimes are still out there and we don't seem to have enough high tech intelligence to catch the big guys so we find the criminals still functioning in low tech..that's kind of scary.

The best spin on all of this though was the insurers telling the public that we are not going to change how we do business though, sounds good to the consumer, real interpretation is that "we are not going to spend all that money on revised IT infrastructure as shareholders would suffer":)

United Healthcare has been eating the government's lunch for a long time and nobody has heard that wake up call.  They are so huge with subsidiaries that nobody pays attention too that they just thrive and get a cut of the profits in almost every area, in fact they scare me a bit and the Tri-Care contract award is even scarier as it appears the lawsuit agains DOD worked and the Blue Cross subsidiary who lost says they will probably close down so if so, more pieces for United to pick up and buy.

These types of IT markets will take care of it unfortunatley. 


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 02:50 | 2616917 Solon the Destroyer
Solon the Destroyer's picture

Government knows that retiring debt would be very deflationary. All debt is perpetual to keep the Ponzi afloat. But there would not be any market for Treasury paper right now without the promise by the Fed to a serial cutting of rates. It's a bribe. Bond speculators are the only marginal purchasers left at these yields and front-running is the payoff for buying paper payable in a steadily declining currency that is a representation of even more debt. The Fed is willing to pay the bribe to keep the Ponzi sham afloat.

The problem is, every time the Fed lowers rates, it is stabbing its monstrous creation in the heart: each halving of the interest rate from the highs in the early 80s has doubled the liquidation value of the Government's debt load. 10 halvings increase the liquidation value 1024 times.

While the trillions of dollars of nominal debt is daunting, the quadrillion dollar liquidation value is utterly terrifying. Melt your brain terrifying. This liquidation value is represented in the derivatives market. When the Treasury market goes bidless, it will rip a hole in the economy that will destroy people, families and communities. The loss of the Treasury market will turn derivatives toxic, and when they too go bidless, it will rip a giant sucking wormhole in the global economy that will annihilate CENTURIES of wealth and destroy nations.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 02:48 | 2616942 Solon the Destroyer
Solon the Destroyer's picture

The Master says it better and righter. From Professor Fekete's Growth and Debt: Is there a Trade-off?:


Serial halving of the rate of interest


In this new interpretation of our formula Aa = Bb, A is the total debt contracted at an average rate of interest a, b is the current market rate, and B is the liquidation value of total debt. We see that B is inversely proportional with b. In particular, every time the rate of interest is halved, the liquidation value of the total debt is doubled. If the interest rate is halved serially by the Fed (which has happened in the past, and may happen again, as interest rates can be halved any number of times without hitting zero or going negative) then, for example, upon a ten-fold serial halving, the liquidation value of the total debt is increased more than a thousand-fold (210 = 1024). This means that trillion is promoted to quadrillion, quadrillion is promoted to quintillion, and so on, in direct consequence of the serial 10-fold halving.


Those who argue that these frightening numbers are merely ‘notional’ and, as such, they have no relevance to the real economy, do not know what they are talking about. The size of the derivatives market is fast approaching the quadrillion dollar mark (if it hasn’t already surpassed it by the time this article is published). It has been talked down by mainstream economists and the financial media saying that “there is nothing to worry about, it is notional value anyhow”. Yet that notional value was able to break the back of the mighty American banking system (along with that of the British). This is so because the total notional value of derivatives represents the liquidation value of insured bonded debt.


We can expect much greater increases in the debt of the federal government, in the trillions of dollars, but the really frightening numbers are not so much the actual increases in the outstanding debt but, rather, the increases in the liquidation value of the total debt caused by the serial halving that the monetization of the increased federal debt will necessitate.


Capacity to expand Treasury debt


Peter Orszag, the new budget director in the Obama administration has declared, as quoted by Leonhardt, that “one of the blessings of the current environment is that we have a significant capacity to expand and sell Treasury debt. If we didn’t have that, if the financial markets didn’t have confidence that we would repay that debt, we would be in even more dire straits than we are.”


The budget director is dreaming. The financial markets don’t have a shred of confidence that the U.S. government will ever repay its debt, certainly not in dollars of the same purchasing power. The Treasury paper is not being purchased by investors; it is bought by bond speculators pursuing risk-free profits. The Big Fix cowboys create unlimited demand for the bonds by holding out the carrot of risk free profits. Speculators plan to dump the paper in the lap of the Fed at the first given opportunity. They know full well that the Fed has to monetize the Treasury debt to provide the wherewithal to pay for the bailouts and stimulus packages.  Without the promise of serial cuts in interest rates the U.S. Treasury paper is unsaleable.


Real investors, foreign governments and central banks, are already sitting on mountains of paper losses due to the loss of purchasing power of the dollar in their own currency. For them, U.S. Treasury debt is a toxic asset which has no real market value because there is no real market for it. Any sizeable offer to sell will result in a swift withdrawal of all bids. U.S. government debt has grown out of proportion to economic activity. It will never be repaid, except in the dreams of the budget director.


Latter-day Moloch


The result of the bailouts and stimulus packages will be a vast expansion of government debt, and a serial halving of the rate of interest to accommodate it, followed by the escalation of the liquidation value of total debt to the quadrillion and quintillion dollar range and beyond.


Deflation will sweep through the land making prices and wages fall. The depression will surpass in severity any previously experienced. Industrial capital will continue to be destroyed along with finance capital. Pension funds will go up in smoke, unemployment will grow. Meanwhile the threat of hyper-inflation will not be removed and will continue to threaten all countries, a ‘first’ in world history. When the liquidation value of government debt reaches a certain height where Federal Reserve notes in existence will no longer be sufficient to supply the bond market with gambling chips the Fed will, Zimbabwe-style, start adding serials of zeros to the face value of its notes. You don’t have to be a rocket scientist to be able to calculate the purchasing power of Federal Reserve notes denominated in the millions. You just make a field-trip to Harare.


There is no trade-off between growth and debt. Under the regime of irredeemable currency, debt is no longer a servant. It is a Moloch, devouring its children.


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 07:43 | 2617044 Dr. Sandi
Dr. Sandi's picture

I really like what Fekete has to say.

But reading it makes my head hurt.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 17:04 | 2618371 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

Me too.  Those 2 brain cells rubbing together can generate some intense heat.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 05:03 | 2616972 Rick Blaine
Rick Blaine's picture

I tell people this all the time (i.e., we don't have a choice...we HAVE to cut spending...or we are literally going to be forced to by the market...and that is going to hurt a lot more...).

Granted, I don't actually know that for a fact...but I'm pretty damn sure that is true...based on what is happening right now in Europe...for one...

Regardless, my point here is that when I tell people this, 95% of the time (actually, it's probably higher than that) I get one of two responses:

1.  Well, you didn't care about overspending when Bush was in office!  You racist!! (or something to that effect)

2.  OK, long as we don't cut ANY spending that actually affects me personally.

After these conversations, I usually calm myself by slowly counting to ten while rubbing my temples...

I then go to my computer...

...and search for the best deals on (more) guns, ammo, and/or other firearms-related gear.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:47 | 2617203 Implicit simplicit
Implicit simplicit's picture

What we should do, what we have to do, and what were gonna do have orgied into a mutant called print as long as we can get away with it. Who would have ever thought that it could go on for sooo long?

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 05:18 | 2616977 LeBalance
LeBalance's picture

I think that what they mean to say is:

"so and so better stop this madness or the "rope and lamppost" crowd will settle it."

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 07:03 | 2617022 Ausmerican
Ausmerican's picture

Shouldn't the markets always take care of 'this'?

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:45 | 2617075 alfred b.
alfred b.'s picture


markets would take care of this...if they were "free"


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 07:58 | 2617049 Tom Green Swedish
Tom Green Swedish's picture

The markets cannot take care of it, when the government will do everything they can do "fix" the problem.  This much is evident in the USA's share of the global market.  It dropped around 10 percent Since Bush the second of the 30 year Bush Clinton Dynasty took office

I used the following government budget simulator and just clicked "change" on all the buttons where there was a decrease in spending.  Took me about 1 or 2 minutes. 

With my method in 2020 the debt will decrease to 60 percent of GDP.  I realize I am much more efficient than Congress and they are all retarded idiots who just want to get reelected but it proves "change" can be made. 

You reduced the debt to 34% of GDP in 2020, and kept it at a sustainable level through 2030.


Savings Relative to Current Law in Billions $7,670
Savings Relative to Current Policy in Billions $11,620

I ran it Current government style, which just includes rampant spending and tax cuts and here is what I got.
You failed to reduce the debt to a sustainable level. Without further changes, a fiscal crisis is likely to occur. Under the current scenario, the debt will not reach 60% of GDP by 2030. Savings Relative to Current Law in Billions $-4,150
Savings Relative to Current Policy in Billions$-200
Sun, 07/15/2012 - 08:43 | 2617073 alfred b.
alfred b.'s picture


   What's needed is an american version of 'bastille day' to strike wall St. and london!

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:08 | 2617087 bob resurrected
bob resurrected's picture

Steve Keen's idea of QE for the People would get out the vote big time. Imagine..

Fed QE for the 99%, $75k per adult

It is short, sweet and simple. KISS Bumper Sticker. Just like the News Media likes it! Politicians too. And, talk about mass appeal! Voters would force their representatives to force the Fed do this.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:12 | 2617089 Jim B
Jim B's picture

Sadly, when the ponzi collapses, capitalism will be blamed, but the real villain is corruption, crony capitalism, and corporate fascism!

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:34 | 2617114 Monedas
Monedas's picture

Anything that deviates from Capitalist orthodoxy is not Capitalism !           Monedas      1929          Comedy Jihad Anything Over One Teaspoon Of Shit In A Gallon Of Ice Cream Is Socialism

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:16 | 2617092 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

"The fate of the world economy rests so much on politicians."

This is a giant misnomer; the reason the politicans are fucking everything up, is b/c their masters (the corporations/banks), want them to. THe corporations and banks run the economy by massive price fixing via derivitives, and divide us by using the whole left/right paradigm while finger fucking our (lessening) wealth.

If real people were in charge of things, we'd fix this thing in 6 mths.

BTW< WTF does the guy mean, "because if people don't fix it, markets will".  Aren't by people?  Or are the HFT computers running the world economy?

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:33 | 2617110 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

Housing recovery? Who believes that shit?



Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:35 | 2617115 Gamma735
Gamma735's picture

You gotta be crazy, you gotta have a real need.
You gotta sleep on your toes, and when you're on the street,
You gotta be able to pick out the easy meat with your eyes closed.
And then moving in silently, down wind and out of sight,
You gotta strike when the moment is right without thinking.

And after a while, you can work on points for style.
Like the club tie, and the firm handshake,
A certain look in the eye and an easy smile.
You have to be trusted by the people that you lie to,
So that when they turn their backs on you,
You'll get the chance to put the knife in.

  -Dogs, Pink Floyd

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:37 | 2617119 slackrabbit
slackrabbit's picture

Maybe we should all do the reverse and tell everyone to increase spending.

Then hopefully it will crash sooner.

True that would be good for gold and for us, and it would be bad for them, but isn't that what they all want, money for nothing?   

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 09:58 | 2617133 Monedas
Monedas's picture

How about an Ethanol Holiday ?    Good for food prices, good for fuel prices, good for deficit reduction !        Monedas        1929        Comedy Jihad A Government As Lean, Lithe and Flexible As A Ballet Dancer Or A Sow Fucking In The Mud And Smothering It's Current Litter    

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:05 | 2617142 GreatUncle
GreatUncle's picture

Laughed my socks of governments spending "2%" more.Any connections to Keynes see I figure this Keynes came out with a way to manipulate the economy and the politicians jumped on it to keep themselves on the gravy train.

The thing is Keynes is a useful mechanism to compensate for technological efficiency not for exploitation. That would have bought humanity some time instead the politicians exploited the decades that followed.

As for politicians controlling the economy, nah they are subservient to it and manipulate it to make it look like they are. Hence got a problem in the markets, create some funny money to try and make it go away.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:43 | 2617197 Snakeeyes
Snakeeyes's picture

Yes. first of all, it really isn't Keynes at all. It was Sir John Hicks that operationalized the disaster known as Keynesian economics.

Second of all, the government is so heavily managing everything now that it will never go away

Even Eric Holder is telling banks who to lend to ... or else! And in what cities!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:47 | 2617199 haskelslocal
haskelslocal's picture

Any ZeroHedger knows the money controls the politicians. Politicians are the scapegoats.

So when this guy come in and blames it all on the "politicians" then it's all a proven charade. Nothing but distraction. Slight of hand.

It's not wrong, it's not right, it's just misleading.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 10:56 | 2617220 Vince Clortho
Vince Clortho's picture

So we just need the Puppets to start controlling the Puppet-Masters.

Good plan.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:07 | 2617234 shovelhead
shovelhead's picture

What would happen if everyone took out Chase credit cards and bought phyz gold and silver and dumped the monthly bills in the trash?

He he he.

Financial terrorism right back atcha. They have the power but we have the numbers. A credit rating won't mean shit when there is no longer any credit. Close all bank accounts and buy metals WITH FIAT and bypass the dollar. They don't make the changes, we do.

They can pass all the laws they want but if nobody complies, they become worthless. Even an army of teacups can't bail an ocean.

10 million people would be hard to chase down.

Banksters ran the old markets. The people will run the new one.


Then I woke up.


Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:59 | 2617350 Alpha Monkey
Alpha Monkey's picture

We'd probably see a rise in no-knock warrentless searches being carried out with suspected "drug dealers" having their gold confiscated.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 11:10 | 2617241 Tom Green Swedish
Tom Green Swedish's picture

If the system worked, We would not be in such a terrible position now.  The politicians don't seem to realize this.  Lets get something straight.  There will always be a top 1 percent.  But the top 1 percent should not reap ALL the benefits of the entire country.  This is particularly disturbing, when I hear about income taxes.  Of course they pay more in income taxes.  They make all the damn money.  But taxes do not stop on taxes on income.  Everything is taxed.  Somebody makeing 45,000 dollars a year paying 5,000 dollars in taxes (including income sales all orther taxes bla bla bla) is in a much different position than somebody makeing 1 million a year paying 100,000 or even 200,000 in taxes.  Which would you rather be? Making a Gross 800,000 a year or 40,000 dollars a year. Tough decision. Yet the politicians keep kissing 1 percent butt.  Yes, I agree its not fair to raise the tax to future generations making above 250,000 dollars, because the tax would not be retroactive therefore making those who never had to pay those taxes clear winners.  I am saying those people who were handed a free multi billion dollar handout by the Bush Clinton 30 year dynasty need to forfeit all their money besides 10 million dollars - More than enough for anybody to survive on.


Lets put it this way.  If you give the top 1 percent's income and distribute it to everybody else in this country evenly everybody gets a 11,000 dollar raise automatically.  If you are a politician and do not think something is wrong with the country given this statistic then you need to go find another job.  I am serious.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 12:48 | 2617542 jack stephan
jack stephan's picture

"I have only one firm belief about the American political system, and that is this: God is a Republican and Santa Claus is a Democrat.

God is an elderly, or at any rate, middle-aged, male. A stern fellow, patriarchal rather than paternal, and a great believer in rules and regulations. He holds man strictly accountable for their actions. He has little apparent concern for the material well being of others. He is politically connected, socially powerful, and holds the mortgage on everything in the world. God is difficult. God is unsentimental. It is very hard to get into God's heavenly country club.

Santa Claus is another matter. He's cute. He's non-threatening. He's always cheerful. He loves animals. He knows who's been naughty and nice, but never does anything about it. He gives every one everything they want, without a thought of quid pro quo. He works hard for charity and is famously generous to the poor.

Santa Claus is preferable to God in every way but one: there is no such thing as Santa Claus.

Pj Sunday

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 14:57 | 2617983 j8h9
j8h9's picture

Republicans 'great believers in rules and regulations'? That's hilarious. 

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 13:11 | 2617612 J U D G E M E N T
J U D G E M E N T's picture

There are only a few things that the citizenry can do right now to wrest the control back for the benefit of the entire population.


First and most importantly is the control of the currency.  It is obvious that TPTB can not and will not play a fair game with the

wealth of our nation, so we must now control it ourselves as a whole.  This will be by the voluntary use of Gold and Silver as

a medium of exchange.  You must start now to accept payment and make payments in a true form of money.  This will, if

all of us participate, wrest the control of the currency from the communistic central bank system.

"Give me control of the currency, and I care not who makes its laws"

So let us be tho ones in control.


Second, there must be a concerted effort to organize a tax revolt.  This is the most effective form of dissent available

to the people.  Believe me, if the revenue that is now being collected and used to subjugate the masses is even cut in half,

the public sector will fold like a house of cards. Their power is what "We the People" give them, and right now we are giving

them almost all of it. The repeal of all property taxes is a must in this scenario.  This must be changed to a consumption tax.

There should be no legal framework  in place to confiscate property based on the monetary system. The right to life,

liberty and property is not a debate it is the law.


Supposedly, under our current socialistic system, and it should be obvious by looking at it that it is, they will expand the

public sector on the back of the private until there is no money left in the private sector anyhow.  That, in history, has

always been the death of a socialistic system. But unfortunately, this process is very long, and it would be better for all

of us if we changed it sooner rather than later.


"The problem with socialism is you always run out of other peoples money"

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 13:12 | 2617635 ekm
ekm's picture

I don't understand why are there still people who believe that the Fed and other central banks are independent. They have never been and never will be, period.

Ron Weiner says it plainly, it's the politicians who are making decisions behind the screens, not bankers. Banks have already been subjugated to the state.

Sun, 07/15/2012 - 15:12 | 2618039 react1200
react1200's picture

FDR created value by investing in the physical economy and implemented glass steagal. Every president there after is a different story. Glass Steagal now or we will face financial genocide!! Expunge all bad debts!!

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