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Q&A On What Just Happened

Tyler Durden's picture


A full Q&A on what just happened from the WSJ's Lousie Radofsky:

The Supreme court said Congress was acting within its powers under the Constitution when it required most Americans to carry Health insurance or pay a penalty. It upheld the mandate as a tax, in an opinion by Chief Justice John Roberts.


But the justices found fault with part of the health-care law’s expansion of Medicaid, a joint federal-state insurance program for the poor. The justices made some changes to the Medicaid portion of the law.


Q: Does this mean the health overhaul law is in place for good?


A: The decision effectively upholds the law for now, but its future depends on which party controls the White House and Congress after elections in November. President Barack Obama and most Democrats consider the law a signature achievement and want to move forward implementing it. Republicans, including presumptive presidential nominee Mitt Romney, have pledged to overturn it. They say they would offer an alternative proposal but haven’t been specific about what it would include.


Q: What happens to any benefits I already get because of the law?


A: They will stay in place for now. Parents will still be able to keep their children on their insurance plans up to age 26, and Medicare recipients will keep getting discounts on prescription drugs to close a gap in coverage known as the “doughnut hole.” New levies under the law, such as the 10% tax on tanning services, also stay put.


Q: When will I see the big changes from the law?


A: Most of the mandates don’t start until 2014. That is when most Americans will be required to carry insurance or pay the penalty at issue in the Supreme Court case. The penalty will start at $95 a year or up to 1% of a person’s income, whichever is greater.


Tens of millions of Americans are expected to get insurance coverage under the system that starts in 2014. Some of the poorest Americans will become newly qualified to enroll in the federal-state Medicaid program—although the court appeared to make some changes to how that program will work. Another batch of people who earn more but still have low incomes will get tax credits to offset their insurance costs. Consumers will be able to comparison shop for policies in newly created exchanges that will operate like popular online travel websites.


Insurance companies will have to sell coverage to everyone, regardless of their medical history, and will have to restrict how much they vary premiums based on age. Companies with 50 workers or more will be required to offer insurance to their workers or pay a penalty.


Q: What if I already have insurance?


A: You may see changes to your plan. Unless your employer has “grandfathered” your insurance benefits’ structure, your plan will have to meet new regulations under the law, such as covering more preventive services without out-of-pocket costs. There has been speculation that some employers will stop offering coverage and funnel workers toward exchanges once they open, but most companies say they have no immediate plans to do that.


Q: What will happen to my insurance premiums?


A: Most consumers can expect to keep seeing increases in premiums and co-payments because the underlying cost of health care is expected to rise. The law contains a few mechanisms to curb premiums, but it also requires that many insurance providers make their benefits more generous, which will raise their cost. Older people could see their premiums go down because of the new age rating rules insurers will face. People who buy policies without the help of an employer could get a better deal by being able to shop on the exchanges, where comparing plans will be easier than before.


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Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:36 | 2568493 SilverTree
SilverTree's picture

America got fucked in the arse!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:42 | 2568553 GtownSLV
GtownSLV's picture

US Sovreign debt just exploded, how long before the 3-5 notch downgrades?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:31 | 2569053 Hype Alert
Hype Alert's picture

No problem.  We'll buy it and pay ourselves back with freshly printed Charmin in new environmently friendly green sheets.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 19:24 | 2571526 Dead Canary
Dead Canary's picture

I know. Let's join the EU and get Germany to pay. It's what all the kool kids are doing.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:37 | 2568508 who-is-john-galt
who-is-john-galt's picture

Q: Does this mean that our liberties are gone?


A: yes, yes it does.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:42 | 2568558 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

Q: Is this a right and glorious victory for our beloved leader Mao-tse Obama?

A: Of course it is.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:52 | 2568678 Nothing To See Here
Nothing To See Here's picture

Q: Does this mean the health overhaul law is in place for good?

A : Yes, because Romney will do everything in his power to win votes by promising to overturn it, and then will fart in the face of the GOP zombies who believed him once he's in the WH.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:44 | 2568580 HelluvaEngineer
HelluvaEngineer's picture

Guns are next.  Probably Dec.-Jan.  Book it.

And it doesn't matter if you elect Romney.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:22 | 2568994 CClarity
CClarity's picture

Come the GOP convention, me thinks the Grand Old Party will figure out a way to NOT have Romney as nominee.  They really won't want him for this fight.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:39 | 2569107 Debt-Penitent
Debt-Penitent's picture

From my cold, dead fingers.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:38 | 2568512 ExploitTheMarket
ExploitTheMarket's picture

So prices will continue to rise... BUT one important question was overlooked - WHAT WILL HAPPEN TO QUALITY OF CARE ???

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:41 | 2568546 CH1
CH1's picture


It will go down, of course.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:42 | 2568565 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

just get on a list for an appointment and when you get one in a couple of years you will find out....

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 20:32 | 2571718 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Re: "Affordable care" -- bullshit is affordable too, but most restaurants still won't put it on their menu(s)!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:38 | 2568514 arkel
arkel's picture

Can someone answer why gold and silver are going down?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:39 | 2568527 SilverTree
SilverTree's picture

To give us the opportunity to stack more phyz!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:41 | 2568557 ohhhhhbaaaaahhh...
ohhhhhbaaaaahhhhhhhhhmaaaaaahhhhh's picture

The price is manipulated illusion. 

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:43 | 2568579 HoofHearted
HoofHearted's picture

Because everyone just left the trading pit to go down to the LCS and get the real physical stuff instead of what is on paper. This ruling makes paper seem even more worthless, as this decision isn't worth the paper it is written on...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:38 | 2568515 Killtruck
Killtruck's picture

Does this signal the end of America?

Yes. We're fucked.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:39 | 2568520 Killtruck
Killtruck's picture

Dammit, he beat me to it. Well played.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:42 | 2568561 CH1
CH1's picture

Does this signal the end of America?

America's been over for some time now, but this will get the message across to more people.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:45 | 2568608 azzhatter
azzhatter's picture

Sometimes you're dead but you just don't know it yet

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:54 | 2568702 CrimsonAvenger
CrimsonAvenger's picture

Like Joe Piscopo's career.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:15 | 2568927 mirac
mirac's picture

just shoot me and put me out of my misery...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:34 | 2569071 Hype Alert
Hype Alert's picture

Would you want to open a business here?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:43 | 2568571 bigdumbnugly
bigdumbnugly's picture

Does this signal the end of America?

"no silly.  actually america as we knew it ended some time ago.

maybe you could think of it not as america ending but the United Socialist States of Amerika hitting full stride."

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:39 | 2568518 JackT
JackT's picture

Well, and there is!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:40 | 2568529 Ivanovich
Ivanovich's picture

I can't wait to read the full article on the cover of Pravda!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:17 | 2570079 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Pravda on the Hudson, or Pravda on the Potomac?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:40 | 2568535 johnQpublic
johnQpublic's picture

so for 1% or 1600 bucks a year i get the same coverage we had when we were paying 4k before if we now opt out of the work policy?

or is it people who work have to keep paying more to subsidize the non-woker?

or are we all paying to support an insurance system and ridiculously overpriced services for the simplest of care?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:42 | 2568570 fuu
fuu's picture

At this point the only incentive to work is for a bank.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:44 | 2569144 seek
seek's picture

1% or 1600 now. Shortly the health care lobby, arguing inflation, will have that at 10% and $16,000.

And yes, being a producer in any capacity is about to suck just that much more. So far they're not taxing assets, at least. Time to look at retirement.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:52 | 2569652 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

No, the 1% is the penalty you pay for not having health insurance. And it is purposely below what it would cost you to buy health insurance, because the feds want you to pay the penalty instead.  That way, they get the money. They could not care less whether you have insurance.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:34 | 2570513 SmittyinLA
SmittyinLA's picture

uh no, the 1% is the penalty, you pay the 1% and get nothing in return. 

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:40 | 2568538 nah
nah's picture

romeny gets elected blows a turd


accepts individual mandate

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:41 | 2568545 pleseus
pleseus's picture

Huge turning point for this country.  The USA is already broke and is going to get a lot broker a lot quicker.  I think the end will come a lot faster than anybody thinks.  Are we going to be Greece in 5 years?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:46 | 2568614 who-is-john-galt
who-is-john-galt's picture

According to my MBA Econ professor last night, we don't have to worry about paying off the US Debt.  We can just print more money to pay it off.  I promptly spit the water from my mouth, gathered my belongings and walked out.  


That's what $10K/semester will get you.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:53 | 2568694 centerline
centerline's picture

Probably the same type of professor who starts off teaching supply and demand curves based on the Dutch Tulip story.  LOL.


Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:03 | 2568805 adr
adr's picture

What I was taught in college econ about the Dutch Tulip Bubble was that the end was brought about because of excessive supply. If the Dutch government stepped in and regulated the supply, keeping it tight. The bubble could have gone forever.

Yes the professor was a disciple of Krugman. He luaghed when I said in 1998 that the growing Nasdaq bubble would explode in one of the greatest crashes in history within two to three years. I said when you have a website for fabric softener, the world has gone insane.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:01 | 2568776 WonderDawg
WonderDawg's picture

At least you had the good sense to cut your losses. Time is money.


Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:41 | 2568550 HyperLazy
HyperLazy's picture

"... expect to keep seeing increases in premiums and co-payments because the underlying cost of health care is expected to rise."

Yeah, cuz them HMO CEO's got expensive habits after all...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:44 | 2568586 g speed
g speed's picture

This won't end America it will just change it a little more--

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:45 | 2568605 fuu
fuu's picture

Q: Why is that 1,000 people can get together and get a massive group discount on car seats or strollers but 300,000,000 people get worse pricing buying in bulk?

A: ...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:54 | 2568698 CH1
CH1's picture

A = Fascist overlords.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:46 | 2568626 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

There has been speculation that some employers will stop offering coverage and funnel workers toward exchanges once they open, but most companies say they have no immediate plans to do that.


Anyone want to bet their health insurance co-pay on this !

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:57 | 2568741 adr
adr's picture

All workers will be changed to 1099 consultants forcing them to cover all costs themselves including all of the SS and medicare tax. Unemployment is going to 50%, essentially 100% since 50% are already wards of the state.

A $50k earner is about to be hit with another $15k worth of liabilities. What is left of the middle class has no chance. The transformation from the USA to the USSA is complete. You will now wait in line for bread and live in a Chinese owned neighborhood paying 20% of your government transfered wage to rent.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:49 | 2568654 centerline
centerline's picture

Just another straw on the camel's back.

Is anyone here really surprised that EVERYTHING leads to a middle-class squeeze?

This is all part of what will bring the system down and how blame will be on the people for it.  Politicians will comtinue to use "divide and conquer" to deflect the blame away from themselves.


Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:33 | 2569064 WonderDawg
WonderDawg's picture

As usual, Centerline, you're right on the money. Today is one for the history books.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:49 | 2568655 Everybodys All ...
Everybodys All American's picture

Individual liberty just died at the hands of the liberal elite just has it has all over Europe. Imagine trying to open a new business in this environment. No chance. Now imagine a current business owner faced with higher taxtion. Say good by to a couple of employees. The days of tyranny are here in spades. Unbelievable. Never hoguht I'd see this kind of bs in this country. Remember at least 25 states are against Obamacare and it could have been more. Obama got his two appointments on the Supreme Court and now we see the result.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:39 | 2569112 ITrustMyGut
ITrustMyGut's picture

roberts sided with the libs d00d

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:50 | 2568661 adr
adr's picture

So I already pay $4200 a yar for health insurance, my company pays $10k. So $14k a year for the health insurance of one employee. The blank check corroate hospital apparatus will continue unabated. $1000 5 minute checkup appointments to write a $5 prescription will be here by next year.


Higher cost for insurance per employee than actual wages FTW!!!!!!!!!

Fuck you DC.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:58 | 2568749 Oldballplayer
Oldballplayer's picture

Don't we have to check with Angela on this stuff?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 10:58 | 2568757 SmoothCoolSmoke
SmoothCoolSmoke's picture

I still wanna know why a hip replacement in the US costs $25,000but, in a brand-new state of the art hospital, from an American trained doctor, it costs $8000 in Singapore?



Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:07 | 2568848 adr
adr's picture

Scam insurance. Scam hospitals. Scam doctors. Scam politicians. Scam lawyers.

Did you really need to ask?

I want to know why it costs $250 total to see a doctor for less than 5 minutes to write a $5 prescription for antibitotics.

Oh wait, scam insurance, scam hospitals, scam doctors, etc.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 13:22 | 2569793 blindman
blindman's picture

scamophilia in a cartelocracy.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:19 | 2568964 Lord Blankcheck
Lord Blankcheck's picture

Lawyers costs,they make more on "Health Care" than Doctors

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 13:33 | 2569861 blindman
blindman's picture

the bankers and finacial sector also get a
healthy cut. see rolling stone, taibbi. mob tricks.
"Sonny is in favor of pushing drugs: "There's a lot of money in that white powder Pop." Tom legally advises Corleone to consider entering the drug business because it is the wave of the future:

Well, I say yes. There's more money potential in narcotics than anything else we're looking at. Now if we don't get into it, somebody else will. Maybe one of the Five Families, maybe all of them. Now, with the money they earn, they can buy more police and political power - then they come after us. Now we have the unions, we have the gambling, and they're the best things to have. But narcotics is a thing of the future. And if we don't get a piece of that action, we risk everything we have - I mean not now, but, uh, tenyears from now."

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:00 | 2568767 And Its Gone
And Its Gone's picture

You now have to buy (from private corporations) what the Govmt. says you need for your own good - no exeptions!  Whats next?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:05 | 2568838 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

have you got the chip implant yet? 

you get to carry yer own healthcare record with you

something the iridology lobby insisted be included...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:09 | 2568869 adr
adr's picture

Next is the mandated black box in your car. Im waiting for the automatic fine generator from Bruce Wilis's car in the Fifth Element.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:09 | 2569343 imamonkey
imamonkey's picture

I beleive progrssive insurance already implemented a program that monitors your speed, location  & whatever else they deem necessary ...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:20 | 2568966 The Duck Stops Here
The Duck Stops Here's picture

So I guess the fiscal cliff is just an oppurtunity to fill some of the gap that this will create

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:22 | 2568987 jusman
jusman's picture

Oh come on guys!  In Canada, health care is medicare and has been for many years.  And yes, sometimes the wait times are long and yes, IF you are willing to pay $25k for the BEST in hip replacement surgery you likely will get better care.  But the mess that I have understood the US system to be (courtesy of the insurance lobby and the plutocrats) is a far cry from what public health care is in many countries.  Unfortunately this is the best that could be done given the logjam that calls itself congress.  Is it better than the status quo?  Not so sure.  Certainly for the uninsured and poor - so what - they should all just drop dead?


Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:11 | 2569356 GernB
GernB's picture

So what. if the federal government doesn't use it's power to do a thing it can't be done?

So states can't solve this problem each with competing solutions so we can see what works best. Of course not, that runs in the face of the dream of a totalitarian world where everyone is a ward of the state.

If states don't do a thing private citizens through the goodness of their hearts can't? Of course not we have to force people to be charitable, better yet we have to eliminate charity and kindness, people are entitled to those things and we should force them to do them.

Why would you assume that if people were not dropping dead before Obamacare that it was a big problem that needed solving,. It was a problem that had already been solved, in some cases almost completely at the state level. What this does is transfer that power to the federal level where people now have no choice to opt out, they have no freedom of choice in the matter.

Thanks for being a chearleader for the totalitarian state and the ability of the majority to rule over the minority with an iron fist.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:14 | 2570066 jusman
jusman's picture

Appreciate the comments.  Interesting viewpoint - what needs to be centrally (federally) controlled and what should be at the state level.  Being a Quebecer within Canada, I can't say I necessarily disagree with that viewpoint, as Quebec tends towards collectivism and socialism, whereas the current federal (Harper) government seems more inclined to individualism - and forcing some neo-con viewpoints down the throats of electorates who do not necessarily agree (and very much on a regional level).  So you are quite right - as I am not a supporter of the current federal majority - and their ruling over the provincial minority.  

One of the reasons I love this site - many intelligent comments that make me think!


Thu, 06/28/2012 - 13:08 | 2569737 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

Certainly for the uninsured and poor - so what - they should all just drop dead?

The poor were already covered by Medicaid. And the working poor have been forced to pay for Medicare, whose beneficiares are the most wealthy demographic in the USA. The mandatory coverage, along with the limits on rates for older people, will only increase the degree to which the working poor are compelled to subsidize wealthy grannies.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 13:08 | 2569738 Nick Jihad
Nick Jihad's picture

Certainly for the uninsured and poor - so what - they should all just drop dead?

The poor were already covered by Medicaid. And the working poor have been forced to pay for Medicare, whose beneficiares are the most wealthy demographic in the USA. The mandatory coverage, along with the limits on rates for older people, will only increase the degree to which the working poor are compelled to subsidize wealthy grannies.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:22 | 2568989 boeing747
boeing747's picture

Bullish for Weight Watcher or Jenney Craig.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:40 | 2569121 Hype Alert
Hype Alert's picture

Nutrisystem meals will be required or you'll pay a tax.  Oh and you'll need a cell phone and transportation to meet your medical needs that are now mandated.  Identity cards will be required replacing your SSN, mandatory, rfid, on your person at all times.  Maybe even an implant, again mandatory.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:24 | 2568995 pashley1411
pashley1411's picture

To reiterate the thoughts of others, Obamacare was a transfer of power and money to bureaucrats, and a transfer of money to the health care sector.    It screws private health care insurance in the ass.   It will, soon, screw the compensation of health care providers, as one provider will rule them all.  

And, there is no indication that the corporatist Romney has an real issue with this, other than playing his election flute for the conservative sheep.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 11:37 | 2569090 WonderDawg
WonderDawg's picture

Well, Romney blazed the trail as Gov of Massachusettes, so I doubt he'll oppose it or change it if elected. He's firm in his convictions.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:03 | 2569290 imamonkey
imamonkey's picture

Jezzus H. Baldheaded - Christ

Can the system just Implode already ... ??? All this talk is boring

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:04 | 2569293 GernB
GernB's picture

So the supreme court has just ruled that through the tax code, the power of the government to take away freedom of choice and property rights is unlimited. So we no longer live in a free country.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:05 | 2569312 imamonkey
imamonkey's picture

You're still free to jerkoff - they're giving us something ...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:53 | 2569657 ljag
ljag's picture


Not really. You gotta pay for porn over the internet or even if you have 'free porn' sites, you still gotta pay the ISP. Magazines don't get it anymore....and jerkin just to be jerkin only goes so far..........

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 13:02 | 2569716 imamonkey
imamonkey's picture

Completely see your point - I guess when you divide the cost of the ISP with the other functions the internet plays, it does cost something to jack it ...   if you're going on youporn, etc ...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 12:32 | 2569520 boeing747
boeing747's picture

Give me Liberty, or give me Obamacare

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