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Ray Dalio Issues Stark Warning: Spanish Collateral Is Running Out

Tyler Durden's picture





 

Confirming what we described in detail in March, Bridgewater's Ray Dalio notes in his Daily Observations that "Spanish banks' collateral is running out in a way that could force them into an ELA." The manager of the largest hedge fund in the world - so not some self-perpetuating political mouthpiece - estimates that the Spanish banking system has only a few hundred billion euros left in eligible collateral and that some of the weaker banks are likely already getting close to a point where their collateral is exhausted. Critically, if this occurs, then Spanish banks will need to turn to its own Emergency Liquidity Assistance (ELA) program. An ELA for Spanish banks would likely be several times the size of those in place for Greece and Ireland, further fracturing the uniformity of central bank standards across the eurozone, and the magnitude of funding coming through the national central banks could accelerate rapidly. This increasing Balkanization of European central banks and funding capabilities only entrenches the impossible task of fiscal union as 'more' sovereign control transfer will be required in return for any core backstopping. Furthermore, those who are hoping for LTRO3: no collateral, no deal! Which the IMF just confirmed is a flashing red warning:

  • IMF: COLLATERAL AT ECB VULNERABLE TO DOWNGRADES, MARGIN CALLS

 

Just EUR300bn left in Spanish Collateral: Then What?

 

An ELA for Spanish banks would likely be several times the size of those in place for Greece and Ireland, further fracturing the uniformity of central bank standards across the eurozone, and the magnitude of funding coming through the national central banks could accelerate rapidly.

 

Spanish Banks' Collateral Is Running Out in a Way That Could Force Them Into an ELA

 

We estimate that the Spanish banking system only has a few hundred billion euros left in eligible collateral. That means that some of the weaker banks are likely already getting close to a point where their collateral is exhausted. (We think this reality is the reason why we are seeing a number of legal changes in Spain that look like an attempt to scrounge up a bit more capital). if Spanish banks run out of ECB collateral, then the Spanish central bank would likely need to turn on its own ELA. The potential magnitude of such an operation would dwarf the nationalized money printing to date.

 

Spanish balance sheets can probably support about €800 billion of borrowing from the ECB. Between the ECB and privately secured funding, mostly foreign interbank, Spanish banks are already borrowing about €500 billion, and if private secured funding was pulled, this borrowing and related collateral could be shifted to the ECB. So we think about the remaining capacity to borrow as the total collateral borrowing capacity (€800 billion) less what is pledged to both the ECB and private lenders (€500 billion), or about €300 billion. However, this almost certainly overstates Spanish banks' collateral cushion because there are strong banks such as BBVA and Santander that probably have ample capacity and weaker banks that are likely much closer to being tapped out.

 

The attempt to manage the imbalances among the Euroland economies is an extremely dangerous highwire act, and to the extent that monetary policies diverge to serve individual countries' needs, the further capital flows will likely go in the opposite direction.

The Balkanization of European Central Banking Continues

We think that one of the bigger risks facing the Eurosystem is the continuing division in its central banking system. Wien the euro came into existence, the individual national central banks within Europe became mostly implementers of a common ECB monetary policy. But as the European debt crisis has dragged on, the national central banks have gradually begun to conduct policies that are creating a differentiated monetary policy between core and peripheral countries (as we'll describe below). The more the national central banks create easier policy within weaker parts of the eurozone, the more they stimulate money creation in the weaker parts of Europe that will logically flow to the stronger parts -- which will only put more pressure on the currency union.

The ECB's rejection of Greek government bonds as Eurosystem-eligible collateral is the most recent example of the growing balkanization, as it will require Greek banks to again turn to their national central bank's ELA for funding, an avenue that basically allows them not to adhere to the ECB's borrowing standards. The real looming risk, however, is in Spain. Spanish bank funding needs continue to grow, system-wide ECB-eligible collateral is running low (and anecdotal signs of banks seeking to create new collateral suggest to us that some banks are probably already almost out), and there is a real chance that the Spanish banks could soon need to turn to an ELA of their own.

An ELA for Spanish banks would likely be several times the size of those in place for Greece and Ireland, further fracturing the uniformity of central bank standards across the eurozone, and the magnitude of funding coming through the national central banks could accelerate rapidly.
Recall that, like the Fed, the ECB has a hub and spoke structure, with policy directed by Frankfurt and implemented by the national central banks (NCB's). But unlike the Fed, which has been around for a very long time and is the national central bank of a single, indivisible sovereign, the ECB is still in its infancy and represents a collective of 17 countries with very different risk tolerances, incentives, and historical perspectives. And importantly, these countries are not bound very tightly in a fiscal union. The ECB charter reflects this, providing a reasonable amount of autonomy and authority to individual NCB's, which was not utilized until the debt crisis. This autonomy has recently translated into the increasing use of emergency liquidity facilities (ELAs) and lending against non-standard collateral by the NCB's. And unlike standard ECB repo lending operations, these loans are solely backstopped by the applicable NCB and, if necessary, the domestic government in that country.

This creates a two-tier monetary policy - exactly what Draghi just tried to tell us he is avoiding.

The ECB has taken some steps:

Emergency Liquidity Assistance (ELA's)
NCB's received, under the original construct of the European Central Bank, certain autonomous rights, including the ability to determine their own policies with regard to the provision of domestic liquidity. However, few central banks ever actually operated outside the Eurosystem for more than very limited purposes. This changed with the onset of the sovereign debt crisis. Several NCB's have opened ELA's, which theoretically give them the ability to unilaterally set collateral standards, terms, and haircuts for lending to the domestic banking system. The risks arising from these ELA loans are borne by the NCB's (since these transactions are "outside" the Eurosystem) and backstopped by the domestic government. The ECB has the ability to shut down these facilities with a two-thirds vote of the governing council (and we believe that the ECB is involved in the set-up and maintenance of ELA's), but technically the NCB's do not require the ECB's approval to open an ELA. Our current estimate of ELA's is €180 billion.

Non-standard collateral
In concert with the recent LTRO's, the ECB announced an expansion in eligible collateral for repo operations. The NCB's had to submit for ECB approval the non-standard collateral they would accept. However, even with the ECB's approval, the risk of loans backed by non-standard collateral is borne by the individual NCB's, not the ECB. After the second LTRO, ECB President Draghi said that €53 billion of non-standard collateral had been accepted by the ECB. We don't know if this number has changed since that time. There is potential for this number to go much higher. It should also be noted that once again we saw differentiation across the NCB's. Only seven NCB's submitted plans to allow their banks an expanded pool of eligible collateral. Most core NCB's rejected the opportunity to ease collateral standards (the exceptions being France and Austria).

 


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Fri, 07/27/2012 - 11:57 | Link to Comment TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Pftttt....give it up, Dalio. Draghi just expressed unequivocal support for doing "whatever it takes to preserve the ," while Merkel was on vaction, and announced that there is definitely going to be a ECB provided 300 billion Spanish rescue package, that will tide Spain over for a few months, coming soon.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:00 | Link to Comment camaro68ss
camaro68ss's picture

Just print some Euros, offer Batman towels for opening new savings accounts, because batman is way better then spiderman, anounce a plan to make a plan to save the country and call it a day

There, its all fixed

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:08 | Link to Comment Race Car Driver
Race Car Driver's picture

::yawns::

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:22 | Link to Comment The Monkey
The Monkey's picture

Biderman, um, has has a bad couple of days.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:30 | Link to Comment silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

Offer Binderman towels?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:51 | Link to Comment Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

SPANISH BONDS

Spanish Bonds in Andalucia
Bank parasites in the days of '09
Oh, please, leave the cajas open
all that wealth is now dead and gone
Gaping holes all over balance sheets
The black cars of the Guardia Civil
Spanish bonds dying on the bourses
Draghi's flyin in on an Airbus tonight

Spanish Bonds
Yo quiero mi dinero
Yo Lo quiero, o mi corazon
Spanish bonds
Lo quiero infinito
Yo Lo quiero, o mi corazon

Spanish weeks stretch like months, its a casino
Every bailout died, no magic pill
They sang the Euro flag
Who's gonna hold the bag
After the Euro dies, they'll be feeling ill
Collateral was looked for, went up in flashes
The Irish debt, drenched in blood
Spanish bonds shatter yield records
But my principal is gonna get nipped in the bud

Spanish Bonds
Yo quiero mi dinero
Yo Lo quiero, o mi corazon
Spanish bonds
Lo quiero infinito
Yo Lo quiero, o mi corazon

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:03 | Link to Comment ZerOhead
ZerOhead's picture

No quiero Taco Bell...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:43 | Link to Comment Hype Alert
Hype Alert's picture

All they have to do is announce the ECB will be buying raw sewage in addition to the other BS they've been buying or is it selling?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:46 | Link to Comment Osmium
Osmium's picture

Towels?  i would offer toasters.  I've seen them bithces at Wal Mart go crazy over toasters.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:11 | Link to Comment JamesBond
JamesBond's picture

we are at the stage of making a plan to save the plan

 

jb

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:59 | Link to Comment sqz
sqz's picture

@TruthInSunshine

Nice sarcasm. Just in case anyone doesn't get it, the exact opposite is the case, especially "definitely going to be a ECB provided 300 billion Spanish rescue package"...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:23 | Link to Comment 4shzl
4shzl's picture

Better still: NATO bonds!!  Yeah, baby -- backed by the full faith and credit of the U.S. taxpayer.  Timmy and Benny are working out the details as you read this . . .

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 11:55 | Link to Comment Al Huxley
Al Huxley's picture

No fucking way!  When did Spanish banks get into trouble?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 11:58 | Link to Comment Cognitive Dissonance
Cognitive Dissonance's picture

"Ray Dalio Issues Stark Warning: Spanish Collateral Is Running Already Ran Out Long Ago"

Fixed it for ya Tyler.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:16 | Link to Comment disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

You mean "there is no such thing as collateral" now and going forward. Now "buy zee gold" Ray. Ain't no thing.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:00 | Link to Comment Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Who needs collateral when Draghi has committed the ECB to printing? It can't be any worse than the crap the fed has on it's books.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:54 | Link to Comment sitenine
sitenine's picture

Yup, and I'm pretty sure Spain has plenty of unencumbered soccer players left to collateralize.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/football-legend-cristiano-ronaldo-be-used-...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:26 | Link to Comment Dr. No
Dr. No's picture

Its a bizzaro world when MBS are marked to face and gold marked at $42/oz.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:02 | Link to Comment Nussi34
Nussi34's picture

Get your "Euro? Nein Danke" Sticker on ebay!

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:14 | Link to Comment franzpick
franzpick's picture

I like the "Nein-Nein-Nein Plan" sticker.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:38 | Link to Comment TPTB_r_TBTF
TPTB_r_TBTF's picture

Euro-Nein Stickers, nein danke.

5 stickers for 3 Euro plus 2.50 for shipping, nein! nein! nein!

You are charging too much.
I'll wait for deflation to set in.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 17:22 | Link to Comment Nussi34
Nussi34's picture

I bought 5. they look really great on an S class, 2 A6 and an X3!

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:03 | Link to Comment apberusdisvet
apberusdisvet's picture

For the Rothschild/Rockefeller/Bilderberg/CFR vision of the NWO to survive, all sovereignty must be ceded to Brussels.  The current dog and pony show is merely a distraction.  The only solution is 1. subordinate all fiscal and monetary policy to the ECB.  2. All gold and public utility infrastructure must be used as collateral. 3. Print like there's no tomorrow.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:11 | Link to Comment magpie
magpie's picture

There is no gold in Europe.

Expect house to house combat in Britain with WMDs to repatriate it to North America and East Asia.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:05 | Link to Comment Haager
Haager's picture

Spain is soon to discover a new world, they can't be in trouble.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:06 | Link to Comment The trend is yo...
The trend is your friend's picture

"Margin Calls gentlemen..You know the rules of the exchange"

Trading places

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:33 | Link to Comment ZaphodBeeblebrox
ZaphodBeeblebrox's picture

"You know perfectly well we don't have 394 million dollars in cash!" Or euros or collateral . . . Oh and adjusted for insanity and inflation make that 394 billion. Best advice from the Dukes: Sell! Sell! Sell! (except your gold and silver). 

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:09 | Link to Comment Jlmadyson
Jlmadyson's picture

Vulnerable to downgrades and margin calls ain't that a B.

And another 1.2 drop in GDP next year!

Greater depression?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:10 | Link to Comment kito
kito's picture

dalio feels the u.s. is deleveraging beautifully.........heh???? i guess a bloated federal govt budget that continues to pump borrowed money into the economy to keep the gdp above -5, while soaring past 103% debt/gdp, while keeping the zombie banks afloat through a discount lending window of nearzero percent, all the while destroying the savers and distorting just about every market known to man is considered a beautiful deleveraging?????????????...........

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:16 | Link to Comment fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Kito first off allow me to brush off the red carpet for you. You are dead on correct QE is not coming. After GDP today it is obvious even to me now. But if you believe in the almighty dow, then you know at some point when QE does not come, it's gonna get slammed down. If it gets slammed down there goes your wealth effect. On top of that more people will just check out of the markets for good. How do you reconcile these things?

They can't jawbone and rumor forever. At some point these banks are gonna stamp their feet like a pissed off 2 year old and force the fed's hand.

 

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:45 | Link to Comment SwingForce
SwingForce's picture

I don't want to work, I just want to front-run the fed all day. That's all these spoiled-rotten banks wanna do- even PIMCO is busting at the seams waiting for it. And this stimulates the economy how?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:01 | Link to Comment Arius
Arius's picture

well... more money to spend on cars, airplanes, hookers, coke,... it all trickles down ....

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:06 | Link to Comment avidtango
avidtango's picture

Right - because so much economic activity (outside of stocks) has occurred after all the other Fed tricks.    If monetizing a trillion dollar deficit year after year is not QE3, 4 & 5 I don't know what is.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:34 | Link to Comment MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

That is the thing isn't it? It is happening, will happen, and cannot stop. What they say and do is two differnt things. How can you know about Li(e)bor, the Fed purchasing treasuries, blah, blah, blah, and NOT know that every back door is hanging wide open greased and ready to take those injections of liquidity right up the...uh...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:49 | Link to Comment Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

When you can tell me ho they are going to fund a 1.3 trillion dollar deficit without the fed printing then I will buy into QE is not coming. But I have a turkey sandwhich riding on it showing up. There will be some sort of cover provided for the fed, you hear the stories now. Like the drought will drive up food costs, trouble in the middle east will drive up fuel prices...blah blah blah. but they will print. They have to.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:52 | Link to Comment fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

Doc so have you abandoned the idea that the market has to drop in order for QE to happen?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:22 | Link to Comment Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

I think a market drop would be ideal, but I don't think it is a prerequisite. I think the appropriate cover will be provided for him when the time comes. If all things were equal and forces were allowed to be played out my opinion is we would have a big deflationary event followed by massive printing to catch the falling knife and then huge inflation. But all things aren't equal in these manipulated markets. Just to be clear. I think this market is way over valued and should be shorted, but I won't do it because Ben will rip your face off. I do go short at times and that is when Qe winds down, but after that I'm out.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:29 | Link to Comment Dr. No
Dr. No's picture

Congress will fail to come to a tax/budget/austerity/et al agreement (as always) and this will spook the market.  This will then set off a fear of deflation which will then cause text book bernank to start printing to "maintain target rate of inflation".

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:50 | Link to Comment Hype Alert
Hype Alert's picture

The problem is paying Cramer to have a tirade on CNBS shouldn't (note I can't say wouldn't) work this time with the DOW at 13,000+ and the S&P at 1376 and climbing.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:36 | Link to Comment RSloane
RSloane's picture

Fonz, they've been jawboning and rumoring heavily for four years. Its working in their eyes. Its their plan. They're not going to stop now regardless of how many people in the EU, specifically Spain, are out of work and have zero savings.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 14:35 | Link to Comment kito
kito's picture

qe3 may come next year, but bernanke understands the law of diminishing returns.....his hesitancy in lsap stimulus proves that.............along with his increasing rhetoric about the fiscal responsiblities of congress.......he will hold up the dow as long as possible, BUT NOT AT THE EXPENSE OF DESTROYING THE DOLLAR THROUGH PRINTING THE DOLLAR INTO CONFETTI.....................

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:47 | Link to Comment Hype Alert
Hype Alert's picture

That's about right.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:11 | Link to Comment Caggge
Caggge's picture

Just have Spain calculate their collateral the same way the banks calculate theirs. That way they can collateral nothing into something.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:06 | Link to Comment FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Their collateral is the words of the central bankers and politicians saying "Al will be well with this next plan!". That is the real collateral.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:29 | Link to Comment Sofa King Confused
Sofa King Confused's picture

The scheme is playing out just as planned.  The interest on the debt is bankrupting the countries and forcing them to take bailouts backed by their collateral. Meanwhile the banksters sit back and wait for them to default and then swoop in and scoop up their new businesses, properties, mining operations or whatever was put up as collateral.  They having been doing this in Central and South America for years.  That why some countries have started to nationalize oil, gas, gold, silver, electric, water to get them back from the evildoers.  In most cases it works out better for the populations of those countries and makes things much cheaper.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 23:52 | Link to Comment FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

I believe Goldman and J.P. and others are playing an inside game, however, not the way you do. You contradict yourself and come up with the wrong solution.

First, governments cannot formally put up private property as collateral. To do that means the government already owns the property. So, if a government comes up bankrupt, theoretically it does not give the "banksters" your home, your mining company or your bank account. IF the company is GM, has a bank bailout, etc where the government has become a propertied coowner it gets more fuzzy. What you suggest is that you need an authoritarian government such as a hard socialist or communist government to take property you say was stolen from the same government.

There is no evidence anywhere that populations are better off with state owned industries. State owned industries always produce the worst products, if any and all innovation stops at the time of nationalization or creation. If what you said was true, the Soviet Union, Cuba and Maoist China would have lead the world in prosperity and efficiency. In fact, all progress stopped at the time of the revolution. Need parts for 1950's cars? Go to Cuba.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 20:39 | Link to Comment Caggge
Caggge's picture

I agree that the collateral is central bankers and politicians words. They have no skin in the game yet they take a huge cut of the pie or they allow their friends to abuse the system for profit. The middle men who have no skin in the game need to be the ones facing austerity. Let business's say the "words" and allow them to fail if their words aren't true. If they fail because their words aren't true then put them in the crowbar motel.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:16 | Link to Comment linrom
linrom's picture

The manager of the largest hedge fund in the world - so not some self-perpetuating political mouthpiece

 

It's a good thing that his name is not Bill Gross, George Soros or Jim Chanos? Makes you wonder if have reached some kind of tradable bottom?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:17 | Link to Comment q99x2
q99x2's picture

HABIT - Hang A Banker I? T?.

Can't figure out the "I" word maybe In Time or In Town.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:17 | Link to Comment Inthemix96
Inthemix96's picture

Heres a novel plan,

1.  Shoot any and all politicians and banksters on site, no one can be spared.

2.  Problem solved.

 

Any takers?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:50 | Link to Comment TPTB_r_TBTF
TPTB_r_TBTF's picture

How is that plan "novel"?  Shooting them instead of hanging them is a "novel plan"?

And it wonT solve the problem.  After you're done, the oligarchs will still be oligarchs, and the sheeple will still be sheeple.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 14:16 | Link to Comment Inthemix96
Inthemix96's picture

Okey doke mate,

Just let them keep doing what they have always done?  Me, I would like to put a stop to the cunts.

Then again big man, I have ideas above my station.

Fuck you big man, unless you have other novel ideas on how to stop the continual rape of man kind, idiot

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 14:57 | Link to Comment TPTB_r_TBTF
TPTB_r_TBTF's picture

Well, since i am not a psychopath, my solution wonT involve killing people.  Killing people to save people, how ironic.

btw, they have your IP address...  They can locate you within a few meters.  Is your bug-out bag packed and standing by?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:19 | Link to Comment Little John
Little John's picture

Get ready for The Second Republic of Texas IPO

YEE  HAW !!!

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:42 | Link to Comment Getting Old Sucks
Getting Old Sucks's picture

You better build that fence along the border.  The U.S. border that is cause we're all planning on becoming Illegal Immigrants in the Lone Star Republic.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:47 | Link to Comment Little John
Little John's picture

Well if you’re Austrian in your economics and you want a gov that is forbidden to even gather information on it’s citizens race then Ya’ll come on. Be prepared to show a ZH cap at the border.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:22 | Link to Comment fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

I don't know about anyone else but I am extremely excited for that guy Biderman's next post. I am guessing he has a glass of scotch in one hand and a handgun in the other and slurs some stuff no one can understand.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:23 | Link to Comment fonzannoon
fonzannoon's picture

dup dup

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:28 | Link to Comment BliptoP3
BliptoP3's picture

Don't you mean "collateral" instead of collateral.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:36 | Link to Comment BliptoP3
BliptoP3's picture

I see, they're calling it non-standard collateral which, I gueass, sounds better than non-collateral collateral, but still not as good as "collateral".

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:43 | Link to Comment Possible Impact
Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:40 | Link to Comment Joebloinvestor
Joebloinvestor's picture

This shit always waits till the weekend.

The only way of knowing if something has really happened (either positive or negative) is on monday when someone goes to the bank and the doors are closed.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:45 | Link to Comment AssFire
Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:58 | Link to Comment TPTB_r_TBTF
TPTB_r_TBTF's picture

oh, oh, that divergence shows that the number of messies in the US has increased.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:56 | Link to Comment americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

My friends in Spain of all ages are telling me that the talk in the cafes is that Spanish sovereignty is non-negotiable and that any politicians or bankers who try to do so will find themselves assassinated. Those here who consider ZH a fight club know that you never put an opponent in a position where they have nothing left to lose. There are hundreds of thousands, even millions, of both young and old Spanish people who are just about there, and politicians and bankers in Spain are not protected by the layers upon layers of weapons and systems that American politicians and bankers have erected around themselves. They walk down the streets, still, many with no bodyguards. This thing can turn overnight. Also keep in mind that the EU-mandated 'austerity' is taking away the financial lives of thousands of people on the inside of the system, who become natural allies of any revolutionary movement. And finally, let's not forget the role of women in the Spanish Civil War - those Spanish women are natural born killers.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:06 | Link to Comment Arius
Arius's picture

what does sovereignty means these days ???  Please ....

take a look at those vidoes showing world maps covering couple of thousands of years ... everything changes all the time... and we are at that very precipe right now ...

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:20 | Link to Comment FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

I am liking Spain more all the time. I was looking at the rampant and growing political corruption in the USA and wondering what it takes to remove an entrenched elitist political class. For now, we still believe in elections but Obama and his allies are even corrupting those.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:24 | Link to Comment TPTB_r_TBTF
TPTB_r_TBTF's picture

The Spanish of all ages are not the ones at the negotiating table.  Once the Spanish accept the bailout terms dictacted to them, then they can go back to hanging out in cafes all day (aside from their siestas). 

But if they prefer to die for something called "sovereignty", TPTB will oblige them.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:26 | Link to Comment Herbert
Herbert's picture

@americanspirit: If Germany eventually tigthens the purse strings, demonstrating in Spain doesn't seem to make much sense. Murdering politicans or bankers is useless if there is no money left.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 17:27 | Link to Comment americanspirit
americanspirit's picture

Hi Herbert - demonstrating doesn't make much sense, you're right. But making object lessons of the aristocratic rich seemed to work pretty well in the French revolution, at least for a while. And then, there is a certain satisfaction to seeing those who are the direct or proximal cause of your suffering suffer as well.

As for there being no money left - when I've lived in Spain bartering was a lively game played by nearly everyone even when money was plentiful. It's a way to avoid being inside the system. And finally, what money are we talking about - those colorful little pieces of Euro-paper?

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 12:58 | Link to Comment bluestone
bluestone's picture

So what?  These people will do what they want to do, without regard to rules, laws, or reason.  They just do what they want.  Sometimes they find a thin justification, but often they don't.  Thus the saying: laws are made to be broken.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:02 | Link to Comment SmittyinLA
SmittyinLA's picture

No problemo, the banks and state will just steal directly from the people.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:05 | Link to Comment CVfriendship
CVfriendship's picture

Alright, so Ray Dalio manages billions...pretty neat, and congrats.  If he's trading on this, he's probably betting on......negative yields for US on the front end of the curve?  Liquid and quiet... OR. He's parking money in the dollar, that's hedged to the friggin nines. OR...he's done being a billionaire working all the time, and is going to sell the thing soon, and he's in cash.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:08 | Link to Comment JamesBond
JamesBond's picture

its all like a surreal Dali painting.  bring on the mating rhinoceroses.

 

-007

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:16 | Link to Comment No One
No One's picture

You say tomato, I say Peseta

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:24 | Link to Comment Seize Mars
Seize Mars's picture

For all the guys who keep saying "just print already," I'm not sure you understand.

First, I don't care what any of the central banks say, they "print" all the time. There has been QE all along in the US. There is printing in Europe right now. I don't care what they say, it's true.

When people honestly think that inflation is a cure for problems, I don't know what to say: are you insane? Printing means a reversion to the Medieval. It means poverty. It means centralized control over EVERYTHING.

Print = bad.

Honest, real collapse = healthy.

Of all the poeple who should know better, Europeans should have it fixed in their minds: inflation is BAD. Inflation goes hand in hand with death, war, central planning, poverty and hunger.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:47 | Link to Comment MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Seize them Mars!

Jeeezus, folks they are criminals, don't you get it!!!! Anything you can think of that they can do they are doing it. They will print and deposit at will. Help me with the list that shows they are criminals, I will get it started:

1. The Fed is buying Treasuries via PDs. This is the equivalent of check kiting. 

2. Li(e)bor was rigged, and most knew it. Timmah knew it.

3. Most of the countries in the EU/Euro currency had help lying on their books so that they could get in. 

4. Subprime lending, need I say more? Rigged to skim fees and hand off bad collateral to create investment vehichles destined to be empty bags of shit promises and no more.

5. Changing the rules so that they don't have to mark their assets to market, they are permitted to hold and mark to model. WTF????

6. Big brokerage firms are commingling funds and they are becoming "vaporized" as in STOLEN.

Come on folks help me out here, keep this list rolling. I beg you. They are all criminals, don't you get it? They are doing any and everything they can think of. You sit here trying to guess if QE 3 will happen or not. Do you see what I am saying? They are sooooo beyond this with their criminal behavior.

 

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:48 | Link to Comment One Ton Lady
One Ton Lady's picture

Do you really think a total collapse will be healthy?  I ask the question merely for purposes of discussion. When this does happen and it will, people of this generation will see hell on earth.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:40 | Link to Comment One Ton Lady
One Ton Lady's picture

I noticed Pollock put out another interesting video on youtube about the slow motion train wreck , people of this generation are witnessing. Sad really. So sad. To watch as this country dies and nobody does a thing about it.   I noticed a woman in Houston , earlier this week, pulled a gun on a meter installer and told him to get off of her property. The light company was attempting to install one of those new and dangerous smart meters and she wasn't having any of it. Good for her.  In respect to that , I would have to say, where are all of the strong men in this country? Where are you?  Is it going to take strong women to stop what is happening ?  The men in this country are wimps and pussies.

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 13:50 | Link to Comment MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Don't pay the debt, it is not legitimate. It was all hatched on criminal behavior.

Done.

Sat, 07/28/2012 - 22:11 | Link to Comment Paracelsus
Paracelsus's picture

If I read between the lines correctly,we had a one off chance  in 2008 to fix this stuff (sorta).Kicked the can instead.I see the US breaking apart.First state will get thrashed to be made an example out of.Full on reset coming.Now I see why those gate-guarded communities are so popular, pull up the drawbridge,what,what.... 

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