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Ron Paul Takes Lead In Iowa

Tyler Durden's picture




 

When we learned on Saturday that the Des Moines Register, owned by Gannett - whose Chairman just happens to be a Private Equity firm head, and worked at Citigroup for most of her career, has endorsed Mitt Romney for president we said that this development "while likely set to provide a very short-term boost to Romney's chances, it is the baseless ongoing accusations against Ron Paul that will likely solidify the groundswell behind the Texan, with such desperate platitudes as "Ron Paul's libertarian ideology would lead to economic chaos and isolationism, neither of which this nation can afford." As it turns out, according to the latest Public Policy Polling data we can skip the kneejerk reaction and go straight to the after effect, because as of the latest polling, Ron Paul has finally taken the lead in Iowa. Granted this is just one of many polling organizations, and potentially it may be biased, but the bottom line is that often time reality (objective and subjective) is self-reinforcing. And when the US public realizes that the only candidate who deserves to be in the White House has a running chance, they will flock to him. Suddenly backing Ron Paul may just become the next cool thing. As for the Gingrich "honeymoon", it was over well before the nth divorce (pardon the pun). At this point we can only hope that the electoral game of reverse American Idol where the poll head is voted off in a week or so stops with Paul. However, with Perry, Bachmann, Romney and Gingrich already having been voted off, the only possible dark horse now remains Huntsman - does he have a running chance against Paul?

From the PPP:

Newt Gingrich's campaign is rapidly imploding, and Ron Paul has now taken the lead in Iowa.  He's at 23% to 20% for Mitt Romney, 14% for Gingrich, 10% each for Rick Santorum, Michele Bachmann, and Rick Perry, 4% for Jon Huntsman, and 2% for Gary Johnson.

 

Gingrich has now seen a big drop in his Iowa standing two weeks in a row.  His share of the vote has gone from 27% to 22% to 14%.  And there's been a large drop in his personal favorability numbers as well from +31 (62/31) to +12 (52/40) to now -1 (46/47). Negative ads over the last few weeks have really chipped away at Gingrich's image as being a strong conservative- now only 36% of voters believe that he has 'strong principles,' while 43% think he does not.

 

Paul's ascendancy is a sign that perhaps campaigns do matter at least a little, in a year where there has been a lot of discussion about whether they still do in Iowa.  22% of voters think he's run the best campaign in the state compared to only 8% for Gingrich and 5% for Romney. The only other candidate to hit double digits on that question is Bachmann at 19%. Paul also leads Romney 26-5 (with Gingrich at 13%) with the 22% of voters who say it's 'very important' that a candidate spends a lot of time in Iowa.  Finally Paul leads Romney 29-19 among the 26% of likely voters who have seen one of the candidates in person.

 

Paul's base of support continues to rely on some unusual groups for a Republican contest.  Among voters under 45 he's at 33% to 16% for Romney and 11% for Gingrich.  He's really going to need that younger than normal electorate because with seniors Romney's blowing him out 31-15 with Gingrich coming in 2nd at 18%. Paul is also cleaning up 35-14 with the 24% of voters who identify as either Democrats or independents. Romney is actually ahead 22-19 with GOP voters.  Young people and non-Republicans are an unusual coalition to hang your hat on in Iowa, and it will be interesting to see if Paul can actually pull it off.

 

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Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:34 | 1994334 kato
kato's picture

rotating nut jobs

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:37 | 1994347 fuu
fuu's picture

RON PAUL

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:41 | 1994370 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

Who?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:46 | 1994391 fuu
fuu's picture

RON PAUL!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:48 | 1994401 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Wwwwwwhaatt????

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:49 | 1994408 Killtruck
Killtruck's picture

Okkaaaaaaayyyyyyyy!!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:02 | 1994464 goldfreak
goldfreak's picture

GO RON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:04 | 1994476 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Yeeaaaahhhh!!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:14 | 1994512 Bananamerican
Bananamerican's picture

me?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:16 | 1994523 Xkwisetly Paneful
Xkwisetly Paneful's picture

How long has the guy been a federal politician and how many pieces of legislature has he gotten passed actually limiting the power of the federal government.

 

I think a  long time and ZERO are the answers but I am not sure.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:20 | 1994538 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

If Congress weren't a bunch of fascist asshats then maybe he would have had legislature that would have been made into law.  Unfortunately, Congress is paid of by K Street whores with corporate agendas and do not agree with Paul about funding wars like Iraq and Af/Pak, etc.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:23 | 1994555 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

Did you know that over 500 children die in firearm accidents every year? Support the progrEssivE rEvolution and end dangerous firearm sales with global legislation. What's your excuse?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:15 | 1994752 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

<-- Government is too large

<-- Government is too small

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:47 | 1994907 Rossalgondamer
Rossalgondamer's picture

C) Govern Oneself.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:22 | 1995010 whstlblwr
whstlblwr's picture

South Carolina primary Jan. 21, talk to your friends in South Carolina to vote for Ron Paul, think deadline for registration is Dec. 21.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:33 | 1995066 wanklord
wanklord's picture

By appealing to tons of bullshit about the Constitution and other patriotic crap, Congressman Ron Paul is able to seduce his brute and ignorant constituency while doing nothing at all in Congress (a clever way to make easy money). He is just part of the establishment while behaving like a "genuine patriot." Dr. Paul is also a mediocre version of one of Leo Strauss' categories of society: the Gentlemen

The gentlemen, are lovers of honour and glory. They are the most ingratiating towards the conventions of their society – that is, the illusions of the cave. They are true believers in God, honour, and moral imperatives. They are ready and willing to embark on acts of great courage and self-sacrifice at a moment's notice.

Besides that, Americans are a bunch of stupid animals easy to manipulate and subdue. In the end, Ron Paul is just another political scam designed to keep entertained these mules.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:42 | 1995095 whstlblwr
whstlblwr's picture

Sorry, didn't read above post, so not reply to you.

Here is response on other blog from criticism of Ron Paul racism.

"I could help but notice that you only provide one side of Ron Paul's associations. Dr. Paul has been very close friends with the great Jewish economists Murray Sabrin, Walter Block. He knew Milton Friedman. He is friends with the noted African American economist Walter Williams. Its possible that he has received contributions from hate groups, but so what? Ron Paul stands for freedom or speech (no matter how vile) and states rights, which may coincide with these horrible groups. But does that mean Ron Paul pushes hate legislation? No, and these groups don't expect that. Contrast that to our current President. He has received contributions from Wall Street and Unions and government dependent groups and he has sold out the country and done their bidding. I would argue that is much more vile than receiving a piddling amount of money from a white supremacist.

BTW: Everyone show your support for Jay Leno. Let's get his rating up

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:44 | 1995118 Totin
Totin's picture

Copy and paste

Copy and paste

Copy and paste

Copy and paste

Wow Wanklord! This really is fun. I think I got it! Thanks!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 22:23 | 1996308 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Totin, observing wanklord's pattern, accurately noted:

Copy and paste [ad infinitum]

You've noticed him too, huh? As far as I recall, this is the first time I've seen him use this particular screed. Usually it's the one where he erroneously refers to "dirty bombs" as controlled nuclear explosions. This has been pointed out to him with no effect, which indicates that he doesn't bother to read any follow up comments. With rare and trivial exceptions, his comments are prepared ahead of time and then copied and pasted wherever he thinks it's at least marginally relevant.

Articles about Ron Paul seem to be one of his big triggers, especially if the article illustrates Ron Paul's growing recognition among frustrated and angry voters. If wanklord is a paid shill or astroturfer, his employer is getting ripped off and must be rather dimwitted as well.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 23:23 | 1996439 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

"Water Army" troops are everywhere -- fortunately, they're easy to spot, due to the concave skull on top of their shoulders.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:14 | 1995250 sullymandias
sullymandias's picture

It seems that Ron Paul leading in this poll has really struck a nerve..

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:23 | 1995574 JeffB
JeffB's picture

I do have to give you props for your honesty in picking out your username.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 22:50 | 1996375 outofhere
outofhere's picture

he could do me a favor and get the 'wank' out of here.  GO RP!!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:31 | 1994587 eureka
eureka's picture

Why is it so unthinkable - to the MM.PTB - that US should not be an Empire?  Because they make their "living" by leverage and lies. To the rest of the population Libertarianism seems increasingly exciting.

RE Huntsman - nice, diplomatic, academic, boring.  US isn't there.

Conclusion:  Believe in Ron.  He can win.  Spread the excitement.

Freedom could come to the US. If you work for it.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:31 | 1994588 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Guns should be out of reach of young children, and when the child is old enough to fire one, the parent should teach the child gun safety. 

Criminals will always have guns.  We need guns too.  Look at the London riots; if the store owners had had guns, that riot would not have lasted the day.  Instead it lasted several.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:46 | 1994639 MillionDollarBonus_
MillionDollarBonus_'s picture

The riots would not have occurred in the first place if the UK government had provided more welfare and job opportunities - the UK government is cutting spending too much and too fast, which is undermining their economy. Letting the public carry firearms is simply too dangerous, and the world is waking up to this.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:54 | 1994671 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

"Letting the public..."

So who knows best?  The government?  Right....

"[M]ore welfare and job opportunities...."

If you make adults suck from the government's tit their whole lives, they don't really become adults.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:10 | 1994739 r101958
r101958's picture

Exactly! And this little tidbit:

'Paul's ascendancy is a sign that perhaps campaigns do matter at least a little'

Riiiiggght! How about this instead 'Paul's ascendancy is a sign that perhaps integrity and policy stances do matter, a lot'. Sheeesh!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:03 | 1994719 CptAwesome
CptAwesome's picture

Imagine we would all be servants of the queen had our fore fathers thought the way you do. Keep people weak and unable to protect themselves that's a brilliant idea! If you prefer living in a progressive dictatorship there are plenty out there you can move to and leave us redneck freedom loving red blooded american's alone.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:00 | 1994942 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Other than near universal gun ownership, the US is every bit the same dependent, emasculated bunch of ignoramuses as the Europeans.  The US is barely any different from say, France when it comes to corporatism and welfare statism.  Rednecks are just as bad or worse than progressive types.  It takes more than being "freedom-loving"--you have to be a hell of a lot less ignorant, too.  We've had nothing but horrible executive leadership in the US, even Reagan was really a turd if you consider Iran/Contra--not one principled statesman.  Ron Paul might be principled, but it is just so hard to believe that this guy could ever win, and even if he won, would he really be able to change anything meaningful?  It would piss off too many bankers, too many defense industry billionaires, too many litigious attorneys and their clients, too many welfare queens.

Nope, only a total collapse will right the ship at this point.  And that collapse brings with it tons of its own baggage.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:32 | 1995618 JeffB
JeffB's picture

"and even if he won, would he really be able to change anything meaningful?  It would piss off too many bankers, too many defense industry billionaires, too many litigious attorneys and their clients, too many welfare queens.

Nope, only a total collapse will right the ship at this point.  And that collapse brings with it tons of its own baggage."

Perhaps you are right, but I wouldn't give up so easily. At least we need to give him a chance. Did we give up when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8lT1o0sDwI

One big problem with wanting total collapse and a revolution to bring us to the Promised Land is that it so seldom works out that way. It usually ends up in murder, misery & horrible hardship before it finally stabilizes under a brutal dictator.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:06 | 1994728 Ryman1075
Ryman1075's picture

Are you serious Shill?

Welfare and reckless spending are what are ruining countries (Europe as a whole and the US).  It is a simple fact that when faced with a strong opponent or a weak one, a criminal will go after the weak one (unarmed one).

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:22 | 1994786 Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

MDB- Your trolling is a little too obvious

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:32 | 1994836 au_bayitch
au_bayitch's picture

Fuck You and your million dollar bonus with a 12ga straight up your cunt.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:57 | 1994593 CrockettAlmanac.com
CrockettAlmanac.com's picture

Government kills far more than 500 children each year. So far the government has been content with tasering and groping kids on American soil but overseas the government straifs and bombs children everyday. The government used a missile to intentionally kill a 16 year old American citizen living overseas. Asking the government to protect kids is like asking Jerry Sandusky to babysit for you.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:01 | 1994948 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Oh please.  Spend a day in Guatemala or Nicaragua and then tell me about how bad you have it in the states.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:29 | 1995351 sullymandias
sullymandias's picture

off point

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:21 | 1994781 Better_late_tha...
Better_late_than_never's picture

Did you know that over 500 children die in automobile accidents every year? Support the progrEssivE rEvolution and end dangerous automobile sales with global legislation. What's your excuse?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:42 | 1994891 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Did you know that the government kills FAR MORE than 500 children each year by:

  • vaccinations
  • allowing food to be toxic
  • support of big pharma
  • encouraging welfar/warfare state which kills people's bodies AND souls
  • chemtrailing/weather modification
  • ethanol subsidies promoting food fuel that jacks grain $ up harming the poor's ability to buy food
  • enabling evil bankers

Much bigger problems than guns, don't you think?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 18:17 | 1994949 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Our benevolent government actively markets (I didn't say "allows to be marketed" - critical) toxins, poisons and hazards of all kinds to American Children.

As just one example of the above, think about U.S. Government subsidies for corn farmers, and how this has allowed for a situation that high fructose corn syrup (now renamed 'corn sugar' by the marketing demons) can be produced for a fraction of the cost of sugar, and therefore HFCS makes its way in increasingly high amounts into thousands of food products, as the government is essentially incentivizing manufacturers of food products to utilize it - so maybe that could have SOMETHING to do with the fact that 1 out of 3 Americans is either in the pre-diabetic stage or GROWS UP TO BE DIABETIC!

Wow! That's like....a serious disease that can be fatal....and where like...people have to have amputations....and where like...U.S. taxpayers and private consumers of health care have their taxes/costs driven up, as 25 million Americans now have diabetes and 79 million Americans have pre-diabetes (who are now likely to develop diabetes)***, which will cost TRILLIONS in direct health care and other economic costs.

But 500 children a year die from accidental firearm related incidents (this is tragic, but let's put it in proper perspective against the millions of kids who have or will develop diabetes as a direct contributory result of eating government subsidized HFCS).

Health and developmental problems, causing tens of thousands of deaths and tens of billions of dollars to be expended, on a yearly basis, year after year after year, sponsored in large part by ACTIVE GOVERNMENTAL POLICIES, FTW.

 

***Diabetes affects 25.8 million people of all ages
8.3 percent of the U.S. population

***An estimated 79 million American adults ages 20 years or older have pre-diabetes.

source: http://diabetes.niddk.nih.gov/dm/pubs/statistics/

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 19:25 | 1995944 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Not to mention fluoride and GMO's!  

We live in a land of toxic soup!

ALSO....did you know that HFCS has been found to contain heavy metals such as mercury and aluminum?

And then they have the nerve to thuggishly swat team raid raw milk dairies and organic food farms....you can't make this stuff up!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:41 | 1994883 HileTroy
HileTroy's picture

Ok after reading MDB for serveral weeks he gets my vote for the best sarcasam and he dont ever use <sarc>  U rock MDB your post are too funny!!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:28 | 1995349 Libertarian777
Libertarian777's picture

MDB, while i know a lot of your posts are just meant to get a rise out of zh readers my fear is that i know there are a LOT of people who actually have the belief system you espouse here. I would appreciate your rebuttle.

Every year an average of 10 people drown a day. 2 of whom are children. Or roughly 700 children. So swimming pools kill more children then guns every year. Given that there are 8.6m pools in the usa and 200 million guns, swimming pools are 16 times more deadly than a firearm. Why are you not running an anti-swimming pool campaign?

Now this exact same fear mongering is used for war propoganda and for 'terrorism'. Again more americans die in swimming pools (3500) every year than were killed on sep 11.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:42 | 1995660 JeffB
JeffB's picture

More innocent human beings are deliberately killed in the U.S. every day than were killed in 911 with full government support. In fact, our U.S. Supreme Court has thrown out all states' laws banning that ongoing, often brutal slaughter.

We would have to have a 911 event every single day of the year, including New Years, Mother's Day, Father's Day, Independence Day, Christmas etc. and then have a quadruple finale at the end of the year to bring the death toll high enough to equal the carnage of abortion on demand, just so we could start fresh for the New Year...

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 18:59 | 1995872 Hobbleknee
Hobbleknee's picture

Did you know 1,500 children die in care accidents every year?

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:26 | 1994561 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture

AMAZING how all the MSMers are either A) talking about Kim Jong Il's demise or B) how Gingrich is slipping (as opposed to RP surging) or C) Romney's big endorsements and how he's gaining in Iowa.

Oh man...how far will these assholes go to NOT talk about Ron Paul?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:44 | 1994634 fourchan
fourchan's picture

lol we will not be ignored.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:46 | 1995123 FMR Bankster
FMR Bankster's picture

The longer they ignore him the better. As soon as they turn their attention to him it will be ugly. He'll be called a racist nut who can't wait to unplug granny from her health care. He needs to pick up enough momentum before the onslaught begins. I've mentioned a few times here that he will win in Iowa. (I live there)This is the first poll (even though PPP is known as a liberal leaning organization)that properly has figured out that without a Democratic caucus there will be more independents voting in The Republican caucus as well as a modest number of young disaffected Democrats.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:56 | 1995706 grid-b-gone
grid-b-gone's picture

Headline when Ron Paul wins the nomination.. "Romney and Gingrich Look to 2016"

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:22 | 1994548 Bananamerican
Bananamerican's picture

How long has RP been the "odd" man out in amerikan politics and with what odds of effecting real change to the status quo?

I think a  long time and ZERO are the answers

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:30 | 1994575 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

1)  He can end the wars, bring the soldiers home instantly.

2)  He can VETO anything he does not like, override THAT, Congressional bitchez!

3)  Audit the Fed.

for starters...

Tue, 12/20/2011 - 11:22 | 1997557 mojine
mojine's picture

And THOSE would make a helluva good start!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:30 | 1994579 BW
BW's picture

If they never pass another piece of legislation that would be great.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:14 | 1994759 BlackSunshine
BlackSunshine's picture

That never stopped people from voting for Obama, what do results have to do with anything?

Examine RP's voting record, you will find it consistent with libertarian principles applied to capitalism and social issues.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:07 | 1994886 flattrader
flattrader's picture

Ron Paul wants to limit the power of the federal government.

He wants to make it small enough to fit under your bedroom door.

He's apparently only a libertarian where men are concerned.

Ron Paul on Reproductive Rights

The sponsor of a bill to overturn Roe v. Wade, Ron Paul's libertarianism does not apply to women, though it does apply to zygotes. His is a no-exceptions anti-abortion position, essentially empowering a rapist to sire a child with a woman of his choosing. Although Paul attributes his stance on abortion to his background as an ob-gyn physician, it should be noted that most ob-gyns are pro-choice, and that Paul's draconian position tracks exactly with that of his Christian Reconstructionist friends.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:40 | 1995652 amsterdamzero
amsterdamzero's picture

Ron Paul supports such measures because the Federal Judiciary doesn't have the right to rule on "reproductive rights" because those powers were not granted to the Federal government by the States in the Constitution.  He has never said that an individual state doesn't have the right to permit abortion to its citizens.  That said, he is pro-life because an individual can't have liberty without life.  This is grade school shit...

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:50 | 1995686 deepthoughtless
deepthoughtless's picture

Check his voting record. Really, he just tries to vote down anything that involves federal government intervention in the decision. That means voting down federal funding for abortions, and that means voting down federal restrictions on abortions (with the exception of partial-birth abortions). That is consistent with his over-arching stance, which revolves around dis-involving the federal government in day-to-day life and decisions.

http://www.issues2000.org/tx/Ron_Paul.htm

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 18:03 | 1995731 NidStyles
NidStyles's picture

You can say that all you wish, it doesn't make it true. It's amazing how easily you ignored the whole argument from his position though as if it were based on religion rather than State's Right's on the issue being far more important that Federal oversight.

 

That's fine though, you can keep forcing your will upon the rest of us though, because you're the moral one, right?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:03 | 1994958 Michael
Michael's picture

Third time's the charm.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 18:00 | 1995723 masterinchancery
masterinchancery's picture

The media is still treating Paul like a kook and ignoring him, and you can't pass legislation with 1 vote.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:16 | 1994524 spiral_eyes
spiral_eyes's picture

This is what Americans will end up with if they don't elect Ron Paul.

Detroit coming to all your cities, bitchez

http://azizonomics.com/2011/12/17/post-industrial-decline-in-england/

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:19 | 1994533 Dangertime
Dangertime's picture

If they cannot stop RP from getting elected, they will absolutely Herbert Hoover him.

He is the only man that can fix this country, but wait and see.  TPTB will collapse the whole system once he takes the reins, just to discredit him and everyone that stands for him.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:23 | 1994554 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

They will collapse equities, and then America will have to rebuild itself.  So?  Americans live in a world far from reality, where 1/5 people are out of work, where people on fixed income are eating cat food to survive, and where everyone has a favorite TV show.  The system must collapse in order for us to wake up, otherwise we are living a lie, and living a lie is worse than anything when it comes to furthering the human condition.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:55 | 1994599 Dangertime
Dangertime's picture

If they collapse equities.....and America has to rebuild.....

 

Will it be rebuilt once again on the quicksand foundation of a Federal Reserve monetary system?

 

It is not the collapse or rebuilding I fear, it is the blaming of RP and his Libertarian viewpoint for the collapse, forever damaging our ability to fix the Nation before it is too late.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:58 | 1994688 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Will it be rebuilt once again on the quicksand foundation of a Federal Reserve monetary system?

Good question.  Equity will collapse anyway; the whole Fiat Ponzi system will.  So it would be best if we had leaders who understand that a system cannot be built on quicksand when the time comes.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:15 | 1994757 Dangertime
Dangertime's picture

I wholeheartedly agree.....

 

I am just not so optimistic that the MSM will paint it that way, nor that the people will keep their heads for such sound decisions in the wake of said collapse.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:57 | 1994685 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

 

 

TPTB will collapse the whole system once he takes the reins, just to discredit him and everyone that stands for him.

Yes, that may well happen.  Very likely I would think.

We're due for another '08 style collapse ...only bigger this time.

They might well hold it off somehow if O gets re-elected.  But let RP get elected and they'd let it crash.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:03 | 1994957 aerojet
aerojet's picture

Why would they do that?  Rich guys want to stay rich.  They would take the path of least resistance, which is to learn a whole new game.  Maybe some would just go away completely--a lot of those dudes (Ron Paul included, sadly) are of retirement age.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:51 | 1994417 whatsinaname
whatsinaname's picture

Isnt Ron Paul bad for Gold prices since he will not let wanton money printing at the Fed ?

On the other had if we go back to the Gold standard is that good or bad for gold prices ?

Opinions either way ?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:00 | 1994445 flacon
flacon's picture

What is "price"? US Dollars? What is a "US Dollar"? Isn't it a defined weight of silver? Don't confuse FRN's with US Dollars because they are not the same. 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:05 | 1994964 POpatriot
POpatriot's picture

The real question is why is Huntsman still in the race?  If he dropped out and put his support behind Ron Paul, it would Ron Paul a sure fire win in Iowa.  I don't understand why this hasn't already happened.  Clearly the Huntsman's supporters #2 HAVE to be Ron Paul.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 23:33 | 1996473 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Rationalization/Denial is an even more powerful drug than Hopium!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:07 | 1994489 fuu
fuu's picture

Ron Paul is good for America, I will take that over my stacks any day of the week.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:31 | 1994582 redpill
redpill's picture

Precisely, PMs are a hedge and insurance policy, not a cause.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:31 | 1994584 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

+ 1  Me too.

He won't take away your gun either...

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:34 | 1994598 fuu
fuu's picture

<bow>

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:40 | 1995404 sullymandias
sullymandias's picture

He won't put a 50% capital gains tax on all PM sales either.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:15 | 1994519 T-roll
T-roll's picture

Ron Paul would be very bad for gold prices.  He will end the Fed money printing and he wants to cut $1 trillion from the federal budget.  Both would be very deflationary.  However, this is what this country needs if it wants to remain solvent.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:42 | 1994612 gangland
gangland's picture

in my opinion, rp is the only viable candidate that the gop can run, with a real chance to win against obama.

im not a supporter of any of these guy because i do not think elections represent the will of the governed, but i ve been saying that once the gop establishment realizes rp can siphon antiwar votes, along with younger voters, indys, even leftys, minorities maybe even, away from obama, then rp would become the obvious choice if the gop establishment is interested in winning rather than blathering.

theyre going to try to make up the next reagan; the dialectic is there.

these other guys / gals are a complete farce in a kabuki ensemble.

having said that, i'll say rp will win gop nomination.

rp can provide the synthesis between the tea party and the ows zeitgest.

that was supposed to be barry's narrative in 2008, but he turned it into the no looking back hope and change bait and switch (predictable).

let's see what happens. rp getting elected will not suddenly change the world. he is a politician just like the rest after all.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:44 | 1994630 Troll Magnet
Troll Magnet's picture

i believe he will change the world.  his non-interventionist policy alone would transform this turmoil-ridden world as we know it.  suddenly, a bunch of fear-mongering, war-propagandizing/war-profiteering assholes will find themselves with NOTHING to do and that alone will be a GREAT thing for humanity.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:57 | 1994662 gangland
gangland's picture

1 man cant stop a multi trillion dollar war machine and 200 years of national history and official policy.

maybe if millions poured into the streets in clear unequivical support of peace and non-interventionism.

but i have no hope of that happening.  most of us are content behind the computer screen ranting and raving, while we wait for The One to come along.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:26 | 1994713 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

 

 

maybe if millions poured into the streets in clear unequivical support of peace and non-interventionism.

Peaceful protest accomplishes nothing, and Americans are too sheepish to start shooting.

Your 400 million guns will be wasted. America will become a full-blown police state ...or collapse altogether... without a shot being fired ...except by police.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:30 | 1994825 gangland
gangland's picture

 

Peaceful protest accomplishes nothing

 

 

yup, it never has and it never will.

non-violent protest is an elite established myth.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:56 | 1994931 11b40
11b40's picture

Tell that to the Brits who had to deal with Ghandi.

Tell it to the racists who stood in the dorway of schools in the South.

Tell it to the war machine that had to finally give up on the idea of empire in SE Asia as the VN war became less and less popular.

You are 100% wrong.  Peaceful protest is the most effective way to force change, once critical mass is reached within the general population.  Violent reaction against peaceful protest is the best way to have the objectives of that protest made more popular.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:14 | 1994975 UpShotKnotHoleGrable
UpShotKnotHoleGrable's picture

i respect your 100% certain logic but you may want to search for ghandi and the myth of non-violent resistance. or maybe some basic primary sourced history, try the salt march protests.

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/education/topics/calcutta-riots.htm

 

cognitive bias is tough to get over.

yes vietnam ended 100% because of non-violent protests both domestically and in saigon.

that's why it ended. all the non-violent protests.

 

 

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:22 | 1995019 gangland
gangland's picture

Gandhi has been regarded for twenty years by the Government of India as one of its right hand men.

I know what I’m talking about–I used to be an officer in the Indian police.

It was always admitted in the most cynical way that Gandhi made it easier for the British to rule India, because his influ¬ence was always against taking any action that would make any difference.

The reason why Gandhi when in prison is always treated with such lenience and small concessions sometimes made when he has prolonged one of his fasts to a dangerous extent, is that the British officials are in terror that he may die and be replaced by someone who believes less in “soul force “ and more in bombs. - Geroge Orwell

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:04 | 1995157 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture

 

 

Violent reaction against peaceful protest is the best way to have the objectives of that protest made more popular.

Ideological victories are pointless against a criminal mafia-style government that only respects bullets coming at them ...which Americans won't do.  

Like I said, your 400 million guns will sit idle while America transforms into a full-blown Russia-style police state ...or collapses altogether.

You sheep won't even stop flying, bankrupt the airlines, and force TSA to back off.

No, there won't be a revolution, and your peaceful protests will be ignored completely ...except as target practice by police.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 19:11 | 1995896 gangland
gangland's picture

force only understands force

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:35 | 1994841 grovernors
grovernors's picture

@ Troll magnet I would rather think that a great power vacuum would be created and then suddenly filled with extremist violence thus ensuring American hegemony through finance, arms sales and the propagation of planned civilization.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:40 | 1994878 gangland
gangland's picture

kinetic peace

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:47 | 1994905 grid-b-gone
grid-b-gone's picture

Under Ron Paul, military hardware that even the military does not want might have a chance of getting cut.

Teachers-turned-administrators would return to teaching or move into another line of work.

The essential shift from government-centric solutions would revert back to the people where it belongs.

TPTB like the tracking ease of technology when it works toward their paranoid need to know, but this growing social networking movement toward RP, despite the entrenched media effort to squelch it, shows the voters can still be heard.

The government only needs to be strong enough to provide security and some essential functions provided most effectively at the national level.

Beyond those very few core national functions, let individual freedom, initiative, and ingenuity sort out the rest.  

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:00 | 1994700 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Ron Paul would be very bad for gold prices.  He will end the Fed money printing and he wants to cut $1 trillion from the federal budget.  Both would be very deflationary.

Gold does great in times of deflation.  Basically, gold does great in times of instability.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:02 | 1994707 ffart
ffart's picture

You are way off base thinking Paul is a supporter of the Federal Reserve.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:02 | 1994463 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

The ! did it.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:33 | 1994596 fuu
fuu's picture

Glad I missed it on the first one.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:48 | 1994400 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

Reposted for posterity (I do not worship Ron Paul; It's just that his back to basics & simple message of telling the truth appears to be so revoutionary and refreshing; maybe more Americans are waking up given their circumstances and desiring to quench their thirst that the drought of facts the Government-Media-CronyCorporate Complex has sown with some truth & honesty?):

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act."

-- George Orwell

 

 

Until each American voter simply votes for the best person most representative of the core principles enshrined in an actual document that is the literal blueprint of how our government is supposed to run and that is also a constraint upon, and not a license for expansion of, governmental powers, we're all going to be getting the toxic manure byproduct of a false left-right paradigm, constructed to use marginally important social wedge issues to ramp emotions and divide and segment the voters, while the two party establishments that in reality really work for the exact same people/entities, as their both deeply captured in what is now our official Corpocratic Kleptocracy, continue to jointly push through a planned agenda filled with the truly critical issues that directly impact the lives of Americans on an everyday basis and in a highly significant way (and adverse to the overwhelming majority).

Republicans & Democrats throw issues like gay marriage and whether the pledge of allegiance must be recited in school out like red meat to their astroturfed bases, to keep the emotions charged, with neither of these or any other of the myriad of issues they fill their time jawboning about having much impact on 95% of the material lives of Americans, while they team up to vote together to give blank check powers to the Executive Branch (to start multi-trillion dollar wars or make de facto law by signing statements), give blank check ability of the Non-Federal Reserve Non-Bank to suck the blood of the taxpayer base and transfer said blood to the favored friends of its New York Branch, effectively picking winners and losers in the economy via central planning, and propping up a cancerous economic trend whereby Wall Street & Banking Parasites drain the nation to the edge of death, and pledge larger and larger share of national revenue to the MIC, so it can profit from taxpayers in the exact same fashion as Wall Street & the Banking Parasites, etc. etc. etc.

But hey, cnBSc, msnBSc, cBS, Faux News, aBSc and nBSc all say Ron Paul can't win, and only a crazy voter would cast a ballot for him, and in fact, he's worthy of being ignored, so we'll all just have to keep on sucking up the intense abuse and assault upon and erosion of our RIGHTS and social and economic interests, and accept the fundamental reality that we must accept the task of learning to make do with an Obama or RomGrinch, and the social wedge issues will guide us to who we prefer on those mostly hollow, meaningless issues.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:18 | 1994532 Bananamerican
Bananamerican's picture

well said again TIS,

I hope RP's Iowa lead is the "plop" heard round the world, as amerikans begin the long arduous task of removing their heads from their asses...

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:21 | 1994540 Potemkin Villag...
Potemkin Village Idiot's picture

At very minimum... The potential juxtaposition of...

Ron Paul vs. Barack Obama

as the final two ballot choices come next November, is compelling...

If nothing more, than to simply say, "HERE YOU ARE YOU FUCKING DIPSHIT VOTERS", take your pick on what kind of democracy you think you live in...

I get so pissed off listening to Obama apologists right now who use the excuse "Well what did you want me to do, vote for McCain"?

Umm... I 'wrote in' Ron Paul back in 2008

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:34 | 1994600 Potemkin Villag...
Potemkin Village Idiot's picture

+1000 internets to you for thinking outside the (ballot) box...

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:31 | 1994585 Optimusprime
Optimusprime's picture

"I 'wrote in' Ron Paul back in 2008."

 

So did I.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:53 | 1994670 Shadowsil
Shadowsil's picture

I didnt know about Ron Paul in 2008. Just saw signs, heard a little words now and then..

I wasted my vote and didnt use it at all, I am one inclined to not vote for the lesser of 2 evils as this ruins my own mindset.

RP even if he doesnt win the GOP, will still have my vote as a put in.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:45 | 1995428 sullymandias
sullymandias's picture

"I 'wrote in' Ron Paul back in 2008."

So did I.

me too

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:50 | 1994655 BigSkyBear
BigSkyBear's picture

"Umm... I 'wrote in' Ron Paul back in 2008"

 

Not many of us...+1

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:14 | 1994758 r101958
r101958's picture

"Ron Paul vs. Barack Obama" = Truth or Consequences (yikes!).

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:32 | 1994832 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

I love your run-on yet lucid posts!  Got my fix....thanks!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:13 | 1994510 midtowng
midtowng's picture

Now all Ron Paul has to do is to flip-flop on his stands against the Federal Reserve and useless foreign wars and the establishment will endorse him.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:24 | 1994536 Bananamerican
Bananamerican's picture

is that your expectation?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 22:59 | 1996396 John_Coltrane
John_Coltrane's picture

I wouldn't hold my breathe on it, but maybe you should.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:15 | 1994522 FL_Conservative
FL_Conservative's picture

Changing back to republicanism one election at a time!  Go Ron!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:42 | 1994380 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

I haven't voted for President for awhile.  I think I will vote for Paul, as long as his running mate is cool.

Ron Paul/Willie Nelson 2012

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:06 | 1994485 CharlieSDT
CharlieSDT's picture

Willie Nelson, Bitchez!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:09 | 1994497 CharlieSDT
CharlieSDT's picture

Ron Paul/ J Billington Bullworth 2012!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:30 | 1994580 Tsunami Wave
Tsunami Wave's picture

Gary Johnson!! 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:45 | 1994894 Tsunami Wave
Tsunami Wave's picture

Why is Gary Johnson such a bad choice? at least for VP he would be good.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:34 | 1994601 richard in norway
richard in norway's picture

any chance of having elizabeth warren as his running mate, it might keep him alive! the only person that the TBTF fear more than ron

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:41 | 1994885 au_bayitch
au_bayitch's picture

Ann Barnhardt?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:17 | 1994999 niccolo and donkey
niccolo and donkey's picture

That warmongering bitch?  Not a chance.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:46 | 1995130 Blano
Blano's picture

Brooksley Born.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:26 | 1994810 Hugh G Rection
Hugh G Rection's picture

Paul/Ventura!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:59 | 1995160 tsx500
tsx500's picture

Ron Paul/Ann Barnhardt 2012 !

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:00 | 1994453 Abiotic Oil
Abiotic Oil's picture

"rotating nut jobs"

Ron doesn't care what you do with your boyfriends in private.  Please keep it off the board here and limit discussion to Ron Paul winning the nomination.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:01 | 1994458 LongBallsShortBrains
LongBallsShortBrains's picture

Yes he can!!!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:28 | 1994571 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

"Yes he can!!!!"

So does that mean your avatar is a hairy ass?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:50 | 1994656 Lndmvr
Lndmvr's picture

+1 for the laugh. Hope FL is doing fine cause I'm heading that way. OT  Banks here in Iowa went to maximum of $5000 per day without advanced notice.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:01 | 1994706 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

My bank needs advance notice too. The amount depends on the teller and if they have the cash on hand. One manager yelled at a teller who would not give me my money. Another one said that logistically, they need advance notice to insure that they have the cash on hand. They want you to "order" the money, even the denominations. Different days of the month and week matter as well.

Near as I can tell, FL is okay. Sounds like a holiday thang on your part???

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:33 | 1994846 Lndmvr
Lndmvr's picture

Knowing you from St pete or have family near by. Looking to buy land in the panhandle/big bend to go off grid and wait out the next 2 years. Although we've had no cold weather here, all those we helped get to end of life have made it. Still trying to find out the state of the gulf since the oil spill. Biggest problem is having to have an address . The gov't from local to fed. base taxes and registrations on addresses. No PO boxs for anything. Try setting up trusts for assets, FM.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:33 | 1995627 scam_MERS
scam_MERS's picture

I still have family in St. Pete too. I'm Lakewood HS Class of '76, Bayway/Maximo Moorings area! Wish I could go back to the early 70's when I lived there, it was such a nice, quiet time compared to now.

Is there still land in the panhandle that is sparsely populated, and would you want to live there - since it seems to get slammed by hurricanes far more than Tampa/St Pete does?

(FWIW, you can tell when someone isn't from Tampa or St. Pete when they tell you someone or something is in/from "Tampa Bay". What, it was from the middle of the bay? Irritates me no end)

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:38 | 1994613 SheepleLOVEched...
SheepleLOVEcheddarbaybiscuits's picture

why would anyone NOT like and support RON PAUL?  you have to be either brainwashed or insane not to....why do youi want the government completely controlling your life?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:29 | 1994818 Better_late_tha...
Better_late_than_never's picture

This is why many will not vote for him: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXQozTxQSiE

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:13 | 1994989 flattrader
flattrader's picture

>>>why do youi want the government completely controlling your life?<<<

Not at all.  But, oddly Ron Paul seems to think control is a good idea.

He's apparently only a libertarian where men are concerned.

Ron Paul on Reproductive Rights

The sponsor of a bill to overturn Roe v. Wade, Ron Paul's libertarianism does not apply to women, though it does apply to zygotes. His is a no-exceptions anti-abortion position, essentially empowering a rapist to sire a child with a woman of his choosing. Although Paul attributes his stance on abortion to his background as an ob-gyn physician, it should be noted that most ob-gyns are pro-choice, and that Paul's draconian position tracks exactly with that of his Christian Reconstructionist friends.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:39 | 1995099 ronin12
ronin12's picture

FAIL.

Let the states deal with the abortion issue.

Reposted from TruthInSunshine:

 

"Until each American voter simply votes for the best person most representative of the core principles enshrined in an actual document that is the literal blueprint of how our government is supposed to run and that is also a constraint upon, and not a license for expansion of, governmental powers, we're all going to be getting the toxic manure byproduct of a false left-right paradigm, constructed to use marginally important social wedge issues to ramp emotions and divide and segment the voters, while the two party establishments that in reality really work for the exact same people/entities, as their both deeply captured in what is now our official Corpocratic Kleptocracy, continue to jointly push through a planned agenda filled with the truly critical issues that directly impact the lives of Americans on an everyday basis and in a highly significant way (and adverse to the overwhelming majority).

Republicans & Democrats throw issues like gay marriage and whether the pledge of allegiance must be recited in school out like red meat to their astroturfed bases, to keep the emotions charged, with neither of these or any other of the myriad of issues they fill their time jawboning about having much impact on 95% of the material lives of Americans, while they team up to vote together to give blank check powers to the Executive Branch (to start multi-trillion dollar wars or make de facto law by signing statements), give blank check ability of the Non-Federal Reserve Non-Bank to suck the blood of the taxpayer base and transfer said blood to the favored friends of its New York Branch, effectively picking winners and losers in the economy via central planning, and propping up a cancerous economic trend whereby Wall Street & Banking Parasites drain the nation to the edge of death, and pledge larger and larger share of national revenue to the MIC, so it can profit from taxpayers in the exact same fashion as Wall Street & the Banking Parasites, etc. etc. etc.

But hey, cnBSc, msnBSc, cBS, Faux News, aBSc and nBSc all say Ron Paul can't win, and only a crazy voter would cast a ballot for him, and in fact, he's worthy of being ignored, so we'll all just have to keep on sucking up the intense abuse and assault upon and erosion of our RIGHTS and social and economic interests, and accept the fundamental reality that we must accept the task of learning to make do with an Obama or RomGrinch, and the social wedge issues will guide us to who we prefer on those mostly hollow, meaningless issues."

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:18 | 1995278 flattrader
flattrader's picture

Ron Paul will FAIL when young women "discover" he is vehemently anti-choice...and he's counting on the "young voter demographic."

By age 45 one out of three American women choose abortion at some point.

This will not go down well when the find out that his prohibition is under any circumstances.

So much for his bullshit brand of libertarianism.  What a fucking hypocrite.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:03 | 1995504 lemonobrien
lemonobrien's picture

Actually not, you don't understand the argument; when does life begin and that life have legal protection. Ole Ron is a doctor and delivers babies; so he believes in a more immediate/instant life theory. I've come to the conclusion too, and have regrets on forcing two abortions on women when I was a young man. They was asian and I didn't want an asian babies. But, hey, thats life. I got a white baby now with blue eyes now; to tell the truth, abortion is more about the man than the woman. We can just walk away ans ay, "fuck'n kill it. I don't want it, it's yours."

 

anyway. its hard to be responsible; people want to prolong childhood now as much as possible and it's sad to see the old retards pretending they're young and hip.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:11 | 1995534 TruthInSunshine
TruthInSunshine's picture

All these people who are clueless about Ron Paul's beliefs, which he's only advocated for 40+ years, consistently, spouting off like the little sock puppets sent in by almost organized effort, to spread their farts in the wind.

Ron Paul has always held that the same, moral, logical and, underlying it all, constitutionally adherent view on abortion. But why take it from me?

Surely any of you ignorant establishment sluts would have cited this, directly from Ron Paul's website, in an attempt to ensure you're speaking truthfully about Paul's position on abortion, RIGHT (/SARC/)?

http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/

The heated debate about abortion is filled with emotional arguments that usually center on considerations such as sexual morality, religious beliefs, women’s rights, or purely on pragmatic reasons: if abortion were made illegal it would still take place – under unsanitary conditions that would endanger additional lives.

However, a rational evaluation of abortion must be built upon one single question: When exactly does human life begin? At conception, at birth or somewhere in between?

Not even the most radical feminist would find it okay to tear apart a recently-born baby just because it is not wanted by its mother. All other considerations aside, the only reason many individuals can support abortion with a good conscience is because they believe it’s not murder… and that unborn babies do not count as human beings.

Ron Paul has delivered more than 4,000 babies. He believes that human life starts at conception, and that casual elimination of the unborn leads to a careless attitude towards all life.

Recalling his personal observation of a late-term abortion performed by one of his instructors during his medical residency, Ron Paul stated, “It was pretty dramatic for me to see a two-and-a-half-pound baby taken out crying and breathing and put in a bucket.”

In an Oct. 27, 1999 speech to Congress, Ron Paul said:

“I am strongly pro-life. I think one of the most disastrous rulings of this century was Roe versus Wade. I do believe in the slippery slope theory. I believe that if people are careless and casual about life at the beginning of life, we will be careless and casual about life at the end. Abortion leads to euthanasia. I believe that.”

During a May 15, 2007, appearance on the Fox News talk show Hannity and Colmes, Ron Paul argued that his pro-life position was consistent with his libertarian values, asking, “If you can’t protect life then how can you protect liberty?” Additionally, Ron Paul said that since he believes libertarians support non-aggression, libertarians should oppose abortion because abortion is “an act of aggression” against a fetus.

At the GOP Values Voter Presidential Debate on Sep 17, 2007, Ron Paul was asked what he will do to restore legal protection to the unborn:

“As an O.B. doctor of thirty years, and having delivered 4,000 babies, I can assure you life begins at conception. I am legally responsible for the unborn, no matter what I do, so there’s a legal life there. The unborn has inheritance rights, and if there’s an injury or a killing, there is a legal entity. There is no doubt about it.”

At the GOP YouTube debate in St. Petersburg, Florida, on Nov 28, 2007, Ron Paul was asked what a woman would be charged with if abortion becomes illegal and she obtains an abortion anyway:

“The first thing we have to do is get the federal government out of it. We don’t need a federal abortion police. That’s the last thing that we need. There has to be a criminal penalty for the person that’s committing that crime. And I think that is the abortionist. As for the punishment, I don’t think that should be up to the president to decide.”

For many years, Ron Paul has been speaking up for babies’ rights. He passionately defends those who cannot speak for themselves because they haven’t been born yet.

In order to “offset the effects of Roe v. Wade”, Paul voted in favor of the federal Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act of 2003. He has described partial birth abortion as a “barbaric procedure”.

At the same time, Ron Paul believes that the ninth and tenth amendments to the U.S. Constitution do not grant the federal government any authority to legalize or ban abortion. Instead, it is up to the individual states to prohibit abortion.

Many people feel very strongly about the issue of abortion, and once they make up their minds they rarely change their opinion. If you are undecided and/or open-minded, check out this page and this site for more information about abortion, including images and a description of medical procedures.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 18:30 | 1995814 fuu
fuu's picture

Some day I am buying you a beer.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 19:15 | 1995912 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

I LOVE YOU!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 19:14 | 1995905 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Libertarians are for ALL people's rights to life, liberty, and happiness....pre-born babies are LIVING HUMAN BEINGS who have also have these rights, even though they reside beneath layers of flesh.

THAT is pure libertarianism!  It is TYRANNISTS who advocate legal killing of some and not others!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 19:18 | 1995923 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

oops...."tyrannists".....my brain got "fancy" there for a sec!

should read: "tyrants"

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 15:45 | 1995124 UGrev
UGrev's picture

Uh, what you think and what you can make into law are two very different things. 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:41 | 1994623 BLOTTO
BLOTTO's picture

44 presidents = all links and descendants of the Merovingian Bloodline.

LEaders of the US are not elected - they are born

So, no - not nut jobs - but rather - Luciferian Sun-worshippers who think it is there divine right to rule over us.

Yes, it is way more serious than most people think

If ZH existed for another 300 years - it would still be the same people saying the same shit - of, its bad decisions, bad leaders, bad planning, bad system, bad thinking.

 

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 14:11 | 1994744 Vergeltung
Vergeltung's picture

(Yoda voice):

"Hmmmm. The 'tard is strong in this one, hmm?"

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 16:11 | 1995179 BLOTTO
BLOTTO's picture

You keep believing that its just bad planning, bad decisions, bad leadership, bad votes and bad choices and in 300 years if ZH is still around - we'll just keep hearing the same thing again and same fuckin excuses...

So when do you wake up and start thinking outside the box?...maybe when you are capable of independent thinking and not listening to your fucking 2 minute CNN or FOX news report than we can get to the bottom of things.

BTW, and as powerful Yoda was - the Emperor Palpatine chased him off and Yoda took off to the Dagoba like a scared little fag and hid in hiding until he died... Nice Jedi leader - take off in a remote swamp like a fuck.

'Hmmmm im a bitch'

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 17:09 | 1995527 lemonobrien
lemonobrien's picture

yes, the tard is strong in this one.

 

Explain how a white-trash Kansas girl and a spade nigga trying to secure a visa had blood line ties to the alien race who bred us for slaves?

 

Or, how a PT boat captain, who was the son of a Irish boot-leg liqueur runner are linked through this linage?

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:34 | 1994335 Martial
Martial's picture

Ron Paul 2012 bitchez!!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:34 | 1994337 GMadScientist
GMadScientist's picture

Paul/Huntsman 2012

The Right Man, The Right Mormon

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 12:51 | 1994415 Freddie
Freddie's picture

Huntsman is one of the worst in the bunch.  Gingrich is the worst one.  His voting record when he was in the house was as bad as Pelosi's.  Gingrich is a mega CFR/NWO stooge.

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:22 | 1994545 weinerdog43
weinerdog43's picture

Thanks Rick Perry!  Always glad to have you!

Mon, 12/19/2011 - 13:31 | 1994583 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Be kind to Freddie. This is his first post where he is not just an anti-dem shill and the first post that does not dis "The Muslim" somehow. 

Freddie is showing signs of growth here, critiquing the Republicans too.

+3 Freddie.

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