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Standard Chartered CEO Says Greek Default Inevitable
Since there is no point anymore in doing any analysis or wasting time thinking, here is the copy and paste of the relevant section from a just released piece in Bloomberg. "Greek Default, Euro Exit Inevitable, Std Chartered CEO Tells Sky. Default, euro exit won’t “necessarily” occur in next 1 or 2 mos., but “quite likely at some stage,” Standard Chartered CEO Gerard Lyons tells Sky News. Greece “not going to pull down Europe” or cause world recession." Actually, the last bit may be a rumor, at least if one remembers what happened to global banking after Lehman was taken down in a "controlled" Chapter 7. Anyway, Johnny 5: take it away.
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The problem is that Greece is not the only problem country. There's just too much debt worldwide not enough gdp conjured up from the most maniacal keynesians or hope driven headline can service the existing world debt let alone begin to grow out of it.
I agree. If Greece defaulting has no effect and won't "bring down Europe", then why all the fuss to keep the POS afloat? Why the buzzing rumor mill?
Europe is dead. So is the US. The "economy" is a function of peoples' productivity. With labor force pariticpation at historic lows and debt at all time highs, combined with high unemployment, rumors and HFT bots are the only thing keeping the masses numb and out of the know. The economy is lifeless because it's being manipulated from correcting.
Life support is not real life.
If Greece defaulting has no effect and won't "bring down Europe", then why all the fuss to keep the POS afloat? Why the buzzing rumor mill?
There are sheep out there that need fleecing.
Right, if Greece defaulting is no big deal at all, then why are they so frantic romor mongering and pumping billions in to keep it afloat?
may i ask a question?
Who is going to make MONEY off all this DEFAULT?
Ultimately, the buyers of Greek CDS - unless the sellers change the definition of default?!?
Presuming the holders have the requisite political sway to get a bailout from the insolvent counterparty...
I got loads of CDSs. I'd imagine most people here have plenty. But they are yellowish and silvery metal rounds and bars. It should help with those 'systemic' and 'counterparty' risks.
And what about the counterparty risk to find somebody willing to pay you the price you want for a piece of scrap metal?
If things get that bad, I probably won't make it anyway.
This is obviously key. Who is the counterparty to all that CDS? AIG? lol
Central Banksters have profited mightily for many years. this is just the pulp of a country after fully squeezed.
On a global scale and in the long run, a few things will be corrected though. Chinese wages will equal Western wages. The West will never enjoy the relative living standards of the 60s and 70s. At least not until another manufacturing revolution pulls the jobs from the East back to the West.
“China is a poor country with only $4,000 per capita income. To talk and think about China to rescue countries with $40,000 per capita incomes is ridiculous.”
-Yu Yongding, a Chinese top economist and former member of the central bank’s monetary policy committee
Solution is simple and inevitable:
0 – FORCE MAJEURE! – Call Void All Bankster Bogus Derivative Debts! Because paying off these trough fraud induced debts have become a technical and practical impossibility.
THE REAL PROBLEMS & SOLUTIONS BY YOURI CARMA, 29 December 2008, (Blogs.Reuters – The Great Debate) http://tinyurl.com/lg4gpv
Mark my words, mark my words if this is not done, the country will go down!
(With help from; Alex Jones, Prof. Michel Chossudovsky, Prof. Michael Hudson, Prof. Joe Stiglitz, Dr. Webster Griffin Tarpley, Dr. Paul Craig Roberts, Dr. Marc Faber, Bob Chapman, Max Keiser, Peter Schiff , Gerald Celenete, Mike Maloney, Jim Willie, Jim Rickards and many others.)
Germany testing the reactions to the inevitable break up of eurozone?
As long as Germany is paying Greece bills, there will be no default. THis will change if German people riot against this bailout. Which will never happen, as most are too lazy to go to protest.
They’ve already defaulted. No one wants to admit it yet.
they want to make sure that the coming downturn is blamed wholly on the greeks
banks are not the problem greeks are
first statement wholly true, second one false in the first part. oh for a more refined junking system
You can always comment if nuance is required ... oh, so you did.
Wait, didn't the Martians offer to buy Greek debt? Or was it that they were planning an invasion to help us out? I can't keep all this straight anymore.
America to Martians "Can't we all just get along?"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPMmC0UAnj0
Guess who just flicked the first domino. I can feel Plato twitching in his grave.
double post *sorry
OH 'at some stage' totaly bankrupt Greece will default....but not today my son....not today!
I think Greece needs to buy (or swap) some of Italys bonds before they both default. Wouldn't that be a hoot to unwind?
if anything, it'll be done at night! surprise everyone!!!!!!!!!!!
You are so right Sheepdog. Not today,not tomorrow and on infinitum. I've been reading this "stuff" for over a year and nothing changes. The powers-that-be can keep this dance going forever. The Fed can print and print and print and nothing will change except the value of the dollar.Eventually, the audience for this "coming desaster" will lose interest ---something like the second coming!
Sure seems that way some days. Its all just a gag? And they know they can do whatever they want because people will never revolt against their own Chinese water torture drip drip drip slow death by debt and eventually starvation?
I don't think this will go on forever. There are real consequences for the actions of TPTB, and their desperation signals that they know they're running out of time.
Seems that way too, but like the above said, watch it day after day after day....each day the wheels SHOULD fly off, but they dont. Yes I know theres far more to it than these stupid 'markets', I write about it all the time stocks are just a societal conditioning tool. When people hear 'The DOW finished up 70 points today' then they know 'all is well'.
But way more sinister things are being set up behind the scenes than simple stock manipulation, theyre working to keep the sheeple placated for a big event coming soon.
Agreed, mostly. My question, though, is have TPTB lost control? Have things accelerated beyond their ability to control the outcome? I think so, but really, all we can do is speculate and try to prepare for an outcome where we're pretty much in survival mode and/or resisting being herded into FEMA camps.
Interesting times, indeed.
Sheepdog- one.EXACTLY. They know something we dont. And they are just trying to keep the show on the road till then
They're all going to delay, postpone, and kick the can until they all buy the farm. On their deathbeds, they will all say "Hey, at least we didn't default."
SO why exactly is Geithner going to the Euro Finance ministers in Poland on Thursday?
Certainly it can't be to dispense advice to Greece about tax collection.
He's gonna help guide it in, um - I mean offer guidance.
Timmay's the set up man for the target mark to save the Euro........OBAMA !! Pony up or else it's goodbye in '12 !
http://www.businessinsider.com/merkel-will-press-obama-and-the-fed-to-bail-out-the-eurozone-2011-9
Crap, I need a bigger mattress for all the Lira, Drachma, and other currencies I'm going to have to start hoarding from the old/new/old Euro failed experiment.
Don't be stupid - fiat is for spending, gold is for saving.
Even if you don't understand the Euro, you can still understand the rational for building the Euro.
The dollar reserve system of debt is ending! Debt is surely failing as the vehicle for saving.
Get yourself a new vehicle and hitch a ride with gold - its soon off to the moon!!
I almost wonder if they are trying to desensitize everyone for a greek default?
It would make sense in that by the time they actually default, it will have already been priced in?
It might actually be welcomed.
Forgive me, I watched "Human Resources" last night and I still have that monkey screaming in the cage in my mind.
pods
Not sure the forex has it priced in. The unwind would be... traumatic, lol.
"We hear that Mr Schauble is preparing Germany’s banks for the shock of Greek default. Do not believe a word of it. He cannot pull this off and he knows it. At some point he thought that time would allow Germany’s banks to work out ways of insulating themselves from a Hellenic shock. Instead, they seem more vulnerable today than ever. So, what on earth is going on? What is Mr Schauble really doing? What plans is he trying to hatch?"
"...the only logical conclusion that I can come to is that, behind all the talk of a German plan to contain a Greek default or to push Greece out of the euro, lies the groundwork for a pragmatic plan that sees Germany bailing itself out; a plan according to which Germany will round up countries it truly deems worthy of sharing its new currency with (the other three surplus countries of the existing eurozone plus perhaps Poland, the Czech Republic and even Estonia) and exiting in the most orderly manner possible; offering, for example, to the eurozone countries that will be left behind (fretting France in particular) a few gifts..."
http://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2011/09/11/is-greece-finished/
ex-adviser of G-Pap
Interesting. Thanks for that.
goo.gl/OYz0r (google translated )
goo.gl/9auGt (in German)
the German reaction in the comments.
20 pages and go on
Interesting but unlikely. The most practical variant would be the 'two-speed Eurozone' with the trappings of the EU/EMU preserved. But what we're seeing is two fatal flaws:
1. Monetary union without fiscal union doesn't work. This makes monetary union simply too close to core sovereignty to work in the end.
2. No currency zone games can stop greedy leveraged investment in the PIIGS or anywhere else. That is Germany's fault and nothing in the Eurozone construct can really be blamed, nor can altering the monetary aspects solve that problem.
Not that Germany won't try something, but it won't work. Maybe for kicking the can....at most.
Varoufakis is a moron with no clue at all. Germany and German banks are ready for a Greek default for almost a year now. The write down of those few billions in Greek bonds German banks are holding is not a big deal. But French and Italian banks will be hit hard. And this may cause the next deep recession worldwide because this countries may not be able to bail out their banks completely. And that´s something Germany wants to avoid as one of the leading exporters in the world.
Varoufakis is a leftist Econ professor, no more, no less. What next, will you be calling Krugman a moron?? (Imagine that!)
Nobody can be sure of being ready for a full-fledged Greek default. After all is said and done, after writedowns and whatnot, there still isn't reasonable assurance a snowball won't run roughshod over the delicate acrobatics of an overleveraged Europe and even world.
Nor is default a viable solution for Greece. It imports 3/4 of its food and all its fuel. Devalue the drachma and win on exports? Uh... WHAT exports?
There will be NO default -- because there already is a controlled default. Gradually, as measures take effect and less and less money goes down dark tubes, there will be more agreed haircuts until they hit 50% or so.
The government has been forced to take those measures -- cut its partisan foot off, if you recall my recent "Saw" comment. It is being dragged to doing just that, fire civil servants (the heart of party membership), divest, open up closed-shop professions and trades. Kicking and screaming, like a reluctant virgin (albeit with an Eisenhower-dollar-sized ass).
Soft default, hard default, orderly default, organized default... How many more flavors are there?
'Nothing to see here' style default, as the DOW tacks on +400 that day as whatever it is will be 'better than expected'.
They just need bigger rumors
Markets are doing fine though, DOW tacked on 400 points since yesterdays Rule 48 open....GO FIGURE!
One thing is obvious, Ben certainly isnt going into FOMC to point at spooky market conditions, hell the markets couldnt possibly look more stable!
So what now?
Print more to stabilize the Eurobitchez. Can, meet can.
"...So what now..."
Grab your ankles?
Not me, Im watching from the nosebleed seats.
The odd thing about all the rumours is that all of the rumoured are IMF members.
Why the hell would they not let the IMF do the job.
On second thoughts forget that.
banksters, women and children first
Coke, Ukrainian hookers, Unicorn skittles, Hopium, KoolAid, and Pixie dust.
RanSquawk News: 09-13 15:36: German finance minister says Greece can solve own problems
that is what counts ;- )
Problem-reaction-solution is out the window...none of this has anything to do with markets, theyre just keeping up a calm facade up until 1 morning the ICBM's are flying.
please you shooting the dead horse...market has priced this in.....market looking to explode to upside....
Hah... I seriously doubt the market has priced in a Greek default. When that day comes, let's see what the market does.
Right its all 'priced in' so why bother paying any attention?
Something definitely has got to give, and no doubt Greece is “not going to pull down Europe or cause world recession."
But I wonder if we too often miss the bigger picture - this isn't like some isolated problem for Greece (acute as it may be in ths instance), the debt virus endemic to the dollar reserve system is everywhere.
If Greece goes or stays the **real issue** - mad debt unservicable in real terms - still remains.
Keep your eye on the prize - the world is undergoing a fundamental shift.
Got physical gold?
'World recession'...whatever, the US is recording the highest unemployment, bankruptcy, and poverty rates ever.
almost sounds like a depression
The US burning to the ground in a charred crisp, and theyre wondering if theres perhaps some signs of fire danger.
But alas, all is well, its HAS to be! After all, we closed up...and thats all that matters. Stocks.
Actually, the last bit may be a rumor, at least if one remembers what happened to global banking after Lehman was taken down in a "controlled" Chapter 7. Anyway, Johnny 5: take it away. - 'on with the BC'
Yeah, but Bob Pisani said what's important here is we finished up.
'Up'? WAY up! Since yesterdays emergency Rule 48 open, the DOW has confidently tacked on +400 points!
I know I'm suffering from recency bias, but damn if this whole thing isn't a lot like 2008.
Standard Chartered also says iron ore may trade above $200 in the intermediate term. the European periphery defaults, which is a severe deflationary force, and yet somehow the bubble in iron ore gets bigger. looks like China has a lot of work to do, because the next stimulus package is going to need to be more than $600B.
That's not recency bias. 2008 was like 4,000,000 years ago to your average schitzo HFT or momobot. You're a historian.
2008 may as well be the Pleistocene Era. Now we got SkyNet, and its aware. Hell its probably building T-1 Terminators on nights and weekends already.
Greece “not going to pull down Europe” or cause world recession."
you have to be up in order to be pulled down. and greece cant cause something that already exists.
its doubtful that greece's default would cause a sudden panic, as the market knows they already have defaulted, and to some extent it might be a short term relief. that being said, the vigilantes will move on to spain, portugal, italy. and then it begins again..............
Greece is a tiny tempest in a boiling teapot, inside a 5 alarm blaze house fire.
yes sheepie, but i still wager that there will be a short term bounce. this has been played out enough. there isnt one investor who feels the greek rat will make it on eu cheese. again, i say only short term, as the vultures will move onto the spanish portuguese and italian carcasses....
Probably one guy will bounce a check and trigger the whole market crash.
Why is the whole world trying to save Greece? Why isn't gold through the roof with all the turmoil??
Is Greece the loose thread on a sweater? You know, the one you pull on and the whole damn thing comes unwound.
@idiot --on your second question, im just as perplexed as you regarding the sudden stagnation in gold. makes little sense. sure there is a level of manipulation, but that cant be the whole picture. its doubtful any of the large central banks are selling any physical. i havent see one pundit (sans george soros-although we assume it was paper gold) selling their gold or proclaiming its time to do so. breather perhaps? greece already priced into gold? then again, if you are holding it for purposes of real world protection rather than asset appreciation via trading, dont think you would want to sell until europe gets cleaned out and we see usdebtclock.org moving backwards in its debt tally......
One word: deflation. All asset classes will decline in price, including commodities.
GLD looking increasingly like the 2006 housing market: http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/quote?ticker=GLD:SP#chart
Yes, I own gold and silver bullion myself, but have been taking some profits very recently.
Are they that worried that Greece could start the waterfall? Or just stress enough of the other PIIGS to get it cascading down.
People worry about hyperinflation, but deflation is the big worry, hyperinflation is the cure (or the result).
pods
apples and oranges
Yes, I own gold and silver bullion myself, but have been taking some profits very recently.
same here
There's nothing quite like a controlled implosion for excitement, is there?
what else is he going to say? Of COURSE it wont affect anyone (wink, wink, nudge, nudge..)
PULL THIS LEG IT PLAYS JINGLE BELLS....
Meanwhile as all these sideshows overseas and carrot on a stick rumor driven markets march steadily upwards, no one is paying attention to the supposed $3 trillion thats expected to be delivered to stocks next week....because market conditions are so tenuous and all. LMAO.
GREEK WAY SANS LUBE = BULLISH
HIGHEST US POVERTY LEVELS EVER MEASURED.......... = BULLISH
THE NEW PARADIGM: THE MORE DIRE THE DATA THE MORE BULLISH
All news is bullish- Rule 48's / no shorts / EuroImplosion.
Got Gold?
As long as they can somehow label it all better than expected, then the algos go into churnfest mode and bid everything higher.
would someone please attempt to answer this, even with comedy, as I never been able to make any sense of it: Wouldn't it be easier for algos to drive the market down--i.e. induce panic selling--than to grind the market up?
Think of it as a fake auction. Where you have fake participants who drive the price up and then dump it to just the right sucker. You can't do that face to face people would figure it out. But behind computers people see someone trying to "outbid" them. So it's just kind of an extension of ebay. Ebay trained people to pay stupid money for stupid things so that all electronic markets would be the biggest suckers markets.
http://meowcheese.com/2008/04/y-u-outbid-me
Who was the little nutsack who came through and down voted every post?
i noticed that too...i want one!
It was Yancey Ward.
“Wait, didn't the Martians offer to buy Greek debt? Or was it that they were planning an invasion to help us out? I can't keep all this straight anymore.”
Tue, 09/13/2011 - 15:58 | Yancey Ward
I'm setting aside 3 gold maples to buy the olympic stadium in athens next year.
BTW, looks like a blanket junker surfed the thread. Everyone keeping score should reduce their red by 1. :D
Edit: got my -1 at 16:32.
hang on. gerard lyons is NOT stanchart CEO.
Huh, thats interesting. Maybe this is another planted story and Greece defaults tonite. After all, Fridays story was Greece would default over the weekend...now we hear from this guy .Not in the next 1 or 2 months, but likely at some point'.
Gee Im glad they found a cure to Fridays news of Greece going under during the weekend....what was the cure again?
Chief Economist and Group Head of Global Research
http://www.standardchartered.com/media-centre/key-people/gerard-lyons/en...
"A Controller Chapter 7"...
"A Controlled Demolition of WTC 7"...
Nothing to worry about folks! Everything will be juuuust fine!
Who are you going to believe; (a) a bunch of corrupt politicos (b) the bond market?
"Default, euro exit won’t “necessarily” occur in next 1 or 2 mos., but “quite likely at some stage" Da...More like imminent.......Greek 1 year Bond Yield at 135%
There is one logical point we can make with certainty here, we are all going to die and not naturally.
Thanks!
I was worrying about 'topping' myself for a while there - glad to hear you have alternative way!
Stage 1 - Greece won't default, Europe won't crash, no global recession
Stage 2 - ok, Greece will default, but Europe won't crash, no global recession
Stage 3 - you get the idea
The Greeks lied at the start and are lieing at the end: I love the consistancy! But all was in the (clean) cards - and all player knew it then as they do now: they just packed it and sold it to retail!
Fraud - systemic!
Result = chat chat chat and rescue!
Fraud!
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It has indeed already happened. The Troika failed by not asking for souls in exchange for cash last year. Who in their right mind would facilitate a loan of that magnatude, without security? Any standard bankruptcy, has a manager on site to control everything. This was not the case with Greece, there should have been seizure of the Finance Minisrty, and massive debt reduction induced (READ: FORCED BY EU), with EU Finance people on site for the next "X" number of years, as needed. The Troika through a series of video conferences and emails, assumed everything was a-okay. How irresponsible was that? Now, the shock when people hear it for the 10 trillionth time. Ackermann being heralded as a "visonary" of all things, for repeating what every news reporter has been saying for a year, but that's Germany, and that's a festering wound itself. Cut Greece loose, but let Germany go with them, in order for balance in the EU. Germany has an annoying habit of trying to control every organization it belongs to. Let them take their toys and find a new sandbox, with their phony export and production numbers, and their last 2 bankrupt banks. Invite China to a beerfest, maybe get them drunk enough to loan you money? Germany would have the homefield advantage.....?
Rabobank CEO: Greece goes bankrupt , 13 September 2011, (AD) (google trans from Dutch) http://tinyurl.com/6atrbny
Rabobank CEO Bert Bruggink: “ The question whether Greece goes bankrupt, is now over. The question is only when.”