Stephanopoulos: "You Reject That It’s A Tax Increase? " Obama: "I Absolutely Reject That Notion"

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From ABC

STEPHANOPOULOS:  You were against the individual mandate…

OBAMA:  Yes.

STEPHANOPOULOS:  …during the campaign.  Under this mandate, the government is forcing people to spend money, fining you if you don’t. How is that not a tax?

OBAMA:  Well, hold on a second, George. Here — here’s what’s happening.  You and I are both paying $900, on average — our families — in higher premiums because of uncompensated care.  Now what I’ve said is that if you can’t afford health insurance, you certainly shouldn’t be punished for that.  That’s just piling on. If, on the other hand, we’re giving tax credits, we’ve set up an exchange, you are now part of a big pool, we’ve driven down the costs, we’ve done everything we can and you actually can afford health insurance, but you’ve just decided, you know what, I want to take my chances.  And then you get hit by a bus and you and I have to pay for the emergency room care, that’s…

STEPHANOPOULOS:  That may be, but it’s still a tax increase.

OBAMA:  No.  That’s not true, George.  The — for us to say that you’ve got to take a responsibility to get health insurance is absolutely not a tax increase.  What it’s saying is, is that we’re not going to have other people carrying your burdens for you anymore than the fact that right now everybody in America, just about, has to get auto insurance. Nobody considers that a tax increase. People say to themselves, that is a fair way to make sure that if you hit my car, that I’m not covering all the costs.

STEPHANOPOULOS:  But it may be fair, it may be good public policy…

OBAMA:  No, but — but, George, you — you can’t just make up that language and decide that that’s called a tax increase.  Any…

STEPHANOPOULOS:  Here’s the…

OBAMA:  What — what — if I — if I say that right now your premiums are going to be going up by 5 or 8 or 10 percent next year and you say well, that’s not a tax increase; but, on the other hand, if I say that I don’t want to have to pay for you not carrying coverage even after I give you tax credits that make it affordable, then…

STEPHANOPOULOS:  I — I don’t think I’m making it up. Merriam Webster’s Dictionary: Tax — “a charge, usually of money, imposed by authority on persons or property for public purposes.”

OBAMA:  George, the fact that you looked up Merriam’s Dictionary, the definition of tax increase, indicates to me that you’re stretching a little bit right now.  Otherwise, you wouldn’t have gone to the dictionary to check on the definition.  I mean what…

STEPHANOPOULOS:  Well, no, but…

OBAMA:  …what you’re saying is…

STEPHANOPOULOS:  I wanted to check for myself.  But your critics say it is a tax increase.

OBAMA:  My critics say everything is a tax increase.  My critics say that I’m taking over every sector of the economy.  You know that. Look, we can have a legitimate debate about whether or not we’re going to have an individual mandate or not, but…

STEPHANOPOULOS:  But you reject that it’s a tax increase?

OBAMA:  I absolutely reject that notion.

 

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Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:27 | 2570119 DrDinkus
DrDinkus's picture

cant take it anymore...just want to chill in the choomwagon

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:29 | 2570132 Mr Lennon Hendrix
Mr Lennon Hendrix's picture

Waka waka!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:35 | 2570173 Titus
Titus's picture

Wanka Wanka! 

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:36 | 2570186 fourchan
fourchan's picture

and his whores agree its a tax too.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:49 | 2570252 Comay Mierda
Comay Mierda's picture

funny thing is this affordable care act is not affordable and blows the budget deficit even wider.

hyperinflation is fucking gauranteed now.

obummer fucker can tax 100% of all income and still wont have enough to balance his GAAP based budget deficit with obamacare.

Bernanke will have to put the printers in OVERDRIVE to pay for this piece of shit legislation and all the liberals still stupid enough to buy the "left/right" paradigm will blame the currency collapse on the "failure of capitalism" and the "tea party" meanwhile it was their own idiocy in voting for unaffordable handouts that brought it on

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:10 | 2570378 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

The comments have been hilarious all day!

Even funnier is that when the right proposed these same steps to counter what Hillary tried to do on health care, it was cool with you. Then when the American Enterprise Inst. said this kind of thing was really smart, you loved it. When Romney did it in Mass., he was so wonderful.

Now Obama does it and it's the end of the Republic, freedom, capitalism, freedom. all hope, and freedom. I think I strained a rib muscle laughing at you all day!

You know, gullibility is not a virtue. Oh, one more thing. HA!!!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:18 | 2570403 Comay Mierda
Comay Mierda's picture

only idiots like you still believe in the "left/right" paradigm. both parties want to bankrupt the USSA

you know what I believe in?

MATH

when GAAP expenses exceed revenues by about 2-3 times, there's a big fucking problem. now add obamacare expenses on top of that

that shortfall has to be filled with more taxes and more money printing.

basic fucking math.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:21 | 2570433 XitSam
XitSam's picture

Except the government doesn't use GAAP. The economy is doing fine. We're all good. /s

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:39 | 2570550 narapoiddyslexia
narapoiddyslexia's picture

bobnoxy hit it outta' the park, sucka's. Read it and weep.

Here's what the majority said -at the very end of Section III(D) of Robert's opinion-

"The Federal Government does have the power to impose a tax on those without health insurance. Section 5000A is therefore constitutional, because it can reasonably be read as a tax."

What Obama said to that Greek asshole is of no importance.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:52 | 2570649 Terminus C
Terminus C's picture

you know what is funny?

When a troll talks to him/her/itself.

Bobby, I knocked all of your teeth out the last time you opened your troll mouth here... do I need to break your jaw for you to get the point?

There aren't two parties in the American political system, only one... the sooner everyone takes the red pill the sooner this shit ends.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:57 | 2571054 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

The fantasies you create in your little mind. You did what, when? And just because you see things some warped way that I don't because it's too fucking stupid for me to accept doesn't mean you've won anything. Little people, little victories. But if it's all you have left in life, I guess you can keep them.

I'm betting that what sits behind your computer is a guy about 5 foot 2 and weighs about 125 poinds that's never been in a real fight in his life, just like all you pro-war chicken hawks. I think I'm safe around you.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 17:20 | 2571186 fuu
fuu's picture

I'll be your huckleberry.

Fri, 06/29/2012 - 01:15 | 2572351 Western
Western's picture

Oh hi max_fischer, nice sock puppet you got here.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:21 | 2570436 The They
The They's picture

the federal government can make us buy anything they want us to buy at the point of a gun! The next logical step is to give them the power to make us THINK anything they want us to think at the point of a gun...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:35 | 2570527 The Big Ching-aso
The Big Ching-aso's picture

 

 

I'm having trouble with the auto insurance comparison thingamajiggy.   First of all, I don't absolutely have to have a car.  If I don't have a car then I don't pay auto insurance.    However if my body is equivalent to a car then apparently all I have to do is get rid of my body and it's all apples to apples and I won't need to pay the obamacare tax because well I'm dead.    Ok, now I think I understand.   

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:41 | 2570561 JPM Hater001
JPM Hater001's picture

Funny how his case for personal responsibilty is to place the burden on all of us for the few...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:48 | 2570624 fourchan
fourchan's picture

score one for the kenyan

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:00 | 2570736 Ragnar24
Ragnar24's picture

Thank you! The basic act of simply being ALIVE does not carry the same monetary risks to OTHER humans. If I drop a battle axe on my jugular and can't afford the ER, then I DIE and no one pays for it.  If, on the other hand, I ram my SUV into a "Smart" car there's a good chance that the OTHER person is going to have medical bills... which is why car insurance is mandatory.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:04 | 2570765 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

What luck. You had insurance and didn't go bankrupt, making you a non-viable consumer for the rest of your life. I think you're starting to get this whole insurance/mandate thing, in your dumb ass kind of way.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:36 | 2570959 Max Fischer
Max Fischer's picture

 

 

If I drop a battle axe on my jugular and can't afford the ER, then I DIE and no one pays for it

Wow!  You right-wingers are incredibly fucking stupid!  AMAZING! 

Just because people can't afford the ER doesn't mean they aren't using it..... FOR EVERYTHING, even primary care shit.  The thing is, if you've got a battle axe stuck in your neck, you don't stop and say, "hey.... too bad I don't have health insurance... I guess I'll just die now." 

Republicans: feigning outrage and drumming up faux McCarthyism for 3 straight years!

MF

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 17:21 | 2571194 fuu
fuu's picture

Working all your alts today bitch.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 18:57 | 2571454 Ragnar24
Ragnar24's picture

Right winger Republican? There's only sheep and non-sheep.  Guess which one you are? Hint: If you still think there are "wings", you're one of the sheep.  

Aside from the baseless ad hominem fallacy of your poorly conceived rebuttal though, if you managed to check your premise that someone else will ALWAYS pay, then you might come understand how fucking IGNORANT you actually are.  

The only reason hospitals have not already gone bankrupt from treating uninsured patients is because the risk is transferred to the state (and the State).  If the implicit bailout of the hospital was removed from the equation, the hospitals would no longer treat battle axe wounds "free" of charge.  But state and local governments will never go bankrupt, right? So I suppose we don't have anything to worry about...

And I know you've been thoroughly mind-fucked by your poli-sci professor so I'm guessing you'll only be awakened once you run out of other people's money to support your idiotic ideology.

Fri, 06/29/2012 - 01:35 | 2572365 Western
Western's picture

lol, you always try to legitimize the false left-right paradigm it's so sad because the truth is obviously that america is in deep shit, no political party is going to save them. this is so obvious to everybody now, your tactics would have served better in 2002.

ps, putting a signature by your name is a hilarious quirk, it makes you memorable.

the only hope for you, as a paid internet opinion weather creator is that you actually do know what's going on and are just doing your job.

otherwise, MF, you are truly lost. may the divine have mercy on you.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:12 | 2570803 BeetleBailey
BeetleBailey's picture

Correct..the car insurance bullshit argument is just that - bullshit.

I laugh my ass off at these turd Progressives when they use this weak-assed reason. That SCOTUS used it shows how fucking STUPID they are -and how they think we're stupid.

FUCK THEM. FUCK ALL LIBERAL SHIT-EATING ASSCLOWNS, AND FUCK PROGRESSIVE CUNTS!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 17:15 | 2571160 Go Tribe
Go Tribe's picture

Yep. They're making us buy equities, too.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:31 | 2570494 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

Basic math, assuming costs remain the same so as to get a true picture of the factors you see fault with in isolation, suggests strongly that if someone is paying more, someone else is spending less.

As in, someone with insurance might now get preventive care, precluding a very expensive emergency room visit later. Or not being able to pay and sticking the hospital with the unpayable bill for an emergency room visit like now, transferred to the rest of us in the form of those steadily rising premiums we pay, or jacked up hospital fees.

You know, just how like the rest of us end up paying for shoplifitng losses. You know about that math, right? Or like how my car insurance bills keep rising because of all the accident fraud here in my state. If Obama guaranteed those losses, we wouldn't pay for them like we do now.

Basic math, and common sense. Bottom line, people won't go bankrupt due to medical bills, like they do now even with private insurance, and would then have money to spend on other things, right?

Take an Advil first. I know that's gonna hurt your head.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:54 | 2570691 suteibu
suteibu's picture

If Obama guaranteed those losses, we wouldn't pay for them like we do now.

You're an idiot who believes in the concept of Obama's "stash."  Where does the money come from to guarantee those losses?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:00 | 2570741 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

In this case, it comes from the free riders getting emergency care at the expense of the rest of us now paying for coverage, a basic concept of insurance, or pooling. Forced to buy coverage or pay that $100 tax that you're all feaking out about...never mind. You don't get it because your premise and beliefs require you don't. Have it your way, be stupid.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:15 | 2570831 TMT
TMT's picture

What if they can't afford the "penalty"?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:54 | 2571074 bobnoxy
bobnoxy's picture

$100? I guess that makes them your neighbors.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 18:20 | 2571371 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

So you're a classist fuck. Got it. I have friends who cannot afford that. That does not make them better or less than you and me. 

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:33 | 2570936 Whoa Dammit
Whoa Dammit's picture

The "free riders" will still be there you idiot. They will now all be getting free health insurance due to their "low income" status and the taxpayers will get the bill. 

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:38 | 2570951 BeetleBailey
BeetleBailey's picture

"Have it your way, be stupid."

Typical liberal bullshit cuntbag retort. Facist fuck.

Using bullshit apples to oranges comparisons (shoplifting......seriously???) to health care insurance is the big mistake here.

In addition, this "$100 tax" won't cover SHIT - WILL IT? If it were that simple, things would be all better in fucking utopia-land.

Kind of like...........oh....O'fuckface raising taxes on cigarettes 161%  - to pay for SCHIP bullshit insurance....AND....in the liberal fuckatard mindset, trying to tax smokers (which are mostly poor, so regressively) into quitting smoking....because of the cost.....THEN finding out the revenue from the added taxes IF the smokers DO quit, won't be enough to cover the fucking adult "kids" in the first place!

Smoke up people! We need the reve......WAIT! QUIT!.no....wait.....smoke....we need the bucks....

THEN the same fucktards let a tax loophole for "cigars" and people en mass switch to them.....fuckin laughable!

Fucking retarded...........

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 23:15 | 2572167 malek
malek's picture

 assuming costs remain the same

Right, and how much have health costs risen annually over the last 30 years?

And how many incentives were put into Obamacare to slow the increase?
NONE.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:40 | 2570556 sadmamapatriot
sadmamapatriot's picture

Individual mandate-invented by Republicans.

Romneycare-passed by Republicans.

Roberts-appointed by Republicans.

 

Well no shit, we are surrounded by fascists. But math is a bitch and she won't be ignored forever. And I will never again have blind party allegiance.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:55 | 2570692 Colonel
Colonel's picture

"Now Obama does it..." You mean like the same warmongering as Bush?

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 14:50 | 2570279 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

THIS IS NOT A TAX!!!! (nixon immitation)
.....
That 50% they'll subtrack from your wages to pay down the interest on the debt will be a tax...

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:38 | 2570511 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

Maybe I am thinking a bit too far outside the box here and if I am, junk me at your pleasure. However, if Chief Justice Roberts is as far right as I think he is, voting with the majority was a brilliant political maneuver.

By sanctioning the individual mandate as it truly is, a tax, he is forcing Obama to campaign for reelection with an albatross around his neck. That albatross is the fact that through his healthcare plan he will be berated as the man who raised taxes on everyone; rich, middle and poor.

Personally, I don't buy into the left/right paradigm, but most others do and the vote by Roberts is a simply a political move. He is saying to Obama, "If you really want this, I am going make you own it. So here it is, shoved right up your arse."

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:43 | 2570583 mkhs
mkhs's picture

Sacrifice the constitution for a veneal campaign ploy?  More likely he has dementia.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:45 | 2570595 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

The Constitution has been sacrificed for much less!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 19:36 | 2571566 TrulyBelieving
TrulyBelieving's picture

What Constitution? This law then subsequent ruling by the SCOTUS just about makes it irrelevent. This will constitutionally protect these statist to make the People submit to any tyranny they can concoct. Liberty and Freedom are defeated today, and tryanny rules supreme. God help us, and pass the ammo.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:44 | 2570587 sadmamapatriot
sadmamapatriot's picture

Even if Obamacare is repealed, the damage has been done, a mortal wound has been dealt to us all as the legal precedent has now been set. Any government mandate is now legal, period, end of story, as long as you add a tax to the mandate. What kind of mandates you think those self serving folks in DC can come up with? Plenty I tell you, and none of it good.

I am thinking it will be a mandate to buy solar panels from the next Solyndra or cars from GM next time they are failing. Do it for the good of the country, the environment, and the economy, or you will be taxed. I don’t buy any kind of Strategy behind this although it will be the catalyst to get Romney elected. This was just pure dumbfuckery.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:19 | 2570867 pods
pods's picture

I can think of an even more self serving one:

Gov. decrees that x% of your paycheck must buy T-bills.

If not, x% is taken as a tax to make up for the money you did not spend buying T-bills.

Hey why the hell not?  It is LaLa land now.  

pods

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:26 | 2570912 pods
pods's picture

Or, to keep with the mandate to purchase from a private entity:

The Federal Reserve wants to divest itself of the MBS garbage rotting within its hallowed halls.

The US Federal Government is now going to require every citizen to use x% of their income to purchase MBSs from the FED.

If not, said citizen will be required to pay a penalty (tax) equal to the difference between what they should have bought and did.

Then the US Fed.gov will use the proceeds to purchase the rest of the stink because the FED will not loan the Feds any more FRNs without compliance.

I can dream up some great things when ideas when rules no longer apply.

pods

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 17:25 | 2571207 Miffed Microbio...
Miffed Microbiologist's picture

Scary (but brilliant) thought! I'm sure it is being considered since now the sky is the limit with this precedent. However with only 50% of people paying income tax the revenue stream seems to be shrinking. Why not go all the way? Mandate all employers to directly submit paychecks to the federal government and they would reimburse the employee what they deem fit. That'll get the pitchforks going... I'm sick of all this incrementalism!

Miffed:-)

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 18:20 | 2571370 Small Business Guy
Small Business Guy's picture

IF they do try to mandate such purchases, Congress/POTUS will have to do it specifically as a "Tax".  No more trying to hide behind the Commerce clause of the US Constitution.

There goes an enormous hole for judicial activism that just got slammed shut.  Big, big win there.

Fri, 06/29/2012 - 00:05 | 2572274 HungrySeagull
HungrySeagull's picture

Sure, slap 30 solar panels on the house and I will recieve a check for exporting power each month.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 16:06 | 2570781 PartysOver
PartysOver's picture

Roberts miscalculated.  I will be voting for the first time ALL DEMOCRATS.  Crash this country sooner.  More opportunity for those smart enough to rebuild and make gadzillions.

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 22:06 | 2571997 Totentänzerlied
Totentänzerlied's picture

"he is forcing Obama to campaign for reelection with an albatross around his neck."

It would, except the ****ing rubes comprising his voter base (to be fair, Mittens' are equally scummy and idiotic) are far too busy being high on hopium to possibly care about such things.

They will happily and enthusiastically tell you "(the messiah comrade Obama) has fixed healthcare" and if you don't like it YOU HATE POOR PEOPLE AND ARE OBVIOUSLY AN INS CO. SHILL WHO PERSONALLY KILLS CANCER-STRICKEN INFANTS!!!1!1!!

Thu, 06/28/2012 - 15:55 | 2570693 ZackLo
ZackLo's picture

Sub-Prime sick care.....and you guys thought they ran out of ideas to blow one last bubble and get that last 5 percent in PPP adjusted buying power before we weimar it.

Mark my words when that money starts flooding at gunpoint the bubble will come and fall just like real estate.

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