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Trichet Repeats Call For European Finance Ministry, Abdication Of National Sovereignty

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The outgoing ECB president has just released an extremely long-winded speech titled "Tomorrow and the day after tomorrow: a vision for Europe" in which he once again makes the simple case that without someone paying for the European experiment (ahem Germany), and without a Finance Ministry being created (read fiscal union), there is not much future to the creature known as the EMU (and parodied earlier). To wit: "This European finance ministry would, first, oversee the surveillance of both fiscal policies and competitiveness policies, and when necessary, have responsibility for imposing the “second stage” I just described. Second, the ministry would perform the typical responsibilities of the executive branches regarding the supervision and regulation of the EU financial sector. And third, the ministry would represent the euro area in international financial institutions. Since my Karlspreis address, it seems to me that the case for such an approach has strengthened." He reiterates his call for the United Empire of Europe: "Increasingly, it seems that it is not too bold to consider a European finance ministry, but rather too bold not to consider creating such an institution." Naturally he concludes: "Exactly how these new institutions would eventually evolve one cannot say." So don't worry about the details (typical Europe) just promptly sign off your independence to those who know better than you what to do (and can afford to pay for what is best for you). Wonderful. Now have fun selling the proposal of abdicating sovereignty to those European countries which are not Germany, with a particular focus on France and Italy.

From the ECB:

Tomorrow and the day after tomorrow: a vision for Europe

Speech by Jean-Claude Trichet, President of the ECB, at the Humboldt University, Berlin, 24 October 2011

It is a great pleasure to be invited to speak here at the Humboldt University this evening. One can only be honoured to be in the university of Hegel, Heinrich Heine and the Nobel prize-winning physicists Albert Einstein and Max Planck – not to mention 27 other laureates. But it is with the ideas of the university’s founder – Wilhelm von Humboldt – that I would like to begin my remarks.

As a Frenchman who has lived in Germany for the past eight years, I note with interest that the mother of the university’s founder – Marie-Elisabeth Colomb – came from a French Huguenot family who also made that eastwards move. Her family had emigrated to Berlin following the Revocation of the Edict of Nantes, a reminder that European integration is a process that has been with us for centuries.

Wilhelm von Humboldt himself was deeply engaged with the question of how to create the conditions for individuals to flourish within a society. His answer involved removing the conditions for mutual harm.

In some ways, this speaks to the challenges of European integration.

The individual Member States of the European Union (EU) also seek to flourish. Their actions are interdependent and can both benefit and damage each other. Removing the potential for mutual harm is essential for collective prosperity.

This dialectic between the individual and the community is at the core of the European project. It is the dialectic between the individual nation states and the community of nations. And it presents some of Europe’s most fundamental challenges.

I would like to reflect today on how to address these challenges – to look forward and offer a perspective of where Europe could go.

In particular, I would like to develop three propositions.

First, while the reasons for European unity have often been presented as deriving from past conflicts and past divisions, forward-looking motivations are in my view decisive.

The unique construction of Europe – with strong local identities and large, integrated markets – is a source of great strength in the new, globalised world we face. It allows Europeans to plant deep roots and build strong communities. At the same time, we can fully benefit from economies of scale and the free flow of trade and investment.

For this reason, European integration is profoundly in the interests of all Member States and deeply connected to their future prosperity.

Second, for Europe to realise fully its future potential, it needs the right rules and the right institutions.

Europe requires a solid form of governance to ensure that the actions of individual countries are oriented towards the common good. Our current arrangements have not yet fully met this standard. They are now being improved. It is a continuous process which will call for Treaty changes if necessary.

As this process will take time, we need to start planning today for the Europe of tomorrow and the Europe of the day after tomorrow.

Third, the underpinning of a more integrated Europe is the emergence of a true European public debate.

As one would say in German, die Schaffung einer europäischen Öffentlichkeit.

Europeans today are highly interconnected via economic and social linkages. Yet our fragmented national public discourse does not necessarily permit citizens to understand fully these connections.

A true European public debate would help us deepen our interest in each other, bridge our linguistic differences and care more about what is happening across our borders.

These are the three main themes on which I will focus tonight.

But before I talk about the Europe of the future, I would like to talk about the Europe of today. To reflect on the relationship between member countries and Europe. And to touch on the challenges we collectively face in tackling the crisis.

1. Europe and Germany

Building deeper union between France and Germany in the service of Europe has been an important theme of my own working life. In this time, I have been profoundly influenced by the German commitment to a stability culture.

In the 1980s, I was seen in my own country as the strongest advocate of the ‘franc fort’ policy. This policy was designed to be part of the modernisation of the French economy through a “competitive disinflation” policy.

In the 1990s, I worked side-by-side with Hans Tietmeyer and Horst Köhler to contribute to the foundations of the euro in the Maastricht Treaty. This work was to ensure that, among other things, the European Central Bank (ECB) would be based on the principles of independence and the pursuit of price stability.

Then in 2003, I had the honour of moving to Frankfurt to become President of this institution.

It was a great personal satisfaction to join an institution that embodied my deep-seated beliefs in central bank independence, price stability and economic discipline.

Over this period I have developed a strong admiration for Germany and its people, and also for the way that Germany conducts its economic policies.

The German economy has often been thought of as the engine of the European economy. But less than 10 years ago, Germany was seen by some observers as the “sick man of Europe”.

Let me cite some books and newspaper articles from that time:

“Can Germany be saved?”, asked one of this country’s most well-known economists in 2003, noting that “Germany provides something of a case study of what not to do in designing a prosperous future”.

“How the mighty are fallen”, said a major international magazine also in 2003, well representing the mainstream economic analysis. "After the German economy was seen as an exemplary model of successful capitalism for decades,” the magazine went on, “ today it is Germany that economists point to with a mixture of contempt and alarm.”

“Vom Meister zum Mittelmaß”, wrote a major German newspaper in 2005, speaking of “absteigende Staaten wie Deutschland, die in ihrer Bedeutung schrumpften und ihren Haushalt nicht in den Griff bekämen.

Thankfully, these gloomy forecasts proved mistaken, and today, Germany is in the lead in rebounding from the crisis.

Since the trough of mid-2009, German real GDP has grown by 6.9% compared with the euro area as a whole by 3.8%. Employment in Germany has increased by 2.1%. Exports have grown by 25.6%. This performance is no accident. Neither is it based on cyclical, unsustainable factors. It is the result of sound fiscal policies, permanent attention to unit labour costs, and bold reforms that have been rigorously implemented over a prolonged period. And it sets an example that is very important for the current situation.

First, it demonstrates how sound policies can lead to prosperity within economic and monetary union.

By encouraging industries to embrace the opportunities of globalisation. By maintaining technological excellence. By prioritising cost and price competitiveness. And by ensuring flexibility in the labour market.

Second, it proves that it is possible to regain competitiveness within monetary union.

Germany after the post-unification boom had a very serious competitiveness problem itself. It took a sustained effort to become competitive again.

This gives encouragement to euro area countries that have lost competitiveness and now must regain it. It also underscores the fact that the adjustment effort must begin immediately.

But there is also a third lesson from the German example.

Would the German recovery have been possible without the euro and Germany being in the euro area? Without Germany benefiting from a vast single market of the size of the United States with a highly stable currency?

The German recovery has taken place in the context of the best inflation record achieved by a major central bank for over 50 years. The ECB has delivered an average rate of inflation of 2.0% since beginning operations in 1999. In Germany it is even lower with an average yearly inflation rate of 1.57%.

Such a low rate of inflation over a comparable time period is actually the lowest in Germany for over 50 years. Moreover, expectations of future inflation remain firmly anchored in line with our definition of price stability.

Financial markets and euro area citizens expect the ECB to deliver on its mandate. The German public can rely on our steadfast commitment to do so.

The euro has extended the zone of monetary stability to Germany’s main trading partners in the euro area. As more than 40% of Germany’s exports go to other euro area countries, this is very important for German prosperity. The stability of the euro has also helped German companies remain competitive vis-à-vis the rest of the world.

2. Europe and the crisis

Let me now turn directly to our current challenges. As you are all well aware, we continue to face the most serious economic and financial crisis since World War II. Tackling the crisis has required unprecedented action from public authorities to maintain economic and financial stability.

Inevitably this has produced diverging views. This is not surprising. The euro area is responding to events of historical importance and it naturally takes time to forge consensus on the right way ahead.

But it is very important that people do not misconstrue these debates. They are about policies, not about principles, because in the euro area our principles do not change.

Our principles are the foundations on which we rest. Stability. Responsibility. Independence.

But our policies must adapt. No two crises are the same. It is precisely because we want to defend and reinforce the principles we cherish, that we have to shape our policies appropriately.

I am fully aware that in this country people have genuine concerns about the single currency. They seek assurance that it remains a community of stability. That it is founded on rules and responsibilities. And that the rules are respected and the responsibilities are taken seriously.

I would like to use this occasion to explain the way the Governing Council of the ECB is deciding on monetary policy.

Our standard measure for fulfilling our mandate of maintaining price stability – avoiding both inflation and deflation – is interest rate policy. But effective interest rate policy requires that our policy decisions are transmitted to the real economy. If that is not the case, our monetary policy cannot achieve its objective.

In this transmission, both banks and financial markets play an important role. They are crucial for the financing of the real economy – of firms and households. Yet the crisis has damaged banks and at times severely disrupted the functioning of financial markets.

Addressing these problems needed to be done through non-standard measures. The ECB has decided such measures, for monetary policy reasons, since the very start of the global crisis. It has been offering liquidity to financial institutions at a fixed rate and with full allotment. It has also provided this liquidity over an extended period of time, up to 12 months, so that the euro area banking sector, Germany’s banks included, could continue to be as correct as possible a vehicle for the transmission of our monetary policy.

With additional liquidity demanded by the euro area banks, our balance sheet has expanded during the crisis. But we have been prudent. Our balance sheet has expanded by about 80% since the beginning of the crisis. Only for the sake of comparison the balance sheet of the Federal Reserve increased by about 230%, that of the Bank of England by 205%, and that of the Swiss National Bank by 235%. The crisis hit all of the economies concerned, but you can see that all our non-standard policies have been measured.

Of all our non-standard measures, the policy of full liquidity allotment at fixed rates has been the most important one in my view. Yet it is the bond market interventions that have received the greatest attention, and the most scrutiny.

But just as our measures of enhanced credit support have been necessary to ensure that banks continue to extend credit to the real economy, our bond market interventions have been necessary to help foster a more appropriate transmission of our policies to the real economy. The government bond markets are crucial for our monetary policy transmission. They largely determine the prices of loans and mortgages and thus affect, indirectly, the transmission of monetary policy to all firms and households.

The ECB’s government bond market interventions are not inflationary. Unlike the bond purchase programmes of other major central banks our aim is not to inject additional liquidity. We actually absorb all liquidity injected by these purchases on a regular basis – euro for euro, week by week.

There is no fuelling of money growth in the euro area. M3 growth is less than 3% currently and inflation expectations have remained firmly anchored by all standards.

So let me emphasise this point. It is very important to understand that all the ECB’s policy decisions during the crisis have been made fully in line with our mandate to maintain price stability.

They have been taken in full independence and we have established a solid track record for our independent decisions. Both inflation and inflation expectations in the euro area demonstrate the value of independent deeds, not just words.

Last week in Frankfurt, at the occasion of my official farewell as President of the ECB, Prime Minster Juncker, the longest-serving prime minister in Europe and chair of the Eurogroup, said that discussions of government pressure on the ECB lacked any basis in fact, that such pressure would have been completely futile and that the ECB always acts completely independently.

3. Europe and the future

I have talked about where Europe has come from. Let me turn now to where Europe is going.

When people seek a justification for European integration, there is a tendency to look backwards.

European integration has banished the spectre of war from our continent, is always stressed. European integration has delivered the longest period of peace and prosperity in European history.

This perspective is entirely correct. But it is also incomplete.

There are many more reasons for striving towards “ever closer union” in Europe today than there were in 1945. And these are entirely forward-looking.

65 years ago the distribution of global GDP was such that Europe had only one role model for its single market: the United States of America.

Today, Europe is faced with a new global economy, reconfigured by globalisation and by the emerging economies of Asia and Latin America.

It is a world where economies of scale and networks of innovation matter more than ever. By 2016 – that is, very soon – we can expect the euro area in terms of purchasing power parity to be below the GDP of China and over and above the GDP of India. Together, these two countries would represent around twice the GDP of the euro area.

Over a longer horizon, the entire GDP of the G7 countries will be dwarfed by the rapid development of the systemic emerging economies.

Europe has to cope with a new geo-political landscape very profoundly reshaped by these emerging economies.

And Europe is also faced with new global challenges, such as climate change and migration, where effective solutions are possible only at the European and international levels.

In this new global constellation, European integration – both economic and political – is central to achieving prosperity and influence. For an outward-looking, export-oriented country like Germany, this is profoundly in its interests.

The challenge is to set the correct path for European integration. Getting this right is essential to realise fully our continent’s tremendous potential. Let me therefore lay out a vision for the Europe of tomorrow.

The Europe of tomorrow

The creation of Europe’s economic and monetary union is unique in the history of sovereign states. The euro area constitutes a “society of states” of a completely new type.

Like individuals in a society, euro area countries are both independent and interdependent. They can affect each other both positively and negatively.

Good governance requires that both individual Member States and the institutions of the EU fulfil their responsibilities.

First and foremost, every country in the euro area needs to keep its own house in order.

This means responsible economic policies on behalf of governments and rigorous mutual surveillance of those policies by the Commission and Member States – going beyond the indispensable surveillance of fiscal policies to encompass all aspects of the economy.

In a society, the institutions of law enforcement can ultimately compel a citizen to abide by the rules. In the euro area, our framework based on surveillance and sanctions depends on the willingness of offending states to comply.

I am aware that many observers wonder what can be done if a Member State simply cannot deliver on its promises.

That is why, when I had the deep honour of receiving the Karlspreis, I suggested a new approach to the policing of economic governance.

For countries that lose market access, the current approach of providing aid against strong conditionality is justified. Countries deserve an opportunity to put the situation right themselves and to restore stability.

But as I suggested in Aachen, this approach should have clearly defined limits. A second stage should be envisaged for a country that persistently fails to meet its programme targets.

Under this second stage, euro area authorities would gain a much deeper and more authoritative role in the formulation of that country’s economic policies.

This would move us away from the present concept where all decisions remain in the hands of the country concerned. Instead, it would be not only possible, but in some cases compulsory, for the European authorities to take direct decisions.

Implementing this idea of the second stage would evidently require a Treaty change. It would also imply a new concept of sovereignty. This is necessary given the complex interdependence that exists between euro area countries. And it is ultimately in the interests of all citizens of the euro area.

In my view, it was important to launch such reflections as soon as possible. I am very happy that the European Council, at its meeting yesterday in Brussels, has indicated in its conclusions: “The European Council notes the intention of the Heads of State or Government of the euro area to reflect on further strengthening of economic convergence within the euro area, on improving fiscal discipline and deepening economic union, including exploring the possibility of limited Treaty changes.”

The Europe of the day after tomorrow

Let me now look even further into the future. A vision that can stabilise expectations needs to address not just tomorrow, but also the day after tomorrow. And as it takes time to implement such a vision, we must start thinking about it today.

It is my firm conviction that the Europe of the day after tomorrow will be of an original type – a new type of institutional framework.

In Aachen, on a personal basis, I began to reflect on some elements of this new possible framework.

I asked the question: with a single market, a single currency and a single central bank, would it be too bold to envisage a ministry of finance of the Union?

This European finance ministry would, first, oversee the surveillance of both fiscal policies and competitiveness policies, and when necessary, have responsibility for imposing the “second stage” I just described.

Second, the ministry would perform the typical responsibilities of the executive branches regarding the supervision and regulation of the EU financial sector.

And third, the ministry would represent the euro area in international financial institutions.

Since my Karlspreis address, it seems to me that the case for such an approach has strengthened.

I now hear leaders calling for a Treaty change to create stronger economic governance at the EU level. I hear euro area citizens calling for better supervision of the financial sector. And I know that our partners in the G20 look to Europe as a whole for solutions, not to individual Member States.

Increasingly, it seems that it is not too bold to consider a European finance ministry, but rather too bold not to consider creating such an institution.

This finance ministry would be only one element of the European future institutional framework. Exactly how these new institutions would eventually evolve one cannot say. As Jean Monnet once wrote: « Personne ne peut encore dire aujourd’hui la forme qu’aura l’Europe que nous vivrons demain, car le changement qui naîtra du changement est imprévisible ». [1]

We have several federal or confederal institutional frameworks in today’s world. To name only a few, the United States of America, the Federal Republic of Germany and the Swiss Confederation. The European Union is unique in its past history, in its present nature, in its future ambition. It will have to invent its own concept.

But one could imagine that in the future European institutional framework, the Council might evolve into the Senate of the Union, the European Parliament into the lower house, the Commission into the executive and the European Court of Justice into the judiciary – each time for the part of sovereignty that is shared.

And I have no doubt, taking into account the long and proud history of the European countries, that “subsidiarity” will play a major role in the future Europe – very significantly more than in the present models of federation.

As I said, these are personal remarks of a European citizen. The future of Europe is in the hands of its democracies, in the hands of the people of Europe. Our fellow citizens will decide. They are the masters.

In any case, whatever the future institutions of Europe will be, an essential element would be the emergence of a truly pan European public debate. As Europeans we connect deeply with our nations, traditions and histories. These are Europe’s roots. But we also need to extend our branches more widely.

To do this, the Euro area needs media, in the broadest sense of that word, that allow citizens to take a deeper interest each other. Media that provide regular information on events beyond national borders. Media that permit citizens to debate and exchange. And media that are not constrained by language barriers. All we need is a pan European public debate, a gemeinsamer öffentlicher Raum, a débat publique pan-Européen that allows Europeans to appreciate the wider community of which they are part – a community where their interests are increasingly shared and their lives more interdependent than ever before.

***

Let me draw to a close.

Twenty years ago, in 1991, my friend Hans Tietmeyer, the former President of the Bundesbank, said that “monetary union is not just a technical matter. It is in itself, to some extent, a political union”.

This condition creates mutual responsibilities.

We see that a challenge in one country can become a challenge for the euro area as a whole. Addressing it requires strong responses from all Member States, including Germany, and from EU institutions.

The global crisis has called into question the overall economic and financial strategy of major advanced economies. All have weaknesses in their economic systems. Not surprisingly, the main weakness for Europe was the nature of its institutional framework – in particular, that its economic and fiscal governance was not commensurate with the interconnectedness of economies sharing a single market and a single currency.

The question is how to confront those obstacles. We should not look back. We must look forward – to the opportunities of Europe for our collective betterment; and to the potential for every country to be stronger and more prosperous in a well-functioning union.

As far as the ECB is concerned, its Governing Council will continue to anchor solidly price stability and confidence in Europe – stability and confidence for 17 countries and 332 million fellow citizens who have decided to unite closely with a single market and a single currency. As Konrad Adenauer said in Aachen 57 years ago: “Gerade wird man die Mahnung verstehen, dass Europa uns heute Schicksalsgemeinschaft ist. Dieses Schicksal zu gestalten ist uns übergeben”. “Above all, people will understand the call: that Europe, for us today, is a community with a common destiny. It’s up to us to shape that destiny”.

Thank you for your attention.

 

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Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:34 | 1804752 Mongo
Mongo's picture

Lunitics running the asylum

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:41 | 1804785 slaughterer
slaughterer's picture

What non-Europeans too easily forget is how economically competitive against one another all the member states of the EU are.  There is no way that they would relinquish sovereignty unless forced to.   It would be tantamount to losing a competitive advantage against the other countries. 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:43 | 1804795 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Abandon the experiment before they blow up the lab!!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:46 | 1804809 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

This will sell like frankfurters east of the Rhine;)

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:52 | 1804833 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture

 

 No, no.

 

As the experiment is blowing up, the lab clearly needs to be bigger.

 

Even the Vatican says the lab needs to be bigger - but it should be the whole world.  Calvi spoke from the grave.  Special phone.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:54 | 1804849 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Abandon the experiment before they blow up the lab!!

But everything has worked flawlessly so far. What could possibly go wrong?

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 18:05 | 1806150 Imminent Crucible
Imminent Crucible's picture

What could possibly go wrong? Funny you should ask. What if Goldman Sachs took control of Europe?

After all, Tricky said, "For countries that lose market access, the current approach of providing aid against strong conditionality is justified." Translation: "Maastricht Treaty don't mean nuthin until we have a political union with the ECB in control."

Who takes over after Trichet? Mario Draghi, Goldman's operative in Italy.

So Tricky calls for European states to yield their sovereignty to the ECB, which in turn defers to Goldman Sachs.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:49 | 1804819 CPL
CPL's picture

GDP of Hungary is equal to Germany don't ya know.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:47 | 1804807 rocker
rocker's picture

Kit Juckes from Societe Gererale, Head of Foreign Research on Bloomberg sasy U.S. will pay.

Kit Juckes says they need 2 trillion.  Hello Big Ben. They are calling you.

And they wonder why everythng is rigged for the rich.

It just gives me a warm feeling knowing I am paying for the bonuses of the European Banksters.

Just after paying for Lloyd Blankfein's 100 million dollar bonus.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:09 | 1804903 vamoose1
vamoose1's picture

tyler is a one  dimensional fool,   aka  an  idiot,  the  frigging  dow  prob  goes  to  20000  in  some  kind  of  an ersatz   dollar,  but  could  we  perhaps  grow  up.stop   humiliating  yourself.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:16 | 1804932 Jean
Jean's picture

Follow the debt, the equity prices are just the magician's off hand.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:35 | 1804754 AnAnonymous
AnAnonymous's picture

The dream of pan European US citizens...

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:37 | 1804766 bigwavedave
bigwavedave's picture

Wanker

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:37 | 1804767 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

great idea, at least everyone speaks the same language. :roll:

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:41 | 1804789 sabra1
sabra1's picture

PIIGS Latin?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:04 | 1804886 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

Anguish?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:39 | 1804777 Segestan
Segestan's picture

If you think his idealism is foolish, just imagine Europa was going to be the seat of Anti-Christ. Amazing the dreams that real labor has to support. Oh well I guess well see what happens to the dream of multi-cult next?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:40 | 1804779 mynhair
mynhair's picture

Too long for algos to read.  Resume climb.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:51 | 1804837 CPL
CPL's picture

Someone pulled the plug in the tub, algos are trading on vapour.

 

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:56 | 1804859 mynhair
mynhair's picture

Give it 90 minutes.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:40 | 1804782 xcehn
xcehn's picture

Things are obviously ridiculously hopeless in Euroland.  Which end is up?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:40 | 1804784 monopoly
monopoly's picture

I PROMISE, the way this is playing out there will not be a day after tomorrow for the euro. It is over, remove the respirator already.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:41 | 1804786 Uncle Sam
Uncle Sam's picture

Isn't this the ascendancy of the 'Fourth Reich'?

Aided and abetted by French Vichy?

Endorsed by the Catholic Church?

Haven't I heard this before somewhere?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:42 | 1804790 Nascent_Variable
Nascent_Variable's picture

It's incredible that this lying, incompetent criminal has the nerve to say that the solution to the problem he and his ilk created is for all of Europe to abdicate their national sovereignty to the same cartel that wrecked the continent's finances.

Trichet would have the EU match the tyranny of the federal government in the US.  The unique cultures of the member states would give way more and more to a homogenous, soulless mass of debt slaves serving their banker masters.

Centralization and globalization have failed.  The results are all around us.  The larger and more complex the system gets, the more power and wealth get concentrated in the hands of the corrupt and incompetent.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:19 | 1804941 donsluck
donsluck's picture

I disagree. Competence is successfully impementing your plans. Corrupt yes, incompetent no.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:42 | 1804791 oogs66
oogs66's picture

well, he does need a new job, should we consider this an application for the position he is creating?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:43 | 1804793 Jonas Parker
Jonas Parker's picture

Reminds me of a small boy walking home in the dark whistling loudly past the graveyard...

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:43 | 1804794 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

I wanna see how Ze Germans swallow this

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:13 | 1804918 Pinto Currency
Pinto Currency's picture

 

I once read a comment that Germans don't riot in the streets.  They buy gold.  That's how Germans speak out.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:24 | 1804961 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

Only if you do something outrageous like renovate an old railway station (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2010/oct/01/protest-germany-stut...) when however your country gets sold down the river by the global banking mafia they tend to go watch 'dancing with the stars' like every other civilized nation

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:43 | 1804796 DonutBoy
DonutBoy's picture

We have to pass the bill so you can see what's in it.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:44 | 1804798 The4thStooge
The4thStooge's picture

Ze Germans are obviously ze only vons capable of keeping zer finances in orda. Zerfore ze otha European countries must forfeit zeir sovereignty to ze 4th reich!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:45 | 1804805 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

Yes only if you mean Ze German(s) Jews running Ze Germany

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 17:10 | 1804815 kaiserhoff
kaiserhoff's picture

That's not German, it's Austrian;)

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:46 | 1804804 LongSoupLine
LongSoupLine's picture

A long-winded rambling that attempts to bridge the gap between logic and complete insanity which, in turn, creates a fragmented perpetual loop dissertation of realistic non-solutions.

My guess?....it gets him a Nobel Prize in the "WTF?" category. (read: past winners - Krugman, Obama, etc)

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:46 | 1804806 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Translation; "We need to have a much bigger debate and much more time to discuss it"

My prediction, no immediate resolution, another set of meetings scheduled - rally on.  I mean why would anyone actually do anything when doing nothing is working out so well.?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:50 | 1804827 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

They cant actually deliver a set plan, carrots and sticks are working so much better!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:47 | 1804812 FutureShock
FutureShock's picture

I hear greeks are leaving for Austrailia in droves, Long European airlines and Au apartment buildings.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:50 | 1804830 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

I heard down-under accepts any scum coming their way with open arms, after all the country was founded as a penal colony

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:12 | 1804915 Shirley Wilfahrt
Shirley Wilfahrt's picture

Kinda like Georgia USA....except with killer beaches and less inbreeding....

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:51 | 1804835 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

They have gold apartment buildings in Austrailia?  Wow, I am in.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:05 | 1804890 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

Good, feed them into that housing Ponzi you got going down under. Keep that going before the AUD gets recognized for what it is: paper... I mean plastic.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:49 | 1804820 PaperBear
PaperBear's picture

I suppose we Europeans have been dumb enough to go along with the situation thus far, why should our overlords not continue on with this nonsense.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:49 | 1804821 Matto
Matto's picture

Haha nice idea, lets see the people of europe join together and become one with their brothers- its amazing they've gotten this far!!

Aren't we due a major war in europe right about now? Just checking my calendar.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:51 | 1804825 bob_dabolina
bob_dabolina's picture

MS just shit itself

Huge candle on HYG about 10 minutes ago

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:50 | 1804826 spiral_eyes
spiral_eyes's picture

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:50 | 1804829 Lebensphilosoph
Lebensphilosoph's picture

"European integration has banished the spectre of war from our continent, is always stressed."

As did the Imperium Romanorum.

 

Well, we already have a European Ministry of Truth, so why not one of finance then, eh?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:54 | 1804851 Azannoth
Azannoth's picture

When Truth is not something you have to empirically prove but something regulated by bureaucrats and something you may very well go to jail for, you know something has to be amiss, when Big Lies are considered 'sacrosanct truths' and blatantly obvious facts outlawed you can only do 1 prudent thing, pack your bags and get out of Doge

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:17 | 1804934 lolmao500
lolmao500's picture

"European integration has banished the spectre of war from our continent, is always stressed."

As would have a third reich. So why did people fight again?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:50 | 1804831 TooBearish
TooBearish's picture

NWO - game plan from the get go....even Vatican endorsing one Global Central Bank...

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:03 | 1804874 mvsjcl
mvsjcl's picture

Yep. Exactly. Just need a little more pain for the unwashed. They will make sure that threshold is reached. Meanwhile, more crisis, more meetings, more roil and upheaval--more confusion to mask the incremental moves leading to the End Game. Damn, that Tolkein guy sure was smart:

One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them,
One Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:07 | 1804897 Catullus
Catullus's picture

Even if you don't call it NWO, it seems like this is the only real explaination. One world currency, one common balance sheet, one set of regulations, eventually one world government. They're pushing a crisis to structure the debate to conclude that their "solution" is the only one.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:50 | 1805084 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Don't forget about one world religion!  Vatican-style, anyone?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 14:38 | 1805298 SilverBaron
SilverBaron's picture

"...these institutions play a crucial role in our quest for a new world order.  An order in which no nation must surrender one iota of its own sovereignty."

George H.W. Bush in an address to the U.N.

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:52 | 1804839 seek
seek's picture

First it's suggested Europe give up sovereignty, then the the Vatican suggests a central bank for the entire world: http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/24/idUS264245887020111024

The good news is we can stop worry about peak out, as long as we connect generators to conspiracy theorists that are spinning.

In all seriousness, I knew a lot of this was to push for more super-national government, but they're laying it on pretty thick these days. Bigger is worse, not better, I hope OWS adds that to their message.

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:51 | 1804840 q1w2reader
q1w2reader's picture

They fail therefore they need more power to succeed?! This is just too far out. Maybe if I bang my head against the table for a bit, my brain will switch back to reality from this too weird alternate dimension or state of consciousness.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:52 | 1804841 AngryGerman
AngryGerman's picture

too much bs to read right now. will take it later with me to the shitter, but not for reading

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:52 | 1804844 SheepDog-One
SheepDog-One's picture

So, a big part of 'EFSF' will be turning in all sovereignty cards? Wow that sounds bullish for riots.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:53 | 1804846 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

So he wants all of Europe to be ruled by a few select Bankers?

What can possibly go wrong?

Mayer Rothschild would be so fuckin proud.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 12:56 | 1804854 Lebensphilosoph
Lebensphilosoph's picture

Wars on the continent have generally been fought to assert sovereignty. So, naturally, the 'banishing' of war is in this case coincident with the relinquishing of this sovereignty. That is to say, our lands have been occupied without a fight.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:24 | 1804881 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

But the question is why do we have to be "competitive"

Its because the now free from Sovergin Euro banks shifted huge quanties of European capital to China & the other Brics, reimporting credit slave arbitrage.

European Technological capital appreciation has collapsed since the early 90s - with capital redirected towards Asia

Two coal fired power stations a week need finance you know.

The man is a modern day slave owner.

Marx Labour theory of value is the ECBs true Bible.

De Gaulle is spinning in his grave.

This is a explosive BIS report - it demands considered attention.

www.bis.org/publ/work346.pdf   Also check out Graph 10 cross border claims by bank location - ............... off shore centres dwarf all others   Also graph 5 - gross capital flows - advanced see western countries  have been exporting massive amounts of capital while OPEC  not so much. This means we would not have a western energy crisis if we redirected our capital internally over the years.    
Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:27 | 1804972 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

 

 

Thank You Kind Sir!' for the GREAT information!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:04 | 1804889 lindaamick
lindaamick's picture

Central Planning efforts generally fail when a great deal of diversity exists within the entity to be Centrally planned.

I think Europe consists of countries with a GREAT DEAL of diversity.

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:12 | 1804913 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

The Pope takes it a step further and calls for world bank:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/24/idUS264245887020111024

Without a doubt it would be as infallible and incorruptible as the Vatican itself.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:20 | 1804948 JW n FL
JW n FL's picture

 

 

When Europe Fails!

The U.S. Dollar will gain strength, at first..

and then..

the vacuum, the gravity, the wave will swamp the boat that we are all riding in.

what will be the sales pitch, while Europe is suffering in heavy rotation on ALL Corporate Owned News stations?

what are they trying to sell us, while watching others suffer, while being threatened with our own down fall.

what are they going to push, in what way are "We the People" about to be manipulated, again?

what do they want from "We the People" now?

I dont know what the sales pitch will be.. but the result will be the same that it ALWAYS IS!

More for them!

and..

Less for U.S.!

Thank God they are busy doing God's Work! which is code for.. separating us form yet more of our work product so that they can have more of money that they then doing nothing productive with.. other than create new derivatives that We the People MUST! Backstop.. any loses are ours and any profits are Thiers!

and that is what we get for being ignorant!

a fool and his money.. should be a kind hearted, uneducated, hard working person is soon stripped / ripped off by some greedy, psycho who has no real use for the extra production.. that is produced by someone else.

It is not only ok to rob from "We the People"!

It is Celebrated!

It is Honored!!

Stealing from the Many! is the Status Quo's RIGHT! and OBLIGATION!! to ensure Prosperity for America and the WORLD!

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:24 | 1804957 lincolnsteffens
lincolnsteffens's picture

Oooo, the last time felt sooo good I think I'll bend over and take a bigger one.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:43 | 1805051 quacker
quacker's picture

 

History has shown again and again that the elite are absolutely miserable with their heads on top of their shoulders.

They absolutely DEMAND to be relieved of their heads. They are given 1,000 opportunities to just change direction and let the people off the hook. But they will not. The gambling debts of the elite must at all costs be borne by the people.

And they absolutely will not stop, EVER, until they are relieved of their heads. The pre-revolutionary state usually lasts for years, if not decades. Every crisis gives them a chance to change direction. To simply have people who are already rich, write down some debt. That’s all it would take.

And yet the global elites stubbornly, adamantly, crisis after crisis after crisis, with hundreds of chances to simply let the people off the hook for the mistakes of their friends, instead INSIST on using each opportunity to only grab MORE power for their friends!

They absolutely insist, they DEMAND, they will stop at nothing until their heads are removed from their bodies.

At some point, the people will oblige.

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:54 | 1805099 MarcusLCrassus
MarcusLCrassus's picture

Blood for the blood god! 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 13:55 | 1805102 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

 "Our fellow citizens will decide. They are the masters."   What a crock of shite!!!!

Hegel would be so very proud of the dialectic-espousing Trichet!

Problem-Reaction-Solution......remember that, folks!  It's the true name of the game to bring about the synthetic solution: "global government".  

This is so predictable, it's almost boring!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 14:00 | 1805126 Banksters
Banksters's picture

Fuck Trichet, Fuck the Pope, Fuck the EU, Fuck the Ecb, Fuck the Fed,Fuck D.C, Fuck Brussels,  Fuck the TSA, and Fuck Homeland Security.

 

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 14:25 | 1805230 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

But DO NOT fuck Janet Napolitano!!!!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 16:23 | 1805354 luigi
luigi's picture

Calling for en european finance ministry would be a good and visionary thing if this call would come from a personality like Adenauer or De Gasperi.

It is indeed quite strange that a Central Bankster calls for it (and, note taken, only for it: no healt care ministry, no defence ministry, no welfare ministry... what for? You'll only have the right to be bleed dry to keep the carrousel turning).

After all, the U.S. do have a federal government.

What lacks european "government" and also increasingly the U.S. federal government is the resolving to the democratic method.

In Europe the Parliament, which is the only organ directly elected by "we the people", has de facto no or little power and can be conveniently bypassed at will (exept for some "rithuals" for the purpoise of saving the face) by the toechnocratic bodies nominated in less than democratic processes.

In the U.S. parliament is a puppet in the hands of multiple lobbies often fighting eachother and with War on Terror now in its 10th year citizens full of patriotism have proudly surrendered the most basic rights: they seemingly don't feel it yet, but they might soon realize that they are more than ever subject to the caprices of power-lobbies with access to the right political levers.

I would long torch and forks, with some options on guilloutines, ropes and soap...

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 14:53 | 1805377 Motley Fool
Motley Fool's picture

There is a lot of good things in this speech.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 15:38 | 1805549 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Help me then as i can't find a good thing?!!

I've read Trichets inane idealistic desperate dribble 3 times through and even read his words backwards in case something made any sense that way too ...but nope!

It just looks like the ramblings of a senile French cock who's lived way too long in a detached, un-democratically elected, socialist-fascist ivory tower in Brussels. The EC's stated motto is, "Strength through Diversity" while Trichet wants the opposite and to process Europeans diverse cultures into an harmoginised loony left margerine controlled from the centre (monopolisation).

Not only are his wishes un-democratic with no public mandate but he's tearing up his own organisations motto like it's a bare-faced lie ...poor delusional little JC, he appears to have lost the plot so just as well he's retiring as nobody quite understood anything this windbag said (like "stability" as Europe fractured) aligned with anything in the real world 

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 16:22 | 1805788 Motley Fool
Motley Fool's picture

Alright.

 

"First, it demonstrates how sound policies can lead to prosperity within economic and monetary union."

This is true; if the policies in the PIIGS were less socialist, the people would have to work and they would prosper.

 

"The ECB has delivered an average rate of inflation of 2.0% since beginning operations in 1999."

This is also true, and given that the ECB has Only this mandate, and are very independant, they will stick to it. This policy of stable inflation rates makes it possible for business to make confident predictions and thus invest. Contrast this with the uncertainty in the USA.

 

"With additional liquidity demanded by the euro area banks, our balance sheet has expanded during the crisis. But we have been prudent. Our balance sheet has expanded by about 80% since the beginning of the crisis."

Not ideal, but better than their peers.

 

"The ECB’s government bond market interventions are not inflationary. Unlike the bond purchase programmes of other major central banks our aim is not to inject additional liquidity. We actually absorb all liquidity injected by these purchases on a regular basis – euro for euro, week by week."

Remember, they have only one mandate, targetted inflation.

"So let me emphasise this point. It is very important to understand that all the ECB’s policy decisions during the crisis have been made fully in line with our mandate to maintain price stability."

Goldbugs are very ardent about gold because they want price stability. The ECB provides this, despite the challenges.

"But as I suggested in Aachen, this approach should have clearly defined limits. A second stage should be envisaged for a country that persistently fails to meet its programme targets."

They will not bail out Greece, etc forever. They are trying to give them a chance to mend their ways.

 

Look. I am not in favour of the euro area, but I understand why it was created; which incidentally is to help the world survive when the dollar fails.  But while we have the euro, the current system does not work, and his suggestion of a european finance ministry to take over when countries engage in excessive socialist policies to the detriment of all people in Europe, is a sound one, given the circumstances.

 

"This finance ministry would be only one element of the European future institutional framework. Exactly how these new institutions would eventually evolve one cannot say."

 

He is admitting he cannot predict the future, and is merely human, a good contrast to invincible helicopter Ben.

 

Finally, I understand the arguments for anarchy, which I believe you advocate, and perhaps we will get there at some stage, in the meantime things are evolving. Where to, who can say. :)

 

 

 

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 19:58 | 1806445 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Not true, there is no such thing as a "sound policy". All political polcies, without exception, are a sole (monopoly) answer. I've news for you: there is no God

What that means is there is no 1 answer to anything, there are dozens sometimes hundreds. All political policies are DOA. Period.

Trichet has about as much to do with the inflation rate (or deflation of asset and retail prices) as you have topping up the oil in my car. Inflation (or deflation) is set by the market, hundreds of retailers adjusting their prices, hundreds of businessmen setting asset prices, none of who refer to or converse with Trichet or any Euro Commie (commissioner) 

Like the average man does not exist all politicians like Trichet talk about the "nation" and the "economy" but are taking their names in vain. They're talking bullshit. they represent nobody in the economy and nobody in the country except their own little clique.

Trichets balance sheet expanding 80% is a measure of the cost of the incompetence of both out-of-control politicians and bankers mistakes. It's a massive mistake and Trichet is a massive mistake bailing these losers out. Trichet has fulfilled the role of Bernanke of the Fed and become the worst investor on the planet swallowing crap from the rectums of corrupt politicians and bwankers. He should have let them go down the sewer where they belong.

The ECB may have "only one mandate to target inflation" but like everything these anarchists do, they trample over all rules and laws and constitutions in their way. Tricket has been intervening in the markets with his size 19 clown boots because he doesn't like what they're saying about the diabolical risk reflected in the interest rates. Like the Fed they are perverting the market, making mal-investments and ultimately causing chaos (we have already reached all-out farce stage)

I agree Trichet cannot predict the future. His problem is he hasn't even got a grasp on the past (2 years). He's been flapping around Europe like a headless chicken for 2 years clucking, "Stability, stability, our plan is stability" while the reality is the interest rates have mushroomed, the Bond market is pear-shaped because of his intervention and we're now where all Govt intervention leads, left with a sack full of shit

Trichet is senile, delusional and a complete idiot

The free market works ..for free ...you can't beat it, Trichet and Bernanke has proved that yet again

 

Tue, 10/25/2011 - 08:00 | 1807515 Motley Fool
Motley Fool's picture

While I agree with some of what you say, let us simply agree to disagree.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 15:19 | 1805477 quacker
quacker's picture

Been looking into the whole Vatican calls for world central bank thing.

Not so fast.

This is just one office of notoriously leftlist priests who issued a white paper that does NOT have official papal backing.

A lot of Catholic commentators are going ballistic today. Father Z, an influential Catholic commentator on eonomic matters writes:

http://wdtprs.com/blog/

"[4] Fourth, the document calls for the creation of some type of world central bank. Yet its authors seem unaware that much of the blame for our present economic mess is squarely attributable to central banks. Here one need only note that theFederal Reserve’s easy-money policies from 2000 onwards played an indispensable role in creating America’s housing-market bubble, the development of questionable securities products, and the subsequent 2008 meltdown.

Calls for a global central bank aren’t new. Keynes argued for such an organization 75 years ago. But why, given national central banks’ evident failures, should anyone suppose that a global central bank wouldn’t fall prey to the same errors? The folly of a centralized supranational body like the European Central Bank setting a one-size-fits-all interest-rate for economies as different as Greece and Germany should now be evident to everyone who doesn’t live in the fantasy world inhabited by EU bureaucrats. Indeed, it is simply impossible for any one individual or organization to know what is the optimal interest-rate for every country in the EU, let alone the world."

The bottom line is that there is by no means Catholic uniformity on this issue and the document issed is NOT an official position.

 

 

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 15:35 | 1805538 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Then the Vatican needs to cull his ass!

But do you honestly believe that this one "just slipped through" the Vatican filter?  

Catholics need to wake up, buck up, and not put up with this globalist crap coming from high up!  Don't be so gullible to think that globalist operatives have not infiltrated the highest levels of ALL institutions.  Think about it....

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 15:37 | 1805543 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Blind loyalty is a deadly "virtue".

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 15:38 | 1805551 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Also, check out what they pope said in this video:

 


www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAbhRxmA46I
Mon, 10/24/2011 - 16:05 | 1805700 quacker
quacker's picture

You're not educating me. I'm well aware that the one-world-governmentists are crawling through all ranks of the Vatican. And I'm well aware that the report was cleared for official release.

But it is not an official position nor a monolithic community.

Rank and file Catholics fighting with the globalist fools at the Vatican is a centuries old tradition. If I had blind loyalty, I wouldn't be fighting those fools every chance I get. Catholics everywhere are fuming over this report, and are continully bumping heads with tha elitists in church constantly. I have no blind loyalty or I wouldn't be arguing against those leftist twits at the top every chance I get.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 18:40 | 1806271 my puppy for prez
my puppy for prez's picture

Understood.  Good for you!  Keep up the fight where you are, and I will keep on the stupid World Council of Churches!

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 19:13 | 1806357 quacker
quacker's picture

Sure thing. And your puppy has my vote, provided he makes it through the primaries.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 18:29 | 1806236 Kina
Kina's picture

Geezus. So the Pope is Hitler and Trishit his right-hand wanker. I knew the bastard didn't die. Still dreaming of taking over Europe. At least the Japanese swapped their thoughts from world domination to young women in school uniforms.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 18:34 | 1806259 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

FUCK YOU Trichet....!!!

TODAY,Tommorow and the day after tommorow.

                                                sincerely .

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 18:41 | 1806278 Bansters-in-my-...
Bansters-in-my- feces's picture

Ps...

I gotta learn to spell that word tomorrow.

Pesky details.

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 19:03 | 1806327 Kina
Kina's picture

Why wait?

Mon, 10/24/2011 - 19:01 | 1806321 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I'm having a vision...of a retard beating on the nose of a bomb with a hammer.

"Exactly how these new institutions would eventually evolve one cannot say."

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!