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Walter Williams On The 2012 Election And Sound Money

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From by Casey Research

Guest Post: Walter Williams On The 2012 Election And Sound Money

Walter Williams has been a professor of economics at George Mason University in Virginia since 1980. He is the author of many books, hundreds of articles and a weekly syndicated column. You may have caught some of his many radio and television appearances – a champion of free-market economics speaking out against socialism and intrusive government. He has described laissez-faire capitalism as “the most moral and most productive system man has ever devised.”

Casey Research: Good morning, Dr. Williams. I was immensely relieved to learn that you were not the author of the recent article No Matter What, purporting to explain why, no matter how bad things get, President Obama would win a second term. The article was widely circulated, however, and I have some concern that a lot of people were misled but never learned that you had not written it.

Walter Williams: Of course the article was a hoax. When it first came out and people started sending it to me, I sent it to the Creators Syndicate that handles my column. They contacted the website that ran the article, and that website ran an apology.

Casey Research: I am happy to have the opportunity to help set the record straight and to share your views with our readers. Can President Obama be defeated in 2012?

Walter Williams: Oh yes. According to a recent poll, if the election were held today, Mitt Romney would beat him. It’s hard for a president to win reelection with a high unemployment rate. It looks like there is no way in the world, between now and the election, that unemployment will drop substantially. That does not bode well for Obama’s reelection.

CR: I believe official unemployment now stands at about 9% and that it’s actually even higher because of how unemployment statistics are reported.

Walter Williams: That’s right.

CR: The midterm election and the Tea Party movement sent a strong message to Congress and the president. Voters want less spending on less government, but Congress and the president still seem to think voters will accept business as usual. Are they right?

Walter Williams: They could be. We can blame politicians a little bit, but the bulk of the blame lies with the American people. That was kind of an epiphany for me. During the 1980s, I would occasionally have lunch with Senator Jesse Helms from North Carolina. He knew that I was highly critical of agricultural subsidies, handouts to farmers.

Something Jesse Helms told me at one of our luncheons made me realize some things I had not realized until then. He said, “Walter, I agree with you 100% that these farm subsidies ought to be eliminated.” But then he asked, “Can you tell me how I can remain the senator from North Carolina and vote against them? If I do what you say, I would be voted out of office.”

Applying his observation today, we can note that the biggest expenditures by the federal government are Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and prescription drugs. Along with other entitlements, these expenditures amount to almost 60% of the federal budget. The beneficiaries of these programs vote in large numbers. Politicians who talk about cutting these programs are going to run into trouble. We have to get the American people, as much as politicians, to respect the Constitution.

CR: It seems that we must overcome some significant misconceptions before we reach that point. For example, some smart people have asked why we can’t just live on credit, why can’t the Fed just continue to print money? You’ve been an economics professor for over 30 years. Do you have a sense of what it would take to teach the average American that living on credit does not work for the federal government any more than it would for individuals or families?

Walter Williams: We have to ask ourselves, “Are the American people any different than the Romans, the British, the French? Are they different from Spain or Portugal?” These were all once great empires that went down the tubes for bread and circuses, for huge spending. There is every indication that Americans will go the same way. They want politicians to enable them to live at the expense of other Americans.

CR: That seems to be a recurring message during elections: “I will give you what you want and make someone else pay for it.”

Walter Williams: That is absolutely right. In my opinion, it is nothing more than legalized theft. If there is slight hope on the horizon, it’s that the Obama administration and Congress have been so brazen that Americans, like never before in our lives, are arguing about the Constitution.

States’ attorneys general are suing the federal government over Obamacare. State legislatures are passing Tenth Amendment resolutions [“state sovereignty resolutions” affirming that the US Constitution gives the federal government only specific enumerated powers and that all other powers remain with the state and the people]. Texas is telling the TSA to “keep your hands off our people.” North Dakota has nullified the health care bill. So the point is, if there is hope on the horizon, it may be this slight groundswell of rebellion. The question is, is it too little, too late?

CR: The US dollar was once redeemable in gold or silver but now it just says, “In God We Trust.” The US monetary system is based on trust, but that trust has been breached and the dollar is in decline. Americans will be wondering whom to hold responsible as we lose the privileges we have enjoyed as custodians of the world’s reserve currency.

Walter Williams: Very seldom are people willing to blame themselves for the problems they create. They always want to blame someone else: the Chinese, Republicans, Democrats. It’s a natural, normal human response, but blaming someone else does not solve the problem.

CR: I mentioned those who have asked why we can’t just live on credit. What about those who really should know better, like Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke and members of the Joint Economic Committee in Congress – do they truly believe in Keynesian economics? For example, does the Fed chairman believe that one more round of quantitative easing will actually get the economy back on track?

Walter Williams: Keep in mind something that Richard Nixon said to John Ehrlichman, who warned that Milton Friedman, an economist and Nobel laureate, advised against the policy Nixon was pursuing. Nixon’s response was, “Milton Friedman is not running for reelection.” These people in Washington have commitments and responsibilities that I don’t have. I don’t owe anybody anything, so I can be perfectly honest. When you are trying to get reelected, or appointed to a high-level position, or hoping to have a high-paying job when you leave government, you just can’t say the sort of things I am free to say.

CR: Will we ever return to fiscal responsibility when there is no constraint on how many dollars can be produced?

Walter Williams: The gold standard is a discipline for the monetary authorities. It restricts their ability to print money. Without a gold standard, the only restriction is the political arena’s restraint that has been shown around the world to be insufficient. Our founders feared fiat money.

CR: Americans seem to have forgotten that.

Walter Williams: Not so much forgotten as just observed that such a restraint on government limits my ability to live off my fellow Americans. At the Democratic National Convention in 1896, William Jennings Bryan, one of the first so-called “progressives,” gave a speech – the “Cross of Gold” speech – condemning the high rate of silver-to-gold convertibility. [Bryan called for the inflationary free coinage of silver at a ratio of 16:1 to gold. His answer to the demand for a gold standard: “You shall not press down upon the brow of labor this crown of thorns. You shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold.”] At that time, we had presidents like Grover Cleveland, who fought against the weakening of the dollar and against moving away from the gold standard.

CR: That’s certainly not a cause championed by Barack Obama.

Walter Williams: No, it’s not. As to that article on Obama’s reelection, I don’t think any of it makes a lot of sense. I appreciate your efforts to get the word out that it was not written by me.

CR: My pleasure. Thank you very much, Dr. Williams. I appreciate you taking the time to talk with me.


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Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:34 | 1616671 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

How quaint! Both the interviewer and interviewee seem to be laboring under the old-fashioned misconception that voters actually choose who becomes President!

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:54 | 1616723 zenbones
zenbones's picture

We do get to choose.  We can choose between the ticket of Rockefeller/Rothschild or the ticket of Rothschild/Rockefeller.  Either way, they win, you lose.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:18 | 1616782 Ratscam
Ratscam's picture

any blue pills left? I'm in dire need of one!

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:02 | 1617301 Freewheelin Franklin
Freewheelin Franklin's picture

I got some little yellow ones. 

Wed, 08/31/2011 - 23:13 | 1621563 FreedomGuy
FreedomGuy's picture

Actually, that's not the point. The point is that we'd choose someone who promises us the impossible rather than someone who tells the truth and refuses to let us live off other men. We, as a people will more likely choose the leaders who offer bread and circuses even though it results in our destruction. You don't need any conspiracies.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:40 | 1616851 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

The sheeple choose who does not become president.  anyone who truly wants individual liberty and personal responsibility cannot become president because that would mean the end of welfare (social security, medicare, etc). And for all of you who don't believe those programs are welfare then you are financially naive.  Recipients on average get a huge amount more than they put into the system, all of this increasing the debt on our children.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:56 | 1617480 Kat
Kat's picture

Last November we tried to choose in CT, but then a bunch of trash bags of "votes" arrived at the Bridgeport polling station and then the choice of the people of CT was sort of trumped by these bags of trash. 

Also, Bridgeport "ran out of ballots" and a couple of unsupervised poll workers were sent to photocopy more (really slowly) as the Democrats sent busses to the ghettos and paid people to come vote Democrat. 

On the bright side, no dead people voted.  Why bother when the non-existent and never existed can vote?  Via black trash bags?

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:34 | 1616672 Shell Game
Shell Game's picture

We have to get the American people, as much as politicians, to respect the Constitution.

The American people as a whole will come to respect collapse before they come to respect the Constitution..

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:08 | 1617311 i-dog
i-dog's picture


And as for the interviewee's comment:

"We can blame politicians a little bit, but the bulk of the blame lies with the American people."

That is a stinking load of "pass the buck where it doesn't belong, and maybe nobody will notice"!

While it is true that an educated "people" MIGHT be able to make an informed choice---if they were presented with ALL the facts---the politicians have full access to all the facts and all the think tanks that analyse all the facts. The people are fed nothing but propaganda and pablum ... and are then expected to make an informed choice?! Give me a break!!

Williams is a failed apologist for the globalists.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:43 | 1616674 jakethesnake76
jakethesnake76's picture

Alright nice to hear from the Dr. always tells it as he sees it .

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:37 | 1616681 New_Meat
New_Meat's picture

"Black by Popular Demand." - Walter E. Williams

Tyler, please add the E. to the headline to disambiguate from the other "Walter Williams" who is, well, not of this view.

- Ned

{and junkstaz, if u haven't heard him, well, he'd make most thinking folk piss their pants.  Not so much fun since his wife died.}

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:39 | 1616687 chet
chet's picture

Meh.  Anyone can talk about politics.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:43 | 1617237 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Exactly.  How about talking about those other "entitlements".  You know, the "I drove my company into the ground but I am still entitled to a massive bailout and huge bonus because I am too big to fail."

Never hear people complaining about those entitlment motherfuckers.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 22:02 | 1617504 Kat
Kat's picture

Where do you hang out?  I hear about it all the time.

So far (at least), the bailout pale in comparison to the entitlements.  I'm sure now that we've increased the Moral Hazard, that'll change.  But, until it does, it's Medicare and Social Security that are driving us over a cliff.

Wed, 08/31/2011 - 07:08 | 1618222 Bob
Bob's picture

Social security is driving no one over any cliff.  The program is still self-sustaining.  Net cost of SS is zero.  The only issue that has any meaning from an accounting standpoint is cash flow. 

Pointing to SS payments as a government expense is absurd . . . but it works as long as you conveniently ignore the fact that the gov has to pay off on SS Trust Fund assets that have been bought and paid for. 

The SSTF is literally an investor that bought Treasury securities.  When other Treasury Debt write-offs are seriously on the table--with meantingful haircuts for well-heeled investors--then perhaps this analysis will make some sense. 

Of course, military entitlements--not self-funded by any definition--continue to escape the attention of these deep "anti-entitlement" thinkers.

This stuff is Accounting 101.  It is not beyond the business community's capacity to understand it. 

The "misunderstanding" is deliberate.  It's nothing but a transparent attempt to frame the issue in terms that will justify writing off the SSTF debt as some kind of twisted virtue. 

Just more attempted theft by the finance community and its useful idiots.  Gotta love "highly principled" sociopaths who just want the lower strata to be "responsible."

Thu, 09/01/2011 - 21:57 | 1624645 anony
anony's picture

Social Security was robbed by Tip O'neill, Lyndon Johnson, Ted Kennedy and spineless republicans sucking at the defense tit, and 40 years of democratic control of Congress. 

Leave it out of the equation until all the money that those paid into it and earned in interest is returned.

Otherwise you prove that you don't know what in hell you are talking about.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:43 | 1616695 DCFusor
DCFusor's picture

Way back, one of the true conservatives, Robert Heinlein stated:

When the plebes discover they can vote bread and circuses for themselves, it's the end of your empire, it's only a matter of time. 

His solution:

Don't let people on the dole vote.

The "progressive defense":

Make sure everyone is on the dole somewhat so the above rule can never pass.

The bad guys won, it would seem, and they's us (well, not me, of course!).

And having once worked fairly high up in the republican party, yeah, only a few people get to decide who you get to vote for, and their mission isn't representing the people at all, no way, not even a little unless it's totally an accident.  I'm sure the dems are no better, and probably worse.  But either set of clowns, are well, clowns.  No choice there except for which squeaky nose or the color of the clown shoes you like best.  Poll workers discard ballots from independents regularly.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:44 | 1616862 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

I think I read everything ever written by Robert Heinlein as a teenager.   He is the God of science fiction or at least the right hand of God, Isaac Asimov.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:06 | 1616950 Manthong
Manthong's picture

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury.”

Whether it was Heinlein, DeTocqueville, Tytler or whoever that  first  opined some form of the above, it is a concept worthy of  being grokked.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:07 | 1616952 JohnG
JohnG's picture

I'll go one better:  Only tax PAYERS vote.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:16 | 1617151 Row Well Number 41
Row Well Number 41's picture

I consider a few Sci Fi books must reads.


The Foundation trilogy

The Moon is a Harsh Mistress

And while not technically Sci Fi the Conan books are also good reads.



Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:21 | 1617169 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

Honor Harrington series by David Weber.

You are welcome.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:09 | 1617317 Burgess Shale
Burgess Shale's picture

Hardwired by Walter Jon Williams was a good read.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:40 | 1617222 Manthong
Manthong's picture

"Out of the Silent Planet"


"That Hideous Strength"

-C. S. Lewis trilogy


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 23:00 | 1617728 piceridu
piceridu's picture

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it." 

Upton Sinclair

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:43 | 1616697 Barbar
Barbar's picture

the bitchez post bitchez!

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:44 | 1616699 notadouche
notadouche's picture

How did Jessie Helms know he wouldn't get reelected?  He had been in for a billion years for plenty of stupid votes.  He still got voted in.  Maybe he should have stated that he was afraid he couldn't raise money from his ag lobbyist if he voted in any way to take money out of ag mouth.  Maybe this is the excuse politicians give in order to shift blame from themselves.   Of course ideally people are voted in to lead, not to be led by the threat of losing elections.   Using your logic, then politicians are finding it easy to shift the blame as well, blaming the people for their deeds, or lack thereof than looking in the mirror and asking what they have or have not done to uphold the integrity of their office.  What have they done or not done to better or worsen the lot of America in the name of "being afraid of not getting elected"  What a total canard.  If you don't have the balls to do the right thing than get the hell out of office and do something else.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:15 | 1616773 XitSam
XitSam's picture

If you don't have the balls to do the right thing than get the hell out of office and do something else.

This is the problem, nearly all of the good people have gotten out or not campaigned in the first place.  That vacuum has been filled with the sycophants.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:20 | 1616993 jakethesnake76
jakethesnake76's picture

Yea how many times has Ron Paul been elected President uhh none times , that is Walters point , the guy is much less diplomatic when on the radio he tells it like it is. And what it is is everybody votes their own Stupid Interest even when it hurts them because people don't think clearly anymore..When People are Angry they think stupid thoughts. Or when they are short sighted as most of us are now today, Start a new utopia some where it ends the Same, it's our fault how many of us really worked and demanded our neiubours and friends worked to keep this country safe and on debt free???

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:43 | 1617438 notadouche
notadouche's picture

Jessie Helms was a Senator as is Ron Paul.  Ron Paul keeps getting elected.  I didn't read this article to mean winning presidential election but equated it more properly to congressional votes which run most of the dollar show.  My point is to take Walters idea, change american people and replace it with american politician.  I think the argument he uses works much better with that substitute.  Case in point, majority of voters according to most polls  did not want Obamacare, yet POLITICIANS lied, and stole to vote it in.  You can't blame the people for the votes of the political elite.  Now if they start holding referendums on healthcare and the people vote it in then the blame can be shifted to the people.  Remember how all the politicians voted yes for TARP, yet held their nose.  The people didn't want it and the politicians knew but did it anyway and their only cover was they "held their noses".  WTF. 

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:49 | 1617460 CrimsonAvenger
CrimsonAvenger's picture

Ron Paul is a congressperson, not a senator. Just FYI.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:46 | 1616701 LeBalance
LeBalance's picture

WW: "We can blame politicians a little bit, but the bulk of the blame lies with the American people."

For the FED?  For the IRS? For 911? For HFT? For houses you can't own?  For the word "register?"

For "re-presentation" by the Articles of Incorporation?  The Red Amendment?  The Patriot Act?

The TSA?  The derivative?  MERS?  The Nuclear Pile?


Please WW, tell me exactly how!

/thought not./

Get serious, or get out.

"What this town needs is a better class of research rag criminal."

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:20 | 1616726 LMAO
LMAO's picture

I concur, spoken like a true politician.

But then again I think he is trying to tell us: "the bulk of the blame lies with the American people for letting us proceed with the destruction of this country and as long as we are permitted to do so, we are just keeping up the good work.

Btw, some comedy Gold from the same article after blaming the American people for the shitpile

Walter Williams: Very seldom are people willing to blame themselves for the problems they create.

He's a cunning linguist

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:17 | 1616984 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

"...a Republic, if we can keep it."

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:03 | 1616740 anony
anony's picture

The american people can shoulder some blame for the current state of affairs due to their motives in voting, and for those that don't vote, they too can shoulder some the blame for not expressing themselves at the ballot box.

That being said, the american people -----as the writer above quickly illustrates -----has nothing to do with the hijacking of their vote by lobbyists who have managed at every turn to thwart the voter.

I can accept no blame personally other than this: I don't possess the resources required to put a stop to the ongoing rape of the people by our representatives in D.C.

The inhabitants of D.C. live in a country separate from the United States. They don't pay social security, but steal from our fund to pay for thousands of programs that have turned our nation's spine into  jello.  They are able to trade on information that a private citizen, who possesses the same information would be prosecuted and jailed for using to make a profit.  They do not lgive themselves cuts in pay for failure nor can they be fired as citizens of the other 51 states are routinely.

We are governed by a foreign nation and to blame us for the inept, corrupt, and entirely criminal enterprise that is the US CONgress is naive, jejune, at best.

You are not excused, Mr. Walter Willams, for your groundless attack on the people.  


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:25 | 1617005 jakethesnake76
jakethesnake76's picture

i agree that the whole point was decentralized Government that's why here in Oklahoma no country was bigger than a days horse ride se people could get redress , and we have lost that since Washington Took that after the Civil War.. But the people do get the leaders they put in there and very few of us can say we did everything we could for ourselves and our country to keep it free and debt free.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:46 | 1617058 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I excuse him because its true.

When we get to the point that some if us are no longer asking the government to, feed us, clothe us, house us, protect us, give a cell phone to us, school us, doctor bribe us for the damned vote...then and only then will I agree.

Some ask too much and always bitch that its never enough even as they walk away with arm loads...(from Keynesians to welfare sows) from some of the most lecherous incompetents among us...he's exactly right.

They strip you of your dignity and you shrug it off and ask for more abuse (not you personally, generally).

So, junk it bitchez...but you know I'm right ;-)

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:15 | 1617147 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

+ 1 nmewn

It actually IS partly our fault.  Yes, there is an Elite there fighting for every scrap.  What is NOT pointed out often here at ZH is that that The Elite is not one monolithic group.  Various rich and powerful families HATE each other.  There are lobbyists and researchers who do NOTHING but dig up dirt on their political opponents (a friend of a friend of mine DOES JUST THAT).

It is up to us as individuals to take our country back.  The best shot we have, IMO, is the Tea Party and that kind of thinking.  Lower taxes.  Less regulation.  More transparency.  Smaller government.

Since that looks unlikely to happen, we then, as individuals, have to prepare against the likely BAD TIMES ahead as the Evil Empire starts to crumble and fight to the death.  By buying gold, etc.

But, politics at the grass-roots level DOES matter.  If we do not elect decent people, we get more of the same.  And it looks like (barring a President Ron Paul), that we WILL get more of the same.

Those of you who say "they are all the same" are not correct.  There is at least 14 cents worth of difference between the Ds and the Rs.

So, junk this too, bitchez, but you know WE are right.   :)

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:03 | 1616741 steelhead23
steelhead23's picture

Very good post.  While I suspect most voters would have no idea what I mean, I find the Fed's purchase of dodgy CDOs to be a violation of the Fed's charter and any losses incurred by Maiden Lane 2 and 3 should be born by the true owners of the Fed (e.g. J.P. Morgan, et al.).

I agree with the author that self-interested beneficiaries of the social safety net are more likely to vote for increasing taxes than those who actually pay those taxes - but a bigger problem is getting the public to understand the issues they face when the MSM is busily trying to hide those problems. 

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:07 | 1616749 Cow
Cow's picture

Because the American people keep electing douchbags like Barney Frank, Steny Hoyer and Sheila Jackson Lee.  'Splain that and you'll have your answer.

Here's the Citizen's Against Governement Waste Analysis of Agriculture, btw:




Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:15 | 1616771 drink or die
drink or die's picture

Politicians created those things, but the American people did nothing about it.  If the people don't keep the politicians in check, the people have failed.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:44 | 1616873 faustian bargain
faustian bargain's picture

Well, it's like he said. If Congress ended the Fed's charter, revoked legal tender laws, removed the mark-to-myth restrictions on interest rates, ended pointless foreign wars and entanglements, stopped subsidizing real estate and every other industry, then the vast majority of Congressmen would not get reelected. People in this country - most of them - simply don't want freedom. They want to be taken care of, and told what to do. And so, they have gotten what they deserved, because nobody cared enough to think about unintended consequences.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:47 | 1617060 AngelsMom
AngelsMom's picture

You've gotta be kidding....obviously it's because we voted for the assholes who made all those things possible, oh master of the disingenuous.  What do you do, go into a voting booth, close your eyes, and do an eenie meenie miney moe? If not, and if you've ever voted, at some point, congratufuckinlations, you made a shit decision, just like the rest of us. Christ, grow a pair and take some goddam responsibility!

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:45 | 1616705 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

Get the Fiat out of politics..........

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:18 | 1617153 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

That will never happen.  You know better than that.  But, if you get junked later, it was not me.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:45 | 1616706 Bam_Man
Bam_Man's picture

I was wondering what had become of old "No Neck" after he left the Yankees in 1975.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:45 | 1616708 Yamaha
Yamaha's picture

Reminds me of Nixon's second term slogan.

"Nixon now More Than Ever!"

Watch Obama -use the same thing........

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:57 | 1616915 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

"I am not a crook" famous anouncement by Ricard M. Nixon, after it became clear to everyone that he was, in fact, a crook. Any country that has a president that gets on national TV and says, "I am not a crook"; has big problem.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 22:47 | 1617671 OrestesPenthilu...
OrestesPenthilusQuintard's picture

Actually the guy wasn't a crook - they got tired of blowing people's heads off so they politically 'assassinated' him.  Russ Baker's Family of Secrets will give you the straight poop.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:48 | 1616713 DeweyLeon
DeweyLeon's picture

"We have to get the American people, as much as politicians, to respect the Constitution."

"The American people" don't think in those terms, it's too abstract. What they see from MC, SS etc. is their rights and anyone reducing their "rights" will be struck down with great vengeance and furious anger.

This shit ain't ending until the money runs out.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:59 | 1616926 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

The money already ran out; We are now a "glider"; waiting to see how long it will be before our flying altitude equals ground altitude.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:48 | 1617252 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Very true, probably why even the mention of Ron Paul makes the average slumbering sheep simply furious.  The sooner a person realizes that nothing is guarranteed and they have to add real value every day, the sooner we can all move on.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:51 | 1616719 Josh Randall
Josh Randall's picture

I loved listening to him in the past before I woke up - but if he's hooked up with Limbaugh he's a shill for the Neocons and a Bankster apologist, no other way to read into his remarks

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 22:01 | 1617498 Cow
Cow's picture

I don't think you have listened to much of Walter Williams.  You make assumptions, but I don't think you have really listened to him.  Sad.  He has a lot to say that is right.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:58 | 1616731 lindaamick
lindaamick's picture

This guy is full of crap.

Not only do americans have no choices when it comes to the people running for office, until the internet came along they had limited access to any information that is not simply propaganda put out by the rich overseers of this country. 

And even with the internet, an american has to work hard to find the truth about any topic related to politics or the economy.  

I guarentee if lazy ass jesse helms would have bothered telling farmers exactly all the negative knockon effects of farm subsidies and how they injure, rather that help except from a very short term perspective, farmers would vote for what is right and of overall benefit to the society. 

Most people want to do what's right but they need accurrate, true information. 

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:55 | 1616913 Clinteastwood
Clinteastwood's picture

Agree Linda.

Pundits like Williams have trouble getting the facts straight when they don't fit the thesis that "Americans have only themselves to blame."  For example, Williams calls Social Security an "entitlement."  Social Security is not an entitlement.  We have paid in to the system all these years and it's OUR MONEY.  

Tell you what:  just send me the money I've paid in to SS and I'll ride off into the sunset and never look to the gooberment for retirement benefits.  Think the goobers will ever do that?  Doubt it.  They have their own ideas about how they want to use my money to buy votes.

Wake up Walter.  Social Security is not an entitlement, and FICA withholding is not a "payroll tax."  You think like a RINO.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:24 | 1617177 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Linda, Clint,

I repectfully disagree (but, no junks).  Social Security and other "entitlements" are no longer our money.  It was all robbed long ago.  You are correct in that they are NOT entitlements though.

WE ARE partly at fault for having elected those who promise to spend more than they tax.  It is up to us as individuals to take our country back, and if that does not work, to stop playing "their" game: Buy gold and get out of the system.

My reply does NOT excuse .gov spending and banksters as having robbed us blind.  But, it IS partly our own damn fault.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:50 | 1617261 adr
adr's picture

Really, you don't think SS is an entitlement? How much do you think you pay into  vs how much you get when you retire? 

My grandmother gets $1200 a month and has been collecting for the past 20 years. I think she got $800 when she started. Even if you take $800 a month for 20 years you get close to $200k over that time. I would need some time to find out what her monthy checks actually were over 20 years but I guarantee it is probably over 100x what my grandfather paid in. His money was spent by the government long ago.

A person making $50k pays about $150 a month into SS or about $1800 a year. One worker paying into the program for an entire year is a little more than what one retiree gets paid in a month. The system requires a massive working population to finance those who have retired.

What is the definition of frcing one group to pay for another? Wouldn't the benefits that the group receives be called an entitlement?

What is sad is that a worker saving $150 on his own and investing that money building a fund for 40 years would probably have a lot more than $1200 a month to live on when they turn 65.

Wed, 08/31/2011 - 00:10 | 1617919 Clinteastwood
Clinteastwood's picture

No it's not an entitlement.  I'm offering to take it back without interest, just gimme my money.  No, that won't be allowed because not only is it not an entitlement, it's a robbery.  

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:01 | 1616732 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture

Something Jesse Helms told me at one of our luncheons made me realize some things I had not realized until then. He said, “Walter, I agree with you 100% that these farm subsidies ought to be eliminated.” But then he asked, “Can you tell me how I can remain the senator from North Carolina and vote against them? If I do what you say, I would be voted out of office.”

And there we have it. The Senator was only concerned with his tenure rather than upholding his pledge to the constitution and that is why we are here.

We are all to blame because the underpinning link to facilitating the Senators tenure and his ability to siphon unearned money into the hands of farmers, is the open cheque book they have been handed courtesy of the FED and its supposed independence.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:59 | 1617289 gookempucky
gookempucky's picture

The tribal wisdom of the Dakota Indians, passed on from generation to
generation, says that, "When you discover that you are riding a dead horse,
the best strategy is to dismount."

However, in government, education, and in corporate America, more advanced
strategies are often employed, such as:

1. Buying a stronger whip.

2. Changing riders.

3. Appointing a committee to study the horse.

4. Arranging to visit other countries to see how other cultures ride dead

5. Lowering the standards so that dead horses can be included.

6. Reclassifying the dead horse as living-impaired.

7. Hiring outside contractors to ride the dead horse.

8. Harnessing several dead horses together to increase speed.

9. Providing additional funding and/or training to increase dead horse's

10. Doing a productivity study to see if lighter riders would improve the
dead horse's performance.

11. Declaring that as the dead horse does not have to be fed, it is less
costly, carries lower overhead and therefore contributes substantially more
to the bottom line of economy than do some other horses.

12. Rewriting the expected performance requirements for all horses.

And of course....

13. Promoting the dead horse to a supervisory position

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:58 | 1616733 NOTaREALmerican
NOTaREALmerican's picture

Can anybody say:  FREE MONEY?  


I know I can.


There's only one solution,   MORE FREE MONEY!!  

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:02 | 1616734 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture


Well, Walter, if the People fucked it up, it seems you would support them when they decide to fix whatever means necessary.

Kind of like, if black leaders wanted to change the legal system, they would be out advocating that no black ever accept a plea bargain, or give up the right to a speedy trial.

Talk about armageddon in the court system. heh.

Too bad all the black leaders are corrupt whores of the Dem party.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:06 | 1616748 Al Gorerhythm
Al Gorerhythm's picture


Well, Walter, if the People fucked it up, it seems you would support them when they decide to fix whatever means necessary.


Presumption Bitchez.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:27 | 1616817 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

Did you know that new MLK memorial statue was made in China?

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:01 | 1616937 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

thank God for that; otherwise the irony would  be insupportable.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:50 | 1617262 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Looks oriental to me, just sayin.

But in truth its probably easier to make it there and burn a few hundred gallons of fossil fuel to bring it back here bypassing the regs.

I can just see OSHA, EPA, unions and whatever else swarming over the artist(s) admonishing and writing reams of violations for not wearing a proper body harness for working at height, hard hat, safety glasses, mask, gloves, proper ventilation plus filters for ventilation to the outside etc...what a

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:58 | 1616919 JohnG
JohnG's picture

If you ever want to really piss off a judge, have your lawyer assert to a "fair and speedy trial."

I do NOT recommend it.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 17:59 | 1616735 alien-IQ
alien-IQ's picture

it was right at this point: "I would occasionally have lunch with Senator Jesse Helms"...where the uncontrollable gag reflexes went into full spasm mode and I puked a little bit in my mouth.

needless to say...I had to stop reading.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:18 | 1616989 SirIssacNewton
SirIssacNewton's picture

Williams lost me at the same point...... Corrupt Senator.  My question to the Senator by Williams would have been when he said that...... "Why don't you do what's right even if it means you won't get re-elected?"  It's pure crap to accept that kind of response from an elected official because what they are saying is that they are bought and sold and are openly admitting to their resolve to break their Oath to uphold the Constitution.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:04 | 1616742 Whalley World
Whalley World's picture

If Romney get's in, nothing will change.  By 2012 I think Americans will be ready for Ron Paul.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:09 | 1616751 Debtless
Debtless's picture

Speaking of R. Paul - why aren't more REPUBLICAN'S demanding that he be taken seriously by the RNC? The media? I haven't heard anyone but unhappy democrats say that he's being treated unfairly.

Seriously, why is there no R outrage?

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:24 | 1616802 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

Because Isolationism is a failed policy.

Ron Paul might appeal to pussies, and the weak minded, but not to the majority.

But this is a semi-free country. Vote for him if you want.

I bet there will be a few write-in votes for Lady Gaga as well.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:51 | 1616891 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

I just don't think you understand isolationism.  It wasn't isolationist.  It was anti military adventurist.  Isolationism was a term coined by the enemies of those who opposed foreign entanglements and military adventurism.


What we need is less military industrial complex and less government in general.  Eisenhower was right about his warnings.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:03 | 1616944 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

plus one. you're right. he's wrong. "Isolationism doesn't work"---OH, and you know this how? Logical proof, please.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:26 | 1616972 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

Based on Rodent Freikorp's avatar,  I'd guess he's somehow involved in the murder-industrial complex.

Ron Paul and non-interventionism threaten the socialist, parasitical way of life that depends on forcing others to pay for services they don't want or need.

Edit: I think his avatar has been changing back and forth between an armed man and a squirrel or something.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:33 | 1617025 Sancho Ponzi
Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:27 | 1617184 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

+ 1 to top

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:55 | 1616911 Abiotic Oil
Abiotic Oil's picture

He is not an "isolationist."

Ron Paul the front runner is a "non-interventionist."

He does not, nor has he ever, advocated breaking off all relationships with the rest of the world.

He does advocate staying out of other country's internal affairs, i.e not spending billions bombing Libya in an undeclared war, "accidentally" killing lots of civilians whose surviving family members live the rest of their lives living in hatred of the US and passing that hatred onto their friends and children.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 22:01 | 1617501 Honey Badger
Honey Badger's picture

If Reagan didn't say that government isn't the solution to our problems, government IS the problem, then Ron Paul would have.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:25 | 1617004 faustian bargain
faustian bargain's picture

Talk about weak minded.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:26 | 1617010 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Please define exactly how Ron Paul is isolationist? Compare and contrast his approach with our current approach to say...Cuba, and Iran.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:04 | 1617306 PuppetRepubl1c
PuppetRepubl1c's picture

@Rodent Freikorps


"Ron Paul might appeal to pussies, and the weak minded"


Interesting.... so you think it is a great idea to pay military contractors trillions of taxpayer dollars to install toilets and Air Conditioning units in bagdad while American infrastructure (bridges, roads, schools) crumble?  Great strategy you have going there.  


Military contractors and the assholes who dole out taxpayer money to them (Dick Cheney) suck just as much blood from the american taxpayers as the bastard children of the welfare state.  In fact there is absolutely no difference between these 2 classes of tax grifting scum.


Somehow you have let the military-welfare complex convince you that wasting tax payer money in the middle east is completely different than wasting tax payer money in the ghettos.  Wake the fuck up they are stealing your money!


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:20 | 1617340 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

Unleash them and the money spent will be all win.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:32 | 1617386 PuppetRepubl1c
PuppetRepubl1c's picture

Unleash them to do what?  If we wanted to destroy Iraq/Afghanistan we should just nuke the fucking place and be done with it, it would save the American tax payers a fortune!  Spending taxpayer money to rebuild these shit holes (and risk American lives at the same time) is a travesty!




Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:47 | 1617454 Rodent Freikorps
Rodent Freikorps's picture

I couldn't agree more.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:06 | 1617308 sasebo
sasebo's picture

They're all useless assholes.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:21 | 1616789 drbower
drbower's picture

UNFORTUNATELY. by 2012 the only thing Ron Paul will be ready for is the grave.  How old is he anyway??

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:59 | 1616927 Abiotic Oil
Abiotic Oil's picture

He recently challenged all the other candidates to take a 20 mile bike ride in 100 degree heat with him.  No takers.  He is in better shape than most 40 year olds.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:00 | 1616931 JohnG
JohnG's picture


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:16 | 1617331 sasebo
sasebo's picture

I don't care if Dr. Paul is 276. Somebody would have to kill me to keep me from voting for the old fucker. He's THE MAN. The only true statesman.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:04 | 1616743 Rastadamus
Rastadamus's picture


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:52 | 1616901 topcallingtroll
topcallingtroll's picture

Instead of believe or disbelieve why don't you look at the data. 

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:05 | 1616746 Debtless
Debtless's picture

So i'd rather vote for the corpse of Grover Cleveland than anyone thus far in 2012.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:07 | 1616750 Epicurus
Epicurus's picture

"Toute nation a le gouvernement qu'elle merite" - Josephe de Maistre (1753-1821

The majority of people acts only out of their own self interest. So do the politicans.

Break that spiral and you create hope for a better society.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:29 | 1617188 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

There it is, well said.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:10 | 1616759 drbower
drbower's picture

It's all about the career politician.  so what if he looses his job?  another words, jesse's point is that his job is far more important that the people.  That's what is wrong with this country- everyone is so myopic that they can not see the big picture.  If that scumbag politician could only be elected once, then his opinion would drastically change. 

the real problem is with the stupid politicians.  If their primary concern was for the people, we wouldn't be in this situation.  When you give people freebies, then of course they will vote for you again, and suddenly it's a part of our culture.  The trouble lies with, when less than 50% of the people are actually PAYING for the gimmies that this stupid "senator/servant" votes for, and more that 50% of the people are recieving the gimmies, and allowed to vote at the same time, it's not possible to "fix" the system, untill someone with enough balls says, if you recieve a gov't check, you can't vote, and if you don't pay taxes, then you can't vote, then the system will implode. Why do you think the election for obamma turned out the way it did?  All the people on the government titty voted for him. now, even THOSE people are upset, because it looks like the titty is gonna be taken away.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:01 | 1616939 Clinteastwood
Clinteastwood's picture

You have considered only half the reason why people voted for Obama.  The other half had something to do with who ran against him.  Really, you oughtta ask the Repugnicrats why the hell they ever thought nominating nitwit McCain was a good idea.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:47 | 1617246 Row Well Number 41
Row Well Number 41's picture

Mccain had a chance with me until the first time I heard Palin speak and answer questions.  I could not believe Mccain would bring on somebody like this with no vetting and just a one hour interview with her.  I've had tougher job interviews for burger flipper in my youth.  I could not tollerate the possibility that she would be in the line of succession. 

Then there was the whole "I don't know nuch about the economy.".  In the middle of an economic crisis that is NOT what you want to hear from your future leader.

I think Ron Pauls chances are highly dependent on who he chooses as a running mate.  It's one thing to trust RP, but quite another to trust his running mate whoever that might be.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:14 | 1616767 DonutBoy
DonutBoy's picture

Yes - well.  This is why I own alot of gold, storable food & water, and 1000's of rounds of ammo.  We're inside the event horizon.

"From bondage to spiritual faith; from spiritual faith to courage; from courage to liberty; from liberty to abundance; from abundance to selfishness; from selfishness to apathy; from apathy to dependency; and from dependency back to bondage once more"

Where on this cycle do you put America today?

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:30 | 1616823 silverbullion
silverbullion's picture

Definitely bondage, but all is not lost yet, despite the fact that the majority are Zombies. 

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:40 | 1617214 Clampit
Clampit's picture

Maybe I'm the optimist, but I like to see US as somewhere between faith and courage. Here's why. Hindsight is a bitch, especially when some new fangled telecom toy shoves it in your face everyday. So physical gold is in the worlds first advertised bubble, everyone getting on the train now fully expects to loose some small multiple of their money. And sovereigns be damed, we don't care.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:16 | 1616774 Diamond Jim
Diamond Jim's picture

you want to get congressmen to vote for America and not lobby infested DC patron then institute term limits and get $$$ out of elections. Helms was right, but if they only serve two terms and tell the voters in their State exactly how it is and the possible negative outcome of voting for something wrong I think most voters will  say OK. Congressmen will then maybe do what they were sent to DC to do....

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:19 | 1616783 Audacity17
Audacity17's picture

Walter is my favorite fill in host for Rush.  Met him at a university a couple years back, great guy.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:22 | 1616794 silverbullion
silverbullion's picture

Introduce a monetary system consisting of hard currency, make the charge of interest on loans illegal and fix the tax rate at 10%

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:25 | 1616806 Diamond Jim
Diamond Jim's picture

Ron Paul ??? Can you imagine him trying to get anything done  ? You would have to give him a landslide mandate and both Houses of CONgress because he is so far out there. He does not have the ability to compromise or listen to alternative ideas. Summary...he has some good ideas but would never be able to institute them into legislation that would pass...we might as well keep what we have at the moment....what Madison put in place...gridlock, until a new consensus is reached.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:12 | 1616970 Abiotic Oil
Abiotic Oil's picture

There is one thing he can do immediately as commander in chief that does not require congressional approval.

He can support the troops.

He can bring the troops home.

The Commander in Chief has ultimate control of the military.

There is a reason that in both the last election and this one he received more donations from active duty military than all the other candidates combined.

We should listen to the trigger pullers and the bullet sponges.

If all he did was that it would be worth it.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:31 | 1617199 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Abiotic is right.  Ron Paul could get a fair amount amount done even with a hostile Congress (but, if he wins, maybe Congress would not be too hostile...).

Why, he could even say: "I veto this, bitchez!"  And let's see Congress override that.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:59 | 1617290 Row Well Number 41
Row Well Number 41's picture

If RP wins in the first place, congress will have received royal ass whoop'n.  He'll have a year or 2 to try to make real change.

I'd be happy if I saw Gold/Silver as a parallel currency, The end of corporate personhood, and the repeal of the patriot act.

Carve out the cancer so the body can heal itself.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:14 | 1616975 GeneH3
GeneH3's picture

I have voted for Ron Paul and all the other Libertarians all the way back to Barry Goldwater. It was a statement: that some of us favor (really) free markets and free minds. The worst possible outcome would have been for one of the libertarians to become the POTUS. He would have been unable to accomplish anything, discrediting the entire idea of reducing government. And the same goes for Ron Paul this go around.

Williams' comments confirm that there is no solution this time or ever within the existing paradigm. There needs to be a paradigm shift. In my opinion, that shift could come with a narrow defeat of Paul followed by a cataclysmic crash that discredits central planning and government control once and for all, after which Paul and libertarians/Austrians would be sought after to offer credible solutions. Dreaming? Absolutely. It won't happen. We are doomed. Time to shrug.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:42 | 1617049 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

Compromise? Fuck compromise. Compromise got us such gems as the 3/5ths clause in the Constitution, Affimative Action, progressive and convoluted tax code that encouraget debt and spending rather than savings and investment. Compromise brought us the Fed, the 14th Amendment, and a National Debt so large that we have little hope of paying it off.

We WILL not afford "what we have" much longer. Principles such as all individuals being created equal, with their inalienable rights, are not open to compromise for the sake of allowing some sychophant attention whore politician to buy your vote.

These people are sheep, and they must be led.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:26 | 1616808 lynnybee
lynnybee's picture

"Walter Williams: Very seldom are people willing to blame themselves for the problems they create."   ......... so, therefore, if the AMERICAN PEOPLE do not go after & prosecute the criminals on WALL ST. who looted the U.S. TREASURY , complicit with government officials , then, will we be blamed for that too ?     Prosecute the criminals who looted the TREASURY, the criminals who facilitated the looting of the TREASURY & off with the heads for treason !     .......... let's blame the real criminals, those behind the scene who came up with the great idea to artificially suppress the prices of gold & silver to make the U.S. $$$ look strong.     We could start out with the biggest criminal of all !! ROBERT RUBIN !! , & don't forget CLINTON, BUSH2 for bond fraud, & don't even get me started about prosecuting the criminals on WALL ST. & the CITY of LONDON for the 9/11 attack .     but, let's just blame the easiest target, the American Citizens, who aren't nearly as savy as the criminals behind the scenes who committed the real crimes & fraud.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:34 | 1617206 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

LOTS of blame to go around lynnybee.  Agree that Robert Rubin would be a great place to start.  Many others too, I also agree.

But, we too ARE at fault for lazy and thoughtless voting...  Voting for the one who says "I will give you more...".

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:29 | 1616819 Sequitur
Sequitur's picture

I'm really coming around to Sprott's point of view silver will be the investment of the decade. Adding to my position at $40 per, previously bought some at $17, so that was nice. Continue to acquire gold as well.

I'll casually mention to people what's going on in Europe. No one has a goddamn clue. Stateside, ZIRP, TARP, Q.E.? People don't even know they exist, let alone what they do and who benefits. Think Americans understand China and India are gobbling up real assets, as well as metals of all kinds? Nope -- too busy with television and McDonalds nuggets (tried them once, how anyone can eat that vile chicken byproduct is beyond me).

So, I do what I do. Once a week, I visit the farmer's market. Spend a nice small sum on fresh tomatoes, corn, fruits, vegetables, and farm-raised meats. Maybe a plant once in a while, some baked goods. Like putting money in the hands of local farmers, even if it is fiat. Interestingly, some of the farmers are more up on what's going on than the office drones I regularly encounter. Also, I have far more respect for the farmers and vegetable pickers than I do most of the fat fucks I regularly see from our vampire institutions, namely banks, but throw in some of these bastard insurance companies too.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:12 | 1616969 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

Good for you. Sprott's right; not because he has a point of view; because of the underlying facts. "what's going on in Europe. No one has a goddamn clue." Yes. That's right. making it up as they go along. I like the fact that the euro was a French project from day one; The French, those masters of Fiat currency who destroyed their own money twice in one century; ah, the irony of it all. What delicious comedy.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:34 | 1617028 Sequitur
Sequitur's picture

Good point. What do you like better, silver or gold?

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:39 | 1617220 DoChenRollingBearing
DoChenRollingBearing's picture

Sequitur, from your quote just upthread:

"I'll casually mention to people what's going on in Europe. No one has a goddamn clue. Stateside, ZIRP, TARP, Q.E.? People don't even know they exist, let alone what they do and who benefits. Think Americans understand China and India are gobbling up real assets, as well as metals of all kinds? Nope -- too busy with television and McDonalds nuggets (tried them once, how anyone can eat that vile chicken byproduct is beyond me)."

Completely correct, most people I talk to know squat about Europe or the Fed...


I like both, but I like GOLD more!  The BEST wealth preserver has ALREADY been chosen, by the Central Banks and the "Giants".  Most of them got their gold very cheap...

Silver for spending if TSHTF or for speculation (excellent for speculation).  For wealth preservation, my vote is for gold.     <--- long and hard reading, but worth it.

Thu, 09/01/2011 - 21:45 | 1624608 anony
anony's picture


Last first. Chicken McNuggets would never have made it past the first batch if the american people who bought them had any common sense at all. Any idea remotely what they are eating.  They should have been the Edsel of fast food.

That pretty much encapsules the intelligence, awareness, and taste of a huge portion of the american people.

And a pretty solid indication of when things will change: when McNauseates cease being asked for.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:41 | 1616861 DutchR
DutchR's picture

Between my birthday an today the world population whenth from 3.3 to 7 billion.

And the future seems not to decline.

I placed my bet.


Finite resources chasing a western style return, I.....



Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:14 | 1616973 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

Yes; that's the basic underlying problem alright. but it's politically incorrect, you can't mention it.

Thu, 09/01/2011 - 21:47 | 1624601 anony
anony's picture

Not so. "We" can all mention it, proclaim it, broadcast it.

What can't happen is the Mass Media mentioning it. Or even hinting at it.

If hundreds of millions of  "we" mention it, then maybe the MSM will too.

The problem is getting "mentioning it", to go viral.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:48 | 1616884 JohnG
JohnG's picture

The "Cross of gold speech" is one of the most powerful I have ever read.  There is a partial recitation by Bryan made later here:

It's very well worth listening to.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:06 | 1616938 Dr. Acula
Dr. Acula's picture

It's a pile of statist rhetoric. Probably more harmful than the BS issuing from the teleprompter-in-chief's mouth.

For actual insight, try reading Rothbard.


Tue, 08/30/2011 - 19:17 | 1616983 IQ 145
IQ 145's picture

"powerful" therefore,"very well worth listening to."  Gee, I always thought correct, or aligned with reality was more important than "powerful"; but I admit it's a lot easier to just float along with the emotional hormones.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 18:49 | 1616888 Medea
Medea's picture

Blame is gay.

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 20:08 | 1617120 Jovil
Jovil's picture

Living through a currency devaluation and how to cope

I was managing an American subsidiary of a successful large US Company in Mexico. It had been a financial turnaround for our team. Cash flow had accumulated in our bank in Mexico and corporate didn’t want the money repatriated to the US. Although we had already paid a 35% income tax to the Mexican government, we would have to pay an additional 30% exit tax to repatriate the money. In addition, we would have to pay high fees for the peso/dollar exchange, in order to make the transfer. The company wanted to expand our successful business and so we decided to keep the money in Mexican pesos to be used for further expansion.


One morning, as my wife and I were on a trip driving on the highway, we heard a national message from the President of Mexico in 1976, Luis Echevarria, one of the most corrupt presidents in Mexican history. “It is a lie that we are going to devalue the peso,” he said.

Read more on how we can cope with the debasement of the dollar



Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:10 | 1617319 mfoste1
mfoste1's picture

just vote Ron Paul 2012 and stfu, thats all that can be done

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 21:46 | 1617453 notadouche
notadouche's picture

Was this guy talking about Obama?  The guy has never taken blame for anything since he took office.  

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 22:17 | 1617479 cranky-old-geezer
cranky-old-geezer's picture



Thousands of years of human history have proven humans aren't capable of self-government.  Humans are just too selfish.  America is no different. 

We started out with a form of government limiting democratic mob rule, but didn't prevent it completely. 

At first only landowners could vote, and a landowner's vote could not be nullified by his wife voting the other way.  That's why women weren't allowed to vote.  It wasn't a sexist thing.  If a woman was a landowner she could vote. It was that way to preserve each landowner's vote.  

When women won the right to vote it destroyed the one-vote-per-landowner system.  A landowner's vote could be nullified if his wife voted the other way, or doubled if his wife voted with him.

At first senators and congressmen were appointed by state legislatures, not by the people at large.  The president was elected by state legislatures, not by the people at large.  This was to preserve state government control over the the federal government.

After the civil war election of senators, congressmen, and the president went to the people at large and state governments lost control of the federal govenment.  Shortly after that various federal welfare programs started to buy people's votes.  Social security is the biggest example.  It was started to buy the senior citizen vote, a strong voting demographic at that time.  Then came various welfare programs aimed at the lower class to buy their votes.

Transfering election of senators, representatives, and the president to the people at large is when things really started going downhill in America.  States completely lost control of the federal government to pure ole democratic mob rule, with the federal government giving money to various voting demographics to buy their votes.

That's when senate candidates, representative candidates, and presidential candidates started dumbing down their message, telling all kinds of crazy lies, and making all kinds of promises.  They were now talking to dumb stupid ignorant American sheeple who knew nothing about government, nothing about economics, but were now voting people into the highest offices in the land.

That was the beginning of the end of America.

Thu, 09/01/2011 - 21:37 | 1624593 anony
anony's picture

Yet another post that gives one hope that not all the people are as stupid, naive, ill-informed, uninformed.

++++++++++++++and many more...

Tue, 08/30/2011 - 23:22 | 1617791 sellstop
sellstop's picture

Most Americans are willing to pay more in taxes to keep the social programs. The tea party is a minority of ignorant misinformed yahoos. I run into them all of the time. They come into the ED with no insurance or ability to pay for the service, and then spout tea party politics. Anti-Obama, anti-Democrat, etc...

We could just raise taxes. If the American people object they will come out and vote.

Meanwhile the dollar would go up, the Chinese wouldn't need to buy up the US debt, we would spend less at Walmart, we wouldn't need to worry about retirement again, a national single payer health care system would let people retire early, the young people could have the jobs, we wouldn't spend all of our money on our last six months of life, and we would leave those dollars to our heirs... Taxes are part of a closed system, a system of collective investment and savings. That money doesn't flee the country.


Wed, 08/31/2011 - 00:10 | 1617920 Quantum Nucleonics
Quantum Nucleonics's picture

"The beneficiaries of these programs vote in large numbers. Politicians who talk about cutting these programs are going to run into trouble. "


"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." B. Franklin

Sadly, Franklin's warning has come to pass. 50% of Americans pay no federal taxes.

Wed, 08/31/2011 - 09:49 | 1618593 HoardeBilly
HoardeBilly's picture

So...during my lifetime I have paid into SS 6ish%, my employer matches, and each dollar put IN is complicated by the timestamp on that dollar.  So, 1980AD dollars paid in...2040AD paid back...

So, figuring for the magic loss of money to real inflation over that time...

would it come out equivalent? 

Any of you math whizzes done this analysis for engineer making median wages throughout his/her lifetime? 

How  bad a Ponzi is this?

Wed, 08/31/2011 - 13:15 | 1619168 HoardeBilly
HoardeBilly's picture

Okay, in trying to answer my own question I took the inflation rates from:

(just used the yearly data - not arguing if data is valid - assuming so)

And used a spreadsheet to calculate a purchasing power peg starting at 1970 where $1, 1970 = $HB1 purchasing power in HoardBilly Fiat dollars ;)  .  So, for $1, 2011, that equates to $HB0.1538 (2011) today or 15cents purchasing power in 1970 dollars.

Then I projected inflation forward as 3% per year and of course!! the same 3% raise per year to keep at equal purchasing power through the carreer of a ficticious Engineer called Billy.  Both are assumptions just to get a feel for how much is paid into the system over a lifetime in real purchasing power vs how much is pulled out during retirement.

Billy also is pegged to 1970 (born then) and started his carreer in the usual way.  In 2011 Billy pulled in $72000 with a purchasing power of $HB10700 and sadly Billy will NEVER make more than $HB12000, although his final (laugable salary estimate in 2036 at age 66 will be $146000, $HB10500).

Billy spends 50 years (ignoring substandard wages during college...just the bulk of the carreer) paying into the SS system. When Billy retires at age 67 he will have made about $3.63M gross with real purchasing power of $HB455,000 and will have put in $472,000 total ($HB59,000) into SS, with the employer paying half of that.

If Billy lives to the ripe old age of 85 (18 years on the dole!)...he collects $2200 per month with no adjustments for inflation from the broke ass SS department.  Each year this $26400 FIXED income reduces from $HB1838 at age 67 to $HB1063 at age 85.  PER YEAR PUCHASING POWER!  Can you say..."Catfood is retirement food?"  I knew you could.

Lets say Billy lives to collect till the ripe old age of Eleventy-one (111).  Retirement for 44 years must be sweet! He collects $1,188,000 from SS!  WOW...oh billy bux the total is: $HB45,700.  I guess the govt gets to pocket the $HB13,300 ($HB59,000 - $HB45,700) in real purchasing power that was paid into the system but never came out as benefit to Billy.

By the way, that $26400 in year 2081 is ~$HB481 for the ENTIRE year.

Back of the envelope is that workers will NEVER be able to recoup the purchasing power taken from them by SS taxes.

Definately a Scam...they collect the money when it is much more valuable in real terms (during youth and career) and give a portion of it back when the value of the money is much much less (old age).

All estimates, assumptions, errors are purely my own.  Don't trust a Goat to do the math for you!  hehe...I think if you peg to a specific date you would see how dangerous inflation is to real wealth. 


Mon, 09/05/2011 - 09:28 | 1634006 shacai
shacai's picture

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