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Will Hungary Be The Next Iceland? PM Orban: "Hungarians Will Not Live As Foreigners Dictate"

Tyler Durden's picture


When it comes to being a NWO debt slave, one can accept their fate demurely and bent over, like a conditionally habituated dog electroshocked into perpetual submission just as the banker elites like it, with threats that the world would end the second one dared to change the status quo (see Greece), or one can do something about being a debt slave. Like Iceland. And then rapidly proceed to be the best performing economy in Europe. And reading some of the latest news out of Hungary, which has to count its lucky stars is not stuck in the inflexible nightmare that is the mercantilist Eurocurrency union, gives us hope that we may soon witness the next sovereign rebellion against the banker yoke. The WSJ reports: "Hungary's premier fired a new broadside in the country's running battle of wills with the European Union, saying that Hungarians should be free to make their own laws without interference from Brussels.  Speaking to a large crowd of supporters celebrating the anniversary of a 19th-century Hungarian revolt against Austrian rule, Prime Minister Viktor Orban said: "Hungarians will not live as foreigners dictate." This has promptly generated the anticipated response from European unelected dictator Barroso, who minutes ago said that Hungary's Orban doesn't get democracy. Oh, we think he does. What he doesn't seem to get, or like, is existence in a banker-governed technocratic, klepto-fascist state, in which the peasantry is merely an intermediary vessel for asset confiscation by insolvent banks. Like Greece... which however already is the butt of all jokes of personal submission to a foreign oppressor, so there is no dignity in kicking a dog that is down.

Why is Orban angry with the EU?

Mr. Orban's sharp words came amid tensions between Budapest and the EU, which is pressuring Hungary to change laws on its central bank, judiciary and data privacy that the group says violate its rules.


EU ministers also voted this week to suspend development funds for Hungary next year unless the country adopts new measures to trim its budget deficit. Hungary insists the country is on track to meet its EU-mandated targets.


The European Commission for Democracy through Law, a legal advisory panel better known as the Venice Commission is expected to issue Friday an opinion on the independence of the judiciary under Hungary's new constitution.

What is ironic, is that even this potentially faux statement of defiance, is peanuts compared to how the people really think. Does anyone wonder why the death of "democratic" Europe would be a referendum? Simple - the people are sick of living in the feudal middle ages, only this time instead of a lord, the person in charge is a CEO of a local insolvent bank..d

About a mile from Mr. Orban's rally in front of the country's neo-Gothic parliament building, an opposition protest drew tens of thousands of Hungarians angry with Mr. Orban and his Fidesz party's legislative agenda.


The demonstration was organized by the group One Million for the Hungarian Freedom of the Press, commonly known as Milla. Speakers called on the government to guarantee media freedom and observe EU norms.


Mr. Orban's government wants "complete political and economic control," said Andras Magyar, a 61-year-old pensioner who joined the protest. "I'm very unhappy about the injustice now, the development of a dictatorial system."


Mr. Orban and his supporters dismiss criticism of the new constitution, which they say protects Hungarian values while complying with EU standards.


"We are going to protect the constitution, which is our security for the future," Mr. Orban said Thursday, to applause. He said Hungary doesn't need the "unsolicited assistance of foreigners wanting to guide our hands."


Mr. Orban's speech offered no detailed, direct comments on the points of contention between Budapest and Brussels. But he did allude to central bank independence, which the EU and IMF have said must be insured before they will start talks on a precautionary loan Hungary wants.

Naturally, Europe merely wants every impression of defiance squashed: after all Germany hasn't funded all those current account deficits with €550+ billion in money it was never again see via the Buba just so these slaves can go ahead and revolt.

The EU is insisting, among other things, that Hungary change the oath of office for central bankers to reflect their role as part of an EU-wide central-bank system.


Mr. Orban's speech captured a sense of national grievance shared by many Hungarians unhappy that the prosperity they aspired to when they joined the EU has been smothered by a mountain of household and public debt.

As for the best summary of how Hungary feels right now?

One person in the crowd held a sign reading: "Colonization: 1956 Soviet Tanks, 2012 Western Banks."

The only question remaining: how much longer will the status quo dangle the carrot of a "solvent" welfare socialist state when at this point everyone knows Europe, and the entire developed world is broke. Curious how pensions will fare when reality comes crashing down? Why take a look at the 80% haircut in the Greek pension system. And then consider that Greece has a first mover advantage. The sad truth is that very soon several hundred million European, and Americans, will realize that the social safety net everyone had taken for granted, and thanks to which nobody dared to revolt, has been long-plundered.

What then?


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Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:46 | 2261673 Ruffcut
Ruffcut's picture

I heard last week they had some issues. Who does'nt. You can't think they would be left out.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:17 | 2261731 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Hungary's Orban doesn't get democracy.

LOL.  Banksters are so full of lies, unbelievable.  And those protests, well I'm sure the bankster cartel hired anit-Orban protesters to stage these types of events, hoping to sway public opinion.  US gov't did it in Egypt and Libya.  It's the best way to win popular opinion in todays vast mobile media network amongst the masses:  Stage a protest, pay the protesters, to sway public opinion when mass media covers it.

People of the world have blinders on, as illuminati theft continues unabated.


Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:34 | 2262157 Ahmeexnal
Ahmeexnal's picture

And while Hungarians are wide awake about the reality facing the world, what are their western european counterparts doing?

Lining up by the millions to buy the new iPad:

When the SHTF, the eurosheeple will have to trade in their iPads....for kneepads.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 15:55 | 2263126 Mountainview
Mountainview's picture

Brussels would only be too happy to appoint a Monti/Papademos for Hungary. An administrator for Budapest. Democracy is only for the rich

and Syria...

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 16:37 | 2263302 caconhma
caconhma's picture

Magyars= Hungarians are great people with great history and traditions.

They were only one who twice bravely fought Soviet invaders in 1945 and 1956. In 1945, few hundred thousands Red Army soldiers were killed storming Budapest.

Then in 1956, Hungarians fought against Jewish commissars appointed by Stalin and Soviet invaders. How, Hungarians will be in front fighting the International Jewish Banking Mafia. God help them!

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 17:44 | 2263532 Don Diego
Don Diego's picture

godspeed Hungary!!

Sat, 03/17/2012 - 06:49 | 2264611 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Hungarian politicians are about as rotten as they come

But if it's a choice of being robbed by your own and robbed by the banking Eurocrat kind you just gotta go with the home team ..everytime

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:21 | 2262288 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Yes, the issue with the direct political control of the Hungarian CB is quite debatable. Historically, europeans have a preference for CBs not under the direct political control of the government. Orban wants to be PM and chief-of-the-printing-press in one.

But the issue with the Hungarian Parliament changing their Constitution with the new "SuperLaws" is a serious one. The Constitution mentioned above is the new-with-superlaws, not the old one.

What they have done is against all agreements inside the EU and it's implications for the human and political rights of the Hungarian Citizens are appalling. The opposition is really trying to get this point across - free speech is also impacted, just to explain this to everybody.

Soon the opposition media might only operate from outside of Hungary.

Don't kid yourself, this Hungarian Government is on the verge of sliding into fascism, the real one. And, quite typical of fascism, it's claiming to protect the citizenship from the predatory Money-Lords.

Whoever wrote this article might regret in future to have focussed on the debt/CB view only.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 20:45 | 2264004 1 Peng?
1 Peng?'s picture

Normally I like what you write, but I think on Hungary you read a bit too much derSpiegel, FT and NYT (I know from your earlier posts that you also know some Hungarians). You seem to have firm views about the constitution, but I guess you haven't seen it (I had a look and it's pretty hogwash, but the good news is that the previous one was also useless and we anyway don't care that much about the constitution in Hungary, - I am sorry, this must be shocking for a German).

Hungary to become fascist? I doubt it: Hungarians are not apt for that. They generally don't respect any authority and are very bad in following rules. It's like herding cats. It won't work and PM Orban knows this very well. His current popularity is not based on authority, but on his 'braveness' to say the truth to the big dogs. that's what Hungarians seem to like, even if it makes their standard of living worse. 

Regarding CB and media independence, the problem is (beyond that most of what you read in MSM is false) that these are still bastions of the previous opposition, impeding the democratically elected government to govern in this difficult situation. In the ideal world which may be the reality in Germany, these should be independent.

Nevertheless, private media is as free as ever in Hungary (check out the websites that i mention below to confirm), in the public part of the media, I would agree that there are clumsy attempts to make it government friendly, - but i think it's mission impossibe to achieve with above mentioned sceptical cats of Hungarians (which is, of course, good)  

So instead of fascism in Hungary, you should rather worry that this government succeeds, because the hope of many decent people is in them.

Sat, 03/17/2012 - 06:26 | 2264591 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

thanks. I definitely read too much news nowadays - I do try hard to filter the spin and the propaganda out but I'm human too.

I know Hungary only from the dozen trips I've made since the curtain fell and the two before that and I agree, irreverent cats is apt! ;-)

I also had a look - my worry is more on the technicality of having what amounts to changes to the const. by a supermajority of parliament - I am a supporter of parliamentarism, but the rules around the constitutions should differ more from the rules around the normal lawmaking.

Let me put it this way: constitutions are not important - until they desperately are. They are worth cherishing.

Not a German, btw! Please, I mean "on the verge of becoming fascist" - as a "danger point" and not as a foregone conclusion. A "tipping point" that requires fortitude.

1. Having a bastion of the opposition in the media (even when they are bloody socialists), IMHO, is not bad for a country and keeps this gov in check. Either people are guillible and can be manipulated by the media or they don't - a PM of a democratic republic has to have a thick skin and has to be critizised by someone - in TV.

2. If a PM claims he can't govern because of too much socialist rabble-rousing against his policies then perhaps it's time to thank him for his sterling service to the nation and have the next one on the job. This kind of feelings are often a sign of staleness. I know he does not say that but his supporters should not suggest this, too.

3. Having the gov making clumsy attempt of making the media more gov-friendly is worth a small international slap on the wrist.

4. Having a parliament making constitutional changes without a clear delegation to it is worrisome to me. Referendums or elected Constitutional Conventions would make me less worried. Technically, the changes are outside of the parameters of the EU. Really necessary?

Let me make an analogy: Italy & Berlusconi (I've posted here in ZH my support of him, btw). At the moment I don't see Orban very far from Berlusconi's media power attitude. But the media aspect is one aspect where Berlusconi strayed from the "perfect path". Alone, it was ok. Well, then came the girls, too... But Berlusconi did not also attempt to make the currency more political and change the constitution. This worries me.

And then comes the currency. Remember how politically important his commitment in fighting inflation was? I cheered when the CHF fix decision came - though it is a dangerous path. Authority is good - depending on the dosis and the occation - but it's a powerful drug, too,

Don't get me wrong, I do hope this government succeeds. I just hope they keep being a much better option than the socialists (urgh).

Sun, 03/18/2012 - 20:54 | 2268189 1 Peng?
1 Peng?'s picture

Thanks and first of all, sorry for guessing your nationality wrongly!

One thing I like in the new constitution is that it was made by a democratically elected parliament, as opposed to the previous one which was a Soviet heritage, boosted by some naive ideas, like everyone has the right to live in a nice place (but in practise it didn't keep great masses to become homeless in the 90ies). I think it was no secret in Hungary, that if Fidesz gets a 2/3 majority, they will rewrite the playbook (the opposition intentionally didn't participate in this process, because they were working on their strategy to make Orban look like a dictator and come back to power on the shoulders of the EU/IMF, instead of Soviet tanks, - clever chaps they are, they knew the weakness of Orban that he will always call one more card on 19). And, BTW, so far the EU haven't had any legal complaint (infringement case) about the new contitution itself (i.e. there is political barking about it, but it seems, legally it's not 'outside the EU parameters') 

The problem with the media is that it's still very biased against the government (even the state media is not really gov. friendly, but closer to neutral). A biased media (in any direction) cannot be good for the country, so I think it needs further rebalancing, so that people can get closer to finding out what's really going on. Of course, the government will not be able to change this setup and I should agree with you that it's probably better not to even try it.



Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:27 | 2262408 RollinsArline3
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my roomate's mom makes $83/hr on the computer. She has been fired from work for 9 months but last month her pay check was $18339 just working on the computer for a few hours. Read more on this web site .....

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:46 | 2261674 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

Luckily, rhetoric doesn't equal reality otherwise Barry's mouthgarbage would make sense.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:49 | 2261687 Esperanza Y Cambio
Esperanza Y Cambio's picture

It's a shame that Hungary didn't get on the Euro before running out of money. They'd be treated like royalty ... please don't default! Please don't default! Please! We beg you!

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:51 | 2261693 jus_lite_reading
jus_lite_reading's picture

YES! I heard about this on Tuesday and it gave me goose bumps thinking that they are waking up!!! 

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:07 | 2261740 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Indeed. First glimmer of hope (for the world) that I've heard all year. If the European Union falls apart before the US is taken down, then the NWO have lost.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:19 | 2262364 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Now you have made me curious and by now you might believe me that I'm seriously interested in your POV.

Please explain it in more details, what kind of scenarios would open if the EU falls apart?

I mean: what exactly would change for the average US citizen? The dollar would have a longer lifespan?

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 14:25 | 2262693 kito
kito's picture

you might be reminded that the nwo have already been defeated in south america. they carry almost zero influence there now. south america, led by the likes of rafael corrrea of ecuador, created a united front and broke the chains of the imf and world bank. it can be done in hungary as it was done in south america................


viva libertad!!!!!

Thu, 03/22/2012 - 12:37 | 2263868 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

!! It is becoming more and more apparent that you sir, regardless of your deflationary 'episodes', are capable of making some excellent observations.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:04 | 2261747 IBelieveInMagic
IBelieveInMagic's picture

Don't get your hopes up. Once the bankers go to work behind the scenes, all this rhetoric will be shown to be what it is...

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:16 | 2261801 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Interesting that Hungary has only ever had 3 attendees at Bilderberg: Lamfalussy (General Manager, BIS), Surányi (President, National Bank of Hungary), and Bokros (advisor, World Bank). None of the senior politicians have attended ... an oversight on Bilderberg's part, or a rejection by Hungarians? :-)

Sat, 03/17/2012 - 06:58 | 2264615 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

Hungary is pretty poor ..their lowly ranking at Bilderberg reflects the low value of national money available to be raped and thieved by international bwanking

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:53 | 2261702 Mongo
Mongo's picture

Hungarians will live as the elite dictates...

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:38 | 2261898 Raging Debate
Raging Debate's picture

The Hungarians are a special breed of people that revolt and ignore the consequences. The Soviets starved several million to death (1/4 of their population) and still gave them the finger. The empire of clay and iron won't dissuade the Hungarians from independence.

They are worlds different than docile Americans that rob each other. As an American we are learning the hard way of passivity when it comes to government. After 1,000+ years of invasions resistance seems baked into their DNA.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:37 | 2262176 bigkahuna
bigkahuna's picture

I guess we'll see...

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:17 | 2262310 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Remember 2006 remembering 1956

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 21:00 | 2264040 1 Peng?
1 Peng?'s picture

very flattering to me as a Hungarian (and as descendant of freedom fighters, as recently as my grandfathers), but I doubt that it's in our genes

i think it's rather just about being at the bad place at the bad time. Hungarians had the (un)luck to get unbearable injustices too many times in history, so when that point comes, they revolt

your numbers about starvation deaths are too high (maybe it was another country, like the Ukraine?). i guess it was rather a couple of ten thousands in the early 50ies in Hungary (?)  

the big massacres were during and after the two WWs

after '56 many people (0,5-1 million?) emigrated, which is a great loss for a small country (but revolution deaths in '56-57 were I gues  'only' a couple of thousands)

Sat, 03/17/2012 - 07:25 | 2264616 Zero Govt
Zero Govt's picture

i visit Budapest a few times a year and interesting the small shops only accept cash now, the credit card fees are extortinate

Isn't it 'strange' banks don't have an inter-bank system for credit cards but choose to funnel all transactions throguh those 2 architects of bubble consumerism (debt slavery), Visa and Mastercard would be cheaper direct than adding these 2 global monopolist middle-men

bank to bank versus

bank to Visa/Mastercard to bank

weird they don't cut the costs/crooks out

the Monopolist Matrix commission cutting global and national consumers ..hope Hungarian banks find their own system/independence like Iran will now have to cut out of the SWIFT system

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:54 | 2261711 Conrad Murray
Conrad Murray's picture

You squids and morgue workers that read these articles better take them to heart. When the time comes, "I was just doing my job", won't mean a damn thing. Your throats will be cut just as swiftly as those of your bosses.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:14 | 2262088 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

Someday in the future, anyone with the title of executive, banker, politician, or lawyer will be viewed suspiciously. People are sick of seeing d-bags drive off in BMWs from their mansions while they go hungry. How long before the masses awake? I don't know.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:41 | 2262192 bigkahuna
bigkahuna's picture

these guys don't understand that.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:58 | 2262265 Escapeclaws
Escapeclaws's picture

I'm sure they're quaking in their boots at your tough words.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:20 | 2262365 LowProfile
LowProfile's picture


Your throats will be cut just as swiftly as those of your bosses.

Don't be so bloodthirsty.

I vote we force them to work in fast food for life.


"Would you like fries with that?"

"...Why yes Mr. Dimon, I would like fries with that.  Thank you very much."

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:56 | 2261716 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

so go long plundered?

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:57 | 2261719 jover
jover's picture

I had no idea that the people in Hungary we're smarter than those over here.

They seem to get it that the western banks are true oppressors.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:00 | 2261732 frenchie
frenchie's picture

eastern europe nations might have some clues as from experience we know that bolshevism is a jewish idea and "pseudo bankster democratic capitalism" is also a jewish idea

Masonic jews and bankers from NYC funded the red revolution by giving gold to Trotski

Marx and Rotschild are just two faces of the same coin

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:29 | 2261858 GeneMarchbanks
GeneMarchbanks's picture

'Marx and Rotschild are just two faces of the same coin'

They indeed are not, but thanks for simplifying.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:33 | 2261874 Treeplanter
Treeplanter's picture

The German govt funded Lenin as part of taking Russia out of the war. Lenin was not a Jew.  Ranting against Jews is a sure sign of stupidity and ignorance. 

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:17 | 2262356 viahj
viahj's picture

how many generations of "purity" do you require to be classified as non-jewish?

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:07 | 2262050 i-dog
i-dog's picture

Lenin's maternal grandfather was a Jew. Lenin's Jewish ancestry is discussed in detail in Oxford University historian Robert Service's biography, Lenin (Harvard University Press, 2000). See also: "Lenin: Jewish roots of a revolutionary," by Zev Ben-Shlomo, Jewish Chronicle, London, April 21, 1995

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:06 | 2261756 DaveyJones
DaveyJones's picture

makes sense, people in europe have had a little more time living under corrupt structures

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:58 | 2261722 frenchie
frenchie's picture

there is also an issue because the new Hungarian Constitution explicitely refers to Christian roots and life protection from womb till natural death

and this is against the NWO agenda... btw this point is relevant with respect to the other post here about lost principles and social desctruction

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:58 | 2261724 Steroid
Steroid's picture

The reason for cutting funds is the high (3%) government deficit. For god' sake, this is the lowest in Europe.

However, probably the biggest real issue is whether the president of the Hungarian National Bank woukl be required to take an oath on the Hungarian constitution.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 10:59 | 2261725 tocointhephrase
tocointhephrase's picture

Viva Hungary! And you can take that to the morgue you bunch of zombie half life scum bag muppets! 


Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:01 | 2261733 trentusa
trentusa's picture

This is the type of hard-hitting honest journalism wrapped up in a colorful metaphor hidden sorta in a simile- or whatever. This is why I love and will never cease to support this website. God bless ZH Tyler & this community.

existence in a banker-governed technocratic, klepto-fascist state, in which the peasantry is merely an intermediary vessel for asset confiscation by insolvent banks.

Wise man sayeth: As it just so happens, ships are parked in the Boston harbor with crates of Grey Goose prepped for tossage overboard as we speak.   :-)

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:14 | 2261797 Manthong
Manthong's picture

Long skiffs with nets.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:01 | 2261734 Legolas
Legolas's picture

If Iceland can break free from the bankers, so can Hungary, and all the rest of world.  The problem is there is a shortage of Red Pills.


Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:48 | 2262217 NorthPole
NorthPole's picture

Dont get your hopes too high. While I certainly wish them all the bast, Hungary is a small, indebted country and IMHO will be easy to pacify. Just impose some trade sanctions, withhold all EU subsidies and watch Orban's ratings plummet when he can't pay pensions on time. Orban's own sheep will overthrow him.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:04 | 2261738 dick cheneys ghost
dick cheneys ghost's picture

bankers and tankers..........MIC threatened congress 2 days ago....bankers on a daily basis....


YO.....Janet Tavikoli has some nice workds for ZH in huffpo............



Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:04 | 2261745 azzhatter
azzhatter's picture

Mr Von Rumpboy doesn't like this kind of talk. There will be no nation states

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:05 | 2261751 Tic tock
Tic tock's picture

-independance of the Central Bank - that's a a little rich

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:09 | 2261765 AlaricBalth
AlaricBalth's picture

Revised Hungarian Declaration of Independence

We hereby proclaim and make known to all the inhabitants of the united states of Hungary and Transylvania, and their dependencies, that all authorities, communes, towns, and the civil officers both in the counties and cities, are completely set free and released from all the obligations under which they stood, by oath or otherwise, to the said house of Barroso-Van Rompuy, and that any individual daring to contravene this decree, and by word or deed in any way to aid or abet any one violating it, shall be treated and punished as guilty of high treason. And by the publication of this decree, we hereby bind and oblige all the inhabitants of these countries to obedience to the government now instituted formally, and endowed with all necessary legal powers.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:12 | 2261781 crzyhun
crzyhun's picture

Elljen a Magyar!!

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:37 | 2261896 RagnarDanneskjold
RagnarDanneskjold's picture

Authoritarianism is more popular and the extreme positions of government during the rising social mood help to mask the extremism of rising politicians. The excessive penalties on Germany during the 1920s made Hitler's nationalism attractive to average Germans. In Europe today, extreme left-wing politics that dominates the media and EU government in Brussels, plus the anti-democratic and authoritarian behavior of the EU, makes Hungary's Orban seem rational at best and at worst, on the same level as those accusing him of a dictatorship. That's not to say he isn't a proto-dictator, but thanks to social mood, we are going to find out.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:16 | 2261804 markar
markar's picture

run like the wind, Hungary from the EMU. The Soviet Bloc will seem like a picnic compared to what's in store for you.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:17 | 2261812 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

The bankers can't see the violence coming any more than they could see the housing bust coming.  The only thing that is saving them is that most people don't understand what the bankers are doing and won't try to understand until they are starving.  Heck, they probably still won't understand the mechanics of why they are starving, but they will be really pissed.  They will have the right general idea.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:47 | 2262212 bigkahuna
bigkahuna's picture

when really hungry people are not trying to get food, they are sleeping.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:19 | 2261815 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

I wish the rest of the world especially here in the U.S would wake up to the fact that the bankers are the real enemy.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:04 | 2262042 Treeplanter
Treeplanter's picture

Bankers are just part of the corrupt permanent political class.  They are enabled by the media thought police and self-serving politicians.  It's not too late to take them down.  Our ace in the hole is that the country is waking up.  We have to keep the internet out of govt control and vote the crooks out.  Strict enforcement of the law would destroy the bankers and remove their favorite judges.  Adherence to the Constitution would destroy crony capitalism and restore the free market and sound money.  The tough part is getting this done during a global economic collapse. 

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 15:01 | 2262847 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture


Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:27 | 2261851 LookingWithAmazement
LookingWithAmazement's picture

Hungary is a black swan, turning white. No crisis.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:31 | 2261863 Bartanist
Bartanist's picture

I suppose that is a nice sentiment to have until the Satan worshipping elitists threaten his death or to take his children or grandchildren, torture them and then make a satainc blood sacrifice of them.

People's view seem to change when one realizes that they are powerless in this world against the demons. It would take a very strong man, with a very strong belief system, to maintain his morals and ethics under such pressure.

Still, good seemingly cannot come from evil acts.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:32 | 2261871 gibons
gibons's picture

Orban is another political clown who wants to concentrate all the power in his office - thats no Iceland and no example to anyone. Ive seen so many of those small fuhrers in Eastern Europe, it never ended well nor for them, nor the countries.


To claim that central bankers are not elected, so I should be printing instead - thats no democracy or a soultion for anything. Same goes for press freedom

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:34 | 2261877 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

The powers that be are stepping up the African war "theater":

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:34 | 2261880 swissaustrian
swissaustrian's picture

Iceland's government encourages freedom of speech and net freedom, Hungary's gov absolutely doesn't.

Their economic approaches to their crises might be similar, but that's about it.

Of course, the main reason why the EU and IMF are freaking out about Hungary is that the government has decided to attend meetings of the Hungarian central bank whenever they want.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 20:09 | 2263920 1 Peng?
1 Peng?'s picture

Who told you that? The 'free' press you get or maybe someone with direct financial interest in Hungary doing not so great under this government?

The stories about this gov's abuses of rights and freedom are way too exaggerated. Of course no one is perfect, but most of the controversial stuff they did was because the country is in deep shit, they got a strong democratic mandate to change it, but all the 'independent' institutions and international bodies are packed by loyalists and friends of the previous gov (which was in power for 8 years till mid-2010 and can be further traced back to communist-times) and are trying to block each and every of their move.

Concerning media freedom, if you are really interested in the truth, just check out the titles of the main Hungarian news website with google translate to see how government friendly they are:

and the main business news websites:

pretty much any time you will find lot of scandals about this gov, plus what shit FT, BBC, Spiegel and other 'free' press is writing about them 

in business portals you will mostly read how bad the economy is doing (i.e. only the bad news, good news forgotten)

Concerning the attendance of central bank meetings by the gov, you are again completly misled by the 'free' press: it was always the case in Hungary (at least in the past 15 years) that one guy from the ministry of finance could attend the interest rate setting meetings of the central bank (without a right to vote). This government wanted absolutely no change in that, but after the criticism from the EU, they will even get the old thing out from the law (which I think is stupid, because it's really useful to have some sort of dialogue between monetary and fiscal policy, - after all, both should be working for the public good and together they can be stronger). In many places of the EU, this is absolutely normal practise, but somehow the 'free' press forgets to mention that.


Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:37 | 2261892 swissaustrian
swissaustrian's picture

Austrian and Swiss banks alike are scared to death about the HUF weakness, because they dumped EUR+CHF mortgages on Hungarians subprime style...

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:48 | 2261915 slewie the pi-rat
slewie the pi-rat's picture

Mr. Orban's sharp words came amid tensions between Budapest and the EU, which is pressuring Hungary to change laws on its central bank, judiciary and data privacy that the group says violate its rules.

 under all this poli-posturing, we have the hungarian citizen, mired up to his/her indebted ass in real estate payments that make no sense in a world that didn't follow what greenspan, benzelbub and most europeons thought would be the "script" regarding assets, debt, and cash flow from incomes

if that sounds familiar, maybe it is b/c they have the same banksters over there, too...

so the hungarians have passed a plethora0'rules (laws) regarding wherefore and thusly that foresaid mortgage payments should be suspended or adjusted DOWN, and the banksters and their "clients" who "need da money" would go fuking bilary on themHungarians if they only could...

the hungarians are gonna do the right thing and tell the EU to go get fuking fuked

trust me and tank me later, ok?

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:06 | 2262003 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

nem szabad!

(Can't touch this)

I got a print of F.Rakoczi that says you're right.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:43 | 2261922 Schmuck Raker
Schmuck Raker's picture


Greece gets a lollipop...

ECB to boost liquidity for Greek banks, sources say

The European Central Bank has upgraded the collateral supplied to the Frankfurt-based organization by Greek banks, sources have told Kathimerini.

It is expected that this will immediately lead to an extra 25 billion euros of liquidity being available to lenders in Greece.


Do you suppose that Fitch raising Greece's rating last week may have just been preparatory cover for this move by the ECB this week?

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:46 | 2261939 hungarianboy
hungarianboy's picture

We shit on the banksters anyway :-)

Orban is not good neither. need something in between.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:51 | 2261965 MayIMommaDogFac...
MayIMommaDogFace2theBananaPatch's picture

Autonomy Bitchez!

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 11:51 | 2261969 Fix It Again Timmy
Fix It Again Timmy's picture

The principal doesn't matter, bankers get a huge hard-on for perpetual guaranteed income streams consisting of interest payments from levied taxes on the "little people."  The principal is created out of thin air by black-magic vodoo shit.  Hey Hungary, just say "Bite Me."

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:28 | 2262133 Ned Zeppelin
Ned Zeppelin's picture

"Hungarians will not live as foreigners dictate."

The recent evidence to the contrary in Euroland says that they will.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:30 | 2262143 Trader47
Trader47's picture

How Long we have to listen to that moron barroso, who put this SOB in charge, he cant even direct piss into a bucket

I suggest the Hungarian mafia make goulash from this twat

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:41 | 2262195 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture

Not sure the Hungarians will be allowed to play the Iceland card.  The more likely outcome will be military intervention to force the governement to comply with international banking regulations or whatever crap they come up with to inflict the wounds.  Threats and injury may come before the actual military intervention.  But all of this really depends on whether the bankers think it's worth it to show their physical side yet, or if they decide it's still too early to expose that hand.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:50 | 2262417 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

 Who's going to invade them? The Hapsburgs? The Turkish? Russia? Been there, done that, still got the language. Hrvatska?

Say, what if the 'debtor' nations 'default' on their onerous usurers' debt en masse? Who's planning to invade 'em all all at once altogether?

"Cous' the tahmes, they are a'shaun ging" -Steve Martin

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 15:02 | 2262860 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture

UN Peacekeepers, NATO, anyone the bankers insist on using?

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 15:59 | 2263131 GoinFawr
GoinFawr's picture

Sure, mb. Though Hungarians aren't usually all that brown-skinned as a rule you know...I suppose your 'bankers' might consider this an exception, but I doubt it.

The logistics get stickier if the fronts multiply though, no?

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 22:58 | 2264288 Ranger4564
Ranger4564's picture

Are the Europeans brown skinned?  You don't seem to realize, skin color is not what determines whether you get reamed or not , it's banker circle, or not.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 12:43 | 2262200 the not so migh...
the not so mighty maximiza's picture

Austria-Hungary Empire RISE AGAIN!!!!


Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:25 | 2262396 Stock Tips Inve...
Stock Tips Investment's picture

The real problem in Hungary is not very different from the rest of Europe. This country has a public debt equivalent to 85% of its GDP (sound familiar?). His collection of taxes is slightly less than 20% of its GDP. His government defict is 4% of GDP. And the growth ofGDP is 1.8%. To pay interest and a small part of the principal of its debt, would need to use more than half of ALL the money they collect in taxes. If they spend less, there will be recession, unhappy people in the streets and probably less collection of taxes. If they want to spend the same, they need someone to give them the money: EU?. For me, is a strong candidate for the default.

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 14:24 | 2262689 Martin T
Martin T's picture

"the biggest threat to Austrian banks is still what it was in 2009—wholesale capital flight from emerging Europe."

"Erste Bank in fact, wrote down the value of its Hungarian and Romanian units by a combined 939 million euros in October."

"UniCredit wrote down goodwill on assets in its home market, eastern Europe and former Soviet Union countries in its third-quarter earnings report in November (8.7 billion-euro impairment charge)".

Back in November in our Goodwill conversation we made the following warning:
"Tip for “banks’ friends”: First came dividends cuts, then bonds haircuts. Next, we will see some massive write-off (Goodwill ?). UniCredit started, others will follow. The path will be very painful for both shareholders and bondholders."

Austrian banks have material exposure to Hungary, both via sovereign bonds and through loans. Erste Group has a total of EUR11bn in assets invested in Hungary (some EUR8bn in loans, some EUR3bn in sovereign exposure) while Raiffeisen Bank International has a total of EUR8bn in Hungarian assets (some EUR6bn in loans, some EUR2bn in sovereign exposure.

It is starting to get rather interesting also please note:

"Erste Bank Hungary closed 2010 with a slim profit of HUF 109m.
    The 2011 data show a pre-tax loss of HUF 152.2bn.
    The bank had total assets of HUF 3,253bn on December 31, 2011, up 9pc from
twelve months earlier. Stock of client loans reached HUF 2,315.3bn to give the
bank a loan-to-deposit ratio of 192pc, among the highest in the sector" - souce Bloomberg

and the icing on the cake for Erste hungary:

"The proportion of non-performing loans in the bank's portfolio rose to
20.5pc in 2011 from 11.7pc in 2010. The rate in the retail portfolio increased
to 16.3pc from 11.4pc, while the rate in the corporate portfolio climbed to
29pc from 12.5pc."

Good night and good luck...



Fri, 03/16/2012 - 16:44 | 2263322 tony bonn
tony bonn's picture

""Hungarians will not live as foreigners dictate.""

damned right.....default here and default now!

fuck the eu

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 17:05 | 2263377 icanhasbailout
icanhasbailout's picture

going long pitchforks torches tar & feathers

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 17:18 | 2263432 pcrs
pcrs's picture

It just means he wants more money to say the exact opposite. His price has not been met.

Sat, 03/17/2012 - 05:09 | 2264566 the tower
the tower's picture

So true. He wants the communist regime back and couldn't care less about the Hungarian people. Don't believe the hype, Hungary is NOT Iceland...

Fri, 03/16/2012 - 17:46 | 2263545 zatoshi
zatoshi's picture

To heaven with the people, to hell with aristocracy! (Pet?fi )

Sat, 03/17/2012 - 03:22 | 2264499 cnhedge
Sun, 03/18/2012 - 05:09 | 2264800 compound interest
compound interest's picture

Hungary is not Iceland, and Orban is worse than any western bankster. He's a nationalist / populist / destructive rat, the worst kind of politicians. Hungary is more like Greece, the only reason it is luckier is that Hungary had been a latecomer to the EU, and couldn't enjoy the constant flow of cheap money and subsidies in that order of magnitude as Greece had (and we know now that cheap money and cheap credit can be like poison in the long run). The hungarian budget deficit is at least 7%, but in 2011 it was manipulated by nationalizing the pension funds, to make it seem like it is 3%. The public debt is above 85% and still rising, much more, almost double than that of the average of Hungary's peers in Eastern Europe (while the potential for growth is much weaker, less than half of the average if its comparable peers). So it is an Eastern European country with Western European debt level, and a government that does not make any sustainable structural changes, it just robs off its own citizens and the part of the private sector that still operate and still in relatively good shape (which part happens to include mainly foreign-owned companies, but not all of 'em).

Mr. Orban's administration does not even try to mask the fact that they are playing favorites: they make exceptions for their own buddies' firms from the extra taxes on some industries, exceptions written in law. The only visible strategic long-term goal of Mr. Orban's regime is to make everyone (from citizens to companies) much more dependent on the State. The other long-term goal now seems to be getting out of the EU - which would be very dangerous for this poor country. Mr Orban doesn't want out of the EU because he knows better for Hungary: he wants out because he, personally, does not want to be told what to do, he does not want to lower the budget deficit, and he wants to get to the Central Bank to PRINT MONEY. (The Central Bank is the ONLY independent institution left in Hungary, every other important organization an office is filled now with Orban's men for the next 10-20 years. However, even the Central Bank also has only 1 year left until Orban's men will take over.) So the news from Hungary are NOT EXAGGERATED. Mr. Orban started his term with asking Barroso to let him let the deficit run, let him let take on MORE debt. When Mr. Barroso told him to f*ck off, then Mr. Orban started his war on western banks and western companies, and started his play on punishing and taxing everyone who is not with him, and making exceptions with anyone who is his buddy.

The only thing that keeps Hungary from becoming a true dictatorship is being part of the EU. It is not that easy being a Chavez or Putin if you are a member of the EU. So this country is truly lucky to have entered the doors of the Union BEFORE this little man grabbed the 2/3 of the Parliament seats (by winning the support of 51% of the voters on the 2010 election, thanks to the special complex voting system, which has been altered since then, in favor of the ruling party of course). It may be bad luck to be a member of a union that is "doomed by its inception", as ZH always suggests it (like it was pushing an agenda, I don't get why), but in the case of this small country, it is still better this way, because the biggest enemies of Hungary are Hungarian politicians like Orban. This is the type of men that led Hungary to world wars always on the wrong side, and this is the type that make countries go bankrupt without any hope of breaking out of poverty. Because he does not care. There will be many sovereign defaults in the world soon, but defaults will be different from each other. There will be some success stories like maybe Iceland, but not all will come out of it in a good shape. Don't expect anything constructive from Mr Orban. He can't build, he can only destroy, confront, and provoke.

Sun, 03/18/2012 - 05:34 | 2266780 compound interest
compound interest's picture

In his March 15. speech Mr. Orban said: "the Central Bank should not be independent from the Nation. The Central Bank should be independent from foreign interests" - that, in his language, means: "I WANT TO PRINT MONEY". Altough Hungary is not part of the EUR-zone, its Central Bank is strictly regulated by the EU. The EU would never let a small country like this print money, because "naked" money printing is a disaster for even the "hardest" currencies in the world, not to speak of the HUF.

Sat, 03/17/2012 - 13:37 | 2265055 hungarianboy
hungarianboy's picture

Hungary is NOT a small country. Netherlands, Belgium Luxembourg etc are much smaller :-)

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