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Spot Gold On June 1, 2010: $2000.00
Submitted by Marla Singer on 11/14/2009 00:23 -0400
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Thanks for admin.nice sharing.very nice..
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Gold is not a market ... thanks to Goldman and Jp Morgans
manipulations. Therfore the rest of the question should be,
"does Jp Morgan and Goldman Sachs want to see gold over
2000? The answer is no.
Just an observation - the over-under shifted a wee bit toward 'over', in the past couple of days.
If stronger position limits by the CFTC are enforced in DEC on both the long and short I vote higher gold and lower oil
This year: Gold = SPX
Next year: Gold = INDU
Weekly gold chart posted here:
http://www.zerohedge.com/forum/us-dollar-interest-rates-gold-charts#comm...
Longer term target is $1343. $2000 would be achievable in a short time frame, but it would require panic buying to form a parabola. Oh, that would be jolly! ;)
I had to vote NO on this one, because while gold will go higher and most likely a LOT higher, it will not happen that fast.
Black carrot karat juice + white karat juice = gray karat juice. What shade of gray would you like?
Will you be picking that up, or is that for delivery? By the way, supplies are on back order and there's a fuel surcharge to be assessed dependent upon: 1.) fuel price when your order is extracted; 2.) fuel price when your order is refined; 3.) fuel price at the time of transport to clearing house; 4.) fuel price at time of delivery (even if you pick it up, because we make the rules); 5.) carry surcharge of 20% less 1% interest on deposit; 6.) currency insurance premium.
Will that be in euros or renminbi? Sign here: ...---... _...---..._...---...
What is the basis for gold? Does it have an existence (it resurrects/falls in the forest and some interpretive self-conscious sees/hears it)? What value does it have? Shall we measure it in essence of life - global average of heartbeats/second less aspirational carbon tax X GGP (global gross production)?
WTF? Who GAS?
If you order pm's from a mint, at some point they will discontinue deliveries, and return your funds. although buying on a cc is a gamble, buying with a heloc seems like a pretty good strategy
@2200 = inflation adjusted old high... @5000 = is price of gold to cover US money supply. @8000 = we can have gold as new world reserve currency... higher then 8,000 is probably bubble
$2,200 is the number you get when you use the official inflation rate data. John Williams of Shadowstats said last month that we need to get to $7,150 to break the 1980 high:
“If the methodologies of measuring inflation in 1980 had been kept intact, gold would have to hit $7,150 to be the equivalent of the 1980 record,” Williams said.
OK, that just blew my mind.
I don't think John Williams can be blown off, and I *do* think gold is set to surpass 1980 b/c the fiat situation is drastically worse now.
So...I find this number intensely sobering.
NOT b/c I 'feel rich' as a goldholder. But b/c as much as I knew that we are in a currency collapse, numbers like this still hit me hard in a deep down place that still, faintly believes that somehow, we'll 'muddle through' this time and things will go back to the way they were as I was growing up. And this is one of those epiphany numbers that says, No, we won't, and that time is gone for good. And it really is the end of an era.
$2200 makes me feel 'rich'. $7200 makes me feel scared.
Shit.
I felt the same way reading that post.
over $8000 would be a bubble.
once we hit $5000 by the end of next year, the USD probably won't even be around as a yardstick.
heh...we bought my aging father-in-law a half-oz of gold for his birthday, about a month ago.
He reckons he won't sell till it hits $2000/oz.
I said, What, you're going to let it go for that cheap...?! :-)
The US government is bankrupt, upholding a welfare global economy and only a default is to be 'official' . Global instability and liquidation coming to a town near you. 2000 gold in six months ? Maybe ......... but 10000 will come after as gold consumes fiat. It's Not Oil that will set the world back but the rarity of silver. Silver is more important than even gold. It's a duel purpose metal.
yes, silver has industrial value which gold does not. However if everybody bails out of the fiat currencies and into gold and silver, they're also jumping into all the other commodities which soar in price to the moon. That means that the companies who make stuff for a living can't afford the raw materials for their factories. Global factory production comes to a complete stop. Silver can't be used in any manufacturing processes if all the factories are closed.
Yes the raw materials would be more expensive in dollars. But since we're being all futuristically hypothetical, shouldn't we assume that the new high prices would be paid in silver and gold?
When everything is corrupt, people turn to gold...everything is corrupt! gold 2000 plus
Janet Tavakoli On Derivatives & Bear Stearns Sub-Prime Fraud
http://dailybail.com/home/janet-tavakoli-on-derivatives-bear-stearns-sub...
Why does one buy precious metals in the first place? Is it an investment, an insurance policy, or a vote of no confidence in any of the following: government, fiat currency, or perceived rigged investment market? Maybe you just define precious metals as a store of value. After all, it won't pay you dividends or interest. Sure you can "make money" on gold or silver just as you can "lose money"...if you're trading it. Without arguing "what ifs" about investment potential/earnings of alternatives over time, an ounce of gold would have bought a fine men's suit in the early 1900's, just as it would today. What's the difference in US dollars to buy that same suit over that time period? Isn't having a portion of your savings in precious metals diversification in and of itself? What's stability? Some may see stability as low volatility in the short term and others may see it as an ongoing trend with acceptable volatility. What period do you choose to compare precious metals to other "investments"? If you cherry pick your dates to compare options, you can say whatever you're predisposed to say.
What's the long-term trend of the gold price in USD? How about looking at it in other currencies? Do precious metals always trade inversely to the USD? Sometimes they do, and sometimes they don't. How about in other currencies? Same. Might we see a dead-cat bounce in the dollar's downward trend? Might other currencies collapse and cause people to flee to the dollar as a perceived "safe haven" again? As the earth's population increases at a faster rate than the increase in precious metals supply, does that make the reduced amount of gold or silver available to each person inherently more "valuable"? What is the most politically expedient way to deal with national debt and the cost of servicing it for the US and other countries? What is the vested interest in the outcome for those in control?
How will the psychology of the herd affect all of the above?
All of the above assumes nothing major happening like vastly expanded or additional wars, derivative defaults, currency dumping/carry trade unwinding, massive QE expansion, widespread bank collapse, etc. If things go really haywire, will we start saying an ounce of gold buys "x" dollars instead of the other way around?
That the question is asked seems to reinforce the notion of a trade that is approaching an expiry date, if only on an interim basis. If gold is rising primarily due to inflation fears (which the parallel sharp rise in equities and commodities since March suggests) then gold is, in the opinion of this humble observer most certainly deserving of bubble status. If it is rising primarily due to a perception of imminent systemic risk and failure then the Treasury Bond market should be selling off with equal vehemence. Also silver should be showing far more esprit de corps with gold if this is the case n'est pas?
I merely seek proof of the price driver at this juncture. I remain unconvinced that inflation will be a serious problem anytime soon given the horrible employment picture and frankly, if it is a fear of systemic risk driving the price I would prefer to hold can goods and shotguns.
Prediction: A new ETF that focuses on buying and collecting on the distressed margin accounts of gold bugs will be launched in 2010.
Ticker Symbol: RFGB (Really Fucked Gold Bug)
I think it will be well below $2000, and maybe even lower than today. I'm no expert, however, and I'll gladly eat crow if June rolls around and I'm wrong. We also have a few precedents set for US Govt intervention in gold if something extreme happens, so further intervention is a reasonable possibility.
Armstrong Economics release their view on Gold on November 7, 2009.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/22417671/GOLD-5000-11-11-09.
This view looks at a longer term cycle until 2016 in relation to fiat money.
Another view of long term cycles of markets is available from The LongWave Group http://www.thelongwaveanalyst.ca/ and they similarly provide a view of and case for Gold during the turbulent times we are experiencing. http://longwavegroup.com/flash_cycle.html
A very interesting iconoclastic framing of the structural underpinnings of the gold market and what accounts for its price movements. I wonder if one can make money from it. The history lessons included were wonderful from an erudite student of history.
~~~~~~~~
Mr. Armstrong is a 49-year-old market
forecaster in New Jersey who has been widely
quoted about commodities and other
investments and has long been one of the most
active silver traders on the New York
Mercantile Exchange's Comex division. He
was also the subject of a separate civil
complaint filed Monday following an
investigation by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission and
Commodity Futures Trading Commission.
Authorities are still trying to figure out what happened to a fund that held
roughly $1 billion in investments by Japanese corporations. So far, they
can account for only $46 million. They fear the rest, or at least a big chunk
of it, may have been lost in trading. In the criminal complaint filed in U.S.
District Court in Manhattan, prosecutors allege Mr. Armstrong took the
proceeds from client accounts and channeled the money to other accounts
to cover up losses.
Despite his active silver trading, it is difficult to tell exactly how much of
Comex's silver stockpiles Mr. Armstrong controls. What is clear is that he
also had strong views about gold. In recent weeks Mr. Armstrong's
predictions for gold had become exceedingly bearish.
However, Comex gold prices -- though in a sharp downtrend in recent
years -- are essentially unchanged compared with a year ago and actually
have risen modestly lately. Since the beginning of August, prices have
advanced $1 an ounce to $257.20. "My guess is that his silver strategy
would have been following his gold strategy, which was extremely bearish,"
one New York metals analyst said.
September 14, 1999
http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/rfi/press/princeton.htm
The Securities and Exchange Commission says that from late 1997, Armstrong began to rack up increasingly big losses on large investments he made in currencies and options. Between November 1997 and August 1999, for example, SEC officials say Armstrong lost $295 million in trading the yen alone - all money that belonged to clients.
Of the total outstanding Princeton notes, floating-rate notes which do not guarantee the principal accounted for 56.3 billion yen while principal-guaranteed, fixed-rate notes accounted for 57.5 yen billion, Setogawa said.
Segawa said an unspecified number of companies bought the floaters for the purpose of postponing or hiding losses on their securities or other assets.
September 20, 1999
http://www.smartmoney.com/breaking-news/?story=19990920050147
http://nihoncassandra.blogspot.com/2006/08/enigma-of-martin-armstrong.html
Bug's prison penpal Marty 'frames' the gold market structural underpinnings in his IBM-Selectric iconoclastic way.
Mandelbrot declines to aver, unsure if reduction of bloomin' buzzin' natural world confusion to elegant mathematical formulae applies to irrational hominid
actions. Burns disputes while agreeing with both, finding all Gang aft agley,
An' lea'e us nought but grief an' pain,
For promis'd joy!
I'm with Burns, 3rd degree.
prison interview
http://economicedge.blogspot.com/2009/10/new-yorker-piece-on-martin-armstrong.html
Did anybody else notice he was way off on the amplitude/contribution of dark matter to the cycle/period? Man oh man. Losin' his skills in the pokey, it looks like.
Maybe no calculators either and slide rules don't do pi well.
Are they considered sharp objects?
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703740004574513870490836470.html
http://themeanoldinvestor.blogspot.com/2009/11/sum-of-all-fears.html
Should have done the over/under at $1500; would have been a much more interesting poll.
Agreed. $2,000 is way too far out to get to by June. $1500? Still a bit frothy but then again...
If Kirby and his claimed "sources" are correct....."real" gold is immensely undervalued
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article14996.html
SNIP:
Unfortunately, there are now more sordid details to report.
When the news of tungsten “salted” gold bars in Hong Kong first surfaced, many people
who I am acquainted with automatically assumed that these bars were manufactured in
China – because China is generally viewed as “the knock-off capital of the world”.
Here’s what I now understand really happened:
The amount of “salted tungsten” gold bars in question was allegedly between 5,600 and 5,700 – 400 oz – good delivery bars [roughly 60 metric tonnes].
This was apparently all highly orchestrated by an extremely well financed criminal operation.
Within mere hours of this scam being identified – Chinese officials had many of the perpetrators in custody.
And here’s what the Chinese allegedly uncovered:
Roughly 15 years ago – during the Clinton Administration [think Robert Rubin, Sir Alan Greenspan and Lawrence Summers] – between 1.3 and 1.5 million 400 oz tungsten blanks were allegedly manufactured by a very high-end, sophisticated refiner in the USA [more than 16 Thousand metric tonnes]. Subsequently, 640,000 of these tungsten blanks received their gold plating and WERE shipped to Ft. Knox and remain there to this day. I know folks who have copies of the original shipping docs with dates and exact weights of “tungsten” bars shipped to Ft. Knox.
The balance of this 1.3 million – 1.5 million 400 oz tungsten cache was also plated and then allegedly “sold” into the international market.
Apparently, the global market is literally “stuffed full of 400 oz salted bars”.
Copyright © 2009 Rob Kirby - All rights reserved
Well no wonder those comex contracts are so cheap. They have nothing to do with the value of the real 1 oz 1 gram 10 gram 10 ounce bars of REAL gold that people have.
My socks just sailed across the room.
I know. I've decided to establish a local "Wolverines" unit. A friend of mine from back home had some better pics as he is working near some of the movie locations (which I no longer have)....but at AJ's site there are some good ones as well....how close will this be to reality once the world acknowledges and seeks retribution for the greatest scam perpetrated in all of human history....that primarily our leaders facilitated....pimping the whole world into oblivion:
http://www.infowars.com/red-dawn-2010/???
The historic relationship between gold and the dollar has been forever severed. Soon, particle accelerators and nuclear reactors
worldwide will go into full-blow gold production mode to stem off the lack of supply. Ultimately, these attempts will be futile.
It's a new paradigm, and those who don't buy now will be priced out forever. Those who do buy now will be rewarded
with a lifetime of riches, as gold will continue its yearly 20+% price appreciation.
Retail Investors, and those born in future generations will be unable to afford the $5000 spot price, or diversify their portfolios.
They will buy gold that is impure, priced in grams, or nothing at all.
This asset bubble is different than the others, It will never slow down or pop.
The gains are permanent.
That's what they said about the housing bubble in 2006.
GET IN NOW!!! NO OTHER ASSET GOES UP 15% every year!
Until it didn't anymore, of course...
Except gold is a precious metal. In fact there is much more leverage used to short gold than there are actual leveraged positions on gold. The bubbles would be the US dollar and the US Treasury market.
"This asset bubble is different than the others, It will never slow down or pop. The gains are permanent."
The only thing that is permanent is that NOTHING is permanent..
+100
certainly not the USD
Can't tell about $2000 in June, cause I can't imagine what's happening to the USD in the same period.
EUR/gold seems more stable. It is at 750€ now, from 666€ 3 months ago., growing steadily just as I like it. Guess it could get to $2000 if the EUR/USD gets to 2. No clue on this though.
About "getting physical", not yet there cause I don't like storing anything of value at home. Then spreads are huge at local shops (20% Ag, 10% Au). But I guess at some point I will have to make my mind...
Meanwhile, a Swiss ETF (JB) is trustworthy enough for me. They promise physical delivery on request and they hedge EUR against USD so lately I am getting a bit extra gold for free.
All gold commercials replaced by Extense ads in 2010.
who cares?
You know whats fun? Clicking on the under $2000 button as many times as you can, while waiting for your comments to post:-)
All gold siezed by June 2010. Official price below $2k.
Official price after seizure below $100.
Wrong.
First of all the US does not control the gold price. Secondly, if the official price after seizure will be below $100 ... what would the U$D be worth? $0.0001?
Officially gold held in Fort Knox (if it is there) is officially $42oz.
Not a bad idea to checkout Marten Armstrongs newest article on this subject.
Bought into physical gold at $650oz and while it is nice to see gold rising steadily when expressed in FRN dollars I have to keep reminding myself that the value of gold has not changed but the value of FRN dollars when expressed in gold has!