Leaked Internal Messages Reveal Co-Worker Support For Fired Google Engineer's Controversial Memo

James Damore, now a former Google employee, caused outrage when he circulated a manifesto on Friday, complaining about Google’s “ideological echo chamber” alleging women have lower tolerance for stress and that conservatives are more conscientious. The chess master, who studied at Harvard, Princeton and MIT and worked at Google's Mountain View HQ, was fired on Monday after the search giant’s chief executive, Sundar Pichai, said portions of Damore’s 10-page memo “violate our code of conduct and cross the line by advancing harmful gender stereotypes” despite saying in the same memo that Google employees shouldn't be afraid of speaking their minds.

But, according to screenshots obtained by Wired, internal discussions that followed Damore's memo and its fallout show Google employees both embracing and advancing its views. Damore himself indicated in the following message that his former coworkers had reached out privately to express "their gratitude for bringing up these very important issues." Others chimed in publicly as well.

 

As an example, the following Google employee blasted the inability of some people to understand and/or acknowlege "how distribution differences aren’t stereotypes and can’t be applied to individuals...it’s basic statistical logic." 

I put almost agree on go/pc-considered-harmful-poll. I thought it needed way more citations. Also, I would have left off anything about “marxism”. You could have made the same points about diversity/psychological safety without them. Adding them in just made the doc seem political. Although, I don’t think either would have changed the reaction.

 

My biggest concern is the number of people who don’t understand how distribution differences aren’t stereotypes and can’t be applied to individuals. It’s basic statistical logic. Regardless of wether [sic] or not there are differences and if they are biological or cultural, this is just a blatant logical fallacy.

 

For example, men’s average height is higher than women’s average height. You would never just assume a woman can’t be taller than 5’9”, but you would expect more men to be above 5’9”.

Of course, intellectual honesty isn't the point of the 'progressive' movement, is it?  The talking heads of the Left are all too eager to put on their science hats when discussing climate change but are less eager to entertain scientific facts when they're deemed 'inconvenient.'

 

Meanwhile, the following Googler tied the whole Damore controversy back to the 2016 Presidential election.

For example, there is broad consensus in all American companies that everyone should be treated the same regardless of race and gender and that sexual harassment or other mistreatment of employees should not be tolerated. But I do not think there is consensus on the following things, which are treated as obvious and noncontroversial at Google.

 

  1. Different recruitment/hiring process for employees on color of their skin
  2. Open stereotyping of employees by race and gender on internal sites without public outcry that makes such instances rare over time
  3. Weekly public (though thankfully anonymous) shaming of employees for misdeeds as slight as anachronistic use of “guys” for a mixed gender group
  4. Frequent references to documents that stigmatize open disagreement with a a rage [sic] of positions
  5. Call for employees to give each other hugs at an all hands meeting because the wrong candidate won a presidential election in the country, following by a mass mailing on how to help your kids deal with grief due to the same occurrence

 

We could go on, or start a centithread on any of these subjects. I understand that these things feel normal and necessary to many holding strong progressive values, especially coming from colleges which are largely run along these norms today. Many feel that the country suffered a huge setback in 2016 and sick to use [sic] other venues, including workspaces with largely sympathetic employee base, to advance their values forward. Google as shining light in the sea of darkness right?

 

But then, what do you propose to do about Googlers who are well within general norms of the country, and many other businesses like IBM, Oracle or whatever - but who do not agree with progressive consensus which is currently in effect in our internal discourse? This consensus, while pretty strong, is also often overstated. During the election season, progressives have been very active at Google, including (sadly I think) draconian responses to anyone who disagreed with their core ideas. Now that passions are subsiding, we can see from polls like the recent one that Googlers have widely varying opinions on go/pc-considered-harmful.

 

Of course, we can only assume these supportive Googlers will soon find themselves unemployed.

Comments

philipat NoDebt Wed, 08/09/2017 - 09:23 Permalink

So this has nothing to do with Google's internal "culture"? I am also not at all surprised that there was no internal reaction against him because that is precisely what "echo chambers" do. It is very dangerous for a large Corporation to exist in such an echo chamber because the real world cahnges outside them?

In reply to by NoDebt

Cognitive Dissonance Son of Loki Wed, 08/09/2017 - 09:33 Permalink

News Flash. Several Supreme Court rulings do indeed confirm that most, not all, of your Constitutional 'rights' are not acknowledged, therefore lost, when working for an employer.Not only can they direct your body, but also your mind. Nothing you say or do at work is 'yours' unless specifically stated in an employment agreement. The default setting is slave for all employees. They own you and your product.

In reply to by Son of Loki

a Smudge by an… 847328_3527 Wed, 08/09/2017 - 11:20 Permalink

I'm with CD above. As to documents I further expect this kid signed away his rights when he took the job. His NDA has more pages than his article. His complete employment contract would be voluminous indeed.

However you and I aren't gonna see them because Google will say with justification that these contain proprietary information.

And common sense would tend to dictate that you don't call your employer out in public. Or even organization-wide. Or even department wide. Or even around the water cooler. But this would be "corporate common sense".

In reply to by 847328_3527

OverTheHedge a Smudge by an… Wed, 08/09/2017 - 12:08 Permalink

Common sense.Google seems to have an inclusive, share anything culture, which is exactly why this document was created - to be shared internally. Entertaining to see what happens though, when an inclusive, sharing culture that is actually aggressively monotheistic in its viewpoint gets challenged. I wonder if they are equally as hidebound and rigid when it comes to technical debates- ie is there any room at Google for innovation?Now, given that roughly half of the US workforce are not left-wing do-gooder snowflakes (at least, I am assuming half, but it might be more than half, as you would assume that non-workers are more likely to be left-wing than workers), this means that Google has openly declared it will limit its employee pool to those who are left-leaning. More reduction in innovation.Google will either have a sea-change, or sink. AOL MKII, in my opinion. Of course it could take decades before the rot becomes apparent, given that .gov props up the rotten edifice..gov is doing a lot of propping up, these days. I wonder if Google could be presented as a fair indicator for the larger economy?

In reply to by a Smudge by an…

Cognitive Dissonance Quinvarius Wed, 08/09/2017 - 09:22 Permalink

Unfortunately the court case will eventually need to go to the Supreme Court. The 9th Circuit Court of Appeals is infected by ideology similar to Google.At this point Google doesn't care if they lose the lawsuit. They were just concerned with quieting the internal screams of snowflake pain and distress.One has to wonder how many people who were screaming about the fired author actually read the dissertation. I wager less than 1%. People infected with strong ideologies are lazy and prefer to be told what and how to think....especially when what they are told affirms their thinking.We so love to be told we are correct. It's a might powerful drug.

In reply to by Quinvarius

fajensen Quinvarius Wed, 08/09/2017 - 10:38 Permalink

Google will pay nothing, this won't event make it past the reception desk of the most scummy 100% commision tort lawyer.The story is about some entitled Unicorn-Snowflake-BicycleHelmet The III'rd millenial finding out the hard way that when one works for a private company then any "diversity" involving Not following "The Company Line" with some visible enthusiasm will be stamped out. Geeez, who could imagine that the "kewliest company evah" would somehow not be exactly like any other big company evah!? A dumbass, that's who!He was fired partly for being a Jerk, but mostly for also being enough of a moron to produce undisputable evidence of epic-jerkhood for HR to nail him with. Having personal "opinions" is strictly an off-the-clock activity in any place of work, even in politics. One does it at the bar, after work, if one must.  

In reply to by Quinvarius

Nobody For President fajensen Wed, 08/09/2017 - 14:14 Permalink

You got a lot of downvotes, mostly because of the snark I think, but as a former personnel guy a long time ago - alas, you are probably right, especially in the 9th Circuit Court...Google used to be a pretty good, and exciting company in the early days, but is lost in the miasma of bay area super 'liberalism', where everybody is equal to and superior than a white male. Check out the Google doodles - 90+% are now about wonderful women or non-white guys. It is in your face crazy if you have taken the red pill...I fear for my country and what it has become, and am glad I'm an old guy and probably won't see the fall.

In reply to by fajensen

Nobody For President fajensen Wed, 08/09/2017 - 14:14 Permalink

You got a lot of downvotes, mostly because of the snark I think, but as a former personnel guy a long time ago - alas, you are probably right, especially in the 9th Circuit Court...Google used to be a pretty good, and exciting company in the early days, but is lost in the miasma of bay area super 'liberalism', where everybody is equal to and superior than a white male. Check out the Google doodles - 90+% are now about wonderful women or non-white guys. It is in your face crazy if you have taken the red pill...I fear for my country and what it has become, and am glad I'm an old guy and probably won't see the fall.

In reply to by fajensen

GUS100CORRINA order66 Wed, 08/09/2017 - 09:17 Permalink

Internal Messages Reveal Co-Worker Support Of Fired Google Engineer's Controversial MemoMy response: GOOGLE is nothing more than a MARXIST PROGRESSIVE LIBERAL CORPORATE POLICE STATE where thought and behavior is fixed, and anybody out of bounds is punished. Unfortunately, for GOOGLE, the CONTROL they SEEK will backfire making them slaves to an evil master that they will not want.

In reply to by order66

NAV shutterbug Wed, 08/09/2017 - 10:04 Permalink

And still too young and inexperienced to know better. No one need apply for a job at Google who is older than 30 years.  It’s like drafting clueless 18-year-olds to die in McCain’s wars; they’re all twenty-something “kids” fresh out of the Establishment schools of  Marxist indoctrination. According to PayScale, a company based in Seattle… “The seven companies with the youngest workers, ranked from youngest to highest in median age, were Epic Games (26); Facebook (28); Zynga (28); Google (29); and AOL, Blizzard Entertainment, InfoSys, and Monster.com (all 30). According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, only shoe stores and restaurants have workers with a median age less than 30…”https://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/07/05/technology-workers-are-young-really-young/

In reply to by shutterbug